The front basket becomes difficult to use when it moves with the handlebars, because it affects the balance of a bike. This is why high end Dutch bikes attach the front basket to the frame. When it's attached to the frame, you don't have the control problems you found, and the front basket can hold a lot of weight before you notice it. The bike I use for filming and livestreaming is an Azor bike with a large front basket attached to the frame. It's perfect for accessing my camera gear without affecting the stability of the bike.
Hi Shifter. If you can find an ex-Post-Office bike made by Pashley in the UK you will have a really sturdy frame-mounted front rack which can carry about 20kg or 44lb. My Elephant-Bike is a refurbished version which I ride most days; they are real work-horses, and just about indestructible. The Pashley Pronto is the civilian non Post-Office version.
@@Teapot-Dave @shifter this is exactly what I was going to add to the conversation, I love my posties bike, the front bucket is always full of junk (just like my car 😅) due to its carrying capacity... It's a heafty beast and I'm glad to live in a relatively flat city.
Every bike sold by Rad Power Bikes has a pretty decent front carrier/basket mount on the head tube, too. Same for almost every long-tail cargo bike on the market (e. g. Tern or Yuba).
The real beauty of the rear basket for commuters is that you don't have to worry about a sweaty back, and you have a proper backpack once you get to your destination. Of course, there's the basket issue. If you don't want it to be stolen, you're probably better off with a non-removable one. I love these videos because they help people overcome barriers in using the bike as a means of transportation in everyday life.
I had been using pannier style bags for groceries and for bikepacking trips. But when I went back to university post retirement, I needed to be able to grab and go with all my books and my laptop, etc. So my solution was a backpack inside a back basket. That way I didn’t have to transfer my stuff back and forth, which can get really annoying. Just put on the backpack and go to class. I can also see this working well for trips to the gym, or various other situations.
@shifter you could try a parking test with baskets (front or back) and panniers. I got a pannier recently and I definitely did not consider this aspect c:
I see a lot of people with front baskets parking backwards in some racks, seems to work fine, and still leaves space for other bikes in the adjacent slots.
Personally, I use both. I use the front basket for things like my wallet, keys, phone and bike chain. I use the back basket for actual cargo, like groceries, plus my purse. I’m aware that there’s a trade-off here, that being the extra weight of two baskets, but for me the pros outweigh the cons 🙃
I use a plastic storage bin with a lid in the rear. I attach the lid by drilling 2 holes in the front facing lip of the lid and corresponding lip of the bin (just drill the holes with the lid snapped on) and using 2 zip ties through the holes to use as hinges. Don't tighten zip ties completely but leave enough of a loop for a little play. While plastic bins are flimsy at the bottom, to reinforce it I attach a piece of plywood to the rack as a base and then you can easily attach the bin to the wood with screws or bolts (use washers so you don't crack the plastic). Voila, you have a closable "trunk" or "boot" to keep items dry and you can even fill the basket over the top with the lid partially open but still firmly attached by the ties. You can use as big a bin as you want as they are available in many sizes. A little ugly like most home made baskets but extremely practical. I had only one failure in years but that was due to faulty welds in the original metal rack.
You've missed a huge plus of a front basket: Freeing up your rear rack for something else, like a child seat. I use both styles on a regular basis, however, my front rack bolts directly to the frame of the bike, not the handlebars so it doesn't exhibit any of the issues you were having with your front basket, like trying to twist the handlebars whenever you turn. Still, I agree with your ultimate conclusion, the rear mounted rack is 'better'. With the right equipment though, it's closer than your tests have shown.
Love your videos! Another option is a folding rear basket (Wald makes one) that attaches with clamps/bolts to the side of the rear rack, so it rides more like a pannier. Doesn't hold as much as the basket you tested, but it's much easier to swing your leg over. Fits a shopping bag, backpack, 12-pack of beer, or whatever. Always there when you need it, folds up when you don't.
I have two of those on my “grocery bike”. Two of them add more weight than a single rack mounted basket, but I’m not going for speed records when I’m going for groceries. The folding rear baskets also make it easier to get on and off the bike (compared to a high back basket or milk crate).
I have two folding baskets, and I love them. I thought they wouldn't be good at first because they're kinda flimsy, but they've held up exceptionally for five years. I also have a front folding basket that hangs off my handlebar; it does its job well. All three together help me with my groceries.
Back basket with a waterproof backpack and a cargo net is my go to combo. I don't get sweaty from wearing my bag but still have the convenience of having it when I get wherever I'm going. Beats panniers any day in my opinion (at least for commuting)
I too like tossing my backpack or DSLR back in the basket. Would rather have a backpack pannier like that Arkel GT18 but $190 is a little steep for just one for me.
@@kishascape I've been thinking of one of those, but as you say, the price is steep. And also, I already have a 25L waterproof backpack that fits perfectly in my basket. I've read the pannier backpacks are also just not very comfortable for wearing, although for daily use its not frequent it needs to be on the back for extended periods so meh
I use a rear basket. Noticeably easier when cycling into a headwind, more stable when looking behind you, large enough to take a large shopping bag of groceries, and also means your bike is more stable when leaning against a lamp post.
I have used both front and rear baskets (still do), and generally find that heavier stuff travels better on the rear, rack whilst lighter things that you need to observe go better on the front. Having said that, last month (August 2021) I transported a Fiat Panda back-axle 5-miles to my local garage on the front of my Elephant Bike (exPost-Office) for them to repair our 12-year-old family car. "The Elephant" is amazing, although it is not the lightest or fastest bike on the planet, but it felt really light and twitchy on the way back home, and spontaneously steered me to my local coffee-shop as I tried to ride past.
Go Canada! I've always been using a basket on the bike rack and have done all my shopping w/ it. I love it and wouldn't wanna do it any other way. the convenience cannot be beat. Panniers can be great for bikepacking, but for urban use I much prefer my basket :-) EDIT: I want to add that I regularly transport 20+ kg in my back basket, and some really tall objects (1.5m tall plants) with not much issue - so can defo reccomend! Happy cycling you lovely lot out there!
You can't really ignore bike geometry. Some bikes just handle a front load (or split front/rear) load better than a rear load. Your bike probably has a higher trail that can handle a bunch of weight on the back. So it differs by bike. Also I prefer getting the load lower on the front (basket mounted to a rack over front wheel). That makes a huge difference. Thanks for the video!
One in the front and two in the back, plus always bring some straps. That lets you use the two rear baskets as a platform if you're hauling bulkier items.
This was such a helpful experiment. I love the idea of a front basket. But will definatly stick to back pannier bags or basket. Thanks for this analytical review. Happy smiles from Scotland.
Hello Shifter, excellent job to show that the rear basket is better than the front one, I also have both and I use both, but without a doubt the back is more practical I always have it fixed, apart you can also cover it with an elastic net that is bought in sports stores and prevents things from falling out of the basket, thank you for helping us to improve in the handling of the bicycle and I also congratulate you for the location of the area you choose to do the tests which are precious and very pretty, greetings and until the next report 😊👍☘️
My "slow" bike is a step through cruiser with a wicker basket on the front and a wire basket on the back. It's super convenient and easy to haul whatever. Mostly it's my tote bag with my lunch, etc that I bring to work. Nice to take off mitts or gloves if I get hot and just throw them in the front basket. My "fast" bike is not a step through, with narrow handlebars and I have one or two waterproof roll down panniers on the back rack. It's good for rainy days, and keeps things more secure, but it's a pain to shove my tote bag into the pannier, and I don't like carrying the pannier bag around because it's kind of dirty and ugly. I can fit more in the baskets, without spending time packing it perfectly, so I prefer them.
Me too. A slow step through with valuable basket on the front and a removable back basket for when it is needed. And a fast bike with no racks but a small handlebar bag. Which does affect its balance but I can see it at all times.
I reaaally love how thorough this testing is. I butchered my front basket when I fell over it yesterday, haha. And now I'm watching which basket to buy for my grocery and regular neighborhood trips. 😅
Great video! We have both. Front basket on wife's bike for purse, keys, wallet, phones etc. Rear basket (milk crate on rack) on my bike for less important and bulk things like our cooler with cold water, lunch and snacks, spare socks/clothes, blanket, tool kit, groceries, etc. Works out fine great combination 😁
front baskets are nice for you to carry things that you are going to use at the moment, such as an empty can that you can take to the next trash can, or a jacket that you took along for the ride but felt the heat and don't want to stop the bike for putting in the back basket, front baskets are nice too for a laid back ride, you can carry some food in the basket and eat during the ride, without worry with stop and get out of the bike to take something. haha, nice video
Front basket is also deeper which is a benefit over the back one. And you have peace of mind because you can see what you are carrying. I think your front one was pretty small. A good idea is to get both. use the front for most things and if you have a heavy load of shopping use the back one. Thats one i'm planning in future. From my experience of only using a front basket it was great for throwing my bag in, or phone or whatever. Super convenient. Buying shopping was sometimes an issue as it got full.
I love my plastic crate mounted to the rear rack. It's so convenient being able to load a full bag of groceries straight in & ride away. The bike feels very stable loaded in this way. I attach it using 2 simple brackets made from strips of plywood, 2 dome head coach bolts & wing nuts purchased from a local hardware shop. Total cost about £12, but obviously much less if a free crate is up for grabs. I can remove it in seconds if I need to use my panniers.🙂
If you stand beside your bike, hold the sadle and give at a big push it'll continue for a while. This is mostly the caster effect (bit of gyroscopic help from the wheel as well). This is also why cycling without holding the handlebars is prossible and even easy. This natural stability can actually be calculated and influenced. I got to use a simple bit of software that tried to do just that a couple of years back. I only had a few hour ro play around with it, but it predicted that any weight infront would negatively impact the stability, most weight on the back wouldn't really do anything and weight near your pedals would improve the stability. We tried it out and the distance the bike would ride on it's own confirmed the predictions. So that's what you're feeling with the handlebar basket, you actually made the stability (way) worse and now have to do a lot more work keeping the bike up.
Problem with the bounce test. The capacity of the baskets does not appear equal but you stocked them with an equal number of balls. The front basket had balls up to the top while the rear had unused space between the balls and the top. Seems likely that a basket loaded to capacity would be more likely to lose items than a basket not loaded to capacity. Just found the channel as I'm looking to increase my hauling capacity on an old rental bike bought as a commuter and since I now work from home being modified to be a better utility bike. It has a front basket and I strapped a large milk crate (hold 6 gallon jugs of milk instead of the usual 4) as a rear basket. Thanks for making such interesting and useful videos. This is a great help for folks just wanting a bit of storage and making this choice. Hoping you have a video already on various panniers and other storage options to help me work out a good setup. You do an excellent job with the production, from filming (without wrecking that we can see), ensuring the video and sound are both clear, to breaking up the videos in to segments. Lots of big and little things you do to make them so good after you've come up with a grand idea and planned out your story or testing. It is much appreciated.
You forgot to include a front basket attached to the frame instead of the handlebars. It makes a huge difference in terms of stability as it doesn't impact steering.
Could you link a system that is frame-mounted? What I can find in abundance is the stuff that mounts to the fork, but those are just as bad as the handlebar-mounted version.
@@Volkbrecht Your frame needs a mounting plate with threaded holes brazed onto the front of the head tube. For example, look at the bikes that accept those baskets from Downtube Bikes.
Front basket mounted directly to the bike frame, not the fork/handlebars, so that it doesn't affect your steering. Two folding rear baskets hanging off the rear rack.
Assuming you can find a front basket that fits on to your bike and is sturdy enough to take a bit of weight. Easy if your frame has a welded on carrier, not so easy otherwise.
Hey, this is pretty cool! It's interesting to watch content from the lockdown period and see how different things were back then. By the way, a step-through bike makes that back basket a lot easier to get on and off the bike.
@@Luigi64 exactly, especially if you are leaving the house with all your stuff in the backpack already. I use some elastic hooks to ensure its staying there (my basket is low profile in height hahah)
In the Netherlands front racks are pretty common and they are really versatile, especially combined with a strap. You have to compensate for the weight when stearing but that's doable. I can imagine that they don't work on bikes that are common in most countries outside of the Netherlands though. The Dutch omafietsen normally don't have hand brakes (so no wires) and the handlebar is curved, which makes it easier to loop backpack straps around it without them getting in the way.
when I was a kid in southern CA, a newspaper route was a common thing. In 4th grade, I would occasionally help a friend with his paper route and we use cloth bags that wrap around the handle bars. It was challenging when it was full. The Sunday paper was usually 3x heavier and you'd easily have 25lbs.
A Wald or Sunlite folding side rear basket is another option. I have the Wald folding rear basket. I love it. It adds 2.8 pounds (Sunlite is the same) but pannier bags aren't exactly light either. I favor the basket over a pannier because you can't steal a Wald basket and therefore don't have to carry a heavy and bulky pannier when you go indoors. Its also more economical. The downside is that unless you want to undo the clamps and screws, it's pretty much permanently affixed to your rack. So you can't just easily take it on and off. But I still prefer it over a pannier. Just drop your stuff in there and go!
I had the same milk crate fixed with zip ties on the rear of my bikes for many years. It must have carried tons of beer and groceries, but no oatmeal. I recently got an upright dutch bike with a rack on the front. I tried a box on the front but found it difficult to steer with weight in it. I now use bungy cords for light things on the front and quick realise panniers with shoulder straps on the rear which are easy to fill in the shop. Another advantage of the daggy milk crate was I never had a bike stolen.
I have been using the milk crate for years. Work's great. Always there when you need it and no need to remove it since no one will steal this low value crate.
The grannies of the 1950's knew which was best. Front handlebar baskets were extremely common. They were simple and inexpensive, and allowed you to easily see the cargo. With constant short trip shopping usage baskets allowed holding the goods without painstakingly tying the cargo for every trip, so that goods could bounce out on occasion, and with a back basket you'd never notice. If rarely heavy goods were transported than the rear rack could be used.
1:10 Yeah, that's the problem: you start your ride, forget the basket is on there, and when you finish you try to swing your leg over the back, hit the basket and almost fall on the ground. Apart from that, back baskets are great.
Omg this happened to me the other day! It was so embarrassing. I had forgotten that I had added the back basket. I fell over and scrapped my knee and foot up.
Thanks for the test. I think it is a no brainer to carry the one in the back but I certainly hate how inconvenient it is to climb on the seat. Panniers are undoubtedly better for long trips
I think the real value in a front basket is that it it complememts a rear basket (added cargo capacity). Like you said, good for smaller, lighter items, especially those of value. My PO Box is really close to my job site, so I use it to haul my mail, up to small packages, on my way home from work. The rear basket is for my laptop and other work items.
If you buy a dutch-style bike (many companies there do this), you can buy a bike with frame-mounted front basket. This is far more stable and has much more carrying capacity than the fork/handlebar mounted variety. It is also ridiculously convenient. I never have to worry about not being able to carry something if I see a shop I'm interested on my rides. Also, if you are riding a more upright position (as you would commuting), that extra weight is placed on the front wheel, rather than the back wheel, which helps balance out the load and the tire wear.
most of those frames build on the front of the bicycle usually have the basket angled towards cyclist instead of angled towards the front what we could see in the vid.
I've been using a collapsible rear plastic basket with an elastic net for a long time and have yet to drop any of the stuff I've been carrying. I use a frameless pannier shelf just fixed to my seat post so I think the weight capacity is probably limited to about 20kg only. For additional volume, I use 2 waterproof pannier bags that just clips to the side of the basket. The basket helps to give clearance between the bags and the wheels as I ride a 20" folding bike and this way, there is enough clearance from the ground too
i’m glad i came across this! i wanted a basket on my bike bc i thought it was cute but i’d rather have a backpack for an easier ride than losing balance w a basket
Just wanted to say - I love that as a North American, you don't fuss about safety gear like helmets. It's brutal having a mandatory helmet law in my city, knowing that it exists because of auto industry lobbying, knowing the police could pull me over at any time, and knowing our new infrastructure would be used more if we weren't stuck in a culture of fear.
I'm from England but lived in New Zealand for a while and cycled a lot for shopping, errands, work, and pleasure. I had a kiddie-trailer which I used to take my two year old son around as well. Six days before we returned to the UK I found out that cycle helmets are a legal requirement there with an on the spot $30 fine if you get caught without one! Luckily I never got caught, but Oops!
This was a perfect video for me because you somehow added dumbbells to your baskets which I also plan to put into my baskets as my recent purchase. Such a coincidence haha.
This vid seems like it was custom made for me. Exactly what I have been scratching my head over the past few days. I was told the front basket on the bike I am looking at could not be added. Turns out they didn't know what they are talking about. The clip on option is perfect for times when I am heading to the store knowing I will be returning with a lot of stuff. Otherwise it stays back home. Can also be said with the rear basket. Made my day !
Useful info, well presented. :) There is so much info out there for 20-somethings doing agro, fair weather, no-fenders, road back rides. It's nice to have useful info for practical bike use--commuting, shopping, etc. 🤓
I am only 20 sec into the video and I am hooked. I have both a front and rear basket (not on the same bike) and I have never seen a video about this before !
You've mentioned it already and that's why another point should really go to the front basket - visual security. But similarly to the conclusion of your study in the video, that would likely be the primary reason to choose a front basket (along with style preference). I don't find the convenience test as necessary because all you may really need in the middle of a ride where you don't need to or shouldn't really have to stop is hydration? And all us bikers know hydration has other, even more convenient locations to be had on a bike frame. (Don't reach for your phone while riding, just pull over to the side and stop!)
For my cargo bike, a 26" Schwinn 7 speed step-through (too old to get my leg over the back basket), I have a front and rear basket and foldable side baskets on the rear rack. The rear rack allows me to carry a small cooler and space for a bag of heavy items (or two bags if not too tall). Depending on contents, I can get two bags in each side basket and one bag in the front. I also carry straps so I can add something like paper towels on top of the rear rack items. I have a 6-8 mi rt commute (depending on store) over mostly flat terrain and have had no issues with the set up. You just have to plan ahead when bagging your purchases.
If you mount the front basket to the handlebar stem, you will be mounting it closer to the frame, and a few inches lower compared to mounting the basket on the horizontal handlebar. With the lower center of gravity and lower momentum the steering will become much easier, and the ride will be stable.
I've got panniers that contain two big shopping bags. So a trip to a supermarket is no problem. Two bags hanging on the steering bar, panniers full, and flowers under the binders on the back, me and my mule ready for the weekend.
If a front basket was my only choice I would use it for eggs, bread, and light items. I prefer using a detachable pet carrier on the rear to carry groceries. The cheap milk crate gets attached to the back rack with bungee cords if need more room or need to separate. I always bike slowly and carefully going home with groceries. No one likes getting home and finding out they came home less than with what they bought. Good video.
I found stepping over a back basket to get on the bike was awkward. I've used a Wald front basket, that's about the same size as your back basket, for decades in NY. I like the feeling of getting a workout with my arms &, most importantly, it has saved my hands on multiple occasions from opening car doors. I was also in a hit & run cab accident where a driver intentionally hit me & the basket acted like a crumple zone & saved me from a lot of the impact. I'm a front basket guy all the way, but your basket needs to be much bigger. Those little ones are useless. I can carry a bag of groceries & my backpack with no problem. I know people don't like the way it changes the balance but you get used to it really quick. I've never found it to impede my steering & I carry a lot of weight. I have to do last minute quick turns all the time. It's totally doable. Like I said, you just get used to it. That's why they're so prevalent here in the city. If they didn't work, messengers wouldn't use them.
Great video! Love the shots of you riding around trying to get the balls to pop out! Especially the big bump with the top-down shot... Balls everywhere!! Awesome! :-)
I just love my front flat rack; i can put a basket, a big bag, a backpack.. i feel is way more convenient and less flimsy than a rear rack ; if for some odd reason the bicycle tips over, it will damage\bend your rear rack every time, while a front rack will be protected by the tip of the handlebar and the front wheel.
Much like the basket or pannier video, it depends on what you're hauling. I have front baskets on both my bikes. Great for stuff like my hat, picking up dinner on my way home from work, light groceries like bread I don't want crushed with the rest, stuff like that. When it's heavy stuff like a jug of juice or something it really hinders turning because the weight wants to go with gravity Extra bonus both of my front baskets are the same model. They have handles that when lifted unlock the basket so whatever you have in it you can just take away in the basket with you
I recently bought a gravel/touring bike which I use to commute a few days a week. The bike actually came with Tubus front and rear pannier racks. At first, I left the front racks off, but now I use them regularly with one or two panniers. While they do slow down the steering, it also makes the bike feel more balanced and planted. When I have all the weight on the back, plus my weight (which is more substantial than I'd like), it feels like I'm pulling the load -- in front feels like I'm pushing it. That said, my bike is probably built differently than the bike you're using. Before this bike, I always used rear panniers and/or a trunk.
This is interesting. I've had people say they feel more balanced with loads in the front, and other people say the opposite. I wonder if it has to do with frame geometry, body shape or something else entirely. May be worth an investigation!
noticed when you have a weight on front the steering becomes more sensitive, harder to steer little unsafem bakc is much better no difference on steering
The weight on the back has a different effect, but can certainly cause it's own instability problems. Like anything, changes to your bike can feel weird, so you have to get used to the way the bike feels. Once you do, you most of the problems go away.
I have both a front and rear rack that can mount my Wald basket, so neither weight nor capacity are an issue, its the same basket either way. I've moved the basket to the front for a few important (to me) reasons. Front rando style racks do not interfere with front fenders. Rear racks almost always interfere with rear fenders that have mid wheel stays (like SKS bluemels, for example; or, now that I notice, your own rear fender stay running underneath the rack brace). Maneuvering a bike in tight places like my balcony, or into/out of elevators, is much easier if the weight is front loaded rather than rear. Lifting the front wheel to reposition is just more difficult than being able to one arm the rear up while keeping the other on the front brake to swing the back around. I also risk hitting fewer people that may also be around me. The bike is also more stable with the front rack as I'm less likely to have the front come up, which is always a risk with a rear rack, esp at intersections where most cyclists get hit. As a side, while it does change the steering, I've found it makes the bike feel lighter and easier to accelerate. Don't have an explanation. Maybe slightly unweighting the rear. Idk. But it feels faster.
I do everything I can to avoid the baskets reviewed here in favor of panniers, frame bags, fork bags, seat/saddle bags and backpacks. The most stable place on your bike for extra weight IMHO is behind and below the stem, where a triangle stem bag goes, but that is where there is also not much room, chiefly because it is a space between your knees. That being said you have stimulated my thinking for a design where a hard shell carbon fiber cargo bay could be integrated into a special custom made frame. For extra space the top of the cargo bay might need to come up a few inches inches above where an average top tube normally lies, but only extending for a little distance coming back from the stem to allow a little straddle space in front of the saddle. It would replace the top tube for about a foot coming behind the stem, the cargo bay walls taking up the structural function of a top tube in the front. A short top tube, giving some straddle area, would go from the seat tube for a few inches until it connects to the back of the envisioned cargo bay. Etc. I know, I know....don't give up my day job. Keep going with your vids. I never miss a one.
Stan, admit it, you secretly want a front basket on your bike, if only to show how carefree you are as you reach in to grab an apple, a drink or even just a hat to keep the sun off! 😉
Hahaha, so after buying the basket, had a week or two with it, loved it. This morning however, it fell off the rack, it was a rainy dark morning, it fell directly in the middle of a round about cross way lol, I I went to go back and get it but just as I was about to cross, a truck ran over it right in front of me lmfao it’s like a pancake now. It was nice while it lasted, but the reviews of saying it falls off, is true lmfao. I’m looking for some serious suggestions on a pannier or something, I need to bring home stuff from work everyday lol
Thanks for the review - new sub here. My guess is if your front basket were on a front rack rather than suspended on your bars some of the handling issues would be improved. That said, I still think the rear basket is a better option. I do have a handlebar bag by Arkel which as you've mentioned, is very convenient. Need to grab your sunglasses at a stop light? Super easy from a handlebar bag vs reaching behind you into a basket/pannier.
Several thoughts. Rear basket bump test was in your draft so balls bounced and likely landed inside the basket as they lacked the effects of wind. Front basket may have tested better with a front rack under it keeping its mass on the front wheel and not having turning drag by frame contact! Also a front rack likely would offer less bounce! Because this is in an urban environment a test could be better set up with standing to pass over obsticles like potholes, curbs, speed bumps etc. From my touring with usually way too much stuff but ballanced and low, a loaded bike is 1000% different from an unloaded one when standing! That will show more issues, IMHO! My preference is to use paniers, as they replicate shopping bags in store and clamp on to the bike. The mass at all points are far lower to the ground. My front Blackburn lowriders are bolted on to the forks on a factory through leg mount. Another bonus for heavier riders the mass is on the wheels rather than loading the frame between the wheels. Love your great videos 🖖
Front loads definitely affect handling more than rear loads, but you can get bikes that account for that by using low trail/high flop geometry. The rear loads feel fine until you leaned too far into a turn, then it much harder to correct because they lag behind the steering inputs. Trade offs unfortunately. I prefer low rider front racks, but that wouldn’t make sense for most bikes’ geometry.
I'm pretty certain that there are plenty of people out there whose experience is the opposite of yours. Most things you put in a basket will probably be in a bag of some sort anyway. Bouncing out isn't usually a problem, and the extra rigidity can be a boon if you have objects likely to puncture or tear a pannier.
I mean anyone with sense would keep something to secure load. Also the ball bounce test is kinda invalid since those are really light and made to do that. I put chips in the front basket and nothing came out.
This is a no brainer. I've had rack mount child seats on the back with a 45lb kid in there, so easily 50 lbs total and I don't even notice they're there. The only problem is the front wheel can get a bit unweighted if you let your own weight get too far back or really take off from a start. I have a front basket that I put my 10lb dog in and it completely changes the way the bike rides and handles to the point it's a little scary. Back basket, all the way. Panier if you really care about your cargo though.
But it is only scary because you aren't used to it. Ride with a loaded front basket for a week, and you won't notice it. The weight on the back can have a pendulum effect on the bike whilst turning, and trust me when I say it can be just very scary if the back end suddenly starts to go on a slippery surface. With a car traveling 10 feet behind you. A change of underwear is handy. 😉
You only made this video to have an excuse to do the bounce test. 😂 I’m loving my basket which attaches to the side of my rear rack. I secure it with a 4ft bungee that has a carabiner for hooks. I take it into the store with me, and the bungee helps with bigger loads, or just strapping down my backpack on top of my rear rack.
@@Shifter_Cycling I want to live in a world where adults can just go ride around the park bouncing balls out of their bikes without having to go through the trouble of investing into recording equipment, starting a YT channel, and working to 30k subscribers just so not to attract the authorities. Or, at least, have an excuse when they arrive.
Side. I use a foldable basket that is mounted at one side of the rear rack. One side of the rack can't be used for bags then but you can still put stuff on top of the rack.
The one thing I’ve noticed while riding a fixed gear, more so without a hand brake, is that a rear rack makes locking up the rear wheel feel weird and is harder to stop. I’m guessing it’s something to do with keeping the back lighter and more nimble that makes it easier to stay in control with a front rack
Generally you would shift your weight forward when skidding on a fixed gear, to make it easier to lock up the rear wheel, so it makes sense that adding weight to the back would make it harder. I find even just a heavy backpack makes skidding harder.
@@queertales But if you want to stop quickly, move your weight backwards, because the static friction generated by locking the wheel is less than the rolling friction of moving wheel just on the edge of locking up. And anyone with any sense uses a front brake, because despite how macho you might feel without one, it actually generates around 70% of the total braking capacity of a bike. 🙄
Thanks for another entertaining and educational video! I totally recommend Topeak's trolleytote folding MTX rear basket: it folds when not in use, sturdy (I lost count of the times I've abused it due to heavy weight), and it's got wheels to lug it around!
Why should I have to choose between front and back baskets. I have both on my bike. The front basket is a convenient place to carry my kryptonite chain lock so I use it everytime I ride. The front basket is also good for certain groceries (like a dozen eggs) where I want to monitor what's going on. Im not a fan of easily removed front baskets because they are easy to remove. I also added a couple of folding saddlebag baskets to sides of the rear rack. Those come in handy when I have a lot of groceries to bring home. I prefer them to paniers because they are a lot harder to steal. The back basket works for groceries and the bag of bike tools that I like to carry on long rides.. The disadvantage of a back basket regarding having to throw your leg higher is easily solved if you get a step through bike. A back basket with a case of beer it in is not easy to get your leg over. .
I recently got a Dutch bike without a back rack, and I'm still trying to find a rack that fits over the metal wheel cover. :( All the so-called "universal" ones I've tried don't quite stretch far enough to reach the wheel attachment. I really miss using a back basket (or back saddle bags) when doing shopping!
Hi tom! Have you ever tried bicycle bags on the back indtead of a basket? That's what most of us Dutchies are using. You wont have trouble swinging you leg over it, you have twice the capacity and they can be closed.
Thanks for confirming my gut feeling regarding front baskets. I have a main rear basket, and 2 additional baskets that I can fold out on either side of the rear wheel. Those make the bike very wide though. If I ever need more I get a trailer. Or rent a cargo bike from our city.
I once used a 5 gal bucket with a lid on the back of my KLR, but, since watching your video, I think it would work for a bike too. It would get points for keeping stuff dry, but no points for style.
The ball test was crazy. I didn't think the back basket would lose any but that was close. I wonder if suspension would have helped? The moral of the ball test is don't take short cuts across the grass, Cheers!
The front basket becomes difficult to use when it moves with the handlebars, because it affects the balance of a bike. This is why high end Dutch bikes attach the front basket to the frame. When it's attached to the frame, you don't have the control problems you found, and the front basket can hold a lot of weight before you notice it.
The bike I use for filming and livestreaming is an Azor bike with a large front basket attached to the frame. It's perfect for accessing my camera gear without affecting the stability of the bike.
It's difficult to find frame-mounted baskets here, but I'm on a new mission to track one down!
Hi Shifter. If you can find an ex-Post-Office bike made by Pashley in the UK you will have a really sturdy frame-mounted front rack which can carry about 20kg or 44lb. My Elephant-Bike is a refurbished version which I ride most days; they are real work-horses, and just about indestructible. The Pashley Pronto is the civilian non Post-Office version.
@@Teapot-Dave @shifter this is exactly what I was going to add to the conversation, I love my posties bike, the front bucket is always full of junk (just like my car 😅) due to its carrying capacity... It's a heafty beast and I'm glad to live in a relatively flat city.
The VanMoof X3 has a frame-mounted front carrier.
Every bike sold by Rad Power Bikes has a pretty decent front carrier/basket mount on the head tube, too. Same for almost every long-tail cargo bike on the market (e. g. Tern or Yuba).
The real beauty of the rear basket for commuters is that you don't have to worry about a sweaty back, and you have a proper backpack once you get to your destination. Of course, there's the basket issue. If you don't want it to be stolen, you're probably better off with a non-removable one.
I love these videos because they help people overcome barriers in using the bike as a means of transportation in everyday life.
I had been using pannier style bags for groceries and for bikepacking trips. But when I went back to university post retirement, I needed to be able to grab and go with all my books and my laptop, etc. So my solution was a backpack inside a back basket. That way I didn’t have to transfer my stuff back and forth, which can get really annoying. Just put on the backpack and go to class. I can also see this working well for trips to the gym, or various other situations.
IMO you forgot one important criteria: parking. Some bike racks are reaaally impractical with a front basket.
This is true. Rarer are some truly awful racks that don't work back basket either
@shifter you could try a parking test with baskets (front or back) and panniers. I got a pannier recently and I definitely did not consider this aspect c:
I always park backwards so in my case, a back basket would actually be worse. It's all preference after all!
I see a lot of people with front baskets parking backwards in some racks, seems to work fine, and still leaves space for other bikes in the adjacent slots.
The front basket parks great if you turn the wheel the opposite direction of the kickstand.
Personally, I use both. I use the front basket for things like my wallet, keys, phone and bike chain. I use the back basket for actual cargo, like groceries, plus my purse.
I’m aware that there’s a trade-off here, that being the extra weight of two baskets, but for me the pros outweigh the cons 🙃
I use a plastic storage bin with a lid in the rear. I attach the lid by drilling 2 holes in the front facing lip of the lid and corresponding lip of the bin (just drill the holes with the lid snapped on) and using 2 zip ties through the holes to use as hinges. Don't tighten zip ties completely but leave enough of a loop for a little play. While plastic bins are flimsy at the bottom, to reinforce it I attach a piece of plywood to the rack as a base and then you can easily attach the bin to the wood with screws or bolts (use washers so you don't crack the plastic). Voila, you have a closable "trunk" or "boot" to keep items dry and you can even fill the basket over the top with the lid partially open but still firmly attached by the ties. You can use as big a bin as you want as they are available in many sizes. A little ugly like most home made baskets but extremely practical. I had only one failure in years but that was due to faulty welds in the original metal rack.
You've missed a huge plus of a front basket: Freeing up your rear rack for something else, like a child seat. I use both styles on a regular basis, however, my front rack bolts directly to the frame of the bike, not the handlebars so it doesn't exhibit any of the issues you were having with your front basket, like trying to twist the handlebars whenever you turn.
Still, I agree with your ultimate conclusion, the rear mounted rack is 'better'. With the right equipment though, it's closer than your tests have shown.
Love your videos! Another option is a folding rear basket (Wald makes one) that attaches with clamps/bolts to the side of the rear rack, so it rides more like a pannier. Doesn't hold as much as the basket you tested, but it's much easier to swing your leg over. Fits a shopping bag, backpack, 12-pack of beer, or whatever. Always there when you need it, folds up when you don't.
Yeah, you can attach two Wald 582 baskets and get a comparable amount of capacity. Each holds a standard paper grocery bag and folds flat.
I was checking this Wald racks out, and I'm interesting. Perhaps I need to make a future video on this topic. Thanks!
I have two of those on my “grocery bike”. Two of them add more weight than a single rack mounted basket, but I’m not going for speed records when I’m going for groceries. The folding rear baskets also make it easier to get on and off the bike (compared to a high back basket or milk crate).
I have two folding baskets, and I love them. I thought they wouldn't be good at first because they're kinda flimsy, but they've held up exceptionally for five years. I also have a front folding basket that hangs off my handlebar; it does its job well. All three together help me with my groceries.
I second the Wald rear basket option. Sunlite also makes a similar one.
Back basket with a step through bike is the way
Love this.
That's what I do but I feel like the whole frame of the bike wobbles so much. It feels unsafe
Back basket with a waterproof backpack and a cargo net is my go to combo. I don't get sweaty from wearing my bag but still have the convenience of having it when I get wherever I'm going. Beats panniers any day in my opinion (at least for commuting)
I too like tossing my backpack or DSLR back in the basket. Would rather have a backpack pannier like that Arkel GT18 but $190 is a little steep for just one for me.
@@kishascape I've been thinking of one of those, but as you say, the price is steep. And also, I already have a 25L waterproof backpack that fits perfectly in my basket. I've read the pannier backpacks are also just not very comfortable for wearing, although for daily use its not frequent it needs to be on the back for extended periods so meh
Yeah i used backpack on rearack too. But i use straps to hold it to the rearack not a net.
I use a rear basket. Noticeably easier when cycling into a headwind, more stable when looking behind you, large enough to take a large shopping bag of groceries, and also means your bike is more stable when leaning against a lamp post.
I have used both front and rear baskets (still do), and generally find that heavier stuff travels better on the rear, rack whilst lighter things that you need to observe go better on the front. Having said that, last month (August 2021) I transported a Fiat Panda back-axle 5-miles to my local garage on the front of my Elephant Bike (exPost-Office) for them to repair our 12-year-old family car. "The Elephant" is amazing, although it is not the lightest or fastest bike on the planet, but it felt really light and twitchy on the way back home, and spontaneously steered me to my local coffee-shop as I tried to ride past.
I think you should have counted the leg issue against the back basket and the 'able to keep an eye on things' one for the front basket.
Go Canada! I've always been using a basket on the bike rack and have done all my shopping w/ it. I love it and wouldn't wanna do it any other way. the convenience cannot be beat. Panniers can be great for bikepacking, but for urban use I much prefer my basket :-)
EDIT: I want to add that I regularly transport 20+ kg in my back basket, and some really tall objects (1.5m tall plants) with not much issue - so can defo reccomend! Happy cycling you lovely lot out there!
for 20+ you need a sturdy one (or at least a bigger like in the video), but yes, 2 full bags of groceries are no problem at all.
I regret getting panniers for groceries then.
Even fitting a boxing bag was not easy.
You can't really ignore bike geometry. Some bikes just handle a front load (or split front/rear) load better than a rear load. Your bike probably has a higher trail that can handle a bunch of weight on the back. So it differs by bike. Also I prefer getting the load lower on the front (basket mounted to a rack over front wheel). That makes a huge difference. Thanks for the video!
I love your videos. They are so informative and fun.
Thanks for watching!
One in the front and two in the back, plus always bring some straps. That lets you use the two rear baskets as a platform if you're hauling bulkier items.
This was such a helpful experiment. I love the idea of a front basket. But will definatly stick to back pannier bags or basket. Thanks for this analytical review.
Happy smiles from Scotland.
Thanks for watching!
Hello Shifter, excellent job to show that the rear basket is better than the front one, I also have both and I use both, but without a doubt the back is more practical I always have it fixed, apart you can also cover it with an elastic net that is bought in sports stores and prevents things from falling out of the basket, thank you for helping us to improve in the handling of the bicycle and I also congratulate you for the location of the area you choose to do the tests which are precious and very pretty, greetings and until the next report 😊👍☘️
My "slow" bike is a step through cruiser with a wicker basket on the front and a wire basket on the back. It's super convenient and easy to haul whatever. Mostly it's my tote bag with my lunch, etc that I bring to work. Nice to take off mitts or gloves if I get hot and just throw them in the front basket.
My "fast" bike is not a step through, with narrow handlebars and I have one or two waterproof roll down panniers on the back rack. It's good for rainy days, and keeps things more secure, but it's a pain to shove my tote bag into the pannier, and I don't like carrying the pannier bag around because it's kind of dirty and ugly. I can fit more in the baskets, without spending time packing it perfectly, so I prefer them.
Me too. A slow step through with valuable basket on the front and a removable back basket for when it is needed. And a fast bike with no racks but a small handlebar bag. Which does affect its balance but I can see it at all times.
I reaaally love how thorough this testing is. I butchered my front basket when I fell over it yesterday, haha. And now I'm watching which basket to buy for my grocery and regular neighborhood trips. 😅
Great video! We have both. Front basket on wife's bike for purse, keys, wallet, phones etc. Rear basket (milk crate on rack) on my bike for less important and bulk things like our cooler with cold water, lunch and snacks, spare socks/clothes, blanket, tool kit, groceries, etc. Works out fine great combination 😁
front baskets are nice for you to carry things that you are going to use at the moment, such as an empty can that you can take to the next trash can, or a jacket that you took along for the ride but felt the heat and don't want to stop the bike for putting in the back basket, front baskets are nice too for a laid back ride, you can carry some food in the basket and eat during the ride, without worry with stop and get out of the bike to take something. haha, nice video
Front basket is also deeper which is a benefit over the back one. And you have peace of mind because you can see what you are carrying. I think your front one was pretty small.
A good idea is to get both. use the front for most things and if you have a heavy load of shopping use the back one. Thats one i'm planning in future.
From my experience of only using a front basket it was great for throwing my bag in, or phone or whatever. Super convenient. Buying shopping was sometimes an issue as it got full.
I love my plastic crate mounted to the rear rack. It's so convenient being able to load a full bag of groceries straight in & ride away. The bike feels very stable loaded in this way. I attach it using 2 simple brackets made from strips of plywood, 2 dome head coach bolts & wing nuts purchased from a local hardware shop. Total cost about £12, but obviously much less if a free crate is up for grabs. I can remove it in seconds if I need to use my panniers.🙂
I love having basket on bicycles . Soon gonna add a back basket now. Thanks for the tests.
An elastic cargo net would solve issues with the bounce test.
Yep, and a couple of bungee cords might solve most of the problems too.
My cargo net makes my back basket super convenient and useable.
Love my elastic cargo net. I don't have a basket, but I use it lots just carrying stuff on the rack
@@fearsomefawkes6724
It's gonna wear out at the usual rate (fast), tho.
@@fearsomefawkes6724 Yeah: i do mean quickly.
If you stand beside your bike, hold the sadle and give at a big push it'll continue for a while. This is mostly the caster effect (bit of gyroscopic help from the wheel as well). This is also why cycling without holding the handlebars is prossible and even easy. This natural stability can actually be calculated and influenced.
I got to use a simple bit of software that tried to do just that a couple of years back. I only had a few hour ro play around with it, but it predicted that any weight infront would negatively impact the stability, most weight on the back wouldn't really do anything and weight near your pedals would improve the stability. We tried it out and the distance the bike would ride on it's own confirmed the predictions.
So that's what you're feeling with the handlebar basket, you actually made the stability (way) worse and now have to do a lot more work keeping the bike up.
Problem with the bounce test. The capacity of the baskets does not appear equal but you stocked them with an equal number of balls. The front basket had balls up to the top while the rear had unused space between the balls and the top. Seems likely that a basket loaded to capacity would be more likely to lose items than a basket not loaded to capacity.
Just found the channel as I'm looking to increase my hauling capacity on an old rental bike bought as a commuter and since I now work from home being modified to be a better utility bike. It has a front basket and I strapped a large milk crate (hold 6 gallon jugs of milk instead of the usual 4) as a rear basket.
Thanks for making such interesting and useful videos. This is a great help for folks just wanting a bit of storage and making this choice. Hoping you have a video already on various panniers and other storage options to help me work out a good setup.
You do an excellent job with the production, from filming (without wrecking that we can see), ensuring the video and sound are both clear, to breaking up the videos in to segments. Lots of big and little things you do to make them so good after you've come up with a grand idea and planned out your story or testing. It is much appreciated.
You forgot to include a front basket attached to the frame instead of the handlebars. It makes a huge difference in terms of stability as it doesn't impact steering.
I don’t believe every bicycle can take a front basket fixed to the frame. Mine actually can’t
@@Uns_Maps_8 depends on the basket size. But maybe it can take a front rack attached to the frame
Could you link a system that is frame-mounted? What I can find in abundance is the stuff that mounts to the fork, but those are just as bad as the handlebar-mounted version.
@@Volkbrecht Your frame needs a mounting plate with threaded holes brazed onto the front of the head tube. For example, look at the bikes that accept those baskets from Downtube Bikes.
Front basket mounted directly to the bike frame, not the fork/handlebars, so that it doesn't affect your steering. Two folding rear baskets hanging off the rear rack.
Assuming you can find a front basket that fits on to your bike and is sturdy enough to take a bit of weight. Easy if your frame has a welded on carrier, not so easy otherwise.
Hey, this is pretty cool! It's interesting to watch content from the lockdown period and see how different things were back then. By the way, a step-through bike makes that back basket a lot easier to get on and off the bike.
I've never considered using a basket, panniers hold more stuff, are waterproof and have a lower centre of gravity.
I also love panniers, but I'd argue they are slightly less convenient. With a basket, you just throw your stuff in and go.
@@Shifter_Cycling Also with panniers you can't always leave then on the bike because they will get stolen.
Personally I like a basket that I can fit a backpack in bc I don't really want to carry a pannier around
@@Luigi64 exactly, especially if you are leaving the house with all your stuff in the backpack already. I use some elastic hooks to ensure its staying there (my basket is low profile in height hahah)
I have wire side baskets in place of panniers that fold down when not in use. always have baskets on me that won't get stollen
In the Netherlands front racks are pretty common and they are really versatile, especially combined with a strap. You have to compensate for the weight when stearing but that's doable. I can imagine that they don't work on bikes that are common in most countries outside of the Netherlands though. The Dutch omafietsen normally don't have hand brakes (so no wires) and the handlebar is curved, which makes it easier to loop backpack straps around it without them getting in the way.
when I was a kid in southern CA, a newspaper route was a common thing. In 4th grade, I would occasionally help a friend with his paper route and we use cloth bags that wrap around the handle bars. It was challenging when it was full. The Sunday paper was usually 3x heavier and you'd easily have 25lbs.
A Wald or Sunlite folding side rear basket is another option. I have the Wald folding rear basket. I love it. It adds 2.8 pounds (Sunlite is the same) but pannier bags aren't exactly light either. I favor the basket over a pannier because you can't steal a Wald basket and therefore don't have to carry a heavy and bulky pannier when you go indoors. Its also more economical. The downside is that unless you want to undo the clamps and screws, it's pretty much permanently affixed to your rack. So you can't just easily take it on and off. But I still prefer it over a pannier. Just drop your stuff in there and go!
I had the same milk crate fixed with zip ties on the rear of my bikes for many years. It must have carried tons of beer and groceries, but no oatmeal.
I recently got an upright dutch bike with a rack on the front. I tried a box on the front but found it difficult to steer with weight in it. I now use bungy cords for light things on the front and quick realise panniers with shoulder straps on the rear which are easy to fill in the shop.
Another advantage of the daggy milk crate was I never had a bike stolen.
I have been using the milk crate for years. Work's great. Always there when you need it and no need to remove it since no one will steal this low value crate.
I also love the milk crate. I tested it earlier this year: ruclips.net/video/w8MX-qMZ9Ao/видео.html
The grannies of the 1950's knew which was best. Front handlebar baskets were extremely common. They were simple and inexpensive, and allowed you to easily see the cargo. With constant short trip shopping usage baskets allowed holding the goods without painstakingly tying the cargo for every trip, so that goods could bounce out on occasion, and with a back basket you'd never notice. If rarely heavy goods were transported than the rear rack could be used.
1:10 Yeah, that's the problem: you start your ride, forget the basket is on there, and when you finish you try to swing your leg over the back, hit the basket and almost fall on the ground. Apart from that, back baskets are great.
This is real.
I do that all the time, face first into the gas station parking lot
Omg this happened to me the other day! It was so embarrassing. I had forgotten that I had added the back basket. I fell over and scrapped my knee and foot up.
just get one thats smaller in height, and use elastic hooks to tie down stuff
It becomes near on impossible to swing a leg over with age👴
My favorite thing about front basket is throwing my phone inside for GPS never had it thrown off because how deep it is
Thanks for the test. I think it is a no brainer to carry the one in the back but I certainly hate how inconvenient it is to climb on the seat. Panniers are undoubtedly better for long trips
I think the real value in a front basket is that it it complememts a rear basket (added cargo capacity). Like you said, good for smaller, lighter items, especially those of value. My PO Box is really close to my job site, so I use it to haul my mail, up to small packages, on my way home from work. The rear basket is for my laptop and other work items.
Not a basket person but I dig your videos so I’ll watch:)
If you buy a dutch-style bike (many companies there do this), you can buy a bike with frame-mounted front basket. This is far more stable and has much more carrying capacity than the fork/handlebar mounted variety. It is also ridiculously convenient. I never have to worry about not being able to carry something if I see a shop I'm interested on my rides. Also, if you are riding a more upright position (as you would commuting), that extra weight is placed on the front wheel, rather than the back wheel, which helps balance out the load and the tire wear.
most of those frames build on the front of the bicycle usually have the basket angled towards cyclist instead of angled towards the front what we could see in the vid.
Upright bikes definitely have a better balance for carrying cargo. These are great points.
@@DarkDutch007 Mine is straight upright, with a large crate in front.
Basket up front and panniers at the back is the best combo if you ask me.
Beautiful city, not crowded, spacious and cool weather
I've been using a collapsible rear plastic basket with an elastic net for a long time and have yet to drop any of the stuff I've been carrying. I use a frameless pannier shelf just fixed to my seat post so I think the weight capacity is probably limited to about 20kg only. For additional volume, I use 2 waterproof pannier bags that just clips to the side of the basket. The basket helps to give clearance between the bags and the wheels as I ride a 20" folding bike and this way, there is enough clearance from the ground too
i’m glad i came across this! i wanted a basket on my bike bc i thought it was cute but i’d rather have a backpack for an easier ride than losing balance w a basket
Just wanted to say - I love that as a North American, you don't fuss about safety gear like helmets.
It's brutal having a mandatory helmet law in my city, knowing that it exists because of auto industry lobbying, knowing the police could pull me over at any time, and knowing our new infrastructure would be used more if we weren't stuck in a culture of fear.
I'm from England but lived in New Zealand for a while and cycled a lot for shopping, errands, work, and pleasure. I had a kiddie-trailer which I used to take my two year old son around as well.
Six days before we returned to the UK I found out that cycle helmets are a legal requirement there with an on the spot $30 fine if you get caught without one! Luckily I never got caught, but Oops!
I just moved to San Francisco and this channel has been a huge benefit! Wish I watched your poncho video before I got caught in some light rain! Lol
I love this content, even front and back basket has a content. Not expecting it thou.
Thanks alot!
This was a perfect video for me because you somehow added dumbbells to your baskets which I also plan to put into my baskets as my recent purchase. Such a coincidence haha.
This vid seems like it was custom made for me. Exactly what I have been scratching my head over the past few days.
I was told the front basket on the bike I am looking at could not be added. Turns out they didn't know what they are talking about. The clip on option is perfect for times when I am heading to the store knowing I will be returning with a lot of stuff. Otherwise it stays back home. Can also be said with the rear basket. Made my day !
I always love the look of this bike. So sleek
Useful info, well presented. :) There is so much info out there for 20-somethings doing agro, fair weather, no-fenders, road back rides. It's nice to have useful info for practical bike use--commuting, shopping, etc. 🤓
I am only 20 sec into the video and I am hooked. I have both a front and rear basket (not on the same bike) and I have never seen a video about this before !
You've mentioned it already and that's why another point should really go to the front basket - visual security. But similarly to the conclusion of your study in the video, that would likely be the primary reason to choose a front basket (along with style preference). I don't find the convenience test as necessary because all you may really need in the middle of a ride where you don't need to or shouldn't really have to stop is hydration? And all us bikers know hydration has other, even more convenient locations to be had on a bike frame. (Don't reach for your phone while riding, just pull over to the side and stop!)
love the last test
For my cargo bike, a 26" Schwinn 7 speed step-through (too old to get my leg over the back basket), I have a front and rear basket and foldable side baskets on the rear rack. The rear rack allows me to carry a small cooler and space for a bag of heavy items (or two bags if not too tall). Depending on contents, I can get two bags in each side basket and one bag in the front. I also carry straps so I can add something like paper towels on top of the rear rack items. I have a 6-8 mi rt commute (depending on store) over mostly flat terrain and have had no issues with the set up. You just have to plan ahead when bagging your purchases.
As a kid growing up I had a paper route and used a front bike rack made out of black strap steel. After a while you get use to the weight
If you mount the front basket to the handlebar stem, you will be mounting it closer to the frame, and a few inches lower compared to mounting the basket on the horizontal handlebar. With the lower center of gravity and lower momentum the steering will become much easier, and the ride will be stable.
I've got a front mounted rack over the front wheel that attaches to the frame of the bike, and a rear rack in the back. Winning combo for me.
Some bikes have basket mounts built into the front of the frame which is nice as they don't affect the steering as much.
That dangling lapel mic is so stressful! But thanks for the content as always :)
I've got panniers that contain two big shopping bags. So a trip to a supermarket is no problem.
Two bags hanging on the steering bar, panniers full, and flowers under the binders on the back, me and my mule ready for the weekend.
If a front basket was my only choice I would use it for eggs, bread, and light items. I prefer using a detachable pet carrier on the rear to carry groceries. The cheap milk crate gets attached to the back rack with bungee cords if need more room or need to separate. I always bike slowly and carefully going home with groceries. No one likes getting home and finding out they came home less than with what they bought. Good video.
No need for weak bungee cords use a MIK system...soooo convenient...
I found stepping over a back basket to get on the bike was awkward. I've used a Wald front basket, that's about the same size as your back basket, for decades in NY. I like the feeling of getting a workout with my arms &, most importantly, it has saved my hands on multiple occasions from opening car doors. I was also in a hit & run cab accident where a driver intentionally hit me & the basket acted like a crumple zone & saved me from a lot of the impact. I'm a front basket guy all the way, but your basket needs to be much bigger. Those little ones are useless. I can carry a bag of groceries & my backpack with no problem. I know people don't like the way it changes the balance but you get used to it really quick. I've never found it to impede my steering & I carry a lot of weight. I have to do last minute quick turns all the time. It's totally doable. Like I said, you just get used to it. That's why they're so prevalent here in the city. If they didn't work, messengers wouldn't use them.
Great video! Love the shots of you riding around trying to get the balls to pop out! Especially the big bump with the top-down shot... Balls everywhere!! Awesome! :-)
I just love my front flat rack; i can put a basket, a big bag, a backpack.. i feel is way more convenient and less flimsy than a rear rack ; if for some odd reason the bicycle tips over, it will damage\bend your rear rack every time, while a front rack will be protected by the tip of the handlebar and the front wheel.
Much like the basket or pannier video, it depends on what you're hauling. I have front baskets on both my bikes. Great for stuff like my hat, picking up dinner on my way home from work, light groceries like bread I don't want crushed with the rest, stuff like that. When it's heavy stuff like a jug of juice or something it really hinders turning because the weight wants to go with gravity
Extra bonus both of my front baskets are the same model. They have handles that when lifted unlock the basket so whatever you have in it you can just take away in the basket with you
I recently bought a gravel/touring bike which I use to commute a few days a week. The bike actually came with Tubus front and rear pannier racks. At first, I left the front racks off, but now I use them regularly with one or two panniers. While they do slow down the steering, it also makes the bike feel more balanced and planted. When I have all the weight on the back, plus my weight (which is more substantial than I'd like), it feels like I'm pulling the load -- in front feels like I'm pushing it. That said, my bike is probably built differently than the bike you're using. Before this bike, I always used rear panniers and/or a trunk.
This is interesting. I've had people say they feel more balanced with loads in the front, and other people say the opposite. I wonder if it has to do with frame geometry, body shape or something else entirely. May be worth an investigation!
noticed when you have a weight on front the steering becomes more sensitive, harder to steer little unsafem bakc is much better no difference on steering
Yes, I agree.
The weight on the back has a different effect, but can certainly cause it's own instability problems. Like anything, changes to your bike can feel weird, so you have to get used to the way the bike feels. Once you do, you most of the problems go away.
I have both a front and rear rack that can mount my Wald basket, so neither weight nor capacity are an issue, its the same basket either way. I've moved the basket to the front for a few important (to me) reasons. Front rando style racks do not interfere with front fenders. Rear racks almost always interfere with rear fenders that have mid wheel stays (like SKS bluemels, for example; or, now that I notice, your own rear fender stay running underneath the rack brace). Maneuvering a bike in tight places like my balcony, or into/out of elevators, is much easier if the weight is front loaded rather than rear. Lifting the front wheel to reposition is just more difficult than being able to one arm the rear up while keeping the other on the front brake to swing the back around. I also risk hitting fewer people that may also be around me. The bike is also more stable with the front rack as I'm less likely to have the front come up, which is always a risk with a rear rack, esp at intersections where most cyclists get hit.
As a side, while it does change the steering, I've found it makes the bike feel lighter and easier to accelerate. Don't have an explanation. Maybe slightly unweighting the rear. Idk. But it feels faster.
I do everything I can to avoid the baskets reviewed here in favor of panniers, frame bags, fork bags, seat/saddle bags and backpacks. The most stable place on your bike for extra weight IMHO is behind and below the stem, where a triangle stem bag goes, but that is where there is also not much room, chiefly because it is a space between your knees. That being said you have stimulated my thinking for a design where a hard shell carbon fiber cargo bay could be integrated into a special custom made frame. For extra space the top of the cargo bay might need to come up a few inches inches above where an average top tube normally lies, but only extending for a little distance coming back from the stem to allow a little straddle space in front of the saddle. It would replace the top tube for about a foot coming behind the stem, the cargo bay walls taking up the structural function of a top tube in the front. A short top tube, giving some straddle area, would go from the seat tube for a few inches until it connects to the back of the envisioned cargo bay. Etc. I know, I know....don't give up my day job. Keep going with your vids. I never miss a one.
Thanks for checking out the video. I think you need to design this carrying thing you've envisioned!
Stan, admit it, you secretly want a front basket on your bike, if only to show how carefree you are as you reach in to grab an apple, a drink or even just a hat to keep the sun off! 😉
Hahaha, so after buying the basket, had a week or two with it, loved it. This morning however, it fell off the rack, it was a rainy dark morning, it fell directly in the middle of a round about cross way lol, I I went to go back and get it but just as I was about to cross, a truck ran over it right in front of me lmfao it’s like a pancake now.
It was nice while it lasted, but the reviews of saying it falls off, is true lmfao.
I’m looking for some serious suggestions on a pannier or something, I need to bring home stuff from work everyday lol
Thanks for the review - new sub here.
My guess is if your front basket were on a front rack rather than suspended on your bars some of the handling issues would be improved. That said, I still think the rear basket is a better option. I do have a handlebar bag by Arkel which as you've mentioned, is very convenient. Need to grab your sunglasses at a stop light? Super easy from a handlebar bag vs reaching behind you into a basket/pannier.
Several thoughts.
Rear basket bump test was in your draft so balls bounced and likely landed inside the basket as they lacked the effects of wind.
Front basket may have tested better with a front rack under it keeping its mass on the front wheel and not having turning drag by frame contact! Also a front rack likely would offer less bounce!
Because this is in an urban environment a test could be better set up with standing to pass over obsticles like potholes, curbs, speed bumps etc. From my touring with usually way too much stuff but ballanced and low, a loaded bike is 1000% different from an unloaded one when standing! That will show more issues, IMHO!
My preference is to use paniers, as they replicate shopping bags in store and clamp on to the bike. The mass at all points are far lower to the ground. My front Blackburn lowriders are bolted on to the forks on a factory through leg mount. Another bonus for heavier riders the mass is on the wheels rather than loading the frame between the wheels.
Love your great videos 🖖
Front loads definitely affect handling more than rear loads, but you can get bikes that account for that by using low trail/high flop geometry. The rear loads feel fine until you leaned too far into a turn, then it much harder to correct because they lag behind the steering inputs. Trade offs unfortunately. I prefer low rider front racks, but that wouldn’t make sense for most bikes’ geometry.
Front or back can definitely depend on geometry. I have a low trail rando bike and it is designed for a front load.
Thanks for making this video. It was fun to watch. Your tests help a lot. Keep it up :-) Regards from Puerto Vallarta, Mexico.
In the back bascket, the more the thing are closer to the driver more stable goes. If the things are passing back the wheel, the more unstable
In my experience, panniers are almost always better than baskets - so important to have a top to seal in your cargo from bouncing out.
I'm pretty certain that there are plenty of people out there whose experience is the opposite of yours. Most things you put in a basket will probably be in a bag of some sort anyway. Bouncing out isn't usually a problem, and the extra rigidity can be a boon if you have objects likely to puncture or tear a pannier.
I mean anyone with sense would keep something to secure load. Also the ball bounce test is kinda invalid since those are really light and made to do that. I put chips in the front basket and nothing came out.
In my experience, using my bike for all transport and errands, panniers suck for everything except long touring.
@@kishascape I just tied the handle of my canvas grocery bag to my basket. Got my beer home ok.
This is a no brainer. I've had rack mount child seats on the back with a 45lb kid in there, so easily 50 lbs total and I don't even notice they're there. The only problem is the front wheel can get a bit unweighted if you let your own weight get too far back or really take off from a start. I have a front basket that I put my 10lb dog in and it completely changes the way the bike rides and handles to the point it's a little scary. Back basket, all the way. Panier if you really care about your cargo though.
But it is only scary because you aren't used to it. Ride with a loaded front basket for a week, and you won't notice it. The weight on the back can have a pendulum effect on the bike whilst turning, and trust me when I say it can be just very scary if the back end suddenly starts to go on a slippery surface. With a car traveling 10 feet behind you. A change of underwear is handy. 😉
Brompton has a very different front basket. It fastens to the frame not the handle bars. So it is part of the bike.
You only made this video to have an excuse to do the bounce test. 😂 I’m loving my basket which attaches to the side of my rear rack. I secure it with a 4ft bungee that has a carabiner for hooks. I take it into the store with me, and the bungee helps with bigger loads, or just strapping down my backpack on top of my rear rack.
Your comment about the bounce test is, sadly, quite accurate 🤣
@@Shifter_Cycling I want to live in a world where adults can just go ride around the park bouncing balls out of their bikes without having to go through the trouble of investing into recording equipment, starting a YT channel, and working to 30k subscribers just so not to attract the authorities. Or, at least, have an excuse when they arrive.
Thanks for this experiment
For front loading, consider tensioner from velo orange, it help stabilize your steering
Side. I use a foldable basket that is mounted at one side of the rear rack. One side of the rack can't be used for bags then but you can still put stuff on top of the rack.
You should've included one of the things you mentioned at the start--convenience when getting or or off the bike. The front basket takes that one. 🙂
I use a front basket (Wald 139) installed on a Surly 24-pack rack ... I also have a Velo Orange cargo net ... works flawlessly good.
The one thing I’ve noticed while riding a fixed gear, more so without a hand brake, is that a rear rack makes locking up the rear wheel feel weird and is harder to stop. I’m guessing it’s something to do with keeping the back lighter and more nimble that makes it easier to stay in control with a front rack
Generally you would shift your weight forward when skidding on a fixed gear, to make it easier to lock up the rear wheel, so it makes sense that adding weight to the back would make it harder. I find even just a heavy backpack makes skidding harder.
@@queertales But if you want to stop quickly, move your weight backwards, because the static friction generated by locking the wheel is less than the rolling friction of moving wheel just on the edge of locking up. And anyone with any sense uses a front brake, because despite how macho you might feel without one, it actually generates around 70% of the total braking capacity of a bike. 🙄
Maybe you should get a hand brake. It s dangerous to ride a bicycle without brakes. And im fairly certain it s also ilegal in a lot of countries.
Thanks for another entertaining and educational video! I totally recommend Topeak's trolleytote folding MTX rear basket: it folds when not in use, sturdy (I lost count of the times I've abused it due to heavy weight), and it's got wheels to lug it around!
Why should I have to choose between front and back baskets. I have both on my bike.
The front basket is a convenient place to carry my kryptonite chain lock so I use it everytime I ride.
The front basket is also good for certain groceries (like a dozen eggs) where I want to monitor what's going on.
Im not a fan of easily removed front baskets because they are easy to remove.
I also added a couple of folding saddlebag baskets to sides of the rear rack. Those come in handy when I have a lot of groceries to bring home. I prefer them to paniers because they are a lot harder to steal.
The back basket works for groceries and the bag of bike tools that I like to carry on long rides..
The disadvantage of a back basket regarding having to throw your leg higher is easily solved if you get a step through bike. A back basket with a case of beer it in is not easy to get your leg over.
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I recently got a Dutch bike without a back rack, and I'm still trying to find a rack that fits over the metal wheel cover. :( All the so-called "universal" ones I've tried don't quite stretch far enough to reach the wheel attachment. I really miss using a back basket (or back saddle bags) when doing shopping!
Great video. I'd definitely use both with cargo nets to keep stuff from flying out.
I'd recommend getting a net for the basket(s). It eliminates the problem of stuff falling out.
Hi tom! Have you ever tried bicycle bags on the back indtead of a basket? That's what most of us Dutchies are using. You wont have trouble swinging you leg over it, you have twice the capacity and they can be closed.
Thanks for confirming my gut feeling regarding front baskets.
I have a main rear basket, and 2 additional baskets that I can fold out on either side of the rear wheel. Those make the bike very wide though.
If I ever need more I get a trailer. Or rent a cargo bike from our city.
I do love my trailer: ruclips.net/video/IeuQSmcOx7Y/видео.html
Gut feelings can be wrong... you might want to try one for yourself, even if just a small one for lighter loads.
I once used a 5 gal bucket with a lid on the back of my KLR, but, since watching your video, I think it would work for a bike too. It would get points for keeping stuff dry, but no points for style.
The ball test was crazy. I didn't think the back basket would lose any but that was close. I wonder if suspension would have helped? The moral of the ball test is don't take short cuts across the grass, Cheers!
Have you ever thought of every getting a step-through bike? Especially if you use a back basket.