Thank you so much for the superb English Royal History documentaries. I am an American (Kentuckian, to be exact) who is a serious Anglophile, obsessed with history! I also HAVE to be tuned in to these kinds of docs to even think about sleeping. But my brain still computes some of the stories, as I dream about Princes in Towers and lopsided, sinister Uncle King Richards, Henry XIIIs with Turkey legs and William of Oranges chasing out the Stuarts, And Richard IIs stopping the Peasants from their revolts nightly, lol. Again thanks. 😉
This is my 2 cents. After watching/hearing countless takes on this account, I have yet to see them piece it together. Perhaps if/when King Charles/King William agree to forensic DNA testing of the bones, we will never really know. Edward V was at first brought to the tower alone, since he was king apparent. Having him there gave Richard III time to think of what to do next. Then Queen Elizabeth quickly brought her and her royal children to Westminster Abbey for asylum. Realizing if anything happened to Edward, his younger brother Richard was next in line. So Richard III needed to have both boys in the tower. Even though he later had all the royal children declared illegitimate, to influence the people to call for him to be King, they would always be a threat to him. The younger brother Richard Duke Of York was supposedly brought to the tower months later by a Cardinal/Bishop under the pretense to assist Edward in preparations for his coronation. Elizabeth knew if both her boys were taken, they would be murdered with no heir, so kept Richard hidden and later when Cardinal returned for the boy, she had swapped another boy in his place while a friend close to her family took Richard away to safety. So long story short, my 2 cents is that if and when DNA testing is done on the bones, they might just find that they are not related. I think this might be the reason Queen Elizabeth II had denied access for DNA testing. If it was found out that one of the boys DNA did not match, means Richard had escaped/swapped. If that is the case, then his line of decendants have a legitimate claim to her throne. I love history and am most fascinated with the war of the roses and the boys in the tower. I hope the DNA testing goes through, just to solve a part of that mystery, although that might open up a big can of worms!
Sorry guys, but there were a lot of mistakes in it. Just one prince (Edward) was at Stony Stratford. The other was with his mother in the asylum of Westminster Abbey. Richard was moved to the tower more than two months after his fathers death. Edward almost to the day one month after it. That’s not days later. Just to name a few from the first six minutes. If you try to solve one of the greatest mysteries of medieval England, this is IMO not acceptable.
@@cyndephillipshohbein8232 which one? Edward being the only prince in Stony Stratford or Richard being in sanctuary with his mother? You can find it in various sources (Mancini, More, Croyland Chronicle and in books as well as papers about the princes and/or the wars of the roses like the one by Dan Jones or Thornton.
You are absolutely correct on the mistakes . While my degree is not history-related, I am fascinated byEnglish Medieval & Early Modern History. I am constantly reading, researching or watching Documentaries or courses on the subject. IMO Richard most likely was to blame, however due to the Woodville's ambitions & desperation to not lose their power, he really didn't have a lot of options. He would have had a target on his back & most definitely lost his position and wealth if young Edward had been crowned. Its very tragic that innocent kids were caught in the crossfire.
Why is Richard considered as evil? Just because he supposedly killed two kids? These boys was out of the picture so he have no reason to do so. But Tudor had.
That dude at about 38:15 said Richard had convinced Parliament to declare all of Edward IV's children illegitimate, including the princes in the tower, and that was the end of it, they were no longer a threat to Richard III. What a steaming pantload, that guy obviously understands nothing (or he's choosing to be obtuse) about medieval power politics. So long as those boys lived, they would have been a constant threat, an ever-present focal point for rebellions seeking to displace Richard and replace him with one of the two princes. The whole illegitimacy thing was a fig leaf with which Richard could pacify some of the nobility and some of the public. However, there would always be those who would believe the princes were the rightful heirs, and fight to put them on the throne. And it would only take one of them to succeed to bring Richard III down.
It was not both Perkins Warbeck and lambert Simnel who claimed to be Richard or York. Lambert Simnel was presented as Edward Plantaganet, Earl of Warwick
Exactly and that too me smacks of Perkin Warbeck being an imposter, because if Richard Duke of York had survived, he would of had a better claim than Edward, Earl of Warwick. The die hard Yorkists must of figured after Lambert Simnel, that presenting someone as one of the Princes in the Tower not only presented a better claim than Henry Tudor, but also was someone that Henry could not prove with the real McCoy without destroying his on claim to the throne.
Lambert Simnel and Perkin Warbeck are names that Henry Tudor gave to Edward V and Richard Duke of York, respectively. Henry also tried to cause doubt among the population by saying that Lambert was claiming to be Edward of Warwick, who he had imprisoned in the Tower since he was 10. This way, he could parade Warwick around as proof. Edward V never claimed that he was anyone else other than Edward IV's son. Same thing with his brother, Richard. Edward V was either killed at the Battle of Stoke, or his face was disfigured by a deep cut to the muscles of the jaw (making it impossible for him to talk) and ended his life as John Evans. Richard of York was caught, after he aborted an invasion of England on his behalf by Scotland. After his face had been pummeled, he was executed in 1499. His sister, Queen Elizabeth, became ill at the news, and was in the process of settingup a household separate from Henry, when she died in childbirth.
Doesn't make sense, there were 2 skeletons found under the staircase, 2. Two males the same age as Rich III nephews. They were killed inside the Tower. The other who claimed to be a survivor was an imposter.
This is a situation in history that fascinates me. I believe Richard did not want the Woodville family to come into any greater power than they already had. And with Young Edward on the throne that surely would have been the case. Richard most likely would have been executed at some point in the future. The timeline is, I think telling. When King Edward died, Richard did not go to London, instead he went to meet up with Young Edward on 4/29/1483, the next day he has Young Edward's maternal uncle and half brother arrested and imprisoned. Then takes Young Edward to the Tower of London by 5/19/1483. Young Richard jones his brother at the Tower on 6/16/1483. Sermon is preached that Edward IV's children were illegitimate on 6/22/1483 and by 6/25/1483 the people of London petition for Richard to be King. Richard orders the death of the Young Edward's maternal uncle and half brother the same day (I question if he had the authority to do that but after he was on a path of no return). Richard is crowned Richard III on 7/6/1483 and the young princes are not seen after the summer of 1483. I think Richard III believed he was the Plantagenet heir and he deserved to be King not some Woodville child. Henry IV cut out the Mortimer children so what was the big deal cutting out Edward IV's children. The problem was Edward IV's heirs were in the directly line after their Father the King. When they matured, they would have fought to regain their rightful place. What a messed up family King Edward III had.
I have a theory if the boys were killed. Everyone thinks it had the be the men in their life…but no one thinks of the women. I remember hearing that Richard the 3rd’s wife was quite power hungry. Or Henry the 7th mother Margret Beaufort worked hard to get her son on the throne. Tho my money is on Richard’s the 3rds wife.
Thank you so much for the superb English Royal History documentaries. I am an American (Kentuckian, to be exact) who is a serious Anglophile, obsessed with history! I also HAVE to be tuned in to these kinds of docs to even think about sleeping. But my brain still computes some of the stories, as I dream about Princes in Towers and lopsided, sinister Uncle King Richards, Henry XIIIs with Turkey legs and William of Oranges chasing out the Stuarts, And Richard IIs stopping the Peasants from their revolts nightly, lol.
Again thanks. 😉
This is my 2 cents. After watching/hearing countless takes on this account, I have yet to see them piece it together. Perhaps if/when King Charles/King William agree to forensic DNA testing of the bones, we will never really know.
Edward V was at first brought to the tower alone, since he was king apparent. Having him there gave Richard III time to think of what to do next. Then Queen Elizabeth quickly brought her and her royal children to Westminster Abbey for asylum. Realizing if anything happened to Edward, his younger brother Richard was next in line. So Richard III needed to have both boys in the tower. Even though he later had all the royal children declared illegitimate, to influence the people to call for him to be King, they would always be a threat to him.
The younger brother Richard Duke Of York was supposedly brought to the tower months later by a Cardinal/Bishop under the pretense to assist Edward in preparations for his coronation. Elizabeth knew if both her boys were taken, they would be murdered with no heir, so kept Richard hidden and later when Cardinal returned for the boy, she had swapped another boy in his place while a friend close to her family took Richard away to safety.
So long story short, my 2 cents is that if and when DNA testing is done on the bones, they might just find that they are not related. I think this might be the reason Queen Elizabeth II had denied access for DNA testing. If it was found out that one of the boys DNA did not match, means Richard had escaped/swapped. If that is the case, then his line of decendants have a legitimate claim to her throne.
I love history and am most fascinated with the war of the roses and the boys in the tower. I hope the DNA testing goes through, just to solve a part of that mystery, although that might open up a big can of worms!
Sorry guys, but there were a lot of mistakes in it. Just one prince (Edward) was at Stony Stratford. The other was with his mother in the asylum of Westminster Abbey. Richard was moved to the tower more than two months after his fathers death. Edward almost to the day one month after it. That’s not days later. Just to name a few from the first six minutes. If you try to solve one of the greatest mysteries of medieval England, this is IMO not acceptable.
I'm Curious; where did you obtain this information, please?
@@cyndephillipshohbein8232 which one? Edward being the only prince in Stony Stratford or Richard being in sanctuary with his mother? You can find it in various sources (Mancini, More, Croyland Chronicle and in books as well as papers about the princes and/or the wars of the roses like the one by Dan Jones or Thornton.
You are absolutely correct on the mistakes . While my degree is not history-related, I am fascinated byEnglish Medieval & Early Modern History. I am constantly reading, researching or watching Documentaries or courses on the subject. IMO Richard most likely was to blame, however due to the Woodville's ambitions & desperation to not lose their power, he really didn't have a lot of options. He would have had a target on his back & most definitely lost his position and wealth if young Edward had been crowned. Its very tragic that innocent kids were caught in the crossfire.
Why is Richard considered as evil? Just because he supposedly killed two kids? These boys was out of the picture so he have no reason to do so. But Tudor had.
Bc having two living kings in the same kingdom is one too many. The boys could be easily used as a figurehead of anyone wanting to rebel.
Richard wasn't evil he was thrown under the bus as by tudor propaganda and king henry tudor vii
That dude at about 38:15 said Richard had convinced Parliament to declare all of Edward IV's children illegitimate, including the princes in the tower, and that was the end of it, they were no longer a threat to Richard III. What a steaming pantload, that guy obviously understands nothing (or he's choosing to be obtuse) about medieval power politics. So long as those boys lived, they would have been a constant threat, an ever-present focal point for rebellions seeking to displace Richard and replace him with one of the two princes. The whole illegitimacy thing was a fig leaf with which Richard could pacify some of the nobility and some of the public. However, there would always be those who would believe the princes were the rightful heirs, and fight to put them on the throne. And it would only take one of them to succeed to bring Richard III down.
It was not both Perkins Warbeck and lambert Simnel who claimed to be Richard or York. Lambert Simnel was presented as Edward Plantaganet, Earl of Warwick
Exactly and that too me smacks of Perkin Warbeck being an imposter, because if Richard Duke of York had survived, he would of had a better claim than Edward, Earl of Warwick. The die hard Yorkists must of figured after Lambert Simnel, that presenting someone as one of the Princes in the Tower not only presented a better claim than Henry Tudor, but also was someone that Henry could not prove with the real McCoy without destroying his on claim to the throne.
Lambert Simnel and Perkin Warbeck are names that Henry Tudor gave to Edward V and Richard Duke of York, respectively. Henry also tried to cause doubt among the population by saying that Lambert was claiming to be Edward of Warwick, who he had imprisoned in the Tower since he was 10. This way, he could parade Warwick around as proof. Edward V never claimed that he was anyone else other than Edward IV's son. Same thing with his brother, Richard. Edward V was either killed at the Battle of Stoke, or his face was disfigured by a deep cut to the muscles of the jaw (making it impossible for him to talk) and ended his life as John Evans. Richard of York was caught, after he aborted an invasion of England on his behalf by Scotland. After his face had been pummeled, he was executed in 1499. His sister, Queen Elizabeth, became ill at the news, and was in the process of settingup a household separate from Henry, when she died in childbirth.
Doesn't make sense, there were 2 skeletons found under the staircase, 2. Two males the same age as Rich III nephews. They were killed inside the Tower. The other who claimed to be a survivor was an imposter.
Yeah but there were two skeletons not one
This is a situation in history that fascinates me. I believe Richard did not want the Woodville family to come into any greater power than they already had. And with Young Edward on the throne that surely would have been the case. Richard most likely would have been executed at some point in the future. The timeline is, I think telling. When King Edward died, Richard did not go to London, instead he went to meet up with Young Edward on 4/29/1483, the next day he has Young Edward's maternal uncle and half brother arrested and imprisoned. Then takes Young Edward to the Tower of London by 5/19/1483. Young Richard jones his brother at the Tower on 6/16/1483. Sermon is preached that Edward IV's children were illegitimate on 6/22/1483 and by 6/25/1483 the people of London petition for Richard to be King. Richard orders the death of the Young Edward's maternal uncle and half brother the same day (I question if he had the authority to do that but after he was on a path of no return). Richard is crowned Richard III on 7/6/1483 and the young princes are not seen after the summer of 1483. I think Richard III believed he was the Plantagenet heir and he deserved to be King not some Woodville child. Henry IV cut out the Mortimer children so what was the big deal cutting out Edward IV's children. The problem was Edward IV's heirs were in the directly line after their Father the King. When they matured, they would have fought to regain their rightful place. What a messed up family King Edward III had.
So the bodies they found in the crypt of the boys parents, (there was an adult and child in each) wasn't the children were looking for?
Nope. They were George and Mary. Edward 4th kids who died before their parents.
Theory neither Henry nor Richard are guilty but Richard’s wife the king makers daughter did it
Didnt king Henry the 7th mother play a roll in having the boys killed to get her son on the throne
I have a theory if the boys were killed. Everyone thinks it had the be the men in their life…but no one thinks of the women. I remember hearing that Richard the 3rd’s wife was quite power hungry. Or Henry the 7th mother Margret Beaufort worked hard to get her son on the throne. Tho my money is on Richard’s the 3rds wife.
They were snuffed out by the pillow conspiracy!
2:00
Overlooked was they were children juvenile throne heirs