Christians Visions of Heaven - Rick Joyner Heaven Testimony
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- Christians Visions of Heaven - Rick Joyner Heaven Testimony. We are going to take a look as Rick Joyner's heaven testimony from a Twitter post on August 5th 2024. Rick Joyner is the founder of Morningstar Ministries and the author of many best selling books including the Final Quest. Rick Joyner is best know for prophetic ministry and prophetic dreams as well. He was closely associated with Bob Jones who claimed to travel to heaven often. Bob Jones would teach on the subject of How to travel to heaven.
Can Christians travel to heaven? Rick Joyner certain thinks so because he claims he traveled to heaven a few times recently. Here is Rick Joyner heaven testimony posted on X: "I know many critical events are going on in the world, but I've been visiting heaven, where it seems no one is worried, so I'm not either. I have been getting what may be the most important revelation yet about what the Lord is doing, and is about to do".
I agree with Rick Joyner in that heaven in not worried about the shaking on earth. Gods authority over all is firmly established and he is not concerned with the shakings. Christians visions of heaven do happen. The Apostle Paul did visit the third heavens in 2 Corinthians 12. And Joel 2 states that in the end times people would have visions and dreams. However i do have a problem with people claiming to travel to heaven often. People in the Bible did have supernatural experiences. But they did not happen often. I do not believe the church should try to teach people how to travel to heaven either. People like Kat Kerr, Bob Jones and Todd Bentley have often tried to teach people to travel to heaven. This is a very dangerous for many reasons. God is real and supernatural happened often in scripture. But the devil is real and he can mimic these things as well. We are to test supernatural revelation. We are to test the spirits. This is to discern what is coming from the Lord and what is coming from the Devil. We should test these things within the church community and let the elders judge these things
#christiannews #heaven #rickjoyner
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Torn Curtain promises to bring you the best and latest Christian content. We follow dozens of ministries and are going to bring you the best content as we come across it. Torn Curtain is a Christian You Tube Channel which main focus is Christianity and Jesus. I am hoping this ministry will help bring: Reformation, Revival and Renewal. I am calling for a WORD and SPIRIT church. I am going to go after the tough and controversial subjects. Many might interpret this is being divisive but my heart is to see the church of Christ be everything it can be! Torn Curtain is a registered 501 (c) 3 Corporation
As a former staff member of MorningStar Ministries, I can say this is Rick's favorite card to pull out whenever he thinks he is not getting enough attention. Seen it used many times, can't say that I have ever seen anything good come out of it. I will say this however to all the people out there who still want to support the man. I was a part of Morningstar for 15 years, I was in MFM, and MST, and a supervisor for 4 of it and even made it into the Journal once. Tossed all his books in the trash when I left. What you need to ask yourself is where are all the former "big names" that came out of this and are they still connected to it. They are not, some ran as far away as they could get.
@BreadstonePublishing thank you for adding this first hand information so people can understand that I'm not trying to slander Rick but I have some serious concerns. We should stick to the basics like bible, snd prayer. The Holy Spirit still moves in power. But God is not a vending machine to be used
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone I completely agree, I am still Charismatic, that will not change. I just fully believe that the time is coming that wise men need to be gathered to re-plant this expression of Christianity in GOOD soil. I see the Lord taking down the old guard everywhere, so I know the time is around the corner.
To me, the Knights of Malta membership is most troubling. Most troubling.
Morningstar website has a whole statement about this. I read it and became more confused 😕 not sure what to think but hundreds of people contacted me and are deeply concerned about that
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone yes. I have also heard what he had to say...and the justification for his membership... Imo it's doublespeak. There is no justification for a believer to belong to this group. Nor is it wise for an intelligent non believer to do so. Lol. I think it's a matter of ..the membership became public knowledge, now it's time for damage control.
I went to many many conferences there. God honored my hunger. I learned so much despite the many matters of concern that have surfaced. Blessings :)
@@maryward2315
If they belong to that group, then they are not a believer. Period.
They are deceiver.
@@maryward2315 I think if you look into Dominionistic beliefs and how they literally will take over the earth and stop anyone who gets in their way. I learned a great deal looking up The Latter Day movement that Rick has been greatly involved with Paul Cain and the doctrine in that movement and The Manifest Son's of God and postmillennialists.
“And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.”
John 3:13
Paul Isiah enoch ? oh, yeah John in revelation ?
@@patrickshore5859 Good points, but then how do you make sense of the above quoted verse from John (3:13)? Jesus says this to Nicodemus well after Moses, Isaiah, etc.
If I remember correctly, interpreters say the prophets saw into heaven, but did not ascend up to it. They saw it, but they weren't actually there.
@@yankeegonesouth4973 how did those interpreters come to that conclusion? Or are you just taking their word for it?
@@marvinjohn25 We all have to interpret. I don't put the same weight on the interpretation as scripture itself. If you can relate 'going to heaven' testimonies to John 3:13, perhaps it's that they occur outside the body. Like I said, it's a matter of interpretation, but our interpretation should not contradict scripture. Paul in 2 Cor 12 appears to leave it as a mystery.
Tks😄yep.. it’s sure gotten wierd out there. Everyone saying they got the truth.
I’ll just stick with the word of God🙏✝️🇨🇦
Stick with the Bible folks
Rick Joyner started his “business” in my hometown in 1982. He was a pilot. He’s not a prophet, he’s a conman. The same way William Branham saw “egg shaped” cars. They were at the World’s Fair. I have nothing against him as a human being. I am incredibly jealous of God’s Word and when someone is taking God’s name in vain-using it to confuse and deceive (intentionally or not) it MUST be called out.
Thank you for sharing this as someone who is familiar with him
Do you think he is making these visions up?
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone I am going to simply put it this way- he’s a pilot. I live in the same county I have always lived and I’ve heard these stories more times than I would like to. I do not know this man nor do I know his heart, having said that, I wouldn’t believe a word he says if he isnt reading scripture verbatim.
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone I’m also not trying to be hateful. I grew up listening to this kind of nonsense. It wasn’t until 2009 that I actually heard the true Gospel by God’s Grace and was granted repentance. I will take nothing beyond Scripture. No, I do not trust this man any more than I would have Bob Jones. Period.
Sadly many lost sheep are following these ppl like Robin Bullock, Kat Kirr , Chris Reed ect ect & to be honest, we need to Pray these ppl must REPENT 🙌✝️🎶🔥🔥I have very vivid dreams , good & bad??? Dreams can just be a dumping ground of our subconscious!@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone
I personally knew the late Harry Bizzel, the spiritual father of Rick Joyner. Rick followed Harry from the Charlotte area to Moravian Falls against his wishes. While spending a few days with the Bizzels at Apple Hill Christian Retreat (which he built), Moravian Falls, Harry told Gary Rich and I that he had just read the manuscript of Rick's newest book, The Final Quest. He said he told Rick, "I never liked your books. But I have to say, this is the worst garbage I have ever read."
Rick still printed his book, which would go on to become the trilogy flagship of his ministry. I have only read one other book, Jesse Penn-Lewis' book, War on the Saints, that is possibly more damaging to the Body of Christ than The Quest. In it, he has to the nerve, gall, and delusion that Paul and others came to him in heaven and said their ministries were failures and he would go on to do what they could not.
Every day I stand in the presence and fear of God knowing that I will have to give an account to the Judge on that Day. I cannot understand why so many Christians so easily depart from God's Holy Word and buy into this nonsense. This is not slinging mud. It's just that I put God's Holy Word, found in the Bible, FAR, FAR ABOVE any and all extrabiblical writings, visions, dreams, prophesies, ect. And we are to know those who labor among us (1 Thess 5:12).
LOVED "This is not slinging mud. It's just that I put God's Holy Word, found in the Bible, FAR, FAR ABOVE any and all extrabiblical writings, visions, dreams, prophesies, ect. And we are to know those who labor among us (1 Thess 5:12)."
Thank you for adding the extra history. This will be helpful to many people to have a better idea of Rick's ministry
Our people are not grounded in the basic doctrines of the Bible. There's no teaching of sound doctrine in pentecostal and charismatic assemblies. The Holy Spirit will guide us into All the Truth.
@@user-rv2dc5lp6e Yeah, you’re clearly a Bible worshipper. Pray more, worship God in spirit and truth. Become a true worshipper of God. Bible worshippers don’t make disciples, but worshippers of God do make disciples.
@@estherj.tolbert8854 Bible worshipper? A true worshipper of God? Let me ask you, have YOU experienced over 100 objective miracles like I read about in my bible (witnesses, places, times, dates, ect)? Or do you serve a subjective God who merely gives you goose bumps and good psychology to get you through the day?
RICK JOYNER, he said in one of his books that , paraphrased, taking the mark of the beast wouldn't send anyone to hell. I cringed when I found this out. Father has had me read several books by various authors to show me how sutble some of them twist the Truth.
Pray for DESERNMENT & PROTECT YOUR SALVATION.
BLESSINGS TO YOU.
Good word as always Joshua. As you know I spent a lot of time pre-1988 counseling Bob Jones and others. Bob was constantly telling our team that was trying to help him about his visits to the second heavens, a place for the principalities and powers of darkness dwell. At that time BOB never claimed to have been in the third heaven but only the second. I would tell BOB he is spending too much time there and it is costing him his relationship with Jesus. That it would end up destroying him and served no earthly good.
What do you make of Bob Jones claims. Do you think he had some legitimate experiences. Was he communicating with demons?
BOB JONES IS ANOTHER FALSE ONE TOO. GO digging, and you'll find his past is very ugly. Again, sex reared it's ugly head. The closets are bulging with horrific, despicable information that people are not aware of.
PLEASE PRAY FOR DESERNMENT AND FATHER WILL FREELY GIVE IT TO YOU. STAND FIRM IN HOLINESS, HONESTY AND TRUTH.
YOUR SALVATION DEPENDS ON IT. TIME IS SHORT.
On judgement day there will be many that knew the bible but didn't know the Lord. He will say depart from me I never knew you. They knew the things of God but not the God of all things. You might want to get to know Him. Spend time with Him. He loves you even when your wrong. We are all wrong about something. The Holy Spirit was sent to be our comforter and our teacher. Those that can't hear Him follow people instead. Give up your life and follow Him.
Hey Josh, I know you called it hyper spiritual but it’s actually called esoteric or Gnosticism. It’s occultish. I burned the books that I purchased from him many years ago.
I understand my friend. Can you explain that for others? It would be really helpful!
👍👍👍👍👍
Great job,kind and respectful done ✅✅✅✅✅
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimonehe'll get there 🎉🎉🎉
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone
Gnosticism is the belief in personal spiritual knowledge (a gnostic). And Josh I appreciate this video as I see you take your stance as that this video is redemptive 1 John 2 you will see that John is not anti-gnostic, nor is he anti-schismatic, John‘s aim is redemptive not reactionary. Even the first century apostles dealt with Gnosticism, people that thought they would receive a special knowledge above what everyone else would receive, consider John the apostle calls himself an elder (The end of the first century apostles).
Esoteric is an adjective that describes something that is only understood or intended for a select few people who have special knowledge or interest in a particular subject. This term is often used to refer to concepts or ideas that are advanced or complex, and are not easily accessible to everyone.
Now ask yourself, where does this power come from? James 3:15 “This wisdom descended, not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.”
Jude 1:19 “These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the spirit.”
I noticed in his books and in his messages he is a revolutionist. He is like Barabbas one that wants to start a revolution as the means for the church to be free and we know that is not biblical. This is how we know we are at the end. PEACE
Josh, this is one of your best and most important videos. You struck a perfect balance. You affirmed the value of supernatural experiences and encounters grounded in scriptural truth, on the one hand, and gave a prudent admonition to test the spirits on the other. I share your deep concern that a number of purported supernatural occurrences being touted by prominent ministries today are not authentically of God.
I used to follow Rick Joyner, and I really found The Final Quest valuable. I've read that book a number of times. That said, I recently discontinued following Rick Joyner The way that he, Chris, and others associated with Morning Star have handled the Mike Bickle exposure was so off the mark and so troubling that I no longer find the ministry credible or of any value.
The way Morningstar handled the Mike Bickle situation is when the red flags started going on for me. You find out who leaders really are while in crisis. I do feel that Chris was probably really trying to help. And Chris did at least apologize for the mistakes he made with ihopkc.
What a Great enjoyable video Brother. Joshua, I really Love hearing you teach God ‘s word, especially speaking on Apostle Paul. I mention him so much here my speller puts his name up now it’s nice to see lol. But I totally agree with everything you said here. I think you’re spot on here bro. Joshua God bless you my friend ☦️🛐🙏🙏 4 🫵🏼😌💯
Debroah I really appreciate you support. I keep you in my prayers 🙏
I heard Joyner preach many times in the 80's. I believed he was a Christian, however, that opinion has changed.
Thank you for sharing
One of the greatest books that i have ever read is Rick Joyner's book, "The Final Quest". Even, so, that does not mean that i agree with Rick Joyner on every doctrinal point. One such doctrine that I oppose is his view concerning the antichrist. He has stated in his books that the "man of sin" might be "the sin of man" rather than being a real person. I totally disagree with this doctrinal view. HOWEVER, when we disagree with one of God's servants we must still be careful about how we talk about them. God has not removed the Scripture, "Touch not My anounted and do My prophets no harm". And, i believe that Rick Joyner is a true prophet of God.
Concerning Heaven, I once had a dream in which a prophet said to me, "Some things can only be learned by being taken into Heaven.". I have not yet been taken into Heaven but i do believe in this extra Biblical experience. And, I believe that more Christians would be taken into Heaven if they could only believe.
My main point is this: let us be careful about how we speak about God's prophets. "The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom."
I agree with you 💯 %. My sentiments exactly. Thanks dear brother.
Brother, how do we know a person is a prophet of God? We must test prophecy. I have read several of Rick's books and I'm not sure that they have borne actual positive fruit in my life. Nevertheless, I think I will keep trying to discern whether it has. Blessings~
@jamesbranscomb855 what proof do you have that he truly represents Father God. One cannot partially represent, Father and spew out mistruths.
When Father brings things to your attention, it's for a reason.
You can accept what the truth is or continue to believe lies.
The choice is that persons.
Be blessed and protect your salvation. Let no man deceive
you....
I grew up Carsmatic church it’s a dream if I could ever find a church like that again it would be so wonderful. Think I will find video I read Rick’s books this man of God is truly Devine.
Praying you find a good church again!
Sorry honey. Rick is no more divine than you or I. He puts his pants on just like any other man. I have read some of his books and enjoyed them. But he is not God. That is the problem, people give these leaders too much idolizing and don't stop to consider that we are called to test their words, visions, etc. to the Word of God.
@@Susan-zk7neHe is a prophet I have read many of his books. Torn curtain compares Rick Joyner to Jim Jones not even a comparison. This is sickening what I’m hearing torn curtain say about Rick and more. I am amazed no fear of affending the Holy Spirit here ???
@@tricillagirl7915 lol that may be a bit of a stretch but prophets in the new testament function differently than in the old. We are to test or check out a word from a prophet and not just automatically believe that person. Its not offending to the Holy Spirit but He welcomes us to seek him for truth.
There are two (2) separate issues that people tend to often blur. One has to do with the credibility (or lack thereof) of the individual minister--whether he stands with integrity as one giving testimony. The other has to do with the legitimacy of the experiences and/or revelations that the individual claims to have experienced. These two really do need to be viewed independently.
There is a prophetic individual whom I currently respect as a dear brother, and I very much believe his heart is true toward God. At the same time, I heard him share a particular "angelic encounter" that he experienced that really made the bells and whistles go off for me. I discerned it to be inconsistent with the fear of the Lord, and a demonic counterfeit. Most alarming. It really gives me pause to ever hold close the caution you shared about the importance of testing the spirits . . . .and how Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.
Daryl i mentioned you in the video at 43:00. Thank you for taking the time to help me see the error in my views on divorce. You were right. I was wrong. I will make that adjustment moving forward. Iron sharpens Iron. I appreciate you brother!
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone Thanks for the public word of acknowledgment on that, Josh. I think your voice in this matter can be very freeing for many who have been abused, faced infidelity in a spouse, and suffered through horrible marriages while remaining true, themselves, to the LORD. God has a good remarriage for a number of these people, who have remained faithful in the fire--some of them for years.
The Bible says no one can see the face of God and live there's a few that seem to visit Jesus or Jesus visits them quiet often, The Bible also says in the end days sons and daughters will prophecy said nothing about visiting Heaven of Jesus coming down to visit anyone, I am charismatic also ,some things being taught are dangerous,Josh I enjoy you channel .Thanks
Thank you so much. Blessings to you 🙌
Can you imagine all his frequent flyer miles?
Rick was a commercial pilot too. He should try flying to heaven
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone a bit dicey trying to get through the firmament.
@@TroyStevens430 don't bring up the firmament. This gets charismatics going crazy. We will be here all night trying to explain it. Lol
it is clear, when Apostle Paul tells the story of his vision and revelation of heaven, which he humbly states in 3rd person, that even if one has a vision, he is not permitted to speak about it (2 Corinthians 12) Good point that was made about the sovereignty of God and that we have no reason to worry since the world is in His hand. HIS will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.
God bless you and all here
I am so thankful that someone is finally speaking out against this because l have been for awhile now with all these people claiming these things!! I also am charismatic but am in agreement with you!!
Thank you so much!
They are not Chrisians at all. They are misrepresenting Father God. I Sincerely wish people would stop calling them a CHRISTIAN..They are far worse than a sinner. A sinner doesn't know any better. One that was once a Christian, does know better. They better get right or get left behind, after the 7 year Tribulation.
Blessings 😊
Thx so much for sharing! I'm seeking God and His word to grow in wisdom and discernment. God BLESS!
You are so welcome
Interesting podcast, Joshua Simone.
Before I discuss Rick Joyner, I want to preface a few points. I am a charismatic who believes militantly that all the sign gifts are alive and well on Planet Earth. I believe the Lord wants everyone in the Body of Christ to speak in tongues. I believe there are many people who have visited heaven and/or hell. Some of them include Heidi Baker, Mary K. Baxter, Maurice Sklar, Randy Kay, Bill Wiese, and Bryan Melvin. Paul told us not to despise prophetic utterances, but to test everything and hold on to that which is good. The yardstick must be the 1611 KJV Bible. I am indignant against many of these so-called "discernment ministries" with their profile of faces of famous preachers whom they claim are incredibly evil hucksters. Many of these "heresy hunters" espouse the heresies of Cessationism and 5-point Calvinism.
With that being said, there are many problems with Rick Joyner. I have read several of his books, including "The Final Quest." A podcast I highly recommend looking at was put out several years ago by a lady who used to be involved in Morning Star. The podcast is entitled "Rick Joyner Exposed as Luciferian." In the first place, Christians should NEVER be involved in any form of freemasonry. Joyner is a member of the Knights of Malta. All professing 'Christians' who are involved in freemasonry, fraternities, or sororities and don't renounce those demonic ties will GO TO HELL! In that video, that lady relates how she had bad feelings when she got involved in Morning Star Ministries. She gave evidence of fraud concerning buildings that didn't even exist. She related how a nanny was at the house of the Joyners and saw some Luciferian regalia. She related the hypnotism at one of the Morning Star meetings where the Beatle's song, "Here Comes the Sun" was sung, and there was a very demonic statement made from the stage. She related how Bibles were not allowed at o n e of the meetings.
Rick Joyner is a false prophet, but true prophets and apostles exist today. On the other side of the pole, much damage is being done by heretics like John MacArthur and Justin Peters. I don't even believe they are truly saved.
Thank you for adding comments that were well balanced and covered the error on both sides of the church. I hope you can hear my heart that talking about frequently traveling to heaven isn't good for the church. I had no idea about the dark stuff you pointed out about Rick
So grateful to have found you. Love your honesty and humility speaking out against our crazy brothers and sisters. ( or at least I think they are 😂)
Thank you so much. Blessings 🙌
I just can't help but feel heartbroken over all this. So do you think he's lieing about these things or is he having demonic visions? Is he himself deceived? I feel like a big part of my life has been ripped from me since all this started with Mike B. Truth trauma is very real. A lot of healing needs to take place.
I don't know Rick personally so i cannot really comment on his visions. But i have my doubts that he is frequently going to heaven.
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone I don't personally know him either but he sure does uplift and even has broken bread together with those that have probably sexually abused those in the body and perhaps even minors. In respects to Mike Bickle he said it wouldn't be long before we saw him again. This in the face of woman who were minors just coming out saying Mike did this to me. Just so grieved.
Thanks for covering this. Appreciate you exposing these guys. Rick Joyner is one of the Kansas City prophets and deeply connected to Mike Bickle who also claimed to go to heaven frequently among many other visions dreams and revelations that he used to teach his people. Anybody who claims dreams, visions, and revelations and uses them for teaching purposes is a cult leader scripture is our sole authority.
So Rick wasn't one of the main Kansas City Prophets. But he was closely associated with them. Paul Cain, Bob Jones and John Paul Jackson were the main ones. Other will add James Goll
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone he may not have called himself one, but he was so close that I would put them together. He called himself a prophet and was close with all of those guys and remains close. So 🤷♂️ he even appears in pictures in IHOP KC’s prophetic history several times
If Paul, the apostle, had a revelation and understood that he should not share the details (2Cor 12:4: "things that man is not permitted to tell.”), why are so many sharing supposedly identical experiences? If Paul wanted to boast in his weaknesses (2Cor 3:5) because of the power of Christ manifested in him, why are so many boasting in their pseudo-revelations and selling books and making money from views to cause so many to stumble? What a lack of fear of God and what opportunism? Jer 23:28: "Let the prophet who has a dream retell it, but let him who has My word speak it truthfully. For what is straw compared to grain? declares the LORD." Thanks for the video.
I have not watched anything from Rick Joyner for years, but you bringing attention to him has caused me and others to take a look. He is an old man and is retired from running MorningStar Ministries. In scripture, the Levites were commanded to retire from ministering in the temple at 50 years old and not beginning until they were 25. What a wise God we have. I think if more older Christian leaders would get out of the way, instead of being in the way, the church might be a lot more healthy. With that said, I see no reason under the sun to read negative comments about RJ and MorningStar unless you see your readers as idiots who are unable to read or exercise discernment themselves. By digesting and spoonfeeding information to followers of your channel is akin to a mother bird with her nestlings. If you want to keep your listeners as babies, depending on you to "know" what is "approved" then keep it up. I found the comment by Joel Richardson comparing RJ to Jim Jones, especially repugnant. One is a Christian brother the other a mass murderer. I have never visited heaven yet, but I look forward to living there. I have read a number of accounts of people who have visited heaven, some of which I believe. Shame on you Josh for this. You are not going to be able to stop RJ's influence in this way. You are simply rallying together many people who already hate him. And some will begin coming after you as well. This will never bear the fruit of bringing 1 billion souls to Christ. I say this as someone who prays for you and cares for you as a brother in Christ. I only touched briefly on how off track I feel your video is. So much mockery and hatred being spewed by those you're quoting. Godly? I think perhaps not.
It is often said that the divided condition of Christendom is an evil, and so it is. But the evil consist in the existence of the error that is causing the division and not all all in those who recognize the error and who are trying to correct it. The evil of the division exists not in the ones who are pointing it out and brining it up. But in the error itself that is causing the division
- J. Gresham Machen
You are a breath of fresh air. Thank you.
Jesus said, ‘they are blind leaders of the blind, LEAVE THEM ALONE….they will both fall into a pit.’
You can’t fix this. You’re supposed to let it run its course.
Shaking my head and rolling my eyes. The only book i read is the bible. I read many great books written by spirit filled people. I am so careful who i watch on RUclips. There are lots of crazy "Christians "around. BTW i love Derick Prince sermons.
Thank you for this video as l have been speaking out against this for awhile!!❤
You are so welcome. Thank you for speaking out.
And you’re mouthing off about Rick’s not telling everything he has learned and experienced? Amazing! 😊
It's great to have morningstar ministry guest here to comment
You also don’t get to decide how often a sincere follow is “allowed” to have deeply personal or significant encounters or revelations. Maybe you or others you know have them less frequently, but that doesn’t mean that there aren’t some who have them frequently, or even DAILY.
You also have to take into account the life and fruit of some ones ministry. To my knowledge Rick isn't doing anything spectacular in my humble opinion
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone I wasn’t addressing RJ, but the body of Christ, in general.
@estherj.tolbert8854 you might want to take into account all the allegations of cover up for sexual abuse going on at morningstar. Or maybe Jesus isn't serious about protecting the little ones anymore?
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone I’ll repeat, I wasn’t addressing the situation with RJ or Morningstar, but the parameters that you are providing and teaching that revelatory people are supposed to be contained within. You are literally blocking out what I am saying or allowing a spirit to cause deafness in you. Perhaps I’m defending all the HIGHLY revelatory people who receive revelation daily…..
Go to 2 cor 11. Paul was conforting false apostles. In 11 the false apostles were claiming their authority to gather a following. Paul said let me boast foolishly. Basically ill take my shirt off and you can see my 195 scares in my back as my proof. Now ch. 12 the false apostles were saying they got a special revelation to get a following. Sounds like today. Paul said i wont boast on these revelations or mention them
Laurie Ditto wrote a very eye opening book about how the Lord brought her to Hell. It was very real and scary. She realized that she had to repent of unforgivness or she would end up there. I believe her. However there are other's who fake those experiences
You see how this vision or dream lead her to Jesus and repentance! Good fruits came from that
I do agree with you. These people are putting a black eye on all Christianity 😢
Thank you for the video and for demonstrating humility in what you share!
Glad you enjoyed it!
This has nothing to do with the video content just with the sound. I’m not sure if anyone else has mentioned it, but there a high pitch sound in your last couple of videos throughout your recording. I had to stop my laptop to make sure it wasn’t coming from there.
Thank you for all your videos! 🙏
@@Missramy100 thank you for pointing this out
Let me know your thoughts on the subject. Do you believe Christians can travel to heaven often?
I would love to have a scriptural reference to support this idea! To date I've never heard of one scripture, however, It appears that many people are teleporting in some kind of way.......through NDE's or Special chosen people. However, I've heard, Michael Jackson went to Heaven and was seen there, then I heard another person said they saw him in hell.
N o one today has gone to heaven or had a taste of heaven. They are charlatans. Rick Joyner is a total phony. ORU with oral Roberts as the head was kind of a loose cannon and many prosperity preachers today all were graduates of ORU…Copeland is one and a very evil man.
@@cjjohnson5383 2 Corinthians 12:1-7 ESV
[1] I must go on boasting. Though there is nothing to be gained by it, I will go on to visions and revelations of the Lord. [2] I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven-whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows. [3] And I know that this man was caught up into paradise-whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows- [4] and he heard things that cannot be told, which man may not utter. [5] On behalf of this man I will boast, but on my own behalf I will not boast, except of my weaknesses- [6] though if I should wish to boast, I would not be a fool, for I would be speaking the truth; but I refrain from it, so that no one may think more of me than he sees in me or hears from me. [7] So to keep me from becoming conceited because of the surpassing greatness of the revelations, a thorn was given me in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to harass me, to keep me from becoming conceited.
bible.com/bible/59/2co.12.1-7.ESV
I don't believe they are really traveling to heaven. They are having delusions probably. There may be some having dreams or visions. But with all the false prophets out there? I can't believe it so I just say God, I don't know but You know and I trust in You and Your Word!
Hello brother. I have to ask you why do you think this was spoken of? Was it to show that God didn't want him to be boasting and that's why he wrote it? Because the main thrust was not the vision. He was going about the business of teaching them. There are no other visions or anything else like this supported to written by the other Apostles or writers. This happened once. We should not have doctrine or even discussions about one section in scripture. Just my personal thoughts. I do not believe any of the supposed visions and dreams of any of them- mainly because their doctrine is horrible.
I guess I have been one of the naieve ones believing everything without discerning. thanks for helping me. One thing could you maybe address sometime is all the videos on YT about trips to hell, all the ones saying I saw christians in hell, and these videos scared me badly causing me to wonder if i am saved. I know really that I am, I got saved filled with the Spirit and left my sinful life and I follow Jesus as best I can. but these videso scare me. I have to just avoid watching hell videos now.
That fact that you are scared is actual proof that you are in God camps. Its the fear of the Lord. However now you need to move into a place of sonship and have God remove that fear. He has you in the palm of his hand. And he will not let you go. He is a loving father who those that fear him and stay on his path!
I do not believe in this travel to heaven biz
Would you share why you feel this way for other sake?
The apostle Paul only gives one account of being caught up to the third heaven. I believe these people are not being truthful. It is a spirit of deception.
@phyllistyler2315 but then again you don't know
They new the word of God but they didn't know the God of the word! Don't kill Him again.
Dank je wel!
Very informative. Thank you
Thanks for watching!
Fortune telling is forbidden in the Bible.
It does not matter if they get it right either because demons know things. They study people. It doesn't matter if what they say makes people happy.
Fortune telling is wrong.
2 Corinthians 11
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works
Deuteronomy 18
10 There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering,[e] anyone who practices divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or a sorcerer 11 or a charmer or a medium or a necromancer or one who inquires of the dead, 12 for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord. And because of these abominations the Lord your God is driving them out before you. 13 You shall be blameless before the Lord your God, 14 for these nations, which you are about to dispossess, listen to fortune-tellers and to diviners. But as for you, the Lord your God has not allowed you to do this.
Rick Joyner is disappointing. He's now wasted much of his ministry life, maybe even being a gate keeper, keeping real Christianity from happening. I attended one of this weekend conferences decades ago, and subscribed to his cassette tape, best of series, probably in the '90s. Most of these messages were a waste of time to listen to, so I unsubscribed, saving some money.
I did like his book, "The Final Quest," but I don't recall him ever saying how he got the visions or had the experiences, which I've never understood.
I found these two parts of "The Final Quest" very interesting, so transcribed the words, posting them on my site:
_____________
Many are deceived by demon-anointed 'worship,' today. Which I think is similar to what Rick Joyner's "The Final Quest" vision illustrates: demons riding on 'Christians,' who think this is the anointing of God. [Warning: grossness factor ahead. But it really is this gross in today's average 'Christian.' It's time to wake up!]
The most shocking part of this vision was that this horde was not riding on horses, but on Christians! Most of them were well-dressed, respectable, and had the appearance of being refined and educated. These were Christians who had opened themselves to the powers of darkness to such a degree that the enemy could use them and they would think that they were being used by God. …
Even worse than the vomit from the vultures was a repulsive slime that these demons were urinating and defecating upon the Christians they rode. This slime was the pride, selfish ambition, etc., that was the nature of the division they were a part of. However, this slime made the Christians feel so much better than the condemnation that they easily believed that the demons were messengers of God, and they actually thought this slime was the anointing of the Holy Spirit.
But here is the great part, when ONE happens, Jesus' heart-cry for us in John 17:
When we reached the level called "The Unity of the Brethren," none of the enemy's arrows could reach us.
And:
When we reached the level called "Galatians Two Twenty," we were above the altitude that the vultures could fly. At this level the sky above almost blinded us with its brightness and beauty. I felt peace like I had never felt it before. …
The "Galatians Two Twenty" level was so wide that there was no longer any danger of falling. … Faith, Hope and Love…were now so large that I knew people far beyond the battle area could see them. Their glory even radiated into the camp of prisoners who were still under a great cloud of vultures. The exhilaration continued to grow in all of us. I felt that being in this army, in this battle, had to be one of the greatest adventures of all time.
That book had a strong positive impact on my life. It helped to answer a lot of questions about goings on in church at the time. I think the book was relevant to that season. Its not an eternal book like the Bible.
@@Susan-zk7ne I was born again in 1991 and that book was wild to me and yet contain many truths too in allegory style, however by 2000 I had left behind the ministries I was involved with nationally and yet the Lord told me to leave it all behind. I was in what they called the prophetic/apostolic and after 20 years I'm glad I did leave. Things began to show up as not right, hard to go into on a post but as we see today many things are way off. I see Rick now with this post as a fraud and hope that's all he is.
@@sherylturnerturner1352 I was in that stream also. It was a wild ride. I've studied church history a bit and there is a pattern where God reveals a part of Himself and it is wonderful, then the people become comfortable and then entitled and that is where it goes wonkers. Then He reveals another part of Himself, and the cycle continues. I think each time He takes His people thru this that the Bod of Christ grows more in maturity and like Him. God works multigenerational as well as personally. We are at the end and the beginning of that cycle I think. May Jesus bless you for your faithfulness.
I’m sorry, Joshua, but you don’t get to create the boundaries or define the parameters in which people can receive revelation. It is no less significant if someone receives a revelation when they are eating or using the bathroom than when they are praying and fasting. 😑
The bible does creates parameters not me. No one is getting visited more then those in scripture
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone The Bible DOES NOT have nor contain the parameters, and especially not the ones you are using.
All angelic visitations are not accompanied by fear or falling prostrate. Mary did NOT fear or fall prostrate when she was visited by an angel.
Not all. But many were accompanied by fear. If fear wasn't the response it should be an "awe" of God
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone There you go again with providing a parameter: “there SHOULD BE an awe.” You don’t get to make the rules.
@estherj.tolbert8854 I studied the supernatural in seminary. I base my opinions on the scriptures. I'm confident in my answers. But God can do whatever pleases him. But we do have scripture to test these things and we are called to do this. We shouldn't assume all revelation is coming from God
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone It’s obvious that all revelation is not from God. If there are biblical parameters for receiving revelations, why don’t you provide them, rather than commending your seminary education? 🤦🏼♀️
How can you test anything you are not allowed to read?😊
Huh
TORN CURTAIN BY JOSHUA BE VERY CAREFUL WHAT YOU SAY ABOUT RICK JOYNER?
I do feel a did this with fear and trembling and prayerfully. I tried to be respectful as much as i could. I wasn't attacking Rick personally. Just the idea that we can travel to heaven frequently
Why do you say this? Is it about not touching the anointed money's supply or perhaps he is using occultic powers and can harm Josh? It is time to talk about this crazy prophetic/apostolic garbage being fed to the unsuspecting.🤔☹
Why are you giving financial advise? You shouldnt give financial advise as other may take your advise and lose ton of money. Get other sponsor thats are not monetary involved.
I am pointing people towards a product that i think can be helpful during these times. Everyone should speak with a financial adviser before making any decisions. I only decided to endorse Birch Gold after a long period of waiting on the lord for the right sponsors. I passed up on dozens of offers. This was the one i believe the lord provided for this channel. Birch Gold recommends people take a small percentage of their portfolio to invest in gold. All investments include risk to some degree. But the advisers at Birch Gold will give you an idea of how God has performed over the last few decades
Sharing nasty comments and opinions from saved or unsaved people is unkind. Stick to scripture, please. Rick Joyner was prophesying what is happening today (Aurora, CO) 30-40 years ago. You don’t know that he hasn’t been to Heaven. You have an opinion, too, but stick to facts. 😊
I can say for certain that you cannot travel to heaven frequently. He is being visited by demons. Even fortune tellers are right at times
Joshua: He said he went , you said he didnt! This is another example of the body of Christ easily taken off focus of what our battle is!
I actually said i don't know if Rick went or not. I do find frequent trips to heaven problematic and new agie. I want to have a biblical discussion on the matter. Rick's twiiter post had 100K views and people had such strong responses i wanted to bring some clarity. I have another You Tube Channel just for preaching the Gospel. We can preach the Gospel and contend for the faith at the same time.
I think our biggest battle today is witchcraft making inroads into the body of Christ along with Gnosticism. This, in my opinion is why so many strongly rebuked Rick in the first place. It's right along with golden chariots of Mike Bickle the pedophile.
rick is fake
Apparently you don’t know what Rick has been through. He has been through more than you, guaranteed. He’s not asking for money, but you talk about gold that you will profit from? Yes, you did say that Rick didn’t go to Heaven. Oh, STOP!😊
Bob Jones has a course on how to teach people to travel to heaven. You should take the course and become the next Rick Joyner
Oh No!! Now you completely lost me!! A commercial in the middle of this discussion just removed any credibility.
I've been funding this ministry completely by myself for over two years lossing alot of money doing so. Less then 1%of viewer have supported the channel. Listen Ministry needs money to exist. I'm sorry if you don't understand this. Jesus had a treasurer to manage the ministries financing. I live in NYC which is one of the most expensive places to live in the world
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone no worries brother I do understand. It was just a little strange to see and hear that. If that's what you need to do to complete the work God has called you to do I'm right there with you. I wish I could help with the finances but dealing with the wife's cancer, medical bills and neurological disorders I'm barely getting by and need more help as well. Maybe a suggestion at the beginning of the video say there will be a commercial involved. Prayers for nothing but the best of Gordon your ministry.
@BryanCurtisSaved you are correct I should explain this a bit more. I would be shocked to hear a sales pitch in the middle of the video without expecting this. It's just to help fund the ministry. I live a simple life without the frills
podcasts have sponsors. Nothing out of ordinary. monetization is not enough for most.. Not a birch gold fan but commend you for adding sponsors to assist in making a living!
Josh, my dear. YOU HAVE GOT TO STOP ✋️ speaking well of people when you have failed to dig deep BEFORE saying one word. NOT ONE...Father pointed out to me that Chris Reed was not a spokesman for Him. I then knew there was something very sinister about him that he was hiding....and sure enough it was true. Father had me read a book by the founder of Morning Star, Rick Joyner, many, many years ago. Well, Lord help me, Joyner said people would go to hell if they took the mark of the beast. There were some other things he said that got twisted. But the mark thing will send people to HELL. I'VE had to read many books to see if I could desern what Father wanted me to. Like He said, if you listen to one long enough, you will desern what the truth is. Rick Warren and Choo are 2 others I can recall. They are making mega bucks for spewing out lies. IT MATTERS NOT HOW LONG YOU HAVE KNOWN SOMEONE AND/OR HOW WELL YOU THINK YOU KNOW THEM, ODDS ARE THEY ARENT WHAT YOU THINK. YOU'VE GOT TO DID DEEP, STOP, LOOK AND LISTEN WAY BEFORE YOU MAKE COMMENTS. PEOPLE LOOK UP TO YOU TO BE 100% CORRECT.
YOU ARE TO BE A SOURCE OF TRUTHS.
BE BLESSED.
You thought i was sticking up for Rick and Chris? I have stated i have serious concerns with both of these guys. I would not recommend anyone follow their ministries. I did a few videos calling out certain things. And recently showed a prophetic word Chris gave that didn't come to pass. But i am trying to speak the truth in love. If i am too harsh they will not hear anything have to say
2 Timothy 2:24-26
24 The Lord’s slave must not quarrel, but must be gentle to everyone, able to teach,[a] and patient, 25 instructing his opponents with gentleness. Perhaps God will grant them repentance leading them to the knowledge of the truth. 26 Then they may come to their senses and escape the Devil’s trap, having been captured by him to do his will.
@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone Josh...they probably don't hear a word you say. This nonsense has gone on far too long. Year after year. Only Holy Spirit can deal with them....IF ITS NOT TOO LATE. Father told me almost a year ago that many have already stepped over the line Into blasphemy. Holy Spirit
has repeatedly called to them a long, long time to STOP, REPENT, TURN AROUND, RUN TO JESUS. HOWEVER, they have ignored Him repeatedly.
It's their choice. So like many others, Father will harden their heart, like He did with Pharaoh. Holy Spirit will leave and never return. It is He that brings on conviction to repent. This is the sin that is unforgivable . Father knew before they were born what their choices would be. But He did give them many chances. They cannot say on judgment day, they didn't know.
It's horrendous to even think about those who have chosen hell over heaven. 😕 All we can do is pray Father's will be done...The Lord's prayer covers everything that's necessary.
Blessings
Let he who is without fault cast the first stone. A famous man once said. You People put so much Energy in negative things.
I’m sorry, Joshua, but you don’t get to create the boundaries or define the parameters in which people can receive revelation. It is no less significant if someone receives a revelation when they are eating or using the bathroom than when they are praying and fasting. 😑
We use scripture as our guideline for all supernatural revelation. The Apostle Paul went to heaven once in 14 years. Do you think the Lord is taking Rick Joyner more frequently? Do not be deceived my friend
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone I wasn’t saying that and you know it. Scripture doesn’t have boundaries for where, when, and how often we are allowed to receive revelation.
@estherj.tolbert8854 supernatural events do not happen frequently in scripture. I've studied the supernatural for over 20 years. These people are communicating with angels of lights which are demons. I know this might be upsetting
@@TornCurtainIJoshuaSimone That’s not true that supernatural events do not happen frequently in scripture. I’m not upset nor am I defending anyone’s ministry. Your teaching is off.