It would be awesome if we could also see the average finishing place of the leaders. For example if one leader has 20% winrate, but 70% of the matches it finishes in 2nd place, the average result is ~1,9. I think it would paint an even better picture of the balance and rankings. Thank you for the statics and your efforts though! I appreciate it very much :)
Hi, thanks for sharing. Would love to hear your thoughts on some further analysis. What has Immortality changed? Why is Ilban so strong and Baron/Leto so much weaker? Helena is also shockingly bad. I'm not familiar with Immortality and would really love your thoughts!
@@cheesable Would shift some emphasis away from experimentation to signet ring, you could add back the first vp I spose. All the research bump cards are strong, think it would be a fun mix up.
@sammacleod7950 I don't think signet ring leaders are suffering too much. Like hundro beast are both doing well. Even Paul is doing relatively well as compared to ix
Ariana should just be errated to be "Draw a card when you mine spice, collect the spice as normal". I think she would at least be decent. Maybe Rhombur should just start the game with a dreadnought instead of troops. If you want to go all in on trying to balance the leaders Helena should not be blocked in yellow. Ilesea's foldspace ring should be free. Leto's Chase should cost 1 solari and not one spice. Paul should be able PLAY the top card of his deck (though it may need some balancing issues), memnon should get a double bump on high council, and Yuna should just start with a water like everyone else.
Imo, the most important conclusion from those stats is that you cannot pass on ilban / tessia as p4/p3 else their win rate skyrocket. Going from 4-3-2-1 to 4-3-1-2 or other variants would not fix this either, you would still be forced to pick them. I think the solution should be through some ban mechanism. For instance, p4 remove 1 leader and pick 1, then p3 remove 1 and pick another, etc. Tessia/ilban would still remain the best pick for p4/p3, but at least, not picking them would be less terrible as you would just ban them.
Yes. If players like a no balance changes game. Picking tessia and ilban will continue to be the dominant strategy. 4312 will address player 2 winrate. That's about all. So separate issue
It would be awesome if we could also see the average finishing place of the leaders. For example if one leader has 20% winrate, but 70% of the matches it finishes in 2nd place, the average result is ~1,9. I think it would paint an even better picture of the balance and rankings. Thank you for the statics and your efforts though! I appreciate it very much :)
Hmmm. It's almost the exact same order. I could put it out in a later video
Thanks for the vid Cheesable 👍
Hi, thanks for sharing. Would love to hear your thoughts on some further analysis. What has Immortality changed? Why is Ilban so strong and Baron/Leto so much weaker? Helena is also shockingly bad. I'm not familiar with Immortality and would really love your thoughts!
Thanks for the detailed stats
Had a fun balance idea... what if the Bene Tleilax track gave endgame points instead of flat victory points
I don't think game duration is a concern. Which is what converting them to endgame does. But I'm not too sure.
@@cheesable Would shift some emphasis away from experimentation to signet ring, you could add back the first vp I spose. All the research bump cards are strong, think it would be a fun mix up.
@sammacleod7950 I don't think signet ring leaders are suffering too much. Like hundro beast are both doing well. Even Paul is doing relatively well as compared to ix
i like this idea a lot 🎉🎉 maybe it will bring back some fun to normal mode. i will test this IRL group. Thx
as i thought , All low tier leader not good on yellow spot strategy 😂😂😂 my Helena went from S tier to F tier 😢😢
Haha it's interesting how beloved helen is in the community. I think people just like playing powerful cards
Where is it possible to play Dune ? Is there a specific website or app ?
We are currently playing on tabletop simulator! Through a discord server called ttsclub. Do come join us!
There is also Dune imperium on Steam. It is very well made.
How many games are the data based on?
5005 Games played! It's in the description
@@cheesable Thank you and sorry for my stupidity :)
@@johannesgunther7208 haha no worries! I prefer if people ask if they are unclear
Ariana should just be errated to be "Draw a card when you mine spice, collect the spice as normal". I think she would at least be decent. Maybe Rhombur should just start the game with a dreadnought instead of troops.
If you want to go all in on trying to balance the leaders
Helena should not be blocked in yellow. Ilesea's foldspace ring should be free. Leto's Chase should cost 1 solari and not one spice. Paul should be able PLAY the top card of his deck (though it may need some balancing issues), memnon should get a double bump on high council, and Yuna should just start with a water like everyone else.
Haha. I doubt this will happen. Tbh, I think it's fine. Part of the discovery process. They have a full reset with uprising anyway
Thought Leto should be S tier since his ring let him catch up 0.5 pt
I guess too many players play him, causing his win rate to go down
He actually isn't very popular online, the spice cost is a lot, and the tempo of the game now is really high. He is just too slow
Imo, the most important conclusion from those stats is that you cannot pass on ilban / tessia as p4/p3 else their win rate skyrocket.
Going from 4-3-2-1 to 4-3-1-2 or other variants would not fix this either, you would still be forced to pick them. I think the solution should be through some ban mechanism. For instance, p4 remove 1 leader and pick 1, then p3 remove 1 and pick another, etc.
Tessia/ilban would still remain the best pick for p4/p3, but at least, not picking them would be less terrible as you would just ban them.
Yes. If players like a no balance changes game. Picking tessia and ilban will continue to be the dominant strategy.
4312 will address player 2 winrate. That's about all.
So separate issue