I combined my Plex Pass with my HD Homerun for DVR to my Plex Server - not the most "elegant" solution but aside from the investment in the Plex Server and one time Plex Pass lifetime it's worth it for the locals...
We have always used OTA TV as we are in a fairly rural area. I was excited about getting an HDHomerun system to watch TV on our computers and excited about the technical improvements of ATSC 3.0. As you mentioned ATSC 3.0 rollout has been pretty much derailed due to broadcasters decision to use DRM to encrypt their programs. Until this gets resolved we plan on sitting on the sidelines.
Thank you for educating me about DRM and ATSC 3. I have submitted my concerns to the FCC. I cut the cord around 7 years ago and can scan around 100 channels in my suburban Chicagoland area of which there are around 50 good channels. More than I could ever watch.
I love my HDHomeRun. Been using it for close to 10 years now with zero issues. My SIL uses my Plex server and the HDHomeRun, all the way in California, to tune into the Detroit Lions when they are playing. Its pretty cool to think she's using my antenna up in the attic.
I bought the 4th Gen Tablo when it first came out, and have been happy with it. I'm reluctant to spend the money on any ATSC 3.0 equipment for now. I'm taking a 'wait and see" attitude about the whole thing, and I know I'll be good with what i've got for the next couple of years.
Another great video. Yeah, DRM encryption blows, but I have heard, do the very limited tuner manufacturers it may not be going through. As you know, it all started with LG discontinuing the ATSE 3 tuner installation in the TV due to the DRM encryption lawsuit. I believe the other makers are following suit. With a very limited product available for the ATSE 3 tuners, it could, I hope, be scraped. You have more of an ear on the subject than I.
I think ATSC 1.0 will broadcast past 2027. Could pickup the tablo cheap during Black Friday. I bought it for my mom however I have been running HDHomeRun for years.
I got my first SEARS BETA VCR in 1978 and taped every second of Beta Tapes, then I got VHS, then over the air VHS/DVD Recorder VCR, Which I converted my tapes to DVD's. I would get Cable for 2 years record every show I could, then get rid of it for 3 years, then get it again for 2 more years, etc....Then added a tuner to my laptop and recorded 1000's of shows on my laptop. I have converted all of these files to digital files. Looking at how ATSC 3.0 is shaping up, I am glad I did.
Yes. Silicondust charges me ~35 per year for TV listings service for my HDHomerun device. I don't mind paying it at all if it helps keep the service running indefinitely and covers development costs of the occassional software and/or firmware update.
Here in Canada I axed the cable 6yrs ago. In this apartment I get a whopping 3 channels 2 of which their reception is sporadic. Good thing I only watch OTA tv for the nightly news.
It must be great to live in a place where AM, FM and TV stations are available. I'm in a shadowed signal area without FM or TV and live next to an AM transmitter. We are 90 minutes and 20 miles away from any TV stations. It is weird to live near a major city without any local broadcast media stations. The success of DRM would eventually open up the entirety of the TV bandwidth to commercial data services, with OTA going away entirely. Entire swathes of radio spectrum have disappeared in the past for similar reasons.
@LonSeidman Does the HDHome run have to use Ethernet or Can it just receive WiFi? Also what does it cost per year for the Grid programming and do you need it? Thank you very much
Thanks for a cord cutter bit. Tablo gen 1 stopped working after 5 years, It worked very well. HD Homerun stopped after 18 months. It was better than the Tablo, but died
I have one HDHomerun 4 tuner and three Tablo's, HDHomerun is a more basic interface but very reliable, the Tablo is being updated regularly and a fancier interface but has a number of quirks and minor problem's that can be irritating. In my area there are several ATSC 3.0 stations with some using DRM which HDHomerun is not able to decode and some more that do not use DRM.
I would like to start a project similar to Mr. Rogers where I make videos mocking society for artistic pleasure. Just found a nice Midi keyboard at Goodwill for $15 so I can make the total budget 30 dollars by mixing Pepsi and Milk. You'll see soon enough, but I love the content Lon, and we will keep fighting the good fight! A couple of Athlons and Durons may have passed on in the process but we will keep chugging along! Because it's not about processors or graphics cards in play. It's about a strange concoction we'll mix today.
What if someone in Miami and someone in New York wanted to share their local OTA feeds with each other, using a VPN or some other point-to-point tunnel? They each have one of these boxes and the other person connects to it and the guy in New York can stream OTA from Miami and vice versa?
Thanks for helping clear up confusion. TV makers aren't very informative about what they're selling. They'll boast about their top couple of features like 4K and streaming support, but don't say enough about what else they support. They may tell you no more than there's an antenna connector (if the even tell you that much). Not whether it supports NTSC, ATSC 1.0, ATSC 3.0, and not if that includes DRM. I still don't know if Nextgen support implies DRM support too or not. I still have old equipment (Computer and games, VCR, DVD player, etc.) that may need to use the older standards, but all TV makers care about is boasting about the newest features. I only know LG isn't supporting ATSC 3.0 because you told me so. If not careful, I could easily be unpleasantly surprised if I buy a TV and find out it doesn't support all the standards I want.
I am confused. These broadcasters use the open public airwaves to broadcast their signals. Then charge people for using the signals. It’s like a private bus company uses the existing bus stops for their buses to pick up and drop off their customers , but they don’t pay for using the spaces.
Am not sure how different TV signals are but am in the UK I have a single TV aerial input in my lounge and using a 4 way powered TV signal booster and running over cat6 through my house I now have 4 rooms able to watch HD UK freeview/OTA on regular TVs (not locked so that each TV has to watch the same channel). Need to use Female to RJ45 Male Coaxial Coax Barrel Coupler at both ends to convert from RF to Rj45 and back again at the the TV end (along with some other simple adapters (everything cheap as chips - think I paid all in less than £50) and also passing throught my patch panel. No apps, no PCs/Mac - just normal TV in rooms I would not be able to run a regualr coax to from the aerial.
I think you forgot to mention one thing, that most TV's have built-in tuners and don't need any of the devices mentioned in this video to watch TV, only if you want to record TV. BTW, I've owned 3 HDHomeRuns over the years and they are exceptional units with every new model an improvement on an already good unit. I give away my old units and make new converts to the HDHomeRuns. One thing I keep asking reviewers who run test TVs to judge performance is to test tuners. I"m old enough to remember reviews that always tested turners because they were a major selling point. Nowadays I can't point to one magazine or channel that tests tuners for the numbers of channels they bring in, the quality and the speed of the built-in TV guides. I've had two Samsungs that had good tuners but the TV channel listings were S L O W. I've written Rtings twice about it.
@@LonSeidman I understand that. What I'm saying is that some people watching this video would think that to watch free OTA tv they need to buy one of the boxes mentioned. Do you remember those commercials for some 'special device' that attaches to your tv to get free TV and only costs $30-$40? You and I know that anyone could go buy one of equal or better quality for a fraction of those prices. I'm saying that some people watching this video would think similarly. Usually you are very detailed in your videos and while watching this I totally expected a word or two about the built in OTA reception abilities of most TV's. This video is primarily about the boxes but secondarily about people's ability to watch OTA tv. Adding a word or two about built-in tv tuners would make it clearer for some people who aren't tech savvy. I'm in my 70's and for a few years used to write about tech, mostly photographic gear, software, computers, etc. and it's amazing that many people today are ignorant that their tv's have a tuner built in thinking they need a little satellite dish on their roofs or pay for Internet service just to watch what their shows. It used to be every TV came with some sort of antenna. Nowadays people would have to read the manual to know this, and how many people bother to open a manual anymore? I just thought taking a moment to mention built-in tuners would be a part of your usual thoroughness in covering a subject. Especially when you also talked about ATSC 1.0 and 3.0 reception but connected that to the boxes, ignoring the built-in tuners. I've written to Rtings a couple of times now about their lack of even mentioning the tuner performance of the tv's they review.
@@greatpix Yes, my TV does have a tuner, but I desire a gateway tuner device like these so I can use an external device such as an AppleTV and have a clean operating system and interface and stay out of the TV system and all of the advertisements and complexity. This allows me to use the TV as a monitor and remain super simple.
I have both, the HDHomerun and Tablo. Hands down, I am a HDHomerun fan. I thought I'd get a Table so I wouldn't have to pay for the option of recording, however, Tablo formats the USB drive in such a way that you can not take it off and watch what you recorded on your laptop or computer. Deal breaker for me. Plus, if my vpn is on I have issues connecting. Now HDHomerun I have is a dual tuner with USB port. For $35/yr that allows me to record and then I can take my usb and watch where ever and whenever I want. Otherwise, both give a good picture. Table does give you the additional internet channels too. HDHomerun only shows what your antenna gives.
User of Tablo Gen 4 since September. Even though this product is 2 year old, I would consider the client apps as beta software. Lot's of bugs and inconsistent UX across the apps. No Windows app and no web browser support. Unfortunately they are about the only player in this space.
The HDHomerun has a lot of potential, but I’ve had numerous problems with this. First is getting ghosted by customer support. Secondly, the audio for the Nextgen channels does not work unless you have a Roku Ultra. Do not buy the Ultra LTE version from Walmart; it will not work. Will also not work with lesser Roku models. Also, the channels that are encrypted are not supported on the HD home run. This is a complete opposite of the Zapperbox. One more thing - the internet connection it needs isn’t wireless. The one benefit this has over the Zapperbox that you have one tuner and one antenna that you can place anywhere and have over the air television on every TV in your house that has a Roku or a Firestick. I keep mine behind the bed in the upper floor bedroom with an amplified Channel Master flat panel antenna in the window facing most of the towers.
I feel what is happening to our area is they are just limiting the broadcast strength in general before DRM can even be implemented. I'm only able to get a Good signal with ABC, and no indoor antenna has worked for me so far.
The HDHomeRun is no good if you are in an area where channels are on the cusp. I have several channels where the signal isn't great, and the HDHomeRun missed them completely. It also has no way to manually add them back in. So, I ended up returning it and sticking with my TiVo Bolt. Also, while it detected ATSC 3 channels, they were audio only, I wasn't able to watch any of them due to the DRM.
Why not just use the antenna and skip the device? Is the box just for A to D conversion? Last time I used an antenna in a larger city, there were only one or two OTA channels available.
If your TV has a tuner built in you don't need the box but you do need to run antenna connections to each. You don't get DVR and in-home streaming without the box.
DRM Encryption could be dangerous, simply because in case of Emergency's like natural disasters ( Hurricane etc ) , you could not receive updates on the upcoming situation
Didn't we go through this 'over the air' incription many years ago? I thought there was such hell raised for the elderly community that couln't afford cable TV that they eventually backed off and free'd up their signals again.
12 Reasons why OTA DRM ATSC 3.0 TV will fail. Just say NO to (DRM). Tell your USA Government about the Hostile Takeover of (OTA DRM ATSC 3.0 NEXTGEN-TV) issues listed below. DRM (Digital Rights Management) Encrypted TV Station's signals. Why? Some 3.0 tuners at this time require you stay on the internet to decode DRM 3.0 TV Stations. Why? 3.0 Currently no 4K and you only get the Simulcasted main channel and no sub channels. Channel Crawling = super slow channel changing (DRM 5 + seconds slow). No sound because of Dolby AC4 audio codec does not have a legal open source license to decode legally on many devices. Some 3.0 tuners have Out of sync audio to video problems. Private Home Networked OTA antenna tuner boxes like (Tablo TV box) can not get official certified approval for DRM ATSC 3.0 NEXTGEN-TV. Why? You may need non OTA home pay internet for updates and to unlock DRM encrypted ATSC 3.0 tv channels. Possible DRM restrictions on DRM ATSC 3.0 recordings and no viewing anywhere on any device with no sound. Emergency alert messages can not be received if DRM is blocking them. OTA DRM ATSC 3.0 TV will fail because the FCC is not going to turn off ATSC 1.0 TV stations for many years if not enough people buy 3.0 TVs and 3.0 boxes. No one has solve the problem of no government money for free DRM 3.0 TV tuner boxes because 1.0 TV turners and recorders will not work after that TV Station switches to 3.0 TV broadcasts. (Range and signal error correction) OR (more sub channels and near 4k picture) trade off problem. FCC is not forcing any 1.0 TV Stations to move over to 3.0 TV. So some TV stations will be on 1.0 and others will be on DRM 3.0. The FCC is only allowing OTA Simulcasts of the ATSC 1.0 main channel at this time on DRM ATSC 3.0 NEXTGEN-TV. DRM ATSC 3.0 is a not finished product and is a work in progress mix of unproven ideas that has never gotten full FCC approval at this time. Software updates for 3.0 tuner boxes may be needed for changes made to the unfinished and future added new official ATSC 3.0 standards modules. Patent License problems. LG no longer sells TVs with ATSC 3.0 tuners. Some 3.0 TV tuners companies may go out of business or stop updates leaving you with no DRM or software updates. OTA ATSC 3.0 is better but is not perfect and still can be affected by weak tv signals: (distance, weather, planes, trees, buildings, trucks, poor antenna, etc). FCC rules that 5 percent of old ATSC 1.0 coverage area does not need to be covered anymore = (SHORTER RANGE). Viewing zone outside of your 15 minute city or town could be blocked. Your TV viewing habits could be tracked by your serial number or IP address. ATSC 3.0 is updatable until it is not updatable without new hardware tuners (ATSC 4.0, 5.0, 6.0, 7.0......). Some of these 3.0 TV issues may be fixed over time. This is only some of the mess with DRM ATSC 3.0 TV. This is my opinion why DRM ATSC 3.0 TV will fail. IMO. Stay on OTA 1.0 TV until DRM is removed from OTA ATSC 3.0 by law. It is the people versus the hostile takeover by private DRM 3.0 TV stations for control over the USA public airwaves. IMO 2024..
Were you a fan of the Amazon DVR box from a few years ago? I have one (don’t use it anymore) and it was pretty cool. With the DVR built in and all the channel listings. It is still viable? Could I hook it back up?
Which of these devices is best for streaming outside the home? And can this be done without running a VPN through my router? I have Nord installed on my phone but don’t believe I can install it on my ATT router.
I want this for my mom but where she lives, she's surrounded by mountains so those indoor antennas wont do it. I havent tried the larger indoor antennas... Has anyone here tried them?Ive tried basic leaf antenna's which work great where I live but not in her area :(
Any chance for PCI cards or USB tuners like the existing Hauppauge QuadHD coming along for ATSC 3? All of my media is on my server, recorded TV included. If they're on the verge of allowing external gateway devices, surely internal or USB tuners are soon to follow, right?
Unfortunately Hauppauge does not support ATSC 3.0 on any product they sell. The only gateway device with ATSC 3.0 is HD Homerun Quad 4k, however this device does not support DRM (as it looks it never will) and you can not record ATSC 3.0 AC-4 sound without paying for that DVR service from Silicon Dust. The HD Homerun can be used for a nice open source DVR using Jellfin, however you still need to purchase an outside EPG subscription for $35 a year from Schedules Direct.
I dont think its silicon dusts fault. I think its the atsc 3 people not giving silicondust any direction or rules on how to be compiant @@tomgeriak3757
Tablo doesn't work if Internet is down, can't watch recorded shows or live tv, have to disconnect antenna and connect directly to tv. Signal has to be perfect otherwise Tablo will crash and recording will fail. Even when signal is perfect it can randomly fail transcode after several hours. It has gotten better with latest update but not as reliable as built in tv tuner
If you have the Internet coming into your home, is that considered “cutting the cable”, because you still have a “cable” coming into your home. You’re just not paying for the “cable TV” portion from that same company.
I have no interest in 3.0. I live in a rural area and have a Tablo and I we have translators. It will be years until we get 3.0 out here. I don't see this happening in 2027. They will lose a lot of viewers. People are moving more and more to streaming. Most of the TV shows can be found streaming and local news streams anyway for free. Many people are moving to "On Demand", where traditional live TV is less important. Also pay OTA has never worked out. In fact there was a service launched in Boise ID when 3.0 got started, only to fail in a few months. If the broadcasters want to lose their 20% or more they have from viewers now, DRM will do that. Plus 3.0 is too complicated, with an internet connection and all. The public will not be interested. If all of the TV sets have 3.0 in years to come and DRM goes away, the audience will be there. But this not going to work as it stands.
Onn is just a Google TV box (with licensed software). It does not have an OTA ATSC 3.0 tuner. The only Android Box with an ATSC 3.0 DRM tuner and recording capabilities is GTMedia X1. Zapper Box is based on Android but does not allow you to load and use Android APKs (apps) other than RUclips.
I barely watch broadcast tv now anyways. If they force me to pay for it, I will stop watching any of it. I am not going to pay to watch tv. They already have so many commercials that I can barely stand them, and then to have to pay for the privilege of watching their commercials is a bridge too far for me.
That did not work for the NTSC standard. We were forced by the Government to switch over so they could sell off our airwaves to private cell phone companies.
I’ve let the FCC know my feelings on DRM and the reasons why it doesn’t make sense for anyone. Let free options stay free. DRM isn’t going to fix the issue of people ditching cable nor is it going to entice people to go out and buy a new tuner to watch what was once free. ATSC 3 has a lot of perks, broadcasters should focus on other revenue streams and leave the OTA signal be.
Instead of barking up the FCC tree it might be more effective to go to the networks the local broadcasters are affiliated with. They have a huge financial interest in their programming being seen by the largest audience possible and encryption and higher transmission fees jeopardizes this. What would happen to the stations if they suddenly were told cease the encryption or we will walk away from our affiliation and you don't get to air our programming anymore? That's a pretty powerful amount of leverage. ABC, NBC, Fox, and CBS have FAST or streaming partners they could immediately broadcast their feeds to at the flip of a switch.
@LonSeidman which is stupid. It makes zero financial sense. In fact its like taking money putting it in a shredder and then lighting the remains on fire.
@@briandonegan8480 from their perspective the only revenue worth protecting are the subscriber fees. It's a terrible business model but that's what they've hitched their wagons to.
I’m having a little trouble understanding this, Lon. The public has spoken out loud and clear that they wanted a business man to run the country. A businessman is going to do what’s good for business, not an individual member of the public. How can you have it both ways: wanting a businessman to run the country but then carve out a niche for individuals who want multiscreen TV watching? Shouldn’t you stop fighting as it has already been litigated on election day? It’s time for us all to fly huge flags from our pickups and leave these issues to someone who’s knows what’s better for us than we do.
ERRATA: at 3:58 I incorrectly stated that DVR fees can be $35-$40 per month, it's actually PER YEAR.
I combined my Plex Pass with my HD Homerun for DVR to my Plex Server - not the most "elegant" solution but aside from the investment in the Plex Server and one time Plex Pass lifetime it's worth it for the locals...
Had the Tablo for years. Once I got the antenna sorted out it worked great. No cost to recording channels.
Thank you for another great video Lon, you do a great service for many, many people.
Thank you my lord
We have always used OTA TV as we are in a fairly rural area. I was excited about getting an HDHomerun system to watch TV on our computers and excited about the technical improvements of ATSC 3.0. As you mentioned ATSC 3.0 rollout has been pretty much derailed due to broadcasters decision to use DRM to encrypt their programs. Until this gets resolved we plan on sitting on the sidelines.
You are the king of OTA digital television information 😂
Thank you for educating me about DRM and ATSC 3. I have submitted my concerns to the FCC. I cut the cord around 7 years ago and can scan around 100 channels in my suburban Chicagoland area of which there are around 50 good channels. More than I could ever watch.
Always appreciate your channel. You got me started with my HD Homerun and Plex. Thanks
The latest Tablo TV update has made it so much more reliable.
Not for the Roku users among us. Some sort of glitch between Roku's update and Tablo has made many channels unwatchable.
That’s good to know but I doubt I will try it again. It was horrible when I tried it a year ago or so.
I run the Tablo TV app in my Windows 11 PC with an Android emulator. It works really well.
Me too
Love my HDHomeRun Flex 4k!
I love my HDHomeRun. Been using it for close to 10 years now with zero issues. My SIL uses my Plex server and the HDHomeRun, all the way in California, to tune into the Detroit Lions when they are playing. Its pretty cool to think she's using my antenna up in the attic.
Encrypting hd antenna transmissions will just push people to pirated iptv
Those days are over with newer encryption. Not like the bootloader days of direct TV.
Thanks For This Information. 😀👍
I bought the 4th Gen Tablo when it first came out, and have been happy with it. I'm reluctant to spend the money on any ATSC 3.0 equipment for now. I'm taking a 'wait and see" attitude about the whole thing, and I know I'll be good with what i've got for the next couple of years.
Another great video. Yeah, DRM encryption blows, but I have heard, do the very limited tuner manufacturers it may not be going through. As you know, it all started with LG discontinuing the ATSE 3 tuner installation in the TV due to the DRM encryption lawsuit. I believe the other makers are following suit. With a very limited product available for the ATSE 3 tuners, it could, I hope, be scraped. You have more of an ear on the subject than I.
I think ATSC 1.0 will broadcast past 2027. Could pickup the tablo cheap during Black Friday. I bought it for my mom however I have been running HDHomeRun for years.
I got my first SEARS BETA VCR in 1978 and taped every second of Beta Tapes, then I got VHS, then over the air VHS/DVD Recorder VCR, Which I converted my tapes to DVD's. I would get Cable for 2 years record every show I could, then get rid of it for 3 years, then get it again for 2 more years, etc....Then added a tuner to my laptop and recorded 1000's of shows on my laptop. I have converted all of these files to digital files. Looking at how ATSC 3.0 is shaping up, I am glad I did.
I Think I Have Had My HD Home Run Sense 2016-2018 & Still Going Strong !
Yes. Silicondust charges me ~35 per year for TV listings service for my HDHomerun device. I don't mind paying it at all if it helps keep the service running indefinitely and covers development costs of the occassional software and/or firmware update.
Here in Canada I axed the cable 6yrs ago. In this apartment I get a whopping 3 channels 2 of which their reception is sporadic. Good thing I only watch OTA tv for the nightly news.
The RCA AT705 sold at Home Depot is a good roof antenna for up to 40 miles
I have Tablo I use it on my I pad 11 inch pro love it
LonBall is giving away 100 Sony QD oleds but cutting the power cords. It still has some value if you simply fix the cord.
It must be great to live in a place where AM, FM and TV stations are available. I'm in a shadowed signal area without FM or TV and live next to an AM transmitter. We are 90 minutes and 20 miles away from any TV stations. It is weird to live near a major city without any local broadcast media stations.
The success of DRM would eventually open up the entirety of the TV bandwidth to commercial data services, with OTA going away entirely. Entire swathes of radio spectrum have disappeared in the past for similar reasons.
@LonSeidman
Does the HDHome run have to use Ethernet or Can it just receive WiFi? Also what does it cost per year for the Grid programming and do you need it?
Thank you very much
You should use grounding devices on tv antennas to protect you from lightning strikes.
Thanks for a cord cutter bit. Tablo gen 1 stopped working after 5 years, It worked very well. HD Homerun stopped after 18 months. It was better than the Tablo, but died
Did you send it in for repair? I think they have a two year warranty. My prime from 2013 is still cranking away after 11 years! Never been turned off!
I’m using and HDHomerun Quattro with Plex to watch and record shows.
I have one HDHomerun 4 tuner and three Tablo's, HDHomerun is a more basic interface but very reliable, the Tablo is being updated regularly and a fancier interface but has a number of quirks and minor problem's that can be irritating. In my area there are several ATSC 3.0 stations with some using DRM which HDHomerun is not able to decode and some more that do not use DRM.
I would like to start a project similar to Mr. Rogers where I make videos mocking society for artistic pleasure. Just found a nice Midi keyboard at Goodwill for $15 so I can make the total budget 30 dollars by mixing Pepsi and Milk. You'll see soon enough, but I love the content Lon, and we will keep fighting the good fight!
A couple of Athlons and Durons may have passed on in the process but we will keep chugging along!
Because it's not about processors or graphics cards in play. It's about a strange concoction we'll mix today.
What if someone in Miami and someone in New York wanted to share their local OTA feeds with each other, using a VPN or some other point-to-point tunnel? They each have one of these boxes and the other person connects to it and the guy in New York can stream OTA from Miami and vice versa?
Thanks for helping clear up confusion. TV makers aren't very informative about what they're selling. They'll boast about their top couple of features like 4K and streaming support, but don't say enough about what else they support. They may tell you no more than there's an antenna connector (if the even tell you that much). Not whether it supports NTSC, ATSC 1.0, ATSC 3.0, and not if that includes DRM. I still don't know if Nextgen support implies DRM support too or not. I still have old equipment (Computer and games, VCR, DVD player, etc.) that may need to use the older standards, but all TV makers care about is boasting about the newest features. I only know LG isn't supporting ATSC 3.0 because you told me so. If not careful, I could easily be unpleasantly surprised if I buy a TV and find out it doesn't support all the standards I want.
I am confused. These broadcasters use the open public airwaves to broadcast their signals. Then charge people for using the signals. It’s like a private bus company uses the existing bus stops for their buses to pick up and drop off their customers , but they don’t pay for using the spaces.
Am not sure how different TV signals are but am in the UK I have a single TV aerial input in my lounge and using a 4 way powered TV signal booster and running over cat6 through my house I now have 4 rooms able to watch HD UK freeview/OTA on regular TVs (not locked so that each TV has to watch the same channel). Need to use Female to RJ45 Male Coaxial Coax Barrel Coupler at both ends to convert from RF to Rj45 and back again at the the TV end (along with some other simple adapters (everything cheap as chips - think I paid all in less than £50) and also passing throught my patch panel. No apps, no PCs/Mac - just normal TV in rooms I would not be able to run a regualr coax to from the aerial.
I think you forgot to mention one thing, that most TV's have built-in tuners and don't need any of the devices mentioned in this video to watch TV, only if you want to record TV. BTW, I've owned 3 HDHomeRuns over the years and they are exceptional units with every new model an improvement on an already good unit. I give away my old units and make new converts to the HDHomeRuns.
One thing I keep asking reviewers who run test TVs to judge performance is to test tuners. I"m old enough to remember reviews that always tested turners because they were a major selling point. Nowadays I can't point to one magazine or channel that tests tuners for the numbers of channels they bring in, the quality and the speed of the built-in TV guides. I've had two Samsungs that had good tuners but the TV channel listings were S L O W. I've written Rtings twice about it.
This video was about gateway devices :)
@@LonSeidman I understand that. What I'm saying is that some people watching this video would think that to watch free OTA tv they need to buy one of the boxes mentioned. Do you remember those commercials for some 'special device' that attaches to your tv to get free TV and only costs $30-$40? You and I know that anyone could go buy one of equal or better quality for a fraction of those prices. I'm saying that some people watching this video would think similarly. Usually you are very detailed in your videos and while watching this I totally expected a word or two about the built in OTA reception abilities of most TV's. This video is primarily about the boxes but secondarily about people's ability to watch OTA tv. Adding a word or two about built-in tv tuners would make it clearer for some people who aren't tech savvy. I'm in my 70's and for a few years used to write about tech, mostly photographic gear, software, computers, etc. and it's amazing that many people today are ignorant that their tv's have a tuner built in thinking they need a little satellite dish on their roofs or pay for Internet service just to watch what their shows. It used to be every TV came with some sort of antenna. Nowadays people would have to read the manual to know this, and how many people bother to open a manual anymore?
I just thought taking a moment to mention built-in tuners would be a part of your usual thoroughness in covering a subject. Especially when you also talked about ATSC 1.0 and 3.0 reception but connected that to the boxes, ignoring the built-in tuners. I've written to Rtings a couple of times now about their lack of even mentioning the tuner performance of the tv's they review.
@@greatpix Yes, my TV does have a tuner, but I desire a gateway tuner device like these so I can use an external device such as an AppleTV and have a clean operating system and interface and stay out of the TV system and all of the advertisements and complexity. This allows me to use the TV as a monitor and remain super simple.
I have both, the HDHomerun and Tablo. Hands down, I am a HDHomerun fan. I thought I'd get a Table so I wouldn't have to pay for the option of recording, however, Tablo formats the USB drive in such a way that you can not take it off and watch what you recorded on your laptop or computer. Deal breaker for me. Plus, if my vpn is on I have issues connecting. Now HDHomerun I have is a dual tuner with USB port. For $35/yr that allows me to record and then I can take my usb and watch where ever and whenever I want. Otherwise, both give a good picture. Table does give you the additional internet channels too. HDHomerun only shows what your antenna gives.
User of Tablo Gen 4 since September. Even though this product is 2 year old, I would consider the client apps as beta software. Lot's of bugs and inconsistent UX across the apps. No Windows app and no web browser support. Unfortunately they are about the only player in this space.
I’m considering adding an OTA antenna. Local company quoted me $875 for install, Channel master pro and connection for two TV’s. Fair price?
The HDHomerun has a lot of potential, but I’ve had numerous problems with this. First is getting ghosted by customer support. Secondly, the audio for the Nextgen channels does not work unless you have a Roku Ultra. Do not buy the Ultra LTE version from Walmart; it will not work. Will also not work with lesser Roku models. Also, the channels that are encrypted are not supported on the HD home run. This is a complete opposite of the Zapperbox. One more thing - the internet connection it needs isn’t wireless.
The one benefit this has over the Zapperbox that you have one tuner and one antenna that you can place anywhere and have over the air television on every TV in your house that has a Roku or a Firestick. I keep mine behind the bed in the upper floor bedroom with an amplified Channel Master flat panel antenna in the window facing most of the towers.
I feel what is happening to our area is they are just limiting the broadcast strength in general before DRM can even be implemented. I'm only able to get a Good signal with ABC, and no indoor antenna has worked for me so far.
I'm a long time OTA user (never-cable). We have a TV with PIP. We love PIP. Do any of these Gateway devices have a PIP capability?
The HDHomeRun is no good if you are in an area where channels are on the cusp. I have several channels where the signal isn't great, and the HDHomeRun missed them completely. It also has no way to manually add them back in. So, I ended up returning it and sticking with my TiVo Bolt. Also, while it detected ATSC 3 channels, they were audio only, I wasn't able to watch any of them due to the DRM.
Why not just use the antenna and skip the device? Is the box just for A to D conversion? Last time I used an antenna in a larger city, there were only one or two OTA channels available.
If your TV has a tuner built in you don't need the box but you do need to run antenna connections to each. You don't get DVR and in-home streaming without the box.
Trying to do the "fcc instructions" and its not recognizing "16-142" or the other text that was supposed to come up? any idea?
Do you have an ad blocker enabled? When you type it in it should automatically pull up the record.
@@LonSeidman No active blocker I'm aware of, should I try a different browser?
DRM Encryption could be dangerous, simply because in case of Emergency's like natural disasters ( Hurricane etc ) , you could not receive updates on the upcoming situation
Curioua why AirTV 2 was not in your thumbnail. Any reason not consider AirTV in this list of devices?
I was not aware of that product.
❤❤❤
Anything I can do with all this exvinity carb?
Yeah I was on board with the zapper box until I saw it was $300
HD Homerun doesnt have a reset button and couldnt find a way to reset on the app
any of these options for dvb-t receiving??? (eu's tv standard).
@@yannisgk HD Homerun sell a version that works in Europe. I have been using a 4 tuner box in the UK for years and it has been rock solid.
@@davewhite7182 thanks!!!
Lon, I'm watching local TV on tablo windows app.
Didn't we go through this 'over the air' incription many years ago? I thought there was such hell raised for the elderly community that couln't afford cable TV that they eventually backed off and free'd up their signals again.
12 Reasons why OTA DRM ATSC 3.0 TV will fail. Just say NO to (DRM). Tell your USA Government about the Hostile Takeover of (OTA DRM ATSC 3.0 NEXTGEN-TV) issues listed below.
DRM (Digital Rights Management) Encrypted TV Station's signals. Why?
Some 3.0 tuners at this time require you stay on the internet to decode DRM 3.0 TV Stations. Why?
3.0 Currently no 4K and you only get the Simulcasted main channel and no sub channels.
Channel Crawling = super slow channel changing (DRM 5 + seconds slow).
No sound because of Dolby AC4 audio codec does not have a legal open source license to decode legally on many devices.
Some 3.0 tuners have Out of sync audio to video problems.
Private Home Networked OTA antenna tuner boxes like (Tablo TV box) can not get official certified approval for DRM ATSC 3.0 NEXTGEN-TV. Why?
You may need non OTA home pay internet for updates and to unlock DRM encrypted ATSC 3.0 tv channels.
Possible DRM restrictions on DRM ATSC 3.0 recordings and no viewing anywhere on any device with no sound.
Emergency alert messages can not be received if DRM is blocking them.
OTA DRM ATSC 3.0 TV will fail because the FCC is not going to turn off ATSC 1.0 TV stations for many years if not enough people buy 3.0 TVs and 3.0 boxes.
No one has solve the problem of no government money for free DRM 3.0 TV tuner boxes because 1.0 TV turners and recorders will not work after that TV Station switches to 3.0 TV broadcasts.
(Range and signal error correction) OR (more sub channels and near 4k picture) trade off problem.
FCC is not forcing any 1.0 TV Stations to move over to 3.0 TV. So some TV stations will be on 1.0 and others will be on DRM 3.0.
The FCC is only allowing OTA Simulcasts of the ATSC 1.0 main channel at this time on DRM ATSC 3.0 NEXTGEN-TV.
DRM ATSC 3.0 is a not finished product and is a work in progress mix of unproven ideas that has never gotten full FCC approval at this time.
Software updates for 3.0 tuner boxes may be needed for changes made to the unfinished and future added new official ATSC 3.0 standards modules.
Patent License problems. LG no longer sells TVs with ATSC 3.0 tuners.
Some 3.0 TV tuners companies may go out of business or stop updates leaving you with no DRM or software updates.
OTA ATSC 3.0 is better but is not perfect and still can be affected by weak tv signals: (distance, weather, planes, trees, buildings, trucks, poor antenna, etc).
FCC rules that 5 percent of old ATSC 1.0 coverage area does not need to be covered anymore = (SHORTER RANGE).
Viewing zone outside of your 15 minute city or town could be blocked.
Your TV viewing habits could be tracked by your serial number or IP address.
ATSC 3.0 is updatable until it is not updatable without new hardware tuners (ATSC 4.0, 5.0, 6.0, 7.0......).
Some of these 3.0 TV issues may be fixed over time.
This is only some of the mess with DRM ATSC 3.0 TV.
This is my opinion why DRM ATSC 3.0 TV will fail.
IMO. Stay on OTA 1.0 TV until DRM is removed from OTA ATSC 3.0 by law.
It is the people versus the hostile takeover by private DRM 3.0 TV stations for control over the USA public airwaves.
IMO 2024..
Tell me what part of the above that the incoming administration could care less about.
Trump's appointee for the FCC has said that he supports DRM. We really messed up during the election. 😢
@@rickygonzalez2519 Then if DRM becomes a reality, you can say goodbye to OTA TV and people will not pay for OTA TV.
Maybe that is what the broadcaster wants. It is expensive to keep a transmitter site going.
@@patrickmartin4996 no doubt it will be sad😢
Were you a fan of the Amazon DVR box from a few years ago? I have one (don’t use it anymore) and it was pretty cool. With the DVR built in and all the channel listings. It is still viable? Could I hook it back up?
It should still work! I never got one due to the difficulties with ATSC 1.0 in my area.
Unfortunately, I am in a rural area more than 60 miles from any tower.. Any options for me?
Amplified antenna
antenna man says 1.0 will be around at least 5- 7 years people will not be ready in 2 years i agree
5:20 Lon for scale.
I’m very tiny :)
But I can still plugged an antenna straight to my TV and watch OTA channels, correct? Or will DRM take that away?
Yes but once the ATSC 1 channels are turned off you’ll need an ATSC 3 compatible tuner
Don't you need an internet connection to decode DRM?
Which of these devices is best for streaming outside the home? And can this be done without running a VPN through my router? I have Nord installed on my phone but don’t believe I can install it on my ATT router.
You can do it with Plex and an HDHomerun. This is another thing that will be restricted by ATSC 3 DRM.
@ Plex combined with the HDHomerun won’t require a VPN? I’ll sign the petition, btw.
Plex live TV streaming works like hot garbage though. Channelsvr does a much better job of it.
You can use Plex+ subscription or Jellyfin for free to stream a HD Homerun outside the home (only ATSC 1.0).
The FCC should support their own Locast app! Remember Locast ? This would solve a lot of the hassle with adding an antenna etc etc
I want this for my mom but where she lives, she's surrounded by mountains so those indoor antennas wont do it. I havent tried the larger indoor antennas... Has anyone here tried them?Ive tried basic leaf antenna's which work great where I live but not in her area :(
I filed.
Any chance for PCI cards or USB tuners like the existing Hauppauge QuadHD coming along for ATSC 3? All of my media is on my server, recorded TV included. If they're on the verge of allowing external gateway devices, surely internal or USB tuners are soon to follow, right?
Unfortunately Hauppauge does not support ATSC 3.0 on any product they sell. The only gateway device with ATSC 3.0 is HD Homerun Quad 4k, however this device does not support DRM (as it looks it never will) and you can not record ATSC 3.0 AC-4 sound without paying for that DVR service from Silicon Dust. The HD Homerun can be used for a nice open source DVR using Jellfin, however you still need to purchase an outside EPG subscription for $35 a year from Schedules Direct.
I dont think its silicon dusts fault. I think its the atsc 3 people not giving silicondust any direction or rules on how to be compiant @@tomgeriak3757
I want a RPi HAT for North American OtA TV.
Not only FCC, Contact your Congressman.
Why wouldnt you just use an antenna? and an old computer for a DVR.
For multiroom / multi device these solutions are better IMHO.
But you MUST have internet to view anything on your tv!
The Hdhomerun ATSC 3.0 gives me 4 tuners for ATSC 1.0 or 2 for ATSC 3.0 and 2 for ATSC 1.0.
Tablo doesn't work if Internet is down, can't watch recorded shows or live tv, have to disconnect antenna and connect directly to tv. Signal has to be perfect otherwise Tablo will crash and recording will fail. Even when signal is perfect it can randomly fail transcode after several hours. It has gotten better with latest update but not as reliable as built in tv tuner
I really like my hdhomerun. I use it as a dvr as well.i wish there was a solution for the atsc 3 encryption.
If you have the Internet coming into your home, is that considered “cutting the cable”, because you still have a “cable” coming into your home. You’re just not paying for the “cable TV” portion from that same company.
Delete this. 👎
No DRM. No deal. No way. Ever !
Trump's appointee to the FCC approves of DRM. We really messed up during the election.
I have no interest in 3.0. I live in a rural area and have a Tablo and I we have translators. It will be years until we get 3.0 out here. I don't see this happening in 2027. They will lose a lot of viewers. People are moving more and more to streaming. Most of the TV shows can be found streaming and local news streams anyway for free. Many people are moving to "On Demand", where traditional live TV is less important. Also pay OTA has never worked out. In fact there was a service launched in Boise ID when 3.0 got started, only to fail in a few months. If the broadcasters want to lose their 20% or more they have from viewers now, DRM will do that. Plus 3.0 is too complicated, with an internet connection and all. The public will not be interested. If all of the TV sets have 3.0 in years to come and DRM goes away, the audience will be there. But this not going to work as it stands.
Someone make a combo ATSC3.0/AndroidTV box. Onn maybe?
Onn is just a Google TV box (with licensed software). It does not have an OTA ATSC 3.0 tuner. The only Android Box with an ATSC 3.0 DRM tuner and recording capabilities is GTMedia X1. Zapper Box is based on Android but does not allow you to load and use Android APKs (apps) other than RUclips.
I barely watch broadcast tv now anyways. If they force me to pay for it, I will stop watching any of it. I am not going to pay to watch tv. They already have so many commercials that I can barely stand them, and then to have to pay for the privilege of watching their commercials is a bridge too far for me.
I tell you what, though- I have MORE LUCK with my ancient Hauppuage PCI tuner cards than with a Homerun..
They are not “their signals”.
Don't buy the 3.0 boxes and force companies to keep 1.0 standard.
That did not work for the NTSC standard. We were forced by the Government to switch over so they could sell off our airwaves to private cell phone companies.
I’ve let the FCC know my feelings on DRM and the reasons why it doesn’t make sense for anyone. Let free options stay free. DRM isn’t going to fix the issue of people ditching cable nor is it going to entice people to go out and buy a new tuner to watch what was once free. ATSC 3 has a lot of perks, broadcasters should focus on other revenue streams and leave the OTA signal be.
They aren’t trying to prevent cable cord cutting, they are afraid of the next Locast
They won the court case against locast and enjoy many taxpayer funded legal protections to prevent future ones.
Instead of barking up the FCC tree it might be more effective to go to the networks the local broadcasters are affiliated with. They have a huge financial interest in their programming being seen by the largest audience possible and encryption and higher transmission fees jeopardizes this.
What would happen to the stations if they suddenly were told cease the encryption or we will walk away from our affiliation and you don't get to air our programming anymore? That's a pretty powerful amount of leverage. ABC, NBC, Fox, and CBS have FAST or streaming partners they could immediately broadcast their feeds to at the flip of a switch.
The problem is that the network owners, like NBC, were among the first to encrypt their locally owned stations.
@LonSeidman which is stupid. It makes zero financial sense. In fact its like taking money putting it in a shredder and then lighting the remains on fire.
@@briandonegan8480 from their perspective the only revenue worth protecting are the subscriber fees. It's a terrible business model but that's what they've hitched their wagons to.
I’m having a little trouble understanding this, Lon. The public has spoken out loud and clear that they wanted a business man to run the country. A businessman is going to do what’s good for business, not an individual member of the public. How can you have it both ways: wanting a businessman to run the country but then carve out a niche for individuals who want multiscreen TV watching? Shouldn’t you stop fighting as it has already been litigated on election day? It’s time for us all to fly huge flags from our pickups and leave these issues to someone who’s knows what’s better for us than we do.
They can ALL go out of business I don't watch there crap programing!
Regular tv sux - who has time to wstch such foolishness?