Honestly you definitely have some good points made about the idols and I’m really enjoying ur vids so far. Tho forgive me for being stupid, but what exactly is a “dominant performer” ?I thought it’s synonymous with being charismatic.
@@rnagrump6069 You arent stupid stop don't say that!😭 A dominant performer is an idol with strong facial features (like a sharp nose or cheebones) that require them to have subtle facial expressions in performances but have strong body language ( which is the none verbal way a person uses their body to communicates their message e.g the way they walk across the stage.) take the way hwasa (dominant) walks across the stage vs how IU (sensual) walks across the stage. Dominant performers include but arent limited to: Hwasa of Mamamoo, Shownu of Monsta X, and Aisha of Everglow.
Chae's regression in her stage presence is genuinely heartbreaking, she was a force to be reckoned during Sixteen, legit look at every stage she did during the show and you'll see she ATE. Only Jihyo was confident enough to go head to head with her because of how much of an Ace she is. The problem is that Chae just did *not* match Twice's concept. She always stood out doing covers such as Greedy or Move, songs that suit her better than Twice's comebacks. It's such a shame to see her lose that power in her stage presence.
I was thinking the same thing. That her issue might be the twice concept. I remember that JYP concert performance with other JYPE rappers where she had the long ponytails. She was very charismatic there
I do get where are you coming from, but my question is- how she isn't in full mode for songs that aren't typical Twice or in songs she's written? Even when she's given more lines and freedom, there isn't a change.
@James Williams What do you mean she doesn't? She's one of Twice members with most writing credits and she even participated in producing once. The members who write songs also distribute lines, and as time goes they're more involved in MV, choreographies, outfits and so on.
Chae is such a wasted talent, during Sixteen, she has such a strong rap game, she's an all-rounder. But this is not fully shown. JYP has a strong favoritism, and honestly, they should've debuted her as a solo before Nayeon. No hate or anything for Nayeon btw.
@@nyek1246 Maybe Chaeyoung wasn't ready to debut solo, maybe the schedule was too tight (so it was for Nayeon cause she looked tired during the tour as well), maybe she's working on it.... people are always ready to assume. At the end of day-Nayeon is the oldest, centre, a lead vocalist and dancer. Chaeyoung as every member of Twice has shown her writing skills and this comeback she also wrote a song.
chaeyoung was my pick in sixteen but as soon as she debuted she was immediately overshadowed. I was pretty shocked when it came to cheer up where everyone was smiling I could see her in the background of their shot with a blank look
Truth. It’s actually sad cuz she was SO GOOD in Sixteen. I was hoping she would drastically improve once they stopped doing Uber cute concepts, but she’s still pretty dead.
Yes, she is soooo good in Sixteen. Very strong rap game. Imagine being a stable major. But i mean, with JYP's history, i'm not shock anymore, with so many wasted talents.
I loved Chaeyoung and Somi in Sixteen. They were my picks. Chaeyoung also did really well during Fancy promotions (I felt like she also stood out the most in the MV too). But for their other songs? Sigh. Idk what happened. She was so charismatic before.
I would add Dahyun as she has a big smile on her face at all times no matter what. I would really like to see Bahiyyih develop more confidence as she always looks so terrified and her fancams look like she's actively memorizing the dance - even when she tries to smile, it's like she's about to cry.
Bahiyyih’s MVSK performance (1/4/22) was honestly her best fan cam so far. I love her to death and I can’t really see where you think she’s about to cry in some performances, but she does this thing where she mouthes other lyrics(?). It’s not completely bothersome, but I think it takes away from her performance and does make it look like she’s trying to memorize parts.
Agreed I think dayhun has regressed in performance as well, the big smile is honestly creepy at this point. Which is sad as she can really put all her expression in her dancing and it makes you want to like and watch her more but the smiling makes me uncomfortable lol
I don't think wonyoung is a bad performer in a sense but she lacks focus in my personal opinion. When she tries to look appealing on stage her dancing loses its sharpness/edge (a lot of the time when she does this she ends up looking weak) and when she does dance she loses her facial expressions and looks deadpan. Honestly she needs to learn how to do both at the same time or else she would suffer in terms of presence.
let's try to understand from her perspective. she was much better in terms of stage presence in iz*one because she didn't have so much pressure. now, of course she has to look cute and prioritize that over other things, because that's what people notice about her. they don't talk about her dancing or vocals anymore, they only talk about her looks. of course she'll focus on looks. she's young and everyone is watching her, judging her, pressuring her. in summary: wonyoung doesn't lack focus. she only changed the way she performed after leaving iz*one because now people only care about her looks instead of her talent and hard work.
@@ncteno I understand your point and there are parts we agree on (e.g. public opinion/scrutiny) but this has always been her issue even from her time in izone. I do like her better as an ive member because she is more in her element with the group's concepts but in terms of her performance she has always been too fixated on either one of performing with her body vs performing with her face (and rarely ever does both together, which is detrimental). Again not saying she's bad because she is above average in comparison to most of the current active idols, it's just that what she lacks does stick out so much you can't help but notice.
i agree with this, i don't think she's a bad performer at all and she was even my favorite performer back in iz*one. she's beautiful and honestly good for her for using that to her advantage for her facial expressions, but based on her performances these days, it can only get you so far in ive, i have always wondered why i'm bothered by wonyoung's facial expressions but not by yujin's when both mostly rely on their facial expressions to boost their stage presence, then i realized 2 things: 1.) wonyoung's facial expressions looks too rehearsed and kinda "forced" even, while yujin's just feels more natural and it looks like it just really comes to her at the moment. of course it's still rehearsed, but the thing is she doesn't make it _look_ like it. and 2.) wonyoung makes facial expressions that looks good for _her,_ while yujin makes facial expressions that looks good _for the song._ i feel like that's their main difference again, no hate to wonyoung, but if she just feels the songs she's performing and just enjoy whilst doing so, i feel like it would greatly improve her stage presence. she's already a good performer, she just needs a little more "push"
Actually wonyoung is great clean dancer in izone,she had lose weight..tho you can expect her after she is overworked..i feel yujin trying always being sexy in ive..i feel this is off...i prefer a person enjoy on the stage ..even i know wonyoung is overworked tho. She is really charismatic person
@@lavienrosewon8811 she lost so much weight, i'm very worried about her. in iz*one she looked so healthy and happy, now her fingers are so bony. i only hope it's not what we think it is, and she's taking care of herself.
Shuhua and Hyewon share the same struggle of a beginner dancer. When your dance foundation is weak, your brain would focus almost entirely on not messing up the choreography, thus starring soullessly to the camera just so they could focus. Take Lia for example. She is definitely not bad as a sensual performer, but when Itzy’s choreo are constantly super challenging to her level, her expressions fall flat as soon as there’s a hard dance break comes up. And when she tries to tone down the moves to focus on her stage presence (and to breathe! And to sing!), she’s at great risk of being crucified by netizens as “lazy”. The companies really really needs to provide these idols way better dance and body condition trainings so they could elevate their dance skills, then maybe just maybe, the stage presence would be elevated as well. Yes Cube I am looking at you.
yes youre right idk hyewon really but remembering the choreo and lyrics is hard enough never mind the facial expressions and natural body language! and shuhua also has her accent to work on. its understandable shuhua isnt keeping up with them when shes practising so many songs for world tour and learning a lot of soojins parts, but hopefully she keeps improving next time idle comes back. as for cube ent i feel like they only thing they can do well is produce good music, but when groups/idols dont do well they throw them away really easily although all they have to do is invest in them a little more to help them be successful. i feel like this is partly to do with the culture of netizens wanting new groups all the time and when the novelty of a group wears off they want new groups and its hard to keep up with so many, cube just needs to be more considerate of the people theyre chucking out
But hyewon looks disinterested most of of the time. It's like she doesn't want to be there. She doesn't give enough energy in her performances. Even those relay videos she looks bored
@@coolkid-xc1yi that we don’t know for sure. Whether what you speculate is true or not, we can’t deny the fact that she quite literally was just thrown into the group with such intense and intricate choreography while not having nearly any adequate dance foundation. Your brain can only retain so much information, it’s next to impossible to focus on appropriate stage presence when you barely could keep up with the choreo. The fact that I’m defending Hyewon while she’s literally my least favorite IZ*ONE member by very far, means you don’t have to like someone to just state the facts and logics.
Some people, no matter how much training they get, will never be good dancers. Tiffany from SNSD comes to mind. (And no this isn't hate. I've been following SNSD for over ten years, and Tiffany was my bias during many eras).
@@blahblahsuperanon that is true, it’s really coming down to how much they understand and able to translate the knowledge into their body movements. However, Tiffany, despite still being the weakest dancer in SNSD OT9, has improved a lot after she went solo and received LA level training.
I really think that SM forced the "sexy dynamite" title on Joy and she almost looked like she is forced to do it. During Peekaboo, really bad boy, bad boy,Psycho ....Joy didn't looked like she enjoyed performing them with SM putting her in uncomfortable outfits most of the time. But in Red Flavour, Queendom, Feel my Rhythm, umpah umpah, power up....she genuinely looked happy performing them. And her height difference with the members also made her look awkward while dancing since she is always trying to match her members height.
Actually with the Sexy Dynamite thing, it all started when one of their directors was just having fun and called her that. It amused her so much that she brought it up in several conversations(and the other members as well), to the point that it eventually just stuck with the fandom. She seems to be very proud of the title but indeed, in an effort to make her look more sensual, she's forced to dress in clothes that are either too tight for her or too short, and matching the other members' height is also a good point.
i don't think that sm forced the "sexy dynamite" title on joy since, as another commenter said, she seems to be proud of the title. although i do agree that she shines more in red velvet's red concepts rather than their velvet ones. as you've said, it's probably because she's dressed in such uncomfortable outfits in their velvet concepts since it's their sexy/mature ones, which probably then affects her stage presence. i saw a clip of her dancing in comfortable clothes and her dancing and energy was so much better than what she gives on stage
Looking back at this video a year later, Shuhua has improved a LOT in her stage presence. She's gotten significantly more confident and with the right concept she lowkey pulls focus from other members
San has actually recently said that he likes to perform the way he does. He spoke about how he once performed more conservatively and didn't like the performance, saying things like "Seeing myself dancing softly just to maintain a pretty face, I thought, is this really the performance that I think of?". This refers to a recent performance where he toned it down. In other words. He can tone it down, but he himself doesn't like it, and personally I think that over-performing is the thing that makes Ateez what they are. P.S there is a redd!t thread about this in the Kpopthoughts subredd!t Edit* trying some things with spelling because my comments get deleted
Something about Wonyoung "trying to look good". I actually like that because in my opinion it's part of her stage presence. The Royal concept of IVE has fits her really well.
I agree! I guess you can define stage presence in whatever appeals to you, but I definitely feel as though she has charisma and her fancams aren't a bore to watch.
The hair color and hair style on Chaeyoung is so true?! I always have this kind of thoughts when I compare her during Fancy era (Everything about her screams iconic) and Feel Special era (she just faded into the background). Might sounds controversial but I would even say Chaeyoung is one of those idols that colored-hair help them so much while performing (Notice her best eras are when she dye her hair color)
The hair colour/makeup/outfit impact on stage presence is literally fascinating to me. You see some idols going viral as soon as they have a different hair colour or a really good look that highlights their beauty. Definitely has a major impact. And I agree, not every idol fit the crazy hair colour, but Chaeyoung definitely does!
Fancy was definitely designed for her. I fell in love with her whole looks during that era. Then they changed the color I was ok fine still looks gorgeous, but then feel special came. They thinned out her hair and honestly her whole fancy charm was gone. But for me Mina and Dayeon are still the worst performers in twice. Mina always has a blanc face and Dayeon is always just smiling. With Chaeyoung I feel like she loses energy during performing and goes blank
@@Dokemoni I don’t find anything attractive about Mina in terms of stage presence(I love her with my whole heart but I agree that she’s the worst in twice) and Dahyun has improved a lot but she can still improve more, I love her smile but it gets creepy when she keeps smiling throughout, but her cry for me performances were really good imo, I love watching Chaeyoung’s fancams, even though she doesn’t do much, I enjoy watching her, it makes me feel relaxed.
I think one trend here is that female members assigned as "visuals" tend to be known for having somewhat static stage presence. i.e. Twice's Tzuyu, Blackpink's Jisoo, Red Velvet's Irene (I know people stan her around these parts but you can't deny that she's received a lot of criticism for lack of expressions/stiffness in cute concepts in the past), Gfriend's Sowon, Idle's Shuhua, and IVE's Wonyoung. Some exceptions include Dreamcatcher's Jiu, EXID's Hani, and Mamamoo's Solar. Notably, groups like Purple Kiss, TXT, and Billlie have pretty solid performances across the board (not all perfect, but no standout "bad" performers relatively) and also no assigned visual positions.
I would Loona’s Heejin, she have arguably one of, if not the best, stage presence of the group and Korea clearly considers her the visual (I know they don’t have official positions besides leader)
I love your editing in this it's great! I personally don't mind San's overperforming, but I get your point. I just want to say that I'm thankful you mentioned the constant ableism about how people make fun of his performance style. Like yeah, if it's too much for someone, I get it, but comparing it to seizures, and calling him the r-word is just disgusting. Stan twitter learn to voice your opinion without being disgusting challenge (impossible).
Agreed. I love San a lot and I agree with what Cheryl said in this video. I truly appreciate his passion and I LOVE watching every single one of his fancams.
Chaeyeong is quite the only instance that I would truly call “having good stage presence when she feels like it.” Yep, not Jennie, not the one who suffered from an ankle injury (her insufficient breath/stamina control plays a role as well, but that still doesn’t mean she’s lazy or uninterested). Chaeyeong on the other hand, is quite known as dancing to the beat of her own drum. I truly think she doesn’t fit the Twice concept. The only era I truly can see her popping off is Fancy. Her bubbly sassy gestures were rather subtle, but they truly elevate her stage presence, that legendary strawberry pink hair helps tremendously as well. Everyone knows she owns Fancy era. Other eras though, I could really see she doesn’t fully enjoy them, not like she looked completely deadfaced, but it’s clear they don’t fit her artistry.
I also think Shuhua actually only has decent stage presence when she wants to. Like every era she has one good fancam and the rest falls flat (her uh oh fancam especially is nice)
i like the idea of branching out from the rankings and doing more exploration into stage presence and general! i think you chose good examples of idols who underperform and overperform but are on the struggle bus nonetheless, and provided actual constructive criticism for these idols. cant wait for your next stage presence video! (also looove the editing style❤️)
Of all the groups, Ateez is probably the best group San can be in. In any other group, he would’ve overpowered everyone to the point that it would be a glaring problem. Ateez has to this point been able to keep up and balance out his energy to the most part. Seonghwa as a dramatic elegant performer and Hongjoong as a theatrical charismatic performer really give off this trifecta effect that works well. His good pal Wooyoung also form a wonderful complimentary dynamic with him as seen in the intro to Answer during that one awarding ceremony that I don’t remember. The only reason why I hope San would tone it down is because I don’t think the human body is designed to take the amount of taxing movements he’s doing now. I don’t want him to actually break himself to perform.
That was actually a problem that Jungkook had when he was younger, the BTS members had to tell him to tone it down and pace himself so he wouldnt get hurt during long concerts. It's a skill to be learned for sure.
I agree with everything you said about shuhua. However, the worst for me in idle when it comes to stage presence is Miyeon, she always looks stunning but she is a snooze fest to me on stage. During a performance of Tomboy I literally said to my screen ''come on Miyeon, look alive''. Besides having the same facial expresion during the whole performance, she dances with like zero energy, at least shuhua looks somewhat energetic when she dances. Miyeon looks like she thinks she's gonna break if she moves fast. A perfect example is during the pre chorus of tomboy, the choreography that they gave to yuqi and the one that they gave to Miyeon is very different. Another problem that she has is that she can not adapt to the different concepts that idle has, when she was performing tomboy or my bag, she might as well could have been performing dumdi dumdi. On another note, I would love to hear your opinions about purple kiss. I was watching a facecam of swan for nerdy and to be honest, I was cringing most of the time.
Facts I honestly feel like Soyeon and Yuqi are the only members currently that enjoy what they do and are fit to be entertiners. The other 3 that are still in the group seem like they are doing it just because they have to and there is no heart into delivering a satisfying performance imo. Also with Purple Kiss I feel so bad for them did they switch producers or something? Why is RBW letting them release garbage?! I miss Zombie era that was the last best song by them. I hope they come back to that kind of concept or their debut concept in Ponzona imo.
@@nelliebellie2222 Yuqi killed it during this last comeback. For some reason I don't enjoy watching soyeon perform that much, but objectively, I know she has good stage presence. I used to feel kinda 'meh' about Minnie, but I loved her during tomboy, I think she is great. Miyeon and Shuhua need to step up, because the gap between the top 3 and bottom 2 is way too big. As for purple kiss, I don't hate any of their songs, but Ponzoña was truly their peak. Their debut was one of my favorites ever. I'm still hoping that they make Crown a whole song.
@@mairimalvarado5532 not entirely related but Minnie’s stage presence (and all of (G)I-DLE’s presence, tbh) was at its best when they were on Queendom imo
You hit the nail in the head with Dayeon, I’ve been wondering all this time what was off about her stage presence. It’s weird because she is a very good performer, it’s like she cracked the code by ice cream but yet doesn’t seem to know how and in a sense regressed. I’ve always found myself enjoying her fancams way more in up! era, it felt more natural/genuine compared to say wadada. I wonder what are your thoughts on all other kep1er members’ stage presence and how they all interact!!
San looks like he is going through all the stages of grief in a dragon ball z episode like love the passion he has regarding the music but it gets a bit too much and i am guilty at giggling once or twice.
It’s gotten better. They’re not centring him 24/7 anymore, so I think he’s getting to shine in his dramaticness, without being overwhelming. He was def a reason why I didn’t watch their performances for the longest time. For me, he was Too much!
You are really gifted at analyzing these performing styles. Dayeon a charismatic trying to be a dominant is so obvious once you say it, but I've never have seen it myself.
I’ve literally only listened to two ateez songs in my entire life, so take this with a grain of salt. Even tho I think San over performing (from the stages I’ve seen) is a thing, I think Guerilla is the perfect song for that. Like when the post chorus kicks in, I think him going batshit insane is perfect for the vibe and energy of the song.
I think the issue with Dayeon’s stage presence is the sudden change in facial expressions all the time. She goes from happy and cute to fierce in a second, like she’s fighting with herself. Imo I find her fancams fun to watch because it’s unique and I actually kinda like it? The issue with Wonyoung is that she tries to multitask on stage, she’s trying to focus on too much at once which is why her mind might be too busy and she keeps repeating the same expressions over and over again. She’s pressured to look pretty which doesn’t help at all. Some visuals might look a bit off while doing certain expressions which is why I think there’s a pattern where some visuals in k-pop have a blank expression most of the time besides giving a slight smile or a wink or they stick to a certain pallet of expressions.
I don't get when the People write wonyoung trying look pretty ...wonyoung is knows pretty, she is just beautiful but her charismatic aura is always here
@@lavienrosewon8811 She’s too pressured to look pretty 24/7. If she looks the slightest bit untidy people will start hating on her again. On stage every idol has to look pretty though
@@bettercallnari wonyoung is pretty after all.i dont get your point...wonyoung look like she did enjoy all the stage for me..she love bring positive vib
Apparently at Kcon yesterday, San was performing so hard that his mic fell off and broke. This is a perfect example of how overperforming *is* a thing and can hinder your performance as a whole. I love him and watching him perform too, but it’s true!
but he himself doesn't feel content when he's not performing vigorously. to him, toning it down is underperforming. we have to respect the way he likes to perform.
I agree with everything except Wonyoung. I think her expressions and moves fit Ive's concept (and Izone's before it) so well. I have watched many fancams of Ive and, apart from Yujin who is clearly the best in the group, I find myself coming back to Wonyoung the most. Yes it's ripetitive, but it doesn't lose appeal for me, even after many performances. I don't mind an idol not changing expressions every performance if I like what they are doing. Sometimes I want to watch exaxtly that thing they do every single time with different outfits. Wonyoung for me is so magnetic. I agree she is trying too much to look perfect on stage but it doesn't take away from my enjoyment of her performance. With a different concept it would be a problem, but with Ive's royal concept it's perfect. And her "narcissistic, my god I love it" is ICONIC. No one in the group performes that part so well.
I really don't get why people are so annoyed about her wanting to look good: If I was a Kpop idol on stage with millions of eyes on me, you can be sure I will be even more self-conscious as her. Kpop fans are ruthless, 99% of people praise her for her visual, I can't blame her for being cautious on stage. People also don't think that she might be so busy that she might be instructed to go easy, not to mess her hair or make up too much. Also, people don't think that she looks very thin and might not eat enough or have enough nutrients, which can contribute to her lacking energy on stage. On the other hand, I agree that, while her stage presence is a bit repetitive (like 90% of idols nowadays, you rarely see changes from one stage to another for most idols, especially 4th gen groups), she does not lose her appeal, and she fits the group's concept and is honestly a good performer and a good centre. When the camera is on her, you don't really look at another member.
@@jessicajessica4392 wonyoung is the one known best performer during pd48,she know used her charismatic aura since many people praised wonyoung's energy in kpop flex in germany 2022. I feel wonyoung did enjoy being on the stage also i dont know why is the kpop stans critized her so much when there re winter and mina in kpop industry with blank facial expressions...
I think it is what makes Wonyoung fit IVE so much. IVE to me feels like a model group (?), the runways, the fashion, it feels like they are meant to have this repetitive and "robotic" nature to their expresisons and stage presence. They have a set type of aura they need to portray because it fits IVE's concept so much. The beauty and attitude of IVE coexists with the members own stage presence, they need to embrace what it truly is to 'LOVE DIVE', to sink and fall in love so much to the point of no return. That is why Wonyoung's presence fits so well because she has this aura and visual to her that can't make you stop watching her in awe.
I think the problem with San is that K-pop has become a different sector in entertainment industry. As a theatre nerd and a Bharatanatyam (form of Indian classical dance)dancer, this is how we perform. Expressions are never subtle here and that’s why I was drawn to Ateez in first place.
Exactly as someone who has been a bharatnatyam dancer for the past 13 years I do take a lot of notes from him cause my stage presence for my dance performances rely on energy and precision and not a lot on facial expressions. His expressions are what draw me in too. He sticks out but not in a bad way.
samee i come from a traditional dance background and i had not really heard of the term "overdancing" until I got into kpop lol. That being said, I absolutely love the way San performs and hope he does not change (but also I understand why it might not be for everyone lmao)
i think the reason why people "ignore" san's overperforming is that they like it, so they (we?) dont see it as a flaw. personally, i love his over the top facial expressions. he can overperform as much as he wants in that regard and I'll love it. his overly exaggerated body movements, though, ive started to think might be a problem sometimes, because in some past stages its made ateez's whole performance look less coordinated and unified. not in all stages though my conclusion however is that hes fine the way he is. both his fans and himself enjoy his over the top performance, and hes a bit of an stan attractor thanks to his performance, too. so hes fulfilling his job as an idol, and i see no reason whyd he'd need to change
Exactly I just replied the same to someone! Some of the fans who bias him are mainly focusing on him and not the whole group performance to notice he can unbalance the performance and overshadow at times. Or they do notice but they like him standing out than the rest so they don't mind 🙃 That being said personally I'm torn bc yes he should adapt to the rest(or the others to him, which they do and they did say that's how they improve by looking at each other but it's also not fair sometimes and he should cooperate as well), but also I like that he expresses how he wants and Atz choreographers do emphasize their individuality. But well no I'm now decided that it should be both. He just needs to find a balance, when and where to unleash! xD
About Joy : I agree with what you said, but I'd add that her outfits certainly don't help her. Half the time she's more focused on pulling her skirt down than on performing, which is 100% not her fault. Her stage presence is noticeably better when she's wearing comfy outfits.
Honestly I never thought about the things you mentioned for Wongyoung, and although I can see your points, I still don't believe she has a problem with her stage presence. I'd say leeseo is the one that imo, struggles in IVE, cause she's forcing a lot of expressions. She's very young though so I can't really be too harsh, she can still learn
I love san's facial expressions and you can see he absolutely enjoys performing, but I think san's musicality is too precise and he tries to match the beat and aura of the song and his body goes into over drive lol. I think if he was a street performer or in a dance crew it would be more appropriate, but his body language feels over the top for being in a kpop group. Non the less he is such a top-tier performer! I completely agree for shuhua and chaeyoung. Sometimes for these two it looks like they are just getting through the choreography and counting steps or thinking of what they'll have for dinner later or if they left the bathroom light on at home 🤷🏾
@@everglowup hey, I would like to know your opinions on Yena's stage presence (Ex-iz*one)... I personally love her stage presence and is one of my favourite performer of kpop
The reason he feels perfect for a street dance crew but not as a kpop idol is because we have seen too many blank faces and unenergized people that the standard is so low. We hardly get energetic and on your face idols like Jhope, Momo, San, Sua
@@mimitabiswas4534 The thing is idols r not just dancers, they need balance, otherwise other areas may be compromised. 1 reason idols don't perform like in 17:17 is because it's not possible for everyone to do this all the time, it requires lots of stamina + energy (ppl's health). It's also difficult for rappers/singers (e.g. Rosé) to do this + acc sound GOOD as they have to use that energy not only to perform but also sing (we have enough lip syncers as is😂). Tbh, whilst some may feel he is better as just a dancer, overdancing like oversinging r real things that r assessed as bad. For e.g. belting the WHOLE song or doing runs every 2 secs. Whilst it might be impressive to do runs + belts, doing so all the time may be overwhelming for the listener. San is a gd performer but performing like him is not necessary in order to have gd stage presence. I like J-hope's performances but he doesn't overperform so the comparison doesn't make sense. No one's against good facial expressions or passion LOL but it should be done in moderation because even too much of something good can be bad.
For me, I don't mind that San is doing 'too much', because of the sheer amount of idols who don't allow themselves to break free of this image of perfection that they cling on to when they are performing. They can come off as overly self-conscious, and while I think it does work in some cases (like Wonyoung, I think she is one of the few exceptions actually), most of the time it makes their stage presence feels half-baked. San gives the impression that he does not give a F about how he looks on stage and he only cares to express himself in the way he interprets the music he performs to. I think that is inspiring and one of his best qualities, and why so many people are drawn to him. I respect your opinion that he is doing 'too much' sometimes, but I excuse it because I applaud his passion for performance and he makes me adjust to his way of performing, not the other way round. A performer who is able to make me adjust to their stage presence despite not being the kind of stage presence that I typically enjoy deserves all my respect and praise. Thanks for the video!
I agree that San is an amazing performer cause he has no inhibitions, he truly let's himself go and be in the moment and doesn't focus on looking cookie cutter perfect for the camera. On the other hand I can agree that his body language can be borderline cartoonish sometimes 😂 especially when he stands out from the others in such a harsh contrast. It's a double edged sword. But truthfully I prefer an over performer over an underperformer any day.
so, if he does not give a F about, so we can criticizing and you all his fans cannot complain about it- because im tired of the hypocrisy and how atiny reacts when we criticize his stage presence.
Wonyoung has that untouchable rich girl vibe that it so captivating to watch. I never get bored with her fancams and always come back it's crazy. I think in their I am era and beyond, her expressions are more natural and it just adds on to her charm. I feel like Yujin has a main character type of energy and wonyoung is more of a mysterious background character that is stan attractor.
i always tought that chaeyoung is the weakest performer in twice not tzuyu as a lot claimed. she always give the bare minium when it comes to sp and always like "meh what im doing here " always bored on stage .at least tzuyu is trying .the hair really helped specially in fancy era tho
yes, Tzuyu might not have the best stage presence but I really see her trying. She gives a smile here and there, but the main point is that when Tzuyu sings her lines, she gives it all. During all these 4 years being an once, I’ve never thought Tzuyu looked bored in stage while singing. And she also improved a lot since that stupid flag scandal (her stage presence before that used to be amazing, I swear). But I don’t see the same in Chaeyoung. No improvement during all these years. It’s frustrating
I think that because even though Tzuyu doesn't give facial expressions she's consistent with energy she gives and she's grown as a dancer over a year. While Chaeyoung always somehow seems to give 60% (at best). I do understand that she's a human but it's a shame because she's talented rapper and decent singer.
@@AB-yk2pq yes even jyp point about that during sixteen and said that she always give 80% of her energy in dancing and performing .she never gived her 100% even during a competition . no sighn of improvement after 7 years .the other twice members improved tho
Someone that agrees with me finally! I also don’t find Tzuyu the worse performer of twice. Like I watched some of her fancams of feel special and fancy and I like that she is really trying. But for Chaeyoung no. Everything it’s her clothes and hair. For me she also don’t try to be better
I don’t know if you’ll read my comment,but I love how you aren’t afraid of giving constructive criticism to your favs instead of just complimenting them for everything,as for your non biases,you also don’t insult everything about them(Wich I’ve seen with another ktubers whom I won’t name) and actually want them to improve and be better. Overall,I love your stage presence videos and how you give constructive criticism even to your faves,even if you’re a bit hasher at times(wich isn’t a bad thing) (I apologize if the comment isn’t coherent,English ain’t my first language)
im a new atiny, and I was like - how can people like this - he looks like he was not doing the same choreo as the rest of them, make me feel uncomfortable, of course in some performance not all of them.
@@Angel-mv5py Yes, I was watching one performance recently that I wish he calm down because I cannot even pay attention to the music because I just hear thinking how painful dancing with that so much energy must feel. In others he is good and I wish he realize that he is looking to intense haha. he said in the interview with sunmi that he watch the other members perform may he could learn some tricks from them, I still a baby Atiny so idk.
Wonyoung - I have a hard time judging Wonyoung for being hyperfocused on her looks when they are such a main component of her _life_ at this point. She's very young, very thin, very pretty, and trotted out to be fawned upon by all these adults who can't stop cooing over how adorable and gorgeous she is, and many of whom are also openly sexualizing her. She has to deal with other people's fantasies being projected on her at all times while she's still developing. I wonder how people critical of her now will react if it's ever revealed she's struggling with body dysmorphia or an eating disorder and it turns out there's a serious danger to her self-image and mental health. (That last part truly isn't directed at you, I understand that this is a stage presence video, it just makes me sad, because I remember NOT being famous at that age and feeling like how people treated me was directly connected to how pretty, sweet, and available I could make myself, regardless of my own feelings or health. It has to be even worse for some idols.) Chaeyoung - I'm interested in a comparison video of Chae performing the same song over the years to see how and if her stage presence has improved or regressed over the years. Might I suggest "So Hot" MNet Ep 500 vs. "So Hot" from their appearance on Yu Huiyeol's Sketchbook vs. "So Hot" Music Bank 20th Anniversary Special Stage, for example?
For Shuhua, i feel that her body language is often also pretty sloppy/ uninvolved (if she was more defined in her movement she would be more an irene) and also some of her rare facial expressions look like annoyance or boredom
i actually think funnily enough, her hair really hinders her in dancing. she doesn't seem to know how to manage it when it's down (and her hair is down 80% of the time) so she ends up being preoccupied with removing it from her face whenever she's not on the camera. her lack of hairography really does contribute to the feeling of sloppiness imo. as someone who also has long hair and a fair bit of experience dancing, i can't imagine not rehearsing at least once with the hairstyle i'll perform in. when your hair is the length of a literal limb, you have to treat it as such in the choreo as well. i think gidle's rapid rise to fame really caused the girls to so overworked, they didn't have time for self-improvement until soojingate. it sucks bc as far as i know, shuhua practiced endlessly and even came to korea a month earlier in order to improve, but there's only so much that can be done without proper direction.
i agree with the wonyoung one a lot! she looks so neat and pretty on stage but she repeats her expressions a lot especially the winking :< i hope she improves on that!
Wonyoung look always photogenic..after all this is her beauty since she is born..yet i think wonyoung has stop winking thing also she did enjoy the stage for me
Even her hair doesn't really change that much, I'd love to see her with another hair colour that isn't just another shade of brunette/black. Maybe red hair? I think she'd suit red hair alot
just coming back since its been around a year to say that I think Shuhua has really grown in the time since this video was made. Queencard wasn't everyone's cup of tea but she really got into performing and her stage presence imo has been exponentially better since.
it's amazing how you can look at these idols and tell exactly what they're doing wrong and analyze it so perfectly. i'd watch these fancams and feel like something's wrong and that i don't like their stage presence, but i could never express it so clearly with words.
Tbh I don't give a damn about San's overperforming, it's what attracted me to him and why he became my favorite Kpop performer and current male Ult Bias I'm a dancer that also exxagerates a lot when it comes to expressions and I can say for sure that I took that from him and Ateez (They're like role models to me) The way we see idols and like their stage presence ends up being a subjective thing and I'm just someone who loves overperformers and people with the weirdest expressions, I relate to them in a certain way... A thing that I find awful tho is just how much hate comments targeted towards San (and Tsuki of Billlie too) have ableist intent? Like people call them slurs and send them hate which is never a good thing to do... Anyways, stan Ateez and Billlie
I agree but I think that reason, him being your bias, or one of them for me, sometimes doesn't allow us to see the whole picture and why he should tone down sometimes. Bc he is our favorite, and if we like this type of performer ofc we aren't going to mind, but we should look at the whole group overall not only him. And then is when we can notice that he can overshadow the rest at times and unbalance the whole group performance.
Since Bouncy era, I think San has improved a lot and he’s no longer overperforming 😊he’s still very energetic but there are significantly less awkward facial expressions/dance movements which is good.
I think you're right. I can say, that now in Nxde, Shuhua seems to me that she's getting better, which is awesome. She is super talented and hard-working and it just killed me inside that she buried it by her dull expression.
I agree on Chaeyoung 100% :( maybe one day we will see her big improvement. And as for now, Shuhua has improved so much!!! Wow I'm shocked. Nude is perfect for her
About San, i agree! But i have noticed that since halazia he's been "overperfoming" less! He still has that energy and passion but now it doesn't seem that off with the group and i guess it's better for his own health too (some moves be looking like he will tear apart really)
just from shuhua's section my contribution to this section is that this seems to be a problem for g-idle's visual members in general. offstage shuhua and miyeon are silly and entertaining but on stage they just have to be "pretty" because they're the pretty ones. like, idle seems to have their own very set regimented roles. soyeon and minnie are the charismatic ones who have the expressions and the fierceness, shuhua and miyeon are the pretty ones so they have to look like dolls, yuqi is in between. i will say, shuhua's responibility in the group has increased since soojin left and she has 100000x more lines and different formations to do so she's probably focusing more on all of that and just looking pretty like her company wants her to
one thing i will strongly disagree with though is "looks can only get you so far" its kpop, looks are everything and will take her everywhere, especially as a "visual" member. the same is to be said about wonyoung. part of the reason she is so huge as possible THE representative idol of the 4th generation is 85% because she's so pretty. if she wasn't an idol she'd be just as popular as a model or an actress because she IS that pretty. just look at snsd's yoona and bae suzy, they're still super popular as top gg visuals
also i'm not into ateez but the section about san really cuaght me off guard with how he was over performing. i've read some of the comments and all of the fans are like "we like it so whatever" but it's total overkill. he'd be AMAZING as a soloist and i think overperforming in that scenario is good bc you're the main attraction but when you're in another group it just looks very off. like, kpop is all about synchronized dance and when san is banging his head 50% harder than everyone else it really doesn't look as knife sharp. everything in kpop is rehearsed even down to the smallest gesture to maintain that sharpness of choreography so i really don't know how jyp of all people (control freak old man) can just let that kind of over performing happen?
@@ivyward1393 you definetley misunderstood my point. By saying "looks will get you far" I was talking on stage presence specifically as this is a stage presence video. I am well aware of the power of looks in kpop I did a whole hour video on it, I'm not ignorant in that area. My point was that many people like to watch fancams of pretty idols just because they are pretty and I don't have a problem with that, but people will get bored with watching someone who has zero substance in their stage presence.
@@ivyward1393this is very late but ateez is not under jyp. they’re under a small label called kq where they have worked their asses off since debut to get where they are on their own. just wanted to correct what you said bc i think ateez deserves the credit for where they’ve gotten themselves 🤗
while i think it's great that san has a lot of passion and clearly loves performing, what bothers me the most is that he is in a group, and should prioritize keeping in sync/the overall unity of their stage. his desire to lose himself completely in the music comes off as a bit selfish -- it's one thing to add your own flair, but he goes so wild that the entire performance loses its balance. he should save that energy for solo stages and be a little more mindful of keeping things cohesive imo
This is such a great comment, I think that’s why his intensity bothers me-as a soloist or part of a dance crew he’d be great, but as part of an idol group he sometimes throws the performance off balance and takes a bit too much attention in parts that aren’t his/full group shots. He’s a standout dancer in a group full of fantastic dancers, but he should take a page out of SuA’s book and learn when to tone it down and when to explode with energy.
Kpop idols can smile all they want, but nothing gets me more excited than a NOICE 🤌🏻 stank face when the dancing is just ✨immaculate✨. Like absolutely tear it up, but I think stage presence is definitely nuanced in terms of preference of what is “good or bad.” Some enjoy all smiles and fairy looks and I enjoy the grit and smiles alike. As long as the performer is EMOTING and not just a deadpan expression. I just want to see the passion an artist has while performing.
Not liking these comments about San from y’all. No one has to like the way he performs, but the “he needs an exorcist” jokes are getting old. Atinys have been dealing with ableism and straight mocking comments from all kpop fans about him and Ateez. Just say you don’t like him and move on. Can’t blame atinys for getting defensive when tiktok comments calling San a “dog with rabies” are getting hundreds of likes.
I just wanted to say I really appreciate all the hard work u’ve been putting into ur editing and I appreciate ur creativity in terms of fonts and backgrounds u’ve been using🥰🥰
I have to say something about Wonyoung here. I love IVE, their concept, their music and I were so happy when I saw them at the big concert in Germany. I am not Wonyoung biased, I casually listened to Izone and didn't watch produce so I had absolutely no opinion about her when I started listening to IVE. Then I saw them at the concert and girl, they all looked stunning and did a great job performing. But Wonyoung really shined. I watched her from my seat and thought: Wow, this is a real celebrity. Really, she is impressive on the stage, and even if she is just talking or standing she has something magical about her, I was really blown away. I have to say I do not see her lacking in terms of stage presence or performance when it comes to Live shows. They were really professional and powerful for a rookie group especially. But I love your videos, I just had to mention this :)
san's like the theater kid of kpop - he performs for the back of the room, which is a theater saying that refers to the necessity of exaggerating your facial expressions and gestures so your emotions come through even in the cheap seats (definitely a useful skill if you're selling out arenas!). so i personally don't mind that he goes ham, but i get how it can be distracting/off-putting - it helps that he's surrounded by people who are just as extra as he is (if not more - some of those guerrilla seonghwa fancams?? hello) hope i didn't come off as overprotective lmao
you're right about the other members tho - psychorious recently said hongjoong could do the literal bare minimum and ooze charisma, and i personally think seonghwa's the best at catching subtle emotional nuances, his inception fancams are god-tier
I'm glad I found this vid, I never see anyone talking about stage presence or blank facial expressions. I've kept my thoughts to myself because I know people can get super overprotective and can't handle constructive criticism at all. Super refreshing to not just hear blind praise.
when it comes to san i guess its just what you like to watch in a performance. if he overperforms then i guess thats what i like to experience.. what i like about san and ateez is that they are unpredictable and its genuinely thrilling to watch them perform! if you dont like 'overperforming' then maybe its just a taste thing imo...
now am convince that atiny are weird people, unpredictable, no he is not, he do the same in all the performance, San is just doing to much that look ridiculous sometimes, as a new atiny I was shook that people like that, like NOOO is uncomfortable and it does not look profesional but I guess some people have cheap taste.
@@rowanjoy419 That's the way they like performers not cheap taste. Energetic. A lot of dancers exaggerate their performances and San to me is no different.Of course it can kinda get irritating if he is unsync but I think the way he performs shows passion. This is coming from someone who isn't an Atiny.
@@rowanjoy419 if it so uncomfy to watch san then why you have playlists saved of him?? youre the weird one here lol.. also i have seen dance crews dance like san and ateez and if you dont like it, im sure there is some other group you can watch instead ❤
@@rowanjoy419 people clearly have different tastes when it comes to performance, but calling smth "cheap" is extremely rude and condescending, besides making no sense. i hope you dont act like this usually
@@Ergolamia im a atiny. I like San, not his stage presence but I like him. Like everglow up like Chaeyoung and Soobin, but no their stage presence. now you understand why I said that people are hypocritic, you can accept when everglow up say that, but not me. I'm weird, but everybody is in a way. I just saying that when he over performance looks messy, the movements are not clean if he just slow down a bit, would look great, but I afraid that his fans would silence me. My issue with the comment is saying that it is unpredictable when is not, when you watch him just two times you can already predict him, I now this because I'm a new atiny and I can predict him already.
I thought the exact same about Shuhua as you and then I saw her live at Frankfurt this year and she's actually improved so much! Maybe it's a difference between recordings and lives but damn I was not expecting her to have the presence she had!
chaeyoung was one of the best performers back in sixteen. maybe it's just twice's earlier cute concepts that didn't fit her that made her regress so much, but i feel like if she's just in her own element and in her own sound, then she would shine so much. she's already so creative and artistic, shown in her song writing skills, she just needs to put that in her live performances
Her preformances of Icon during her rap part on tour really disappointed me but I hope she can get more motivation and energy cause she's far far away from non talented person.
@@AB-yk2pq very true! the girl is so talented, she has the creativity and artistry which are two of the most important things to possess in the music industry. if she just puts that energy into her stage presence then she would unstoppable
Hii bestie😊 I was actually surprised when I saw Chaeyoung here, I thought it was gonna be Dahyun but I agree. Just watched her icon performance and I was like "Girl do something, you're spitting facts, you should be screaming the lyrics like other rappers do"
@@velvetieyuri hello to u too bestie! hope you're having a great day 💖 i don't think that chaeyoung necessarily needs to shout or scream her raps to better her stage presence, but more like she just needs to have more confidence and energy when she does so. when u think of other rappers like jennie, lisa, soyeon, jessi, hyuna, cl, etc., u can feel the confidence that they have whenever they rap. chaeyoung just needs to reclaim the energy she had back in sixteen not only to better herself as a rapper, but also a performer as a whole
i always knew something was bothering me about dayeon’s stage presence, but i couldn’t put it into words until you said it! you explain things really well, and i love these types of videos so much. thank you for all the effort you put in! :)
one video that would be amazing is idol who improved their stage presence the most over the years? maybe not the best performers but the ones the worked hard to get better? usually i dont see much improvement in kpop since most idols have a persona on stage ans they stick with it i would love to see who you picked and your opinions on them!
i think wonyoung’s schtick just works for some people and not others. as a huge wonyo stan i will melt any time she winks bc she’s so adorable but i understand that for those not aboard the wonyoung train that it could be seen as boring or even cringey. totally agree with chaeyoung too, been a once since 2016 and she kinda been serving dead fish on stage since more&more era which sucks because i know what a capable performer she is. i know her fans like that about her but i am really just waiting on her to SERVE
Thank you for this!! As a performer, I cannot say my vocals or dancing are spectacular, but what I do wow ppl with is my stage presence, and it honestly comforts me a lot that i can just slip into this persona on stage
Honey. Have you thought about making a podcast on Spotify or something like this? Seriously I love listening to you while studying and cleaning. Even if I don't agree with everything you say, your tone of voice and the way you deliver content is very professional. I feel like I'm listening to an interesting lecture of my favorites teacher
I’m always asking myself where San gets his energy from. I love the passion. But I do think he oftentimes stands out too much when looking at the group as a whole. Personally my favourite performer in ATEEZ is Hongjoong. He’s fierce and crazy when he needs to be, sensual when it’s appropriate and overall he just seems _in touch_ with the essence of each song.
I just love all of them 🤩 Their chemistry while performing is so fun to watch. Especially the rap line . The energy they bring to the performance is insane . Also there are other members like Yeosang and Yunho to create perfect balance . So their performances are not too much nor too less.
ruclips.net/video/yShZunHQb0g/видео.html&ab_channel=COLORONCOLOR - I watched this performance of San (where he decided to tone it down) and it was like watching a whole different person LOL. He's mentioned how he personally didn't rlly like performing like this and sticking with a "pretty face" but I get why his stage presence isnt for everyone. Nonetheless, he's still one of my favorite performers in kpop and I commend him for sticking to his mindset and style regardless of what haters say.
There was this rap performance of Chaeyoung and some other JYP rappers during a JYP concert. And she was really good there. Makes me wonder if the problem might be Twice's concept
(Commenting twice because Cheryl liked my other comment) Shuhua -> unpopular opinion: her stage presence didn't improve in Tomboy era, she just got the opportunity to show her dance skills Wonyoung -> She and TXT's Soobin are part of the "I am supposed to look like a visual rather than a performer" club Dayeon -> I believe people can develop other stage presence styles, but the dominant type requires a level/type of confidence Dayeon doesn't seem to have on stage Joy -> she is actually similar to Yoona, her smile is her strength and when the concept doesn't require it they still have their body language, but it feels like something is missing Chaeyoung -> same as Dayeon, except Chaeyoung doesn't try to be dominant, which is kind of a problem sometimes, because her rapping is her main skill yet she looks like she doesn't know what to do in front of an audience San -> already commented about him, but I wanna talk about how you said "every PROFESSIONAL fancam", let's stop giving money to unofficial fancams. Back to San, his case is a proof that people think facials = stage presence, just because his facials are perfect it doesn't mean he has no room for improvement PS:. for a second I thought you put Taemin on this list, ily and your content but I was about to write an whole essay about why the five members of Shinee are not allowed in this video
@@salembejaoui1880 I think her styling improved and fits her well, which contributes to her being slightly more interesting to look, but her stage presence is really not it.
Girl if you're talking about improvement , then sky is the limit . And San is just a few inches away from that sky . Meanwhile other idols are still struggling to take off. I'm not trying to put down other idols but as compared to them he's much better. If we really want to criticize someone , people will really take out the slightest point. Of course he has a room for improvement. But I love that we don't know where he has to improve. And when this happens , it means that the artist is doing something out of the norms and is going his own way . And even if a few ( not really few tho) people are liking it , he should stick to his originality ☺️
As someone who started stanning atz becaus of San, I only notice his overperforming issues after looking at the groups' dance practice/fancams, he tends to be unsync with the other members sometimes due to his own body rhythm(?)(the way he feels the music KJKSDA i have no idea how to put this in actual words) i find it slightly annoying because of the unsync-ness, but I personally think he have more control in their latest comeback, or maybe I just simply like san HAHA i liked the way you compiled and made this list! great job!! (and yes i was cleaning my room while listening to this😂
Your videos really help me with my own dance journey and working on my own "stage presence," I love how you actually explain everything in detail rather than just saying "this is bad because I say so"
I guess I can understand what you mean about San, but he is honestly the reason I got into ATEEZ. I absolutely love every facial expression he makes, because it’s authentic. None of that practiced same old recycled facial expressions. He really captures the emotions of the song completely. I always favour performers who don’t make me bored, and I could honestly watch San non stop all day and not get bored. He is one of a kind.
This is the first of your videos I've seen, and I like that you added those computer tabs at the top. Itxs an interesting and creative way to mark the sections. 😊 Good job.
I personally feel like shuhua improved a lot on their latest comeback! while I still think that there's room for more, nxde era really made her entire aura change!
Idols with bad stage presence really irk me. Not to the point where I actively hate on them or post nasty things online (i wouldn't do that to anyone), but it makes me impossible to stan them. Even if every other member has good stage presence, the idol who doesn't sticks out like a sore thumb and brings down the whole stage. They don't have to be 100% on every single stage (bc it's relatively impossible to do that without experiencing burn out), but if it's consistently 0%... yeah, i'll take my attention elsewhere.
I agree with the majority, except for wonyoung. I've been to some shows where IVE performed, and from what I've seen she NEVER lacks energy on stage. In the live performance, she and the other members as well we're all giving their 100% and i could SEE it. Wonyoung isn't even my bias in IVE but the way she interacts with the audience is honestly captivating.
hey not really related to the topic, but thanks for using WJSN's Last Sequence in your vid. really happy to know you also appreciate the song enough to use it.
Shuhua face is so dramatic that i actually find her a good performer in idle, i prefer her stage presence than miyeon for example. Miyeon lack of control in her upper body during dance make her stand out in a negative way
I'm so glad you're making these more regular because legit I love everything you've done and often find myself just watching/listening to your vids a lot while I'm working or chilling. You're a really great orator and your voice is so amazing and suites the content you're delivering... a total slay.... love you queen! Keep doing what you do because you're amazing! 💜💙
i had noticed chae's lack of stage presence in the most recent comebacks and it's heartbreaking cuz she can do this, she's definitely able. its sad to see that
It's one thing to not particularly enjoy San's style of performing but it's a whole other to put that man on a list of idols that are STRUGGLING with stage presence...he has phenomenal presence. period. He is simply a highly energetic and CRAZY performer and it suits some of our preferences and it doesn't suit others...however, nobody can claim he is strugglying with presence. That's just ridiculous.
1:04 for those asking, the instrumental is Last Sequence by WJSN
Honestly you definitely have some good points made about the idols and I’m really enjoying ur vids so far. Tho forgive me for being stupid, but what exactly is a “dominant performer” ?I thought it’s synonymous with being charismatic.
@@rnagrump6069 You arent stupid stop don't say that!😭 A dominant performer is an idol with strong facial features (like a sharp nose or cheebones) that require them to have subtle facial expressions in performances but have strong body language ( which is the none verbal way a person uses their body to communicates their message e.g the way they walk across the stage.) take the way hwasa (dominant) walks across the stage vs how IU (sensual) walks across the stage. Dominant performers include but arent limited to: Hwasa of Mamamoo, Shownu of Monsta X, and Aisha of Everglow.
Last Sequence's instrumental is beautifulll
last sequence is such a good song! I hope it's not their disbandment song
Eunseo is so pretty btw 😍
Chae's regression in her stage presence is genuinely heartbreaking, she was a force to be reckoned during Sixteen, legit look at every stage she did during the show and you'll see she ATE. Only Jihyo was confident enough to go head to head with her because of how much of an Ace she is.
The problem is that Chae just did *not* match Twice's concept. She always stood out doing covers such as Greedy or Move, songs that suit her better than Twice's comebacks.
It's such a shame to see her lose that power in her stage presence.
I was thinking the same thing. That her issue might be the twice concept. I remember that JYP concert performance with other JYPE rappers where she had the long ponytails. She was very charismatic there
I do get where are you coming from, but my question is- how she isn't in full mode for songs that aren't typical Twice or in songs she's written? Even when she's given more lines and freedom, there isn't a change.
@James Williams What do you mean she doesn't? She's one of Twice members with most writing credits and she even participated in producing once. The members who write songs also distribute lines, and as time goes they're more involved in MV, choreographies, outfits and so on.
Chae is such a wasted talent, during Sixteen, she has such a strong rap game, she's an all-rounder. But this is not fully shown. JYP has a strong favoritism, and honestly, they should've debuted her as a solo before Nayeon. No hate or anything for Nayeon btw.
@@nyek1246 Maybe Chaeyoung wasn't ready to debut solo, maybe the schedule was too tight (so it was for Nayeon cause she looked tired during the tour as well), maybe she's working on it.... people are always ready to assume.
At the end of day-Nayeon is the oldest, centre, a lead vocalist and dancer.
Chaeyoung as every member of Twice has shown her writing skills and this comeback she also wrote a song.
chaeyoung was my pick in sixteen but as soon as she debuted she was immediately overshadowed. I was pretty shocked when it came to cheer up where everyone was smiling I could see her in the background of their shot with a blank look
Truth. It’s actually sad cuz she was SO GOOD in Sixteen. I was hoping she would drastically improve once they stopped doing Uber cute concepts, but she’s still pretty dead.
I feel like the only time she wasn't overshadowed was in fancy era , she also got her first 1 million view fancam.
Yes, she is soooo good in Sixteen. Very strong rap game. Imagine being a stable major. But i mean, with JYP's history, i'm not shock anymore, with so many wasted talents.
I loved Chaeyoung and Somi in Sixteen. They were my picks. Chaeyoung also did really well during Fancy promotions (I felt like she also stood out the most in the MV too).
But for their other songs? Sigh. Idk what happened. She was so charismatic before.
maybe cause her personality is completely different from twices concept
I would add Dahyun as she has a big smile on her face at all times no matter what. I would really like to see Bahiyyih develop more confidence as she always looks so terrified and her fancams look like she's actively memorizing the dance - even when she tries to smile, it's like she's about to cry.
Bahiyyih’s MVSK performance (1/4/22) was honestly her best fan cam so far. I love her to death and I can’t really see where you think she’s about to cry in some performances, but she does this thing where she mouthes other lyrics(?). It’s not completely bothersome, but I think it takes away from her performance and does make it look like she’s trying to memorize parts.
@@seongminluv7554 i love her mvsk fancam, that concept really suited her!
@@seongminluv7554 huening bahiyyih fans... always trying to polish trash
Agreed I think dayhun has regressed in performance as well, the big smile is honestly creepy at this point. Which is sad as she can really put all her expression in her dancing and it makes you want to like and watch her more but the smiling makes me uncomfortable lol
@@whatreallymatters571 talk that talk is mature concept again so lets hope we get to see her better side : )
I don't think wonyoung is a bad performer in a sense but she lacks focus in my personal opinion. When she tries to look appealing on stage her dancing loses its sharpness/edge (a lot of the time when she does this she ends up looking weak) and when she does dance she loses her facial expressions and looks deadpan. Honestly she needs to learn how to do both at the same time or else she would suffer in terms of presence.
let's try to understand from her perspective. she was much better in terms of stage presence in iz*one because she didn't have so much pressure. now, of course she has to look cute and prioritize that over other things, because that's what people notice about her. they don't talk about her dancing or vocals anymore, they only talk about her looks. of course she'll focus on looks. she's young and everyone is watching her, judging her, pressuring her.
in summary: wonyoung doesn't lack focus. she only changed the way she performed after leaving iz*one because now people only care about her looks instead of her talent and hard work.
@@ncteno I understand your point and there are parts we agree on (e.g. public opinion/scrutiny) but this has always been her issue even from her time in izone. I do like her better as an ive member because she is more in her element with the group's concepts but in terms of her performance she has always been too fixated on either one of performing with her body vs performing with her face (and rarely ever does both together, which is detrimental). Again not saying she's bad because she is above average in comparison to most of the current active idols, it's just that what she lacks does stick out so much you can't help but notice.
i agree with this, i don't think she's a bad performer at all and she was even my favorite performer back in iz*one. she's beautiful and honestly good for her for using that to her advantage for her facial expressions, but based on her performances these days, it can only get you so far
in ive, i have always wondered why i'm bothered by wonyoung's facial expressions but not by yujin's when both mostly rely on their facial expressions to boost their stage presence, then i realized 2 things: 1.) wonyoung's facial expressions looks too rehearsed and kinda "forced" even, while yujin's just feels more natural and it looks like it just really comes to her at the moment. of course it's still rehearsed, but the thing is she doesn't make it _look_ like it. and 2.) wonyoung makes facial expressions that looks good for _her,_ while yujin makes facial expressions that looks good _for the song._ i feel like that's their main difference
again, no hate to wonyoung, but if she just feels the songs she's performing and just enjoy whilst doing so, i feel like it would greatly improve her stage presence. she's already a good performer, she just needs a little more "push"
Actually wonyoung is great clean dancer in izone,she had lose weight..tho you can expect her after she is overworked..i feel yujin trying always being sexy in ive..i feel this is off...i prefer a person enjoy on the stage ..even i know wonyoung is overworked tho.
She is really charismatic person
@@lavienrosewon8811 she lost so much weight, i'm very worried about her. in iz*one she looked so healthy and happy, now her fingers are so bony. i only hope it's not what we think it is, and she's taking care of herself.
Shuhua and Hyewon share the same struggle of a beginner dancer. When your dance foundation is weak, your brain would focus almost entirely on not messing up the choreography, thus starring soullessly to the camera just so they could focus. Take Lia for example. She is definitely not bad as a sensual performer, but when Itzy’s choreo are constantly super challenging to her level, her expressions fall flat as soon as there’s a hard dance break comes up. And when she tries to tone down the moves to focus on her stage presence (and to breathe! And to sing!), she’s at great risk of being crucified by netizens as “lazy”. The companies really really needs to provide these idols way better dance and body condition trainings so they could elevate their dance skills, then maybe just maybe, the stage presence would be elevated as well. Yes Cube I am looking at you.
yes youre right
idk hyewon really but remembering the choreo and lyrics is hard enough never mind the facial expressions and natural body language! and shuhua also has her accent to work on. its understandable shuhua isnt keeping up with them when shes practising so many songs for world tour and learning a lot of soojins parts, but hopefully she keeps improving next time idle comes back.
as for cube ent i feel like they only thing they can do well is produce good music, but when groups/idols dont do well they throw them away really easily although all they have to do is invest in them a little more to help them be successful. i feel like this is partly to do with the culture of netizens wanting new groups all the time and when the novelty of a group wears off they want new groups and its hard to keep up with so many, cube just needs to be more considerate of the people theyre chucking out
But hyewon looks disinterested most of of the time. It's like she doesn't want to be there. She doesn't give enough energy in her performances. Even those relay videos she looks bored
@@coolkid-xc1yi that we don’t know for sure. Whether what you speculate is true or not, we can’t deny the fact that she quite literally was just thrown into the group with such intense and intricate choreography while not having nearly any adequate dance foundation. Your brain can only retain so much information, it’s next to impossible to focus on appropriate stage presence when you barely could keep up with the choreo. The fact that I’m defending Hyewon while she’s literally my least favorite IZ*ONE member by very far, means you don’t have to like someone to just state the facts and logics.
Some people, no matter how much training they get, will never be good dancers. Tiffany from SNSD comes to mind.
(And no this isn't hate. I've been following SNSD for over ten years, and Tiffany was my bias during many eras).
@@blahblahsuperanon that is true, it’s really coming down to how much they understand and able to translate the knowledge into their body movements. However, Tiffany, despite still being the weakest dancer in SNSD OT9, has improved a lot after she went solo and received LA level training.
I really think that SM forced the "sexy dynamite" title on Joy and she almost looked like she is forced to do it. During Peekaboo, really bad boy, bad boy,Psycho ....Joy didn't looked like she enjoyed performing them with SM putting her in uncomfortable outfits most of the time. But in Red Flavour, Queendom, Feel my Rhythm, umpah umpah, power up....she genuinely looked happy performing them. And her height difference with the members also made her look awkward while dancing since she is always trying to match her members height.
I agree that the height difference makes a big difference
Sm love oversexualized second visuel in their group
Actually with the Sexy Dynamite thing, it all started when one of their directors was just having fun and called her that. It amused her so much that she brought it up in several conversations(and the other members as well), to the point that it eventually just stuck with the fandom.
She seems to be very proud of the title but indeed, in an effort to make her look more sensual, she's forced to dress in clothes that are either too tight for her or too short, and matching the other members' height is also a good point.
@@bananabunch4590 yea we’ll said
i don't think that sm forced the "sexy dynamite" title on joy since, as another commenter said, she seems to be proud of the title. although i do agree that she shines more in red velvet's red concepts rather than their velvet ones. as you've said, it's probably because she's dressed in such uncomfortable outfits in their velvet concepts since it's their sexy/mature ones, which probably then affects her stage presence. i saw a clip of her dancing in comfortable clothes and her dancing and energy was so much better than what she gives on stage
Looking back at this video a year later, Shuhua has improved a LOT in her stage presence. She's gotten significantly more confident and with the right concept she lowkey pulls focus from other members
San has actually recently said that he likes to perform the way he does. He spoke about how he once performed more conservatively and didn't like the performance, saying things like "Seeing myself dancing softly just to maintain a pretty face, I thought, is this really the performance that I think of?". This refers to a recent performance where he toned it down.
In other words. He can tone it down, but he himself doesn't like it, and personally I think that over-performing is the thing that makes Ateez what they are.
P.S there is a redd!t thread about this in the Kpopthoughts subredd!t
Edit* trying some things with spelling because my comments get deleted
May I know what performance he toned him down in? I want to watch it.
@@kavitapanchal8422 I think it was their guerrilla performance at the blue house iirc!!
@@kavitapanchal8422 i think it was guerrilla performane at the blue house: ruclips.net/video/8VwrgSHBcSU/видео.html
@@kelseypablo4961 correct
Sigma behavior fair enough
Something about Wonyoung "trying to look good".
I actually like that because in my opinion it's part of her stage presence. The Royal concept of IVE has fits her really well.
I agree! I guess you can define stage presence in whatever appeals to you, but I definitely feel as though she has charisma and her fancams aren't a bore to watch.
yeah she looks so elegant she owns the concept
I completely agree!
@Berleezy’s YoUnG MasTer Lol slay
I feel like her changing it up a bit and adding more fierce looks here and there would do wonders for her and the concept but other than that I agree.
The hair color and hair style on Chaeyoung is so true?! I always have this kind of thoughts when I compare her during Fancy era (Everything about her screams iconic) and Feel Special era (she just faded into the background).
Might sounds controversial but I would even say Chaeyoung is one of those idols that colored-hair help them so much while performing (Notice her best eras are when she dye her hair color)
Omg, I totally agree
The hair colour/makeup/outfit impact on stage presence is literally fascinating to me. You see some idols going viral as soon as they have a different hair colour or a really good look that highlights their beauty. Definitely has a major impact.
And I agree, not every idol fit the crazy hair colour, but Chaeyoung definitely does!
Fancy was definitely designed for her. I fell in love with her whole looks during that era. Then they changed the color I was ok fine still looks gorgeous, but then feel special came. They thinned out her hair and honestly her whole fancy charm was gone. But for me Mina and Dayeon are still the worst performers in twice. Mina always has a blanc face and Dayeon is always just smiling. With Chaeyoung I feel like she loses energy during performing and goes blank
@@Dokemoni I don’t find anything attractive about Mina in terms of stage presence(I love her with my whole heart but I agree that she’s the worst in twice) and Dahyun has improved a lot but she can still improve more, I love her smile but it gets creepy when she keeps smiling throughout, but her cry for me performances were really good imo, I love watching Chaeyoung’s fancams, even though she doesn’t do much, I enjoy watching her, it makes me feel relaxed.
@@Dokemoni Tzuyu seems worse than Dahyun to me
I think one trend here is that female members assigned as "visuals" tend to be known for having somewhat static stage presence. i.e. Twice's Tzuyu, Blackpink's Jisoo, Red Velvet's Irene (I know people stan her around these parts but you can't deny that she's received a lot of criticism for lack of expressions/stiffness in cute concepts in the past), Gfriend's Sowon, Idle's Shuhua, and IVE's Wonyoung.
Some exceptions include Dreamcatcher's Jiu, EXID's Hani, and Mamamoo's Solar.
Notably, groups like Purple Kiss, TXT, and Billlie have pretty solid performances across the board (not all perfect, but no standout "bad" performers relatively) and also no assigned visual positions.
this is a great take
Jieun's needs a Spotlight
U forgot to i include Miyeon like she looks so bored on stage, shuhua at least tries to give us energy, but Miyeon looks so static
I would Loona’s Heejin, she have arguably one of, if not the best, stage presence of the group and Korea clearly considers her the visual (I know they don’t have official positions besides leader)
I like how you said “around these parts” like this is a western film
I love your editing in this it's great!
I personally don't mind San's overperforming, but I get your point. I just want to say that I'm thankful you mentioned the constant ableism about how people make fun of his performance style. Like yeah, if it's too much for someone, I get it, but comparing it to seizures, and calling him the r-word is just disgusting. Stan twitter learn to voice your opinion without being disgusting challenge (impossible).
Agreed. I love San a lot and I agree with what Cheryl said in this video. I truly appreciate his passion and I LOVE watching every single one of his fancams.
umm, what's is the "r-word" ?😅😭
@@piss2493 it's a slur said towards disabled people. It's really disgusting for people to say that about San...
@@marsmoment oh, bruh that's so disgusting. Just because a word exists u can't just throw it around so casually 💀
@@piss2493 exactly. non-disabled people still say it to this day and it's just so weird and infuriating.
Chaeyeong is quite the only instance that I would truly call “having good stage presence when she feels like it.” Yep, not Jennie, not the one who suffered from an ankle injury (her insufficient breath/stamina control plays a role as well, but that still doesn’t mean she’s lazy or uninterested). Chaeyeong on the other hand, is quite known as dancing to the beat of her own drum. I truly think she doesn’t fit the Twice concept. The only era I truly can see her popping off is Fancy. Her bubbly sassy gestures were rather subtle, but they truly elevate her stage presence, that legendary strawberry pink hair helps tremendously as well. Everyone knows she owns Fancy era. Other eras though, I could really see she doesn’t fully enjoy them, not like she looked completely deadfaced, but it’s clear they don’t fit her artistry.
@@Diyel the looks tho but in terms of rap flow she doesn't fit in yg
I also think Shuhua actually only has decent stage presence when she wants to. Like every era she has one good fancam and the rest falls flat (her uh oh fancam especially is nice)
@@Faeriiexx
Wish standards are not so low...
yeah i always thought the style/concept of twice is the polar opposite of chaeyoungs style
At this point, I think Jennie is very selective when she does perform. But Chae for sure too, it’s infuriating
i like the idea of branching out from the rankings and doing more exploration into stage presence and general! i think you chose good examples of idols who underperform and overperform but are on the struggle bus nonetheless, and provided actual constructive criticism for these idols. cant wait for your next stage presence video! (also looove the editing style❤️)
same
Of all the groups, Ateez is probably the best group San can be in. In any other group, he would’ve overpowered everyone to the point that it would be a glaring problem. Ateez has to this point been able to keep up and balance out his energy to the most part. Seonghwa as a dramatic elegant performer and Hongjoong as a theatrical charismatic performer really give off this trifecta effect that works well. His good pal Wooyoung also form a wonderful complimentary dynamic with him as seen in the intro to Answer during that one awarding ceremony that I don’t remember. The only reason why I hope San would tone it down is because I don’t think the human body is designed to take the amount of taxing movements he’s doing now. I don’t want him to actually break himself to perform.
That was actually a problem that Jungkook had when he was younger, the BTS members had to tell him to tone it down and pace himself so he wouldnt get hurt during long concerts. It's a skill to be learned for sure.
I agree with everything you said about shuhua. However, the worst for me in idle when it comes to stage presence is Miyeon, she always looks stunning but she is a snooze fest to me on stage. During a performance of Tomboy I literally said to my screen ''come on Miyeon, look alive''. Besides having the same facial expresion during the whole performance, she dances with like zero energy, at least shuhua looks somewhat energetic when she dances. Miyeon looks like she thinks she's gonna break if she moves fast. A perfect example is during the pre chorus of tomboy, the choreography that they gave to yuqi and the one that they gave to Miyeon is very different. Another problem that she has is that she can not adapt to the different concepts that idle has, when she was performing tomboy or my bag, she might as well could have been performing dumdi dumdi.
On another note, I would love to hear your opinions about purple kiss. I was watching a facecam of swan for nerdy and to be honest, I was cringing most of the time.
Facts I honestly feel like Soyeon and Yuqi are the only members currently that enjoy what they do and are fit to be entertiners. The other 3 that are still in the group seem like they are doing it just because they have to and there is no heart into delivering a satisfying performance imo. Also with Purple Kiss I feel so bad for them did they switch producers or something? Why is RBW letting them release garbage?! I miss Zombie era that was the last best song by them. I hope they come back to that kind of concept or their debut concept in Ponzona imo.
@@nelliebellie2222 Damn. Calling it “garbage” is a little too much for some people that actually enjoy the song like me lol
@@nelliebellie2222 Yuqi killed it during this last comeback. For some reason I don't enjoy watching soyeon perform that much, but objectively, I know she has good stage presence. I used to feel kinda 'meh' about Minnie, but I loved her during tomboy, I think she is great. Miyeon and Shuhua need to step up, because the gap between the top 3 and bottom 2 is way too big. As for purple kiss, I don't hate any of their songs, but Ponzoña was truly their peak. Their debut was one of my favorites ever. I'm still hoping that they make Crown a whole song.
@@si_multifandom_ch_5099 Oh mb I should of added in my opinion
@@mairimalvarado5532 not entirely related but Minnie’s stage presence (and all of (G)I-DLE’s presence, tbh) was at its best when they were on Queendom imo
You hit the nail in the head with Dayeon, I’ve been wondering all this time what was off about her stage presence. It’s weird because she is a very good performer, it’s like she cracked the code by ice cream but yet doesn’t seem to know how and in a sense regressed. I’ve always found myself enjoying her fancams way more in up! era, it felt more natural/genuine compared to say wadada. I wonder what are your thoughts on all other kep1er members’ stage presence and how they all interact!!
Yeah her analysis of hers clicked something in my mind that I had perceived but couldn’t really put my finger on it.
I don't know why she's on this list. The main dancers in this group are all like this. I could say the same about xiating and hikaru
@@dinahgraham4964 i completely disagree
San looks like he is going through all the stages of grief in a dragon ball z episode like love the passion he has regarding the music but it gets a bit too much and i am guilty at giggling once or twice.
My headcanon is that he’s just always in his Halateez form when performing live.
@@callmejimpickens5558 what in the pokemonㅡ
It’s gotten better. They’re not centring him 24/7 anymore, so I think he’s getting to shine in his dramaticness, without being overwhelming.
He was def a reason why I didn’t watch their performances for the longest time. For me, he was Too much!
😭😭 Not "all stages of grief in a dragon ball z episode" 💀
omg nooo stop! I can’t with this comment lol 💀💀🤣🤣
You are really gifted at analyzing these performing styles. Dayeon a charismatic trying to be a dominant is so obvious once you say it, but I've never have seen it myself.
I’ve literally only listened to two ateez songs in my entire life, so take this with a grain of salt. Even tho I think San over performing (from the stages I’ve seen) is a thing, I think Guerilla is the perfect song for that. Like when the post chorus kicks in, I think him going batshit insane is perfect for the vibe and energy of the song.
"going batshit insane" thats the perfect definition lol. and i agree
Exactly
I think the issue with Dayeon’s stage presence is the sudden change in facial expressions all the time. She goes from happy and cute to fierce in a second, like she’s fighting with herself. Imo I find her fancams fun to watch because it’s unique and I actually kinda like it?
The issue with Wonyoung is that she tries to multitask on stage, she’s trying to focus on too much at once which is why her mind might be too busy and she keeps repeating the same expressions over and over again. She’s pressured to look pretty which doesn’t help at all.
Some visuals might look a bit off while doing certain expressions which is why I think there’s a pattern where some visuals in k-pop have a blank expression most of the time besides giving a slight smile or a wink or they stick to a certain pallet of expressions.
Your view on Dayeon's stage presence is actually intriguing ngl.
@@everglowup Why thank you 😌
I don't get when the People write wonyoung trying look pretty ...wonyoung is knows pretty, she is just beautiful but her charismatic aura is always here
@@lavienrosewon8811 She’s too pressured to look pretty 24/7. If she looks the slightest bit untidy people will start hating on her again. On stage every idol has to look pretty though
@@bettercallnari wonyoung is pretty after all.i dont get your point...wonyoung look like she did enjoy all the stage for me..she love bring positive vib
Apparently at Kcon yesterday, San was performing so hard that his mic fell off and broke. This is a perfect example of how overperforming *is* a thing and can hinder your performance as a whole. I love him and watching him perform too, but it’s true!
Mic breaking has become a part of San's performance lol. For example, if his mic doesn't break by the end of HALA HALA did he really perform it? lmao
I love when someone overperform
@@annanowak9620 okay no.
@@idkchar olay yes.
but he himself doesn't feel content when he's not performing vigorously. to him, toning it down is underperforming. we have to respect the way he likes to perform.
I agree with everything except Wonyoung. I think her expressions and moves fit Ive's concept (and Izone's before it) so well. I have watched many fancams of Ive and, apart from Yujin who is clearly the best in the group, I find myself coming back to Wonyoung the most.
Yes it's ripetitive, but it doesn't lose appeal for me, even after many performances. I don't mind an idol not changing expressions every performance if I like what they are doing. Sometimes I want to watch exaxtly that thing they do every single time with different outfits. Wonyoung for me is so magnetic. I agree she is trying too much to look perfect on stage but it doesn't take away from my enjoyment of her performance. With a different concept it would be a problem, but with Ive's royal concept it's perfect.
And her "narcissistic, my god I love it" is ICONIC. No one in the group performes that part so well.
I really don't get why people are so annoyed about her wanting to look good: If I was a Kpop idol on stage with millions of eyes on me, you can be sure I will be even more self-conscious as her. Kpop fans are ruthless, 99% of people praise her for her visual, I can't blame her for being cautious on stage. People also don't think that she might be so busy that she might be instructed to go easy, not to mess her hair or make up too much. Also, people don't think that she looks very thin and might not eat enough or have enough nutrients, which can contribute to her lacking energy on stage.
On the other hand, I agree that, while her stage presence is a bit repetitive (like 90% of idols nowadays, you rarely see changes from one stage to another for most idols, especially 4th gen groups), she does not lose her appeal, and she fits the group's concept and is honestly a good performer and a good centre. When the camera is on her, you don't really look at another member.
This! U worded my opinion perfectly
@@jessicajessica4392 wonyoung is the one known best performer during pd48,she know used her charismatic aura since many people praised wonyoung's energy in kpop flex in germany 2022.
I feel wonyoung did enjoy being on the stage also i dont know why is the kpop stans critized her so much when there re winter and mina in kpop industry with blank facial expressions...
agreed!
I think it is what makes Wonyoung fit IVE so much. IVE to me feels like a model group (?), the runways, the fashion, it feels like they are meant to have this repetitive and "robotic" nature to their expresisons and stage presence. They have a set type of aura they need to portray because it fits IVE's concept so much. The beauty and attitude of IVE coexists with the members own stage presence, they need to embrace what it truly is to 'LOVE DIVE', to sink and fall in love so much to the point of no return. That is why Wonyoung's presence fits so well because she has this aura and visual to her that can't make you stop watching her in awe.
I think the problem with San is that K-pop has become a different sector in entertainment industry. As a theatre nerd and a Bharatanatyam (form of Indian classical dance)dancer, this is how we perform. Expressions are never subtle here and that’s why I was drawn to Ateez in first place.
San is a dancer not an idol dancer.
@@24yeffinakawarjri24 true…. Rather than calling him a dancer I would say he’s an awesome performer
Exactly as someone who has been a bharatnatyam dancer for the past 13 years I do take a lot of notes from him cause my stage presence for my dance performances rely on energy and precision and not a lot on facial expressions. His expressions are what draw me in too. He sticks out but not in a bad way.
samee i come from a traditional dance background and i had not really heard of the term "overdancing" until I got into kpop lol. That being said, I absolutely love the way San performs and hope he does not change (but also I understand why it might not be for everyone lmao)
@@marksrealfreak hey….. it’s nice to see another classical dancer here. 🫂
Thanks for your input buddy
your editing is getting so much more creative i love it so much!!!
Tysm! I appreciate it! 😭
i think the reason why people "ignore" san's overperforming is that they like it, so they (we?) dont see it as a flaw.
personally, i love his over the top facial expressions. he can overperform as much as he wants in that regard and I'll love it.
his overly exaggerated body movements, though, ive started to think might be a problem sometimes, because in some past stages its made ateez's whole performance look less coordinated and unified. not in all stages though
my conclusion however is that hes fine the way he is. both his fans and himself enjoy his over the top performance, and hes a bit of an stan attractor thanks to his performance, too. so hes fulfilling his job as an idol, and i see no reason whyd he'd need to change
Exactly I just replied the same to someone! Some of the fans who bias him are mainly focusing on him and not the whole group performance to notice he can unbalance the performance and overshadow at times. Or they do notice but they like him standing out than the rest so they don't mind 🙃
That being said personally I'm torn bc yes he should adapt to the rest(or the others to him, which they do and they did say that's how they improve by looking at each other but it's also not fair sometimes and he should cooperate as well), but also I like that he expresses how he wants and Atz choreographers do emphasize their individuality.
But well no I'm now decided that it should be both. He just needs to find a balance, when and where to unleash! xD
About Joy : I agree with what you said, but I'd add that her outfits certainly don't help her. Half the time she's more focused on pulling her skirt down than on performing, which is 100% not her fault. Her stage presence is noticeably better when she's wearing comfy outfits.
Honestly I never thought about the things you mentioned for Wongyoung, and although I can see your points, I still don't believe she has a problem with her stage presence. I'd say leeseo is the one that imo, struggles in IVE, cause she's forcing a lot of expressions. She's very young though so I can't really be too harsh, she can still learn
I would like for chaeyoung to become more dominant in her stage presence, because imagine that rap in icon, but with a dominant performer.
shuhua's such a force of personality offstage it's a shame it doesn't come through in her performances
I love san's facial expressions and you can see he absolutely enjoys performing, but I think san's musicality is too precise and he tries to match the beat and aura of the song and his body goes into over drive lol. I think if he was a street performer or in a dance crew it would be more appropriate, but his body language feels over the top for being in a kpop group. Non the less he is such a top-tier performer!
I completely agree for shuhua and chaeyoung. Sometimes for these two it looks like they are just getting through the choreography and counting steps or thinking of what they'll have for dinner later or if they left the bathroom light on at home 🤷🏾
Omg San as part of a street dance crew is everything I want in life. He would be AMAZING!
@@everglowup EXACTLY! San still has me in a chokehold from that performance video of pick it up 🥴
@@everglowup hey, I would like to know your opinions on Yena's stage presence (Ex-iz*one)...
I personally love her stage presence and is one of my favourite performer of kpop
The reason he feels perfect for a street dance crew but not as a kpop idol is because we have seen too many blank faces and unenergized people that the standard is so low. We hardly get energetic and on your face idols like Jhope, Momo, San, Sua
@@mimitabiswas4534 The thing is idols r not just dancers, they need balance, otherwise other areas may be compromised. 1 reason idols don't perform like in 17:17 is because it's not possible for everyone to do this all the time, it requires lots of stamina + energy (ppl's health). It's also difficult for rappers/singers (e.g. Rosé) to do this + acc sound GOOD as they have to use that energy not only to perform but also sing (we have enough lip syncers as is😂).
Tbh, whilst some may feel he is better as just a dancer, overdancing like oversinging r real things that r assessed as bad. For e.g. belting the WHOLE song or doing runs every 2 secs. Whilst it might be impressive to do runs + belts, doing so all the time may be overwhelming for the listener. San is a gd performer but performing like him is not necessary in order to have gd stage presence. I like J-hope's performances but he doesn't overperform so the comparison doesn't make sense. No one's against good facial expressions or passion LOL but it should be done in moderation because even too much of something good can be bad.
For me, I don't mind that San is doing 'too much', because of the sheer amount of idols who don't allow themselves to break free of this image of perfection that they cling on to when they are performing. They can come off as overly self-conscious, and while I think it does work in some cases (like Wonyoung, I think she is one of the few exceptions actually), most of the time it makes their stage presence feels half-baked. San gives the impression that he does not give a F about how he looks on stage and he only cares to express himself in the way he interprets the music he performs to. I think that is inspiring and one of his best qualities, and why so many people are drawn to him. I respect your opinion that he is doing 'too much' sometimes, but I excuse it because I applaud his passion for performance and he makes me adjust to his way of performing, not the other way round. A performer who is able to make me adjust to their stage presence despite not being the kind of stage presence that I typically enjoy deserves all my respect and praise.
Thanks for the video!
I agree that San is an amazing performer cause he has no inhibitions, he truly let's himself go and be in the moment and doesn't focus on looking cookie cutter perfect for the camera. On the other hand I can agree that his body language can be borderline cartoonish sometimes 😂 especially when he stands out from the others in such a harsh contrast. It's a double edged sword. But truthfully I prefer an over performer over an underperformer any day.
so, if he does not give a F about, so we can criticizing and you all his fans cannot complain about it-
because im tired of the hypocrisy and how atiny reacts when we criticize his stage presence.
@@rowanjoy419 why did you reply that to this comment where they were respectfully giving their opinion and praising him lmao
@@rowanjoy419 girl chill😭😭you’re the only one in here getting mad that’s embarrassing
@@user-gz7kt7vf1g and what
Wonyoung has that untouchable rich girl vibe that it so captivating to watch. I never get bored with her fancams and always come back it's crazy. I think in their I am era and beyond, her expressions are more natural and it just adds on to her charm. I feel like Yujin has a main character type of energy and wonyoung is more of a mysterious background character that is stan attractor.
i always tought that chaeyoung is the weakest performer in twice not tzuyu as a lot claimed. she always give the bare minium when it comes to sp and always like "meh what im doing here " always bored on stage .at least tzuyu is trying .the hair really helped specially in fancy era tho
yes, Tzuyu might not have the best stage presence but I really see her trying. She gives a smile here and there, but the main point is that when Tzuyu sings her lines, she gives it all. During all these 4 years being an once, I’ve never thought Tzuyu looked bored in stage while singing. And she also improved a lot since that stupid flag scandal (her stage presence before that used to be amazing, I swear).
But I don’t see the same in Chaeyoung. No improvement during all these years. It’s frustrating
I think that because even though Tzuyu doesn't give facial expressions she's consistent with energy she gives and she's grown as a dancer over a year.
While Chaeyoung always somehow seems to give 60% (at best). I do understand that she's a human but it's a shame because she's talented rapper and decent singer.
@@AB-yk2pq yes even jyp point about that during sixteen and said that she always give 80% of her energy in dancing and performing .she never gived her 100% even during a competition . no sighn of improvement after 7 years .the other twice members improved tho
Someone that agrees with me finally! I also don’t find Tzuyu the worse performer of twice. Like I watched some of her fancams of feel special and fancy and I like that she is really trying. But for Chaeyoung no. Everything it’s her clothes and hair. For me she also don’t try to be better
This might be an unpopular opinion but I always thought that Mina had the worst stage presence of Twice.
I don’t know if you’ll read my comment,but I love how you aren’t afraid of giving constructive criticism to your favs instead of just complimenting them for everything,as for your non biases,you also don’t insult everything about them(Wich I’ve seen with another ktubers whom I won’t name) and actually want them to improve and be better.
Overall,I love your stage presence videos and how you give constructive criticism even to your faves,even if you’re a bit hasher at times(wich isn’t a bad thing)
(I apologize if the comment isn’t coherent,English ain’t my first language)
I think San's faciais are perfect, his body language however is too intense sometimes
im a new atiny, and I was like - how can people like this - he looks like he was not doing the same choreo as the rest of them, make me feel uncomfortable, of course in some performance not all of them.
@@rowanjoy419 I agree! I like his stage presence but at the same time it's weird to watch because he sticks out so much it just a bit awkward at times
@@Angel-mv5py Yes, I was watching one performance recently that I wish he calm down because I cannot even pay attention to the music because I just hear thinking how painful dancing with that so much energy must feel. In others he is good and I wish he realize that he is looking to intense haha. he said in the interview with sunmi that he watch the other members perform may he could learn some tricks from them, I still a baby Atiny so idk.
with joy too - you can alway tell if Red Velvet has a live stage when the camera pans to Joy singing. Her face always shows a "pain" expression.
Wonyoung - I have a hard time judging Wonyoung for being hyperfocused on her looks when they are such a main component of her _life_ at this point. She's very young, very thin, very pretty, and trotted out to be fawned upon by all these adults who can't stop cooing over how adorable and gorgeous she is, and many of whom are also openly sexualizing her. She has to deal with other people's fantasies being projected on her at all times while she's still developing. I wonder how people critical of her now will react if it's ever revealed she's struggling with body dysmorphia or an eating disorder and it turns out there's a serious danger to her self-image and mental health.
(That last part truly isn't directed at you, I understand that this is a stage presence video, it just makes me sad, because I remember NOT being famous at that age and feeling like how people treated me was directly connected to how pretty, sweet, and available I could make myself, regardless of my own feelings or health. It has to be even worse for some idols.)
Chaeyoung - I'm interested in a comparison video of Chae performing the same song over the years to see how and if her stage presence has improved or regressed over the years. Might I suggest "So Hot" MNet Ep 500 vs. "So Hot" from their appearance on Yu Huiyeol's Sketchbook vs. "So Hot" Music Bank 20th Anniversary Special Stage, for example?
For Shuhua, i feel that her body language is often also pretty sloppy/ uninvolved (if she was more defined in her movement she would be more an irene) and also some of her rare facial expressions look like annoyance or boredom
Omg you're so right. I think it's more than just her facial expressions being the problem.
i actually think funnily enough, her hair really hinders her in dancing. she doesn't seem to know how to manage it when it's down (and her hair is down 80% of the time) so she ends up being preoccupied with removing it from her face whenever she's not on the camera. her lack of hairography really does contribute to the feeling of sloppiness imo. as someone who also has long hair and a fair bit of experience dancing, i can't imagine not rehearsing at least once with the hairstyle i'll perform in. when your hair is the length of a literal limb, you have to treat it as such in the choreo as well. i think gidle's rapid rise to fame really caused the girls to so overworked, they didn't have time for self-improvement until soojingate. it sucks bc as far as i know, shuhua practiced endlessly and even came to korea a month earlier in order to improve, but there's only so much that can be done without proper direction.
it's ok to say that she can't dance
@@biahao she can dance, as she is dancing, but her dancing is, at times, souless
@@yutisima mmm no she memorizes the steps of a choreography and executes them on stage like a machine that's not dancing
Shuhua is so frustrating because her Vlive presence is top notch 😭
Right? how can an idol being so charismatic off stage but being weak on stage?
@@navitiny9510 Maybe she's simply more comfortable being with fans and her members off stage than when they do an actual preformances. Nerves I guess.
i agree with the wonyoung one a lot! she looks so neat and pretty on stage but she repeats her expressions a lot especially the winking :< i hope she improves on that!
Wonyoung look always photogenic..after all this is her beauty since she is born..yet i think wonyoung has stop winking thing also she did enjoy the stage for me
@@lavienrosewon8811 Yep
i agree about the wonyoung one, the only thing different each time is her outfits and hair
Even her hair doesn't really change that much, I'd love to see her with another hair colour that isn't just another shade of brunette/black. Maybe red hair? I think she'd suit red hair alot
just coming back since its been around a year to say that I think Shuhua has really grown in the time since this video was made. Queencard wasn't everyone's cup of tea but she really got into performing and her stage presence imo has been exponentially better since.
It's weird seeing the Shuhua section now that we had two comebacks with good stage presence from her xd
it's amazing how you can look at these idols and tell exactly what they're doing wrong and analyze it so perfectly. i'd watch these fancams and feel like something's wrong and that i don't like their stage presence, but i could never express it so clearly with words.
Tbh I don't give a damn about San's overperforming, it's what attracted me to him and why he became my favorite Kpop performer and current male Ult Bias
I'm a dancer that also exxagerates a lot when it comes to expressions and I can say for sure that I took that from him and Ateez (They're like role models to me)
The way we see idols and like their stage presence ends up being a subjective thing and I'm just someone who loves overperformers and people with the weirdest expressions, I relate to them in a certain way... A thing that I find awful tho is just how much hate comments targeted towards San (and Tsuki of Billlie too) have ableist intent? Like people call them slurs and send them hate which is never a good thing to do...
Anyways, stan Ateez and Billlie
Amazing video btw!! I agree with almost everything you said about all the idols mentioned ^^
I agree but I think that reason, him being your bias, or one of them for me, sometimes doesn't allow us to see the whole picture and why he should tone down sometimes. Bc he is our favorite, and if we like this type of performer ofc we aren't going to mind, but we should look at the whole group overall not only him. And then is when we can notice that he can overshadow the rest at times and unbalance the whole group performance.
MAMAMOO stays undefeated in stage presence. (And live vocals, naturally!)
Since Bouncy era, I think San has improved a lot and he’s no longer overperforming 😊he’s still very energetic but there are significantly less awkward facial expressions/dance movements which is good.
I think you're right. I can say, that now in Nxde, Shuhua seems to me that she's getting better, which is awesome. She is super talented and hard-working and it just killed me inside that she buried it by her dull expression.
I agree on Chaeyoung 100% :( maybe one day we will see her big improvement.
And as for now, Shuhua has improved so much!!! Wow I'm shocked. Nude is perfect for her
About San, i agree! But i have noticed that since halazia he's been "overperfoming" less! He still has that energy and passion but now it doesn't seem that off with the group and i guess it's better for his own health too (some moves be looking like he will tear apart really)
just from shuhua's section my contribution to this section is that this seems to be a problem for g-idle's visual members in general. offstage shuhua and miyeon are silly and entertaining but on stage they just have to be "pretty" because they're the pretty ones. like, idle seems to have their own very set regimented roles. soyeon and minnie are the charismatic ones who have the expressions and the fierceness, shuhua and miyeon are the pretty ones so they have to look like dolls, yuqi is in between. i will say, shuhua's responibility in the group has increased since soojin left and she has 100000x more lines and different formations to do so she's probably focusing more on all of that and just looking pretty like her company wants her to
one thing i will strongly disagree with though is "looks can only get you so far" its kpop, looks are everything and will take her everywhere, especially as a "visual" member. the same is to be said about wonyoung. part of the reason she is so huge as possible THE representative idol of the 4th generation is 85% because she's so pretty. if she wasn't an idol she'd be just as popular as a model or an actress because she IS that pretty. just look at snsd's yoona and bae suzy, they're still super popular as top gg visuals
also i'm not into ateez but the section about san really cuaght me off guard with how he was over performing. i've read some of the comments and all of the fans are like "we like it so whatever" but it's total overkill. he'd be AMAZING as a soloist and i think overperforming in that scenario is good bc you're the main attraction but when you're in another group it just looks very off. like, kpop is all about synchronized dance and when san is banging his head 50% harder than everyone else it really doesn't look as knife sharp. everything in kpop is rehearsed even down to the smallest gesture to maintain that sharpness of choreography so i really don't know how jyp of all people (control freak old man) can just let that kind of over performing happen?
@@ivyward1393 you definetley misunderstood my point. By saying "looks will get you far" I was talking on stage presence specifically as this is a stage presence video. I am well aware of the power of looks in kpop I did a whole hour video on it, I'm not ignorant in that area. My point was that many people like to watch fancams of pretty idols just because they are pretty and I don't have a problem with that, but people will get bored with watching someone who has zero substance in their stage presence.
@@ivyward1393this is very late but ateez is not under jyp. they’re under a small label called kq where they have worked their asses off since debut to get where they are on their own. just wanted to correct what you said bc i think ateez deserves the credit for where they’ve gotten themselves 🤗
Funny, how Shuhuas stage presence improved so much right after this.
while i think it's great that san has a lot of passion and clearly loves performing, what bothers me the most is that he is in a group, and should prioritize keeping in sync/the overall unity of their stage. his desire to lose himself completely in the music comes off as a bit selfish -- it's one thing to add your own flair, but he goes so wild that the entire performance loses its balance. he should save that energy for solo stages and be a little more mindful of keeping things cohesive imo
This is such a great comment, I think that’s why his intensity bothers me-as a soloist or part of a dance crew he’d be great, but as part of an idol group he sometimes throws the performance off balance and takes a bit too much attention in parts that aren’t his/full group shots. He’s a standout dancer in a group full of fantastic dancers, but he should take a page out of SuA’s book and learn when to tone it down and when to explode with energy.
Kpop idols can smile all they want, but nothing gets me more excited than a NOICE 🤌🏻 stank face when the dancing is just ✨immaculate✨. Like absolutely tear it up, but I think stage presence is definitely nuanced in terms of preference of what is “good or bad.”
Some enjoy all smiles and fairy looks and I enjoy the grit and smiles alike. As long as the performer is EMOTING and not just a deadpan expression. I just want to see the passion an artist has while performing.
I always look forward to all of your videos
Respectful, true opinions
I love it
Not liking these comments about San from y’all. No one has to like the way he performs, but the “he needs an exorcist” jokes are getting old.
Atinys have been dealing with ableism and straight mocking comments from all kpop fans about him and Ateez. Just say you don’t like him and move on. Can’t blame atinys for getting defensive when tiktok comments calling San a “dog with rabies” are getting hundreds of likes.
yeah, these comments are not sitting right with me.
Winter not being here is a breath of fresh air. THE WORLD IS HEALING!
Would you consider analyzing some of Seventeen’s stage presence in the future? (not necessarily a full video, maybe a shorter one like this?)
yea, I've seen Cheyl usually ranking female groups. Would love to see her opinion about my top fav group SVT stage presence
the video came at the best time😊 thank you❤️
I just wanted to say I really appreciate all the hard work u’ve been putting into ur editing and I appreciate ur creativity in terms of fonts and backgrounds u’ve been using🥰🥰
I have to say something about Wonyoung here. I love IVE, their concept, their music and I were so happy when I saw them at the big concert in Germany. I am not Wonyoung biased, I casually listened to Izone and didn't watch produce so I had absolutely no opinion about her when I started listening to IVE. Then I saw them at the concert and girl, they all looked stunning and did a great job performing. But Wonyoung really shined. I watched her from my seat and thought: Wow, this is a real celebrity. Really, she is impressive on the stage, and even if she is just talking or standing she has something magical about her, I was really blown away. I have to say I do not see her lacking in terms of stage presence or performance when it comes to Live shows. They were really professional and powerful for a rookie group especially. But I love your videos, I just had to mention this :)
Grüße aus Deutschland :D:D
san's like the theater kid of kpop - he performs for the back of the room, which is a theater saying that refers to the necessity of exaggerating your facial expressions and gestures so your emotions come through even in the cheap seats (definitely a useful skill if you're selling out arenas!). so i personally don't mind that he goes ham, but i get how it can be distracting/off-putting - it helps that he's surrounded by people who are just as extra as he is (if not more - some of those guerrilla seonghwa fancams?? hello) hope i didn't come off as overprotective lmao
you're right about the other members tho - psychorious recently said hongjoong could do the literal bare minimum and ooze charisma, and i personally think seonghwa's the best at catching subtle emotional nuances, his inception fancams are god-tier
I'm glad I found this vid, I never see anyone talking about stage presence or blank facial expressions. I've kept my thoughts to myself because I know people can get super overprotective and can't handle constructive criticism at all. Super refreshing to not just hear blind praise.
Oh passion & pure talent? The exact reason I immediately made Ateez o e of my ult groups the very first time I discovered them. San is my bias afff!
*one of
when it comes to san i guess its just what you like to watch in a performance. if he overperforms then i guess thats what i like to experience.. what i like about san and ateez is that they are unpredictable and its genuinely thrilling to watch them perform! if you dont like 'overperforming' then maybe its just a taste thing imo...
now am convince that atiny are weird people, unpredictable, no he is not, he do the same in all the performance, San is just doing to much that look ridiculous sometimes, as a new atiny I was shook that people like that, like NOOO is uncomfortable and it does not look profesional but I guess some people have cheap taste.
@@rowanjoy419 That's the way they like performers not cheap taste. Energetic. A lot of dancers exaggerate their performances and San to me is no different.Of course it can kinda get irritating if he is unsync but I think the way he performs shows passion. This is coming from someone who isn't an Atiny.
@@rowanjoy419 if it so uncomfy to watch san then why you have playlists saved of him?? youre the weird one here lol.. also i have seen dance crews dance like san and ateez and if you dont like it, im sure there is some other group you can watch instead ❤
@@rowanjoy419 people clearly have different tastes when it comes to performance, but calling smth "cheap" is extremely rude and condescending, besides making no sense. i hope you dont act like this usually
@@Ergolamia im a atiny. I like San, not his stage presence but I like him.
Like everglow up like Chaeyoung and Soobin, but no their stage presence.
now you understand why I said that people are hypocritic, you can accept when everglow up say that, but not me.
I'm weird, but everybody is in a way. I just saying that when he over performance looks messy, the movements are not clean if he just slow down a bit, would look great, but I afraid that his fans would silence me.
My issue with the comment is saying that it is unpredictable when is not, when you watch him just two times you can already predict him, I now this because I'm a new atiny and I can predict him already.
I thought the exact same about Shuhua as you and then I saw her live at Frankfurt this year and she's actually improved so much! Maybe it's a difference between recordings and lives but damn I was not expecting her to have the presence she had!
chaeyoung was one of the best performers back in sixteen. maybe it's just twice's earlier cute concepts that didn't fit her that made her regress so much, but i feel like if she's just in her own element and in her own sound, then she would shine so much. she's already so creative and artistic, shown in her song writing skills, she just needs to put that in her live performances
Her preformances of Icon during her rap part on tour really disappointed me but I hope she can get more motivation and energy cause she's far far away from non talented person.
@@AB-yk2pq very true! the girl is so talented, she has the creativity and artistry which are two of the most important things to possess in the music industry. if she just puts that energy into her stage presence then she would unstoppable
Hii bestie😊
I was actually surprised when I saw Chaeyoung here, I thought it was gonna be Dahyun but I agree. Just watched her icon performance and I was like "Girl do something, you're spitting facts, you should be screaming the lyrics like other rappers do"
@@velvetieyuri hello to u too bestie! hope you're having a great day 💖
i don't think that chaeyoung necessarily needs to shout or scream her raps to better her stage presence, but more like she just needs to have more confidence and energy when she does so. when u think of other rappers like jennie, lisa, soyeon, jessi, hyuna, cl, etc., u can feel the confidence that they have whenever they rap. chaeyoung just needs to reclaim the energy she had back in sixteen not only to better herself as a rapper, but also a performer as a whole
So by Nxde era safe to say Shuhua got off the bus right
I groaned when San came on because I love him but it's true so true and you should say it
i always knew something was bothering me about dayeon’s stage presence, but i couldn’t put it into words until you said it! you explain things really well, and i love these types of videos so much. thank you for all the effort you put in! :)
one video that would be amazing is idol who improved their stage presence the most over the years? maybe not the best performers but the ones the worked hard to get better? usually i dont see much improvement in kpop since most idols have a persona on stage ans they stick with it i would love to see who you picked and your opinions on them!
i think wonyoung’s schtick just works for some people and not others. as a huge wonyo stan i will melt any time she winks bc she’s so adorable but i understand that for those not aboard the wonyoung train that it could be seen as boring or even cringey. totally agree with chaeyoung too, been a once since 2016 and she kinda been serving dead fish on stage since more&more era which sucks because i know what a capable performer she is. i know her fans like that about her but i am really just waiting on her to SERVE
Thank you for this!! As a performer, I cannot say my vocals or dancing are spectacular, but what I do wow ppl with is my stage presence, and it honestly comforts me a lot that i can just slip into this persona on stage
THE DAYEON PART IS SO : YES YES YES
i feel like it's a regression since kep1er and it's sad
Honey. Have you thought about making a podcast on Spotify or something like this?
Seriously I love listening to you while studying and cleaning. Even if I don't agree with everything you say, your tone of voice and the way you deliver content is very professional. I feel like I'm listening to an interesting lecture of my favorites teacher
My guy San looks possessed sometimes ngl its terrifying........has he considered acting? pff
Your editing is sooo good. I mean every video you put out is amazing and really well made. Keep up the good work!!!
I’m always asking myself where San gets his energy from. I love the passion. But I do think he oftentimes stands out too much when looking at the group as a whole. Personally my favourite performer in ATEEZ is Hongjoong. He’s fierce and crazy when he needs to be, sensual when it’s appropriate and overall he just seems _in touch_ with the essence of each song.
I just love all of them 🤩 Their chemistry while performing is so fun to watch. Especially the rap line . The energy they bring to the performance is insane . Also there are other members like Yeosang and Yunho to create perfect balance . So their performances are not too much nor too less.
ruclips.net/video/yShZunHQb0g/видео.html&ab_channel=COLORONCOLOR - I watched this performance of San (where he decided to tone it down) and it was like watching a whole different person LOL. He's mentioned how he personally didn't rlly like performing like this and sticking with a "pretty face" but I get why his stage presence isnt for everyone. Nonetheless, he's still one of my favorite performers in kpop and I commend him for sticking to his mindset and style regardless of what haters say.
There was this rap performance of Chaeyoung and some other JYP rappers during a JYP concert. And she was really good there. Makes me wonder if the problem might be Twice's concept
(Commenting twice because Cheryl liked my other comment)
Shuhua -> unpopular opinion: her stage presence didn't improve in Tomboy era, she just got the opportunity to show her dance skills
Wonyoung -> She and TXT's Soobin are part of the "I am supposed to look like a visual rather than a performer" club
Dayeon -> I believe people can develop other stage presence styles, but the dominant type requires a level/type of confidence Dayeon doesn't seem to have on stage
Joy -> she is actually similar to Yoona, her smile is her strength and when the concept doesn't require it they still have their body language, but it feels like something is missing
Chaeyoung -> same as Dayeon, except Chaeyoung doesn't try to be dominant, which is kind of a problem sometimes, because her rapping is her main skill yet she looks like she doesn't know what to do in front of an audience
San -> already commented about him, but I wanna talk about how you said "every PROFESSIONAL fancam", let's stop giving money to unofficial fancams. Back to San, his case is a proof that people think facials = stage presence, just because his facials are perfect it doesn't mean he has no room for improvement
PS:. for a second I thought you put Taemin on this list, ily and your content but I was about to write an whole essay about why the five members of Shinee are not allowed in this video
Shuhua: the only thing that improved for her is the amount of lines she got
@@salembejaoui1880 I think her styling improved and fits her well, which contributes to her being slightly more interesting to look, but her stage presence is really not it.
Girl if you're talking about improvement , then sky is the limit . And San is just a few inches away from that sky . Meanwhile other idols are still struggling to take off. I'm not trying to put down other idols but as compared to them he's much better. If we really want to criticize someone , people will really take out the slightest point. Of course he has a room for improvement. But I love that we don't know where he has to improve. And when this happens , it means that the artist is doing something out of the norms and is going his own way . And even if a few ( not really few tho) people are liking it , he should stick to his originality ☺️
Chaeyoung lacks in vocal and stage presence yet onces still call her ace of twice 😭
Only in stage but not vocal
@@RUKA_BABYMONST7R okay okay
As someone who started stanning atz becaus of San, I only notice his overperforming issues after looking at the groups' dance practice/fancams, he tends to be unsync with the other members sometimes due to his own body rhythm(?)(the way he feels the music KJKSDA i have no idea how to put this in actual words) i find it slightly annoying because of the unsync-ness, but I personally think he have more control in their latest comeback, or maybe I just simply like san HAHA
i liked the way you compiled and made this list! great job!! (and yes i was cleaning my room while listening to this😂
Your videos really help me with my own dance journey and working on my own "stage presence," I love how you actually explain everything in detail rather than just saying "this is bad because I say so"
I guess I can understand what you mean about San, but he is honestly the reason I got into ATEEZ. I absolutely love every facial expression he makes, because it’s authentic. None of that practiced same old recycled facial expressions. He really captures the emotions of the song completely. I always favour performers who don’t make me bored, and I could honestly watch San non stop all day and not get bored. He is one of a kind.
This is the first of your videos I've seen, and I like that you added those computer tabs at the top. Itxs an interesting and creative way to mark the sections. 😊 Good job.
I personally feel like shuhua improved a lot on their latest comeback! while I still think that there's room for more, nxde era really made her entire aura change!
it all comes down to passion. you can tell who wants to be up there and who doesn’t. it’s simple
Idols with bad stage presence really irk me. Not to the point where I actively hate on them or post nasty things online (i wouldn't do that to anyone), but it makes me impossible to stan them. Even if every other member has good stage presence, the idol who doesn't sticks out like a sore thumb and brings down the whole stage. They don't have to be 100% on every single stage (bc it's relatively impossible to do that without experiencing burn out), but if it's consistently 0%... yeah, i'll take my attention elsewhere.
I’d be a lousy performer too if my companies treated me more like property than a human.
huh... so that is why dayeons eyebrow-raises makes me cringe
i am so thankful that someone talks about san, daeyon and joy i really agree with everything u said
I agree with the majority, except for wonyoung. I've been to some shows where IVE performed, and from what I've seen she NEVER lacks energy on stage. In the live performance, she and the other members as well we're all giving their 100% and i could SEE it. Wonyoung isn't even my bias in IVE but the way she interacts with the audience is honestly captivating.
hey not really related to the topic, but thanks for using WJSN's Last Sequence in your vid. really happy to know you also appreciate the song enough to use it.
FR
Shuhua face is so dramatic that i actually find her a good performer in idle, i prefer her stage presence than miyeon for example. Miyeon lack of control in her upper body during dance make her stand out in a negative way
I'm so glad you're making these more regular because legit I love everything you've done and often find myself just watching/listening to your vids a lot while I'm working or chilling. You're a really great orator and your voice is so amazing and suites the content you're delivering... a total slay.... love you queen! Keep doing what you do because you're amazing! 💜💙
i had noticed chae's lack of stage presence in the most recent comebacks and it's heartbreaking cuz she can do this, she's definitely able. its sad to see that
It's one thing to not particularly enjoy San's style of performing but it's a whole other to put that man on a list of idols that are STRUGGLING with stage presence...he has phenomenal presence. period. He is simply a highly energetic and CRAZY performer and it suits some of our preferences and it doesn't suit others...however, nobody can claim he is strugglying with presence. That's just ridiculous.