Audiopipe COPIED Taramps - But why doesnt it make rated??? PART 1
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- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- GUYS! Finally releasing part 1 of the in depth look into the Audiopipe AP3000 VS the Taramps HD3000 to see exactly what is different about the Audiopipe that prevents it being able to make the same power as the taramps, despite being a direct clone of the board and components. Was this a mistake? Was the Audiopipe deliberately crippled? Lets have a look and find out!
Stick around for part 2 coming as soon as I can get it out!!
Link to Mr Volkman's channel: / @anthonyvolkman2338
Oh man, so much good info here! I'm glad you split it up into 2 parts, this gives us a lot of info, plus gives us something to look forward to with Part 2!
First time subscriber from Jamaica 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Please biuld it overkill ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️
Sigh ... It has been 10 months since this video came out. There isn't anything on @Williston Audio Labs' channel about the upgraded audio pipe neither. Disappointing ...
@@peterletran That was my thought as well ...
Heck yeah. And he managed to come out with part 2 before you even came out with your part 2. lololol
I’m so anxious to know what the final output will be!
It’s like watching an amplifier soap opera.
I'm not focused on the ending but the journey it's amazing
I admire your tenacity and the unyielding desire to learn. You have enough knowledge and experience to design your own amp. Crowd sourcing it will be an absolute hit. More power to you Sir.
Great to see your new shop, will be fun to see how this transformer surgery goes!
Bro, I am stunned to find out that you started at ground zero as far as your electrical knowledge just five years ago, and that you have no formal education regarding fixing this stuff. I’ve been watching your videos for like six months, this whole time assuming you had an electrical engineering degree because you’re obviously very knowledgeable. I really want to learn how to fix amps like you have. Do you have any advice on the steps I should take to follow a similar path as you have? I am starting at a place very similar to when you must have. Just trying to learn what mosfets and diodes and rectifiers are and what they do exactly. A lot of the information I find online snd on RUclips assumes you have a basic understanding of what the underlying things being worked on are, so they very rarely come at it from an absolute beginners perspective. They often assume, for example, that I would know what to do when they say, “now you need to test the output mosfets to see if they’re blown as well.” But a) I don’t know which mosfets are the output mosfets, b) I don’t know how to test mosfets to see if they are blown or not & c) do mosfets have to be desoldered from the board to test them? Or can they be tested in place? Etc etc
So as you can read, I am a true beginner and 99/100 Even what are supposed to be beginner tutorials are conducted as if I have a couple college level electrical engineering courses under my belt already. Can you point me towards any video or book or anything really that you think would help me that starts at the absolute fundamental basics? Any help would be greatly appreciated! And thanks for making such awesome videos and always being so stoked on what you’re doing. It makes them really entertaining and makes it so I’m always up for watching you work. Much appreciated!
Buy the amplifier repair guide on bcae1.com, all basics covered ☺
@@barevids 3 years later. And this is going to help me so much. Love your channel!
Thank for asking this! I want to start building amps and I am at basically ground zero as well. I have some audio knowledge but it's studio recording and live sound FOH and none of that seems like it crossed over to technical audio electronics lol
A. The no electrical education back ground blew my mind.
B. Absolutely amazing video as always!
Hello Sam,
Modifiying this will be very hard....
1. At 25kHz switching frequency (stupidly low) from the smps the benefits of litz wire will be negligible.
Increasing the frequency will reduce the idle current (if you don't change the core or the primary turns) but how can you change the frequency since the pwm comes from the pic microcontroller?
2. If they reduced the turn ratio to reduce the rail voltage there is a reason; which kind of fets are they using on the class D and how are they driving them?
How are they driven is more important than rds considerations when you are switching something like 120A (120v rail over 1ohm on the peak of the sinewave) at 180kHz. Maybe just going to 14 turns instead of 12 will make the output stage explode under load...
3. Changing the core with a bigger one could be good (provided that the class d keeps up with the power increase) but:
- how about using the same core, double the frequency to 50khz and just go with 1+1 turn on the primary and 7+7 turns on secondary. This will provide the same output voltage with shorter winding and thus less resistive losses.
- to to this the switching frequency must be doubled and the dead time adjusted to have zvs on the primary fets. Loose zvs under full load because of too short dead time and eveything will surely explode.
-if you increase the frequency and half the turns on the transformer prepare to have higher switching losses on the primary side... Select the fastest fets you can (lowest Qg), today there are much better fets that the usual irf1404 and similar devices.
- if you rewind the transormer it shall be bifilar wound on both primary and secondary at this power level.
This is a quite ambitious project, I hope you all the best but honestly speaking... Good luck with it.
I have more than 20 years experience in power supply design and to do something like this I would have done a lots of calculations and testing before trying and see what's happens.... Good luck and great content on this channel as usual.
I hope he sees your comments. You sound very knowledgeable!
dude thank you SO much for your comment!
1) Absolutely agree! We will be increasing the frequency FIRST before buying litzwire, to see what upper limit we can get away with, and then deciding if litzwire will actually benefit us at all or not. In regards to changing the pwm freq to the fets without having to re-program the PIC, well you'll just have to wait and see what I have in store for that! ;)
2) I genuinely believe this was a mistake. The whole rest of the amplifier, including PCB and trace thickness, model of mosfets used, output inductor size and inductance, etc, is IDENTICAL. Swapping the transformers around from these 2 amps will yield identical opposite results (i have tested this). There were no mal effects using the taramps transformer in the audiopipe and it made bang on the exact same power as the taramps did.
3) Using the same core was an idea, option 3 (it would have still included upping the freq). I will have full control of deadtime and switching freq after my mod so i will be able to fine tune this under heavy load. I will definitely be investigating the best fets for the application, i will probably order a whole load of different models to try, since i only need a low number of each.
Its definitely a project well above my pay grade so to speak, but I find i learn the fastest when i jump in the deep end with this kind of stuff, and im looking forward to seeing what happens, even if there are some smoky results at first!! Thank you for the kind words.
@@barevids Re: the transformer, another possibility is that it was just a standard transformer already in use. Rather than have their supplier roll a new one just for that amplifier line, they may have opted just to use a common part already in stock for production. Since they are willing to do a copypasta on the amplifier and sell it as their own design, I doubt they would be bothered much by the loss in maximum power. On top of this, the device stresses will be lower and there will be less likelihood for warrantee claims. All good for the bottom line. Anyway, just a thought...
Love your colabo with Big D. It's like a test and a validation tech vid all in one. Great job
Plant the amps in the garden and see if you grow 2 amp trees 🤔
Might have to wait till they are of ample size to get any fruit.
Hey really cool. I've been wondering about exactly the same thing. Increasing the output rails to boost power. But how do you determine where to draw the line. Do you look at the caps, rectifiers or output FETS. Besides could you increase 12v regulator to 15v to relieve stress on regulator and handle higher input or do you just increase resistance to input of regulator to limit current? Lots of questions!
This is a really great idea for a video series!
I'm ready for the second video already good job on describing everything this is going to be your best video yet.
I remember when I was at school and talking to a friend's dad that was an electrical engineer telling me about the skin effect and having to specify hollow laminated wire to get the efficiency required in the transformer for the current project.
When Sams in the garden you know it's about to get serious, great video Sam!
You want more power. Well, be careful you do not saturate the core. It is important to know the core parameters so you know how long to apply a pulse for a given number on turns on the primary for a desired amount of current to not saturate the core, or run the core with excessive magnetic flux that causes excessive core heating i.e. loss of efficiency.
Considering the core is the same size and the primary voltage is the same and you would like to get more power out of it (i.e increase current), increase the operating frequency and reduce the number of primary turns. If you increase the core size, you will need to use less primary turns for the same frequency or increase the primary turns and lower the operating frequency. Issue here is primary inductance. The primary current ramps up faster with a smaller inductance and slower with a larger inductance, the ramp should not be too high about 10% is a good figure, otherwise you will be storing too much magnetic energy in the core which will have to be returned to the primary power supply with every switch instead of transferring it to the secondary, this will mean more dead time needed to remove this energy to prevent stairway saturation form happening.
Concerning skin effect, at 20KHz the skin depth is 0.54mm, so 1mm diameter wire can be used. If operating at 50KHz, skin depth is 0.34mm so 0.6mm diameter wire could be used. You will have to calculate the area of the conductor needed to pass the current you want and dived it by the conductor area that passes the desired frequency to find out how many of these wires you need. There is no need to use litz wire, that is very fine conductors used for MHz applications.
If I only lived in the UK!!! Your absolutely delivering the very best amplifier repair /modification content in live format I've seen anywhere. (Side note Perry B) amplifier tutorial also A+ content. Keep the amp porn rolling Sam. I have often wondered why someone with unlimited funds hasn't hired you to build an absolute tank of an amplifier maybe you and Volkman need to further collaborate in a business verture?! Appreciate all your efforts and contribution to the car audio world . Thank you
Thanks for taking so much time and editing work to explain fully
oh the suspense!..I can see these mods opening up a whole lot of other cans of worms. excellent video sam.
Wow thank you very much again sam for another great video very educational can't wait to see part 2 nuff respect 👍👍🙏🙏
I have been waiting on pins and needles for this video! Cheers my British brother!
Great production value video. Awesome investigative tech reporting.
Can't wait till you collab for your own amplifier design and brand.
Can't wait to see the finished product being tested!
AMAZING VIDEO!!! This got me so excited to follow along! I can’t wait for part 2!! Keep up the Great work!
This is the DREAM VIDEO I think everyone who has loved Car Audio and likes how things work was waiting for all their lives.
It also shows , you really do get what you pay for with high end class D amps.
Before I even watch the video I just want to say I'm so excited to see it lol 😆. And. Continue.... 🤣
I love it when you guys colab. Brilliant stuff :)
glad to see this video idk if you remember but talked to you on fb quite a while back about this and sent some support via paypal. great channel
You and Big D's collaboration is very cool. Ive been a sub to both ya'lls channels for awhile now, better than anything on cable! FR
Are you going to do a Dyno Test on the New Rockville Krypton M-3 4000 watt amplifier anytime soon? Wondering if it will reach it's rated power.
P.S. I love your RUclips videos. Keep up the good work informing your followers.
🔊🔊 Let's go part 2....
In my Korean amp still modified number of turns for spl race , at 14v power is like 18v. Calculated turns in order to stay safe about rail cap value and a new fan to prevent raise temperature about more amps drain to irfp044n section. Amazing video great stuff
Audiopipe now has the aphd30001F1 that I believe does rated power. Its the new updated model. It comes with a 250A in line fuse.......
Feel like the logical progression is that Sam ends up being the next Metro/mister Eddie/barracuda/jahtubbys... intriguing stuff
I just bought my first Taramps amp. Its a smart boss 3k. 😎 Taramps is definitely in a league of their own in my opinion. Parker the basshead got over 7000 watts out of his 3k! That blows my mind, i had to try one. Im glad i did. What an amazing sounding amp as an added bonus, they fight impedance rise and make the same power on several impedance loads. I cant think of an amp that can compare to Taramps smart amps features especially for their cheap price and small size. They seemed to have set a new benchmark. I bought the bassknob with cliplight with mine, they make very nice knobs as well. If you ever can get ahold of the new smart boss 3k please make a video on it.
Excellent video! Back in the 80's I wanted to make my own high current DC to DC converter to power up my Dynaco ST-120 amp for my car, I never had the money to buy a good amp for my car (at the time). This mod should be very educational to all of us viewers!
Found you from Williston audio labs channel and big D wiz. Subbed!
When will we see a hand made Sam amp that will do 1,200rms @ ohms?
I think that would be cool
The HD3k is known for instability and even catching fire. Perhaps the lower rail voltage was intentional and not a flaw at all.
Yes. Transistors run at their max voltage. Don't know if they switched to other transistors but it was known issue at that time
Such a great video man, great job. Always learn something new and different
This is insane it's really hard to believe you were able to learn as much as you know that fast with no real schooling and hearing you saying you didn't even know what the parts were. Iv wanted to see you build your own design of amplifier because I know it would be built right. The power amp was the first time I've ever seen you really compliment a amp. It makes me want to buy one. After watching this I want to go and get a audio pipe and just have you modify it. Great stuff as always have a great one till the next one 👍👌✌️💯🎶
I'm loving this topic. Learning a lot. Thanks for sharing
Been waiting for this. Kick ass man. Lookin forward to the results. I'm an Audiopipe fan. Running an APCLE30001.D and an APCLE2004.
After literally watching all your videos I would like to know how about working on driver boards when you think that its the problem but the part numbers have been scratched off and getting new ones. I'm pretty sure that's the problem with a american bass hd3500 I've been working on for awhile now according to everything I watch on your site. Also can you also show in your videos a little more detail on your oscilloscopes connection points. Great work bud I've learned a ton from you. Thanks mike.
Great video I can't believe you are self taught .. I took electronics at a tech high school and still can't keep up with you . Can't wait to see what you do with this amp .. thanks
A fine example of why you can't judge a book (amplifier)by it's cover(guts).Very fascinated with
Results of your modifications will
interesting to see them on the scope and dyno. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and time.
Been waiting 20 years for a video like this awesome idea 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Could you use a neo core for a smaller transformer?
I'm genuinely excited to see this happen also I wish I could work on amps because I have a crossfire CFA202 I would like fixed it powers up and plays but only 1 RCA works and someone before me broken the crossover switch.
Damn short sleeves and sunshine...this is gonna be awesome.
In England? That's rare!
Hey Sam, you did a video awhile back about gain matching, and dialing in phase. How would a man go about doing the same on a 4 sub, 4 amp setup? I totally understand the 4 sub, 2 amp process, but getting 4 matched vs. 2 is uhh...👀
I have an idea, but I'd certainly prefer your input above all else.
Been subscribed and def not going anywhere. Riveting would be the word I would choose for the series on "souping up" a shitty copy of a fullbridge. "No, not being sarcastic at all I'm stoked. N congrats on the new pad brotha nothing like having new and improved around you!
Let's go with part 2!
They got a new version be good to compare your upgrade version vs there's the aphd f1 series
This is an amazing series. Ive been waiting forever to see you make improvements to amplifier designs!!!! So excited for the rest of this series!!!
First time watching.. great content buddy gained a new sub👍🙂
The old school Kicker ZR amps had their transformers wound with bundles of small gauge wires. They were pretty stout amps too.
Hey buddy love all your videos quick question for you I have a 9900 dd 18esp and a soundigital 8800 power amp it's a dual 1ohm sub it's at 2ohm now you think I can write my sub at half ohm or do you think my soundigital amp will blow I have three agm batteries and 1 350 amp alt for electrical let me know what you reccomend or leave it at 2ohm until I get my other 18 and then make it a 1ohm load thank you very much
Looking forward to seeing part 2 oyeah
Was wondering if you and Big D could do a collaboration on how brands improve (or degrade) from previous versions to the new ones. Example- Rockford Fosgate Prime R1 1200D to R2 1200D. The new one is lighter, and curiously has a much higher fuse requirement yet only puts out a slightly more power. Did they cheap out on the internals (haven't seen the guts of the new one).
On that schematic there are some P type mosfets IRF5210 , why are they connected in short to gnd ? Can you see those internal protection diodes ?
Hi, i really need some help. I have an old Magnat Classic 360. Issue with the amp is channel 1-2 sound and work perfect but channel 3-4 keep frying speakers. Both are set up the same no difference. Changed all the Transistors to new but same thing keeps happening. Anyone have an idea of what the issue could be ?
Look at the hand wound Old School Phoenix Gold power supply's. Like a Beautiful Ribbon .... Ive yet to see anyone else have Beautiful ones like those .
Wean my tearamp bass 8 k dies I know exactly where I'm sending it straight to you I think you are probably the best amplifier repair specialist in the UK
Where's part 2?
Great illustrated video!
Thanks for that!
Also, I have an adcom car amp I want to change rail caps in before using in my car (it's ancient). Any tips on the best method to prevent board damage? Thanks!
Do you think would run a mojo my2500.1 at .5 or .8 plus rise? Any info would be appreciated.
Hell yee-uhh I been waitin for Sam tuh upload again!
What kind of diode is in that audiopipe aphd-3000d-h1 located between the power and ground input. It's right by the remote input.
Just watched your video on box rise I have a dual 1ohm 9500 18 dd wired at 2 ohm wanted to wire down to half ohm but I dont want to blow my amplifier my box is ported and the amp is a 8800 soundigital power amp let me know what you recommend please and thank you for all your advice in all your video's
@barevids Hi good day I have been watching your videos on youtube and just wanted to say how much I appreciate those excellent in depth videos, I am an auto electrician but always wanted to learn about circuits in amps since I have a few of them. I have a small amp here I am trying to fix myself, its mine so I don’t mind practicing on it. Its a MMATS D300HC Modded Class D, the amp was working fine until I powered it up with a 12v DC regulated power supply and had it pushing 2 12’’ Type R Alpines, each speaker 1000w. I was told I under powered the amp and blew the outputs, which are 8 IRF3710 transistors. The amp came on it protect since then. So I bought the 8 transistors all of the same batch and I installed them myself, the amp comes on perfectly now and the transistors stay cold, the only issuse is that when I hook any speaker to it and pass 1/4 gain the amp green power light begins to flicker with the bass and the speaker makes a ‘cok cok’ noise. I am lost at this point. I have it running on another power supply for testing and when it does the problem the power supply doesn’t even drop in power is stays at 13.4v so I think its getting proper power. It even does it if I connect a 6x9 speaker.
Great vid! Following.
Could you possibly consider building a large power capacitor array to store more reserve power for those peak demands? I've wanted to do this on the rail side for a long time.
Those giant 12v power caps are just about useless....the key is to have the caps on the high voltage side...
you can add more capacitance but be careful. too much capacitance or too low ESR could lead to instability on switching power supply
Had to take a painpill sam you guys just squeezed my brain whoooooo..
love this kind of stuff. keep up the good work!
Hi. I also have the pioneer gm-d9601 amplifier, but it is defective. Can you help me to detect it?
want to have a similar career path, what should i look into studying?
Please what’s the name of your server power supply of 350A@12V and where can I get one to buy?, thanks
Question, why does my car audio system make a loud thumping sound when the car turns off
Man I can't decide if I should go with two RS gold 12's and the Smart Bass 3k or Two Savard Hi-q 12's and the Smart Bass 5k. Please help me decide. I will have two 6-pack banks of Shenquan 6ah 40c cells and sufficient copper from alt to fuse to bank and then bank to fuse to amp.
Sam your the man. Much love respect from the island boy living in Canada
Hey there, is there a follow up to this video to see the new nodded amp? Could someone I'm theory modify there AP amo , with your ( paid of course) expertise and services ... I think k that would be awesome....
Rewatched and ready for the mod video
So did you go back to the garden?
Can you actually make a amp if I was a paying customer base on what subs I have to push them far if need but clean bass for that drive around town days.
Have you ever had an audiopipe apcl 1500.1d on the bench?
Hey do you think i could use that litz wire on voice coils??
Long awaited video
Damn im owner of hd3k, im fine with stock power etc :D but damn waiting for you to make this audiopipe to do at least 4k+
When u were talking aboutbuilding your own transformer and was explaining skinning effect does the same thing happen in a subwoofer voice coil and if it does can it be remedied the same way
No the frequencies are way too low ☺
@@barevids oh that makes sense.. how did that a.p. amp u were making better work out and r you doing another video on it
Where is part 2 in this video I need to see the outcome of the aidiopipe
What power supply si the 350 amp one? Where can I find one
please please please, i recently purchased a HD3000 waited to get here all the way from Brazil have plugged and tested it. Output voltage goes up to 78V without clipping and everything seems to be working as it should. Trouble is: anything above 32v on output will give me a square wave even though the amplifier wont clip. My target voltage is 56.5v to run two kickers 15" 800rms. But anything above 32 is square (oscilloscope show me that) So could you PLEASE give me your opinion on what it could be? Seems like everyone back home (im Brazilian) is so cough up on getting the desire voltage but no ones cares about the quality of the wave, and we both know that a square signal is what burns our speakers at least the majority of times. Ps: the whole system is brand new, all running 0 gauge wires, good ground, 3xAGM 105 amp batteries, pioneer stereo, digital processor etc (all flat) Oscilloscope has been used to set up others amps with in the car for mid bass and treble. So i've ordered the HD3000 for my bass (good value for money) in which should have plenty of power for 2x800w subs. Please let me know why do you think that after 32v the signal squares, should i ignore that set the gain up to the 56.5v that i need and as longer the amp itself isn't clipping am i good to go? Will be waiting for your reply 🙏🏼 Kind regards
Hi. I need to know where you are taking the ground reference for the scope from. If you are grounding the scope to the amplifier main ground then this is correct. Remember this is a full bridge amplifier. For the speaker to see a 74v wave across it, each speaker terminal both plus and minus will have a 37v wave on it, out of phase from each other so that the speaker sees double that as the potential difference. It sounds like your amp is working fine. If you take your scope but put the ground probe on the negative speaker terminal instead you should be able to see the full combined waveform of both terminals.
Could you also open the new cerwin vega and soundstream clones to that amp? 😆
Can you update the transformer in any amp to upgrade the amps power?
Can’t wait to see part 2 bro love this videos mods can u modified a MMats D200 HC old school 🙏🏽 i got it i eill send it to u just let me know how much 💰??
#Question
How would I be able to get the microchip(programed) for my amp
where i can get those toroids? or what code they are?
O módulo de 2000 RMS deles é a mesma construção do módulo 3000 da Taramps
This is gonna be epic!!!
Can you please give me your opinion I need a 3000.1 amp and what would be better the Taramps md3000.1 or the Banda Beat 3000.1 about the same price. I have several people saying one or the other but nobody agrees on one.
~Powerus 3k.
@@barevids do you have a way to contact you. I have a poineer amp stuck in protect mode