BROKEN!! £38K Audi R8 dual-clutch transmission - Can we fix it?
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- Опубликовано: 25 ноя 2021
- The 7-speed, DL800, dual-clutch transmission found in the Audi R8 and Lamborghini Huracan is a fantastic system, able to deliver almost seamless gear changes. But, it can fail - and when it does - it can be catastrophic!
Audi do not sell the majority of the internals separately, so if something breaks (2nd gear, for instance) you're looking at the prospect of paying up to £38k for a new one from Audi.
But all is not lost. We've spent the last seven years repairing these gearboxes, using our specialist tooling and reverse-engineered components.
In this video we show you inside a broken DL800 unit and outline all of the weak points and common failures.
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Well as a precision engineer that has made many of those components on that table in various forms disguises it's nice to see some appreciation that goes into these gearboxes.
The tolerances are tight and no room for error.
No assembling that on a Sat morning with a hangover 🤣🤣 Loving the channel great info 👍👍
Thank you!! No i agree, they are very touchy to assemble.
I was a Audi tech for 47 years now retired for 4 years and was given a S5 with a 7 speed DSG that had a transmission oil leak, there was a TSB for it as there was not enough sealant applied to case flanges,had to dismantle and reseal. Yes worst part was assembling to make sure the shafts didn’t distort the little seals, took two of us to guide assemble in place and complete job worked out great. Being flat rate and car under warranty, I lost my shirt as I only wanted to do it once.
All good fun!!
@@REPerformanceUK Only fun I had was beating that car on the road test
As an engineer for over 50 years I really appreciate your work and explanation. Superb information
Super well explained video, loved it. Keep them up!
I’m an R&R tech at a small transmission shop in Canada. I love supercars and have done a few dct jobs and was just curious roughly how these worked, so l searched it up and you delivered. New sub and can’t wait to dig into some technical videos on some of the “common” supercar issues! Very interesting even though I’ll likely never have the pleasure of seeing one in my bay. Thanks and good luck!
Thank you! Glad you enjoy them!
Bloody love your work guys!! Some of the best content out there. Perfectly demystifies a lot of the engineering in these cars 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Thank you! Glad you enjoy it!
Thanks Ricky! I asked for a Gearbox video and you guys delivered. Awsome video! Pretty high tech stuf.
All for you! lol
It was special being deep in your box. Illuminating strip and fascinating to see how you have self taught and re engineered that which is made out of "unobtainable". Amazing viewing.
Thank you!
Excellent informative Insight to a complex engineering tool that's taken for granted. Thanks 👍🏻
Thank you!
Great vid into this very complex gearbox ,great job thank you.
Thank you!
Hello Rick,I just can’t imagine how many times you had to go through the thought process of what make these boxes tick, and then get to the elevated point of making them work after a rebuild..a lot of late nights involved..👍..love the delivery understandable and entertaining.. tommy
Thank you! Yeah they can give me sleepless nights!! lol
Love the videos man. All the way from Jamaica 🇯🇲
Thank you!
Terrific informative video. Subbed!
Thank you!
brilliant video
Very informative video, thanks👍👍
Glad you liked it
Great video and super clean place 💯👍guys
Thank you!
Down to earth no bullshit videos.....well done
Thank you!
Great video thank you
Thank you!
Great to watch and learn things about the shit that goes on in motors and gear boxes . Great channel guys 👍
Thank you
Great vid Ricky 👍. Love these insights in to the inner workings. How is the manual comparatively cost and parts wise, to rebuild/replace etc. Also how do these boxes compare to the McLaren ones? Are they the same box roughly or different units?
Manual/R-Tronic is much cheaper in comparison but also much simpler. Remember the R-Tronic is a manual gearbox with hydraulic control instead of a clutch pedal and gear lever.
So interesting! Still, very interested in the example cost of rebuilding vs. a new one...
P.s. I recognise the GT up on the ramp in the background 😉
Thank you!
Fascinating thanks 👍
Very welcome. Thank you
Thank you for the wonderful video. By the way, R-tronic is less durable than S-tronic, but is it more maintainable? Also, is R-tronic reliable for circuit driving? Thank you.
The multiplate wet clutches seem similar to those used in heavy machinery / tractor transmissions and brakes for years - way better than dry stuff. Q - How does the DL800 compare to the Graziano which I believe is in the Mclaren and the Getrag which I'm told is in the 458/488/F12 ?
This is a Graziano so very similar. The Ferrari boxes follow the same principle but different geometry.
Fascinating, can't help wondering about the engineering thought processes that go into designing one of those things. And then then yours when you first took one apart !!!
How they were designed baffles me!!
Another great video, Ricky!! Many thanks for the information provided. A question-the short and long stubs, are there any hidden issues while removing them, or they are removed straightforward to be upgraded? Planning to do clutch upgrade, along with diff cover, stubs and pan as preventative action for 1200 bhp R8. Appreciate your reply and support.
No easy enough to get out of not stuck on the diff!
Love the video 📹
Thank you!
So glad I found this channel. Absolutely love the work you guys are doing down there. Love the attention to detail 👍
ps, have you got any jobs going? 😉🤣
Thank you!
Yeah gotta watch when you quote a price online, no matter what it is, someone will always say you've over paid or quoted too much! This video, as do many of your others, cements my thoughts that RE will build one of my cars in the future!
Thank you!
Amazing !
He's the Louis Rossmann of Audi Gearboxes 😎 Right to repair! ✌️
Thank you!
Fascinating! And I thought a CVRT Tank gearbox was complicated! So is the complexity of these the reason why robotised manuals are replacing them now?
No these are replacing the manuals….
Hi! I`m big fan of the channel. Any chances maybe you could make a video about Alusil Nikasil coatings?
It would be a very talky video as nothing to show, only the chemical process/material to talk about. Nikasil is very old!
Great video Ricky glad mine is low powered manual 😂 imagine my gearbox clamp might be a bit easier
👍🏼
Very intresting video loads of tech in one of those for sure .....
Thank you!
very interesting. You would want some serious confidence along with mastercraftsman skill to do what you do. I hope the dufer doesn't twist on you when you reassemble! thanks for the vid.
I hope so too! lol Thank you!
Really enjoying these in depth videos, thanks for taking the time to make them. As a home mechanic I'll never dig into one of these, but it's nice to have an idea of what's going on. Cheers
You’re welcome! Glad you are enjoying them!
Impressive knowledge of things you aren't supposed to know 🙉 and what a piece of engineering that box is.
Thank you! Yes they are impressive units!
"Keeps you out of mischief"...... and your vids keep me out of mischief, poor ol' Miss Chief she's starting to think no one loves her.
These gearboxes are expensive when they go wrong. Slightly different car, but the STronic in my Audi 2012 A7 failed this year, and I needed a Clutch, Gear Selector, Loom, Fluids, Adaptions, labour and cost me the thick end of £4k!!!
Mechatronic was ok thankfully.
But, the poor design flaw was that there was no warning, that anything was going to fail, when you're driving at 60mph on the motorway. Box was behaving correctly, and then *Boom*....Gearbox fault, displays on the MMI.
Scary times, and more so when you're given the overall costs to repair an old 2012 car......
Fixed it though and hopefully it's been done well, and will last my time with the car.
Yea they are expensive when they go wrong! Glad it’s sorted now!
Nice vid thx man, this is my new trans for Pikes Peak Hill climb... Coming from PDK. Had issues with pdk DCT fluid go into Gear oil compartment.... Is R8 also 2 different oils? Thx
No just one oil on these, does the whole gearbox! Good luck at pikes peak!!
Ok awesome thank you! I'm sponso Motul and they have High torque DCTF do you think that's good for that trans? Thx
Loving the Tech talk. Is the Manual gearbox a safer bet if you were buying an older R8. With prices starting around 40k for the older one, are these R8 good valve for money or just a money pit ?
A manual would probably be slightly cheaper to rebuild/replace. Possibly easier to get parts for too. The gearbox in this video is the S-Tronic, which is the newer box in the facelift and gen 2. The older R8 had the R-Tronic which is basically an automated manual so not a lot of difference. Some prefer the manual to the R-Tronic due to the R-Tronic being a bit clunky in slower traffic. A well looked after R8, I would say is great value for money. They're pretty solid all round and running/maintenance costs are very reasonable for a car that cost nearly £100k new. Just do due diligence when buying and you should be good to go. Love my V8.
Manuals are easier to work on and get parts for. These DCT’s are great boxes and not exactly an Achilles heel….just when they go wrong it can be a problem!
Fantastic vids M8 👌 great insight, i heard its not too good to do too many launch controls on golf r dsg, problem is u have no way of knowing how many has been done if u buy a second hand r, how can u tell? Is it totally luck of the draw when buying.
Yes without plugging it in it’s hard to tell number of launches. Normally they do the clutch first when abused but the diff will have backlash too!
@@REPerformanceUK wow thanks for the reply you are a great guy and obviously a fantastic engineer, so u need to plug the car in to see what abuse it has gone tru??
@@hyway62 yeah we can check launches, time spent in each gear etc.
R8 2015 with s tronic (dsg) is it normal to have some slack when shift from D to R? There is movement on prop shaft
My 2014 R8 wont go into any gear after a hard launch at the dragstrip. The engine is fine, runs fine, no lights on the dash. No clunking noises, rolls just fine, and no fluid spill...Any idea what it may need?
30 secs in you say "it's a dl800" I immediately thought... Oo sounds like a bad boy dq500 with a transaxle... Followed by.. I must be a massive vw geek lol 🔥 vid tho
hahahahaha
Man, wish I knew a tenth of what you know. Very impressive. So do your prefer the first gen in a real manual?
R8 GT is my favourite R8!
Great video ! Can I make one observation, i recommended using gloves when touching gearbox components, I’ve had issues with helicopter gearbox’s where the salts in your hand sweat causes corrosion to start
Normally I would, but everything is dirty and covered in oil so has to be cleaned. To be honest when i started the video I wasn't expecting to get dirty lol
Also gearbox oils are not good for the skin and are very cancerogenic so gloves are very important.
@@evo5349 like I said, when I started the video I wasn’t expecting to get dirty! 👍🏼
@@REPerformanceUK I know it's just worked on wind turbine boxes and the stink of the oil and itchy shin if hands where not cleaned properly.
Here’s a challenge that would make a great vid. Make a gearbox test rig :)
I had thought about a gearbox dyno.......£££££
Regarding my R-tronic. Should i change the oil? Its a 2010 r8 v10 with 59k miles
Every 4 years you should change both the gear oil and hydraulic oil.
You need to extract your understanding & enthusiasm, install into clones, open garages in every corner of the UK, you will have the Costa Business plan in car form right there 👊🏻
Thank you!
@@REPerformanceUK your welcome. Lets put it this way if you had a garage in South West I would definitely enquire about the best way forward with adding a hybrid turbo or twin, remap, intercooler, cold intake and all ancillary parts necessary for a Peugeot 308 THP 200 upgrade. Its a nightmare down here regards trying to find someone with the requisite knowledge on how to do this correctly and as yet have been unsuccessful finding anyone capable, most only offer stage 1 remaps. Do you know of any garages in the Cornwall/Devon area that do similar work to yourselves?
My PDK has a seal that's being pushed out some... Is that mean that shaft is wondering inside? I pushed seal back ... Lol I hope that keep it in for my Pikes Peak 100yr race .. what's your recommendation?
Which seal is it?
@@REPerformanceUK2014 pdk boxster... the lower round one was out by 3mm . I tapped it back in . Drove the car a bit and it seems to not come out again... Not sure why it was 3mm out
Ok keep an eye but it’s normally caused by wandering bearings!
So if you have a Gen 1 Facelift (2014) R8 V8 and you wanted to take it to say 750 Hp, would you suggest upgraded 2nd gear and clutch or all internals, or no upgrade needed at that level HP? Assuming you were not tracking it or but occasional short speed runs on the street, just having some fun?
That would be fine, maybe a better clutch but we are doing over 1000bhp on that box with no issues. The higher trq the less you can launch it if that makes sense.
@@REPerformanceUK - when you say you're doing over 1000bhp on that box, do you mean with or without modification?
That’s without modification!
@@REPerformanceUK - WOW!
Are Porsche pdk as closed a shop parts wise?
Hello Tim, yes pretty much!
Hey mate i have audi r8 2008 automatic gearbox and the first gear don’t change till 4000-5000rpm
And after firts gear is fine do you thing is the clutch?
Probably not clutch, any error codes?
Exactly reason why won't buy sec hand S 8 which sucks because such a lovely performance car
👍🏼
I’ve always fancied an R8 but not any more.
Same oil pump in McLaren and Ferrari/Getrag/Mercedes/Ford. Must be Hoerbinger internal components. Much better design than the McLaren or Ferrari as it only uses one DCT fluid and so there's no worry of cross contaminating gear oil and dct and the consequences of that happening without external sign.
Hi my car is audi r8 v10 2013 when i shift gear directly ingage to number 2 the fault code in auto trans is p073f unable to engage gear one .. and when i drive car the transmission stil to shift 4 so the trans drive 2-3-4 onley can any help ... thank you
Hello, drop us an email as the DCT is a complex gearbox so could be many things.
Hey .. How do u add dct fluid correctly and how do you check the level ?
There are special tools to add fluid and check level.
@@REPerformanceUK something I can just buy ?
@@huracanian3051 yeah you need diagnostic machine and just a trans fill tool. Sealey do a 3l pump one.
@@REPerformanceUK so I had a small leak coming out of the case bolts and I replace them everyone told me since there's a tube fill or level 2 in there that I can just turn the car on have it go through its warm up and why it's idling open up that drain plug and if anything comes out on good to go I can drive the car it has enough in there ?
@@REPerformanceUK I have a good steady stream come out of their I hurried up put the bolt back in can I drive it or not ?
Almost all auto trans have a similar style wet clutch pack like that
Yeah they are brake bands, but similar style.
Tractor gearboxes are just as fun when you reinstall them
Yeah I bet!
Great tech. No one explains this stuff because they don't understand it, or they think there's some advantage to keeping it a secret...
Thank you!
This is the Graziano DL800 7-Speed Dual-Clutch?
Yes sir!
Fuck me that guy knows his stuff 😳 that's an impressive bench of parts 👌
Thank you!
14:30 they tell they reason of repair
Isnt it hard on a transmission to use LAUNCH CONTROL?
Yes, very!
You say their complicated, to most yea, to you and and I, the're child's play. ;)
Alright.....£38k....Oh Mallort....
Can a Saenz or PPG sequential be installed?
Yes but harsh as road trans and would need a lot of work to fit.
Huuuuuge complexity subassembly, i worked just once on a dsg transmission (from a seat 2.0tfsi), but i don't like at all.. HUGE number of small bolts which have to be unbolted, many safe couplings... anyway much more complexity than bmw newer tct.
For dragrace at any moment i would choose a custom built manual gearbox at small power levels, OR a th400 derived tct. Both way less complex than that dct. Sequential gearboxes are in my opinion way too expensive for dragrace.
Yeah more complex than engines now!!
Anybody experienced DL800 being overfilled 1-2L from factory ?
Earlier ones had a different fill tube so do carry more fluid.
@@REPerformanceUK factory fill tube ?
Oil level height pipe was not changed in height upon inspection.
I'm having problems with a 2016 year R8 V10+, it has a 7 speed dual clutch transmission and there is a massive stutter during a gear change that happens from 4th gear to 2nd on full acceleration (only that gear combination). I have also recorded it and performed various tests, link to my video:
ruclips.net/video/8Lcv1XOxl6A/видео.html
About 50% of the time when I do a full acceleration and the kickdown kicks from 4th to 2nd, the car shakes all over and then moves. Everything else, even launching from 2nd gear, works perfectly fine.
Do you have any ideas what might be causing this? I'm really hoping to solve this problem without having to buy a whole new transmission from the dealership, the car is quite old and it would be financially quite devastating if it comes down to that.
I appreciate your help. Thank you.
A new engine is £12500 damn.
The V10’ are over £30k
Not even watching the vid, they are childs play. You should be able to do it blindfolded.
👍🏼
German quality 🤣🤣🤣
They’re not that bad….but like anything can break!
ICE are just overly complicated now, EV are totally the way forward, mechanically and electrically simple
Not for me I’m afraid, batteries are too complicated, too expensive and degrade quickly. Synthetic fuels are the future mixed with hybrid power.
@@REPerformanceUK complicated? Compared to an R8 gearbox they are child's play,
Cheaper than an R8 gearbox too.
degradation in early leafs was a thing but since 2014 it's a total non issue. Plenty of EV out there with over 100k miles on them with > 90% battery capacity on them still.
Synthetic fuels are expensive incredibly energy intensive and unable to make any reasonable quantity. Porsche are doing it but only to keep their classics going in their museum.