As far as cars fit for purpose, the only one ive ever owned that i didn't want to modify anything on was my 2004 Lexus LS430. It did everything it needed to do absolutely beautifully. So naturally i put wheels on it and ruined the ride quality
Except in the book the mouse cleans up the house for the boy. It’s a mutually beneficial exchange. Teaches kids that if they’re going to ask for a lot, they should be willing to cooperate and help those that are helping them…
I disagree with an ND Miata "needing" an exhaust. I put one on mine after I got it and ran it for a few months and came to the conclusion that a loud exhaust is a fundamental character mismatch to the rest of the car. It just didn't "feel" right making more noise. I put the OEM one back on and I think the volume level is perfectly matched to the car on the street.
I honestly disagree on the W124. It is a great car, but by 2020s standards it's kinda shit. Even the plebian Passat is more comfortable, safer, faster and has better driving characteristics. Something like a 340i completely OBLITERATES any version of the W124. It was great back then, but by now it is a RELIC. Same thing applies to the LS400.
17+ GT350R is quite good out of the box, sounds epic and handles great with the magnaride. Modern GT3/GT4 are great out of the box, but depends how much much exhaust you need. Not sure how you’d improve it through mods.
So few cars need nothing. GT4 is absolutely lovely out of the box, but it could use exhaust tweaks and an exhaust valve controller. If you forget the gearing issue.
@Nick22257 It's a trade-off. The GT has way better ratios. Near perfect. But Tremec feel is far better than the Getrag. But like you, I have a small convertible (ND1 Miata in my case) that allows me me to row for days it's so tightly spaced.
My ZL1-1LE is bone stock. 11 second 1/4 off the truck. Lap Times within the top 5% at any race track. Sounds great with the stock exhaust. Superb braking power with its 15.5" brakes. 1.19 max cornering Gs. I've clocked 1.4 on slicks. Obviously the 7:16.04 Nurburgring time. No reliability issues. Excellent cooling system with 11 heat exchangers. Cheap running costs vs the competition that it's up against. ...and a back seat to take my 6 year old on weekend drives. Excellent front end feel. Adjustable ride height, toe, and camber right from the factory. Shorter 5th and 6th gears. Comes in Manual. Gets tons of respect on the road. Perfect car period, end of discussion. It needs nothing.
@@davec3568 Your denial doesn't change that everyone agrees the Camaro has poor visibility. And that everyone agrees FWD is lame for acceleration. These are basic facts not opinions.
@@davec3568 My opinion, others including Jason's opinion and basic physics. Well you can, but that's not the point it's a fundamental flaw that prevents them from being a perfect car.
2016 Camaro 2SS or 1LE. Enough power to scare you, enough handling to impress you, enough luxury to coddle you. Of course it could be better put together, but what it offers is tremendous.
This is a dumb comment but if i could have a 6g ss with a coyote variant in it that would be perfect for me😂 I would have a bunch of chevys on my list but needing a cam to sound good knocks them all off
@@Kalepsis Is the steering any good with the steering box rather than rack-and-pinion? I swear I've heard that the one weak point in those was the steering was a bit dead and imprecise.
I can not imagine.. the concept of someone having a C55 and dumping it for a '18 Laptop car. I bought a 05 Element after being smacked in my 05 Accord EX (the most perfect car Ive had, full leather, blue, with chmsl, wing, alloys and the sunroof.) Two months after having it I hated the sunroof and had to change out the battery.. and I realized that the power steering was electric.. which is why she actually had "decent" power with the hvac on. -- In short, didnt like it faaar too complicated / nice. Bought my Element in 14, with a 4spd in a vinyl Blue color inside and a -- identical to standard Police Blue outside. I put the backseats up I only have 1 other person with me.. and I haul everything from a washer dryer, water heater, 6pc table and chairs, 20' Ladder and Power Washer, 4 Lawn Mowers.. plus other passenger. My Element.. needs.. minor things. No tint or apple bs, no nav or leather junk. Id switch out the 4spd for a 5. id change out the rear for a Ford or Chevy one.. with a more robust rear suspension. I wouldnt change the nose.. or much else. (Maybe in a imaginary world, I might add 4" inside the rear windows) whose doors open like a pair of french doors. But.. its damn near perfect. Its got head room for someone who is 7'5. Its got no tech b.s Ive fixed the Vrtec solidnoid as well as a ton of other mait stuff. Might need speakers.. cause I ride with the windows down in all weather.. all the time and music cranking. --- In a world of Uber and Lyft where everyone has their windows up... I want to CRANK THE MUSIC L O U D !!!
I had the C55 for 10 years and 100,000 miles. I have sport bikes now that scratch the itch the AMG left behind. The C55 wasn’t dumped, we decided it was time to see other cars :).
Are you ready? Rolls Royce drop head coupe. It does it's mission flawlessly. And for realism... Lexus rx330/350. There is absolutely nothing to do to that roller skate to make it better. It is the perfect androgenous car.
I think most cars aren't perfect because all engineering is built on compromises. They are also a product of their time. Also, Derek listing how many mods his Porsche had me laughing.
But if you take it as a product of the era, even then compromises will have been made - for cost, reliability, or just to appeal to more people? It's always going to be the case. I guess the real question I took from this is, even with those known compromises, is there a car you wouldn't change because it's good enough you're enjoying it without thinking about changing it?
My top 5 picks would have to be: -Mercedes 300 sl gullwing -Mercedes 300 sel 6.3 -Ferrari Dino 206 -1986 Honda CRX Si (even the US spec is a dream car of mine) -1962 Chrysler 300H Long Ram
Gullwing is just too expensive and special to touch. But imagine a world where they were abundant. Everyone would replace the drums on each corner to disc brakes.
@kamilb8232 You have a good point. 👍 I've never driven one, but I have heard that the finned aluminum drums actually work pretty well. If a sack full of millions were to fall from the sky and land on my porch, I'd use a Gullwing for early morning, quick (not necessarily fast), backroads driving; in good weather. In that context, I think that the drums would be fine. 🤷♂️
Anything too old requires mods just to function today (headlights, brakes, A/C upgrades for R134a as R12 doesn't exist anymore, tires, aftermarket repairs since OE suppliers went out of business 15 years ago and the parts are all gone). Anything too new has so much junk added on due to regulations, many of the mods are just removing or bypassing that stuff.
1998 is basically oldest I'd ever want to go back from today Also considering how much worse safety was back then, and how many more distracted drivers are on the road today
@@Cypress_green I live in México so we did not get any Hondas in those days, you are correct about the understeer but, even so it pulls .85g in cornering.
I realized years ago, we enthusiasts modify because the manufacturers engineer compliance and compromise into every model. This is usually due to gas mileage, safety, cost, etc. Honda's were built with double wishbone suspension until the 2000's (except the S2000). I can only assume this was abandoned for MacPherson due to manufacturing costs.
For me, my 6th gen Camaro 2SS 1LE is perfect. Tremec transmission is engaging but not irritating, clutch is the same, seats are comfy but very well bolstered, it has modern tech, a fine sound system and the best sounding engine in production. That said, every American V8 needs an x pipe exhaust and fat cam. But suspension is magneride, both comfy and stupid stiff, steering is the best in any EPS car I've driven. And pre-facelift is the best looking muscle car of the 3. Edit bought mine with skip shift delete, other than that, literally flawless.
@iainbradbury1463 ZLE has too much power, I drove one for maybe 30 minutes around town, and it literally can't be enjoyed or revved out unless you're on a highway or track.
@@braydenbro9247 "too much power" you just revealed yourself as insane. And visibility really matters in traffic, the blind spots in that car are atrocious and make it too dangerous for spirited driving in traffic.
My R8 is the least modified of the 42 or so cars I've had. Just changed the exhaust and that's about it. Practically everything else I've had has been extensively modified.
I'd say the LC500, but I bet people would want to manual swap it. But for its intended purpose, I think it does a great job. Please say it does a great job, I don't want any remorse.
My 1993 Rx-7 was a treat. Loved that car bone stock. It may have needed some reliability changes in the long run but for years 2 through 5 that I owned it it was fantastic
My E39 530i M sport manual was probably the only car that only got a subwoofer in 12 yrs of ownership, but also had limited time and funds. If I still had it, I would do some of the mods like M539 is doing to those M54 motors and 6 spd transmission and diff. I think end use case drives the decision on how much one modifies, as we all can't afford GMA T.33 (dream ride). And they are not making a T.43 for the masses to enjoy. Great topic. Going down a E82 N52 manual 🐇 hole for fun, slowly long ownership I have done ~ 15% diff ratio change 3.73 from 3.23 no L$D, E9X M3/1M suspension arms, 4 pots from F22/F30, larger offset wheel with square MP44 with 225 width rubber for grip/slip balance, chamber plates, poly RSFB, BMW perf exht, 3SI... Only thing left is a swap in oil cooler and M cluster with oil temp and maybe one day 1M body front and back...
Got a 2007 facelift W211 diesel V6 in 2021, restored it with OEM/OE+ parts. No mods. Handles like a boat but I love it to death. I'd say any modern EClass W212/W213 AMGs are probably great cars for what they are meant to do i.e their purpose. So my answer is the modern E-Class lol.
Love the C43. I had a 1998 black with 2 tone. It needed 18 inch monoblocks and springs, which I did. My current F87 M2 CS is near perfect. H&R springs are my only mod, and it needed them with its stubby stance. It kind of needs an exhaust due to the cow udder muffler, but it’s not a high priority.
i think a later ls400 from Lexus with the nakimichi stereo was pretty peak. for it's intended purpose it didn't need anything to be a competent quiet and luxurious car for the driver or passengers
Just bought a manual Alfa Giulia Q 2016. Visually & functionally I’m stunned, as I don’t want to change a single thing - which I normally would (height, wheels etc) It will however get some upgrades in rustproofing, fixing a trunk water leak etc.
wow ...here again to get some love for my R129...yes its a 300SL 5sp auto...I always 'think' I want a manual. and want v8 or v12..but is is a great car as created and fits 'my needs'....but I have left it alone mechanically ..cosmetics a few fixes (SLK55, replacing bits as needed) ....just keep driving
2016/17 Chevy SS 6MT gets my vote. Depends on if you count the skipshift eliminator as a necessary mod, as you can technically drive around it by not letting all the conditions it needs to activate line up.
I was about to say this. I owned one for a year and even autocrossed and tracked with it. The only real thing I wanted to change (outside of brake fluid and an alignment) was the seats had poor bolstering.
I haven’t driven a GT4 in particular but I do have an early pre smog 308 GTB and would definitely agree with your assessment. However I did do a couple of small reliability things like a Pertronix ignition hidden in the distributor to get rid of the points, a gear reduction starter, and a Birdman fuse block so it won’t burn itself to the ground. I wouldn’t change anything about the way it drives, sounds, or looks though. Did you do any reliability upgrades to the GT4?
LS400 is the only thing I could come up with. Some trucks and off-road vehicles would fall in there perhaps, but I'm not really versed enough to know. Maybe Tacoma/Hilux or Land cruiser.
I would say the European E28 M5 fits this discussion, although BMW tends to like very heavy flywheels. You guys talked about lightened flywheels a few times, when is that episode? Asking before I commit to an OEM 28 lb flywheel in my M42 E30.
@vladimirchervenkov6949 Hi! I've modified the interior with rollbar, racing seats (2x) + steering wheel + belts. Plus, no problems with cooling system. ONLY Liqui Moly oils & aditives! It's unique and very special 😎
I know this may not be a popular opinion but to me I love the look and feel of a stock car. To many people don’t know what they are doing. I don’t have the opportunity to drive as many true performance cars, but to me a car I loved was my 08 Acura TL Type S. I loved the Kinetic Blue Pearl, I loved the feel and driving of it. Was it perfect? No. But I think that’s why we like certain cars. I also would argue that it would’ve been nice to have Apple CarPlay, it would’ve ruined the look of the interior. Same when folks change the wheels/rims. The design was picked for a reason. Sometimes theyre wrong. If I ever did modify, it’d have to be in a tasteful way.
After owning a 5th Gen Camaro SS and making a good number of changes (and having more I desired) and then selling it to get a 6th Gen SS 1LE, the 1LE accomplishes everything I was hoping for from my 5th Gen out of the box.
Sounds as though Jason would like an E39 B10 3.3 with the manual box… and since you picked an AMG as the car needing no mods, that makes Alpinas fair game too!
Was going to mention that myself, I actually have one. The only change on my car is the stereo, but that was the previous owner, and I do have the original so it can go back in. I wouldn’t change anything about it. I could see some people putting a short shift kit on it, but I like a long throw shift, and I think it suits the character of the car to have a longer throw.
Love my 128i with the m sport package. Feels like a modern e30. When it was time to refresh the suspension I went with a b12 kit but for the most part, it’s stock.
i have a 190e sportline dtm`92 edition. Apart from needing more power (it s the 1.8 version) it`s kinda perfect, but i ve changed the steering wheel. Perfect seats, suspension, driving feel, engine sound
Oddly enough, I didn’t mod my 2012 Fiat 500 Lounge… manual, red leather and a Bose sound system from the factory. The only thing I did was have it delivered w/ Abarth style wheels and tint. Yes… not fast, but as a downtown city car? It’s the perfect size, pretty and makes you smile. I only got it because the Abarth had yet to be launched in NA.
The W211 E55 was just about perfect. The power, features, luxury... its all there. Sport mode lets it start in 1st, smooth air suspension, adjustable dampening.
I did a few laps @Road America with the new M3 Comp & thought it was perfect as-is. Journalists talk about “lack of steering feel” all the time on certain cars, I’m still trying to figure that out, it’s prob a me thing. Great topic & episode today!
There's an episode where they talked about that, but I have no idea which one to direct you to. IIRC it's one of the episodes where they're across a table against a wall.
If we’re not talking about major engineering issues, then both the E39 M5 and E46 M3 were perfection out of the box. There was nothing either M-car could be faulted for, and both served their purposes well. Again, not talking about rod bearing, subframe issues etc, because not every car suffered the same fate. I would also argue that out of the box, the Maserati Quattroporte (2005-2012) was perfection, with the choices coming down to which gearbox you preferred and face-lift or not. I had the DuoSelect and I quite liked the “animal” nature that came along with that gearbox, plus it was the closest thing next to a true manual that was available. Few other cars come to mind, though I’ve not driven, are Lotus Carlton, R53 Cooper JCW, Audi RS2 Avant and Toyota Landcruiser (J60/70) series
Just got Hyundai i20N Performance, love it stock but some voice inside my head is telling me to do some moods like intake, blow-off valve, ....😊😅😊😂 Now I'm in split decision what to do😂😂😂 Great podcast episode guys
Although mine isn't stock engine-wise, the 2015 Camaro Z/28 fully encompasses its intended purpose. It isn't pretending to be a comfortable street car, neither is it beyond street use. Visually and viscerally on point.
03 Lexus LS430 Ultra Luxury, 18 Genesis G80, and 18 Chevy bolt (in-town gocart) are probably the closest i have owned that served the function i wanted where it didnt really need modification. If i nitpick tho, each one has like one thing i would add or change. Ls430 (GROM Vline bluetooth android auto module), G80 (comma.ai), bolt (better front seats). So im not sure if it 100% counts as perfection? Everything else i have modified to enhance what it does. I feel like most cars are compromised by having to be street-able. So off road cars are better with suspension and wheel and tire changes, sports cars generally power, suspension, brakes alignment/camber. So luxury cars are probably the easiest to not modify because it satisfies its purpose out of the box. Also DTS is right about old cars and reliability mods eliminates most older cars.
The only vehicle I haven't modified is my '99 911 996 Cab manual (w/ cable throttle, sport seats, LSD). Yes the final drive is too long but I use it for medium to long distance fun drives and it suits the highway. The exhaust could be a bit louder, but that also works against the main mission--no drone as-is. Plus the top goes down for more engine noise. Becker audio, so you just have to hook up a bluetooth adapter to the CD interface.
After driving a GR Corolla, Golf R, Civic type R and Elantra N. I think the Elantra N was the only one I didn’t think about throwing mods at when driving
Lexus ES is about perfect dor its intended use case. Aside from the dieselgate recall, our Mk7 TDI was pretty close to perfect as well. Only made aome personalization changes with OBDEleven to get Urban Joke Tail Lights and be able to rolldown windows with the key fob.
@balucipher Fair enough. I don't have much experience with them. I just hear great things about them and that they don't have the issues with floors ripping out like the previous generations
@ yeah they're ok stock but I don't think win the don't do any mods category. Most people at this point replace the rod bearings with aftermarket as preventative maintenance but they're more solid overall than the E46 M3s for sure.
I don't have much experience with these, but what about Cadillacs and Lincolns from the 60s? Obviously the sealed beam headlights is a problem, but is it really a modification to put in sealed beam LED headlights instead of the stock sealed beam ones. I see it has the same thing as tires and air filters. You might go for original looking ones, but you wouldn't be expected to put natural rubber tires on a original Model T.
I've been daily driving a Mk5 Jetta GLI for the past 6 month, only thing I've changed is the wheels, to other OEM wheels. And a little bit of programming to change to European lighting behaviour. It's a great effortless, quiet, daily/roadtrip/fun enough on a twisty road car. It does have a couple glaring engineering weaknesses, but that just means you have to replace certain parts a little more often than you'd like. I have a noisy old car for driving like I stole it, this is a great counterpoint.
Just to say, the second facelift 129s got the 600 brakes and all have 5sp autos. I have a 99 SL280, and as it's 'use case' is wafting about small French country roads I wouldn't change a thing.
Could y’all discuss pros cons/what to look for in lightweight flywheel? Considered that or underpulled pulley’s but never felt like risking the drivability/vibration
Higher rpm from a standstill start if you aren't practiced, so higher clutch deg. and better if you sharp your game for normal driving, it thing it could be rewarding but risky given you engage it every given minute
I dont know if any of my picks are “perfect” but here are all the cars I have driven that I could own without modifying. Some are in higher trim, and obviously in manual when applicable. S2000 F87 CS F80 Comp E92 gts Gt350R (gen 2) GT2 Amg gtr R35 gtr A90 supra Gen 5 viper Im sure that will change as I get the privilege of experiencing more interesting machines. I relate to this heavily as my first two cars I bought were modified subarus and I’ve been chasing that dragon ever since. Nothing to liven up a morning commute like ethanol and an external wastegate!
1) If you give a mouse a cookie is supposed to illustrate the ridiculousness of the slippery slope fallacy. Or there was no greater lesson and it was just a clever circular literary structure that resulted in lots of sales. Ask the author. 2) The difference between a car needing a mod and just fundamentally not liking what the car "is trying to be" is that cost benefit analysis that owners have to make. Miatas: Yes you add an exhaust so you can actually hear the engine note over wind noise, and you buy a stiffer rear sway bar to flatten out some of the happy rolly pollies. Definitely worth it. Asking a CT-5 V Blackwing to be shorter isn't exactly in the realm of "mods", that's just indicating the desire for a different car altogether. Given its size is part of what makes it "what it is" what are the specific mods that would actually be done to make it feel smaller, or would it make more sense to just realize that it is (at its core) a beefy car only slightly smaller than an M5?
As you’ve said, it depends what you’re going to use it for. Some would argue a Buick LeSabre is perfect out of the box. Would I buy one? No. I bet the Porsches are great out of the box, but they’re not for sitting in daily commute traffic.
Basically any car can meet buyer’s expectations, if either the expectations are set low or the desire for the car is extreme (this could also be cause by financial reasons)
When the episode started, I thought about the E39, the Camaro SS Manual and one of my big favs, the Chevy SS. The fact that a good 2016/17 Chevy SS manual still goes above MSRP is staggering ! IIRC, in the Chevy SS review, you compared it to the E39 M5 and in a former carmudgeon episode, you mentioned its interior had typical GM rattles. And during the CT4 and CT5 Blackwing episodes, I felt the CT4 BW needed a NA V8 and it would have been perfect. Given that GM has killed the camaro, i think they should launch a CT 4.5 V BW ! or call it the CT 4 V SS blackwing ! GM perfected the Alpha platform so well that a car so good it needs no mods is right around the corner.
Mini Cooper S R53. I own the R52 version (cabrio), and as much as I think on modding it, it just doesn't need anything. Its engine comes with a compressor, factory LSD, JCW 18 inch wheels, Sparco JCW bucket seats, stock exhaust does pops and bangs, the stock ride is low enough... Why would I mod it if it already has everything I need from it?
The e46 330i ZHP is the perfect daily. It takes an already nearly perfect car and adds the only little modifications a real enthusiast could think of - shorter shift knob, very subtle body kit, very subtle sport muffler, nice 18" wheels, slightly lower suspension. That's all on top of great sport seats, excellent steering, good smooth torquey engine, balanced suspension, all comfort features you really need - automatic lights, wipers, heated memory seats. Some jerk is gonna say the car would benefit from LSD. No, it doesn't need it. Go buy an M3 and suffer the consequences.
Yes. This. Had one back in the day and for a factory slicked up ride for "regular" public road driving I thought it was simply perfection and needed nothing. Rode in a friend M3 of the same era and I though that was overdone for the street.
For me, the "perfect" car is the one most people modify anyway: My ND2 Miata. I acknowledge you can make it faster, corner harder, and be "better", but for my use case it's damn near perfect stock. I get tempted to put an exhaust on it, but then I realize I am ruining the character of the car I love. So it stays stock. And it's better for it.
Pretty much. I have an ND2 as well and I'd agree, evenough though I added a Goodwin Racing Superstreet exhaust. left stock it would have been perfectly fine, enjoyable, and wildly entertaining. But I like the subtle add of the Goodwin muffler.
I love my “perfect for me” ND2 Miata. Yet I have long felt tempted to add an exhaust to enhance the sports car the auditory experience. I’ve researched several exhaust options, but haven’t been able to decide which direction to go- Goodwin, Flying Miata, or… So for now it remains stock.
@@AdamSKarp I was in the same boat for a bit and there's no rush on this as far as I'm concerned. I think it's easier to mod the ND's to a point you don't like so I'm slow with any changes on it because it's so good out of the box, IMO. Fortunately, I'm in a local Miata Club and had a chance to listen to many different exhaust systems from other club members. Between that and doing some on-line research and snooping I settled on the Goodwin Superstreet. Couldn't be happier and I think their tuning is spot on. Basically it keep's the stock Miata character but just wakes it up a bit and it's such an addictive sound. Their Helmholtz chambers really do the trick with a sonorous sporty sound without any drone. I think Goodwin has some RUclips vids with their different exhausts to listen to.
@lupinsea thanks for sharing your perspective and experience. I do think it’s wise to take time deciding. I agree it would be helpful to be able to hear different exhaust setups “in the wild” besides in videos people have posted.
What about an early series 3 jaguar e-type with the V12 and before the big bumpers (so maybe 1972)? Series 1 is great except so first gear synchro and series 2 was still an i6
I have had that thought before because I love modding cars, and cars that I "love" and yes there is an answer, in my case for a fun car that would be the '05 Ford GT, I wouldnt change a thing to that car, well.. maybe add Carplay and MAYBE, a cold air intake for more supercharger whine. also, this question is really purpose dependent, If I bought something like a brand new RAV4 as a daily commuter/house car, I wouldnt mod a single thing to it.
Veloster N is very close to perfect for the expected experience. The only flaw is the 19 inch wheels on super low profile tires. The car loses 10+ lbs per wheel and gains performance and comfort by going to 18 inch wheels.
Without giving up my age, there are a lot of cars I've owned that weren't perfect. Austin America, for example.. or VW 23-window Deluxe Microbus. Cars I feel were correct without modifications for the time period? 1974 BMW 2002. 1978 VW Scirocco. 1985 Toyota Corolla GTS liftback. 1991 BMW 318is. 1991 E34 M5 Touring. The most recent car that I've "experienced" that's just about perfect without modifications is the BMW1M or its lesser versions, the 135i and 128i. I drove a 1M, which is awesome, but my 135i MSport with manual 6-speed does nearly the same things without the expense. its 300hp and 300 lb-ft. of torque is a near match to the 1M and is great fun when the turbos spool up. I like the sports seats and Harman Kardon sound system. No navigation screen. On the practical sideI especially like the fold down rear seat and pass-through. The flat floor makes a trip to IKEA an unheralded joy. if, on a road trip, your better half needs a nap, there's room to stretch out with resorting to the fetal position. There's an optional roof rack for your surfboard. The only thing I changed on mine is the tires -- from the run-flats to Michelin Pilot Sports. So there's no spare tire. I can'r remember when I last changed a tire on the side of the road.
My F90 BMW M5 Comp is great (dare I say - perfect) out of the box. First car I’ve had with no mods. My 718 Boxster GTS is perfect out of the box, haven’t done anything to it. My ND2 Miata RF Club has a full page of mods as it was not very good out of the box.
I’m not sure one exists. I heard the 964 rs a couple of times. But I have one, and I really think the exhaust is too quiet. Both me and a friend who have one ended up modifying the exhaust to wake it up a little.
I just assumed you were spitting into the water cup
I will say this podcast is perfect out of the box!
They like shit box Mercedes too much.
Could be an hour longer
needs a modmail on discord with no open chat so dont have to moderate it , comments deleted by youtube algo etc, otherwise cant send content ideas
As far as cars fit for purpose, the only one ive ever owned that i didn't want to modify anything on was my 2004 Lexus LS430. It did everything it needed to do absolutely beautifully.
So naturally i put wheels on it and ruined the ride quality
@@DerekLikesCars They really are nearly perfect. I just wish they were a bit prettier.
@nickrulez809765 the facelift (04-06) is what I'd call handsome rather than pretty. The pre-facelift is bad tho
Nutty Trail Mix getting more sponsor exposure and screen time than the official channel sponsor
Id argue "give a mouse a cookie" is about the danger of being too generous and being exploited.
Except in the book the mouse cleans up the house for the boy. It’s a mutually beneficial exchange. Teaches kids that if they’re going to ask for a lot, they should be willing to cooperate and help those that are helping them…
@griffins750 i agree with you on that as well.
Somehow not surprised to see a very specific Sacco era Benz on the thumbnail
I disagree with an ND Miata "needing" an exhaust. I put one on mine after I got it and ran it for a few months and came to the conclusion that a loud exhaust is a fundamental character mismatch to the rest of the car. It just didn't "feel" right making more noise. I put the OEM one back on and I think the volume level is perfectly matched to the car on the street.
I take engine noise over exhaust noise all day long.
@farishanafiah8461 Exactly, after I went back to a stock exhaust the intake noise became way more pronounced and I forgot how nice it is
1.5 or 2.0 though?
@@miguelmc2289 Mine's a 2.0, can't comment on the 1.5 as we never got them in the US
Sounds like maybe your exhaust choice was just too loud?
W124 Mercedes and the Lexus LS400 are both perfect for their intended purpose.
LS400…the car that was copied off of the W124
@vladimirchervenkov6949 It's derivative, but it's also better.
@@nickrulez809765 they had second mover advantage, just like BMW with the E30 M3
even though bmw spent, what, like a tenth what Mercedes did on the platform?? @@vladimirchervenkov6949
I honestly disagree on the W124. It is a great car, but by 2020s standards it's kinda shit. Even the plebian Passat is more comfortable, safer, faster and has better driving characteristics. Something like a 340i completely OBLITERATES any version of the W124. It was great back then, but by now it is a RELIC.
Same thing applies to the LS400.
17+ GT350R is quite good out of the box, sounds epic and handles great with the magnaride. Modern GT3/GT4 are great out of the box, but depends how much much exhaust you need. Not sure how you’d improve it through mods.
The GT350 gearing is too tall just like Porsches. I own one and I wish the gearing was more closely spaced.
Gt350 is great, I think there are some longevity issues with the 5.2 engine though.
So few cars need nothing. GT4 is absolutely lovely out of the box, but it could use exhaust tweaks and an exhaust valve controller. If you forget the gearing issue.
@@kamilb8232 that’s unfortunate, the ratios and fd in my 15 gt are one of my favorite things about the car. Shifting constantly like my s2k
@Nick22257 It's a trade-off. The GT has way better ratios. Near perfect. But Tremec feel is far better than the Getrag.
But like you, I have a small convertible (ND1 Miata in my case) that allows me me to row for days it's so tightly spaced.
My ZL1-1LE is bone stock. 11 second 1/4 off the truck. Lap Times within the top 5% at any race track. Sounds great with the stock exhaust. Superb braking power with its 15.5" brakes. 1.19 max cornering Gs. I've clocked 1.4 on slicks. Obviously the 7:16.04 Nurburgring time. No reliability issues. Excellent cooling system with 11 heat exchangers. Cheap running costs vs the competition that it's up against. ...and a back seat to take my 6 year old on weekend drives. Excellent front end feel. Adjustable ride height, toe, and camber right from the factory. Shorter 5th and 6th gears. Comes in Manual. Gets tons of respect on the road. Perfect car period, end of discussion. It needs nothing.
My '18 Camaro SS 1LE and '25 Elantra N are good out of the box. Reliable on track with zero mods too.
Can't see, can't accelerate.
@@snek9353 Wrong, and wrong again. 🤣
@@davec3568 Your denial doesn't change that everyone agrees the Camaro has poor visibility. And that everyone agrees FWD is lame for acceleration. These are basic facts not opinions.
@@snek9353 Nope, just your misguided opinions. You also can't mod a car to change any of that.
@@davec3568 My opinion, others including Jason's opinion and basic physics.
Well you can, but that's not the point it's a fundamental flaw that prevents them from being a perfect car.
2016 Camaro 2SS or 1LE. Enough power to scare you, enough handling to impress you, enough luxury to coddle you. Of course it could be better put together, but what it offers is tremendous.
This is a dumb comment but if i could have a 6g ss with a coyote variant in it that would be perfect for me😂 I would have a bunch of chevys on my list but needing a cam to sound good knocks them all off
I owned an e39 M5. That car needed nothing, it was perfect from the factory.
Exhaust ! (I had one too)
Kennan is that you?
Shifter... Needs a shifter. Resonator delete is cheap and makes it more fun for next to no money without making it obnoxious.
@@Kalepsis Is the steering any good with the steering box rather than rack-and-pinion? I swear I've heard that the one weak point in those was the steering was a bit dead and imprecise.
This is the answer
My ‘18 Chevy Volt is the perfect daily driver. I had a ‘06 Mercedes C55 once with a lot of engine modifications only, it was perfect after that.
The only “mod” the volt required was a bigger back seat.
I can not imagine.. the concept of someone having a C55 and dumping it for a '18 Laptop car.
I bought a 05 Element after being smacked in my 05 Accord EX (the most perfect car Ive had, full leather, blue, with chmsl, wing, alloys and the sunroof.) Two months after having it I hated the sunroof and had to change out the battery.. and I realized that the power steering was electric.. which is why she actually had "decent" power with the hvac on. -- In short, didnt like it faaar too complicated / nice.
Bought my Element in 14, with a 4spd in a vinyl Blue color inside and a -- identical to standard Police Blue outside. I put the backseats up I only have 1 other person with me.. and I haul everything from a washer dryer, water heater, 6pc table and chairs, 20' Ladder and Power Washer, 4 Lawn Mowers.. plus other passenger. My Element.. needs.. minor things.
No tint or apple bs, no nav or leather junk.
Id switch out the 4spd for a 5. id change out the rear for a Ford or Chevy one.. with a more robust rear suspension. I wouldnt change the nose.. or much else. (Maybe in a imaginary world, I might add 4" inside the rear windows) whose doors open like a pair of french doors.
But.. its damn near perfect.
Its got head room for someone who is 7'5. Its got no tech b.s Ive fixed the Vrtec solidnoid as well as a ton of other mait stuff. Might need speakers.. cause I ride with the windows down in all weather.. all the time and music cranking. --- In a world of Uber and Lyft where everyone has their windows up... I want to CRANK THE MUSIC L O U D !!!
I had the C55 for 10 years and 100,000 miles. I have sport bikes now that scratch the itch the AMG left behind. The C55 wasn’t dumped, we decided it was time to see other cars :).
I love my Volts. What awesome dailys.
Are you ready? Rolls Royce drop head coupe. It does it's mission flawlessly. And for realism... Lexus rx330/350. There is absolutely nothing to do to that roller skate to make it better. It is the perfect androgenous car.
Just to be clear, the '04 gen RX330? I like looking at those more than I'd ever like to admit.
I think this is effectively, the perfect car. I completely agree 👍.
I think most cars aren't perfect because all engineering is built on compromises. They are also a product of their time.
Also, Derek listing how many mods his Porsche had me laughing.
But if you take it as a product of the era, even then compromises will have been made - for cost, reliability, or just to appeal to more people? It's always going to be the case. I guess the real question I took from this is, even with those known compromises, is there a car you wouldn't change because it's good enough you're enjoying it without thinking about changing it?
My top 5 picks would have to be:
-Mercedes 300 sl gullwing
-Mercedes 300 sel 6.3
-Ferrari Dino 206
-1986 Honda CRX Si (even the US spec is a dream car of mine)
-1962 Chrysler 300H Long Ram
Gullwing is just too expensive and special to touch. But imagine a world where they were abundant. Everyone would replace the drums on each corner to disc brakes.
@kamilb8232 You have a good point. 👍 I've never driven one, but I have heard that the finned aluminum drums actually work pretty well. If a sack full of millions were to fall from the sky and land on my porch, I'd use a Gullwing for early morning, quick (not necessarily fast), backroads driving; in good weather. In that context, I think that the drums would be fine. 🤷♂️
@@kamilb8232A lot of them seem have the disc brake upgrade installed. At least those that are actually being driven.
6.3 is a good one! 6.9 is close but would want euro lights, I don't mind US 6.9 bumpers.
"My Volkswagen doesn't ask, it demands", may be one of the greatest lines I've heard uttered on this show!
Anything too old requires mods just to function today (headlights, brakes, A/C upgrades for R134a as R12 doesn't exist anymore, tires, aftermarket repairs since OE suppliers went out of business 15 years ago and the parts are all gone). Anything too new has so much junk added on due to regulations, many of the mods are just removing or bypassing that stuff.
There is a perfect in between.
1998 is basically oldest I'd ever want to go back from today
Also considering how much worse safety was back then, and how many more distracted drivers are on the road today
NISSAN Sentra SE-R form the early 90's is perfect out of the box in my humble opinion.
Too much understeer out if the box, a 90s civic si is better
Sentra is more for American Drivers. Honda was more translated from Japanese.
"If you liked the Dodge Dart, your gonna love this Nissan!"
@@Cypress_green I live in México so we did not get any Hondas in those days, you are correct about the understeer but, even so it pulls .85g in cornering.
I realized years ago, we enthusiasts modify because the manufacturers engineer compliance and compromise into every model. This is usually due to gas mileage, safety, cost, etc. Honda's were built with double wishbone suspension until the 2000's (except the S2000). I can only assume this was abandoned for MacPherson due to manufacturing costs.
My guess is it's the engineering cost over the manufacturing cost.
For me, my 6th gen Camaro 2SS 1LE is perfect. Tremec transmission is engaging but not irritating, clutch is the same, seats are comfy but very well bolstered, it has modern tech, a fine sound system and the best sounding engine in production. That said, every American V8 needs an x pipe exhaust and fat cam. But suspension is magneride, both comfy and stupid stiff, steering is the best in any EPS car I've driven. And pre-facelift is the best looking muscle car of the 3.
Edit bought mine with skip shift delete, other than that, literally flawless.
I was going to going to mention the 2018 SS 1LE as well. I'd also add the ZL1 1LE.
@iainbradbury1463 ZLE has too much power, I drove one for maybe 30 minutes around town, and it literally can't be enjoyed or revved out unless you're on a highway or track.
@@braydenbro9247 "too much power" you just revealed yourself as insane.
And visibility really matters in traffic, the blind spots in that car are atrocious and make it too dangerous for spirited driving in traffic.
I’m in a non 1LE 2SS and I approve this message
@@braydenbro9247 Any V8 6th gen is too fast for city roads.
Candidates have to not need more induction or exhaust noise, and already have a decent stereo.
Yeah, an R129 500SL seems to fit !
My R8 is the least modified of the 42 or so cars I've had. Just changed the exhaust and that's about it. Practically everything else I've had has been extensively modified.
I'd say the LC500, but I bet people would want to manual swap it. But for its intended purpose, I think it does a great job. Please say it does a great job, I don't want any remorse.
Heard hybrid rear diff ratio swap to no hybrid versions was a thing. Wish many Lexus product had a manual, and not just the last IS250 rwd...
My 1993 Rx-7 was a treat. Loved that car bone stock. It may have needed some reliability changes in the long run but for years 2 through 5 that I owned it it was fantastic
My E39 530i M sport manual was probably the only car that only got a subwoofer in 12 yrs of ownership, but also had limited time and funds. If I still had it, I would do some of the mods like M539 is doing to those M54 motors and 6 spd transmission and diff. I think end use case drives the decision on how much one modifies, as we all can't afford GMA T.33 (dream ride). And they are not making a T.43 for the masses to enjoy. Great topic. Going down a E82 N52 manual 🐇 hole for fun, slowly long ownership I have done ~ 15% diff ratio change 3.73 from 3.23 no L$D, E9X M3/1M suspension arms, 4 pots from F22/F30, larger offset wheel with square MP44 with 225 width rubber for grip/slip balance, chamber plates, poly RSFB, BMW perf exht, 3SI... Only thing left is a swap in oil cooler and M cluster with oil temp and maybe one day 1M body front and back...
Got a 2007 facelift W211 diesel V6 in 2021, restored it with OEM/OE+ parts. No mods. Handles like a boat but I love it to death. I'd say any modern EClass W212/W213 AMGs are probably great cars for what they are meant to do i.e their purpose. So my answer is the modern E-Class lol.
Love the C43. I had a 1998 black with 2 tone. It needed 18 inch monoblocks and springs, which I did.
My current F87 M2 CS is near perfect. H&R springs are my only mod, and it needed them with its stubby stance. It kind of needs an exhaust due to the cow udder muffler, but it’s not a high priority.
i think a later ls400 from Lexus with the nakimichi stereo was pretty peak. for it's intended purpose it didn't need anything to be a competent quiet and luxurious car for the driver or passengers
An ND3 Club is driving perfection straight off the showroom floor. No mods needed.
Just bought a manual Alfa Giulia Q 2016. Visually & functionally I’m stunned, as I don’t want to change a single thing - which I normally would (height, wheels etc)
It will however get some upgrades in rustproofing, fixing a trunk water leak etc.
"If You Give a Mouse a Cookie" teaches the dangers of sharing
wow ...here again to get some love for my R129...yes its a 300SL 5sp auto...I always 'think' I want a manual. and want v8 or v12..but is is a great car as created and fits 'my needs'....but I have left it alone mechanically ..cosmetics a few fixes (SLK55, replacing bits as needed) ....just keep driving
2016/17 Chevy SS 6MT gets my vote. Depends on if you count the skipshift eliminator as a necessary mod, as you can technically drive around it by not letting all the conditions it needs to activate line up.
I was about to say this. I owned one for a year and even autocrossed and tracked with it. The only real thing I wanted to change (outside of brake fluid and an alignment) was the seats had poor bolstering.
What about the badges? - Most of these I have seen in the US have had the badges changed to Holden badges
Absolutely. You can mod to the moon, but don't need to.
I haven’t driven a GT4 in particular but I do have an early pre smog 308 GTB and would definitely agree with your assessment. However I did do a couple of small reliability things like a Pertronix ignition hidden in the distributor to get rid of the points, a gear reduction starter, and a Birdman fuse block so it won’t burn itself to the ground. I wouldn’t change anything about the way it drives, sounds, or looks though. Did you do any reliability upgrades to the GT4?
As a 308 GT4 owner I was surprised you didn't mention the thermal reactor and air pump. Both have been removed on my car.
As for the intro filming last, that's also what Craig Ferguson used to do during his The Late Late Show run for the same reason.
Awkward stare
LS400 is the only thing I could come up with. Some trucks and off-road vehicles would fall in there perhaps, but I'm not really versed enough to know. Maybe Tacoma/Hilux or Land cruiser.
I was also thinking LS400/LS430
Haven't owned them, but I'd say a Lexus LC500 and any new Caterham (you can spec them with exactly what you want).
love the setting!
17:14 blue e30 wagon beAUtiful piece of metal
19:16 19:23 now That’s some sick C43 photos
31:08 gorgeous W124 wagon
Also 27:50 hilarious
Based on the thumbnail only I'm guessing another episode about an old Merc...
😂
I would say the European E28 M5 fits this discussion, although BMW tends to like very heavy flywheels. You guys talked about lightened flywheels a few times, when is that episode? Asking before I commit to an OEM 28 lb flywheel in my M42 E30.
My BMW M3 E36 ❤😎 just perfect 👌
I want an E36 M3 so bad but I’ve got to point out the inherently flawed cooling system and cheap materials interior
@vladimirchervenkov6949 Hi! I've modified the interior with rollbar, racing seats (2x) + steering wheel + belts. Plus, no problems with cooling system. ONLY Liqui Moly oils & aditives! It's unique and very special 😎
I know this may not be a popular opinion but to me I love the look and feel of a stock car. To many people don’t know what they are doing. I don’t have the opportunity to drive as many true performance cars, but to me a car I loved was my 08 Acura TL Type S. I loved the Kinetic Blue Pearl, I loved the feel and driving of it. Was it perfect? No. But I think that’s why we like certain cars. I also would argue that it would’ve been nice to have Apple CarPlay, it would’ve ruined the look of the interior. Same when folks change the wheels/rims. The design was picked for a reason. Sometimes theyre wrong. If I ever did modify, it’d have to be in a tasteful way.
I whole heartedly agree! I own 6 cars, 100% stock. When I buy a used car the first thing I do is replace the mods with stock equipment.
After owning a 5th Gen Camaro SS and making a good number of changes (and having more I desired) and then selling it to get a 6th Gen SS 1LE, the 1LE accomplishes everything I was hoping for from my 5th Gen out of the box.
Sounds as though Jason would like an E39 B10 3.3 with the manual box… and since you picked an AMG as the car needing no mods, that makes Alpinas fair game too!
Was going to mention that myself, I actually have one. The only change on my car is the stereo, but that was the previous owner, and I do have the original so it can go back in. I wouldn’t change anything about it.
I could see some people putting a short shift kit on it, but I like a long throw shift, and I think it suits the character of the car to have a longer throw.
For the Battle of the Barges, get yourself a 2012 Jaguar XJL Supersport. You'll be amazed.
Love my 128i with the m sport package. Feels like a modern e30. When it was time to refresh the suspension I went with a b12 kit but for the most part, it’s stock.
i have a 190e sportline dtm`92 edition. Apart from needing more power (it s the 1.8 version) it`s kinda perfect, but i ve changed the steering wheel. Perfect seats, suspension, driving feel, engine sound
Oddly enough, I didn’t mod my 2012 Fiat 500 Lounge… manual, red leather and a Bose sound system from the factory. The only thing I did was have it delivered w/ Abarth style wheels and tint. Yes… not fast, but as a downtown city car?
It’s the perfect size, pretty and makes you smile. I only got it because the Abarth had yet to be launched in NA.
The W211 E55 was just about perfect. The power, features, luxury... its all there. Sport mode lets it start in 1st, smooth air suspension, adjustable dampening.
I did a few laps @Road America with the new M3 Comp & thought it was perfect as-is. Journalists talk about “lack of steering feel” all the time on certain cars, I’m still trying to figure that out, it’s prob a me thing. Great topic & episode today!
There's an episode where they talked about that, but I have no idea which one to direct you to. IIRC it's one of the episodes where they're across a table against a wall.
If we’re not talking about major engineering issues, then both the E39 M5 and E46 M3 were perfection out of the box. There was nothing either M-car could be faulted for, and both served their purposes well. Again, not talking about rod bearing, subframe issues etc, because not every car suffered the same fate. I would also argue that out of the box, the Maserati Quattroporte (2005-2012) was perfection, with the choices coming down to which gearbox you preferred and face-lift or not. I had the DuoSelect and I quite liked the “animal” nature that came along with that gearbox, plus it was the closest thing next to a true manual that was available. Few other cars come to mind, though I’ve not driven, are Lotus Carlton, R53 Cooper JCW, Audi RS2 Avant and Toyota Landcruiser (J60/70) series
Just got Hyundai i20N Performance, love it stock but some voice inside my head is telling me to do some moods like intake, blow-off valve, ....😊😅😊😂
Now I'm in split decision what to do😂😂😂
Great podcast episode guys
Although mine isn't stock engine-wise, the 2015 Camaro Z/28 fully encompasses its intended purpose. It isn't pretending to be a comfortable street car, neither is it beyond street use. Visually and viscerally on point.
03 Lexus LS430 Ultra Luxury, 18 Genesis G80, and 18 Chevy bolt (in-town gocart) are probably the closest i have owned that served the function i wanted where it didnt really need modification. If i nitpick tho, each one has like one thing i would add or change. Ls430 (GROM Vline bluetooth android auto module), G80 (comma.ai), bolt (better front seats). So im not sure if it 100% counts as perfection? Everything else i have modified to enhance what it does. I feel like most cars are compromised by having to be street-able. So off road cars are better with suspension and wheel and tire changes, sports cars generally power, suspension, brakes alignment/camber. So luxury cars are probably the easiest to not modify because it satisfies its purpose out of the box. Also DTS is right about old cars and reliability mods eliminates most older cars.
1997 Buick LeSabre V6 3800 was absolutely flawless out of the factory. There is absolutely nothing you can do to that car to improve it.
The only vehicle I haven't modified is my '99 911 996 Cab manual (w/ cable throttle, sport seats, LSD). Yes the final drive is too long but I use it for medium to long distance fun drives and it suits the highway. The exhaust could be a bit louder, but that also works against the main mission--no drone as-is. Plus the top goes down for more engine noise. Becker audio, so you just have to hook up a bluetooth adapter to the CD interface.
S2000 is worth experiencing stock and is also really rewarding to modify if you know what you’re doing
New Dark Horse in manual is great. 4 seats, loud, fast enough, and if you live down south its a great daily with magnaride.
- Gen 3 Ford F150 Raptor w/ 37” tire package
- Jeep Wrangler 392 w/ XR package
- i kinda want to say 458, but i would want it with a manual.
After driving a GR Corolla, Golf R, Civic type R and Elantra N. I think the Elantra N was the only one I didn’t think about throwing mods at when driving
Lexus ES is about perfect dor its intended use case.
Aside from the dieselgate recall, our Mk7 TDI was pretty close to perfect as well. Only made aome personalization changes with OBDEleven to get Urban Joke Tail Lights and be able to rolldown windows with the key fob.
How about an E90 M3, or 1M coupe? Would you do any mods to those?
Needs an exhaust because it's far too quiet stock. And carbon fiber plenums make such glorious induction noise, you're missing out leaving it stock
@balucipher Fair enough. I don't have much experience with them. I just hear great things about them and that they don't have the issues with floors ripping out like the previous generations
@ yeah they're ok stock but I don't think win the don't do any mods category. Most people at this point replace the rod bearings with aftermarket as preventative maintenance but they're more solid overall than the E46 M3s for sure.
BMW E53 X5 3.0 inline 6 - does everything well
I don't have much experience with these, but what about Cadillacs and Lincolns from the 60s?
Obviously the sealed beam headlights is a problem, but is it really a modification to put in sealed beam LED headlights instead of the stock sealed beam ones. I see it has the same thing as tires and air filters. You might go for original looking ones, but you wouldn't be expected to put natural rubber tires on a original Model T.
I've been daily driving a Mk5 Jetta GLI for the past 6 month, only thing I've changed is the wheels, to other OEM wheels. And a little bit of programming to change to European lighting behaviour. It's a great effortless, quiet, daily/roadtrip/fun enough on a twisty road car. It does have a couple glaring engineering weaknesses, but that just means you have to replace certain parts a little more often than you'd like.
I have a noisy old car for driving like I stole it, this is a great counterpoint.
2003 Mazda Protege 5 5MT, 2012 MINI Cooper S Base 6MT, MK 7 GTI DSG (with smooth roads)
E82 1M, E39 M5, W203 C55 AMG, W211 E55 AMG
Just to say, the second facelift 129s got the 600 brakes and all have 5sp autos.
I have a 99 SL280, and as it's 'use case' is wafting about small French country roads I wouldn't change a thing.
Maybe a Lexus LC 500, does the job it sets out to do pretty well.
Perfect but it needs a manual
I would get a 96-98 cobra, never driven it but I imagine I wouldn’t change it for many reasons
Could y’all discuss pros cons/what to look for in lightweight flywheel?
Considered that or underpulled pulley’s but never felt like risking the drivability/vibration
Higher rpm from a standstill start if you aren't practiced, so higher clutch deg. and better if you sharp your game for normal driving, it thing it could be rewarding but risky given you engage it every given minute
Depends entirely on the car and how you drive it.
I dont know if any of my picks are “perfect” but here are all the cars I have driven that I could own without modifying. Some are in higher trim, and obviously in manual when applicable.
S2000
F87 CS
F80 Comp
E92 gts
Gt350R (gen 2)
GT2
Amg gtr
R35 gtr
A90 supra
Gen 5 viper
Im sure that will change as I get the privilege of experiencing more interesting machines. I relate to this heavily as my first two cars I bought were modified subarus and I’ve been chasing that dragon ever since. Nothing to liven up a morning commute like ethanol and an external wastegate!
1) If you give a mouse a cookie is supposed to illustrate the ridiculousness of the slippery slope fallacy. Or there was no greater lesson and it was just a clever circular literary structure that resulted in lots of sales. Ask the author.
2) The difference between a car needing a mod and just fundamentally not liking what the car "is trying to be" is that cost benefit analysis that owners have to make. Miatas: Yes you add an exhaust so you can actually hear the engine note over wind noise, and you buy a stiffer rear sway bar to flatten out some of the happy rolly pollies. Definitely worth it. Asking a CT-5 V Blackwing to be shorter isn't exactly in the realm of "mods", that's just indicating the desire for a different car altogether. Given its size is part of what makes it "what it is" what are the specific mods that would actually be done to make it feel smaller, or would it make more sense to just realize that it is (at its core) a beefy car only slightly smaller than an M5?
As you’ve said, it depends what you’re going to use it for. Some would argue a Buick LeSabre is perfect out of the box. Would I buy one? No. I bet the Porsches are great out of the box, but they’re not for sitting in daily commute traffic.
2003 C5 Corvette Z06 is a pretty complete car in my opinion
Basically any car can meet buyer’s expectations, if either the expectations are set low or the desire for the car is extreme (this could also be cause by financial reasons)
Like someone buying a Camry. Knows exactly what to expect. And wants no change needed.
@mirzaster precisely why I posted this comment
I put a BlueBus in my E39 M5, does that count? Of the 4 options, I have M-Audio and a folding rear seat, pretty perfect for my use.
The way he picked that bottle up pissed me off bad
When the episode started, I thought about the E39, the Camaro SS Manual and one of my big favs, the Chevy SS. The fact that a good 2016/17 Chevy SS manual still goes above MSRP is staggering ! IIRC, in the Chevy SS review, you compared it to the E39 M5 and in a former carmudgeon episode, you mentioned its interior had typical GM rattles.
And during the CT4 and CT5 Blackwing episodes, I felt the CT4 BW needed a NA V8 and it would have been perfect. Given that GM has killed the camaro, i think they should launch a CT 4.5 V BW ! or call it the CT 4 V SS blackwing !
GM perfected the Alpha platform so well that a car so good it needs no mods is right around the corner.
Mini Cooper S R53. I own the R52 version (cabrio), and as much as I think on modding it, it just doesn't need anything. Its engine comes with a compressor, factory LSD, JCW 18 inch wheels, Sparco JCW bucket seats, stock exhaust does pops and bangs, the stock ride is low enough... Why would I mod it if it already has everything I need from it?
The e46 330i ZHP is the perfect daily. It takes an already nearly perfect car and adds the only little modifications a real enthusiast could think of - shorter shift knob, very subtle body kit, very subtle sport muffler, nice 18" wheels, slightly lower suspension.
That's all on top of great sport seats, excellent steering, good smooth torquey engine, balanced suspension, all comfort features you really need - automatic lights, wipers, heated memory seats.
Some jerk is gonna say the car would benefit from LSD. No, it doesn't need it. Go buy an M3 and suffer the consequences.
Yes. This.
Had one back in the day and for a factory slicked up ride for "regular" public road driving I thought it was simply perfection and needed nothing. Rode in a friend M3 of the same era and I though that was overdone for the street.
The CTS-V is pretty good. I'd add a loud exhaust because I'm like that. However, as a Cadillac, the quiet exhaust would be acceptable. 🤷
My first gen Smart ED needed nothing.
For me, the "perfect" car is the one most people modify anyway: My ND2 Miata. I acknowledge you can make it faster, corner harder, and be "better", but for my use case it's damn near perfect stock. I get tempted to put an exhaust on it, but then I realize I am ruining the character of the car I love. So it stays stock. And it's better for it.
Pretty much.
I have an ND2 as well and I'd agree, evenough though I added a Goodwin Racing Superstreet exhaust. left stock it would have been perfectly fine, enjoyable, and wildly entertaining. But I like the subtle add of the Goodwin muffler.
I love my “perfect for me” ND2 Miata. Yet I have long felt tempted to add an exhaust to enhance the sports car the auditory experience. I’ve researched several exhaust options, but haven’t been able to decide which direction to go- Goodwin, Flying Miata, or… So for now it remains stock.
@@AdamSKarp I was in the same boat for a bit and there's no rush on this as far as I'm concerned. I think it's easier to mod the ND's to a point you don't like so I'm slow with any changes on it because it's so good out of the box, IMO. Fortunately, I'm in a local Miata Club and had a chance to listen to many different exhaust systems from other club members. Between that and doing some on-line research and snooping I settled on the Goodwin Superstreet. Couldn't be happier and I think their tuning is spot on. Basically it keep's the stock Miata character but just wakes it up a bit and it's such an addictive sound. Their Helmholtz chambers really do the trick with a sonorous sporty sound without any drone. I think Goodwin has some RUclips vids with their different exhausts to listen to.
@lupinsea thanks for sharing your perspective and experience. I do think it’s wise to take time deciding. I agree it would be helpful to be able to hear different exhaust setups “in the wild” besides in videos people have posted.
Fl5 civic type r. Perfect out of the box
I’d say tires are the first thing I want to change on nearly every factory new car.
All of my 80s and early 90s Mercedes are all perfect .
What about an early series 3 jaguar e-type with the V12 and before the big bumpers (so maybe 1972)? Series 1 is great except so first gear synchro and series 2 was still an i6
Apline A110 with no mods is great.
No matter what the engineers said and how good the dct is, it needs a manual imo.
And N/A
Manual transmission missing
@@ian-kz3mb that's what gordon murray wanted. Lol
I have had that thought before because I love modding cars, and cars that I "love" and yes there is an answer, in my case for a fun car that would be the '05 Ford GT, I wouldnt change a thing to that car, well.. maybe add Carplay and MAYBE, a cold air intake for more supercharger whine.
also, this question is really purpose dependent, If I bought something like a brand new RAV4 as a daily commuter/house car, I wouldnt mod a single thing to it.
Veloster N is very close to perfect for the expected experience. The only flaw is the 19 inch wheels on super low profile tires. The car loses 10+ lbs per wheel and gains performance and comfort by going to 18 inch wheels.
Without giving up my age, there are a lot of cars I've owned that weren't perfect. Austin America, for example.. or VW 23-window Deluxe Microbus. Cars I feel were correct without modifications for the time period? 1974 BMW 2002. 1978 VW Scirocco. 1985 Toyota Corolla GTS liftback. 1991 BMW 318is. 1991 E34 M5 Touring.
The most recent car that I've "experienced" that's just about perfect without modifications is the BMW1M or its lesser versions, the 135i and 128i. I drove a 1M, which is awesome, but my 135i MSport with manual 6-speed does nearly the same things without the expense. its 300hp and 300 lb-ft. of torque is a near match to the 1M and is great fun when the turbos spool up. I like the sports seats and Harman Kardon sound system. No navigation screen.
On the practical sideI especially like the fold down rear seat and pass-through. The flat floor makes a trip to IKEA an unheralded joy. if, on a road trip, your better half needs a nap, there's room to stretch out with resorting to the fetal position. There's an optional roof rack for your surfboard. The only thing I changed on mine is the tires -- from the run-flats to Michelin Pilot Sports. So there's no spare tire. I can'r remember when I last changed a tire on the side of the road.
My F90 BMW M5 Comp is great (dare I say - perfect) out of the box. First car I’ve had with no mods.
My 718 Boxster GTS is perfect out of the box, haven’t done anything to it.
My ND2 Miata RF Club has a full page of mods as it was not very good out of the box.
Have either of you ever driven a series 1 SL60 AMG r129? Do you think the enlarged engine and other mods are enhancements?
Would love to hear what was wrong with the gr86 throttle calibration
I’m not sure one exists. I heard the 964 rs a couple of times. But I have one, and I really think the exhaust is too quiet. Both me and a friend who have one ended up modifying the exhaust to wake it up a little.