Why Counting Improves Your Rhythm & Timing
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
- Follow-up video answering counting-related questions: • How to count "unquanti...
How does one best develop solid rhythm and timing? Counting out loud is the most powerful practice tool at our disposal. Counting does wonders for our timing, precision, and consistency. It's the key to mastering complex rhythms and playing accurate to the millisecond. To get the most out of your practicing, you need to be counting.
A couple books for developing your counting skills:
Rhythm Knowledge, Volume 1 & 2 - by Mike Mangini
Universal Rhythms - by Dave Dicenso
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For those wanting to go deeper, I made a follow-up answering many questions from this video's comments here: ruclips.net/video/4Bhj-qrB6Ao/видео.html
As a guitarist mainly, I realize when playing with my band that internal timing is something us 6-strings fanatics never really train.. Thank you so much for sharing this method, I can already isolate a few scenarios where my timing fails!
I got the berklee book and that's one exercise they have you practice from the start. Count the measure while playing notes. It fucks with your brains but I can see the benefits already
So true, I have good “feel” sometimes, but it’s all passive. And I feel guitar players are more privy to this because we are very “noodley” players (how many times have you just played pentatonic licks with the amp not even on, right?) and often, unless we are classical guitarists, aren’t that disciplined in our practice
Yea tried recording my riffs and i was so off time
I really wish you uploaded more :( I never miss a video of yours
Man I’m getting that Adam Neely vibe hard but in a diff way that’s fresh! Awesome stuff Shaun!
Anthony Lopez BECAUSE HES BALD?
Except it's actually understandable lol
He's a freind of Adam coincidentally
I’ve been recording myself without a met lately and listening back to the recording. I’ll put a met on top of the recording and I’ll change the tempo to follow when I rush or drag hearing the inconsistencies. After I watched this I tried counting the quarter note out loud during it, and it was far more consistent then previous times. Thanks for the great tip! I’ll definitely keep this up.
I wanna see you counting Sequence Start or Drunk! That'd be sick 👌
Gabriel Power I’d love to see anyone try to count those dummy fast subdivisions articulately
Adam Neely explains it a little in his video about how to play in a drunk style about how rhythm was notated in drunk
Okay, I must say that at first I was pretty sceptical about this whole “counting out loud” idea. But now, having spent two months counting over EVERYTHING that I practice, my time-keeping has REALLY REALLY REALLY improved! And yes, adding the voice counting did force me to practice everything at least 20% (and for some exercises even 30%) slower at first. But within the two months I was able to get the speed back to the original level. Not only this whole experiment helped me improve my overall time-keeping, it also helped me keep the subdivision timing (or as Shawn calls it “microtiming”) more consistent.
Awesome this is motivating me to try it! Had never heard of this technique before :) can't wait to give it a shot ... I need to practice slower anyway :)
Awesome this is motivating me to try it! Had never heard of this technique before :) can't wait to give it a shot ... I need to practice slower anyway :)
Awesome this is motivating me to try it! Had never heard of this technique before :) can't wait to give it a shot ... I need to practice slower anyway :)
Awesome this is motivating me to try it! Had never heard of this technique before :) can't wait to give it a shot ... I need to practice slower anyway :)
Awesome this is motivating me to try it even more after watching the video! Thanks both. Had never heard of this technique before :) can't wait to give it a shot ... I need to practice slower anyway :)
I've heard this idea before, but this is a much more comprehensive and logical guide. Thanks
Pure gold!
I love when an 11 year old beginning drum student tells me that they can’t count and play at the same time, it’s just not possible! 😊
Thank you for this incredibly valuable advice. I am going to take it to heart. From now on, counting it is!
count me in, me too
@@youtubeshortsmakingmylifeshort - two, three, fourrr!-
THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU -- i've been playing for thousands of hours but my time is intermediate level at best, and I always felt like I was playing along to the music rather than driving the rhythm, which led to a lot of dragging. It wasn't obvious what specifically I needed to practice. But active time keeping and developing a perfect internal metronome is my new goal now. This video is gold
this is super super important for piano pieces. if you're playing solo piano, it's easy to not have a sense of steady rhythm throughout, and counting really helps this. it becomes even worse when you're practising because while you naturally stay on beat on stage when you mess up, when you're practising you tend to go back and undo the mistake and lose complete track of rhythm. playing with a metronome helps, but I've found counting out loud to help more.
P.S. great video as always Shawn, keep it up!
P.P.S. more cowbell please
I second this big time. Piano being a part of the rhythm section, it's so important to internalize the pulse. I also find that in practice I don't tend to make it through a whole piece because as you mentioned any mistake or opportunity for embellishment takes me away from the pulse to correct the mistake or figure out the embellishment.
Timing is everything, even in pitch, that's a thing I learned on youtube
Don't mumble! As soon as I noticed this in my practice and started "confidently counting" things were better.
I've been looking at a TON of "improve your rhythm videos" but this, THIS, is the real advice. Actively keep the beat. Changes everything. Thank you so much for this!
The new breed by Gary Chester. Great book to learn how to incorporate the voice in your playing.
Well, just ordered it. Thanks for the tip!
Yeah dude
I appreciate the contrast between how thorough and serious you are with your exposition of the material and how silly you act in the videos. It's dope, i like it :D
"You can hit the wrong thing at the right time, and it might work, musically" Absolutely true. This vid is a gem.
You are my absolute favorite drum teacher I have ever come across.
You dont just show us what to do, but how to conceptualize the idea.
Keep up with those vids man! So refreshing
Timming and timming is every thing.thank you!
Thank you so much for putting this video together. I play guitar in a band and rhythm is what has made me sound instantly musical in my journey so far.
If my drummer, who likes playing by "feel", watches this video diligently, it would save my band so much of frustration and needless arguments.
This is one of the best videos about rhythm I’ve seen in a long time. Love the Zappa reference but for real, this is something I’ve always known is a good thing but have ignored because it sucks. Especially when you’re not a drummer, but I’m gonna really work on my rhythm with this approach, thanks Shawn !!
Thank you Shawn for this incredible lesson!
Wow, super helpful! I still kinda struggle with timing and slowing down. I have a tendency to rush and then over-compensate. Definitely going to continue incorporating this in my practice routines.
This video is great! Im a guitarist, which by nature is terrible at timing and keeping rhythm. However, I have this dope riff, and I need to record it proper, but I fail to keep the tempo. I feel bad. Then I see this. And I try. A month later and the recording sounds n i c e in tempo, real good. Counting is key, many thanks
You’ve convinced me. Now counting out loud when practicing or sight-reading - and working on hearing an internal click-track. :-) (pianist, Berlin)
I started doing this intuitively yesterday. I’m not a drummer but a songwriter. For me this helps me to find more interesting rhythm motifs that later becomes into hooks. Invaluable advice for any musician!
Successfully doing a fill while counting feels x2 satisfying btw 👌
This helped me not just in playing music but also reading scores. I always got lost when reading a score while listening to the music, because a syncopation or suspension, or even fast tempo made me lose where the pulse was.
In 1 day with the new breed as a work support I already see improvements... Thanks a lot !!
I can definitely attest to the validity of this. It really forces you to lock in.
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh fine. Thanks for explaining this so well; I'll start counting. You've also answered a question I've been struggling to find an answer to: how to increase my freedom and confidence within a bar/beat/song etc. Peace.
Omg joining a drum corps is my dream! Great to see it featured here.
Many moons ago one of my drum teachers forced me to do what you're doing: count out loud. It totally blew my mind how HARD it was to do, and I really hated having to learn to do it. But, I have found it's an integral part of learning how to run your own internal clock (accurately). There's something about FEELING what your limbs are physically doing in coordination with the sounds coming out of your mouth helps cement the "muscle memory" part of learning to play in time. But it's hard AF to learn.
It's a GREAT way to learn how to play polyrhythms, too. Try doing a 4 (hi-hat/snare) over 3 (kick) and then COUNT one of them at the same time, or up the ante by making the vocal count use a different base (say, count to 6, following 2 measures of the kick), while maintaining the original 4 over 3. It's hard to do, but once you can do it, you can remove the voice, and like Shawn noted, suddenly you have all this thinking space available in your head that's been taken up counting, and you don't really need the counting any longer cuz your internal metronome works on its own.
You guys are on such a high level...... I'm a sax player (old), but came to this via Adam Neely's channel. This is great stuff, a really good insight, no matter what instrument you play. However, it made me realise just how bad I am at counting (I've been known to skip a beat). Now I'm searching for advice on counting, but aimed at those of us with an instrument stuck in our mouths.
Amazing how well this simple technique works... just what I needed - thank you for sharing your expertise!
I play several instruments and do a bit of home songwriting, and although I can play to a decent standard my timing is a bit sloppy, and when I concentrate too hard on the metronome and timing I totally lose feel and groove. So I've just quickly tried this method by recording e-drums into cubase (the thing I struggle with the most) and STRAIGHT AWAY on first attempt without any practice I notice I am no longer over-concentrating on the metronome rather I am listening to my counting, which is obviously locked to the metronome. So as you say, I am now playing to my internal clock rather than something external. Such a simple thing yet this is pure gold and will make a huge difference to my playing for all instruments and recording (and blood pressure)! Thanks very much!!!!! If I ever meet you the beers are on me!
YAS! Counting rules supreme. Gotta remember to count more in practice. Thanks for the reminder Shawn! :)
This comment made me listen to Coltrane's Love Supreme.
I watch videos about music all the time, but this one is quite groundbreaking. I value being a musician, not a robot. Many guitarists can blast out very fast riffs, but its just their fingers, not their brains. Gonna understand what im playing more, thanks!
As a pianist I found this video assuring. Thank you.
Very helpful video! After 2 years of studying the flute, timing is still one of my main challenges. I will try to count in my head, I can already anticipate how this will help.
(I am not a drummer) It has always been very hard for me to play bass and sing at the same time. A long time ago, I realized, that not only I can't sing, but I can't even count (1,2,3,4,1...) why playing a bit more complex lines. Learning to count helped me with the singing a lot (now I can sing over bass lines, that were to me absolutely impossible before, but I still have a long way to go).
All this is something, that nobody told me, I figured it on my own and I sort of thought, that's just in my case and everybody has his/her way of learning things. Now, when I see, that a professional recommends it highly, I will practice counting even more. Thanks for the video! Good stuff.
Thank you for this mind opening video ! Counting over everything i'm playing is my next to goal, until now i relied on singing rhythms or Simply "feeling" the pulse, almost like dancing but by doing that i sometimes become "passive" and loose focus…
Fantastic! This is exactly what I needed.
As a guitarist, as soon as I stray or improvise slightly away from a 'written' part, I totally lose any sense of where I am in the measure. I've always been jealous of musicians (all the good ones) who have this 'inner' sense to always fall back on their feet at exactly the right place. Now it looks like I might be able to acquire it. Thank you!
I always rested my ass on that "inner sense" and it was pretty good, ngl. Counting out loud felt like a step back, like I was admitting that I suck, which is a very adolescent thought to being with, but only a short time of implementing loud counting into my routines has already shown me what is possible.
This is outstanding and essential info, just what I needed to hear to confirm my suspicions on the difficulty that I am experiencing. When I started to learn drums (6 years ago) I noticed immediately that when I started to count, especially when counting rests, I made mistakes. I would impulsively strike a note on the rest that I counted, and the groove would spiral down the drain from there. “Ok so relax…go slow… now go, 1e+a…BAM!” Again would hit a note on the rest that I counted. It’s impulsive and automatic. So I looked up ADHD and drumming because I was pretty convinced that my condition is causing the impulsivity. Did not find anything. So I progressed on without ever counting rests. But now it has become an obstacle.
I tried your advice the other day while driving to work; I practiced counting and just imagined playing the bass note where it should land. When I started, it was a train-wreck, so it took more than an average amount of patience with myself, but by the time I gotten to work I had worked it out in my mind enough to believe that I can get better at it. Woohoo!
I feel like a prereq for counting while playing is counting while listening to music. If you count time well while actively listening to different instruments in the same song, you are more likely to be able to keep time while playing with others, or yourself (which is an other to your ears)
I think you're making a great point. Yesterday I was listening to some Meshuggah and for the first time I could *really* comprehend two parts of two songs. I've watched videos about those songs in the past, trying to understand them, but I only got so far. I've been counting over music for some time - trying to comprehend or even transcribe it - but now that I've started doing it over my own playing, I think it fused the whole thing together.
I know this must be done.
So I am going to make myself do it.
Thanks to you
Thank you for explaining this on thought level.. was looking for this! :)
hi shawn. thanks for sharing this. i had suspected that i need to go down that rabbit hole (counting to everything) but i wasnt convinced that it s the right approach. you have given me the confidence to go ahead! thank you 😊
Wow, I'll be trying this immediately, thank you! I've been trying for years to improve my rhythm guitar, but have seemed to be on a plateau - I can't wait to try this new approach!
Thank you, I will include those concepts in my practice routine 😀
I learned at a young age, through the power of metal and to BANG MY HEAD
Yes. Man, you are the best. Such a great inspiration. Much Love
Thank you very much for making this video. I was born without rhythm and now looking to learn guitar actually. looking over RUclips for someone to train this. I very much appreciate your advice.
I'm sure going to try that!! Great advice! Thank you
I will try my best to reach the goal！Hope after years of practicing i can finally understand why bassist like jaco can do such precise timing😂😂
Gonna apply this tomorrow thanks!
This was a great video! Two questions:
1 - do you ALWAYS count time in a song? Or only in complicated parts where you might get lost?
2 - do you have some practical exercises?
thats the best video about time keeping ive seen!
best explanation I've found on this thanks !
Wow, didn't know you were in the drum corps scene. Would love to hear more about your experience and how the drum corps experience transfer into the drum set world both in technique and music making!
i actually started doing this a few months ago because it seemed like it was a thing that i should be able to do. it was something that i came up with on my own and it certainly is difficult. but after a few months it's much easier [but still difficult] and i definitely feel like i have a much more solid grasp on what i'm playing. it's cool to have techniques validated and lets me know i'm on the right path for my own practice. 👍👍👍
did you keep it up? How's it going now?
@@mosstet I did. it helped immensely. counting while playing really helped me internalize where the subdivisions are in relation to the downbeat, both conceptually but also how they felt. it sounds very simple, counting out loud, almost too obvious so it's easy to overlook. it really helps dial in your rhythm in a big way.
@@marcmcshane Improving my sense of subdivisions and being able to intentionally put a note anywhere in time is specifically what I'm looking to improve. Were there any other exercises/videos/resources that tried and would recommend for this?
@@andrewsalvatore3828 awesome. so I'm actually a bassist but I often turn to drum exercises to help focus on just rhythm. this is a bass video but really translated to percussion of that's you're instrument of choice. this one really helped be get those syncopations internalized. 🍕🍕🍕 ruclips.net/video/_D-v0qnSfUU/видео.html
Great video, again. I usually think of this "brain space" like of "RAM memory" - the more you free up, the more capacity you have...and the goal is to move this timing thing from RAM to HDD and finally to the BIOS itself ;)
Gavin Harrison uses a similar metaphor of "CPU usage". He reckons playing live takes up say 20% by itself, so anything that takes up more than 80% in the practice room will be by definition unplayable live.
@@fuglsnef Interesting way of thinking, that makes sense now that I think about it.
This is the best video on RUclips. Damn.
Thank you.
Thank you so much this video really opened my world.
will also help with your sight reading
Great vid!
Fine motoric skills and voice are very much related from a neurologic perspective. I would love to see a video with Shawn in an MRI scanner to see what happens if he plays a rhythm with and without counting with his voice.
Very worthwhile to learn from... thanks.
Excellent! Thank you.
Thank you shawn
Thanks, Shawn. ☝️😎
thank you!!!!
Adam Neely recommended this in his latest Q+A video! I tried counting in numbers but it seems that the click makes more sense. Really good tips here! Thanks!
I watched the whole video now. I mean while playing, in my mind, it seems easier to imagine the click rather than counting? if that makes sense?
The bouncing ball giving a visual aid to timing is brilliant along with a click . counting too
Ah, shame! I was expecting "If you're completely new to counting, I would probably recommend that you start....with ONE!"
You explain it so well!
You're awesome! Thanx for the vid
GRE4T STUFF! Makes so much sense!
Thanks a lot man, love u
Very informative, thank you
Timekeepers. The keepers of time... Sounds so poetic ^^
GREAT VIDEO, THANKS AND HUGS FROM BRAZIL
Thank you! I'm def a rusher and never have been able to figure out how to not be. simple as 1 2 3...4 😂 I'm going to start this tomorrow when I go to practice.
This video reminds me of an old joke: what do musicians think when listening to other people’s music?
Guitarist: I can definitely play it faster!
Keyboard: wow! What a beatiful chord progression!
Drummer: 1-2-3-4
Great man,
A really important lesson!
So I’m a guitarist! And I my internal time WITHOUT the metronome has mostly been poo. I’m really gonna try this
Awesome !!
Great advice, I know I need to do this more. It's similar to bassist Richard Bona, who often sings what he is playing, and I sometimes practice that. I think that his version is useful for gaining melodic understanding, knowing what note each note sounds like before you play it. This is a logical continuation of that sort of regiment. Excited to give it a go.
Thanks for this! I'm sending it to all my students :) I think counting aloud is beneficial for other instruments such as guitar, bass, keyboards too
great video
I found you via the Rick Beato vid...liked and subbed!
Awesome video Shaun.How would you recommend translating counting practice for musicians who can’t use their voices while they play?
Legs? Whole body movement? Leo P is dancing, man, this is a way to count
Similar to this I heard some great advice, if you can sound out the groove vocally you want to you can usually play it. whatever syllables you like for the different kit hits. Use this technique to sound out micro timings etc. don’t need to be a beatboxer but some ba da kuhs etc. this apples to all instruments. Indian konnakol also very helpful rhythmic solfège vs 1234. I also found coincidentally vocally speaking 1234 immensely improved my dance ability vs just intuitively trying to stay on beat
You are fantastic dedicated musician.
My internal clock is pretty accurate in telling me when it is time to eat or sleep or get drunk.
The result of years of effort put into not counting.