For me, that's the line that justifies the ending to John's arc. At that point he realized that everything he had done in the hopes of saving his family was wrong, and his actions had only supported and bolstered a fascist state that ended up tearing his family apart. It really is beautiful and tragic.
@@writershard5065 Exactly so. Though his physical death comes later, the look on his face at the end of this clip shows that this is the moment John Smith dies. The moment he realizes that he is the worst possible version, in all the infinite worlds, of what John Smith had the potential to become.
It was pretty startling to watch the writers make a complete 180° seemingly just to give things a nice ending. Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely loved that the series ended with Black Communists winning a version of victory against the Reich, but I really would’ve liked to see more of John Smith’s story in the days immediately after the end of the war.
@@randbarrett8706 I never liked any of the resistance or the good guys they never had any real character just bland characters compared to the “bad” guys they had much more interesting stories
@@jorenvanderark3567 Honestly, I would argue that a kid fresh from college hates far more people than he did going in. Before the kid didn't really think about politics, now he hates conservatives, white people, rich people, minorities who are conservatives, and more!
@@jorenvanderark3567 lol the exact contrary, you can’t say a word to these people that you became an racist subhuman, transphobic, homophobic, eterophobic, antisemite, islamophobic, nazi, communist, low class privileged, white guilt of this and that (because is obviously your fault to not have a time machine), toxic male chauvinist, religious fanatic, atheist, bigot, phobophobic hahahah.. poor freedom of speech, what they have done to you Edit: I have forgotten the fat shaming because I’m skinny
@@Fuzznator let's say for a second that you're not spouting horseshit I would still have one question. The LGBTQ community is the state since... when exactly?
I always thought that her thoughts that it better Thomas to be dead, then hate them is kinda selfish. It better my child be alive and hate me, then be dead.
@@DvornyashkaDiaries no, she knows if there is an alternate thomas, there would also probably be an alternate helen. which means snatching him away and bring him across the barrier would inflict the same kind of torment she has been going through on another version of herself. worse in fact, since she knows her thomas is dead, the other helen would not have the same kind of closure, spending the rest of her life wondering what happened to him.
@@Shiirow What truly pissed me off was... we'll never know if Alt Thomas went back home after Vietnam and he and Alt Helen will never know what happened to Alt John Smith.
Say what you will about the direction the show took and about the finale, but god, one thing they did *not* fuck up was Helen and her arc. Terrific character, my personal favorite.
John should have followed the same course with her. John seeing the other world and his son alive and healthy inspires him to try and do the right thing in his own world.
Agreed. I always liked Helen's character quite a bit, which is maybe why I never really had a problem with the ending when taken as a whole. This was sort of the one part the show really needed to get right imo, in that if they're going to 'personalize' the Nazi characters, it's irresponsible to just cut away from that, almost or essentially on a moral basis you have to be committed enough to follow that through to the full conclusion and see that by the end it actually 'says something'.
@@LimerickWarrior1 I don't think that would have worked because John was never really shown the limitations of his or the Reich's power in a way that really prompted him to reject it. Like the whole show is basically him navigating crises and holding things together for the Reich, so naturally when he encounters something like the portal/alternate worlds, he'd have no reason to think that the Reich's or his power should stop there, either (it's just more of the same). Also, John virtually had full knowledge of everything that was happening the whole time, while Helen had to have various things concealed from her throughout. John had so many chances to reflect or take a chance to defy the Reich. I don't think it would feel right for the show to afford him the opportunity to be anything other than a sad moral failure by the end. Like imo the philosophical insight of something like Nazi ideology is how we can justify morally abhorrent things by claiming that you're just making 'necessary' and 'pragmatic' decisions. Like genocide and/or the mass industrialization of human death would horrify anyone at first glance, but we talk ourselves into it by convincing ourselves it's necessary for our own continuation or security or whatever. John has basically been doing this sort of thing the whole show, he's not just going to wake up from this without the world seriously shaking him out of this role by change of circumstance, because pretty much everything in his life is fitted to keep him on the same course he always has been. IMO it makes perfect sense that he would only realize what he became the moment he realized he destroyed everything and that there was no place further to go with this. I think that amount of moral clarity feels right for the character, any more would have felt apologetic for the character or unrealistic or both.
...if you see how insidious the Woke-indoctrination is manifesting atm, with the entire Gender-BS where chíldren are made to question their natural sexe... .... 'her mind belongs to the state' is a realization of the world WE are living in..
The evolution of Helen Smith and the emotional trauma of her tasting her own medicine really makes the show. After losing Thomas, she realizes the Reich is not only a double-edged sword, it’s an indiscriminate monster. When she said, “I wouldn’t want him to see what we’ve become”. These words were priceless. I haven’t seen characters evolve and move onscreen like this since the 80’s. The Axis powers were always going to lose and yes, this show is pure fantasy and non-realistic, however, these two characters are important. It took them to lose their child to actually see themselves.
This was the moment. The end of John Smith’s arc. All the compromises he made, all the terrible things he did he justified to himself by telling himself it was to keep his family safe. When Helen confronts him with the truth, in a way nobody else could, he realises just how degenerate he has become. It’s shattering for him, even more so since he’s seen the other path
@@davidabest7195 But what would be the point of being an effective leader if he didn't have his family? His entire motivation, his life is his family, if he has lost his family what's the point in his mind. While sure it seems like the smarter option at that point reality has hit him and he realises he's gone wrong
Helen is one hell of a good mother. Despite how much she misses her boy she won't take him away if it means him being happy. Both of these actors carried the show.
“I wouldn’t want him to see what we have become…” I believe that firm line reminds John of his conversation with Thomas in that restaurant and he now realizes why Thomas hated his cold reaction to the incident there.
Say what you will about the finale, but I loved this scene. You can see the desperation in John and Helen's pain as she wrestles with her own failures. She only cares about Thomas here and no one else and she is willing to let him go if it means being in a better world.
Image if he actually brought his alt son to that world. I don't think he would ever fully accept it. He son might have actually joined an resistance group, and fought against his father.
@@stevekidkil1081 Counterparts should hypothetically have the same genes, but environmental factors could lead to one getting sick earlier in life than the other. Ironically, if he did get sick, the Marines would send him back. .
huh usually I'm used to the fragile yet strong mother bear figure justify their horrific and/or stupid panicked actions, it's kinda refreshing seeing this take on a mother's strength.
@@alexistoxqui6984 agreed, at first she kinda was annoying but you could kinda understand with how shit their world is, and seeing her progress, and this scene and what followed. oofffttt. Meanwhile on fucking StArTrEk DiScOvErY
Helen became my favorite character. These two actors have such good chemistry on screen together. They truly sell a husband and wife, both full of fear mixed with true love which makes them so tragic. Helen really grew on my the most out of everyone in the show. It's just too bad the last two episodes really ruined so much.
Even watching her appearance evolve. She started as a very conservative looking middle aged woman into a woman looking for her own appearance. It starts in Montana and it's subtle, but it feels like she's shrugging off her old life
Helen loved her son so much that she didn't want to ruin the freedom another version of her son could have even if it went against her deepest desires of seeing him again and having him for her own. Great character writing.
Hell no. She sat on her ass while millions died and couldn’t be bothered to even look over her shoulder until her own daughter had to tell her what a monster she was. Then she doesn’t even face the repercussions of her actions as she ensures she dies instantly when she finally tells John what she feels. She is a coward in every sense of the word.
She definitely would of had to be brave....wearing a dress with such a deep neckline even though she has more wrinkles and lines on her neck and chest than a topographical map of North America.
John's motivation to use the portal to bring his son back is very similar to what the Kingpin tried to do with his deceased loved ones in Spider Man Into the Spider-Verse.
I remember watching this and feeling that this show could have had many more seasons and still be brilliant. The ending was a bit rushed but this scene is sheer brilliance.
I ended up loving this show, although it seems they suddenly felt the need to finish it for no reason, so many loose ends whereas the first season that was a bit boring where so long. I loved this scene as well, so moving.
I mean at the time it was exceedingly obvious to me Tagomi's actor was unavailable for whatever reason. He definitely was not supposed to die like that, basically off-screen at the beginning of S4. Though honestly I found not attaching the resistance to anything political deeply disappointing from s3 onwards. There's not enough media in the West that really discusses what political/ideological solution there is to the growth of nazism/facism. The multiversal superweapon became more of a crutch for the storytelling at that point than anything really meaningful, as much I like all the stuff with alt-John.
The problem is; Helen’s other self is still alive so she couldn’t go to the other world unless Smith would have the guts to order his men to kill alt Helen.
Yep, I had thought about that, how it showed how cold he'd become, that he'd had that done. As I watch the scene again, I suppose it's possible he wasn't going to take Helen through the portal, but just show it to her from this side, and bring Thomas back through? I dunno. Either way, I guess he's brutalizing Helen #2, either by killing her or by kidnapping her son.
I could imagine Smith becoming similar to Stalin for 2-3 decades. Pulling off horrifying policies, evading and surviving assassination attempts before dying in his own piss because everyone's too afraid to check on him.
I'm surprised that the Reich isn't in a constant state of civil war. All the Conquered nations of the world have no obligation to pay any attention to Reich politics unless an occupation is in effect.
It is impossible to Helen togo through the portal without being splattered, the other Helen is alive. John did it because the other one was murdered by his underman trying to kill Juliana
She transcends her personal thoughts, desires and drama and thinks of alt-Thomas, puts him first. In this scene she showed the female overpowering the male, like the portal winning in the end. Esoteric stuff.
It really doesn’t, he’s about to launch an invasion of the west. He should be taking the quickest form of transportation to where his military command is at. Even if he did decide for some dumb reason to take a train, why wouldn’t his security be watching every inch of that track, since it’s such an important event? Just feels like rushed writing, a shame.
I really wish this scene was longer. Multiple seasons led up to this moment and puff! it was over. It's a great scene and conveyed everything it needed to. Anything more probably wouldn't have made it better. But such a heavy moment between a husband and wife deserved more than a minute of dialog.
Yup. Spolier, btw. In their timeline, Thomas turns himself in to the Reich (the Ministry of Health, I believe) because he was "incurably ill" and was thus euthanized (believing in the Nazi German ideology of removing the weak and sick people from society). In the alternate timeline, Thomas enlists himself to fight in the Vietnam War. So, in both timelines, they lose their son.
In retrospect, the show should have focused on the Smith family and them slowly losing faith in the Nazi Party. After Thomas' death I thought that's the direction the show was going to go. Not this...
Does anyone notice the resistance members seem to be wearing a mixture of old US military uniforms and gear along with civilian clothing, like one of them is wearing a United States Army M1 Helmet while another one is wearing WW2 era US Army ammo pouches, anyone care to explain?
Honestly, this was a very powerful scene and I can tell you now that if alt-Thomas was brought to this totalitarian nightmare universe, he would’ve joined the Resistance at the first opportunity and he probably would’ve killed John Smith with his bare hands if he got the chance! Especially if he found out about his own parents being killed, because I think that Nazi assassins would’ve killed alt-Helen so that no one would miss him. Also, I’m fairly certain that as a member of the Resistance who was torn from his life and has military training, Thomas would becomes the Nazis worst nightmare and the Resistance’s greatest soldier!
This series is a warning. Western liberal freedoms are easy to criticise and take for granted while we have them. It's more fragile than we think and a Chinese or Russian dominated world would be a dystopian hell. One of my favourite scenes is when Tagomi closes his eyes in his hellish reality and opens them to a vision of our reality, flawed, but with free music, life, and hope.
This show is supposed to be on its final season this year. 4 seasons? Plus, you could tell the final season was a rushed mess to wrap up all the storylines that needed at least another season or 2 to wrap up. The trade minister didn't deserve that shitty ending when he was extremely pivotal to the story. The west coast resistance shows up late. Didn't show how hard hitting they were in disrupting the empire's supply lines. John Smith taking over needed at least a full season, and we never get to see the Chinese rebellion or storylines in other parts of the world. So, know that great shows may start on the original stream apps like Netflix and Amazon, but when these two networks feel not enough people are subscribing for those shows, they cancel them. So I suggest everyone to inflate the numbers on your favorite shows by cancelling your subscription and only resubscribing once your show's next season comes around, then cancel again. Otherwise, no matter how good and interesting your show is, they will cancel it if it doesn't bring in enough subscribers and viewers for the first 2 weeks
I really started to love Helen during the show and this is an incredible scene. Both actors are great and the dialogue is really good. To bad the general ending of the show was so bad. Instead of being a circle, it opened a whole new potentional plot and left us with more questions than answers. I only lasted through season 4 because I wanted to know how the Smiths will end up. They are the most interesting characters, next to Tagomi but his death was to quick. Maybe the actor wanted to get out of the show, because it felt like his story didn't really finish.
Say what you will about the last season and the ending of the show but this scene was absolutely fantastic, a perfect ending to John and Helen's story.
I mean, it was an armored train with heavy weapons and a large security detail. However, it should be pretty obvious the easiest way to kill a VIP like that is just by blowing up the rails instead.
With him being leader of America and the high activity of the resistance you'd imagine there would of been atleast one or two completely identical trains following this same route at different times to confuse the resistance in which one there's Smith.
@@vasiliymedvedev1532 yeah and how would they find out the exact time and place to ambush him it’s stupid if the show was even semi realistic smith would of crushed the resistance
And why not use the Nazi Concorde we saw throughout the entire show? Or the nazi Harrier? Using the train at the same exact time as he launches an assault on the West just doesn't make sense.
@@jamesbelshan8839Correction. Google operation paperclip and find out where all the peenmunde rocket scientists went to. Von Braun was the head of the Saturn V space program at NASA. Truth is stranger than fiction
Let's just dress in olive drab with visible weapons, walk single file across open snow covered ground in the middle of the day to place charges while no one sees us.
S4.E09... This should’ve been the ending and there should’ve been a season 5 to end the show properly. Smith is such a good character that i began to side with him and hated the resistance. Wyatt is ok but Juliana is so boring. it’s Rome all over again. I’m pretty sure a lot of American presidents wanted to do that to Hoover. This scene was so good and then the next episode just derailed everything... I think, we can all agree, that this episode should be the real final episode. They divided the empire; The end of this season was such a shame. A real disappointment for an otherwise very good season. It really felt rushed towards the end. And here’s the thing... Smith was kinda the show's main character. Season 1 he was the antagonist. Season 2 and 3 he had become an antihero and by season 4 Juliana's arc had been so far relegated to the side, that Smith and Helen were constantly centre stage with the Japanese plot being the next most interesting. The show went out of its way to make clear that John was never a die-hard Nazi. Every deed and decision he’d ever made he’d done for his family. The tragedy of his character was supposed to be that he could only go upwards onto ever more shaky ground, or come crashing down with his wife and kids' fates in the balance. To all of a sudden take a 180 with his character feels so cheap and forced to me. Why is he going full steam ahead with plans for Holocaust.3.0 when he and his family are safe? Because he “didn’t know how” to stop it? Really!? But his mate, Bill, could turn the planes around with a single order and publicly throw away his badge? Not to mention that’s terribly unrealistic for a nation where significant portion of the population are extremely indoctrinated and at least half the top military staff in the American Reich are still die-hard Nazis. This needed another fucking season. We should’ve had John lose his sanity over Thomas and kidnap him. It would’ve made for great storytelling. If the writers wanted to drum up the “Absolute power corrupts absolutely” trope, they could’ve... but not in half a bloody episode! Way to butcher 4 seasons worth of character development in 30 fucking minutes. :(
She is a black hole that sucks everyone’s happiness and good blessings and she gets them killed and once one boyfriend dies she finds a new one almost instantly. The little bird with the broken feather as John smith said
What I don't get is if all the films represent a different universe does all of the other universes have similar films or what point is keeping the films? Like of course it seems like they are important but if it's just a bunch of alternate history and alternate universe what use are they to the Reich?
Why would there be an AK 47 in this universe? It was constructed by a Soviet in 1949? How would this be possible? I know it is a minor thing but it bothers me.
I can't for the life of me understand why a show about an alternate history in which the Nazis and Japanese win the war doesn't have bright and cheerful lighting
@@seangilbert7365 Subliminal to how the energy of that supposed time is. Even though economically and militarily booming, the vibe is just dark and tainted. That's my opinion.
All the power in exchange for your soul. John Smith was headed towards destruction regardless. He too thought that he can destroy the Reich from within. Little did he know that all his power derived from the high ranking officials that granted him the position of Reichsmarschal (imperial marshal).
i don't know what to say, i know helen is a brave character, but i think helen is very naive, remember when helen made some mistakes smith was there to do what dad should do to protect his family but what helen did was the opposite, remember when helen cheating on her with Dr psychology, and i know helen is an easily influenced character and i feel the ending is bad
This ending was so stupid. If I was the director of this series smith would have began work with the resistance after his visit to the alternate world. He would have come back and recruited his friend who was still an American. They would have recruited officers displayed propaganda shown the destruction of Washington and what the old America was. He would have revolted took America marched north freed Canada and formed the Republic of North America rallying the last generation of Canadians who fought and bringing back the spirit of the Great War.
I love this show u know why ? Because im living in a theo-fascist state , just like where juliana crane lives in. Watching this gives me hope ... Thx americans !🤍
*_"I wouldn't want him to see what we have become"_*
Brutally honest self assessment
For me, that's the line that justifies the ending to John's arc. At that point he realized that everything he had done in the hopes of saving his family was wrong, and his actions had only supported and bolstered a fascist state that ended up tearing his family apart. It really is beautiful and tragic.
@@writershard5065 this. and his expression at the end of this clip in response to her words shows that entire realization
@@writershard5065 Like a greek tragity play.
@@writershard5065 Exactly so. Though his physical death comes later, the look on his face at the end of this clip shows that this is the moment John Smith dies. The moment he realizes that he is the worst possible version, in all the infinite worlds, of what John Smith had the potential to become.
And did anyone give her an Oscar yet?
in another world, this show got more than just the 4 seasons, and it finished at the pace it's intended to
What and John smith surviving crushing the rebellion like what would of happened
It was pretty startling to watch the writers make a complete 180° seemingly just to give things a nice ending.
Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely loved that the series ended with Black Communists winning a version of victory against the Reich, but I really would’ve liked to see more of John Smith’s story in the days immediately after the end of the war.
@@randbarrett8706 I never liked any of the resistance or the good guys they never had any real character just bland characters compared to the “bad” guys they had much more interesting stories
@R J yeah sadly I wish they let it run at it’s time
@R J easy 2-3 more seasons
"Amy isn't ours anymore, her mind belongs to the state" must be one of the darkest and most terrifying sentences in this whole dystopia
I'm sure a lot of parents say the same thing when their "kids" come home from college in current day America, 2022.
@@greggyfontane1487
"Oh no he has met people different from him and does not mindlessly hate them anymore where did we go wrong"
@@jorenvanderark3567 Honestly, I would argue that a kid fresh from college hates far more people than he did going in. Before the kid didn't really think about politics, now he hates conservatives, white people, rich people, minorities who are conservatives, and more!
@@jorenvanderark3567 lol the exact contrary, you can’t say a word to these people that you became an racist subhuman, transphobic, homophobic, eterophobic, antisemite, islamophobic, nazi, communist, low class privileged, white guilt of this and that (because is obviously your fault to not have a time machine), toxic male chauvinist, religious fanatic, atheist, bigot, phobophobic hahahah.. poor freedom of speech, what they have done to you
Edit: I have forgotten the fat shaming because I’m skinny
@@Fuzznator let's say for a second that you're not spouting horseshit I would still have one question.
The LGBTQ community is the state since... when exactly?
Now that's a mother figure. She will not let the grief of her son be used to snatch away the child of another.
Helen was consistently the most believably written character on the show.
I always thought that her thoughts that it better Thomas to be dead, then hate them is kinda selfish. It better my child be alive and hate me, then be dead.
@@DvornyashkaDiaries not really, she understood that said Thomas would be taken away from another mother
@@DvornyashkaDiaries no, she knows if there is an alternate thomas, there would also probably be an alternate helen. which means snatching him away and bring him across the barrier would inflict the same kind of torment she has been going through on another version of herself. worse in fact, since she knows her thomas is dead, the other helen would not have the same kind of closure, spending the rest of her life wondering what happened to him.
@@Shiirow What truly pissed me off was... we'll never know if Alt Thomas went back home after Vietnam and he and Alt Helen will never know what happened to Alt John Smith.
Say what you will about the direction the show took and about the finale, but god, one thing they did *not* fuck up was Helen and her arc. Terrific character, my personal favorite.
She was absolutely insane.
Helen is easily the best part of season 4. Love her character.
John should have followed the same course with her. John seeing the other world and his son alive and healthy inspires him to try and do the right thing in his own world.
Agreed. I always liked Helen's character quite a bit, which is maybe why I never really had a problem with the ending when taken as a whole. This was sort of the one part the show really needed to get right imo, in that if they're going to 'personalize' the Nazi characters, it's irresponsible to just cut away from that, almost or essentially on a moral basis you have to be committed enough to follow that through to the full conclusion and see that by the end it actually 'says something'.
@@LimerickWarrior1 I don't think that would have worked because John was never really shown the limitations of his or the Reich's power in a way that really prompted him to reject it. Like the whole show is basically him navigating crises and holding things together for the Reich, so naturally when he encounters something like the portal/alternate worlds, he'd have no reason to think that the Reich's or his power should stop there, either (it's just more of the same). Also, John virtually had full knowledge of everything that was happening the whole time, while Helen had to have various things concealed from her throughout. John had so many chances to reflect or take a chance to defy the Reich. I don't think it would feel right for the show to afford him the opportunity to be anything other than a sad moral failure by the end. Like imo the philosophical insight of something like Nazi ideology is how we can justify morally abhorrent things by claiming that you're just making 'necessary' and 'pragmatic' decisions. Like genocide and/or the mass industrialization of human death would horrify anyone at first glance, but we talk ourselves into it by convincing ourselves it's necessary for our own continuation or security or whatever. John has basically been doing this sort of thing the whole show, he's not just going to wake up from this without the world seriously shaking him out of this role by change of circumstance, because pretty much everything in his life is fitted to keep him on the same course he always has been. IMO it makes perfect sense that he would only realize what he became the moment he realized he destroyed everything and that there was no place further to go with this. I think that amount of moral clarity feels right for the character, any more would have felt apologetic for the character or unrealistic or both.
“Her mind belongs to the state”
Such a short but terrifying statement
...if you see how insidious the Woke-indoctrination is manifesting atm, with the entire Gender-BS where chíldren are made to question their natural sexe...
.... 'her mind belongs to the state' is a realization of the world WE are living in..
The evolution of Helen Smith and the emotional trauma of her tasting her own medicine really makes the show. After losing Thomas, she realizes the Reich is not only a double-edged sword, it’s an indiscriminate monster.
When she said, “I wouldn’t want him to see what we’ve become”. These words were priceless.
I haven’t seen characters evolve and move onscreen like this since the 80’s.
The Axis powers were always going to lose and yes, this show is pure fantasy and non-realistic, however, these two characters are important.
It took them to lose their child to actually see themselves.
Really though,they lost all three,she just didn't want to lose another one.
This was the moment. The end of John Smith’s arc. All the compromises he made, all the terrible things he did he justified to himself by telling himself it was to keep his family safe. When Helen confronts him with the truth, in a way nobody else could, he realises just how degenerate he has become. It’s shattering for him, even more so since he’s seen the other path
Bruh no that was just simply artificial miscommunication
He should have just had her gassed then went on to be an effective leader lol
Profoundly correct. Hadn't thought of it that way
@@davidabest7195 But what would be the point of being an effective leader if he didn't have his family? His entire motivation, his life is his family, if he has lost his family what's the point in his mind. While sure it seems like the smarter option at that point reality has hit him and he realises he's gone wrong
A bit like Michael Corleone
Helen is one hell of a good mother. Despite how much she misses her boy she won't take him away if it means him being happy. Both of these actors carried the show.
“I wouldn’t want him to see what we have become…”
I believe that firm line reminds John of his conversation with Thomas in that restaurant and he now realizes why Thomas hated his cold reaction to the incident there.
Underrated actors. Brilliant acting
Say what you will about the finale, but I loved this scene. You can see the desperation in John and Helen's pain as she wrestles with her own failures. She only cares about Thomas here and no one else and she is willing to let him go if it means being in a better world.
@@rv2167 that’s your opinion most people hated it because it was rushed and they kill the most interesting character in a poor way
IMO Helen is the best part of season 4 in a good way.
@@elim4181 sorry but no I could never get into the good people they are bland compared to the other characters
@@ye_clapped_6974 to each their own.
@@elim4181 yeah true true
Image if he actually brought his alt son to that world. I don't think he would ever fully accept it. He son might have actually joined an resistance group, and fought against his father.
Now thats a much more interesting plot the just killing john and the resistance taking the portal!
Under that society, life and destiny, he would probably get sick again
@@ricardoabreu4997 actually I think he had a genedic disease, that he did not have in the alt world.
@@stevekidkil1081 Counterparts should hypothetically have the same genes, but environmental factors could lead to one getting sick earlier in life than the other. Ironically, if he did get sick, the Marines would send him back.
.
@@RealKieron Yes. I think this plot would have been stretched out further and John would not have died yet if there had been another season.
.
'Hes gonna hate us' yeah imagine bringing a better version of a alternate universe to a hell universe
huh usually I'm used to the fragile yet strong mother bear figure justify their horrific and/or stupid panicked actions, it's kinda refreshing seeing this take on a mother's strength.
So true 😯😊!
That’s a fact! At first I thought she was going to be an annoying character but she actually made me enjoy her brave character.
@@alexistoxqui6984 agreed, at first she kinda was annoying but you could kinda understand with how shit their world is, and seeing her progress, and this scene and what followed. oofffttt. Meanwhile on fucking StArTrEk DiScOvErY
gay
Helen became my favorite character. These two actors have such good chemistry on screen together. They truly sell a husband and wife, both full of fear mixed with true love which makes them so tragic. Helen really grew on my the most out of everyone in the show. It's just too bad the last two episodes really ruined so much.
Yeah she really nails the conflicting emotions in this scene. Good actress.
Even watching her appearance evolve. She started as a very conservative looking middle aged woman into a woman looking for her own appearance. It starts in Montana and it's subtle, but it feels like she's shrugging off her old life
Powerful. Helen was right.
Bringing Thomas from the world where the Allies won World War 2 to the Fascist dominated world would be a rude awakening for him
Helen is the moral of the entire movie , this character is built with love &compasion for the humanity .
Helen loved her son so much that she didn't want to ruin the freedom another version of her son could have even if it went against her deepest desires of seeing him again and having him for her own. Great character writing.
"lets bring him home"
*holy music stops*
That shows a mothers true love.
Damn this scene is soo deep and intense that it's scary 😲
Yes it is very intense 😲🥺😊
Now for the woke woman of color leading the literal Black Communist Republic against those evil Nazis!
@@IsaiahRichards692 They should have left off that communist part.
If they had taken that Thomas and put him in their universe, he would have joined the Resistance.
After this, John ran and changed his name to Walter Bishop to avoid being caught.
Helen was so brave.
Mother’s love
Hell no. She sat on her ass while millions died and couldn’t be bothered to even look over her shoulder until her own daughter had to tell her what a monster she was. Then she doesn’t even face the repercussions of her actions as she ensures she dies instantly when she finally tells John what she feels. She is a coward in every sense of the word.
She definitely would of had to be brave....wearing a dress with such a deep neckline even though she has more wrinkles and lines on her neck and chest than a topographical map of North America.
@@lwschy Dang bro you roasting her harder than the minorities she turned a blind eye to
She was mistaken
these rebells walk so close to each other that the german mg protecting the bridge would thank them for that
This was Helen's best season. She had some good moments and dialog
Imagine being kidnapped by a parralel world parents.
With buttons instead their eyes
John's motivation to use the portal to bring his son back is very similar to what the Kingpin tried to do with his deceased loved ones in Spider Man Into the Spider-Verse.
Even more similar to Dr Bishop's action in the serie Fringe
I remember watching this and feeling that this show could have had many more seasons and still be brilliant. The ending was a bit rushed but this scene is sheer brilliance.
I ended up loving this show, although it seems they suddenly felt the need to finish it for no reason, so many loose ends whereas the first season that was a bit boring where so long. I loved this scene as well, so moving.
@@rv2167 everything leading up to ending was great, but ending itself was really really terrible
I mean at the time it was exceedingly obvious to me Tagomi's actor was unavailable for whatever reason. He definitely was not supposed to die like that, basically off-screen at the beginning of S4. Though honestly I found not attaching the resistance to anything political deeply disappointing from s3 onwards. There's not enough media in the West that really discusses what political/ideological solution there is to the growth of nazism/facism. The multiversal superweapon became more of a crutch for the storytelling at that point than anything really meaningful, as much I like all the stuff with alt-John.
The actress who played Helen is fantastic. Her performance is unfortunately overshadowed by Rufus Sewell.
No, they work together perfectly, they make each other shine.
“Her mind belongs to the state”
Well good thing you are the state now I guess.
Everything she said is heavy and undeniably true
The problem is; Helen’s other self is still alive so she couldn’t go to the other world unless Smith would have the guts to order his men to kill alt Helen.
Yep, I had thought about that, how it showed how cold he'd become, that he'd had that done. As I watch the scene again, I suppose it's possible he wasn't going to take Helen through the portal, but just show it to her from this side, and bring Thomas back through? I dunno. Either way, I guess he's brutalizing Helen #2, either by killing her or by kidnapping her son.
I always lover the Helen character. Finally she is the hero of the serie.
Dr. Walter Bishop would like a word...
The last season was sooooooo bad but had moments of brilliance like this scene. So powerful.
This show could’ve ended so much better
They have to stay true to what actually happened in that alternative universe
That one last sentence means everything
Most scenes of High Castle is infinitely better if the resistance isnt there
Pesky resistance. Just anarchists!
John Smith should join the same club with Walter Bishop 😂
Wow! Fringe fans are also here, yeeea)))
How did those people think it would end for them they wouldn't end up like the Spartans
I could imagine Smith becoming similar to Stalin for 2-3 decades. Pulling off horrifying policies, evading and surviving assassination attempts before dying in his own piss because everyone's too afraid to check on him.
I'm surprised that the Reich isn't in a constant state of civil war. All the Conquered nations of the world have no obligation to pay any attention to Reich politics unless an occupation is in effect.
It is impossible to Helen togo through the portal without being splattered, the other Helen is alive. John did it because the other one was murdered by his underman trying to kill Juliana
She transcends her personal thoughts, desires and drama and thinks of alt-Thomas, puts him first.
In this scene she showed the female overpowering the male, like the portal winning in the end.
Esoteric stuff.
"Why are we taking the train? Let's take the bitchin VTOL jet aircraft instead."
Man in the High Castle will continue in season 5.
Season 5 ......when?!
Now that I think about it. They have concords and giant VTOLs. Does it make sense for the president to ride a train around a warzone.
It really doesn’t, he’s about to launch an invasion of the west. He should be taking the quickest form of transportation to where his military command is at. Even if he did decide for some dumb reason to take a train, why wouldn’t his security be watching every inch of that track, since it’s such an important event? Just feels like rushed writing, a shame.
Yeah. Not even a lick of escort, shit ending.
I really wish this scene was longer. Multiple seasons led up to this moment and puff! it was over. It's a great scene and conveyed everything it needed to. Anything more probably wouldn't have made it better. But such a heavy moment between a husband and wife deserved more than a minute of dialog.
finally helen gets a very very good arc and the show had to end so abruptly. urgh
3:09
are he talking about the vietnam war?
Yup. Spolier, btw.
In their timeline, Thomas turns himself in to the Reich (the Ministry of Health, I believe) because he was "incurably ill" and was thus euthanized (believing in the Nazi German ideology of removing the weak and sick people from society).
In the alternate timeline, Thomas enlists himself to fight in the Vietnam War.
So, in both timelines, they lose their son.
@@bonk369 Assuming he doesn't survive the war, which isn't a given.
.
In retrospect, the show should have focused on the Smith family and them slowly losing faith in the Nazi Party. After Thomas' death I thought that's the direction the show was going to go. Not this...
Exactly, I would have bet on him fighting against his own party after Thomas. Then the alternative world shit started happening.
Smith character had so much more potential. I seen him as reverse ”Walter White” character from the start, but they blew it.
They never had faith with the Nazis, they just pretended from the start
That would be too boring, way too simple and predictable. This ending is truly unpredictable which is why it's amazing.
When Hitler travelled by train the entire route was secured by one soldier every 25 meters. Absurd that they wouldn't have some sort of line security.
Does anyone notice the resistance members seem to be wearing a mixture of old US military uniforms and gear along with civilian clothing, like one of them is wearing a United States Army M1 Helmet while another one is wearing WW2 era US Army ammo pouches, anyone care to explain?
WOW! Good for her!
As someone who's lived in PA, those are NOT the Poconos lol. Those mountains are waaaay too tall.
Honestly, this was a very powerful scene and I can tell you now that if alt-Thomas was brought to this totalitarian nightmare universe, he would’ve joined the Resistance at the first opportunity and he probably would’ve killed John Smith with his bare hands if he got the chance! Especially if he found out about his own parents being killed, because I think that Nazi assassins would’ve killed alt-Helen so that no one would miss him. Also, I’m fairly certain that as a member of the Resistance who was torn from his life and has military training, Thomas would becomes the Nazis worst nightmare and the Resistance’s greatest soldier!
Best scene in the finale.
This was the best scene in the entire show
Man, Helen's actress needs more roles. She is damn good.
In season 4 of Star Trek discovery
Watched this the 1st time at 1916 Spring St Sch NY
This series is a warning. Western liberal freedoms are easy to criticise and take for granted while we have them. It's more fragile than we think and a Chinese or Russian dominated world would be a dystopian hell. One of my favourite scenes is when Tagomi closes his eyes in his hellish reality and opens them to a vision of our reality, flawed, but with free music, life, and hope.
yes the scenes with Cary-Hiroyuki Tagawa were by far my favorite.
This show is supposed to be on its final season this year. 4 seasons? Plus, you could tell the final season was a rushed mess to wrap up all the storylines that needed at least another season or 2 to wrap up. The trade minister didn't deserve that shitty ending when he was extremely pivotal to the story. The west coast resistance shows up late. Didn't show how hard hitting they were in disrupting the empire's supply lines. John Smith taking over needed at least a full season, and we never get to see the Chinese rebellion or storylines in other parts of the world.
So, know that great shows may start on the original stream apps like Netflix and Amazon, but when these two networks feel not enough people are subscribing for those shows, they cancel them. So I suggest everyone to inflate the numbers on your favorite shows by cancelling your subscription and only resubscribing once your show's next season comes around, then cancel again. Otherwise, no matter how good and interesting your show is, they will cancel it if it doesn't bring in enough subscribers and viewers for the first 2 weeks
04:08 to 04:13, that speech is the bravest line here
in a different world the nazis made a shoe about what if nato won and john smith is an American
I really started to love Helen during the show and this is an incredible scene. Both actors are great and the dialogue is really good. To bad the general ending of the show was so bad. Instead of being a circle, it opened a whole new potentional plot and left us with more questions than answers. I only lasted through season 4 because I wanted to know how the Smiths will end up. They are the most interesting characters, next to Tagomi but his death was to quick. Maybe the actor wanted to get out of the show, because it felt like his story didn't really finish.
Loved Helen's dress here
Say what you will about the last season and the ending of the show but this scene was absolutely fantastic, a perfect ending to John and Helen's story.
Excellent actors, I'm going to keep watching :)
What a concept, what a scene. My god
This scene just reinforces my opinion on how insignificant juliana crane was for the whole plot and what a useless character she was.
I love this show but the ending was too soon I wish this has a season 4
This is season 4 dude???????!🤣
Uh oh be careful John, haven't you seen the show Fringe?
Ahhhh yes the reichsfuhrers train completely unguarded this show decreased dramatically in s4
I mean, it was an armored train with heavy weapons and a large security detail. However, it should be pretty obvious the easiest way to kill a VIP like that is just by blowing up the rails instead.
@@roy6907 you would still think the most important man in America his route would of been guarded only if at weak points or just patrolled
With him being leader of America and the high activity of the resistance you'd imagine there would of been atleast one or two completely identical trains following this same route at different times to confuse the resistance in which one there's Smith.
@@vasiliymedvedev1532 yeah and how would they find out the exact time and place to ambush him it’s stupid if the show was even semi realistic smith would of crushed the resistance
And why not use the Nazi Concorde we saw throughout the entire show? Or the nazi Harrier? Using the train at the same exact time as he launches an assault on the West just doesn't make sense.
What? So was the woman, Helen, on the side of justice or darkness in the end??
They ended this horrible
That AK should not exist in this world. Gotta love how they just stopped caring about in-universe continuity like that.
by that logic, though, rockets designed by Von Braun shouldn't have taken us to the moon.
@@jamesbelshan8839Correction. Google operation paperclip and find out where all the peenmunde rocket scientists went to. Von Braun was the head of the Saturn V space program at NASA. Truth is stranger than fiction
Let's just dress in olive drab with visible weapons, walk single file across open snow covered ground in the middle of the day to place charges while no one sees us.
S4.E09... This should’ve been the ending and there should’ve been a season 5 to end the show properly. Smith is such a good character that i began to side with him and hated the resistance. Wyatt is ok but Juliana is so boring.
it’s Rome all over again. I’m pretty sure a lot of American presidents wanted to do that to Hoover.
This scene was so good and then the next episode just derailed everything... I think, we can all agree, that this episode should be the real final episode. They divided the empire;
The end of this season was such a shame. A real disappointment for an otherwise very good season. It really felt rushed towards the end.
And here’s the thing... Smith was kinda the show's main character. Season 1 he was the antagonist. Season 2 and 3 he had become an antihero and by season 4 Juliana's arc had been so far relegated to the side, that Smith and Helen were constantly centre stage with the Japanese plot being the next most interesting. The show went out of its way to make clear that John was never a die-hard Nazi. Every deed and decision he’d ever made he’d done for his family. The tragedy of his character was supposed to be that he could only go upwards onto ever more shaky ground, or come crashing down with his wife and kids' fates in the balance.
To all of a sudden take a 180 with his character feels so cheap and forced to me. Why is he going full steam ahead with plans for Holocaust.3.0 when he and his family are safe? Because he “didn’t know how” to stop it? Really!? But his mate, Bill, could turn the planes around with a single order and publicly throw away his badge? Not to mention that’s terribly unrealistic for a nation where significant portion of the population are extremely indoctrinated and at least half the top military staff in the American Reich are still die-hard Nazis.
This needed another fucking season. We should’ve had John lose his sanity over Thomas and kidnap him. It would’ve made for great storytelling. If the writers wanted to drum up the “Absolute power corrupts absolutely” trope, they could’ve... but not in half a bloody episode! Way to butcher 4 seasons worth of character development in 30 fucking minutes.
:(
Agreed, I hate it
Well said
@@amazingabby25 this show had some amazing moments.
@@amazingabby25 What a shame it ended in such a messy way, was so close to being a classic.
Too bad I couldn't go on to read the book because these two aren't in it. 😞
Book is better from what I heard.
That would be so fucked if you were enlisted in the US army and got kidnapped into a Nazi-America.
I wonder why he was healthy in one world and not in another
Maybe because of the nuclear explosion in DC
Isn't Thomas only got epilepsy? That would be from nukes exposure right? I mean I have epilepsy but I didnt get it from radioactive exposure 😂
If it just me or is Juliana one of the worst characters
She isn't even a charachter
A void at the center of the show. A huge defect.
She is a black hole that sucks everyone’s happiness and good blessings and she gets them killed and once one boyfriend dies she finds a new one almost instantly. The little bird with the broken feather as John smith said
She should have been euthanized rather than Thomas 😅 she’s not up to Reich policy
this is a black note.
The expansion of evil into another universe
What I don't get is if all the films represent a different universe does all of the other universes have similar films or what point is keeping the films? Like of course it seems like they are important but if it's just a bunch of alternate history and alternate universe what use are they to the Reich?
I think that the films are the reason that the Axis won the war because in the season 1 finale Hitler has a huge collection.
please helen !!
Why would there be an AK 47 in this universe? It was constructed by a Soviet in 1949? How would this be possible? I know it is a minor thing but it bothers me.
No, it was 1947, hence the name. In this timeline it was made by a German.
269mm HE 12,5kg de explosivo
So does this mean he or someone went back to kill world 2 helen otherwise how would smith think helen would be able to travel to world 2v
The concept of the show is good but the show over all is pretty poorly executed. As Alternated His Hub said why is everything so grey and dark
I can't for the life of me understand why a show about an alternate history in which the Nazis and Japanese win the war doesn't have bright and cheerful lighting
@@seangilbert7365 😂
@@seangilbert7365 Subliminal to how the energy of that supposed time is. Even though economically and militarily booming, the vibe is just dark and tainted. That's my opinion.
Based on the book, book went off rails too.
All the power in exchange for your soul. John Smith was headed towards destruction regardless. He too thought that he can destroy the Reich from within. Little did he know that all his power derived from the high ranking officials that granted him the position of Reichsmarschal (imperial marshal).
i don't know what to say, i know helen is a brave character, but i think helen is very naive, remember when helen made some mistakes smith was there to do what dad should do to protect his family but what helen did was the opposite, remember when helen cheating on her with Dr psychology, and i know helen is an easily influenced character and i feel the ending is bad
Smith: He’s gonna die
*17 years later*
*Thomas Smith Cracks Knuckles*
Thomas: You Can’t Kill Me!
This ending was so stupid. If I was the director of this series smith would have began work with the resistance after his visit to the alternate world. He would have come back and recruited his friend who was still an American. They would have recruited officers displayed propaganda shown the destruction of Washington and what the old America was. He would have revolted took America marched north freed Canada and formed the Republic of North America rallying the last generation of Canadians who fought and bringing back the spirit of the Great War.
I spoilt the last episode for me. Mh. I watched every episode except for the very last, and now I ruined the last. But I'll watch it nevertheless.
I love this show u know why ?
Because im living in a theo-fascist state , just like where juliana crane lives in.
Watching this gives me hope ...
Thx americans !🤍
@Hlod Wilson probably saudi arabia or iran
That's good to hear!
.
Wolrd
Why is there an Irish guy leading the rebels?
I really like his other series “What If Pancho Villa Won the War!”. What garbage!