A Former Teacher On Why She Quit, Dealing With Parents, And Why Teaching Is Broken
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- Опубликовано: 25 авг 2024
- Chelsea is joined by former teacher and RUclipsr Natalie Parmenter to talk about why she left the profession, and her advice for (potential) future teachers.
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Thank you so much for having me! Chelsea, I can’t even describe how important your support has been for my channel. 🩷🩷🩷
🖍️ Primary Focus is the parent’s guide to elementary school answering all your questions from a teacher’s perspective. I hope you check it out!
Huge respect for all you do and all the resources you have created. This was a great conversation!
@@sara61696 thank you! 😍
My mom was also an elementary school teacher for decades - so much of what you said resonated with what I've heard from her! Knowing how much she had to deal with from parents before they had 24/7 access to teachers, I can't IMAGINE being a teacher trying to handle parents now! Thank you for the years you put in and the work you're doing now!
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My wife just resigned as a principal of a middle school. Her blood pressure has been at dangerous levels, she has constant migraines, severe anxiety, one day we think she had a mild stroke (half her face started drooping) and this is all due to the parents and the complete lack of assistance.
WOW omg 😱 that’s scary 😧 I hope you’re wife is okay.
We wait to long when the pay check is good
Oh man, I pray that Jesus provides me with a job that doesn't put me through so much stress.
It’s a stressful environment! So glad she got out (as I did). Btw, the drooping could have been a complex migraine…I ended up going to the ER for a similar thing.
The drooping is Bell’s palsy , a lot of people get that. It’s treatable! Glad she quit!!!! Health is WEALTH!!!🙏🏽
Because parents use school as a daycare instead of a place of education.
This IS a problem. It's crazy how many students show up almost every day, but complete NO work. It's so obvious that their parents are on their asses about being at school, but they could care less about their actual grades. For many, it's a daycare. In fact, I just told my students this the other day, trying to encourage them to take their lives in their own hands before they become adults with zero skills.
Exactly. Parents expect teachers to also raise their kids, because the parents are to lazy to do it themselves.
Even teachers are leaving daycares as well. The whole teaching system is broken.
@@tonychains1262 And, why do you think there is any chance for most of them to do any work, when that starts when a child is 4 years old? It's frightening to think about the illiteracy level in our country rising and rising.
This! Then they wanna complain about how expensive it is to raise even just one child…..then why’d you have a kid to begin with? I’ve also noticed that some of these parents put more effort into making sure their kids have brand new designer clothes, than making sure the kids are well behaved and are educationally set.
So nice to hear a voice from someone who wasn’t a millionaire CEO by 25 lol! A hyperbolic statement, I know, but these past few guests, while excellent, were so out of my realm career wise and tax bracket wise, it gets hard to relate to. I love hearing from a working class perspective, especially a Teacher. They need a voice now more than ever!
Exactly this.
My sentiments exactly! 💯
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I agree.
I could not agree more
28 years teaching science in CA. I wanted to quit for years and finally could bc my husband works for a successful tech company. People think the workday is really short, but the work I did at school during the day was just carrying out the hours of work I did in the evenings and all weekend. I missed all of that time with my family because I was either working, or recovering from the physical and mental stress of working. I worked for a very good school district and with one exception, the parents were lovely. Generally the students were really great too. The big issue is that in order to be an even halfway decent teacher, you have to give up your life to the job, and you get almost no compensation for all of that work. Teaching is not a calling, it’s a job. Excuse any errors. I’m doing voice to text.
I will be eternally grateful to you, you changed my whole life and I will continue to preach your name to let the whole world know that you saved me from huge financial debt with little investment, thank you,lsabelle-ChIoe-Scott.
sear ch her names above, if you care.
I completely agree with you. All the best to you in your post teaching life!
Caring positions always get taken advantage of. Because if you do only the work your paid for the ones your in charge of pay the price. Nursing, aged care, disability. All the same
I completely agree.@@freazeezy
I once had a parent who would email me MULTIPLE times a day, for a HIGH SCHOOLER, expecting an immediate response.
This parent was a middle school counselor. It was ridiculous.
I no longer teach. It’s not all parents, but it’s enough to make a difference, and worse- it’s the admin. Admin needs an overhaul.
Did you ever think that there was a reason she reached out multiple times a day. Did you ever peacefully ask her or did you just judge her and punish her and " teach her a lesson " by ignoring the emails , prompting her to write again ?
Maybe things she saw in counseling caused her to worry about her child. Maybe the child was not doing well in your class or possibly expressed to their parent they did not enjoy your class. Maybe you were one of these teachers that plays favorites and the child felt unheard.
Maybe it's none of those things or several and more.
Just by your comment alone I can see that you think you what was better for that student.
Are you a parent ? Where you a parent at the time? One thing about being a parent high school does not mean that kid is not someone's child. 18 is considered "adult" for a reason. Some of us would argue that's even a bit young.
I'm always amazed at childless teachers who think they know better than the parents. Blows my mind.
@@AgapeLove878People like you are part of why I quit.
(I have a son, but several emails a day is way too much. Makes a teacher dread speaking to the parent.)
@@AgapeLove878 High school teachers in the USA normally have 100 or more kids on their caseload at any given time. Expecting someone that busy to always be on call to immediately respond to you whenever you want something is not reasonable. Your kid is not supposed to be more important than any of the other kids.
Teachers inevitably end up with lots of experience meeting parents who are doing a terrible job at parenting, for a variety of reasons. There are a LOT of parents out there who are just fucking awful. The idea that "parents always know what is best for their kids" is not even close to the truth, and teaching is one of those jobs where you become intimately familiar with how far it is from the truth, as well as the implications.
Plus getting a teaching license normally involves taking classes on developmental psychology--i.e. time spent studying what actual scientific research has discovered about how children's brains grow and how they are actually affected by what they experience during childhood, including the various ways they might be treated by adults.
How many classes like that do you have to take before you're allowed to get pregnant?
One thing that's well understood about teenagers, for example, is that their main developmental need is for increasing amounts of independence and the experience of making their own decisions and taking responsibility for the consequences. There's a ton of research out there showing how "helicopter parenting" when a kid is too old for it tends to cause mental health problems.
I'd expect a school counselor to know this, of course, but people can develop cognitive blind spots around topics that they have high levels of emotion about--same reason surgeons have that rule about not operating on family members.
Just because the parent emailed you multiple times a day, doesn't mean you had to engage with them multiple times a day. Check and respond to emails twice -- at the beginning of the work day, and again at the end. Problem solved. You are only expected to respond within contracted hours. Parents can learn to wait just like they wouldn't storm into a doctor's office demanding to be seen despite not having an appointment. If it's a true emergency, what is your child's teacher going to do? Dial 911 for you?
@@madeleinesoares6232I worked at a private school and definitely I was expected to respond to emails outside of work hours, even on weekends.
It seems that most pink collar jobs are broken. Teaching and nursing especially. The way the train them is broken and the way we treat them after is broken, and we rely too heavily on people who don't know these jobs to make the decisions that impact them.
Cna and nursing student here, it's definitely broken. If it weren't for my end goal of being a pmhnp I would have quit nursing in general just bc staffing and staff-patient ratios are HORRENDOUS. It's not that there aren't enough nurses, it's that there aren't enough nurses who want to be in this cruel system. And even then, we're short anyway bc hospitals and senior homes don't want to pay an additional salary when we can just rush through everything and skip breaks.
I completely agree.
Amen.
Literally, politicians(Republicans )are saying they don't want American children to go to college because they graduate as liberals, are making education policy, and have been doing so for over 30 years. They have no respect for learning.
truth! I don't know who is making the rules for schools in QLD Australia, but now we're going four days a week and extended terms...these people don't work on the ground and have no idea how the assessment calendar and reporting periods work or how students and teachers are after assessments and exams, it's just insane.
The elephant in the room is how education has been weaponized by politicians. I was horrified to learn how NC teachers are treated!
Okay. You went there. Thank you.
They want public facilities to fail.
Exactly, Republicans are ruining public education.
Because teachers are highly educated they are threatening to non educated parents. They then get slapped with the “woke” label. So much for being smart, dedicated, hardworking, and caring.
As a former teacher I assure you it’s the same or worse in all Red States. Blue states aren’t any better, they are just broken in other ways.
She's not making these up. She's telling 100% the truth about everything. What a shame that our education system is losing wonderful humans who love the children and the essence of teaching but run ragged....beat in every way. Shame.
Good for her to leave the toxic education system. Sad for our children.
Forget the kids! At the end of the day, you have to look out for your professional and personal well being! It’s a job!
Sad for the adults who are the children. Lol. We never actually grow up to become mature adults. Children having children, repeat. If the world is in a mess, it's because of the childish games children like to play. They fight and kill over toys.
It's even sadder because places around the world will treat (and pay) teachers far, FAR better.
In Europe, Asia, South America, etc., certified teachers can actually make a middle class living, and I mean the middle class living from the American 1950s & 1960s, when you could make enough to live off of, and have extra left over for vacations, modest investments, unforeseen emergencies, etc.
It's not "the education system" that's the problem.
It's the AMERICAN education system.
We all need to realize the difference.
@@DiamondFlame45I agree with your philosophy.
Sad for children, yes, but the lack of parenting, and how awful some parents are to teachers, is beyond anything I will ever understand. I don't care how many jobs they have to have, and some don't even work. If you have children, BE A RESPONSIBLE PARENT!!!
I'm a former teacher in-training from Germany and it's not much different here. The big difference is that teachers in Germany are actually well-paid with good pension and benefits. However it does come at a price: The state basically owns you, you're not allowed to strike, your employer can move you around schools as needed or keep you at a school you don't like, and especially if you're unmarried and without children, you have no chance to object. Additionally, before obtaining permanent employment, you'll have to deal with 18 months of on-the-job training ("Referendariat"), which depending on your supervisors, can be extremely stressful at best and a borderline culty hazing process that'll leave you scarred for years at worst. I quit and that time still haunts me, which had nothing to do with students or parents.
Wow..that's horrifying! Especially how they move you at any time, no striking allowed, and how they discriminate against the teachers who are unmarried and child-free by choice.
⁸t t tt y ⁷
Thank you for sharing. I had no idea how bad things were in Germany. I always assumed that it was one of the best countries as far as teaching is concerned.
It is definitely better than the states but yeah, still dealing with some of the same issues. Buying materials out of pocket, a lot of extra activities that are not payed (at school work groups between teachers etc.)… no real compensation for overtime, when you are sick you are still expected to provide materials for the students. I am lucky I am at a great school but there are still many things in the system who are outdated and not really fair
@@mccolkit sounds bad but you don’t know all the perks. They are basically unfirable for any reason. They have private insurance paid by the state even in their old age, which is unheard of for the rest of us in Germany. The parents cannot do anything even if a teacher is racist, sexist or anything else cause they cannot be fired. Also yes technically you can be moved but I know if no teacher that was ever moved unwillingly. Being a Beamte (this SUPER permanent position) is a coveted position for many Germans.
There is too much shit to deal with as a teacher. Overly demanding parents, unaddressed behavior problems, ineffective administrators, government adding more to teach into an all ready packed curriculum every single year, ridiculous PD requirements, and all for a salary nowhere near equal to the educational requirement to do the job. Why the hell would you want to have these miserable days and work all weekend when, for the same salary, you can work a retail job that stops when you clock out? This is why there is a teaching crisis.
Yeah, it's literally insane.
I started teaching a month ago and I'm contemplating either quitting or jumping off a cliff. This profession is no joke.
The sheer disrespect from the parents as well as the students is astounding.
@@AlIskanderZhaoGo with your gut instinct and resign. I quit teaching at the end of last school year. Things are only going to get worse from here on out. You deserve better.
@@AlIskanderZhao Don't let the job take over your life, not worth it!
Yes let’s not learn just say duck it!
I am sitting here and shaking my head in agreement. I just retired after 34 1/2 years. I couldn’t even finish the year, that is how bad it has gotten. I made the decision to leave in May, just out of concern for my health. I felt terrible doing so but no one was looking out for me…Sad what the job has become. I felt that I was no longer teaching but only following a script and student behavior was out of control and there was no consequences. I officially retired over the summer and do not regret it one bit, I just wish I was in a position to have left earlier than I did.
I retired last July, and I totally get what you are saying. I am so thankful that I was able to leave with a full pension.
Had my first panic attack (I think) yesterday for 25 minutes in class. All because of student behavior and lies.
Yup, quit after 3 years of uni. Once I got my foot in an actual school for shadowing, I very quickly realized we are in deep shit.
Same thing happened to me lol. When I did my student teaching I realized this career path wasn’t for me
All "women's work" is underpaid. The assumption was that the teachers would be married so the income was not for living on. Men were expected to subsidize the education system by marrying teachers.
The starting wage needs to be at least 60K per year adjusted for higher cost areas. It should be 4-5x the rent of an available 2 bedroom apartment within 10 miles of the school.
Wow. I never knew that!
With that logic it should be at least $112k where I am. But the pay scale tops out at $98k. Higher than other places, yes, but it’s necessary now with cost of living.
@@melanieshaw7577if I made 4 times the rent of a 2 bedroom apartment near the school, I'd make what my husband makes as a software engineer. (80-90k range) Which makes sense, actually. He works hybrid, less hours than I did teaching, he has less stress (only works extra around release days), gets way better benefits so I'm on his health insurance and he gets 3 months PAID PATERNITY leave, etc etc. Teaching is more responsibility and stress and I have a Master's degree, I'm dual certified to teach ELA/Writing and Japanese. But I was making less than half of what he was at much longer hours, including eating up some weekend time. I definitely went into the wrong career!
Hmm…. But historically there were also a ton of male teachers? Just read any literature from the 1800s. What time period and place are you saying that teaching was “women’s work”? In some places and times women weren’t even allowed to be teachers!
@@samanthaquant7411 low pay is associated with every job that is considered "women's work." Perhaps you also need to look at how much male teachers were paid back then vs women. Were men paid better as teachers when women weren't allowed to teach?
Retired teacher (30 yrs.) in ME and FL. Natalie has nailed it. I retired just before COVID, and we were “the flavor of the month” for many years prior. Horrible pay, disrespect, parental expectations of “multiple” daily communications, administration that is so afraid of being sued that there is no backup, etc.
what Natalie is doing is fantastic! I wish her luck and pray she has over a million followers!! 😊
I am an Army officer and I’ve always felt that we are paid very fairly. I would love to see legislation in a state that ties teacher’s salaries to military officers in that state.
Rough estimate (we are paid differently based on where we are), the lowest ranking officer in NC would make about 70k a year, by 5 years, it’s about 100k.
Totally agree. My husband makes about 90k as an O1E which, with how expensive our area is, is decently enough to support a middle-class family and put some savings away. I've met teachers here who are paid so little that they have to seek designated low-income housing options. I've thought their pay structure should be similar to military structure, not exactly the same of course but with an untaxed portion to reflect regional COL and a base pay along some sort of pay scale.
@@lucievelyn4866 Way to be shitty about something vocally in support of teachers making more money 🙄
@@lucievelyn4866it's a federal pay scale-- you can literally Google it and see the pay charts. Discussing what you make in the Military, or even as a civilian federal employee, is no big deal. I wish the civilian sector were so open about compensation.
@lucievelyn4866 Hmm... Just wait, China is waiting in the wings and will supplant the US as the world imperial power. It'll be a much better world then, right?
@@lucievelyn4866 Because a) they probably have a different opinion about their job than you do, and more importantly, b) their point is that teachers are really important, so they should be paid at least as much as another salaried position the government pays for.
My mom was a 5th grade teacher in Virginia for 30+ years and I honestly think it's a big part of why we're not close. She worked SO MUCH, I can't really remember spending any quality time together growing up. I was grading her papers as a middle and high schooler, and she was still up until midnight almost every night doing paperwork. She bought so many school supplies and enlisted family members to go to every Staples in town when things went on sale with quantity limits. She was stressed all the time. And all that is with was teacher's union. Then I moved to NC as an adult and it's astounding how much worse it is for teachers here. I'm disgusted that our state leaders are failing our teachers and our kids so badly. I love that Natalie is trying to help build bridges across the divide between parents and teachers!
I taught in a public school for 25 and my kids went to the same district, but I would never teach today or send my kids to public school today. Things have changed so much.
Teaching is a dead end career and I say this as a former teacher! I work in corporate now and I wouldn’t change it for the world! Higher pay and I work remotely. Some of these people need a reality check! Your kids are not special! At the end of the day, it’s a job! What’s insane, getting shot in the classroom is considered a workplace injury for teachers?!
Could I ask what career path you transitioned to? (Former teacher here). Wonder if a lot of cross skills are involved?
@@ViviolauI recommend Corporate Learning and Development roles! I work as a LMS administrator for a company but I want to go advance into a Learning Experience Designer role because I want to create content
@@DiamondFlame45 Thank you :) I will check it out.
Only a month in and I am annoyed like crazy. I left garbage call center work for this madness. I'd rather do neither.
Just to add…I retired early in 2021 after 21 years of teaching middle school. Teaching was a second career for me, so I was able to retire at 62. However, I decided to substitute teach just to stay in the game and help out when teachers need to be out. I just want to say, I’ve been called on 3 different occasions to cover classrooms where the permanent teacher quit, I’m talking just same day quitting walking out! The main reasons were the same throughout which was, student behaviors out of control, lack of administrative support, non parent support, tons of paper work, excessive meetings, and no planning time. So, yes, teaching is becoming an at-risk field if something is not done soon.
I don't think anything is going to be done, soon or not. Districts and admin hear the same things teachers do, and all they do is pile more on. Student behaviors and the parents they come from, are horrible, but it's not politically correct to talk about it.
lol I’m watching this video at 9:30 pm as I put the finishing touches on my lesson plans for tomorrow. I’ve been teaching for 17 years, 13 of them in my current position at a public high school. Everything that y’all said in this video is right. Teaching is supposed to get easier with experience, but my job is much more difficult now than it was ten years ago. I spend more time on paperwork than I do planning and doing actual teaching. I have to document in triplicate every single little thing that happens in my classroom. I’m not allowed to use my teaching skills to make decisions anymore, and I have to justify everything I do as being related to improving standardized test scores in subjects that I don’t even teach. I work long hours far beyond what I’m paid for. Every day is stressful in new and different ways.
I also deeply worry about the effect that being in constant contact with parents has on kids, especially older kids. It doesn’t help that the parents won’t stop texting the kids during the school day… And it also doesn’t help that parents get angry when teachers insist that students don’t answer their phones during instruction time. And these are high school students! They should be able to function without reminders from Mom every 45 minutes!!
I have seen the results of this constant monitoring from parents already. My students are more passive than they were ten years ago, more prone to freezing when I ask them to do something, and more prone to talk to their parents when they have a question instead of simply asking me. I have a parent who emails me with questions about her son’s homework every week. Her son is a high school junior who intends to go to college! When is he going to learn to ask questions on his own behalf?!
Chelsea, I don’t think you need to “check yourself” when it comes to these issues just because you’re not a parent. I think it’s okay to say “Hey, this is having real observable negative effects on kids.” And yes I understand that parents worry, and yes we all know that letting your kid gain some independence can be terrifying. But that independence needs to happen. Even if you have to fight against the cultural tide of constant communication to do it.
Anyway, thank you for another great video!!
You need to stop being afraid of finding something else to do.
Well said!
Well stated.
Honestly, as an 11 year Kindergarten Teacher in Virginia, the parents are the least of my issues. It's all the testing, data, paperwork, work outside of school/late night, low pay, and just plain abuse that is pushing me out of the classroom. I am slowly realizing how it's not worth my life and stress. I'll be trying to be a specialist/resource teacher next year, because this ain't it! It's sad that I go around telling people not to go into teaching because it's not worth all the work! Something's gotta give! Not to mention most of us have a second job! Smhhh
I substitute as a special Ed Resource sometimes. I don't recommend it long term. The students still have behavior issues that are rewarded.
@@robinsonfamily222EXACTLY…. You are right. Being a Special Ed / Resource teacher is not better. It actually could be worse. I hate the way they coddle and pacify bad behavior because of a students’ disability….
each teacher needed a clerical assistant 20 years ago but not AMERICA
I worked for 2 years as an RSP (resource specialist teacher) in California. There is a lot of paperwork involved with being an RSP teacher.The IEP paperwork alone can be overwhelming. You have to teach and do all of the paperwork, testing and facilitate IEP meetings. It is a lot! I would stay after school at least 2 hours 2-3 times per week, in addition to this I also ended up taking work home because there simply wasn't enough time to do everything! What made things even worse is the fact that I was the only RSP teacher at my school site (some schools have a minimum of 2). During the months of May and early June last school year, I spent a majority of time out of the classroom testing and doing IEP meetings. I felt so bad because I could not service the students on my caseload. I had to monitor student progress and do IEP progress reports on all of their goals. It was difficult to do this when I was out of the classroom so much. There were so many kids that needed to be tested and legally we had 60 days to test and hold the IEP meetings for these students. It was very stressful. In addition to all of this I taught 7 different grade levels (TK-5) and had to provide sub plans/work everyday so the subs could run the class while I did testing/meetings. This went on for about a month and a half. There were quite a few students on my caseload that had behavior problems which made it hard, especially when there were multiple subs.
The phenomenon of children losing the majority of their unsupervised time is definitely kind of weird. I understand the impulse to make sure you always know where your kid is and what they're doing, because we unfortunately hear too many stories of bad things happening, and people don't want it to be their kid that something happens to. But on the other hand, kids need opportunities to develop independence and self-reliance. If they don't get those opportunities until their teen years (or later!), they are being set up for major anxiety issues when they finally find themselves riding without training wheels, so to speak.
I was a child to a helicopter parent and I am very socially stunted. Kids need independence and time to play and socialize with friends
We can either pay teachers what their worth, create career growth paths and make the conditions reasonable or we can forget about having a literate, civil population.
just left teaching after 15 years and not even gonna watch because I know I'll be so triggered and write a dozen comments… Thank you for giving voice to those of us who stuck around and still left.
49:15 this is truly what it comes down to. Education is at the core of a strong country and a strong economy and yet the country refuses to pay the educators.
I took a Teaching & Training course in high school and my teacher told all of us about how broken the system is, how she had to use money from her own pockets to buy teaching equipment, and inflexible conventional teaching is to a the learning types. I want to be a teacher, but that's gonna wait until things get better or I'm confident I can make a change.
Ditto.
Hope you're crafting a plan B, then. 🌚
I'm glad she told you the truth.
Get into after-school care, more freedom
How on earth is it legal to keep NC teachers from assembling? That seems like a 1A violation
This is true with state workers of many varieties in multiple states, unfortunately.
It’s illegal for teachers to strike or unionize in many states. In most areas with unions they have so many laws limiting their powers they ultimately work for the school district instead of the teachers. Or the unions protest teachers no matter what, up to including any abuse that doesn’t have criminal charges attached.
Back when I was a teacher I saw all the above but never ended up in an area where I could join one. Mentioning wanting to start one was the easiest way to find yourself fired for something bad enough to lose a license over that you obviously didn’t do. It’s also almost impossible to sue a school district due to how insanely expensive it is even if you win.
I'm a teacher in Texas and it's rough - I am trying to work on starting my own business so I can leave teaching as well. It is one of the most underappreciated professions - what she is talking about is only surface level too. It doesn't account for possible toxic admin, the emotion of dealing with student behavior each day, etc.
Oh and I am on year 11 and there are brand new teachers coming in making as much as or more than I do. Expertise is not valued here.
Teacher in Texas! Wasn't there an incident last year (and this year) a child brought their mommies gun to school and shot their teacher? That's one reason I'd quit teaching in America. They have the highest school shootings than any other country in the world.
How do new teachers make more than an 11-year veteran? Is your salary schedule upside down? @@starlightandscout
Me too! Just resigned at year 5.
I started my own business 3 months ago!!
Too many parents treat school like daycare. As long as they aren’t in the house they aren’t their problem.
This is really ridiculous. Parents are often not interested in what their kids are doing in school, which is the true recipe for disaster.
Exactly. They want less and less to do with their kids on the whole yet they still demand the final say in what and how their kids are taught. Talk about a contradiction in terms.
I would say this has been a problem on both sides. Parents are often made to feel like they aren’t important. I had a mom tell me she threw up before every IEP meeting because it was so intimidating. It shouldn’t be that way. I had co-teachers tell me they don’t encourage parents to participate because they are annoying. You can’t have it both ways. Parents should be required to speak to teachers with respect and teachers should mutually show respect for the role of the parent.
@@happycampers7889exactly. Can’t have a hostile enemy mindset about parents and then wonder why we stay away from campus. I am very interested in everything going on with my child at school, watch their grades closely.
Well if they raised their kids well they would be mostly right.
All that work and for so little pay sounds exhausting. I'm a teacher too but not in the USA and I work at Uni. The pay still sucks but at least they leave you alone. If I had to deal with the terrible salary AND the constant demands of parents , administration etc, I would explode!!! It's heart-breaking what they're doing to teaching... 😢
this was an incredible episode. i teared up so many times listening to how bad teachers have it. its heartbreaking. they are some of the most valuable people in our workforce.
I totally get your frustration with dealing with parents as a teacher. It can be tough sometimes. But I think it's important to remember that not all parents are difficult. Some are really supportive and understanding.
I turned over more than half mil working with CHRIS RYAN STEWART on a wide array of options and finally sticking to a few that have been favorable in the past 2 years. I began working with him in October after the feds lended 300b for stimulus to stem crisis, i knew i needed help.
Oh, really? That's interesting! It's great to hear about someone who can provide financial guidance and support. I'm sure teachers, and anyone dealing with financial stress, could benefit from his expertise and also maximize income
Definitely! It's important to have someone who can guide you in making smart financial decisions. I'm sure CHRIS RYAN STEWART has some valuable insights to share. I have witnessed a remarkable growth of $485k in just the past two quarters.
@jenniferwilson-yz7rwI think that both parties need to begin the school year with a clean slate. The minute anybody enters the classroom ready for battle is the moment any hopes of peaceful business relationships between the parties ends. It would of course also be great if every parent out there realized that it is their responsibility to discipline and instill good moral values within their offspring on the home front right from the offset. Plus, demanding that their child’s teacher turn their child into a flawless genius and person oversight is absurd and needs to leave the parents’ mindsets once and for all or else they are setting themselves and their kids up for rude awakenings.
As a person that lives in NC, went to school here and now is thinking about her toddlers future education… she is 100% accurate!
I just cannot believe how much access parents have. Holy balls.
One of the reasons I'm glad I don't want kids. I could never bring them into this "educational" mess. On top of that worry about them not making it home.
No lie, I have a 12 yo but in this mess today I wouldn't have one even if I were the same age as I was when I had him
My parents live in north Carolina and have wanted me to move down and lived near them but I would have to take almost a $30,000 to 40,000 a year paycut. It's insane.
Please interview a women first responder next!
49:36 "Well said." 😂😂😂 I'm the son of a retired public school teacher. I very much appreciate the interview and the introduction to Natalie Parmenter's work. Thank you for the video!
We Stan a teaching episode. 👏🏽
In my country, Russia, it’s the same. After covid I became self employed and started taking care of my own pension and benefits. It’s still not easy and requires even more responsibility, but it makes me happy, I won’t ever quit teaching
У нас это, наверное, ещё хуже. У меня оклад 14100...
My daughter goes to a small parent participation school and I'm grateful every day for those teachers. It's definitely hands on and a lot of parent involvement but, it's so worth it. My daughter is also on the spectrum so I'm really hands on. I can only work part-time due to having to be so involved with school and therapies so we definitely feel the financial strain but, I feel so blessed that she's able to go there. I'm really grateful for good teachers. You guys are truly the MVPS.
I'm so happy I made productive decisions about my finances that changed my life forever. I'm a single mother living in Canada, bought my second house in September and hoping to retire next year at 49 if things keep going smoothly for me
Congratulations beautiful lady. You're really doing well for yourself, I'm 44 and my financial life is in a mess.Any great tips would really go a long way in shaping my life. I want to buy my own house, that's really a big flex.
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A bit of a ramble below regarding the crap teachers sometimes have to put up with based on my own experiences as a student, so please don't click if reading a lot isn't your thing 😂
I'm not a teacher but I've usually been on the good side of most teachers and fully respect them. My senior year of high school was done at a school in New Orleans that was hit hard from Katrina. I attended the 07-08 year. Most of the teachers were first years. And most...didn't last that one year. I lost about five teachers for my classes.
First gone was the art teacher because he had enough of being called gay by the students. Honestly doesn't matter in my eyes, the man knew art and I, as a talentless person, was interested in learning from him. He left a week before Thanksgiving break. Then I lost my journalism teacher who spent most class time trying to get the class to shut the hell up and pay attention. He finally had enough and stopped teaching and some asshole students had the raw audacity to report him to the principal. But I'm very certain that she knew it wasn't him, but them, and he quit instead of being fired. The prinicpal liked me quite a lot since I wasn't from New Orleans and didn't behave like them, so she spoke with me frequently if we passed in the hallway. Not saying all students are like this and yes, an argument can be made about low income areas and parents who aren't attentitve or interested in their kid's schooling but the end result still is a child that, put very delicately, is difficult. If ripping the band-aid off and speaking your mind, they're some pretty awful kids.
Third teacher was my math teacher. She was a timid woman, but I always tried to smile at her and show I was paying attention as I knew the rough school was probably unnerving and I wanted to be at least one friendly student. Perhaps I'm a bit of a "teacher's pet" but I see it as trying to sympathize or empathize. But she quit after, rumor has it, she tried to break up a fight and was hit with a chair, putting her in the hospital. I wish I'd have asked the principal what hospital she was at...I would've brought her some flowers or something or just visited her and let her know that in the brief time she was there, I really liked her teaching style. Math is my worst subject and I was actually repeating it from my junior year. I had a brief hope I would finally do well with a patient teacher finally, but...while I still passed with an A, it was NOT because of hard work.
I forgot to mention it before, but I also lost the replacement to the art teacher (she was a substitute and didn't teach art...or anything at all, so that class became my study hall to finish up homework). She got in a car accident and while she survived, she was also a very sweet woman. Again, I wish I had asked about what hospital she was at to visit or send a card or something to her.
Next teacher lost was the replacement for the math teacher. He was a man who admittedly deserved to be fired. He didn't even attempt to teach because he was talking with women on his cell phone and scheduling dates during class. No, not via texts, he made phone calls to these women in class, so we all heard him. He also openly admitted that he felt on a religious level that it was fine for him to cheat on so many women because he saw it that that's why there's more women than men...so that guys can be with more than one women at a time (I do not mind anyone being polyamorous so long as all parties are aware and consenting. But that's not what this looked like and it was inappropriate during class time). THIS was the only time I approved of students going to the principal to have a teacher removed and within a month or so, he was gone. We would go months without a teacher, so those days were graded as an A by default from the school. We did finally get a teacher around January or so and he lasted until the end of the year.
And as an "honorable mention", we almost lost my English teacher. She did quit at one point, but was begged to come back by the students, of all people. Now, I do NOT fault a single teacher who would say no and look for better opportunities, but she was quite amazing in trying to make class approachable for everyone and show that she cared. She'd go to bat for students who maybe were about to be expelled and offered many study sessions for the ACT or other tests. When sne saw we couldn't afford a year book staff, she started one. At my prior high school, you could only join Yearbook Staff if you were on the honor roll, gatekeeping otherwise really good candidates. I enjoyed writing back then but was terrible at math, so I never would've been able to join. So, I applied for a role in this new version and while I wanted to just be a journalist or learn how to edit photography, I became the Editor in Chief (during a very stressful class in which she snapped and yelled, she pointed out that everyone needed to be paying attention because except for me, everyone else read on a fourth grade level. That...was a pretty sobering moment but might be in part why I was given such a role in the yearbook ). The teacher assigned me this and while I'm honored, I definitely think it was a bit too much, lol. I did do interviews of the teachers and principals, though and I have a hilarious story that I'll save regarding the vice principal's interview.
Sadly, we didn't have enough time to finish the book. She was even willing to get our addresses and mail us one over summer, finishing it herself. My family moved states after I graduated, so I don't know if she actually did do that, but damn...makes me wish I could've helped finish it, with that kund of determination. But I'm appreciative that she even tried to get it started because that was juat more of her time and money going into it. At graduation, she was the teacher that each student spoke highly of, including in my own speech. I was Valedictorian, but given how most of my grades were just an A because I lost a teacher, I never used it on my resumé. Didn't feel earned.
All of this though is to say, when I remember that senior year, abso-frickin-LUTELY do I support teachers making more! Or...quitting when they've been pushed beyond their limits. There's only so much you can do for the kids before you just break. And these teachers never even mentioned the parents being an issue (though I don't think they reached out to parents all too often. I don't remember any parent/teacher meetings that my mom attended).
I'm retired, but your your post had my eyes tearing up thinking about how the students were trying to learn with no assigned teacher, and how administration would rather play musical chairs with the substute teachers instead of allowing them to continue to teach in the same classrooms.
This was so well done......as a teacher with 29 years in this abusive profession I sure appreciate your effort, kindness, and understanding of what a lot of us go through.
@@khem127 Hi, that would almost be preferrable to what actually happened, lol. We rarely had sunstitute teachers. Teachers quit and were rarely replaced. When the art teacher quit because of the homophobic slurs, we did get a sub, but she didn't actually teach art or anything. So long as we showed up and were quiet, we got an A. As that was my first class of the day, I just used it to finish any homework or to read. When she got into a car accident, she was never replaced. They made us go into the auditorium. But, after only about two days, a "game" was started in which someone would have their shirt pulled over their head and they'd be beaten with a sock full of something rough. Yes, like prison, but "It's just a prank! 🤪". Yeah, I didn't find it funny when it happened to me. I instead managed to sweet-talk the security people into letting me just sit outside the art room. That corner of the building was the only one that had wifi as the students had stolen the ethernet cables everywhere else in most of the school. Or, I went to the library. I never spent another class in that auditorium as it was chaos in there.
I think when the journalism teacher was forced to quit, my schedule was changed and I was given a new class. My schedule was changed a ton that year once I told them I hoped to go to college, so they began to throw me in a lot of courses that would look good on a college application. They needn't have bothered, I sadly never graduated as work and school became too much to juggle. But I appreciate the effort. The school has rebranded to being a college prepatory school, so...good on them. Not sure if the student body is actually any better, though.
The math class was where I had the most teachers. As I had said, fhe first teacher was put in the hospital when she tried to break up a fight and was hit with a chair. She quit after that and I 100% do not blame her. The second teacher was the sexist guy who felt it appropriate to call up various women during class and claimed it was sole sort of holy sign that men should have multiple women (I scrubbed the religious part from my original comment, but yes, his words were something to the effect of, "God made more women than men so men could have more than one."). Yikes, lol. So, no love lost for when he was actually fired. We then went months without a teacher and again, the auditorium was where we were supposed to go. Nope, I went back to the art room or the library.
Oh. Did I mention the fighting was also so bad that thr entire school had to eat lunch at the same time? Lunch became I think an hour and a half (and school was changed to be like, from 8:45 to about 4 or 4:30PM). I didn't feel like even trying to get a plate of food so lunch for me became a bag of chips and a soda, or I brought a sandwich. I remember sitting down to eat outside one day when gunshots could be heard in the distance. The kids screamed and everyone ran back inside but I was rather annoyed as the shots weren't all that close and surely we'd all by that point had heard gunshots before. I don't say that to sound tough and the prinicpal right after gave a speech about how "a bullet has no name on it", as in, anyone can be victim to a shooting, even if they're not the intended target. True, but...the shots were from several blocks away. We were fine where we were, lol. We were in a rough area and shots were common. Say a prayer for whomever was the target and keep it moving.
Anyways. I say all of this to hopefully shed some more light on the situation. No "musical chairs" occurred, just the loss of great teachers and great class opportunities.
I remember my first year of being a teacher, I lost a great deal of weight from stress (which was alarming since I'm already on the petite side). Woke up at 6 am and crashed at 11 pm on normal days, practically working non-stop except for short meal breaks. The work days stretched out even longer if there was grading or lesson planning or meetings, or something else that required my attention. So glad I'm not longer in that environment.
I am a teacher and admin who is the last 3-5 years of my career. I am exhausted . Teaching has become so difficult for all of us- including administration. Most of us are working overtime to support our staff, our students and families . Public Education has been undermined for decades - on purpose to privatize education and monetize it. Conservatives have been attacking us constantly and this has seeped into a lack of respect /support for schools. I feel for my teachers and do everything I can to lessen their loads, to deflect the crazy from our District offices, parents etc.
WHY do they want to privatize it?? Makes no sense. Look what privatization does to health care!!
@@lisaj4441Because there is money to be made by destroying common goods in favor of personal profit. And America as a country seems to have decided this is a good idea. I'm not fond it, either.
Teaching children gender theory is where you guys ficked up. Then you told them if they didn't like it they can leave or send their kids to private school and now that they're doing that you're complaining and crying about it.
@@lisaj4441why else??? for profit. there’s a concerted effort to make the population uneducated and helpless. the corporations, the churches, the political parties… they want control and money. this is the economic system we allowed to fester for decades
I'm a substitute teacher, and even though I'm paid half as much as the teachers I share an education level with, I've been working 50+ hour weeks with no overtime pay and am still expected to pay for my own school supplies. It's very frustrating.
When I was in college, I used to teach part-time English course, the students were very amazing. But the parents were literally douchebags who demand their kids to excel in this (second) language pronto. I’ve got enough arguments with stubborn parents, particularly threaten me to get fired.
Respect to all teachers, from minimum salary to never ending works.
Yeah, it’s really a no-win situation with many parents a lot of the time. They always find something new to complain about without any reason or rhyme whatsoever. Even when their children are doing really well in school. 🙄
Sure, blame the parents. That's the problem with the system. The hubris -- the idea that the education system knows best. Truth is, the parents could get together and do a much better job.
@@donjindra, parents are a negative factor in this equation of failing system. You probably do not teach to not know this as problematic.
@@Dr.Sharron I'm a parent. I had kids in the system. I was educated in the system. There were good teachers. There were bad teachers. I'm sure there are both good and bad parents. So what is your evidence that parents are a net negative factor? Which parents? How were they negative? Did they interfere with reading assignments? Math assignments? Did they encourage their children to miss school, get bad grades or misbehave in school? Please be specific.
Whew the way this is a very timely conversation
We need teacher discounts everywhere like we have military discounts, there is not enough done for our educators.
Early on in my career a senior teacher sat down with me and shared with me that there is always more to be done and to be okay with not getting it all done (grading, lesson planning, parent conferences). She also told me to set a reasonable end time and not bring any work home, especially once I had tenure. Essentially, make sure you have a life outside of teaching and to take care of yourself.
I still do the best I can for my students within the hours I work, but her words ring true, and have helped me last 18 years in this job.
If you want to last, you MUST set boundaries with parents, the administration, and the job in general (just say no!)
Our students deserve the best, and perhaps one day we will fund education that way. Until then, we will get what we pay for.
That was great advice. Proud of having taken no work home in 20 of my 29 years into this toxic garbage job.
I am with you. My sister had a PHD in immunology- and was teaching middle school and high school biology at a private Jewish school and make 55K gross a year. One of her administrators, a supposed friend, took her to the hospital last year where she DIED less than 2 days later. When the administrator called me after my sister died, the administrator told me it was a good thing she DIED because she was going to be fired if she couldn’t physically be in the school. She was 61, she died of abdominal sepsis. She had been in an bad auto accident in Oct. of 2020(yes during the pandemic before the vaccine) because (I sure it was cheaper) they were called to have the children back into school. She never recovered from that accident but was force to pay 150-200 a ride to school as she was in a wheelchair. They insisted that she be in school rather than teach virtually, for the reasons that you said - supervise kids here, supervise kids there. To top this off, when we went to pick up her belongings from the school and bring them back the schools supplies, the administrator again told me and my nephew that it was a good thing that she died because she was going to be fired if she couldn’t physically be in school. Sorry, for the rant this is still an open wound. I have lost faith in the US’s education system completely.
I hope you told that woman off.
@@vintagejaki751 the first time I was in shock. The 2nd locked in the school behind closed doors with a security officer. My nephew said that he was surprised I didn’t punch her.
As a retired teacher, I never thought these posts would make me want to cry. The school board or school should be sued.
I had a teacher once so me down with fear in her eyes to tell me that it "might" be possible that my son was autistic after our first day of school. I was like yes that seems reasonable we are on waiting lists. The sigh of relief from that woman was audible. I felt so bad for her.
I did make it past the 20 year mark. I definitely attribute it to being in a strong union state. The union has fought for our working conditions and excellent wages and benefits. Most teachers can't claim that. I've also had very supportive principals, and that can make all the difference in the world. That said, yes, there is a lot to put up with. I work with low income children, and their parents are usually very respectful. However, I see the school lacking some of the resources that my own kids got in their middle class neighborhood school. I also see two alarming trends. School standards have been pushed down, so that what was once a 2nd grade standard is now taught in first grade. What's the rush? Second, students were way different 25 years ago--attention spans have shortened considerably. This profession is definitely a calling. Don't do it unless you love it.
It was so nice to hear from another teacher. Thank you for giving us a platform.
One thing I think she did not address which is also a major component to teachers leaving the profession is the district leadership and the building leadership. If you have a toxic administrator running your building it can make your life miserable.
We put a tracker on our little one today because the bus is always late and we have to meet it at the driveway.
I’m almost 30 years old and I often think about my time as a K-12 public school student. My teachers were the best people and actually cared about their students. I received a well-rounded education and met classmates from different backgrounds. Learning about the world and engaging with people is so important when we are young. It makes me sad to hear about the current state of education because we all deserve better especially the kiddos 😢. If the “powers that be” care about the future and strength of our nation, they would care to invest in education. It starts there.
TFD this is another great episode! 💕🙌🏽 Thank you to all the teachers who help shape our next generations. I don’t know how you guys do it. Grading assignments, managing multiple personalities inside and outside of the classroom. I think it’s criminal that teachers are not paid more.
As a parent of a child with ADHD and anxiety issues, calls from school were almost always about some melt down event. It was important for me to have a greater than normal contact with teachers and school administrators. I couldn't work full time because I had to be available for those calls. Believe me when I say, I wanted to have way less interaction with my child's teachers. The best teachers gave me their precious time to help recommend resources, create an action plan to head off potential triggers, ensure my child's safety and actually have him learn. Lesser teachers would shame my child, which is heart wrenching.
Teaching is hard. I praise wholeheartedly those who dedicate themselves to this work. They should be paid well. After all, they are doing one of the most important jobs on the planet. They should have our backs when they ask for the resources they need. They should have a life away from their job. They should have an adequate pension. Our children deserve teachers we truly value.
I recommend watching the debate between the president of HSLDA vs. an anti-homeschool professor on Mikala Petersons podcast.
My children are plenty socialized as homeschoolers. And it’s not unschooling and it’s not that expensive and it’s not as hard as she’s making it sound.
49:15 so true. Professions that are traditionally seen as “women’s” work are often undervalued. Secretaries were often men and well compensated until women entered the profession, so the work was then paid less. The reverse happened when men entered nursing and programming profession, the pay went up!
Recommend the book Brotopia if anyone wants to explore this topic more.
Parents of my students: No, they can't be special ed! I want them only in gen-ed classes; how dare you judge my child and find them lacking!
Me (a teacher and a parent) Hmm... my two year old is stimming a lot, has sensory issues, and is displaying a need for a routine and structure that seems beyond the norm. Better have him checked for autism so I can get him supports as soon as possible if needed.
We are not judging your babies; we just want to help them the best we can.
Thanks a lot for this deep insight about pros and cons of teaching in the US. What's astonishing is that many trends and patterns are the just the same across the ocean (by the way, I'm writing from Italy). For instance, parents who are getting more and more anxious about their children at school and who end by constantly controlling both their children and the teachers, often negatively interfering with the day by day activity of the school.
I think sometimes schools overcommunicate now, which I assume is in response to the parents. I will sometimes miss important announcements because I received messages from multiple teachers and the principal from Class Dojo and email.
Yes, some parents literally want DAILY updates on their kids’ progress. As if somehow their kid is going to plummet in 24 hours time. Most of the time, most parents don’t read those email updates that THEY THEMSELVES requested. They just want to create more work for the teacher and intimidate them into lot by threatening to get them fired by telling some lie to the admin. just to make themselves (the parents) feel falsely empowered. It’s all an act of bullying and nothing more. Plus the fact that parents often become so detached from- and often scared of their offspring internally that they use and abuse the teacher as the middleman when it comes to giving updates and being the bearer of bad news.
As a homeschooling parent I want to offer my prospective, with total respect for both women:
First I'm not anti school, I just don't choose it for my family. I actually support taxes going to public schools and each year decide if maybe this is the year we'll send them to school.
Second, school isn't safe in America anymore. Several times you mentioned it being a safe place-- statistically this is just truly less true than it used to be. So it's not unexpected that parents would not treat it like it is.
Third, school as it currently exists has only been a concept for a couple hundred years max. Really as it is structured was born in the industrial revolution. For the vast, vast, vast swath of human history the vast, vast, vast majority of kids stayed with their parents until they got married, or maybe until an apprenticeship. They were educated at home, albeit maybe not in a literate way. They'd learn from their parents (often boys with dad and girls with mom) the skills needed to use as an adult and they'd go into the same profession as their parents. Now I'm not saying that's the best way either but as far as Chelsea thinking sending kids off to school and being away from them is "normal" in human history it's really not. Aside from nobles who sent their kids to be foster kids with other nobles or to boarding schools most of humanity's history parents and kids stick together until at least adolescence. We're NOT evolved to be away from our kids this much. It's new. Good or bad, just like we aren't evolved to deal with smart phones so that doesn't make it bad, maybe being separated isn't bad, but maybe it's also unnatural.
I totally agree with the difficulty of not having the teacher to be bad cop with homeschooling. I am currently wrestling with that with my kids, they don't always behave as well for mom because they know even if they're naughty she'll still love them, where as teacher's affection seems conditional. So that's a point.
Lastly, I think a lot of this shift in attitude has to do with a shift in demographics. She said that parents sending a third kid to kindergarten were much more chill-- but most parents I know don't have a third kid. More and more 1 or 2 kid households are the norm, so the percentage of classrooms occupied by first time sending their kids to that grade parents is rising, simply because of how much smaller families are. I mean even if someone has 4 kids we now see that as a big family-- when my mom was a kid she was the eldest of 5 and saw her family as medium sized.
And I also think individualization has become huge for the culture in sooo many avenues of life -- we know kids learn, develop, and prioritize at different rates and in different ways more now than before. Yet at the same time budgets have been cut to schools so we have more kids per classrooms and less teachers aides so the teacher child ratio is worse and they're simply less capable of individualizing education despite any desire they have to do so. I think that's a huge reason for the rise in homeschool.
I hugely feel for teachers and personally don't see myself as against them, but instead as a type of teacher myself, albeit a different kind. So I feel kinship with them and wish the system worked to help them and empower their good desires to love their students more.
love this comment and agree with so much!
Will add a few things as someone teaching young minds for 12 years.
-In my experience what has bothered me about the daily pictures and live posts for parents has been the time it takes and the fact that the parents won’t get the full context of what’s happening which can lead you to getting staged pictures. Parents wanting to monitor kids while at school day care is a natural sign as for most of human history you would know who is caring for their child.
- Evidence is coming out that STRUCTURED homeschool kids do better including socially. They often interact with the wider community and with different ages way more than kids in conventional school spending too much time with the same age same group for many years in a role. I dont know many people that left conventional school setting saying they were socially ready for the world. Let’s stop putting all homeschoolers in the same freak/loner/crazy religious package when evidence starting to say otherwise. + post pandemic after parents realised how little active learning kids were doing on average per day (1h 45min) its undertandable why they would be unhappy with the system.
- Why do we push so hard for kids to be independent when that’s in their DNA and like a seed if watered and given sun and nutrients it will happen naturally. No need to force separation (WHICH ITS NOT ONE OF THE PURPOSES OF SCHOOL) kids are kids for such a little while, let them be kids and NEED us and be attached to us (which according to the biggest attachment theorists including Piaget its essential for healthy emotional development and NATURAL development of independence, opposite to this forceful separation and indepence we are pushing. +++ Longest study ever conducted about day care (by Canadian gov) shows that kids sent to day care too often/at early ages do worse in general specially emotionally. LET KIDS BE ATTACHED TO A PRIMARY INDIVIDUAL CARER AND LETS STOP PRETENDING THAT A STRESSFUL PLACE FULL OK STRANGERS ON ROTATION WILL BE JUST AS GOOD FOR A CHILD !
- As someone with lots of experience in the field I also understand parents anxiety and part of it I believe comes from a natural fear of living your child w strangers which hasn’t happened for most of human history (and this forceful push for independence is also very new) Would you knowingly leave your child with a nanny that’s walks in letting you know they were binge drinking wine until one hour before they showed up? (TRUE STORY AND COMMON) NO!!!! But you will with professional when you drop your child off bc you just won’t know it. Again, this hasn’t happeend for most of human history, parents have the right to be careful w strangers
- I am no right winger but I am also not a hypocrite, if we dont want views from side Y in school then we can’t comply we can’t bring our side X view to school.
I went to public school and my classmates were so immature that socializing with many of them would only have brought me down in terms of my preparedness for life. I made friends outside of school, many from church, and several were homeschooled. They were more mature, more articulate, more intellectually stimulating to talk to than most kids from my public school. And they were doing stuff all over town. They had all kinds of interesting experiences.
I am now a parent, and a teacher (ready to quit). I have always wanted to homeschool my kids, but I don't know if they respect me enough to follow my lead as their teacher. I can imagine getting in some sort of a power struggle over multiplication facts and having no other adult to defer to, no principal, no parent to call home to 😂, no way to mentally reset for the rest of the day leading into the evening, etc. I would hate to have my husband come home to a house of unrest and anger because I couldnt get the kids to do their schoolwork or something like that. That's a hesitation I have, personally. Along with finances.
Very similar experience here but in private school. I do have similar worries but im hoping to still go that way, I think when the child is homeschooled you STAY as their primary attachment instead of school friends which gives you more influence over them, also reminding how good the child has compared it to school in the sense of having someone that will follow their interests and give them flexibility school would not etc @@rachthelionheart
@@rachthelionheart I think you could do it 🙂 Children need to be taught to be respectful of their parents and adults.
It is the lack of connection that is holding you back. When your children are away at school and daycare they are not developing that deep connection with you. Taking time to foster deep connection would be needed first but once that was formed, the struggles would ease. Exploring the world with them and seeing your kids discover and learn.... it is fantastic 🎉
I've been saying similar things about family size being one of our major problems, not just with education but with the culture itself. I was born in 1954. In my generation we had lots of kids as playmates. We played together in an unstructured environment. That means we had to learn how to get along if we wanted to be part of the group, and we had to do so without parental supervision. Kids naturally socialize each other. Play is how we learn the consequences of good and bad behavior. We now have a society formed of too many only children who don't have a chance to learn how to get along. Many have been raise with the idea that they are forever going to be the center of attention. Behavioral habits learned at an early age are hard to break.
It’s the same in the UK. The sector is in crisis. 😢
It's so interesting how the issues with increased access to communication and erosion of boundaries echoes the shift to increased access to medical data and to after-hours emails etc with medical staff. It absolutely increases anxiety and is bad for the patients and the medical staff. I cringe every time I hear a betterhelp ad about how great it is they have instant and constant access to their therapist for when a crisis happens. It sounds like such a good thing but it represents a real detrimental shift.
Yes! I have always questioned that about Better Help! As a teacher, I don't respond to emails after a certain time period and I expect that from my therapist. I want him to care for himself.
As a patient, I was once life threateningly sick and so my oncologist post poned her family Christmas vacation to give me surgery. I still think about that, she gave up some of her family time to save my life. I don't know what the fix is for a situation like that but I will be thankful for her and her family the rest of my life ❤
Fyi: They found ovarian cancer and I'm great now! 6 years with no regrowth!
@@lizgreer6888In the medical system, the most logical solution for me is to work in groups, so that if one professional is unavailable, there is always someone to see the patients. Although it’s completely understandable that some areas don’t have so many doctors and people create personal relationships with their providers… but yeah, I’m a mental health care professional, and I also shudder when I see therapists talking about being constantly available outside of sessions. It’s so easy to romanticize that idea, but you need good boundaries to remain in a caretaking job, or else you can burn out very quickly. Some availability is important, but it needs to be limited
Remember that good benefits does not necessarily mean free benefits. We have several different health benefit choices in the districts in my locality, but the medium cost one still costs teachers, $1000 per month approximately deducted from their paycheck. And yes, that is for a single person, not for their children or spouse. Whether you think teachers are paid too much or too little, it’s still important to note that the amount paid and benefits very significantly between districts even within the same state.
Yikes. I am a former teacher and I agree with a lot of what she says about why a teacher would want to leave the industry, but now that I am gonna be homeschooling its clear to me she hasn't done a lot of her research - like many homeschooling parents have. Both traditional school and homeschool have their pros and cons, but for me and my family, homeschooling pros far outweigh the cons.
I know. They lost credibility to me when they started dissing homeschooling. Students who were homeschooled have much higher test scores. And so many kids in the public school systems can’t read!
This is why after 1 year of studying for a Certificate of Education, I quit. I love teaching kids, but I don't ever want to talk to parents. LOL. And when I learned about progressive education, I knew this was something I would advocate for, which I know MOST (if not all) parents would be appalled and HATE to know about.
Now that I'm a parent, I'm much more forgiving to teachers than when I was single and a student. I get the hard work behind what they do. However, I do hate teachers who are passive-aggressive to their students because of this stress. That's who my kid's first grade teacher was; she was so critical that my kid develop anxiety about "breaking" the rules (i.e. coloring outside the lines, knowing how to correctly write letter A). I'm pretty laid back, even taught my kid about fonts and that there is no correct way to write letters and it wouldn't matter as long as anyone can read what they wrote (hello, doctors?!) So it was just stressful to balance being compassionate to the teacher (30 to 1 ratio per class) and also wanting to protect my kid from "stressed" teachers. I'm just glad my kid has a much more laid back 2nd grade teacher now.
what do you mean by progressive education? If most to all parents would hate something than they have tje right not to have their child exposed to it!
@@rba4377 Most parents don't want to hear from their teacher that it's okay that their kid is not excelling in a particular subject (like reading, math...) because they might be excelling in a different subject (like art, dance, music...) Traditional schools rely so much on academics (i.e. reading, math, social studies...). Progressive schools, some of them, rely on the strengths and talents of kids. They change their curriculum based on the kid. So if a kid is a artistic, they make math/science more appealing by incorporating activities that lets them practice their art skills. Something like that.
Most parents are very competitive, and wants to make kids "busy". And that's what most teachers do just because DOE tells them to, give them more homework. I appreciate teachers who just let kids be kids. That's untraditional, that's progressive.
I recommend Googling progressive education, you'll see a lot of examples, from the extremes ones to the hybrid ones (traditional+progressive). But it's very interesting. Also very expensive, and only offered at private schools. So I get why it's not something most people know about. It's mostly for the people with power and money to get their kids in those schools.
Im all for following kids interests but they DO need a foundation in the basic subjects despite their interests. Not only kids need guidance because they dont always know whats better for them, I used to not like many subjects but im so glad i still learned them because, now I love them and have a good foundation on them, and if I had chosen to pursue a career involving one of those subjects I would have been able to because I would have had a foundation on it instead of not having it because I was let choose everything at an early age.
Also letting kids guide too much of their learning can lead to a biased learning experience that the child is less and less exposed to other things which makes them like more and more what they already know which can be limiting.
There are many schools that teach the foundation of the main subjects and dont over do it for kids, that was my experience in a traditional school as a child. I learned all mandatory subjects but had lots of play time and learning was very hands on, I loved it and as an adult im so grateful for it.
I just never heard being called progressive if you are referring to waldorf montessori etc. I taught for years so I know those models, I havent found any model that I 100% agree like most parents prob wont. I see their good sides but I worked with post montessori kids and interviewed at montessori and turned the position down. In my experience its not healthy to not use the word NO with a child like montessori does, doesnt mean the child should hear that all the time but the montessori kids I worked with could often NOT COPE AT ALL w the other NO and not having things go their way. It was a meltdown EVERYDAY! Also being an educator is already so stressful, and YES educators should be held to high standards and follow the educational institution philosophy but during the interview, I was told the number of things i wouldnt be able to say, the word NO was just the beginning and 1 I dont think thats healthy for the kids, 2 its just more stress on teachers which is not good for kids. Ive met grown montessori kids some did well and quite a few told me the emphasis on the individual was so intense that up to this day they struggle to work in collaboration with others, be open to different opinions and they regret not having been exposed to high levels of certain subjects.
I do like some aspects of it but I've worked with kids for long enough and read about childhood development, psychology and philosophies so much that have realised that you need a good balance of everything to develop a well rounded child intellectually, psychologically, emotionally etc. @@nerdmommy7114
@@rba4377Other means of progressive education in addition to the examples listed by other people involves schools and teachers going the extra mile to be all-inclusive, culturally diverse, support students who identify as other genders besides male and female, teach critical race theory, etc.
And if you switch between districts, they only let 10 years of experience follow you for the pay ladder. Getting my masters, where I can teach dual credit courses with the university in town, means I get 1000 dollar pay bump. but I can only have that pay bump or move up the experience side of the pay ladder (500 per year), not both.
10:10 To be fair, while Target might pay well on the surface, it gets undercut if you can only work part time or they barely give you hours which lowers the amount you would have actually made. (From someone who has tried to get a job at Target)
I completely agree with you. You have a master's degree. It's a no brainer that your education and your skill set should promise a salary that far surpasses an income a teenager could make. And I'm not being sarcastic here. I work in fast food.
I'd be curious to hear from caregivers or former teachers who home school and the students who are products of home school. I think like the public school system, there are home school situations that are fringe (abuse and illiteracy) and the other end of the spectrum that produces smart and well adjusted and socially thriving kids.
I've mostly witnessed children on the positive end of that spectrum. Kids who are homeschooled are part of teams and other co-op groups to help them socialize and learn to be in teams. I think in both public school and home schooling, it's about being intentional.
I just wanted to jump in add a different perspective because the discussion on homeschooling seemed to be negative-leaning.
Regarding what to look for in a school that would be a good place to work at, completely agree with the commute and the school spirit. Also, if you can get any impression of how the teachers feel about the administrators. The two schools I have worked at were night and day in terms of how involved the administrators one. At one school we lived in fear of the admin and at the other the admin were again just so present and there for us. She is right - you will need help and when you need help you want the admin who will support you.
I did teach for awhile and found it very difficult to deal with things like not holding children accountable for their school work, grade creep and parents forcing children to enroll in classes the child is not prepared to take despite teacher and administrator warnings. I can’t imagine continuing to handle all that plus not being able to use certain words like “gay” or having to teach “intelligent design” as a science (rather than a philosophy). Thanks to this small but loud and vicious minority, school is no longer safe but a political cesspool. Having said all that, I suspect (or at least hope) that this hard right politicizing of schools is similar to the prohibition era of the 1930s….a blip in the road and something we will laugh at decades down the road. This to shall pass…
such a great chat about this topic, very helpful! thank you
I quit because I am not going to teach minors about things that only parents should be discussing with their minors. I also quit because alot of kids are freaking scary, violent and disrespectful and their parents do not step in and do THEIR JOB, also classrooms have too many children in them for me to do MY JOB.
I’m a first year teacher and I don’t know if I want to continue after this year. I love kids, I worked full time as an instructional assistant during the day while going to school full time at night to get my education degree. Now that I’m here, it’s so different. It’s 2 jobs. The job you do when you’re teaching the kids all day, and then the administrative job you have when kids leave. I’m doing this, LETRS training, taking 2 graduate courses and trying to lesson plan and prep for the lessons I planned and all the data collection on top of it. It’s too much. Not enough hours in the day to get everything done.
Even in Australia, where there are pretty strong Teachers Unions, and Primary school teachers are paid well, nothing can really compensate for the fact that there is so much unpaid labour occurring outside of the workplace. I know primary school teachers who leave because even after putting in a 6 hour day, they then have to do report writing, and class preparation, in their own time at home which isn't usually paid for. Never underestimate the ability to leave work at work. Being able to mentally clock off when you leave work is super important.
Not making upto atleast 500k before retirement is an unfulfilled retirement. I’m 32 and my wife is 29. We are both planning and working towards retiring with over $3million in net worth and no debts. Currently living smart and frugal with our money. No longer putting blames on the FED for our misfortunes. Saving and investing lifestyle in the stock market made it possible for us this early. Even till now, we earn weekly.
I must also give credit to Larysa Caba. She made all this possible through the great decisions she made with my portfolio.
I feel one Of the greatest challenges that we first timers face in the ma rket is that we end up losing all we have,making it difficult to find ourselves back to our feet. My biggest advice is to always seek the services of a professional just like I did when I ventured into it for the first time. Big thanks to Larysa Caba. I now make huge profits by weekly through her services while still learning to stand on my own.
I think she trades for everyone I meet. I met her twice at a meeting in Germany and after her lectures from Ella I had to personally ask her to be my financial advisor. she is definitely good.
I trade with her every week and make huge profits from her. her consistency is crazy.
I have never seen a trader as open and transparent as Larysa Caba with her clients. The way she decides to make a profit for her clients. she allows you to express your fears and she still rests your fears and that is my respect. I don't normally comment on videos, but this word should be included. she is really cool.
She is so absolutely telling the truth. The pay does not match the stress and it becomes insulting to see how others are able to advance in their careers and increase their income without a degree.
Private tutoring when done correctly brings in more money than a regular teacher salary.
Maybe if you're tutoring five hours a day for the super wealthy. Teachers make up to 138k at my school.
@@BarryBrandon-mz7gb that's great! What state?
As a parent I agree that as much as I love seeing pictures of my child at school I also then get thoughts of “why are so and so in every picture and why is my child in so few pictures- do they like her less?” Thoughts that I know are ridiculous and a waste of time but I can’t help. Sometimes it’s easier to let go without getting so many updates
As a former teacher, I never believed in the whole reward system or even the Honor Roll for that matter. Students can be acknowledged for their good, hard, decent work without receiving a token of appreciation from their teachers in the form of points, a piece of paper, or a material object. All it does is lead to competition and bad blood between students (So…what grade did you get on such-and-such assignment? …. Really? Well I got an A+!) and also between parents (“So…my kid is able to read chapter books and they are only five years old! Can your kid do that?”).
I don’t think it’s a matter of not enough money. It’s a matter of family values going down the drain and the finances that are there going to a bunch of administrators instead of to the actual teachers. The reason why I don’t believe it’s just not enough funds is that other countries who spend less per student are getting better educations.
I made it 2 school years after my master's in teaching before retraining at community college. It's completely unsustainable.
As a former NC public school teacher who also taught from 2012 - 2017, this is VERY close to my experience. North Carolina is an awful place to teach.
I’m a teacher, 💯in agreement! Thanks you!
Not to try to prove by anecdote, but regarding your section on unschooling - it worked for my brother and me. All the typical stats, PhD in anthropology for me, MA in math for him, good and fulfilling jobs, etc. I’m known among my friend group for being the one who knows all the cool places to go and the one with the massive social network. It helps that we have a family that’s very focused on reading and that our mother was an excellent math tutor, to cover the basics. Part of the reason my parents proposed homeschooling to us was having had negative experiences with bullying (and because we lived in a rural area that liked to ban books). That period wasn’t exactly my social peak but I felt like it set me up for success later in life - and now, living in a walkable city has probably been the single greatest factor contributing to having a great social life. In other words, my circle probably would’ve been pretty small in Upstate NY, whether homeschooling or going to public school.
Last year, the state of NC, decided that we needed even more work to do-on our own time. It's called LETRS training. (Which you work on at home 2-3 nights a week plus weekends.) No, we were not paid for this, yes, it was a yearlong training, and surprise! This year is Part 2 of the training. I retired last summer after 36 years. I miss my students, but I do not miss the unrealistic expectations and never-ending paperwork. I feel SO sorry for anyone getting into the profession. I don't think it will get better anytime soon.
I teach in Georgia and just finished my second LETRS training. We received stipends for finishing.
Consider yourself lucky. We did not receive any money for our off the clock efforts.
I’m a high school English teacher. I stayed up until 2:00 am planning lessons because I have no time to grade. I have amazing admin, hardly any “problem” parents, and a handful of difficult students (blatantly RACIST students), but overall, I teach at a great school. EVEN SO, it’s a difficult job that I won’t continue next year. You can’t be a creative teacher and have a life. Sorry, it’s just not possible.
I'm a soon-to-be former teacher. This year was the first time I've actually felt politics in the classroom...on top of the apathy, entitlement, and lack of backbone from "leadership". Now I'm looking to leave, despite a few of my trusted students begging me to stay for their senior year. Nah...I'm good.
I'm a teacher and RUclipsr from the UK. I really enjoyed listening to this and related to a lot of the points raised!
For me as a teacher right now isn't the pay even though it is very important to be paid well. However, the number one reason to quit is the verbal abuse and sometimes physical abuse teachers have to endure. The level of disrespect is terrible. The emotional turmoil that you have to keep inside, on top of the problems and afflictions we have in our own home. The abuse we have to tolerate and endure from students, particularly in middle school and high school is bad.
No, you are absolutely right! The constant need for access creates a tense sense of mistrust. Many children have become impossible to redirect because of this parental mistrust. Children usually mirror their parents’ dominant perspectives.
"Teachers are underpaid because it's traditionally a woman's job, and women are undervalued in our culture." WOW 🤯👏I have never heard anyone say that and it's makes so much sense. Thank you, Natalie!! As a college professor contingent faculty, I understand a lot of these issues.
I’m 50+ and have 8 more yrs of teaching high school to go! Teaching requires 1,000’s of decisions per class! But I’ve recently discovered how to use the Chatbox AI and admit that it’s a game changer! I’ll get better at it; saving me hundreds of hours and giving me a better work life balance. Teaching is in my DNA 🧬. I’m sure teaching will change again in the next few years.
I'm using chat GPT to help with my special ed master's degree, as a conversation starter and advisor. In what ways do you use it to help reduce your workload?
@@Miss_Elaine_ I use it to create grammar activities for ELLs. I enter a vocab list and ask for a text between 400-500 words for emerging high school students with 10 multiple choice reading comp questions asking about internal vs external conflict, author’s tone, central idea etc… Then, I ask it to create a poem with 4-line rhyming stanzas using the same vocab list based on the same short story followed with fill in the blank items and an answer key. So, as long as I set the parameters, the practice materials can be endless! Hope this helps.
Great talk! Though I have to disagree about homeschooling! In the UK a child doesn't receive extra care/attention/help unless they are disruptive. My daughter is a quiet, well mannered child that struggles to focus. As a result they sat her at the back of the classroom for 2 years. They then complained to me that she was falling behind and suggested I take her to see a doctor. I trusted the school but they were not interested in pursuing a special needs assessment because it costs them money. Socialisation and it being hard to plan lessons are not Cons, they are a part of home education, especially for those of us who have no choice. Having 30 kids in a class and expecting a single teacher to make sure my daughter has a good education is not feasible. I worked diligently with the teacher to ensure my daughter was not behind but she was not disruptive enough to warrant the teachers attention or concern. She was too. Busy firefighting other kids behavior. I haven't listened to all of this talk but I hope you mention that a homeschool setting does benefit some kids, like my daughter who would get left behind through no fault of her own.
I used to have a boss with a daughter in highschool and she would be on her kid's case all day about what she was doing. She had a schedule for her kid's day and had cameras in the house to watch her. She would call several times a day to nag the poor kid about EVERYTHING. No surprise, the older daughter had moved out and wasn't talking to her mom anymore because she was so controlling. It was not enjoyable to work with her, either. She would gaslight me, tell me to do something ASAP and then an hour later ask me why I was sound it at all. I can't imagine what she would be like with her kid's teachers. What a nightmare!
Alot of School District funds go to pay "consultants" instead of raising teacher salaries.
ALSO can we just talk about how the downfall of public education is good for the wealthy? Their kids go to private school, so public school kids having a poor education just means less competition for their kids who got the best education regardless of how hard they actually worked.