Reading fast but not understanding the content is certainly a waste of time. However, read fast _and_ comprehend the content, measurable by being able to answer questions out of the text is a quality. For example LSAT test takers are being asked substantial questions from the text, question requiring comprehension, aggregation and analysis of the content.
Young people have no clue how well-read earlier generations were. As a boomer, I always felt so ignorant compared to my mom, my uncle, who would chat through dinner making references to things I was totally clueless as to what he was speaking about. My cousins assured me they were clueless as well, although I was in the same profession and had the same basic degrees. (He had an LLD., Doctor of Law, rarely awarded any longer but not where one would be expected to pick up literary references.) 8It reminds me of the way people in other countries will speak their language, the language of a neighboring country and perhaps English! Or the way adults when I was young could speak, or at least write Latin. I was taught Latin in elementary school, but discouraged in Junior high school, pushed toward "more useful" languages. Yet that small amount of Latin helped me more times to discern the meaning of words--other languages, law.... I remember when people --not even college grads, much less English lit majors, would know every Shakespeare play... My mom was a nurse--never even attended a liberal arts university, yet she could quote Shakespeare. I have heard "kids" in their 20s not know WHAT (not just where) the Atlantic Ocean is...they thought Canada was in Siberia on a map, and Africa was in China's place. That requires so much ignorance...of the equator, weather patterns, international relations, history...An English girl about 21 had to ask what a Nazi was--and yet nazis were responsible for a war that caused the deaths of 50 million Europeans way under 100 yrs ago! How could her parents or grandparents not have mentioned that to her? Or the bombs, rationing? If only out of respect for those who gave their lives? Now that I am over 60 (by a year but nonetheless.....), I am trying to keep my brain active. Word games, reading, memorizing geography, relearning American History that has escaped my brain. I cannot believe what I forgot! First, I noticed how I could not remember math--no kids I had to help with homework, so I forgot it all. Math doesn't matter to me much, but history, geography, and political relations are necessary to stay engaged. A Dementia-like condition could be the result of watching talk shows, reality shows...simply not using your brain. It would be so easy--so why couldn't it happen to a young person who never had that knowledge to start with? Because it's so simple to look anything up on the internet, it's seductive--why bother to remember if you can do a search and find it again?! If schools aren't inspiring kids to fill their heads with information, those brain cells will atrophy...and if your brain is empty at 40 or 45, by 60 or 70, you won't have a prayer of holding a conversation! I can see 2 60-year-old people 40 years into the future, holding their phones or tablets up to one another, hoping they'll converse, then share the discussion back with them.... If we don't learn the information available in books, it's only a matter of time before it will be too difficult to absorb what's in those books! Our minds are muscles--if we don't exercise them, they atrophy. Ask anyone who has been ill or had surgery. When you feel better and go out socially, you are tongue-tied, unable to engage in repartee. Just as you get out of practice absorbing what's in books. Or if you don't read maps--you aren't going to pick one up and be able to navigate. Use it or lose it.
Your evidence is completely anecdotal. What you said would imply that most adults were well versed in Latin in the sixties and seventies. But that only applies to your seemingly highly educated family. The problem with a lot of these arguments, regarding how literate young people are is that they usually aren't based on real literacy data. Many of them are based on anecdotal evidence, using obscure cultural references (Shakespeare, Tolstoy, etc.) as a proxy for literacy. It's a fundamentally conformist viewpoint. To turn Chomsky's own point back on him, would he understand modern literary references made by his students? Or is he treating the literature he was raised with as the only "proper" form of literature.
In modern day society universities expect students to learn twice and much in half the time and also expect them to actually understand the material. Are you kidding me? They expect students to be superhuman or something.
I believe that books like "War and Peace" should be read about once every ten years: there are always new sides of it to learn. When you are young you like the excitement, the characters, the romance, the battles, then you love Tolstoy's view of history and philosophy, then you go deeper in the character, their complexity, the spirit of Russia, the Decembrist uprising foreshadowed. The pleasure for me it's endless. The last time I read it it was on Kindle: it's easier for me because I can read without having to wear my reading glasses. Moreover I never in my life underlined a book, with Kindle I do and take notes. What I also love is to look up words, some that I don't know, but especially the ones I know the meaning of but it amuses me to read the definition and etymology. I also find it somehow much easier to go back to a page I have already read, and most of the times one can press and read directly a note, instead of looking at the end of the chapter or, more likely at the end of the book and loose the page he was reading. Therefore this is one of the times I disagree with Professor Chomsky. And Kindle is not illuminated like a PC so I can fall asleep like with a normal book. Of course one should have the great classics and his favourite books on paper. But I love that with kindle I have a huge library with me and nothing will go lost. I actually read more slowly and with greater attention and pleasure on kindle.
3:39. I have A.D.D and a learning disability, and I have always hated that I couldn't read fast. It has been something that has angered me since late middle school-early high school. It angered me to no end. I really do my best to try to read books even though it is very hard. And I think I really needed to hear, that there is no advantage to reading fast. Because that will make me a better reader.
There is nothing wrong with reading Kindle books , Physical books or Audio books. The main thing about reading (for learning) is to make it an active process by reading carefully, thoughtfully and taking notes in your own words.
True, but distraction is more likely with Kindle. I've disappeared down wormholes searching a word, which leads to a Wikipedia search. It definitely affects concentration.
mostly you are right, however there are studies indicating that the more physical approach of turning the pages by hand and feeling it lead to a deeper reading experience.
When i get electronic readings for my uni courses i never remember them as well as i do with hardcopy. i think its the physical act of holding and turning pages that helps to commit content to memory, like a form of sensory memory. Also, highlighting and typing notes doesn't work as well as underlining and writing in the margins, at least for me. Not sure if that can be extrapolated to whole populations but thats been my experience.
I think that will change in the future. Even though the evidence proves that people retain more by reading physical copies and writing physical notes, our continual digital evolution could condition future generations to recall things better through reading/writing digitally; this is just a thought. I also find myself retaining more digitally than reading/writing physically nowadays.
I have to partly disagree with Chomsky here. One of the greatest gifts I ever received was a first or second generation Kindle; this was when they were exclusively e-readers and not tablets as they are today. It was in 2008, I was 24 and recently out of college and had started to do some independent reading on topics o enjoyed. Back then it was mostly non-fiction with the occasional novel and for the most part it's the same today. That is something I pretty much never did as a kid, for a variety of reasons, but now that I didn't have a ton of academic reading I had more time. That Kindle was amazing for a couple reasons. 1) Books are MUCH more accessible on Kindle, a) for being easier to find in the catalogue and b) because they are much cheaper. Now if my library of local bookstore didn't have it I didn't have to simply "move on" or pay to have it sent to the store. Also, being digital they were a fraction of the price. For a person with student debts, that is important. 2) Kindle is, in many ways, easier to read. This may seem unimportant at first but it helped me read much more. I like to read before bed as a way to wind down. If you have a significant other you cannot use the bedside lamp. A backlit Kindle takes care of that and is much more effective than a book light. Because of that I greatly increased how much I read before bed and this had a big impact on the number of books I've been able to read. [Note: the earliest generation Kindles were not backlit but my first, a Christmas 2008 gift, was one of the first if not the first generation Kindle to have a built in back lighting] 3) the ease of carrying it made me read more. It's easier to carry a thin tablet than a book so I take it with me when I do something that requires a wait, like going to the dentist. Also, when going on vacation I don't have to choose only a book or two to take with me. So if I am bored of a choice I can now switch to 100s of downloaded books, that's also increased the amount I've read. I could go on and on (already am) but simply put Kindle has fundamentally altered my relationship with books in a great way. It's allowed me to read more not only in terms of volume but also in scope. I'm much more inclined to take a chance on a classic when it's 99¢ and always at my finger tips. As much as I love Chomsky I have to respectfully disagree about those Kindles. The newer "iPad" style Kindles on the other hand.....
That's a valid point, but it doesn't mean many people aren't getting that same information and value from other places. It just means this one source of value is not as prominent as it used to be (according to mostly anecdotal evidence.) We must be careful not to equate the values derived from a book with the book itself.
I have written emails to professor Chomsky and they tend to be short but I do this because I know how many emails he gets and I don't feel like my ramblings would be of much value to him, so I keep it short.
@@JohnSmith-cv5pjIn my experience, yes. But it's fairly understandable, and aside the main topic. He used to spend 4 hrs a day just emailing. Imagine.
I remember more from reading real books than PDF's. Theres something about feeling and turning the pages physically which makes the brain to store the information better. So, is taking notes by handwritting. Also my eyes itch from constant staring into the display.
Absolutely spot on! Was just thinking the same. Will post a more expanded comment, but that I, as someone who's actively learning English, can memorize more words read in physical books than on my MacBook (same goes for eReaders) is something I'm 100% sure about. Each book is different and reading a real book is more-dimensional than reading text on a Kindle-like device. But I guess it's not a debate for or against, it's a debate for some better balance.
Just googled "screen vs. paper: what is the difference for reading and learning?" - plenty of links to different studies. From one such "if you want to recall the dates of certain events, a computer screen may help you better remember them when studying. However, if you want to recall why such an event occurred or where, paper may be your best bet." Basically, paper is better for better acquisition of abstract concepts: why and where vs what and when for digital screen. www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-lazar/study-finds-difference-in_b_10210036.html
3:39 I am glad to hear one of the greatest minds of our time has expressed so many things that I have expressed. I makes the world a lot less lonelier.
Not only reflection and mulling over what is read in literature but discussion about it or the use of the literature in discussions of other topics helps gain a better understanding of it.
I feel Chomsky's view is rather outdated today, not because his argument has any flaws, but that our ebook technology has evolved so much since then that "difficulty of turning pages" has became insignificant, and ebook techs (not just kindle, but other reading apps on phones, pdf viewer/editors on laptops, etc) have advanced to a point of being truly competitive with traditional paperback books (eg. note taking features, bookmarks, page/word search, etc). As for other people's arguments about last generation quoting Shakespeare and so on, I find that to be placing excessive value to past books. Yes, Shakespeare and similar authors have explored many philosophical themes, but that is also the same for authors of today. For example, plays like Hamilton, Phantom of the Opera, The King and I, and so on; why are they ranked below Shakespeare? Furthermore, those books from the past often don't age well (eg. Taming of the Shrewd), and many philosophical questions of today are far beyond those of the past (eg. Matrix: take the blue pill or the red pill?), and our mediums to discuss those have also expanded far beyond books and plays (eg. comics, music videos, video games, cartoon/animations, multi-season tv dramas). Finally, do let me ask: could the boomers quote with confidence books that were published since 2000? How many different authors have they read of? I personally can list off around 60 different book authors whom published their works within the last decade, and I can tell you for sure some of their works are just as moving and thought provoking as works of Shakespeare.
Another advantage of e-books is that you can instantly bring up the dictionary for a word you do not understand. This is incredibly useful when reading someone like Charles Dickens who uses ornate language in his novels. Most modern readers are not just not going to understand all the Victorian era words he's throwing around.
@Yankie Doodle the kindle basically has 13 dictonaries and if a phrase or word is really archaic or exotic you have the option to connect to Wikipedia in an instant to obtain the definition.
Jo M Yeah but there’s an increasing amount of people who’ve been reading as homework and something no that has to be done. They don’t want to read anymore, they just want to say that they’ve read 150 books in a year. They’re not interested in what the books says, they’re interested in the idea of being well read. I’m not saying that being a fast reader is a bad thing, but a lot of people nowadays don’t like to read, rather they like the idea of being a reader.
A stark observation. Surf any house purchase or rental agency website and look at the photos of houses/apartments for sale or rent. One thing stands out. Hardly any of them contain a single book, or bookshelves. Now, either the people selling or renting out those homes either have a kindle and a large number of downloaded books, or they simply do not read. It is almost certainly the latter. It is a mistake to conflate owning a kindle or tablet with an automatic assumption that the quality of reading is inferior. But what is highly likely is that those who own no books also do not download reading material on tablets or other devices. But they do download a lot of games and other apps.
I skipped a lot of classes when I was in uni (too boring!), but when I had to study some material before the exams I would receive them in electronic format. I tried both studying from my computer and on paper after printing them. Major difference. Quite clearly it helps a lot more to study on paper. One of the vague explanation that I can give is that paper & writing enables the reader to better project themselves into the material, as if it were easier to objectify and give shape to the ideas in the mind by having an external & more tactile element to work with. If you write something down, it's your own hands; if you do it by the computer, there is one more mediation between the thought and the writing, which is the technological medium. This is the first argument. Another argument may simply be related to habits. Since I studied at school on paper, and very little on computers, perhaps the brain associates writing & reading with seriousness and attentiveness. On the other hand, computer has been from the very beginning related to games for me, for chatting, basically to entertainment. Therefore, when I read something online, it's as if all the history with the medium somehow plays a role in attitude (though unconscious it may be), making the reading less focused and involving lower attention span. My 2 cents.
Many things matter in reading and learning. Most of the time, if it's worth reading to learn, we need to read thoughtfully, taking time to consider, and almost in essence "dialoguing" with the material. Of course there are many things we will read quickly, it's more or less scanning, and much material deserves little more. But the good stuff, the rich stuff, the valuable stuff takes attention and time.
I've noticed, even in mainstream books, that many people do not know how to use the English language. When the errors become too many to ignore in a novel, I just stop, return it, and permanently delete it. I must say though, that kindle is great. All I need is my phone, rather than hundreds of book to stack up, and once a year cart down to the library to donate...
Reading text on a kindle is the same as reading emails on your computer screen Noam. Oh kindle is different to a book ( outstanding observation Noam) he says he pays more attention to a printed media as opposed to digital. Does he not pay attention to his computer screen?
i find kindle books to be better for taking less messy notes, and for highlighting, but i also find i feel sort of more 'fulfilled' or something when i read a paper book.
Kindles make it super convenient especially on a train or plane where you don't want to pull out a big thick book on a long commute. But I prefer physical books for reading at home.
Let's assume the following experiment: we disseminate a text to two groups. The first group is being told to pay attention, because there will be questions from the text, and the text will not be available later. The second group will not be told that the text will be unavailable during the examination. Both groups will be encouraged but not require to take notes, they will be allowed with cellphones and other distraction devices. Which group do you think will pay more attention to the content? The same applies for the electronically stored content. Knowing the fact it is available at any time anywhere makes us focus less or understanding and eventual memorization of what we read. A related concept: early in my career people were taking notes at the meetings. Somebody was the official note taker, but most of us took notes for future personal use. How many people are taking notes nowadays and how this impacts the dissemination of concepts discussed in the meeting?
Thanks to Kindle, I've gone from reading a book once every two years, to one a week. That two years was not deep reflection either. I guess I could always go back to PlayStation if Kindle is no good.
I think it depends on how the Kindle is used of it’s negative or not for retention and actual education, which I think is what he’s saying. What frame of mind are they in, are they focusing. It’s more a mindset issue then an issue of what the words are being transmitted by.
I've started reading a lot more books recently, physical books, I don't speed read, yet I still struggle to remember much more than bits and pieces, vague and general concepts.
I love books! I have continually tried to self educate and work my way through all the classics (especially since education is so expensive and almost barred off now) I can keep conversation well supposedly "well educated" people and yet I AM NOT! the screens just don't feel the same as holding a book and look at the crisp pages. It's just like blagh I hate looking at a screen reading and I hate the colors of them.
Not long after the atrocity in Afghanistan/Iraq began Noam was so hopeful because of the protests that appeared before the war even started, comparing that to the fact that it took years for the Vietnam protests to develop. I wonder how he feels now.
I definitely have sympathy for this viewpoint. One might think that the internet would help to harness the curiousity and creativity of people but instead it's just an endless stream of imagery and superficiality.
Talking generally about a book is probably misleading at the start. Some books are designed to be read rapidly, contains very little difficult diction, grammar or concepts that requires introspection. Like novels and things. There are some other books that are not, that are designed to be read, re-read and then considered, challenged and examined. Those books have no place on kindle.
What else did we loose in that was a really fun few days! Can't we just go on to the R.I.P Van and hand out books to those who want them? I read every single Encyclopedia Brown book. I loved that serial. It was like, no matter how difficult the case, he always won! Reading is important= RIP Schoolatic, Oh shhit, it is Reading is fundamental Edit:RIP to RIF! Damn that was a close one!
I don't see the link between ebooks and a person's success in learning thing. Ebooks have an advantage in that they allow you to make notes on important points; in many ways I see that as an advantage.
Kip Vaughan Equivalent to a notebook. I think he is making a different point he said there can be advantages but it all goes to how we use and the promote the use of that technology. Unfortunately it is overwhelmingly on the side of its damaging than on the side of it is helping but it doesn't have to be that way it's just the way it is now. Hopefully seeing these negative effects will allow us to temper our discipline and influence us to promote the use in better ways. For instance where is the forum for intellectual discussion or a forum for artists to discuss and collaborate. There are very few advances in that way compared to amount of game app's.
Yankie Doodle im pretty sure a kindle is designed in such a way that it is made to look as accurate and as close to an actual book as possible, also im not so sure what you mean your brain is trying to ‘decipher’ its the exact same fucking shit you stupid fuck
I am reminded of ancient greek philosophers like Socrates disliking books because "You're just taking someone else's idea, rather than think for yourself." Many of the arguments in this comments section come across as people disliking/not understanding new technology and mediums of information. People aren't getting dumber, on average schools demand more of their students, if you want to take that as any kind of measurement. Not to say people are getting smarter either, people are people, intelligence is relative to the subject. But society as a whole seems to be demanding more of younger generations. Part of the issue that for the majority of human history, the highly educated make up a very small percentage of the population. Yet with the advent of recent technology we can very easily see, the... less well educated? Of society, and we often end up focusing on these individuals because, well it's funny. It doesnt represent society as a whole. Just like I don't judge all people over 60 because of the many Karen meltdown videos online. As for reading less, its mostly anecdotal. I could say a lot of my peers actively read. But again, it's just anecdotal and you'd need to take my word for it. Tho while many students may not get literary references held in reverence in the past. Theres a whole host of more modern references that people would instantly get. But I imagine people might look down on such references as not being "intellectually stimulating" enough. Which I'd counter this straw man I've created as not properly understanding the new mediums technology has brought us. Either way thank you for listening/reading my ted talk, goodnight.
After watching this watch Chris Hedges' speech at the New School where he talks about Michael Jackson's funeral. Jump to the last question and answer at the end of the video which also covers the topic of reading on devices as opposed to books. But you should really just watch the whole video from beginning to end and the end, as I said, relates to the topic of this video.
Repetition seems to solve the problem for me, to stop following and start thinking or start to follow the same again for clarity. I think it is hard to follow a book, so to me pro's and cons to both.
We didn't loose, though I can tell you. I went to hell and back, physically and mentally. It was in the top five worst I've been through. 1) Myenmare/Burma subject would have killed me if I hadn't been through worse.
Hes right about stimulus hunger. Social media makes even intelligent and focused people jittery for successive hits of superifcial information and less tolerant of protracted and systematic knowledge gathering
It's a very ableist opinion. I am both physically and visually disabled and paper books (and PDFs) are not accessible for me. I can only read books on a lit e-ink screen with specially designed fonts called hyperlegible. Without modern ereaders (I currently own a Kobo) I wouldn't be able to read long texts at all.
if you look at as many aspects of the current culture as you can, you can only conclude the attention span is rapidly shrinking, it's almost as if everyone's somehow developing ADD
@@hihi2667 I'm a millennial. But I was a weird kid. I read a lot. Didn't play games/watch movies/do a lot of sports. Didn't have a smart phone till I was 19 I think. Since I've gotten one. Developed a RUclips habit. I've noticed a subtle change in my ability to just.. wait. Just in the past 6 years. It could be many other things. Life is a rocky road. But I can't help wondering what happened to that kid with the books. The kid that could hang out in a park for hours just trying to get the trees to look right in his drawings. My younger cousins seem to have an even worse attention span than I remember kids my age having. Again, maybe this is just a side effect of my age. But I can't help but compare my current aptitude to my past ability to remember subjects or my patience in my formative years.
It truly is horrible. TikTok, Snapchat, and RUclips are pretty much all they spend their free time on. Note-taking in class is at a minimum, cellphones always in hands in front of them, or a laptop on which they claim to be taking notes…psst…they are not. They are working on homework assignments in other classes, watching YT (typically game walk-throughs or just watching other people play…?!?!), or actually playing games. Yet, when they converse with you it’s “I feel like…”, “It feels like…”, “I feel it’s…”, and “I know it all…and more.” Frightening! Every gen exhibits some of these same traits, indeed. But these last two gens are out-of-balance, in all categories.
I like how my favourite public intellectual is catastrophically wrong and uneducated when it comes to specific modern devices and the research surrounding them. And the difference between a kindle and a backlit mobile phone running twitter.
You certainly can't reread sentences as easily or take your time as easily to mull over the meaning. Going back a few pages and rereading a paragraph is also much more difficult. I would think the learning is more superficial in most cases. Maybe for purely informational books like history books it wouldnt be much better but even then you cant as easily pauze for a second to integrate what youve just read and connect it to other knowledge you have.
@Yankie Doodle _"What's your fucking point?"_ My fucking point is that you don't _have_ a fucking point. Unless you seriously think study is only possible by reading?
"Stimulus hunger" not patient, independent, syntopical, reading of text will: a) strengthen democratic systems b) ... c) ... (All right, it's certainly not "a.")
He's talking about literacy, the ability to read. It's well known that people have trouble focusing on long texts now. Most people don't even read articles any more. Too long. They skim the headline and write comments about how outraged they are about the article... which they never read.
Holy fuck I finally found something I disagree upon with Chomsky I think there are sure some disadvantages to it but generally its a blessing and we should embrase not "Combat" it but thats probobly on because im 18 and hes 89
I don't know what he's talking about... I love being able to take around a whole bookcase of books with me wherever I go and being able to look up the definition of a new word, make bookmarks or notes and see other's bookmarks. I've found that reading on a kindle is not a whole lot different than it is with a regular book, the screen doesn't tire your eyes and it resembles paper (I always turn off the backlight), it just has all those added bonuses I mentioned. I still buy physical books for the ones I really like though. EDIT: I also don't get this "forced to read fast on a kindle" thing he talks about, I have never experienced that..
Chomsky in a nutshell. Everything sucks, you are all slaves, my wisdom will save us. He's made a lot of money with it. He is like a tv evangelist who specializes in liberal arts majors.
I think this explains it. His view towards kindles didn't make logical sense. The medium words are written on doesn't determine reading pace. But it all makes sense if he was confusing kindle with audiobooks.
In my day, you were required to have memorized Euclid, and have twelve years of Latin and as many in Greek - much less French, German, and Biblical Hebrew - before you even qualified for entry into Kindergarten...
Kindle is much more efficient and accessible. It is much easier to take notes, search for specific references, find certain publications. It is so much easier to go back and read over something again on kindle. I rarely say this but Chomsky is completely wrong here. Personally, I read a publication on kindle and if I find it useful I purchase the hard copy anyway. Kindle is just a more efficient way.
I dunno. I personally agree with him. Having a book that you mark up, with a physical implement like a highlighter, I retain for more information than I do simply grazing over it with a finger tip. This is anecdotal, yeah. But I see his point. There's a certain gravitas to reading a.. analogue? book that you don't get from an electronic one. Let alone audiobooks. Both of electronic books and audiobooks are huge in my life however. They have many unique benefits. But I find myself struggling to truly retain information I've learned from those mediums. I increasingly find myself returning to libraries and book stores to reread things or to brush up the gaps in my memory. Could be I'm just getting old though.
@@thatdudeoverthere2188 I think the "analog book" thing is simlply out of custom. We don't give the same importance to e-books simply because they haven't been in our cultures for thousands of years like fisical books have. But it's just matter of time. I guess it'll be harder if an individual is already old and accustomed to the idea of "real books" containing "real information" being fisical books, and e-books being the "new things" you don't thing of them as simply "books". Btw highlighting doesn't make you retain in memory, more specifically it helps recognition, but not recall. I desagree with Chomsky, and it's hard to agree with him 'cause he doesn't give any reasons or evidence for what he's saying, I guess it's his personal experience.
It doesn't matter how fast you read, which contradicts what a lot of "influencers", "digital educators" and "market gurus" would have one believe. Read 10 books in one month! Hahaha, get a life. Understand deeply the first book you read first of all.
@@DesertsofHibernia Different individuals have different biases and inclinations based on the kind of lives they live, hence an individual's tendencies with regards to the usage of a medium is always different from that of another individual, and the difference, as I already mentioned, comes from the kind of lives the individuals live. The tendencies that you mentioned in your comment are found in the majority population because electronic books are new. The difference lies not in the medium, the difference lies in the receiver.
@@DesertsofHibernia I will point out to you how your argument is inconsistent. First you argued that the point of difference between the two media lies in the difference between a reader's "tendencies" while using these media. Then I pointed out that such tendencies are not caused by the medium but by the reader's own biases and inclinations. Then you argued that the difference lies in the fundamental manner in which the words are presented to a reader by the two media. Then I presented an analogy to counter that point. Now you are again back to your first argument about the nature of "tendencies" of the reader. I have countered both your arguments, if you have a reply to further illuminate this meaningful discussion that we have had then I'm willing to read it.
@@DesertsofHibernia "And the point has always been that people are influenced by the manner in which information is presented to them." This is the exact same point that I am making. There are two communication systems, each consisting of a medium and a receiver. The medium, I proposed, performs the same function, but it's the receiver that changes due to its environment, according to its own inclinations and biases. Therefore an adjustment is required in the receiver, not in the medium, so that the two communication systems perform similarly.
@@DesertsofHibernia If you observe one medium to be a more accelerated version of the other, then my observation is very different from yours. We can argue about the interpretation of an observation, we can't argue when the observation itself is different.
That's not what he was talking about. He was referring to e-readers where you can't highlight sections, take notes, underlines things to come back to, write in the margins, etc. E-readers have progressed far in that regard
None of your comments are valid. You can highlight and take paper and pen notes referenced to pdf loc on the old kindles. Even taking notes in the newer versions of kindle is a slow painstaking process b/c the keypad still has a lag and your notes get deleted periodically.
Darrin Kornelsen Kindle is not the only e-reader on the market. Everything I said was true, especially regarding older versions of e-readers. They have come a long way, especially with search allowing you to easily reference pages and notes in large books. The convenience factor is not even a discussion. I seldom read "real" books anymore, only when I can't get PDF/mobi versions of them. Regardless, e-readers are the now and the future.
Actually the great old books are in the public domain, you can find them and read them digitally for free! I would recommend you check out oodles books, you can download classic texts and audiobooks on there
@@37Dionysos The mobile app has all sorts of books from the ancient Greek texts to 19th century literature. If Homer, Dante, Shakespeare, Dostayevsky, Dickens etc are "oodles of shit" then I don't know what to tell you. I was trying to have polite discourse and let you know that my generation has access to so much wonderful knowledge which is often overlooked. Ebooks and audiobooks allow people to access so much for free. I for one think that's wonderful, especially for people who can't afford to buy tomes of overpriced books
Two ways of reading books are 1 letrare =spend my timing or keep in library. 2 analysis. Mean I learned a lot from what I read. And yes there all most younger people does not read. Even older. For learning. Tech support them to be fast food productions.
I don't agree with him on this one. I agree people may read less but there is plenty of evidence to show the same effect on the brain from a hard copy, kindle to audio. Sounds like an old guy not understanding what's going on with tech. My son reads hard copies and he read 40 books this year already at 10 years old. People are much more intelligent than their grandparents because the access to knowledge is a few typed letters away no looking through the World book for hours anymore.
People like me born in the early 1980s well not agree with him. But I totally agee with him my generation is wholly illeate. I read more then the majority of people I know. I use print always.
I even notice a certain disdain for reading in people sometimes. It probably has to do with new forms of media promoting the fragmentation of attention to the point where sitting down for an hour to read seems impossible. There's this anxiety or restlessness i notice in myself sometimes to sit down for prolonged periods of time. Potential is collapsed and you'll be sitting down for a while, the future is setfor a while. Then again in other ways potential in new patterns and content of thought opens up. Its the same reason maybe that some of my friends often prefer to watch tvshows over movies because the movie locks you in. There's something unpleasant about collapsing potential. People like the idea of having options open what to do with their time. Yet the only way to achieve anything is to collapse potential again and again. We must do everything linearly.
love ya Noam, but you're geezing here. This was a wasted 4 minutes - trying to generalize new technology or whole generations with a broad-brush is an age-old game and it has typically been a waste of words. The printing press was demonized for replacing the oral traditions
7788Sambaboy exactly. i see issue with the fact that modern electronic information is tracked by corporations, whereas a print book may be purchased for untraceble cash... but to hear someone of noam’s prestige comment that information from an ebook somehow is less likely to permeate the reader compared to a printed book containing the same text is the most ok boomer moment of my week.
Chomsky is a clever guy, but the about it's too fast to read the kindle, is far out. It's kind of conservative and snobish. kindle is digital ink, it's even better than a book, because you can increase the size of letters, do remarks, go back and forth as easy as any book. it's an ignorant statement
There is some good research suggesting kindle does not stimulate the same parts of the brain as reading print. Why is up for debate, but don't rush to say something is impossible/ignorant before checking out some of the studies.
Repetition seems to solve the problem for me, to stop following and start thinking or start to follow the same again for clarity. I think it is hard to follow a book, so to me pro's and cons to both.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
3:39 "It does not matter how fast you read, there's no advantage in reading it fast"
Yes, this is so true. One could argue that trying to read it fast can actually hurt comprehension.
Well I take ages to read but have visualize everything
@@radcow I think that you are taking in more of the information when you picture it.
Woody Allen on speed reading . . . "Yeah, I've read War and Peace . . . . .It's about Russia."
Reading fast but not understanding the content is certainly a waste of time. However, read fast _and_ comprehend the content, measurable by being able to answer questions out of the text is a quality. For example LSAT test takers are being asked substantial questions from the text, question requiring comprehension, aggregation and analysis of the content.
Young people have no clue how well-read earlier generations were. As a boomer, I always felt so ignorant compared to my mom, my uncle, who would chat through dinner making references to things I was totally clueless as to what he was speaking about. My cousins assured me they were clueless as well, although I was in the same profession and had the same basic degrees. (He had an LLD., Doctor of Law, rarely awarded any longer but not where one would be expected to pick up literary references.) 8It reminds me of the way people in other countries will speak their language, the language of a neighboring country and perhaps English! Or the way adults when I was young could speak, or at least write Latin. I was taught Latin in elementary school, but discouraged in Junior high school, pushed toward "more useful" languages. Yet that small amount of Latin helped me more times to discern the meaning of words--other languages, law....
I remember when people --not even college grads, much less English lit majors, would know every Shakespeare play... My mom was a nurse--never even attended a liberal arts university, yet she could quote Shakespeare. I have heard "kids" in their 20s not know WHAT (not just where) the Atlantic Ocean is...they thought Canada was in Siberia on a map, and Africa was in China's place. That requires so much ignorance...of the equator, weather patterns, international relations, history...An English girl about 21 had to ask what a Nazi was--and yet nazis were responsible for a war that caused the deaths of 50 million Europeans way under 100 yrs ago! How could her parents or grandparents not have mentioned that to her? Or the bombs, rationing? If only out of respect for those who gave their lives?
Now that I am over 60 (by a year but nonetheless.....), I am trying to keep my brain active. Word games, reading, memorizing geography, relearning American History that has escaped my brain. I cannot believe what I forgot! First, I noticed how I could not remember math--no kids I had to help with homework, so I forgot it all. Math doesn't matter to me much, but history, geography, and political relations are necessary to stay engaged. A Dementia-like condition could be the result of watching talk shows, reality shows...simply not using your brain. It would be so easy--so why couldn't it happen to a young person who never had that knowledge to start with? Because it's so simple to look anything up on the internet, it's seductive--why bother to remember if you can do a search and find it again?! If schools aren't inspiring kids to fill their heads with information, those brain cells will atrophy...and if your brain is empty at 40 or 45, by 60 or 70, you won't have a prayer of holding a conversation! I can see 2 60-year-old people 40 years into the future, holding their phones or tablets up to one another, hoping they'll converse, then share the discussion back with them.... If we don't learn the information available in books, it's only a matter of time before it will be too difficult to absorb what's in those books! Our minds are muscles--if we don't exercise them, they atrophy. Ask anyone who has been ill or had surgery. When you feel better and go out socially, you are tongue-tied, unable to engage in repartee. Just as you get out of practice absorbing what's in books. Or if you don't read maps--you aren't going to pick one up and be able to navigate. Use it or lose it.
excellent post thank you.
Your evidence is completely anecdotal. What you said would imply that most adults were well versed in Latin in the sixties and seventies. But that only applies to your seemingly highly educated family. The problem with a lot of these arguments, regarding how literate young people are is that they usually aren't based on real literacy data. Many of them are based on anecdotal evidence, using obscure cultural references (Shakespeare, Tolstoy, etc.) as a proxy for literacy. It's a fundamentally conformist viewpoint. To turn Chomsky's own point back on him, would he understand modern literary references made by his students? Or is he treating the literature he was raised with as the only "proper" form of literature.
Tl;DR
I did not read your entire post. It is too long.
In modern day society universities expect students to learn twice and much in half the time and also expect them to actually understand the material. Are you kidding me? They expect students to be superhuman or something.
I believe that books like "War and Peace" should be read about once every ten years: there are always new sides of it to learn. When you are young you like the excitement, the characters, the romance, the battles, then you love Tolstoy's view of history and philosophy, then you go deeper in the character, their complexity, the spirit of Russia, the Decembrist uprising foreshadowed. The pleasure for me it's endless.
The last time I read it it was on Kindle: it's easier for me because I can read without having to wear my reading glasses.
Moreover I never in my life underlined a book, with Kindle I do and take notes.
What I also love is to look up words, some that I don't know, but especially the ones I know the meaning of but it amuses me to read the definition and etymology.
I also find it somehow much easier to go back to a page I have already read, and most of the times one can press and read directly a note, instead of looking at the end of the chapter or, more likely at the end of the book and loose the page he was reading.
Therefore this is one of the times I disagree with Professor Chomsky.
And Kindle is not illuminated like a PC so I can fall asleep like with a normal book.
Of course one should have the great classics and his favourite books on paper.
But I love that with kindle I have a huge library with me and nothing will go lost.
I actually read more slowly and with greater attention and pleasure on kindle.
3:39. I have A.D.D and a learning disability, and I have always hated that I couldn't read fast. It has been something that has angered me since late middle school-early high school. It angered me to no end. I really do my best to try to read books even though it is very hard. And I think I really needed to hear, that there is no advantage to reading fast. Because that will make me a better reader.
There is nothing wrong with reading Kindle books , Physical books or Audio books. The main thing about reading (for learning) is to make it an active process by reading carefully, thoughtfully and taking notes in your own words.
True, but distraction is more likely with Kindle. I've disappeared down wormholes searching a word, which leads to a Wikipedia search. It definitely affects concentration.
mostly you are right, however there are studies indicating that the more physical approach of turning the pages by hand and feeling it lead to a deeper reading experience.
what was he saying? i got lot 5 seconds in
Only if we were more potent beings.
When i get electronic readings for my uni courses i never remember them as well as i do with hardcopy. i think its the physical act of holding and turning pages that helps to commit content to memory, like a form of sensory memory. Also, highlighting and typing notes doesn't work as well as underlining and writing in the margins, at least for me. Not sure if that can be extrapolated to whole populations but thats been my experience.
Lol, it's all in your brain, you think you'll learn slow, you will.
I think that will change in the future. Even though the evidence proves that people retain more by reading physical copies and writing physical notes, our continual digital evolution could condition future generations to recall things better through reading/writing digitally; this is just a thought. I also find myself retaining more digitally than reading/writing physically nowadays.
The kindle is a fantastic device done so much excellent reading on it
I have to partly disagree with Chomsky here. One of the greatest gifts I ever received was a first or second generation Kindle; this was when they were exclusively e-readers and not tablets as they are today. It was in 2008, I was 24 and recently out of college and had started to do some independent reading on topics o enjoyed. Back then it was mostly non-fiction with the occasional novel and for the most part it's the same today. That is something I pretty much never did as a kid, for a variety of reasons, but now that I didn't have a ton of academic reading I had more time. That Kindle was amazing for a couple reasons.
1) Books are MUCH more accessible on Kindle, a) for being easier to find in the catalogue and b) because they are much cheaper. Now if my library of local bookstore didn't have it I didn't have to simply "move on" or pay to have it sent to the store. Also, being digital they were a fraction of the price. For a person with student debts, that is important.
2) Kindle is, in many ways, easier to read. This may seem unimportant at first but it helped me read much more. I like to read before bed as a way to wind down. If you have a significant other you cannot use the bedside lamp. A backlit Kindle takes care of that and is much more effective than a book light. Because of that I greatly increased how much I read before bed and this had a big impact on the number of books I've been able to read. [Note: the earliest generation Kindles were not backlit but my first, a Christmas 2008 gift, was one of the first if not the first generation Kindle to have a built in back lighting]
3) the ease of carrying it made me read more. It's easier to carry a thin tablet than a book so I take it with me when I do something that requires a wait, like going to the dentist. Also, when going on vacation I don't have to choose only a book or two to take with me. So if I am bored of a choice I can now switch to 100s of downloaded books, that's also increased the amount I've read.
I could go on and on (already am) but simply put Kindle has fundamentally altered my relationship with books in a great way. It's allowed me to read more not only in terms of volume but also in scope. I'm much more inclined to take a chance on a classic when it's 99¢ and always at my finger tips.
As much as I love Chomsky I have to respectfully disagree about those Kindles. The newer "iPad" style Kindles on the other hand.....
3:29 to the end. --- So many people need to hear this.
It hurts my soul that prominent people aren't finding value in War and Peace. That "novel" explores so much about the human experience.
That book is a life changer. like giving HD quality to their world view
That's a valid point, but it doesn't mean many people aren't getting that same information and value from other places. It just means this one source of value is not as prominent as it used to be (according to mostly anecdotal evidence.) We must be careful not to equate the values derived from a book with the book itself.
I read it every 10 years and it's always different and more exciting. It has a different meaning for every stage of your life.
@Yankie Doodle After page 100 you'll get addicted like to your favourite TV series. Read it on Kindle: you'll be less scare by the size :)
They’re finding value in other places.
I have written emails to professor Chomsky and they tend to be short but I do this because I know how many emails he gets and I don't feel like my ramblings would be of much value to him, so I keep it short.
Was answer short too?
@@JohnSmith-cv5pjIn my experience, yes. But it's fairly understandable, and aside the main topic. He used to spend 4 hrs a day just emailing. Imagine.
I remember more from reading real books than PDF's. Theres something about feeling and turning the pages physically which makes the brain to store the information better. So, is taking notes by handwritting. Also my eyes itch from constant staring into the display.
Absolutely spot on! Was just thinking the same. Will post a more expanded comment, but that I, as someone who's actively learning English, can memorize more words read in physical books than on my MacBook (same goes for eReaders) is something I'm 100% sure about. Each book is different and reading a real book is more-dimensional than reading text on a Kindle-like device.
But I guess it's not a debate for or against, it's a debate for some better balance.
Just googled "screen vs. paper: what is the difference for reading and learning?" - plenty of links to different studies. From one such "if you want to recall the dates of certain events, a computer screen may help you better remember them when studying. However, if you want to recall why such an event occurred or where, paper may be your best bet." Basically, paper is better for better acquisition of abstract concepts: why and where vs what and when for digital screen.
www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-lazar/study-finds-difference-in_b_10210036.html
xeraph02 well said
@@armanmkhitaryan27 Your english is very good from what I read. Keep up the work! :)
3:39
I am glad to hear one of the greatest minds of our time has expressed so many things that I have expressed. I makes the world a lot less lonelier.
Not only reflection and mulling over what is read in literature but discussion about it or the use of the literature in discussions of other topics helps gain a better understanding of it.
A lot of it has to do with instant gratification. Our instincts have brought us to this point.
I feel Chomsky's view is rather outdated today, not because his argument has any flaws, but that our ebook technology has evolved so much since then that "difficulty of turning pages" has became insignificant, and ebook techs (not just kindle, but other reading apps on phones, pdf viewer/editors on laptops, etc) have advanced to a point of being truly competitive with traditional paperback books (eg. note taking features, bookmarks, page/word search, etc).
As for other people's arguments about last generation quoting Shakespeare and so on, I find that to be placing excessive value to past books. Yes, Shakespeare and similar authors have explored many philosophical themes, but that is also the same for authors of today. For example, plays like Hamilton, Phantom of the Opera, The King and I, and so on; why are they ranked below Shakespeare? Furthermore, those books from the past often don't age well (eg. Taming of the Shrewd), and many philosophical questions of today are far beyond those of the past (eg. Matrix: take the blue pill or the red pill?), and our mediums to discuss those have also expanded far beyond books and plays (eg. comics, music videos, video games, cartoon/animations, multi-season tv dramas).
Finally, do let me ask: could the boomers quote with confidence books that were published since 2000? How many different authors have they read of? I personally can list off around 60 different book authors whom published their works within the last decade, and I can tell you for sure some of their works are just as moving and thought provoking as works of Shakespeare.
If only we all could of had a grandfather like Noam🏅
could've.
But you can be a grandfather like Noam
@@griveouswithhislightsabers3665 exactly mate
Eloquent and accurate.
Another advantage of e-books is that you can instantly bring up the dictionary for a word you do not understand. This is incredibly useful when reading someone like Charles Dickens who uses ornate language in his novels. Most modern readers are not just not going to understand all the Victorian era words he's throwing around.
@Yankie Doodle lol you will tho
@Yankie Doodle the kindle basically has 13 dictonaries and if a phrase or word is really archaic or exotic you have the option to connect to Wikipedia in an instant to obtain the definition.
That’s not the issue though, the problem is that nobody sits down to read and think about what they’ve just read anymore. Same thing with movies.
@@sanitorz232 ... what are you talking about? People read because they want to read..
Jo M Yeah but there’s an increasing amount of people who’ve been reading as homework and something no that has to be done. They don’t want to read anymore, they just want to say that they’ve read 150 books in a year. They’re not interested in what the books says, they’re interested in the idea of being well read. I’m not saying that being a fast reader is a bad thing, but a lot of people nowadays don’t like to read, rather they like the idea of being a reader.
A stark observation. Surf any house purchase or rental agency website and look at the photos of houses/apartments for sale or rent. One thing stands out. Hardly any of them contain a single book, or bookshelves. Now, either the people selling or renting out those homes either have a kindle and a large number of downloaded books, or they simply do not read. It is almost certainly the latter. It is a mistake to conflate owning a kindle or tablet with an automatic assumption that the quality of reading is inferior. But what is highly likely is that those who own no books also do not download reading material on tablets or other devices. But they do download a lot of games and other apps.
I skipped a lot of classes when I was in uni (too boring!), but when I had to study some material before the exams I would receive them in electronic format. I tried both studying from my computer and on paper after printing them. Major difference. Quite clearly it helps a lot more to study on paper. One of the vague explanation that I can give is that paper & writing enables the reader to better project themselves into the material, as if it were easier to objectify and give shape to the ideas in the mind by having an external & more tactile element to work with. If you write something down, it's your own hands; if you do it by the computer, there is one more mediation between the thought and the writing, which is the technological medium. This is the first argument. Another argument may simply be related to habits. Since I studied at school on paper, and very little on computers, perhaps the brain associates writing & reading with seriousness and attentiveness. On the other hand, computer has been from the very beginning related to games for me, for chatting, basically to entertainment. Therefore, when I read something online, it's as if all the history with the medium somehow plays a role in attitude (though unconscious it may be), making the reading less focused and involving lower attention span. My 2 cents.
Many things matter in reading and learning. Most of the time, if it's worth reading to learn, we need to read thoughtfully, taking time to consider, and almost in essence "dialoguing" with the material. Of course there are many things we will read quickly, it's more or less scanning, and much material deserves little more. But the good stuff, the rich stuff, the valuable stuff takes attention and time.
I've noticed, even in mainstream books, that many people do not know how to use the English language.
When the errors become too many to ignore in a novel, I just stop, return it, and permanently delete it.
I must say though, that kindle is great. All I need is my phone, rather than hundreds of book to stack up, and once a year cart down to the library to donate...
“...one of the gurus of the new technology...I forget his name.”
He must have read it on a Kindle, then. 😉
Reading text on a kindle is the same as reading emails on your computer screen Noam. Oh kindle is different to a book ( outstanding observation Noam) he says he pays more attention to a printed media as opposed to digital. Does he not pay attention to his computer screen?
i find kindle books to be better for taking less messy notes, and for highlighting, but i also find i feel sort of more 'fulfilled' or something when i read a paper book.
Kindles make it super convenient especially on a train or plane where you don't want to pull out a big thick book on a long commute. But I prefer physical books for reading at home.
One advantage of Kindle is being able to locate a passage quickly.
Lol 😂
Let's assume the following experiment: we disseminate a text to two groups. The first group is being told to pay attention, because there will be questions from the text, and the text will not be available later. The second group will not be told that the text will be unavailable during the examination. Both groups will be encouraged but not require to take notes, they will be allowed with cellphones and other distraction devices. Which group do you think will pay more attention to the content?
The same applies for the electronically stored content. Knowing the fact it is available at any time anywhere makes us focus less or understanding and eventual memorization of what we read.
A related concept: early in my career people were taking notes at the meetings. Somebody was the official note taker, but most of us took notes for future personal use. How many people are taking notes nowadays and how this impacts the dissemination of concepts discussed in the meeting?
Thanks to Kindle, I've gone from reading a book once every two years, to one a week.
That two years was not deep reflection either.
I guess I could always go back to PlayStation if Kindle is no good.
@Yankie Doodle gatekeeping.
I think it depends on how the Kindle is used of it’s negative or not for retention and actual education, which I think is what he’s saying. What frame of mind are they in, are they focusing. It’s more a mindset issue then an issue of what the words are being transmitted by.
I've started reading a lot more books recently, physical books, I don't speed read, yet I still struggle to remember much more than bits and pieces, vague and general concepts.
I love books! I have continually tried to self educate and work my way through all the classics (especially since education is so expensive and almost barred off now) I can keep conversation well supposedly "well educated" people and yet I AM NOT!
the screens just don't feel the same as holding a book and look at the crisp pages. It's just like blagh I hate looking at a screen reading and I hate the colors of them.
Not long after the atrocity in Afghanistan/Iraq began Noam was so hopeful because of the protests that appeared before the war even started, comparing that to the fact that it took years for the Vietnam protests to develop.
I wonder how he feels now.
Manual hypertext linking unavailable on kindle - I.e. Flicking back to a page
I definitely have sympathy for this viewpoint. One might think that the internet would help to harness the curiousity and creativity of people but instead it's just an endless stream of imagery and superficiality.
Talking generally about a book is probably misleading at the start.
Some books are designed to be read rapidly, contains very little difficult diction, grammar or concepts that requires introspection. Like novels and things.
There are some other books that are not, that are designed to be read, re-read and then considered, challenged and examined. Those books have no place on kindle.
Someone please explain to Noam how to turn pages backwards on kindle. It's sad to hear that someone of his intellect struggles with changes in form
What else did we loose in that was a really fun few days! Can't we just go on to the R.I.P Van and hand out books to those who want them? I read every single Encyclopedia Brown book. I loved that serial. It was like, no matter how difficult the case, he always won!
Reading is important=
RIP
Schoolatic, Oh shhit, it is Reading is fundamental
Edit:RIP to RIF! Damn that was a close one!
I don't see the link between ebooks and a person's success in learning thing. Ebooks have an advantage in that they allow you to make notes on important points; in many ways I see that as an advantage.
Kip Vaughan Equivalent to a notebook. I think he is making a different point he said there can be advantages but it all goes to how we use and the promote the use of that technology. Unfortunately it is overwhelmingly on the side of its damaging than on the side of it is helping but it doesn't have to be that way it's just the way it is now. Hopefully seeing these negative effects will allow us to temper our discipline and influence us to promote the use in better ways. For instance where is the forum for intellectual discussion or a forum for artists to discuss and collaborate. There are very few advances in that way compared to amount of game app's.
Yankie Doodle im pretty sure a kindle is designed in such a way that it is made to look as accurate and as close to an actual book as possible, also im not so sure what you mean your brain is trying to ‘decipher’ its the exact same fucking shit you stupid fuck
I am reminded of ancient greek philosophers like Socrates disliking books because "You're just taking someone else's idea, rather than think for yourself."
Many of the arguments in this comments section come across as people disliking/not understanding new technology and mediums of information.
People aren't getting dumber, on average schools demand more of their students, if you want to take that as any kind of measurement.
Not to say people are getting smarter either, people are people, intelligence is relative to the subject. But society as a whole seems to be demanding more of younger generations.
Part of the issue that for the majority of human history, the highly educated make up a very small percentage of the population.
Yet with the advent of recent technology we can very easily see, the... less well educated? Of society, and we often end up focusing on these individuals because, well it's funny.
It doesnt represent society as a whole. Just like I don't judge all people over 60 because of the many Karen meltdown videos online.
As for reading less, its mostly anecdotal. I could say a lot of my peers actively read. But again, it's just anecdotal and you'd need to take my word for it.
Tho while many students may not get literary references held in reverence in the past. Theres a whole host of more modern references that people would instantly get.
But I imagine people might look down on such references as not being "intellectually stimulating" enough. Which I'd counter this straw man I've created as not properly understanding the new mediums technology has brought us.
Either way thank you for listening/reading my ted talk, goodnight.
After watching this watch Chris Hedges' speech at the New School where he talks about Michael Jackson's funeral. Jump to the last question and answer at the end of the video which also covers the topic of reading on devices as opposed to books. But you should really just watch the whole video from beginning to end and the end, as I said, relates to the topic of this video.
I try to get physical books when I can, but sometimes all I can get my hands on is PDFs
Print it out.
Repetition seems to solve the problem for me, to stop following and start thinking or start to follow the same again for clarity. I think it is hard to follow a book, so to me pro's and cons to both.
We didn't loose, though I can tell you. I went to hell and back, physically and mentally. It was in the top five worst I've been through.
1) Myenmare/Burma subject would have killed me if I hadn't been through worse.
Hes right about stimulus hunger. Social media makes even intelligent and focused people jittery for successive hits of superifcial information and less tolerant of protracted and systematic knowledge gathering
misslead title
i had to watch the whole thing for 3:03
Context is good.
It's a very ableist opinion. I am both physically and visually disabled and paper books (and PDFs) are not accessible for me. I can only read books on a lit e-ink screen with specially designed fonts called hyperlegible.
Without modern ereaders (I currently own a Kobo) I wouldn't be able to read long texts at all.
Chomsky on technology and reading.
Gr8 rspnse by Chomp, so tru...
what was he saying? i got lot 5 seconds in
Well first of all i think we gotte be clear about the facts
A library is better than a kindle. You can sleep in a library. The lighting is more impressive. You can sit at a table.
Better title would be "Chomsky on Millennials and Attention Span"
if you look at as many aspects of the current culture as you can, you can only conclude the attention span is rapidly shrinking, it's almost as if everyone's somehow developing ADD
@@hihi2667 I'm a millennial. But I was a weird kid. I read a lot. Didn't play games/watch movies/do a lot of sports. Didn't have a smart phone till I was 19 I think.
Since I've gotten one. Developed a RUclips habit. I've noticed a subtle change in my ability to just.. wait. Just in the past 6 years.
It could be many other things. Life is a rocky road. But I can't help wondering what happened to that kid with the books. The kid that could hang out in a park for hours just trying to get the trees to look right in his drawings.
My younger cousins seem to have an even worse attention span than I remember kids my age having.
Again, maybe this is just a side effect of my age. But I can't help but compare my current aptitude to my past ability to remember subjects or my patience in my formative years.
It truly is horrible. TikTok, Snapchat, and RUclips are pretty much all they spend their free time on. Note-taking in class is at a minimum, cellphones always in hands in front of them, or a laptop on which they claim to be taking notes…psst…they are not. They are working on homework assignments in other classes, watching YT (typically game walk-throughs or just watching other people play…?!?!), or actually playing games. Yet, when they converse with you it’s “I feel like…”, “It feels like…”, “I feel it’s…”, and “I know it all…and more.” Frightening! Every gen exhibits some of these same traits, indeed. But these last two gens are out-of-balance, in all categories.
I like how my favourite public intellectual is catastrophically wrong and uneducated when it comes to specific modern devices and the research surrounding them. And the difference between a kindle and a backlit mobile phone running twitter.
read thoughtfully & carefully, full stop
Yankie feels pressured to read fast in Kindle, but me and Darrin don't. In Kindle, I can reread anything you decide as many times as you want
Where is this from? Thanks for uploading.
I wonder what he thinks of audiobooks. I certainly "read" a lot more than I would if they didn't exist.
It's learning.
You certainly can't reread sentences as easily or take your time as easily to mull over the meaning. Going back a few pages and rereading a paragraph is also much more difficult. I would think the learning is more superficial in most cases. Maybe for purely informational books like history books it wouldnt be much better but even then you cant as easily pauze for a second to integrate what youve just read and connect it to other knowledge you have.
@Yankie Doodle _"Listening isn't reading."_
...and tomatoes aren't pencils. Scroll down for equally profound insights.
@Yankie Doodle _"What's your fucking point?"_
My fucking point is that you don't _have_ a fucking point.
Unless you seriously think study is only possible by reading?
"Stimulus hunger" not patient, independent, syntopical, reading of text will: a) strengthen democratic systems b) ... c) ...
(All right, it's certainly not "a.")
my man
To read fast. To think hastily. Different.
It's people summarizing everything because they haven't been educated and have a ton of info they can't consolidate. So they just give a vague gist
Please, Father , I am the fool and low profile, only I like to read and try the best for everyone as my thoughts 🙏🏼.
Seems like Noam is conflating literacy with the joy of reading in certain areas.
Yes! Definitely agree
He's talking about literacy, the ability to read. It's well known that people have trouble focusing on long texts now. Most people don't even read articles any more. Too long. They skim the headline and write comments about how outraged they are about the article... which they never read.
I am reading steven Pinker on kindle. He makes me think really deeply about just how violent our time is.
I would send him brief emails so as not to waste his time.
Holy fuck I finally found something I disagree upon with Chomsky I think there are sure some disadvantages to it but generally its a blessing and we should embrase not "Combat" it but thats probobly on because im 18 and hes 89
I prefer paper
I don't know what he's talking about... I love being able to take around a whole bookcase of books with me wherever I go and being able to look up the definition of a new word, make bookmarks or notes and see other's bookmarks. I've found that reading on a kindle is not a whole lot different than it is with a regular book, the screen doesn't tire your eyes and it resembles paper (I always turn off the backlight), it just has all those added bonuses I mentioned. I still buy physical books for the ones I really like though.
EDIT: I also don't get this "forced to read fast on a kindle" thing he talks about, I have never experienced that..
Chomsky in a nutshell. Everything sucks, you are all slaves, my wisdom will save us. He's made a lot of money with it. He is like a tv evangelist who specializes in liberal arts majors.
Is it me, or is he maybe confusing a kindle with an audiobook (Audible?) maybe?
That make sense
I think this explains it. His view towards kindles didn't make logical sense. The medium words are written on doesn't determine reading pace. But it all makes sense if he was confusing kindle with audiobooks.
In my day, you were required to have memorized Euclid, and have twelve years of Latin and as many in Greek - much less French, German, and Biblical Hebrew - before you even qualified for entry into Kindergarten...
I don’t know why in the hell any of you feel the need to make notes in your books-or your stupid kindles. Just read and absorb the information.
Kindle is much more efficient and accessible. It is much easier to take notes, search for specific references, find certain publications. It is so much easier to go back and read over something again on kindle. I rarely say this but Chomsky is completely wrong here. Personally, I read a publication on kindle and if I find it useful I purchase the hard copy anyway. Kindle is just a more efficient way.
What he said about Kindle is nonsense.
I dunno. I personally agree with him. Having a book that you mark up, with a physical implement like a highlighter, I retain for more information than I do simply grazing over it with a finger tip.
This is anecdotal, yeah. But I see his point. There's a certain gravitas to reading a.. analogue? book that you don't get from an electronic one. Let alone audiobooks.
Both of electronic books and audiobooks are huge in my life however. They have many unique benefits.
But I find myself struggling to truly retain information I've learned from those mediums. I increasingly find myself returning to libraries and book stores to reread things or to brush up the gaps in my memory.
Could be I'm just getting old though.
@@thatdudeoverthere2188 I think the "analog book" thing is simlply out of custom. We don't give the same importance to e-books simply because they haven't been in our cultures for thousands of years like fisical books have. But it's just matter of time. I guess it'll be harder if an individual is already old and accustomed to the idea of "real books" containing "real information" being fisical books, and e-books being the "new things" you don't thing of them as simply "books". Btw highlighting doesn't make you retain in memory, more specifically it helps recognition, but not recall.
I desagree with Chomsky, and it's hard to agree with him 'cause he doesn't give any reasons or evidence for what he's saying, I guess it's his personal experience.
It doesn't matter how fast you read, which contradicts what a lot of "influencers", "digital educators" and "market gurus" would have one believe. Read 10 books in one month! Hahaha, get a life. Understand deeply the first book you read first of all.
This "philosopher" just said, without any justification, that reading words from a page is different from reading words from a screen. Hilarious.
@@DesertsofHibernia Different individuals have different biases and inclinations based on the kind of lives they live, hence an individual's tendencies with regards to the usage of a medium is always different from that of another individual, and the difference, as I already mentioned, comes from the kind of lives the individuals live. The tendencies that you mentioned in your comment are found in the majority population because electronic books are new. The difference lies not in the medium, the difference lies in the receiver.
@@DesertsofHibernia It's like saying drinking water from a bottle is different than drinking water from a glass.
@@DesertsofHibernia I will point out to you how your argument is inconsistent. First you argued that the point of difference between the two media lies in the difference between a reader's "tendencies" while using these media. Then I pointed out that such tendencies are not caused by the medium but by the reader's own biases and inclinations. Then you argued that the difference lies in the fundamental manner in which the words are presented to a reader by the two media. Then I presented an analogy to counter that point. Now you are again back to your first argument about the nature of "tendencies" of the reader. I have countered both your arguments, if you have a reply to further illuminate this meaningful discussion that we have had then I'm willing to read it.
@@DesertsofHibernia "And the point has always been that people are influenced by the manner in which information is presented to them." This is the exact same point that I am making. There are two communication systems, each consisting of a medium and a receiver. The medium, I proposed, performs the same function, but it's the receiver that changes due to its environment, according to its own inclinations and biases. Therefore an adjustment is required in the receiver, not in the medium, so that the two communication systems perform similarly.
@@DesertsofHibernia If you observe one medium to be a more accelerated version of the other, then my observation is very different from yours. We can argue about the interpretation of an observation, we can't argue when the observation itself is different.
This video is THE definition of irony.
Why is reading on a kindle any different than a book? Why? You can read thoughtfully carefully on a kindle.
That's not what he was talking about. He was referring to e-readers where you can't highlight sections, take notes, underlines things to come back to, write in the margins, etc. E-readers have progressed far in that regard
None of your comments are valid. You can highlight and take paper and pen notes referenced to pdf loc on the old kindles. Even taking notes in the newer versions of kindle is a slow painstaking process b/c the keypad still has a lag and your notes get deleted periodically.
Max Schlepzig Reading a kindle is exactly the same as reading a book except the kindle is more convenient:)
Darrin Kornelsen Kindle is not the only e-reader on the market. Everything I said was true, especially regarding older versions of e-readers. They have come a long way, especially with search allowing you to easily reference pages and notes in large books. The convenience factor is not even a discussion. I seldom read "real" books anymore, only when I can't get PDF/mobi versions of them. Regardless, e-readers are the now and the future.
No. You can't make detailed margin notes.
Look and see how many of the great old books are on Kindle---virtually zero. But you can have all the Neil Gaiman you can swallow. Vomit freely.
Actually the great old books are in the public domain, you can find them and read them digitally for free! I would recommend you check out oodles books, you can download classic texts and audiobooks on there
Also classics are great but so is Neil Gaiman, just because something is modern doesn't make it inherently bad
@@Swanky11 Gaiman is "great"? You mean as in, "I had a great time at the circus"? Or "That was a great comic book"?
@@Swanky11 Don't know what you consider "great old books" and "classics" but they sure have "oodles" of shit at that site!
@@37Dionysos The mobile app has all sorts of books from the ancient Greek texts to 19th century literature. If Homer, Dante, Shakespeare, Dostayevsky, Dickens etc are "oodles of shit" then I don't know what to tell you. I was trying to have polite discourse and let you know that my generation has access to so much wonderful knowledge which is often overlooked. Ebooks and audiobooks allow people to access so much for free. I for one think that's wonderful, especially for people who can't afford to buy tomes of overpriced books
hes rng ppl dnt abrvte 2 mch
i no thinks screens reeding did affecting me anglish skills omg chomsky rotflmao and u wont beleeve what happens next!!!!!!
Two ways of reading books are 1 letrare =spend my timing or keep in library. 2 analysis. Mean I learned a lot from what I read. And yes there all most younger people does not read. Even older. For learning. Tech support them to be fast food productions.
Instant gratification
Omg I did it I was too brief .
I don't agree with him on this one. I agree people may read less but there is plenty of evidence to show the same effect on the brain from a hard copy, kindle to audio. Sounds like an old guy not understanding what's going on with tech. My son reads hard copies and he read 40 books this year already at 10 years old. People are much more intelligent than their grandparents because the access to knowledge is a few typed letters away no looking through the World book for hours anymore.
This is why I i have no respect for Chomsky
People like me born in the early 1980s well not agree with him. But I totally agee with him my generation is wholly illeate. I read more then the majority of people I know. I use print always.
Jeremy Reagan Yet you still can't spell agree or illiterate. Really activates the almonds.
I even notice a certain disdain for reading in people sometimes. It probably has to do with new forms of media promoting the fragmentation of attention to the point where sitting down for an hour to read seems impossible. There's this anxiety or restlessness i notice in myself sometimes to sit down for prolonged periods of time. Potential is collapsed and you'll be sitting down for a while, the future is setfor a while. Then again in other ways potential in new patterns and content of thought opens up. Its the same reason maybe that some of my friends often prefer to watch tvshows over movies because the movie locks you in. There's something unpleasant about collapsing potential. People like the idea of having options open what to do with their time. Yet the only way to achieve anything is to collapse potential again and again. We must do everything linearly.
Carl Watts shut up
Carl Watts media.giphy.com/media/5aLrlDiJPMPFS/giphy.gif
love ya Noam, but you're geezing here. This was a wasted 4 minutes - trying to generalize new technology or whole generations with a broad-brush is an age-old game and it has typically been a waste of words. The printing press was demonized for replacing the oral traditions
7788Sambaboy exactly. i see issue with the fact that modern electronic information is tracked by corporations, whereas a print book may be purchased for untraceble cash... but to hear someone of noam’s prestige comment that information from an ebook somehow is less likely to permeate the reader compared to a printed book containing the same text is the most ok boomer moment of my week.
Wtf!
too long this video
Chomsky is a clever guy, but the about it's too fast to read the kindle, is far out. It's kind of conservative and snobish. kindle is digital ink, it's even better than a book, because you can increase the size of letters, do remarks, go back and forth as easy as any book. it's an ignorant statement
There is some good research suggesting kindle does not stimulate the same parts of the brain as reading print. Why is up for debate, but don't rush to say something is impossible/ignorant before checking out some of the studies.
Gay tho
Boohoo
reading is boring, that's why I listen to audio recordings on youtube
Always disappointed by the shallowness and obviousness of Chomsky's critiques.
Repetition seems to solve the problem for me, to stop following and start thinking or start to follow the same again for clarity. I think it is hard to follow a book, so to me pro's and cons to both.