Ancient Typewriter Annnndddd, it will be the last season, which makes no sense. The show is extremely popular and even if the night king is defeated, people are going to learn how to get along with each other and that's 3 seasons worth of material, at least.
The problem with GoT is that it used to be based on George RR Martin's very well written "A Song of Ice and Fire" series and now it's just Dan and Dave's poorly written fan fiction 😕
You're also comparing an author that is taking 7 YEARS to write a book and the shows producers who have to write the story/dialogue and shoot the show in a year and half. I get it, the books are well crafted. Well, no shit!! It better be well written if it takes him this long!!
Maplenerd22 Previous seasons were also well crafted because they were based on those well crafted novels. They didn't have to rush the plotline- they cut quite a bit from the books to get to the ending quicker. You can't blame the well paid actors who showed no desire to leave the biggest roles of their lives, and you can't blame HBO which has granted an enormous budget and made it clear they were willing to take on the show for at least 10 seasons. You can't blame it on the special effects which have only improved with the budget, and you can't blame it on the cast which have been stellar throughout. Dan and Dave's shift in focus to wanting to create their own pet projects (including a confederate show???) are soley to blame for the drop in quality. They're trying to wrap the series up as quickly as possible with a total disregard for the quality storytelling that made the show a hit in the first place. They ruined a great show based on great books, stop defending them
+Pete - Are you seriously suggesting they should drag this out for 10+ plus seasons like what the Walking Dead is doing?? Are you really this stupid?? If there's anyone to blame here is George RR Martin for taking so damn long to write a book. If the writers were to stretch GoT out and waited for Martin to finished his "well crafted" series, they would probably have to wait for another 8 years. That means GoT will be in its 16th seasons. No one is going to be following the show by then. Also no actor will want to be on the same show playing the same characters for 16 seasons!!!!! Imagine the show keep talking about "Winter is coming" for 16 seasons. How stupid of a show would that be.
Hey Harry Ballsak! "Last I heard" doesn't count. If you didn't read those books, you're really in no position to speak on them 😉 Talking about things you know nothing about is pretty much the definition of ignorance. If I'm a moron, at least I'm a moron who reads and only speaks on what he knows. I'll take an educated moron over an ignorant genious anyday. Oh, and those last 2 books were both long as hell- there were about 2 seasons worth of material each there. And Winds of Winter was partially delayed because the show started showing book spoilers as early as season 5 and Martin started making changes.
Maplenerd22 "10+ plus" is redundant. I'm not saying they should've dragged out anything, I'm saying they shouldn't have cut out pivotal pieces of the plot in previous seasons and kept with the standard pacing of the show. Everyone fell in love with the show back when they took the time to show character development and build upon the tension and plot. This season felt like a clift notes version of the story. No, I don't think they should drag the story along like in walking dead- unlike walking dead, this is a story with an established beginning, middle, and end. There's also a lot of content here. Even with the cuts to storylines which Dan and Dave decided not to include on the show, the ending is obviously longer than 2 seasons. You don't want to drag the story out but you don't want to rush it either. Right now it's being rushed so Dan and Dave can get started on their weird confederate show everyone is offended by. If their heart isn't in it anymore they should let someone else pick up where they left off. This was never their story to begin with so I doubt they'll be missed
It feels like a cliche fantasy fanfic movie to me now. Especially since almost every character this season gets saved by someone or something at the last second. I'll continue to watch it for the characters either way.
Cuz I'm a wanderer - That's where I'm at with this now. Even despite the (many) issues I have with the last three seasons, it's still a fantastic show, it's just a shame that the quality of the storytelling has dropped so sharply.
The show gets alot more "basic" honestly. We used to have cool characters on every side and it used to be hard, to seperate "good" from "evil". Every side had their good and their bad. Now, every "good" character joins the same side and every "bad" character the opposing side. Even Jaimie left cercei (probably taking bronn with him). Now there is not a single "good" character on cercei`s side
DEUCE Qyburn wasn't established as a villain. Although he probably will be, for now there is still a not purely evil character on Cersei's side. But you're right, character motivations became much simpler lately
This show has just devolved into a fan fiction, logic and good dialogue have been thrown out of the window, the fact that people are defending and applauding this is just making the situation worse.
No fan fiction, because it is canonical adaptation, with all the legality, etc. Fan fiction, by definition, is un-canonical, unofficial version of the story.
and any other conversation in that episode or just that one (which was great). other was for example jon and jorah but the place was wrong that was conversation that should take place on the ship when they are going to eastwatch
Alright I absolutely hate, I hate, I hate, I hate, when people say the 'it's has dragons it doesn't need to make sense.' I'm sorry but just because something is a certain genre doesn't mean that it's rules of logic and consistency don't apply in order to make a GOOD story. The world dictates that certain things like teleportation and cringeworthy fan service and the hero is saved the last second tropes don't apply. In something like Star Trek they literally have a teleportation device that applies to the story, it doesn't here. D&D wanted to get it done as fast as possible and you 'it has dragons it doesn't need to make sense' people have butchered it for the people like myself who advised everyone i knew to watch it in the first place have been betrayed because of it. Can't wait for the reboot in 30 years when the real story will be told.
GRRM is actually _stricter_ when it comes to logic and realism than most of his fans. Saying that fantasy stories don't need to make sense is an insult to fantasy authors in general, _but also to GRRM in particular._
The fact it has magical elements means jackshit. In a story, rules are needed. Even with magic. It needs limitations and it needs to establish elements. If teleportation is a thing, cool, but it needs consistency. Sure, a writer can easily do things “just cause” but that’s cheap and ruins the story. The difference between good and bad writing is how the writer can come up with the best solutions without needing to break their rules.
"why u complainin bout logic in a show with fkin dragons". No! No! No! Enough with this argument already. All these seasons we established this as a normal world like us with elements of magic. All these seasons we established that messenger ravens take time and distances are huge. They even mention in the seventh episode that ravens may take time in such storms. You can't just say fuck all that just for the sake of a dragon deus ex machina. I love a dragon deus ex machina, the scenes they are showing on screen have been stellar; but the main selling point of the series has always been its in-universe consistency, realistic situations, and complicated characterization. That is what set it apart from all other stories. That was the Game of Thrones I fell in love with. And I don't want that sacrificed for flashy scenes. I don't want a Michael Bay film, I don't want Hollywood stories, I want the real as fuck gritty story with dark fantasy elements that Game of Thrones used to be.
+Zubin Trivedi Incidentally, there is a reason why GRRM gave his dragons two legs and two wings instead of the usual four legs and two wings you see in other fantasy. He said so himself: He did it because in the real world, there is not a single animal with four legs _and_ wings. _GRRM himself thinks_ that you should care about logic and realism in fantasy - and he's stricter with that than most people, myself included.
+1 consistency isn't the same as realism. I don't expect GoT to be realist (there's freaking dragons ! ) but I expect its universe to be consistent : if Daenerys doesn't have the ability to compress space-time, she should not be able to compress space-time !
Not to mention all the characters have level 9000 plot armor. Bronn avoids a blast of dragonfire simply by jumping out of the way. Then he comes out of nowhere to push Jaime away from the dragonfire. Then Jaime sinks to the bottom of a lake wearing plate armor and is miraculously pulled to the surface hundreds of yards away by Bronn in the next episode. And how Jon's group miraculously runs into a frozen lake with an island in the middle. And then the ice miraculously breaks in a perfect circle thus protecting them from the zombie's until the precise time when Dany arrives. And then Jon gets left behind, surrounded by wight walkers and his furs soaked with frozen water, and out of fucking nowhere here comes Benjen with a horse. Honestly D&D can suck a dick. Guarantee the books will VASTLY different than this mess of a show ( if they ever come out, sadly ) This show was built on drama and political intrigue set in a gritty realistic medieval world ( seasons 1-4 ). Now it's just a basic hollywood-formula shit show, appealing to the idiots who want boobs and violence.
Dark Blade Also drogon barely got damaged by those harpoons that were hyped up all season. A fucking ice toothpick did more damage then qyburn's secret weapon. I was expecting to see a mangled and brutalised Drogon. Maybe this would've explained why Danny went Mad queen mode in episode 5. Also she should've captured Jamie and bronn after the battle and had Bronn burned and eaten by her dragons alongside Randyl Tarly (Rickon Tarly should escape the battle and head for oldtow now where he can have a heartfelt scene with Sam).
It's interesting how people are focusing so much on travel time and pacing issues when there are even bigger story issues. Like how the writers seem to be forgetting things that have been established in the show. Like that Sansa letter they're making such a big deal over. Go back and watch previous episodes. Everyone immediately knew that Sansa wrote the letter under duress. And the letter was no longer at Winterfell since Catelyn took it to Robb. Arya's story about learning to shoot didn't make much sense either. She said that she practiced with a bow Bran was using. Except in the first episode of the show, they were just teaching Bran to shoot and Arya immediately showed that she was a better shot by hitting the target.
Totally agree. Also, the logic behind the idea of going beyond the wall to capture a wight was just absurd. Going without any horses made it even way more absurd. And the drama at Winterfell between Arya & Sansa & Littlefinger was crap. Felt too forced & it didn't make that much sense
I hated... and i mean hated.. when Davos said "Thought you were still rowing" This is what makes a show cheap, reacting to memes that nobody will remember in 10 years. Nobody will get that, making GoT a show of its time. And stuff like "ohh the fans liked Tormienne, lets build on that!" Cmon stop putting fanservice in and stick to the story. But maybe thats just me... I love GoT. But yeah since the books were over.. It went downhill.
That was just a small little joke. It's the least of our worries. The real dumb shit is NK being able to end the war by killing drogon right next to him but he aims at viseryion.
+Kevin House Implying that Benioff & Weiss have a plan for the show that goes beyond "Oh look, what a great face Kit Harrington made in that scene! Let's see how we can get that again!"
Okay I don't really care about the transportation problem. The show ends next season and is 7 episodes long. My problem is that ever since last season, this show has been predictable asf and fan service. I avoided all spoilers for this season and am still able to figure out what's going to happen. Every since Martin left the writers don't know what to do and just do whatever the fans want them to do
its fans like you that make me laugh it's like the same song and dance that happens with every tv series that comes from a book series, things are changed, things are left out and things are done for fan service. Just enjoy whats given to you and realise that the series will never be as good as the books in anything, only parts will.
I find it funny how stupid you look assuming that I actually read the books and am a fan of them. The books are boring to me. I think that TV is a much better medium for this type of idea/story, and it obviously is since the TV show is much more popular than the novels. But its people like you who are so closed minded to the idea of criticism that its comedic. If you honestly think that the writers have any idea what they are doing, you are wrong. Even though I don't like the books, what I can appreciate about them is that GRR Martian in no way tries to appease his fans just for the sake of appeasing them. The writers obviously didn't learn that lesson when GRR was with them and it clearly shows that they didn't learn it when he left.
since when is making an assumption close minded, it's assumative. anything on tv is a better medium because more people watch tv than read books and there is much more advertising in regards to tv shows than books. You've just got to look at it more open minded, your focus is narrowed. It makes me laugh people like you are the people joe rogan makes fun of, are wrapped up and absorbed in critcism instead of focusing on being your own self motivator and creating/finding your passion and building yourself and other people up. People love to complain because its a distraction from what they're not doing with their life.
The pacing was horrible. We did not even see anything from the unsullied since they conquered casterly rock. They just appeared randomly in kings landing.
I mean, yeah, it's worth a fucking explanation. So this foreign army that just took heavy losses and has presumably little to no provisions since it's fleet was burned is able to march all the way across a hostile continent and arrive at the capital to perfectly coincide with this meeting their Queen who they haven't seen in months is having...real plausible.
DEUCE One thing that bothers me is that we are never told what is the size of Daenerys' army. We don't know how many unsullied, dothraki or westerosi she has under her
We know how many Unsullied there are, more or less. I don't think many of them died at the hands of the harpies. But why were the Dothraki made out to be these incredible warriors? Sure they're good, but it's the Unsullied who are meant to be this unstoppable force. In the past, a relatively small number of them took down an army of Dothraki.
TL;DR Action scenes and great CGI and mind blowing background scores salvaged a poorly written season. D&D are good at adaptations and writing action battle sequences. The reason why the show got popular in the first place was because of its characters. Good guys make mistakes and pay for it. Bad guys have certain redeeming qualities. We feared for the safety for our favourites. Now, we don't. Because at this point, Jonny boy has the thickest plot armour and nothing can touch him. Also, most of the characters were doing things that were out of character for them. Tyrion being outwitted by Cersei and Jaime. (Just Tyrion being really stupid as a whole) Dany's reaction (or lack thereof) to Viseryion's death. Jon bending the knee and totally falling for Danaerys. Mountain not jumping to protect Cersei in front of the wight. Jaime sticking around with Cersei even after she burnt the Sept, killed his uncle, and by extension his last son. Petyr Baelish doing whatever the hell he was doing in Winterfell. (Don't even get me started on the Winterfell plot this season) What I liked about the initial seasons was not the dragons and the magic and the supernatural fantasy stuff. I liked the conversations. *Petyr and Varys* *Varys and Tyrion* *Tyrion and Tywin* *Arya and Tywin* *Cersei and Tywin* *Robert and Cersei* *Jaime and Brienne* There were so many memorable dialogues. I can't think of any quotes from this season that will stay with me. And lastly, this does not mean I will stop watching the show. All those dirtbags that say, "Oh if you hate it so much why do you keep watching it?" Because I'm bloody invested in this show. I've nerded out over this franchise for years. So I will never hate it. I can only be disappointed. And right now, son, I'm disappointed.
You summed up everything I was thinking pretty much. This show isn't about the dragons or magic, it's about the people and the power politics. The characters make it and they're the reason why I'll keep watching.
I think season 4 was absolutely the best season but, season 6 has the two best episodes of the show; Battle of the basterds and winds of winter. Season 7 has had some great moments so far but he's right, the pacing is crazy. I still love it though.
Game of Thrones SHOULD have been an animation. they could do so much more with a way smaller budget. More battle scenes, more flashback scenes, more dire wolves, giants, dragons and wight walkers.. as long as it was done right it would have definitely worked.
It would have made it immeasurably more expensive, and IMO it wouldn't really have been that much of a benefit. GoT was never about the fantasy elements, it was very deliberately about everything else with the fantasy elements as just a plot element or a backdrop. As much fun as it would have been to have the Mountain actually *be* an 8-foot tall giant swinging a 2-meter long greatsword with one hand, so much of Game of Thrones is simply made of characters talking in rooms that ultimately making it animated would have been more of a burden than a benefit for it.
I don't know why Rhaegar Targaryen went to the trouble of marrying someone in secret. That revelation must have been fan service... I mean does being the rightful heir even matter in this show?
Being the rightful heir doesn't matter at all. But it was a revelation that was done quite right imo. Basically meaning jons a true targaryen by marriage right.
I know what it means. It's just that I can't make sense of Rhaegar's actions. Why did he have to keep his marriage with Lyanna a secret? Why get married at all?
let's just tread over the fact that they "annulled" a years long marriage that produced multiple children. I suppose Westeros doesn't have a word for "divorce" but still . . . like, what?
the baratheon and starks were close allies, lyanna was a stark and was to be married off to robert baratheon, rhaegar was targaryen and his father was king aries targaryen who burned ned & lyanna stark's father and brother alive, so you can see why rhaegar and lyanna's romance were kept between themselves.
Tally Bee the idea is that Rhaegar is obsessed with prophecies and that for his son aegon to be Azor Ahai he'd have to have three children like the three heads of the Targaryen dragon. Also his wife couldn't have anymore children so he annulled his marriage to have another legitimate child with the last name Targaryen.
I think it was way out of character for Deanrys to fly up there. And if the Night King is such a master javelin thrower, why didn't he just kill Jon while he was chilling on that Island? Why did Dany only take one dragon to the loot train battle, but decided to take all three beyond the wall?
@bruncla2303 - What's the impossibility? What are you basing this on? Neither the books or the show have clearly stated how far in distance each places are from one another. Perhaps the show is depicting Westeros as a much smaller place than it is perceived in the books. So maybe Eastwatch isn't that far from Dragonston.
bullshit there is a map and by few remarks in which they mentioned travel times between places u can calculate those distances and by that u have a scope of the map and the next step is just simple map reading
Dumbass, the maps are for the books!!! There are a few remarks in the books that reference distance for a few places, but they have never referenced how far Eastwatch is from Dragonstone. Even if want to consider the map as source, it still shows nothing because maps have different scales. Unless you know the the scale used, there is no way to calculate or infer distance just by looking at it. Are you seriously this stupid. IN any case, It doesn't matter what they book says. The show doesn't have to follow the book explicitly!!! If you haven't noticed already the show have changed MANY THINGS from the book. So it's not out of reason for the show creators to decide Westeros is smaller in scale than it was depicted in the books. This explains the fast travel time.
This season was just way too short. They also dumbed Tyrion down to underpower Danaerys which was hars to watch. That being said the finale was excellent imo.
Man, you have a near-to-perfect pronunciation ( I usually need subtitles to watch English shows, and yours is an exception ) and this quirk when you say "Thrones" with a clear "r" is just a cherry on top of an awesome cake :)
The reason that everyone SEEMS to teleport is actually a deliberate choice to cut down on filler. It actually started throughout season six because all of the storylines were either going to take too long iron go by too fast. Basically because Aryas plot was over the equivalent of a couple weeks they couldn't deal with the Jon plot being over several months. (Yknow bcuz of travel)
Logan smith whatever the reason it's still too rushed. I personally like filler as long as its interesting, provides good world building, or character development.
It's not just the pacing. The characters motivations don't feel as bound as they did before with the character's arc. Also, G.R.R.M. left after season 5, which was the last great season. He probably was the one who advocated the slow pacing among the writers, as well as knowing the characters better than anyone else. He supposedly left to finish the books, but I read in an article recently that he wasn't caught up with the show, because he's been "too busy traveling", so I'm wondering if he left in the best of terms, or they just had too many creative differences. Either way, I do love the show, and until recently I thought it was the greatest show ever, but now I just think that for the first 5 seasons, and I wish they would bring G.R.R.M. back for the 8th season, but I know they won't. I also thought the alternated-reality confederate show they want to make after game of thrones would be an interesting idea, if developed correctly, but now I realize that since G.R.R.M. was the one who brought that extra sense of realism to the show, and he won't be involved, the show will most likely be just okay, but never great.
ChindogusMake Yeah once you realize it was George's original work being "adapted" for the first five seasons with George helping out and now it is them on their own you can definitely tell they might not actually be the good writers we thought... maybe good adapters?...
Yeah, maybe. Also, a lot of people are saying that we should go easy on them cuz they are on uncharted territory, but that's bullshit. They already spoke with George, so they know where everything is headed. I think they are decent writers, but that's just not good enough because it was much better with George's help.
The thing with GoT is that it's crunch time now and they have to wrap everything up nicely. They've got so many characters that they need to finish with
Ethan Sensbach Not really. I find the criticism, like in the video, is silly, because in previous seasons story and characters were being established and all leading to the certain point. So then you could make one travel into 4 episodes, because there is so much things to happen and so many people to die. But when all of that happened, when all of the chess pieces are in place, where story was leading us, then there is no need for slow paced travels. Making ti slow paced would force writers to come up with fillers, and as much more information you put there, you must then deal with them later
Wlof25 The problem with this is that if the ending was actually climaxing naturally then it wouldn't feel terribly rushed and underdeveloped. They are condensing multi episodes worth of material down just to find their shitty cgi budget. The show has become complete action schlock now.
Ethan Sensbach I disagree. Because if you waste your time by slowing down, you need to get more fillers and those fillers are either just there to kill some time, that is, worthless, or those fillers would effect the story in a different way. Before we could see slow travel, because there are so many character to develop, so many plots to do and so many people to kill. When you have less character and story progresses almost to its end, then you cant just go around and slow down.
Wlof25 They don't need to slow down for fillers though, they need to slow down to actually explain what's going on in the plot and with the characters. In their rush to finish we're losing all the character development.
I totally agree with this If the knight could chuck a spear to kill the dragon why didn't he do the same with the small group on the ice Or send the dead to attack one at a time rather than a big group that breaks the ice They could just exhaust them to death I mean it has to be the king is f'ing with them. Playing with his good. And where this story lacks is the white walkers. Everyone else we are given a super realism. We learn all about them and what they want. But the walkers...no.... We don't understand them...what are they...are they just a virus that grows without any other purpose?
they already told us what they are, they are magical weapons made by the children of the forest to fight against the first men who invaded westeros, but the children of the forest and the first men eventually came to a truce in which the children of the forest would be left alone and live in their forest and the first men can have the rest of the lands to grow their crops and build their settlements, but despite the peace, the white walkers still existed to do what it was made to do, kill.
Poltical espionage, grey moral characters, characters acting out of their personality and consequences are fading away from the show. And it sucks to see a great show become a good show.
My favorite part of that episode I that they traveled from the wall to King’s Landing within just a few minutes or the viewer. I love the show and the story but that whole whitewalker capture expedition was ridiculous, they were practically teleporting all over the kingdoms.
I can't believe so many people are criticizing GRRM for not finishing his books sooner. Well BS, I don't want him to finish the books and deliver something at the level of Game of Thrones S7 (and pretty much 6), seriously, it is better left unfinished and leaving the space to so many theories that will never be resolved. But I believe that GRRM will finish it, he is taking his time to do it right, and I believe that books will be published after series ends, with things playing out completely different, probably with a different ending. cudos to GRRM for not rushing things. regarding D&D, I can't believe that they are so lost without the books, I understand that it is GRRM's vision and that he is the only one who can comprehend the entire thing, but dumbing down of the main characters, just killing them of willy-nilly, cause they have nothing for them to do, so many deus ex machina moments, total BS. Show quality went from 9.5 to 5.8. Someone mentioned the quality of the books going down, but there it is more like from 9.8 to 9.1.
it's the budget they can't afford to pay the CGI for the dragons and direwolf, night king etc. since it is reaching its end they can't afford to stuff too much filler between those traveling points. so instead of spending time between point A and B you skip B and go to D. Its not much traveling speed it's pacing speed has picked up. They kill off direwolves for the same reason. Its all about budget and logistics.
davidcici11Evolution No, it's not. They've got enough money, I mean they even paid Emilia a fucking 1000000 per episode. HBO even wanted to pay D&D to make the seasons 7 and 8 longer, but D&D didn't want to.
Finally, I have found a video where someone ACTUALLY represents their arguments correctly and backs them up with facts. I have seen countless videos bashing Game of Thrones Season 7. But you sir, you point out the actual flaws in the show without being ignorant and over-exaggerating everything. I completely agree with everything you have said. Although, one thing that almost everyone forgets is that George R.R. Martin supposedly has iffy health as of right now. It could be that they are purposely rushing the show in hopes to finish it before his passing. :( Which bothers me but at the same time, I would rather have George R.R. Martin administering the writing of a rushed storyline FOR THE TV SHOW. I heard the books are literal perfection. So I hope they stay that way and are not rushed at all.
Thanks for the shoutout :) I feel ya so much on this, the decline in logic and quality of writing is breaking my heart because I freaking LOVE "Game of Thrones". They're rushing this season to the detriment of the show. This is becoming fantasy action, while we all fell in love with the actual GAME of thrones.
THANK YOU, I'm probably one of the biggest got out there and the pacing of season 7 is driving me insane. The shorten seasons aren't doing the show justice. I said these to couple of my friends that completely disagree with me. It's shaking my vibe on the show due to the pacing. It's annoying but the action we are getting is something we have never seen in previous seasons. Although the action sense aren't as rewarding as they use to be. The battle of the bastards the second greatest episode in the series to date. It was so jaw dropping and satisfying because we had so much anticipation for it, and it made it so much more awesome.
What is the problem? Benioff and Weiss are good at adapting, but they are poor original writers. They were not competent to end Game of Thrones in a way that most people liked. Everybody thought they must be geniuses when they won those Emmies, especially Benioff and Weiss. But they weren’t geniuses, they were The Wizard of Oz. They were nothing but a Big Humbug. And in the end they escaped in their balloon. And they couldn’t take Dorothy with them, because “they don’t know how it woiks.” The deteriorating writing wasn’t really noticeable in earlier seasons, when the plot was kind of meandering around amorphously with little direction. But at the end, when important plot points had to be resolved, they fell flat on their faces. Then all their failings came prominently to the front. What can be done about this? Nothing, it’s over. That’s just the way it goes. Don’t trust Benioff and Weiss any more, that’s all.
I like what you had to say. I also thought the Benjin thing was odd as well. However when I thought about it more, Benjin was still under the assumption that he couldn't cross the wall due to magic placed over it which was mentioned a couple season ago. I think when the night king touched Bran it enabled him to now cross over therefore breaking the magic possibly.... so Benjin maybe just had enough and sacrificed himself lol
Yeah I really wanted to see a few episodes of gendry running his way back, the raven flying to Dragon stone,Danaerys flying to Jon and his team , all while cutting every now and then to Jon and his team chilling at the lake and white walkers doing nothing.That'd have really helped the pacing and the story telling.
You are correct however you need to redo your math. The UK, where apparently GoT is set, is quite small. A dragon could travel south to north with 3-6 hours. But Danny should freeze way up there. The raven situation still baffles me in the show. It seemed as fast as tweet, unless time does actually go by but they don't show it like it used to. Which would mean that Jon Snow has been away from Winterfell for months if not a year (longest winter ever!!!) I won't even mentioned how slow the boats should be. That's why I stop complaining about it. She should still be at sea... If you want to add some logic into it, which I do every Sunday then I remember that I want the story to progress so I let them defy all those great natural laws. Can't wait for the finale😁😎, let's have a 10 year time jump! 😋
That's exactly what I've been saying in all the bloody fan-forums but these idiots' only excuse is "it's a fantasy show, why bother?" The Known World has its own set of rules and the show has done its best to show us the time that passes while travelling and the character development that happens during that period. This episode could've easily been used to do that instead of "Easter Egg" references and sex jokes. My suggestion: The entire episode should've been about the journey (even though it's the dumbest reason for a journey) interjected by whatever is happening elsewhere and it should've ended with Gendry running away and the lot of them just stuck there. Because that's what they used to do before. They used to show Stannis sailing for KL at the end and resume that in the next episode. That'd at least give a sense of progression of time in our minds and in this case, serve as a great cliff-hanger. NOTE: They've fucked up the cliff-hangers as well in this Season.
they could have saved the 6th episode by gendry running off and then the rest of the time spent with Jon Snow and crew showing the passage of time and perhaps one of them wondering what the wights were waiting for (not knowing about the dragons coming). Then when they almost get overwhelmed suddenly the dragons swoop into view unexpected and we have a Han Solo moment in the first Star Wars. And Dany could have said she decided to follow them to the Wall which is why she arrived so quickly.
TBH, I would choose to wait 5 more years for the genius plotlines George writes than endure this stupidity from the current show writers. The writing is so bad, time bends when it suits them, characters have become dumb while they used to surprise us in previous seasons, dialogues are mediocre. So disappointed. Stupid Plotlines. Plain Stupid. Episode 6 of this season is the most dissatisfying climax episode in the history of GOT. Plus the whole "convincing Cersei" plot is Stupid af.
That ending is pretty accurate in my opinion. Maybe not Bran, but maybe someone else. It's sort of like a really long story, something that can be told in a bar for the centuries to come in Westeros. Something like a song, a song of ice and fire :^)
It seems people don't understand that they are winding down the season. the creators are trying to conclude the entire series. Now I don't think that's a good idea, they are trying to wrap up all the plot lines that GRRM has in the books, I think they should make a new stopping point, which would satisfy what has happened in the show. In other words they should create their own finish line instead of reaching for GRRM.
I think with how the latest seasons are being "rushed" is more to do with whats happening in the show itself. The characters are getting more desperate and seem to be rushing about trying to fight the enemies in the north while also trying to get the throne and defeat the enemies in the south while also trying to gain allies. I think the producers are running with that and making it similar in the episode and season layouts. I could be completely wrong but that's my theory on it.
The reason there were so many of these filler episodes was so we the audience could see the characters personalities and how they grew and developed. All those scenes when people are travelling, they are always having a conversation with someone about something and it dove us into how said character thinks and that is what was so great about those filler episodes. With that being said, season 7 and 8 are the climax of the entire show, we no longer need those filler episodes to learn more about characters since we already know all we need to know. There aren't really any important new characters being introduced and so no need for the 'travel' scenes. This makes the show seem more fast paced but it means we get to experience more what we've been waiting for throughout all these years.
Is anyone else pissed that no main characters are being killed off? I know it sounds strange but Game of Thrones has always been amazing because it's been realistic regardless of the many fantastical aspects, the human element has always been prominent. So far there has been so many incidents where main characters should have easily died ended up staying alive.
Wow, I think your onto it. This was a great video, I still love both books and show, but really they need some more pacing help. I would like a amiddle ground though. Imagine if we had this episode spaced out over 3 episodes, it would have been slow... I just want it more middle ground.
But the reason why they're not showing the travels anymore is specifically because they have been showing them for the past 6 seasons. In these seasons, they had to show it because they had to introduce the characters and the places. This is the last act of the series. This is the season in which the story is closing on itself. We have already been introduced to Westeros, we don't need to see the characters travelling from point A to point B anymore; we just need the already-established characters to interact and to be brought together in already-established locations. Some things are a bit stretched but overall you can't blame the show for simply going faster when it nears the end. All stories do that.
Amazing content as always brother. I'm glad you decided to do an episode that actually finds the flaws in a show as great as Game of Thrones, because there are flaws. But flaws and all this season has been nothing short of spectacular. I can't wait to see how it all ends, Hopefully not in 2019.
They could have made the ep6 thing more believable if they had shown them on the mound at different periods of the day/night talking about how the supplies had run out and questioning why they weren't being attacked. Being surrounded by still zombies for 5 days would have been pretty creepy. They could have also had conflict arising between them out of the stress of it all. But whatever I don't think the pacing is the biggest issue of GoT (from s5 onwards), the nosedive in writing has been far worse.
My biggest problem is that it feels like Fan Fiction which gets worse because of the plot holes they created. For Example: In the books the wall will most likely come down thorugh the Horn of Winter, which was never mentioned in the Show. The Book fans would love to have an ice dragon in the story... so they got a Undead Dragon that breathes "ice" to take down the wall...
AtZ Show: The story of Game of Thrones is not told by Brandon Stark, but by Samwell Tarly. It will be know under the name of "A Song of Ice and Fire". But only by a few survivors. Because now that winter is here, it's here to last for a generation. #TeamNightKing
it have turn up to Game of Convenience, so many clise, and predicable. Dario was left to esos so action hero john can hook up with dany. Brother of sam is dead so leater fan favorite sam can be lord, stupis 2 episode drama of aria and the letter, tryng to ad some suspemse before kill littlefinger. Smart Characters like varis, litlefinger, tyrion, annihilated in favor to action heroes and dam spetacle. Deus ex macina all the time, benjing purpose is to show last time and save, bran, john. Army of the dead, nerfed to oblivion, so easely to kill rigth now. Shoe have estabilish how the army of the dead will end, just kill the nigthking and all the army will imediatly colapse, a clise we have see so many time in so many movies.
My problem with Game of Thrones can be summed up with one single quote from Benioff & Weiss. _"We reconecptualized the role to make it worthy of the actor's talents."_ If you don't get why that's a problem, check out The Dragon Demands' RUclips channel.
Honestly....I saw a few episodes but I couldn't get into this show. I cant shake my original thought since day 1 that this entire series is nothing but a cheap watered down American version of LOTR.
I had the exact same question when I was watching this episode and yes the last season is comparatively the worst of them all because it was so predictable...
I loved the first three seasons, but I honestly felt the pacing was a bigger issue from seasons 4-6. At times some character arcs felt rushed, while other arcs felt completely slow. It was painfully uneven. Season 7 may be rushed, but at least it's consistent finally.
What pisses me off is a lot of the fast travel crap could have been written to make more sense. For example how to fix the dragon stupidity: Have Danaries go with Jon to Eastwatch, then wait there when he goes out. Tada! Now Gendry's run can alert her and we're talking like a 20 minute flight. It'd even made the matching outfit work. They had the actress on the Eastwatch set, so I don't know what happened; this might have been a scheduling screw up and intended even. Just saying, little things like that can fix all the gaping holes with $0 budget increase or time loss.
Heather Holt so undead Jon, undead Beric, a captured wight and presumably sometime soon the white walker and their entire army can cross the wall but Benjamin can't. That's BS
it was said in previous seasons and in the books that the there is an enchantment that stops whites from crossing the wall. But since the knight king touched bran in that vision he had, maybe they can now breech the wall.
In the last part, you were really on to something there, I feel. Bran is in the citadel doing the green seeing, and Samwell is sitting next to him doing the writing.
Agree with you and i like to add the weakness in Jon character vs Dani and this reunions in all episodes became so boring and until now we didn't hear a thing about the night king story which must be deep and connected so it fits the show
It would've made more sense if they went past the wall with horses, a snow tent, dried food, did some hunting, had a raven with them at all times, you know, like how they always did beforehand. To catch a white walker, they needed an army, even just a small army of 100 men, even just some wildlings. They could've done it more the way George RR Martin did before.
The AtZ Show I'm glad you noticed too. And you did a video about it. It has been so sad these last two seasons to see what they have made out of it. Exactly like you said, biggest show in HBO history, just make more freaking episodes! We will wait. Do it right. Why do they have to rush and mess it all up? What a bunch of idiots
i mostly agree, the thing i do not agree with is when people say that dany could have roasted the knight king with drogons dragon fire and just destroyed the whole army of the dead. maybe im wrong but white walkers can only be killed by valyrian steel and dragon glass, unlike wights which are also killed by fire, white walkers seem to not be affected.
I'm just grateful for the show, nothing s gonna be perfect perfect and the book is longgggg, they did good with what they could do and especially with how much episodes that were alotted .
I'm glad they've made the changes. There were parts of season 4-6 especially that really felt like filler, like Arya's training and anything with Sam. But now they're making the most of the build-up. I don't even care if it's sped up, they're on series 7. Shit needs to happen fast.
Hopefully we'll get a GoT reboot in 10-15 years after George finally finishes the books. Then someone can do this show properly. Someone who won't feel the need to rush through the final episodes and can continue telling a proper story with consistent pacing until the end. I wouldn't even mind more filler episodes to fill in some lore/backstory of more characters. Many characters were cut out of the books and/or were combined for the show. 15 episodes a season for 10 seasons sounds about right to me.
Here's something to consider. If we had a full ten episode season, would the special effects have been as good? It seems to me that they shifted the budget to give us some really satisfying holy shit moments and had to sacrifice some of the pacing as a result. I personally don't mind THAT much.
There's always been some time jumps the audience must infer in Game of Thrones, certain lines would be followed more on the journey while others would just go straight from A to B, Vikings does the same thing, they leave it up to the audience to assume the lapse in time, really not too big of a deal, should be used to it by now. No reason to waste time on filler travel. Also, I wonder if the Night King has some greenseer ability, maybe he knew waiting would get him a dragon.
You said they are treating it more like a movie instead of a tv show but I think someone from the makers of game of thrones said that these last 2 seasons would be 2 seven hour movies... something around that and I recently watched the previous episodes on Sunday before episode 6 ( i watched the early leak but still) and it actually kinda does play like a movie back to back to back with little to no time skips so I think the biggest problem with these last two seasons is they are releasing them like previous game of thrones seasons when they should of really done something like Netflix and release them all at once so people could enjoy them in their full glory... at least in my opinion
Teleportation has driven me crazy in Season 7 but nothing bothers me more than Jamie and Bron ten miles away from the Lannister BBQ after showing us Jamie sinking to the bottom of an abyss. UGGGH!!!! Absolutely no way Jamie in armor is going to make in 10 miles away up a hill.
This is what happens when Dan & Dave grabbed a half finished masterpiece and think "Hey this is good! Let's adapt it!" But then realize that they have to jump ship when George RR Martin states he won't have the books done on time. In all honesty they should've adapted the show the 7 volume collection way Book 1=Season 1 Book 2=Season 2 Book 3=Season 3 Book 3.5=Season 4 Book 4=Season 5 Book 5=Season 6 Book 5.5=Season 7 And more than likely Book 6 is so long it needs to be split in two so, Book 6=Season 8 Book 6.5=Season 9 And finally book 7=Season 10 That way all the storylines from the books can be fully adapted on to the screen and that way at the very least we get 8-9 seasons of what George RR wanted to make.
I don't have an issue with the show itself. I have an issue with the fan base. I don't think spoilers exist, but that's just my opinion. If someone can explain to me why knowing the words "red wedding" ruins everything or why I am supposed to care, I might check it out. I find it hard to believe anything can be so good that uttering as single word describing it destroys the entire series. From the outside it sounds like, "if you knew anything about this show, you wouldn't watch it".
"We don't want Daenaerys to fall off" "We don't want her to fall off." "Fall off." This woman is descended from a dynasty who called themselves dragons. She sat in the middle of a fiyah and didn't get burnt. She rides around on a huge-ass dragon that knocks shit down like freaking King Kong and you all think she can't overcome a little wind resistance? I have a BTEC in aviation studies, I get everything about lift, drag, weight, thrust, but seriously. That'd be a shit way to go. Here lies Daenerys Stormborn, of the House Targareyan, first of Her Name. Mother of Dragons. Breaker of Chains. Queen of Mereen. Khaleesi of the Great, Grass Sea. Queen of the Andals, the Rhoynar, the First Men. Lady of the Seven Kingdoms and Protector of the Realm. How did she die? She fell off her dragon. Yol (Yawn Out Loud. Yes I did invent that. Tell your friends, it's gnna be thing)
Pacing is key for a series like this. And it looks like HBO lost that key and had it replaced, but it doesn't work on the lock as well as it should. That's the feeling I get when I watch the series now.
Pacing has to be relevant though. The end of the series is near, all the characters have grown to the point they should be for the final battle. Character build up takes time. Final battles don't. This season was about alliances, you don't need the slow pace stuff for that. Sure, it's different then we are used to, but it's appropriate. We already know the lands, the families, the traps, the good and bad people, we don't need 3 episode journeys anymore.
The season 8 will 100% be far worse than seasons 1-4 writing wise. The season 7 made sure of that. Making the classic good vs evil, making characters who shouldn't have met meet, making almost everybody dumb as fuck (even Tyrion and Littlefinger who died cuz got stupid).
The first 6 seasons were great the first 4 was the golden age season 5 was a big bump in the road but still felt like game of thrones season 6 I really like it seemed like they knew what they were doing once the they had gone past the books but season 7 for the reasons you said feels like a different show it's like they are fed up and just want to fast forward and ignore the past 6 seasons now it feels like a different show like a fan fiction I agree it's not terrible but it's far from the quality we have had previously I just pray that George finished the books so we have a difinitive real finish to the series
Im glad people on the internet are disappointed in the new season. I love the show even though it's basically fan service now but I seriously can't say one negative thing about the show around my friends or they all shit on me and say I always find something to hate on "even in the best show ever!". Shit, if we're going to set the bench mark for TV perfection so low we shouldn't ever expect a faithful adaption of ANYTHING.
I've just bashed all 7 seasons in a couple of months and while i do agree the change in pacing for the scene over the wall was ridiculous, it didnt bother me that much. Ive had more problems with what i see as missed opportunities for concluding a story. Like when Arya was Tywin Lannisters cup girl. I Would of liked to have seen them meet again. And I would of loved to have seen Jamie get revenge on the guy who chopped off his hand. But he was just killed in the woods by Hodor and never remembered again. Missed opportunities.
i don't like the fast pacing but you have to understand, they have to fit so much story into 7 episodes, and rumors say next season is going to be even shorter (but longer episodes)
Season 8 is coming.. And it will be the shortest season ever.
So be prepared, for the show is short and full of error..
Ancient Typewriter How many episodes?
6 episodes, unfortunately..
Ancient Typewriter Are you fucking serious. Why?
Ancient Typewriter Annnndddd, it will be the last season, which makes no sense. The show is extremely popular and even if the night king is defeated, people are going to learn how to get along with each other and that's 3 seasons worth of material, at least.
Tommy Tom 6 episodes but all of them 80-90min+ so it's like 9 regular episodes. Almost like getting a new movie every week.. Not mad at that LOL.
The problem with GoT is that it used to be based on George RR Martin's very well written "A Song of Ice and Fire" series and now it's just Dan and Dave's poorly written fan fiction 😕
You're also comparing an author that is taking 7 YEARS to write a book and the shows producers who have to write the story/dialogue and shoot the show in a year and half. I get it, the books are well crafted. Well, no shit!! It better be well written if it takes him this long!!
Maplenerd22 Previous seasons were also well crafted because they were based on those well crafted novels. They didn't have to rush the plotline- they cut quite a bit from the books to get to the ending quicker. You can't blame the well paid actors who showed no desire to leave the biggest roles of their lives, and you can't blame HBO which has granted an enormous budget and made it clear they were willing to take on the show for at least 10 seasons. You can't blame it on the special effects which have only improved with the budget, and you can't blame it on the cast which have been stellar throughout.
Dan and Dave's shift in focus to wanting to create their own pet projects (including a confederate show???) are soley to blame for the drop in quality. They're trying to wrap the series up as quickly as possible with a total disregard for the quality storytelling that made the show a hit in the first place. They ruined a great show based on great books, stop defending them
+Pete - Are you seriously suggesting they should drag this out for 10+ plus seasons like what the Walking Dead is doing?? Are you really this stupid?? If there's anyone to blame here is George RR Martin for taking so damn long to write a book. If the writers were to stretch GoT out and waited for Martin to finished his "well crafted" series, they would probably have to wait for another 8 years. That means GoT will be in its 16th seasons. No one is going to be following the show by then. Also no actor will want to be on the same show playing the same characters for 16 seasons!!!!! Imagine the show keep talking about "Winter is coming" for 16 seasons. How stupid of a show would that be.
Hey Harry Ballsak! "Last I heard" doesn't count. If you didn't read those books, you're really in no position to speak on them 😉 Talking about things you know nothing about is pretty much the definition of ignorance. If I'm a moron, at least I'm a moron who reads and only speaks on what he knows. I'll take an educated moron over an ignorant genious anyday. Oh, and those last 2 books were both long as hell- there were about 2 seasons worth of material each there. And Winds of Winter was partially delayed because the show started showing book spoilers as early as season 5 and Martin started making changes.
Maplenerd22 "10+ plus" is redundant. I'm not saying they should've dragged out anything, I'm saying they shouldn't have cut out pivotal pieces of the plot in previous seasons and kept with the standard pacing of the show. Everyone fell in love with the show back when they took the time to show character development and build upon the tension and plot. This season felt like a clift notes version of the story. No, I don't think they should drag the story along like in walking dead- unlike walking dead, this is a story with an established beginning, middle, and end. There's also a lot of content here. Even with the cuts to storylines which Dan and Dave decided not to include on the show, the ending is obviously longer than 2 seasons. You don't want to drag the story out but you don't want to rush it either. Right now it's being rushed so Dan and Dave can get started on their weird confederate show everyone is offended by. If their heart isn't in it anymore they should let someone else pick up where they left off. This was never their story to begin with so I doubt they'll be missed
I felt like that too. Consistency is key to series.
It feels like a cliche fantasy fanfic movie to me now. Especially since almost every character this season gets saved by someone or something at the last second.
I'll continue to watch it for the characters either way.
Cuz I'm a wanderer
Exactly. Those coincidences happen way too often now. And I'll watch it anyhow, too :D
Cuz I'm a wanderer - That's where I'm at with this now. Even despite the (many) issues I have with the last three seasons, it's still a fantastic show, it's just a shame that the quality of the storytelling has dropped so sharply.
The show gets alot more "basic" honestly. We used to have cool characters on every side and it used to be hard, to seperate "good" from "evil". Every side had their good and their bad. Now, every "good" character joins the same side and every "bad" character the opposing side.
Even Jaimie left cercei (probably taking bronn with him). Now there is not a single "good" character on cercei`s side
DEUCE Qyburn wasn't established as a villain. Although he probably will be, for now there is still a not purely evil character on Cersei's side.
But you're right, character motivations became much simpler lately
This show has just devolved into a fan fiction, logic and good dialogue have been thrown out of the window, the fact that people are defending and applauding this is just making the situation worse.
LeoX2727 agreed when I heard jon say... "danny" the cringe everyone with me had was like a perfect unison of cringe
Amen, pandering everywhere
No fan fiction, because it is canonical adaptation, with all the legality, etc.
Fan fiction, by definition, is un-canonical, unofficial version of the story.
LeoX2727 Logic gone yes. Dialogue though is still great. The dialogue in the last episode between the Hound and Tormund was GREAT!
and any other conversation in that episode or just that one (which was great). other was for example jon and jorah but the place was wrong that was conversation that should take place on the ship when they are going to eastwatch
Alright I absolutely hate, I hate, I hate, I hate, when people say the 'it's has dragons it doesn't need to make sense.' I'm sorry but just because something is a certain genre doesn't mean that it's rules of logic and consistency don't apply in order to make a GOOD story. The world dictates that certain things like teleportation and cringeworthy fan service and the hero is saved the last second tropes don't apply. In something like Star Trek they literally have a teleportation device that applies to the story, it doesn't here. D&D wanted to get it done as fast as possible and you 'it has dragons it doesn't need to make sense' people have butchered it for the people like myself who advised everyone i knew to watch it in the first place have been betrayed because of it. Can't wait for the reboot in 30 years when the real story will be told.
GRRM is actually _stricter_ when it comes to logic and realism than most of his fans. Saying that fantasy stories don't need to make sense is an insult to fantasy authors in general, _but also to GRRM in particular._
The fact it has magical elements means jackshit. In a story, rules are needed. Even with magic. It needs limitations and it needs to establish elements. If teleportation is a thing, cool, but it needs consistency. Sure, a writer can easily do things “just cause” but that’s cheap and ruins the story. The difference between good and bad writing is how the writer can come up with the best solutions without needing to break their rules.
It makes no sense it was just sex and useless boring characters
"why u complainin bout logic in a show with fkin dragons". No! No! No! Enough with this argument already. All these seasons we established this as a normal world like us with elements of magic. All these seasons we established that messenger ravens take time and distances are huge. They even mention in the seventh episode that ravens may take time in such storms. You can't just say fuck all that just for the sake of a dragon deus ex machina. I love a dragon deus ex machina, the scenes they are showing on screen have been stellar; but the main selling point of the series has always been its in-universe consistency, realistic situations, and complicated characterization. That is what set it apart from all other stories. That was the Game of Thrones I fell in love with. And I don't want that sacrificed for flashy scenes. I don't want a Michael Bay film, I don't want Hollywood stories, I want the real as fuck gritty story with dark fantasy elements that Game of Thrones used to be.
+Zubin Trivedi Incidentally, there is a reason why GRRM gave his dragons two legs and two wings instead of the usual four legs and two wings you see in other fantasy. He said so himself: He did it because in the real world, there is not a single animal with four legs _and_ wings. _GRRM himself thinks_ that you should care about logic and realism in fantasy - and he's stricter with that than most people, myself included.
No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No1 No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No! No!
I agree with everything you said. Although I would definitely tone down a bit lol
+1 consistency isn't the same as realism.
I don't expect GoT to be realist (there's freaking dragons ! ) but I expect its universe to be consistent : if Daenerys doesn't have the ability to compress space-time, she should not be able to compress space-time !
Not to mention all the characters have level 9000 plot armor. Bronn avoids a blast of dragonfire simply by jumping out of the way. Then he comes out of nowhere to push Jaime away from the dragonfire. Then Jaime sinks to the bottom of a lake wearing plate armor and is miraculously pulled to the surface hundreds of yards away by Bronn in the next episode. And how Jon's group miraculously runs into a frozen lake with an island in the middle. And then the ice miraculously breaks in a perfect circle thus protecting them from the zombie's until the precise time when Dany arrives. And then Jon gets left behind, surrounded by wight walkers and his furs soaked with frozen water, and out of fucking nowhere here comes Benjen with a horse. Honestly D&D can suck a dick. Guarantee the books will VASTLY different than this mess of a show ( if they ever come out, sadly )
This show was built on drama and political intrigue set in a gritty realistic medieval world ( seasons 1-4 ). Now it's just a basic hollywood-formula shit show, appealing to the idiots who want boobs and violence.
Dark Blade Also drogon barely got damaged by those harpoons that were hyped up all season. A fucking ice toothpick did more damage then qyburn's secret weapon. I was expecting to see a mangled and brutalised Drogon. Maybe this would've explained why Danny went Mad queen mode in episode 5. Also she should've captured Jamie and bronn after the battle and had Bronn burned and eaten by her dragons alongside Randyl Tarly (Rickon Tarly should escape the battle and head for oldtow now where he can have a heartfelt scene with Sam).
@@Kunumbah1 Ice toothpick? Don't be so dumb.
@@Kunumbah1 Is that what should have happened? You are a silly person! Get out of my office!
It's interesting how people are focusing so much on travel time and pacing issues when there are even bigger story issues. Like how the writers seem to be forgetting things that have been established in the show.
Like that Sansa letter they're making such a big deal over. Go back and watch previous episodes. Everyone immediately knew that Sansa wrote the letter under duress. And the letter was no longer at Winterfell since Catelyn took it to Robb.
Arya's story about learning to shoot didn't make much sense either. She said that she practiced with a bow Bran was using. Except in the first episode of the show, they were just teaching Bran to shoot and Arya immediately showed that she was a better shot by hitting the target.
Totally agree. Also, the logic behind the idea of going beyond the wall to capture a wight was just absurd. Going without any horses made it even way more absurd. And the drama at Winterfell between Arya & Sansa & Littlefinger was crap. Felt too forced & it didn't make that much sense
I hated... and i mean hated.. when Davos said "Thought you were still rowing"
This is what makes a show cheap, reacting to memes that nobody will remember in 10 years. Nobody will get that, making GoT a show of its time. And stuff like "ohh the fans liked Tormienne, lets build on that!" Cmon stop putting fanservice in and stick to the story.
But maybe thats just me... I love GoT. But yeah since the books were over.. It went downhill.
I'm not gonna lie, I laughed when Davos said that but I share your opinion.
I'm not gonna lie, I laughed when Davos said that but I share your opinion.
That was just a small little joke. It's the least of our worries. The real dumb shit is NK being able to end the war by killing drogon right next to him but he aims at viseryion.
Jere I know davos used to have the best dialogue on the planet. He was the goat and now he’s just there
+Kevin House Implying that Benioff & Weiss have a plan for the show that goes beyond "Oh look, what a great face Kit Harrington made in that scene! Let's see how we can get that again!"
Okay I don't really care about the transportation problem. The show ends next season and is 7 episodes long. My problem is that ever since last season, this show has been predictable asf and fan service. I avoided all spoilers for this season and am still able to figure out what's going to happen. Every since Martin left the writers don't know what to do and just do whatever the fans want them to do
Ashi Aku exactly it's like a clever person copying someone cleverer homework and they've been cut off
So shit finally happens in the show. After six seasons I can only say THANK LORD!
its fans like you that make me laugh it's like the same song and dance that happens with every tv series that comes from a book series, things are changed, things are left out and things are done for fan service. Just enjoy whats given to you and realise that the series will never be as good as the books in anything, only parts will.
I find it funny how stupid you look assuming that I actually read the books and am a fan of them. The books are boring to me. I think that TV is a much better medium for this type of idea/story, and it obviously is since the TV show is much more popular than the novels. But its people like you who are so closed minded to the idea of criticism that its comedic. If you honestly think that the writers have any idea what they are doing, you are wrong. Even though I don't like the books, what I can appreciate about them is that GRR Martian in no way tries to appease his fans just for the sake of appeasing them. The writers obviously didn't learn that lesson when GRR was with them and it clearly shows that they didn't learn it when he left.
since when is making an assumption close minded, it's assumative. anything on tv is a better medium because more people watch tv than read books and there is much more advertising in regards to tv shows than books. You've just got to look at it more open minded, your focus is narrowed. It makes me laugh people like you are the people joe rogan makes fun of, are wrapped up and absorbed in critcism instead of focusing on being your own self motivator and creating/finding your passion and building yourself and other people up. People love to complain because its a distraction from what they're not doing with their life.
The pacing was horrible. We did not even see anything from the unsullied since they conquered casterly rock. They just appeared randomly in kings landing.
DEUCE did we need to lol no one cares about them
I mean, yeah, it's worth a fucking explanation. So this foreign army that just took heavy losses and has presumably little to no provisions since it's fleet was burned is able to march all the way across a hostile continent and arrive at the capital to perfectly coincide with this meeting their Queen who they haven't seen in months is having...real plausible.
DEUCE One thing that bothers me is that we are never told what is the size of Daenerys' army. We don't know how many unsullied, dothraki or westerosi she has under her
yeah beacuse her army never shrinks. it is as big as it needs to be for the plot
We know how many Unsullied there are, more or less. I don't think many of them died at the hands of the harpies. But why were the Dothraki made out to be these incredible warriors? Sure they're good, but it's the Unsullied who are meant to be this unstoppable force. In the past, a relatively small number of them took down an army of Dothraki.
TL;DR
Action scenes and great CGI and mind blowing background scores salvaged a poorly written season.
D&D are good at adaptations and writing action battle sequences. The reason why the show got popular in the first place was because of its characters. Good guys make mistakes and pay for it. Bad guys have certain redeeming qualities. We feared for the safety for our favourites. Now, we don't. Because at this point, Jonny boy has the thickest plot armour and nothing can touch him.
Also, most of the characters were doing things that were out of character for them.
Tyrion being outwitted by Cersei and Jaime. (Just Tyrion being really stupid as a whole)
Dany's reaction (or lack thereof) to Viseryion's death.
Jon bending the knee and totally falling for Danaerys.
Mountain not jumping to protect Cersei in front of the wight.
Jaime sticking around with Cersei even after she burnt the Sept, killed his uncle, and by extension his last son.
Petyr Baelish doing whatever the hell he was doing in Winterfell. (Don't even get me started on the Winterfell plot this season)
What I liked about the initial seasons was not the dragons and the magic and the supernatural fantasy stuff. I liked the conversations.
*Petyr and Varys*
*Varys and Tyrion*
*Tyrion and Tywin*
*Arya and Tywin*
*Cersei and Tywin*
*Robert and Cersei*
*Jaime and Brienne*
There were so many memorable dialogues. I can't think of any quotes from this season that will stay with me.
And lastly, this does not mean I will stop watching the show.
All those dirtbags that say, "Oh if you hate it so much why do you keep watching it?" Because I'm bloody invested in this show. I've nerded out over this franchise for years. So I will never hate it. I can only be disappointed. And right now, son, I'm disappointed.
You summed up everything I was thinking pretty much. This show isn't about the dragons or magic, it's about the people and the power politics. The characters make it and they're the reason why I'll keep watching.
Right now, son, I am in sad agreement.
I think season 4 was absolutely the best season but, season 6 has the two best episodes of the show; Battle of the basterds and winds of winter. Season 7 has had some great moments so far but he's right, the pacing is crazy. I still love it though.
Nicolai Trevino Battle of the bastards had alot of awseome visuals but other than that it is terrible writing.
Hardhome and dancing dragons are my favorite episodes both in s5
Ivan Kuseta agreed
Game of Thrones SHOULD have been an animation. they could do so much more with a way smaller budget. More battle scenes, more flashback scenes, more dire wolves, giants, dragons and wight walkers.. as long as it was done right it would have definitely worked.
yeah that would have been pretty dope man. Someone could have actually told the entire story
Agreed.
It would have made it immeasurably more expensive, and IMO it wouldn't really have been that much of a benefit. GoT was never about the fantasy elements, it was very deliberately about everything else with the fantasy elements as just a plot element or a backdrop. As much fun as it would have been to have the Mountain actually *be* an 8-foot tall giant swinging a 2-meter long greatsword with one hand, so much of Game of Thrones is simply made of characters talking in rooms that ultimately making it animated would have been more of a burden than a benefit for it.
Ser Devil I have seen the first 4-5 episodes. What's your point?
I think his point is that, though the anime show is great, the live action Netflix movie was absolutely terrible :(
I don't know why Rhaegar Targaryen went to the trouble of marrying someone in secret. That revelation must have been fan service... I mean does being the rightful heir even matter in this show?
Being the rightful heir doesn't matter at all. But it was a revelation that was done quite right imo. Basically meaning jons a true targaryen by marriage right.
I know what it means. It's just that I can't make sense of Rhaegar's actions. Why did he have to keep his marriage with Lyanna a secret? Why get married at all?
let's just tread over the fact that they "annulled" a years long marriage that produced multiple children. I suppose Westeros doesn't have a word for "divorce" but still . . . like, what?
the baratheon and starks were close allies, lyanna was a stark and was to be married off to robert baratheon, rhaegar was targaryen and his father was king aries targaryen who burned ned & lyanna stark's father and brother alive, so you can see why rhaegar and lyanna's romance were kept between themselves.
Tally Bee the idea is that Rhaegar is obsessed with prophecies and that for his son aegon to be Azor Ahai he'd have to have three children like the three heads of the Targaryen dragon. Also his wife couldn't have anymore children so he annulled his marriage to have another legitimate child with the last name Targaryen.
I think it was way out of character for Deanrys to fly up there. And if the Night King is such a master javelin thrower, why didn't he just kill Jon while he was chilling on that Island? Why did Dany only take one dragon to the loot train battle, but decided to take all three beyond the wall?
Here come the "How dare you criticise the show" comments. Sorry but Dan and Dave can't write for shit, seasons 1-6 were GRRM's work.
Alfred of Wessex right!
Alfred of Wessex I mean they have to finish a story that was left on pretty much a cliffhanger. It's a lot harder than starting from scratch.
Alfred of Wessex grrm was involved in season 7 and 8....
Dude is Season 1-4 and 5 somewhat.
He wasn't what are you smoking dude?
They are using fast travel even though they haven't been there yet , plain and simple...
A Guy who likes stuff I mean there was this level of fast travel in the first seasons as well
when? and dont forget fast travel problem isnt about showing the journey but about imposibility to make the journey
@bruncla2303 - What's the impossibility? What are you basing this on? Neither the books or the show have clearly stated how far in distance each places are from one another. Perhaps the show is depicting Westeros as a much smaller place than it is perceived in the books. So maybe Eastwatch isn't that far from Dragonston.
bullshit there is a map and by few remarks in which they mentioned travel times between places u can calculate those distances and by that u have a scope of the map and the next step is just simple map reading
Dumbass, the maps are for the books!!! There are a few remarks in the books that reference distance for a few places, but they have never referenced how far Eastwatch is from Dragonstone. Even if want to consider the map as source, it still shows nothing because maps have different scales. Unless you know the the scale used, there is no way to calculate or infer distance just by looking at it. Are you seriously this stupid.
IN any case, It doesn't matter what they book says. The show doesn't have to follow the book explicitly!!! If you haven't noticed already the show have changed MANY THINGS from the book. So it's not out of reason for the show creators to decide Westeros is smaller in scale than it was depicted in the books. This explains the fast travel time.
This season was just way too short. They also dumbed Tyrion down to underpower Danaerys which was hars to watch. That being said the finale was excellent imo.
Man, you have a near-to-perfect pronunciation ( I usually need subtitles to watch English shows, and yours is an exception ) and this quirk when you say "Thrones" with a clear "r" is just a cherry on top of an awesome cake :)
The reason that everyone SEEMS to teleport is actually a deliberate choice to cut down on filler. It actually started throughout season six because all of the storylines were either going to take too long iron go by too fast.
Basically because Aryas plot was over the equivalent of a couple weeks they couldn't deal with the Jon plot being over several months. (Yknow bcuz of travel)
Logan smith whatever the reason it's still too rushed. I personally like filler as long as its interesting, provides good world building, or character development.
It's not just that it's rushed. The timeline has also stopped making sense.
The time travel begins in season 2 with Litterfinger
It's not just the pacing. The characters motivations don't feel as bound as they did before with the character's arc.
Also, G.R.R.M. left after season 5, which was the last great season. He probably was the one who advocated the slow pacing among the writers, as well as knowing the characters better than anyone else. He supposedly left to finish the books, but I read in an article recently that he wasn't caught up with the show, because he's been "too busy traveling", so I'm wondering if he left in the best of terms, or they just had too many creative differences.
Either way, I do love the show, and until recently I thought it was the greatest show ever, but now I just think that for the first 5 seasons, and I wish they would bring G.R.R.M. back for the 8th season, but I know they won't.
I also thought the alternated-reality confederate show they want to make after game of thrones would be an interesting idea, if developed correctly, but now I realize that since G.R.R.M. was the one who brought that extra sense of realism to the show, and he won't be involved, the show will most likely be just okay, but never great.
ChindogusMake Yeah once you realize it was George's original work being "adapted" for the first five seasons with George helping out and now it is them on their own you can definitely tell they might not actually be the good writers we thought... maybe good adapters?...
ChindogusMake he left after season 4
Yeah, maybe. Also, a lot of people are saying that we should go easy on them cuz they are on uncharted territory, but that's bullshit. They already spoke with George, so they know where everything is headed.
I think they are decent writers, but that's just not good enough because it was much better with George's help.
ChindogusMake Season 4*
Season 5 had Dorne and Meereen, do not call that great please.
Lars2Lars9Lars totally agree with you.
The series peaked with the fourth season
The thing with GoT is that it's crunch time now and they have to wrap everything up nicely. They've got so many characters that they need to finish with
Alex Beamer It's only crunch time because the writers have decided to only have two more seasons. They are unnaturally rushing the material.
Ethan Sensbach
Not really. I find the criticism, like in the video, is silly, because in previous seasons story and characters were being established and all leading to the certain point. So then you could make one travel into 4 episodes, because there is so much things to happen and so many people to die.
But when all of that happened, when all of the chess pieces are in place, where story was leading us, then there is no need for slow paced travels.
Making ti slow paced would force writers to come up with fillers, and as much more information you put there, you must then deal with them later
Wlof25 The problem with this is that if the ending was actually climaxing naturally then it wouldn't feel terribly rushed and underdeveloped. They are condensing multi episodes worth of material down just to find their shitty cgi budget. The show has become complete action schlock now.
Ethan Sensbach
I disagree. Because if you waste your time by slowing down, you need to get more fillers and those fillers are either just there to kill some time, that is, worthless, or those fillers would effect the story in a different way.
Before we could see slow travel, because there are so many character to develop, so many plots to do and so many people to kill.
When you have less character and story progresses almost to its end, then you cant just go around and slow down.
Wlof25 They don't need to slow down for fillers though, they need to slow down to actually explain what's going on in the plot and with the characters. In their rush to finish we're losing all the character development.
I totally agree with this
If the knight could chuck a spear to kill the dragon why didn't he do the same with the small group on the ice
Or send the dead to attack one at a time rather than a big group that breaks the ice
They could just exhaust them to death
I mean it has to be the king is f'ing with them.
Playing with his good.
And where this story lacks is the white walkers.
Everyone else we are given a super realism. We learn all about them and what they want. But the walkers...no....
We don't understand them...what are they...are they just a virus that grows without any other purpose?
they already told us what they are, they are magical weapons made by the children of the forest to fight against the first men who invaded westeros, but the children of the forest and the first men eventually came to a truce in which the children of the forest would be left alone and live in their forest and the first men can have the rest of the lands to grow their crops and build their settlements, but despite the peace, the white walkers still existed to do what it was made to do, kill.
That was The nightkings plan all along to get daenerys to save them so he can destroy the wall.
Poltical espionage, grey moral characters, characters acting out of their personality and consequences are fading away from the show. And it sucks to see a great show become a good show.
My favorite part of that episode I that they traveled from the wall to King’s Landing within just a few minutes or the viewer. I love the show and the story but that whole whitewalker capture expedition was ridiculous, they were practically teleporting all over the kingdoms.
I can't believe so many people are criticizing GRRM for not finishing his books sooner. Well BS, I don't want him to finish the books and deliver something at the level of Game of Thrones S7 (and pretty much 6), seriously, it is better left unfinished and leaving the space to so many theories that will never be resolved.
But I believe that GRRM will finish it, he is taking his time to do it right, and I believe that books will be published after series ends, with things playing out completely different, probably with a different ending.
cudos to GRRM for not rushing things.
regarding D&D, I can't believe that they are so lost without the books, I understand that it is GRRM's vision and that he is the only one who can comprehend the entire thing, but dumbing down of the main characters, just killing them of willy-nilly, cause they have nothing for them to do, so many deus ex machina moments, total BS.
Show quality went from 9.5 to 5.8. Someone mentioned the quality of the books going down, but there it is more like from 9.8 to 9.1.
it's the budget they can't afford to pay the CGI for the dragons and direwolf, night king etc. since it is reaching its end they can't afford to stuff too much filler between those traveling points. so instead of spending time between point A and B you skip B and go to D. Its not much traveling speed it's pacing speed has picked up. They kill off direwolves for the same reason. Its all about budget and logistics.
davidcici11Evolution No, it's not. They've got enough money, I mean they even paid Emilia a fucking 1000000 per episode. HBO even wanted to pay D&D to make the seasons 7 and 8 longer, but D&D didn't want to.
elvis radins Exactly
davidcici11Evolution "They don't have enough budget", but you know they gotta have that zombie polar bear.
Finally someone understands
Finally, I have found a video where someone ACTUALLY represents their arguments correctly and backs them up with facts.
I have seen countless videos bashing Game of Thrones Season 7. But you sir, you point out the actual flaws in the show without being ignorant and over-exaggerating everything. I completely agree with everything you have said.
Although, one thing that almost everyone forgets is that George R.R. Martin supposedly has iffy health as of right now. It could be that they are purposely rushing the show in hopes to finish it before his passing. :( Which bothers me but at the same time, I would rather have George R.R. Martin administering the writing of a rushed storyline FOR THE TV SHOW. I heard the books are literal perfection. So I hope they stay that way and are not rushed at all.
Thanks for the shoutout :) I feel ya so much on this, the decline in logic and quality of writing is breaking my heart because I freaking LOVE "Game of Thrones". They're rushing this season to the detriment of the show. This is becoming fantasy action, while we all fell in love with the actual GAME of thrones.
THANK YOU, I'm probably one of the biggest got out there and the pacing of season 7 is driving me insane. The shorten seasons aren't doing the show justice. I said these to couple of my friends that completely disagree with me. It's shaking my vibe on the show due to the pacing. It's annoying but the action we are getting is something we have never seen in previous seasons. Although the action sense aren't as rewarding as they use to be. The battle of the bastards the second greatest episode in the series to date. It was so jaw dropping and satisfying because we had so much anticipation for it, and it made it so much more awesome.
What is the problem? Benioff and Weiss are good at adapting, but they are poor original writers. They were not competent to end Game of Thrones in a way that most people liked. Everybody thought they must be geniuses when they won those Emmies, especially Benioff and Weiss. But they weren’t geniuses, they were The Wizard of Oz. They were nothing but a Big Humbug. And in the end they escaped in their balloon. And they couldn’t take Dorothy with them, because “they don’t know how it woiks.” The deteriorating writing wasn’t really noticeable in earlier seasons, when the plot was kind of meandering around amorphously with little direction. But at the end, when important plot points had to be resolved, they fell flat on their faces. Then all their failings came prominently to the front. What can be done about this? Nothing, it’s over. That’s just the way it goes. Don’t trust Benioff and Weiss any more, that’s all.
I like what you had to say. I also thought the Benjin thing was odd as well. However when I thought about it more, Benjin was still under the assumption that he couldn't cross the wall due to magic placed over it which was mentioned a couple season ago. I think when the night king touched Bran it enabled him to now cross over therefore breaking the magic possibly.... so Benjin maybe just had enough and sacrificed himself lol
Yeah I really wanted to see a few episodes of gendry running his way back, the raven flying to Dragon stone,Danaerys flying to Jon and his team , all while cutting every now and then to Jon and his team chilling at the lake and white walkers doing nothing.That'd have really helped the pacing and the story telling.
You did not just put good luck Charlie over game of thrones. Please I did not just hear that, NO SIR!
You are correct however you need to redo your math. The UK, where apparently GoT is set, is quite small. A dragon could travel south to north with 3-6 hours. But Danny should freeze way up there. The raven situation still baffles me in the show. It seemed as fast as tweet, unless time does actually go by but they don't show it like it used to. Which would mean that Jon Snow has been away from Winterfell for months if not a year (longest winter ever!!!) I won't even mentioned how slow the boats should be. That's why I stop complaining about it. She should still be at sea... If you want to add some logic into it, which I do every Sunday then I remember that I want the story to progress so I let them defy all those great natural laws. Can't wait for the finale😁😎, let's have a 10 year time jump! 😋
Tbh tho i kinda think that same problem was in good luck charlie :P especially in the road trip movie they did...
How dare you...
Your theory at the end of the video legitimately blew my mind.
Hahaha dope video man, the ending was great. Def opened my mind to something new about got
I have an even BETTER theory. What if Bran is training the NEW three eyed raven? 😈
That's exactly what I've been saying in all the bloody fan-forums but these idiots' only excuse is "it's a fantasy show, why bother?" The Known World has its own set of rules and the show has done its best to show us the time that passes while travelling and the character development that happens during that period. This episode could've easily been used to do that instead of "Easter Egg" references and sex jokes.
My suggestion: The entire episode should've been about the journey (even though it's the dumbest reason for a journey) interjected by whatever is happening elsewhere and it should've ended with Gendry running away and the lot of them just stuck there. Because that's what they used to do before. They used to show Stannis sailing for KL at the end and resume that in the next episode. That'd at least give a sense of progression of time in our minds and in this case, serve as a great cliff-hanger.
NOTE: They've fucked up the cliff-hangers as well in this Season.
they could have saved the 6th episode by gendry running off and then the rest of the time spent with Jon Snow and crew showing the passage of time and perhaps one of them wondering what the wights were waiting for (not knowing about the dragons coming). Then when they almost get overwhelmed suddenly the dragons swoop into view unexpected and we have a Han Solo moment in the first Star Wars. And Dany could have said she decided to follow them to the Wall which is why she arrived so quickly.
TBH, I would choose to wait 5 more years for the genius plotlines George writes than endure this stupidity from the current show writers. The writing is so bad, time bends when it suits them, characters have become dumb while they used to surprise us in previous seasons, dialogues are mediocre. So disappointed. Stupid Plotlines. Plain Stupid. Episode 6 of this season is the most dissatisfying climax episode in the history of GOT.
Plus the whole "convincing Cersei" plot is Stupid af.
That ending is pretty accurate in my opinion. Maybe not Bran, but maybe someone else. It's sort of like a really long story, something that can be told in a bar for the centuries to come in Westeros. Something like a song, a song of ice and fire :^)
It seems people don't understand that they are winding down the season. the creators are trying to conclude the entire series. Now I don't think that's a good idea, they are trying to wrap up all the plot lines that GRRM has in the books, I think they should make a new stopping point, which would satisfy what has happened in the show. In other words they should create their own finish line instead of reaching for GRRM.
I think with how the latest seasons are being "rushed" is more to do with whats happening in the show itself.
The characters are getting more desperate and seem to be rushing about trying to fight the enemies in the north while also trying to get the throne and defeat the enemies in the south while also trying to gain allies. I think the producers are running with that and making it similar in the episode and season layouts.
I could be completely wrong but that's my theory on it.
The reason there were so many of these filler episodes was so we the audience could see the characters personalities and how they grew and developed. All those scenes when people are travelling, they are always having a conversation with someone about something and it dove us into how said character thinks and that is what was so great about those filler episodes. With that being said, season 7 and 8 are the climax of the entire show, we no longer need those filler episodes to learn more about characters since we already know all we need to know. There aren't really any important new characters being introduced and so no need for the 'travel' scenes. This makes the show seem more fast paced but it means we get to experience more what we've been waiting for throughout all these years.
You make some good points - I was saying something similar at work but as succinct as you've put it!
Is anyone else pissed that no main characters are being killed off? I know it sounds strange but Game of Thrones has always been amazing because it's been realistic regardless of the many fantastical aspects, the human element has always been prominent. So far there has been so many incidents where main characters should have easily died ended up staying alive.
Tried to watch 3 episodes , it was so trash i could not continue , what a joke.
I remember a time when fantasy and magic was uncool. Just like wearing Star Wars stuff got u bullied
Wow, I think your onto it. This was a great video, I still love both books and show, but really they need some more pacing help. I would like a amiddle ground though. Imagine if we had this episode spaced out over 3 episodes, it would have been slow... I just want it more middle ground.
by the way, no one used the weirnet from Bran...
But the reason why they're not showing the travels anymore is specifically because they have been showing them for the past 6 seasons. In these seasons, they had to show it because they had to introduce the characters and the places.
This is the last act of the series. This is the season in which the story is closing on itself. We have already been introduced to Westeros, we don't need to see the characters travelling from point A to point B anymore; we just need the already-established characters to interact and to be brought together in already-established locations. Some things are a bit stretched but overall you can't blame the show for simply going faster when it nears the end. All stories do that.
Amazing content as always brother. I'm glad you decided to do an episode that actually finds the flaws in a show as great as Game of Thrones, because there are flaws. But flaws and all this season has been nothing short of spectacular. I can't wait to see how it all ends, Hopefully not in 2019.
That year long wait is gonna suck!!
They could have made the ep6 thing more believable if they had shown them on the mound at different periods of the day/night talking about how the supplies had run out and questioning why they weren't being attacked. Being surrounded by still zombies for 5 days would have been pretty creepy. They could have also had conflict arising between them out of the stress of it all.
But whatever I don't think the pacing is the biggest issue of GoT (from s5 onwards), the nosedive in writing has been far worse.
My biggest problem is that it feels like Fan Fiction which gets worse because of the plot holes they created. For Example:
In the books the wall will most likely come down thorugh the Horn of Winter, which was never mentioned in the Show.
The Book fans would love to have an ice dragon in the story... so they got a Undead Dragon that breathes "ice" to take down the wall...
AtZ Show: The story of Game of Thrones is not told by Brandon Stark, but by Samwell Tarly. It will be know under the name of "A Song of Ice and Fire". But only by a few survivors. Because now that winter is here, it's here to last for a generation. #TeamNightKing
it have turn up to Game of Convenience, so many clise, and predicable. Dario was left to esos so action hero john can hook up with dany. Brother of sam is dead so leater fan favorite sam can be lord, stupis 2 episode drama of aria and the letter, tryng to ad some suspemse before kill littlefinger. Smart Characters like varis, litlefinger, tyrion, annihilated in favor to action heroes and dam spetacle. Deus ex macina all the time, benjing purpose is to show last time and save, bran, john. Army of the dead, nerfed to oblivion, so easely to kill rigth now. Shoe have estabilish how the army of the dead will end, just kill the nigthking and all the army will imediatly colapse, a clise we have see so many time in so many movies.
My problem with Game of Thrones can be summed up with one single quote from Benioff & Weiss.
_"We reconecptualized the role to make it worthy of the actor's talents."_
If you don't get why that's a problem, check out The Dragon Demands' RUclips channel.
Honestly....I saw a few episodes but I couldn't get into this show. I cant shake my original thought since day 1 that this entire series is nothing but a cheap watered down American version of LOTR.
I had the exact same question when I was watching this episode and yes the last season is comparatively the worst of them all because it was so predictable...
I loved the first three seasons, but I honestly felt the pacing was a bigger issue from seasons 4-6. At times some character arcs felt rushed, while other arcs felt completely slow. It was painfully uneven. Season 7 may be rushed, but at least it's consistent finally.
What pisses me off is a lot of the fast travel crap could have been written to make more sense. For example how to fix the dragon stupidity: Have Danaries go with Jon to Eastwatch, then wait there when he goes out. Tada! Now Gendry's run can alert her and we're talking like a 20 minute flight. It'd even made the matching outfit work. They had the actress on the Eastwatch set, so I don't know what happened; this might have been a scheduling screw up and intended even. Just saying, little things like that can fix all the gaping holes with $0 budget increase or time loss.
Sad that HBO went from great shows like The Sopranos, The Wire, Oz, Deadwood, just to name a few to trash like Games of Thrones.
PS. I don't think Benjin is dead.
He said "it's not time" since he can't cross the wall he couldn't go with Jon.
Heather Holt so undead Jon, undead Beric, a captured wight and presumably sometime soon the white walker and their entire army can cross the wall but Benjamin can't. That's BS
I'm a burrito exactly why can everyone but benjen cross the wall it really doesn't make sense
HarryMoho Idk I guess because he's half white walker
it was said in previous seasons and in the books that the there is an enchantment that stops whites from crossing the wall. But since the knight king touched bran in that vision he had, maybe they can now breech the wall.
They could breach the wall by the help of Dany's dragon.
But seriously, Benjen really died and it was another big failure by D&D's writing.
In the last part, you were really on to something there, I feel. Bran is in the citadel doing the green seeing, and Samwell is sitting next to him doing the writing.
2:45 "This is when row-your-boat Gendry has to Usain Bolt it back..." 😂😂😂😂😂
GOT was good early seasons now it's just Over hyped as fck
Agree with you and i like to add the weakness in Jon character vs Dani and this reunions in all episodes became so boring and until now we didn't hear a thing about the night king story which must be deep and connected so it fits the show
"It may not be up there with good luck charlie" lmao
Season 7 was really boring for me I couldn't get into it I haven't finished the season either
It would've made more sense if they went past the wall with horses, a snow tent, dried food, did some hunting, had a raven with them at all times, you know, like how they always did beforehand. To catch a white walker, they needed an army, even just a small army of 100 men, even just some wildlings. They could've done it more the way George RR Martin did before.
The AtZ Show I'm glad you noticed too. And you did a video about it. It has been so sad these last two seasons to see what they have made out of it. Exactly like you said, biggest show in HBO history, just make more freaking episodes! We will wait. Do it right. Why do they have to rush and mess it all up? What a bunch of idiots
HBO wants more episodes, but D&D want out.
This is exactly how I've been feeling! You spoke it so well!
Completely agree. I do feel like it's becoming rushed, they're quickly wrapping things up, that's how it feels right now.
i mostly agree, the thing i do not agree with is when people say that dany could have roasted the knight king with drogons dragon fire and just destroyed the whole army of the dead. maybe im wrong but white walkers can only be killed by valyrian steel and dragon glass, unlike wights which are also killed by fire, white walkers seem to not be affected.
I'm just grateful for the show, nothing s gonna be perfect perfect and the book is longgggg, they did good with what they could do and especially with how much episodes that were alotted .
I'm glad they've made the changes. There were parts of season 4-6 especially that really felt like filler, like Arya's training and anything with Sam. But now they're making the most of the build-up. I don't even care if it's sped up, they're on series 7. Shit needs to happen fast.
Hopefully we'll get a GoT reboot in 10-15 years after George finally finishes the books. Then someone can do this show properly. Someone who won't feel the need to rush through the final episodes and can continue telling a proper story with consistent pacing until the end. I wouldn't even mind more filler episodes to fill in some lore/backstory of more characters. Many characters were cut out of the books and/or were combined for the show. 15 episodes a season for 10 seasons sounds about right to me.
Here's something to consider. If we had a full ten episode season, would the special effects have been as good? It seems to me that they shifted the budget to give us some really satisfying holy shit moments and had to sacrifice some of the pacing as a result. I personally don't mind THAT much.
Dude its a fantasy show there are dragons there are ice zombies why do you care about fysics
that was actually an awesome theory at the end lol
There's always been some time jumps the audience must infer in Game of Thrones, certain lines would be followed more on the journey while others would just go straight from A to B, Vikings does the same thing, they leave it up to the audience to assume the lapse in time, really not too big of a deal, should be used to it by now. No reason to waste time on filler travel.
Also, I wonder if the Night King has some greenseer ability, maybe he knew waiting would get him a dragon.
You said they are treating it more like a movie instead of a tv show but I think someone from the makers of game of thrones said that these last 2 seasons would be 2 seven hour movies... something around that and I recently watched the previous episodes on Sunday before episode 6 ( i watched the early leak but still) and it actually kinda does play like a movie back to back to back with little to no time skips so I think the biggest problem with these last two seasons is they are releasing them like previous game of thrones seasons when they should of really done something like Netflix and release them all at once so people could enjoy them in their full glory... at least in my opinion
I lost it when he said extra from AMC XD
Watch the Dragon Demands, if you dare.
Teleportation has driven me crazy in Season 7 but nothing bothers me more than Jamie and Bron ten miles away from the Lannister BBQ after showing us Jamie sinking to the bottom of an abyss. UGGGH!!!! Absolutely no way Jamie in armor is going to make in 10 miles away up a hill.
This is what happens when Dan & Dave grabbed a half finished masterpiece and think
"Hey this is good! Let's adapt it!"
But then realize that they have to jump ship when George RR Martin states he won't have the books done on time.
In all honesty they should've adapted the show the 7 volume collection way
Book 1=Season 1
Book 2=Season 2
Book 3=Season 3
Book 3.5=Season 4
Book 4=Season 5
Book 5=Season 6
Book 5.5=Season 7
And more than likely Book 6 is so long it needs to be split in two so,
Book 6=Season 8
Book 6.5=Season 9
And finally book 7=Season 10
That way all the storylines from the books can be fully adapted on to the screen and that way at the very least we get 8-9 seasons of what George RR wanted to make.
I don't have an issue with the show itself. I have an issue with the fan base. I don't think spoilers exist, but that's just my opinion. If someone can explain to me why knowing the words "red wedding" ruins everything or why I am supposed to care, I might check it out. I find it hard to believe anything can be so good that uttering as single word describing it destroys the entire series. From the outside it sounds like, "if you knew anything about this show, you wouldn't watch it".
"We don't want Daenaerys to fall off"
"We don't want her to fall off."
"Fall off."
This woman is descended from a dynasty who called themselves dragons. She sat in the middle of a fiyah and didn't get burnt. She rides around on a huge-ass dragon that knocks shit down like freaking King Kong and you all think she can't overcome a little wind resistance? I have a BTEC in aviation studies, I get everything about lift, drag, weight, thrust, but seriously.
That'd be a shit way to go. Here lies Daenerys Stormborn, of the House Targareyan, first of Her Name. Mother of Dragons. Breaker of Chains. Queen of Mereen. Khaleesi of the Great, Grass Sea. Queen of the Andals, the Rhoynar, the First Men. Lady of the Seven Kingdoms and Protector of the Realm.
How did she die? She fell off her dragon.
Yol (Yawn Out Loud. Yes I did invent that. Tell your friends, it's gnna be thing)
I think the change of pace was much needed, I got tired of all the feeling and I really really need it a change in the space.
Pacing is key for a series like this. And it looks like HBO lost that key and had it replaced, but it doesn't work on the lock as well as it should. That's the feeling I get when I watch the series now.
Pacing has to be relevant though. The end of the series is near, all the characters have grown to the point they should be for the final battle.
Character build up takes time.
Final battles don't. This season was about alliances, you don't need the slow pace stuff for that.
Sure, it's different then we are used to, but it's appropriate. We already know the lands, the families, the traps, the good and bad people, we don't need 3 episode journeys anymore.
The season 8 will 100% be far worse than seasons 1-4 writing wise. The season 7 made sure of that. Making the classic good vs evil, making characters who shouldn't have met meet, making almost everybody dumb as fuck (even Tyrion and Littlefinger who died cuz got stupid).
Except this is good vs evil executed poorly. Lord of The Rings is good vs evil but done in a nice consistent way.
The first 6 seasons were great the first 4 was the golden age season 5 was a big bump in the road but still felt like game of thrones season 6 I really like it seemed like they knew what they were doing once the they had gone past the books but season 7 for the reasons you said feels like a different show it's like they are fed up and just want to fast forward and ignore the past 6 seasons now it feels like a different show like a fan fiction I agree it's not terrible but it's far from the quality we have had previously I just pray that George finished the books so we have a difinitive real finish to the series
My problem with the show is that a lot of the dialogue are a bunch of backstories, and they only rarely backing up any of it.
Im glad people on the internet are disappointed in the new season. I love the show even though it's basically fan service now but I seriously can't say one negative thing about the show around my friends or they all shit on me and say I always find something to hate on "even in the best show ever!". Shit, if we're going to set the bench mark for TV perfection so low we shouldn't ever expect a faithful adaption of ANYTHING.
I've just bashed all 7 seasons in a couple of months and while i do agree the change in pacing for the scene over the wall was ridiculous, it didnt bother me that much. Ive had more problems with what i see as missed opportunities for concluding a story. Like when Arya was Tywin Lannisters cup girl. I Would of liked to have seen them meet again. And I would of loved to have seen Jamie get revenge on the guy who chopped off his hand. But he was just killed in the woods by Hodor and never remembered again. Missed opportunities.
i don't like the fast pacing but you have to understand, they have to fit so much story into 7 episodes, and rumors say next season is going to be even shorter (but longer episodes)