4:41 The game should also recognize when there is someone in the lobby going 0-6 that the loss may have been out of everyone’s control. It sucks to lose CR going 3-3 when there is an obvious dead weight bringing everyone down
I was winning 4-6 rounds and people left 6 games running in my 'placement/early' games. Weirdly this sent my MMR down to like 1400 (maybe that's normal not sure). I've noticed now I'm in lobbies with healers getting trained no matter how much you peel for them and they go 0-6. You then are naturally 3-3. My rating just gets 0 change every game and have to wait for a lobby with two good healers. Just got to prey to the matchmaking gods😂
BINGO. It should say he the team with the rogue on it won 80% of the rounds lets give the rouge a big rating bonus but it doesnt it just lets the shitty player tank everyone with 0 gains
Holy shit, I was literally about to comment the same thing. I'm floating at 1800 and starting to get games where there is 1 person that loses all 6 rounds (always a DPS) and is complete deadweight. And after about two games the other 5 players know it and the dps just jump on them and stick to it. So I'm starting to go 3-3 over and over. So for example: As a healer, if the deadweight DPS is on my team, it is pretty much a loss and there is not much you can really do about it, unless you have a "star" DPS along with them that can carry the damage and you and the DPS can somehow coordinate CC enough? But, Solo q is more about surviving and doing consistent damage throughout and winning through dampening (a lot of the time), rather than trying to line up triple CCs and coordinating your teams CDs at the same time like a normal 3s. So if you have a DPS that is just an absolute meat bag, no matter how good of a healer you are, eventually dampening will make it impossible to deal with so you just.. lose. Just my experience at lower ratings right now.
@@jeremybowles9330 What exactly do you want the DPS to do when they are hard focused? even if they use defensives, LoS, they are still getting pummeled. People in arena would rather talk shit about someone being hard focused than actually do something to help.
@@matheusalmeida6592 could even have a healer and just shuffle best 2 out of 3. Don’t need to have the healers every match. But if healers queue they must be on both teams
my problem is that I queued 5-6 games around 1900 as a healer. Every time there was 1 guy who was significantly worse than everyone else and just died every match and won 0. So this was default 3/3 for both healers. Rating unchanged for playing for almost 2 hours. Feels like a waste of time
the same happens as a dps bro, some games 1 of the 2 healers is just significantly worse than the other one, so 1 healer goes 6-0, the other goes 0-6. And all the dps go 3-3.
Well, this is why solo shuffle is so unpopular. I've been sitting whole day in a queue and got to play 4 games. 2s or 3s are definitely the way to go for proper and fun experience.
I think it's just the MMR that makes it confusing for everyone and thank you for the explanation, I've got a better understanding on how solo shuffle works.
I'm queueing as a healer, stuck at about 1400-1500 because 3/6 gets me nothing, a 4/6 gets me like +10 but a 2/6 loses me like 40-50. For one bad game I need to do well in 5 other games just to get back to where I was. And my cr is not even that high...
This is just the same system used in RBG, 3v3 and 2v2. Except the match MMR is the same thing as enemy team MMR in rated. The game basically calculates your MMR. MMR basically meaning the rating where the game expects you to play with 50% winrate, based on current information. If you win a lot of games in a row, the game raises your MMR to find the rating that you would be going 50-50 at. Once you go 50-50 at that rating your MMR stays there and your current rating, your actual rank raises there. You don't lose current rank from losing a game, if your MMR and the match MMR are much higher. Your MMR will be affected, but the game still wants you to get out of like 1400 real fast if you're currently winning half of your games against 2400 players. On the flip side, if you're 2400 current rating and 2400 MMR, but you end up in a match with 2200MMR players? If you lose or go even there, you lose rating. You're expected to come on top in a match played at rating level which you're supposed to be above. This is why healers are having a rough time climbing. Since there are so few healers compared to dps, they get stuffed into lobbies with much wider MMR differences than is optimal. And since there are MANY more lower rank dps than lower rank healers, more commonly healers get sucked down in MMR. And when a 2100mmr healer is playing in a 1600mmr match, the expectation is that he wins. But in DF, damage is so high, that it only takes one unlucky round where your dps just suicides. You lose one match against the 1600 healer, and your rating tanks. Your MMR also tanks and you're set back significantly.
Thank you for making this vid. It is incredibly frustrating playing with people only to learn they're delusional, arrogant, or egotistical. It's extremely rampant in RBGs too. Coming from a background in League of Legends and Super Smash Brothers, so many people across any platform will make every excuse why
@@bestpinoza oh that's my bad on the word choice, I thought it was implied that when I mentioned the item level or composition it was me quoting what the bad players would say lol. I'll edit that in to clarify
win 3 games and getting 0 rating like actually 0 is incredibly frustrating then you factor in 30-45 min ques, plus ppl leaving sometimes, i just played for almost 2 hours and gained nothing lol, 2 leavers, 2 games where i got 0 rating, im at 2k rating.
Just won 4 rounds, got 0 rating, my rating was middle of the pack compared to the other players in the match. my mmr was 37 lower than the average matchmaking value?
Its making it hell for healers, i keep getting 0 rating when i win 5 or 6 of the rounds and i do this for like 3-5 games in a row like this and gain 0 literally 0, then i play one game and lose and i drop 70 rating... its bullshit it makes it unfun, because i dont get any reward for winning but sufer for losses
As someone who plays both dps and healers in solo shuffle there’s no way it works as straightforward as you described. My dps gains significantly more rating for wins than my healer. I don’t think the average matchmaking value matters. I think the average match making value of the players in the lobby that you win with, and lose to matters. So if you win matches against lower rated players you gain less. There is something fishy going on with healers.
It's probably because healers actually get into queues. As a dps you need to wait so fucking long to get a match that if the mmr gains were the same youd never have a chance.
You are right. Each invidual rounds mmr matters This is why your healer feels different. If the other healer has lower mmr than you than he is tanking the mmr of his group EVERY round Therefore as a healer you have an even tighter window of how well you're expected to play or not play depending on the other healers mmr
I watched this the first time and didn't agree, but after watching a second time and really listening it makes a lot of sense. What you said about the 3-3 thing is so spot on and it makes me feel a lot better about myself. I see your point, my whole problem was how can I be expected to win more then 3 rounds with teammates that dont press basic defensives? Feeling like I was doing bad for going 3-3 like it's a loss cause not getting rating but like your saying, 3-3 means you did your best with the chances you had, 50% of the game you don't have the bad player on your team so yeah I agree 100% that 3-3 is a win unless it's a lot lower rank. I'm glad I watched this again. Maybe now I can stop stressing so much and enjoy it. I have no idea how or why but since the DF release it's been a roller coaster and frustrating, I had no idea a game could do that. Now I know and had to pull back. Embarrassing thing is I am a 38yr old retired man that's only started gaming since stopping work!
I've just had 4 games in a row where I've won 4-5 and someone leaves last round and "rating unchanged". I'm fuming right now. 30 min queue times just for that, and no rating change. I'm really sad.
I'd like to see a video where you talk about how to "carry" a lobby. Like what do I need to do to move up, because when your CR and MMR are close, even going 4-2 isn't enough to move up. I don't really know what I'm doing wrong. It's not damage, I am topping damage most games, so how do I carry a warrior who doesn't use defensives? Do I just need to focus on CC? But then I am not doing max damage and we lose anyway. So I'm sort of stumped. I'm still learning, so I know I can do better, it just feels like I am going to get hard stuck. Like what's the difference between a 1600, 1800, 2k, 2.4k frost mage?
One thing that might help if ur mage is to make sure to be hyper aware of ur teammates cool downs so when u guys are bursting be sure secure cc on healer and perhaps root off target. Things of that nature. And then just spam pollying dps on their offensive cool downs. If you learn to time that well it will really allow you to put you're ability to dps well to use. Hope this was helpful. Glhf
An important thing to think about is that 'topping damage' isn't always the most important. You might want to focus on doing alot of dmg at the right moments. So don't pump your offensives into someones defensives, or pop all your dmg while the enemy healer is free to just spam heal. I had a game where me and another guy did the same dmg at the end of 6 rounds, but I went 5-1, and he went 1-5. Because he was just mindlessly doing dmg the whole time, while I focus my damage during certain windows of opportunity to score a kill.
as a healer yesterday i won 3/3 games - someone left - no rating for me next game i won 5/5 games - someone left - no rating for me next game i won 4/6 games - i got 1 rating and thats why i wont que solo as a healer anymore fk this lol
I love this solo shuffle system sooo much. Finally all these (boosted) "2.4 exp" players get what they deserve. ELO DOES NOT LIE. It never has. Not in LOL, not in Sc2, not in Chess. It's the ultimate Mirror and players don't like what they see in its reflection.
ngl tho its a melee fest... try playing as a caster in solo shuffle and tell me how it works out lol. not impossible but ngl the caster has to play like 10x better than all the melee or try that much harder cause every round is gonna be the caster being trained into the ground and sub optimal comps for them, meanwhile fury/dk/dh can go with just about anything and just cleave with their brains turned off and do same or more damage... just seems kinda dumb how much easier it is for some classes to do same or more damage. idk how they could fix it without pruning certain classes tbh cause cant just buff caster damage so yeah, just weird spot to be in as a caster... every time i que up on a caster of mine its 3 other melees, and i play melee as well and just seems so much easier. (i have more exp on caster btw but have played both at glad rating)
@@ImperviouslyGaming I don't disagree. But as long as you measure your rating within the ladder of your spec, that should be fine. You can't compare a resto shaman rating with a fury warrior.
@@EndoPvP yeh it's a melee zugzug bracket. Lame af tbh if the game was like cata/mop then casters would be more able to carry but instead melee he 8 gapclosers, similar cc and more damage/uptime than b4 with better healing besides lock tbh.
This is my situation, I would like if someone could confirm or deny my assumptions: I play shaman, I'm currently 1400+ rated on my enhancement solo shuffle spec and I got there in like 10 matches. Then I swapped to elemental and my rating was 0 since I didn't play any games as ele, but I noticed I was gaining waaaay less rating in 10 matches... Truth be told I found it very hard to survive for a few first matches as ele until I got to understand how to counter pressure as ele. Now, is that because my MATCHMAKING RATING is shared between specs but CURRENT RATING for that spec isn't, is that the reason I'm gaining was less rating as ele? I hope I didn't overcomplicate the explanation and thanks to anyone who answers me.
I do think that the MMR is somehow shared / class wide to certain extent (maybe only for role specs? since if you play 1 dps spec and then another on same class it is similar playstyle ????), because my friend who switched from fury to arms got into very similar situation
didnt watch it all but just by 2min i can see u get it. But the big thing thats annoying is that it makes so incredibly high jumps up and down atm and thats beacuse its not a big enough player base in solo shuffle. for example ive played like 10-12 solo shuffles since release first 5-6 games i sky rocketed to 1600 but now my last 4-5 games ive been qued into an mmr matchmaking of below 1600 and lost alot rating when going 4-2 and 3-3 and it felt so bad that ive not qued more and i actually loved the first 5-6games but im a competetive guy so when the matchmaking sucks i kinda stop giving a f. thats just my take hope blizzard finds a fix to it beacuse the idea behind soloq is great i just wanna play and not have to lf a group,if i have a group to play with great awesome but being forced to lfg sucks as a duelist peaker.
If you are a due list player then if you kept playing you would get there. By not playing you are admitting you aren’t that good. Every glad player climbed to 2400+ easily. It’s not the mm
@@CheyTacHD by being duelist peak i meant that im bad at the game, and its hard to find groups in lfg.thats fun to play with id enjoy more a solo shuffle matchmaking that doesnt give 0rating change and 30 min que times.
if your Current raiting and mmr is the same,going 3-3 will get you 0 ,it means you belong there,4-2 should give you some ,5-1 bit more and 6-0 a better chunk
I absolutely dislike the rating system, does not matter if I gain 4 wins or 2 wins or 5 wins, the last 10 games maybe in total gained 50 rating but lost like 100,. It makes it impossible to get higher rating if does not matter how well you perform you still get shafted. Kind disincentives and de-motives me to not play anymore of it if I can't get anything out of it regardless of performance.
That's all fine, the thing that's killing me is waiting 30 minutes for a game! I wanted soloq to escape the lfg hell, in the end it's the same thing if they don't fix it.
Just wondering how mmr works in df. Got 70 for the first time today and did one shuffle with 5 or 6 wins. Next game was almost on 2k mmr with 480 personal rating. What the heck is going on?
excellent video by THE excellent mage. nice clear explanation Ven. I was wondering what the outcry was about but I guess it makes sense that a lot of WoW players may not have the same level of SoloQ mmr experience from other games because they probably just don't play those other games so they were just extremely confused on how it was all working.
not only does solo shuffle matchmaking take 20-40 minutes, not only do you not gain rating if someone leaves, but i have to deal with this system as well-.-
I agree with you but they need to implement another layer to the point system depending on classes. For example, someone who goes 3-3 with a shit spec for solo shuffle like an affliction lock or frost dk and how they aren’t represented that much in 2400+ compared to the other classes like a DH or Unholy DK. I get what you mean by “you should be in that rank because that’s what you should be” but if they made it a point system that is also based off of the top classes to lower classes then that would be more fair. Gives the classes who aren’t flavor of the month a reason to continue on while punishing the classes that are literally free points.
I was 1900+ rating today and my game bugged so i leave the match in the first battle, i got warned and lost 200 mmr Just dont wanna play anymore I need to wait a 30 minutes Q just to play one game and then the game bugs and i lost all my rating
Sorry that happens but there must be a huge punishment for leavers. Collateral damage is bad but most people leaving aren't getting bugs they are trolls
I'm getting super frustrated healing solo shuffle. It feels like it's impossible to keep people alive. I am spending every gcd and it just feels hopeless.
That being said 2 nights ago i won 4 rounds in a row like 4 games in a row and on the 5th round the guy with like 0 or 1 left and i got nothing its fkn stooppid
honestly im done with solo shuffle, as a player that has very little play time, i dont have the luxury to have fixed mates to play with in rated arena... and solo shuffle seemed to me like a ray of hope. But now it honestly feels like a cancer... i went up in rating the first week, felt very nice, but then the 2nd week people with very low mmr started showing up, not only low mmr but some with also very low CR too, i won 5/6 and got nothing, then anotzher game a managed to win 6/6, go a rediculous 3+, and worse was when people decide to focus a poor ret that queued up with us by god only knows how is that even possible a ret pally at 1100 cr queueing against people at 1900 cr and 2000 mmr... The ret became a punching bag, every roudn he died and i automatically got 3 win 3 loses and lost a woping -208 pts... this doesnt motivate me to continue playing it at all, im going back to 2v2, solo shuffle can burn alive for all i care. Funny thing is, blizzard took freaking 6 months to find a good rating system for it, and all they did was copy paste the system from 3v3 in it... but guess what? it's not how it should be, because on the meantime while you're trying your best to survie helping your mates, there'll always be that one dude, that will run into everyone burst head on and died in 3 secs and because of him, you're gonna lose rating, it's way too much unfair of a system, there's the word "SOLO" in it, and to me i think the system should analyse players by their individual perfs or else this thing should had never been created
Please just acknowledge how many huge issues there are with this elo system. I feel like I’m taking crazy pills over here. I’ve played ranked online multiplayer since I was a child and I’ve never seen such a poorly designed system.
Whats bad about it? People just genuinely don't understand the system. A lot of people are also realizing the reason they can't climb past 1400 is because they suck and playing solo makes them realize it really was them when they were hardstuck and not their teamates.
@@jayfaulkner2602 Because MMR is a stupid way to measure things. You're in a match with 5 other people not solo. You could get matched 3-4 times in a row with incompetent people that just play bad & tank your MMR. Then you're stuck in MMR hell. Matches should always be based of current rating with like a 50 rating flex.
@@Wishxinever You’re talking short term. These systems are designed to be accurate long term. Do you reject the law of averages? The only way that the 5 players on your team could affect your MMR over hundreds of games is if you rolled bad RNG on most of your games, which is unlikely at best and almost impossible at worst.
Agree with most of it. But the example of borngood was pretty bad. There are varying levels of “good” and comparing one of, if not the best hpal, ro everyone else is silly imo. The healing situation in solo shuffle is a different problem altogether though. It’s healer vs healer and you’re just praying you can make “the bad” dps win one game. Then heal your team while they kill said dps the other 3. No wonder there are less than 10% of the pop playing heals in higher games. I mean the BEST players struggle to turn these losing games into winning games from the streams I’ve watched. Are they higher rated on average? Definitely. But they’ve also played TONS more games on that specific character or have multiple of “x class”.
I have been consistently climbing in solo queue with no clear walls yet... except. Leavers and 35 minute queue times. I spent 4 hours I had to play last night on 2 leave groups a failed +12 key w someone absolutely refusing to interrupt and a single 5-0 shuffle game where both teams just took turns training the mm hunter while ignoring the completely immortal 2 affliction locks. The tuning still isnt right. I'll say that. Aff with a priest is nearly unkillable. Warrior and aff are still too strong as sustain. Dh and mm have too much burst but are weaker in survivability. Ww monk seems to be the sweet spot. Rogues are still broken with no sign they will not be anytime soon. Mages seems to be coming up the higher I go. Probably just a high skill ceiling I imagine. Lower ratings they fall over. +49 rating in 4 hours. Oof.
Ah and i'm still cofused. Just finished shuffle: my matchmaking 1085 - average matchmaking 1115, 4 won, 0 rating gained (screenshot available). I think there is no simple rule to calculate rating loss or rating gained.
Thank you for clarifying ven. I went 2-4 twice In a row and lost 48 ratings each game. Last game I went 3-3 and gained 246. Now I - kind of - know why. As a side note, you need to at least win 3 out of 6 for vicious mount bar to go higher no matter you lose or gain rating. Worth mentioning imo.
it's also rating that is significantly easier to gain. Being 2400 in solo q atm is probably like being 1750 on the actual 3s ladder. Somehow the system is incredibly inflated.
@@TGShunai SoloQ is the only rating that truly shows how good you are because rated arenas you can get carried solo you can’t . Plus rated you can swipe your debit card and get any rating you want. SoloQ is designed to expose the boosted trashcans that’s why I love it lol
@@marcusdddd4285 Well, it's not that easy. For example, as I said, the rating is INCREDIBLY inflated at the moment. And solo Q also favours certain classes over others. For example, you can see multiple DH's above 2400 how have never been close to 2400 in normal 3s. Why is this? Because you get way to much CR to easily (just like RBG when it first came out in 2010 or something) AND because DH can carry a game due to it's dmg being highly tuned, aoe, and have multiple instant CC's to use. So the only thing you can say is, how good is a DH compared to other DH players in the solo Q ladder. You can't think 'wow this demon hunter must be good because he is 2400 in solo Q' when he has never been over 2.1 in normal 2s/3s AND there are so many DH's over even 2600, being 2400 turns out to be mediocre as a DH, while 2400 might be really high for a boomkin or frost mage for example. So you can't just say 'solo q shows truly who is good and who isn't. It's not actually that straight forward.
this is such a dumb system. Like you said, if you're playing at your rating then you should be winning roughly half your games. It sucks when you can't get over 4/6 because it'll give you 0 rating(even when you have 3 killing blows and the highest dps), and even if you go 5/6 your rating goes up minimally. ESPECIALLY in a que with randos who have no idea what they're doing. There's no comm system to talk to them and say "hey, come on this spriest" but they zugzug the wwm who is spinning around a pillar and leading them on as a troll. Or triple druids in the que plus an evo. You could go 2/6 and because of the system in place, your rating tanks. But you can't get back up because you had a good streak at the beginning of the season, so even if you win a majority of the matches you get 0 rating; so now everything is literally outside of your control when it should be based on merit. dps, killing blows, and of course wins should be taken into account and it shouldn't be so dependent on randos who suck and your initial rating. You can tell blizz likes the idea of an "average grade", because they probably depended on one when they went to school to develop this pos game.
Can we just get the entirety of the WorldofPvP subreddit to watch this video so we stop getting posts about it every 30 seconds? Thanks Ven, now I have a video to point them to if they're still confused.
After climbing in some solo shuffle games (most 4 wins), I had a lobby as retri only with S tear classes (shadow, unholy, mm hunter & two heals, Druid and Drag). No chance… 😂 I lost all games… And no, it was not me who always died. As a maybe B class, it‘s crazy to play against only S classes…. 😢 I lost so much cr and mmr….
bro. I'm consistently 2k-2.2k with no voice randoms as a healer with little effort........ and I have queue'd solo all day as a prevoker struggling to get 1300. win 5 games, get 3 points. win 2 games, lose 70 points
Me, healer: going 6-0 and no rating changed. Tell me how this is fair. Please tell me. What sort of mental gimnastics to I need do employ for this to seem "fair" in this reality. Lets not fool ourselves, the system is crap and needs fixing.
I understand how it works and it is stupid. There are skilled players at low levels because they are on alts or just decided to start a bit later this season. MMR is a stupid system for a video game.
If you gain nothing from 6-0 it means your Mmr was super low compared to your raiting,you prob lost a lot the last few shuffles so it will increase highly (mmr) even if you gain nothing and the next few games you will gain more ,Like legit just look at those 3 stats and its pretty easy to see what you will need to do
@@zzzzzz-rn3oh its not stupid. Is one of the best ways to make it somewhat fair. But you have to use some of your brain power to understant it. You are literally commenting under video where he explained it. If you are not gaining much rating for winning it means you belong on rating you are right now or should be lower ( of course depends on enemies rating) if you win a lot good games arrow your actual rating will skyrocket and you will start to get more and more rating for wins. Its simple
Sounds pretty clearly like in the given example you were not only expected to win, but didn't perform as well as you could've. Heals is ranked against the other heals. Just because you won the round doesn't mean you played better than their healer, fyi. Perhaps the enemy DPS played like absolute dogs etc.
yes but thats impossible i mean.. ques takes like 1h and when u get a game there will be ppl all from 0 rating to 1700 EVEN if ur on 1700 urself.. so the system is broken..
Nice video thanx! But just one thing: when in 4 shuffle in a row (24 matches) you find temmates who think is not important to cc healer, is not your fault. Imho who play shuffle are 60% bored pvers who passing the time waiting teammates for M+. I can understand a bad positioning for average pvper, slowness in momentum, ecc ecc....but if u are pvper u cc healer....no doubt. A champion can survive and carry all of them (expecially healer) but average player like me, lose rating galore.
TLDW; What he wants to say but doesn't want or can't. If you are on a lobby that has lower mmr than your CR is.. just leave at round 5 or 6 because chances are very high you won't get any rating at all. And leaving = -150 rating BUT your MMR will not get touched at all and therfore you can just climb after 1-2 matches very easy. Welcome to Blizzard "esport" and matchmaking. Isn't it great?
i wouldnt mind the system if it didnt require me to win ATLEAST 5/6 rounds to gain half the rating i lose if i go 3/3 some games, the system just feels like a waste of time honestly, the rating win/loss ratio just feels way the fuck off, you would think winning the majority of rounds would give you rating but it just straight doesnt unless its 5/6 or 6/6 for me, your damage or killing blows doesnt seem to matter at all either, terrible ranked system honestly
Like the video, end of it was kida cringe. We all know there is actually approx 300 rating difference between EU and NA. So 2k NA is similar to 1.7k in EU
fucking exactly. Friend sent me this and I was like absolutely BULLSHIT. I went 1-5 because my MMR was 1300 (I know ... healer issues) and theirs were 1000. Because I had people running around like fucking idiots and running out my links and just dying. ZERO CC. It was horrible. I lost nearly 80 rating from that and when I win 3 I get nothing, 4 maybe 10 rating??? Fuck this game
all solo shuffle comes down to is if you get a dh or fury warrior on your team and for how many rounds because of the class imbalance this expansion. thats all solo shuffle is.
But my match matchmaking rating is 2 k, my mmr is 1700 and my cr is 1700. I go 3-3 and its unchanged. so im playing 3-3 against people 300 rating higher than me , and it says unchanged. how the actual fuck am i suppose to climb.
because your current rating and mmr is way higher than the game mmr, that mean you're "supposed" to win 5 to 6 games since you play against lower rating/mmr opponents. Also even if you gain 0 rating, you still gain mmr who will help in the long run. MMR > current rating in solo q in every game
i play eu and solo q is 50 min per game to just go in as sub and have the guy break all my cc zug zug and fuck me over they don't care about me at the start i was able to get 2270 like a week ago but when i won 5 games the other guy leaves and i get 0 and then i have to wait 50 min q just to have the guy leave if i win or try to fuck with my utility and i am mostly the guy with hightst cr once it paired me up as 2.2 with sb 0 cr an d that is bad. Ppl DC and decline when the q pops it is just a shihole in eu idk about NA
The issue there is clearly a matchmaking issue as you shouldn't be put in a game where everyone is 200 points lower or something. Maybe at very high mmr where there's no games. If you're 1800 with 1600 lobby I'm wondering why. I played only 6 rounds this whole season and won 5 as disc so this isn't personal lol I've just seen it and read about it.
@@7128jml While i completely agree, we already lack healers and the queue time is already so long. Plus the fact that WoW PvP has always been a minigame who lacks a large pool enough of players. Ajusting the matchmaking to fit more accuratly your current rating to have more "gains or loses" of rating would also implies waiting 2x/3x the current queue time we have as dps (personnaly beetween 10 to 20 minutes at any time given around 1k9 cr)
3v3 solo shuffle is problematic-queue timers/team comps. If Blizzard wants to save this game make 2v2 solo shuffle and new rated pvp game types. This game will only then reclaim the throne
The worst matchmaking in the entire game, you win 3 and usually get 0, you win 2 you insta lose 50+ , you win 4 you get less than 30 and you gotta win 5+ to get 50+ , someone leaves you get 0 even after the changes. Worst system in the game
Игры
![Eminem - The Death of Slim Shady [Album Trailer]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/X0HIrS6kUYI/mqdefault.jpg)
4:41 The game should also recognize when there is someone in the lobby going 0-6 that the loss may have been out of everyone’s control. It sucks to lose CR going 3-3 when there is an obvious dead weight bringing everyone down
I was winning 4-6 rounds and people left 6 games running in my 'placement/early' games. Weirdly this sent my MMR down to like 1400 (maybe that's normal not sure). I've noticed now I'm in lobbies with healers getting trained no matter how much you peel for them and they go 0-6. You then are naturally 3-3. My rating just gets 0 change every game and have to wait for a lobby with two good healers. Just got to prey to the matchmaking gods😂
I don’t think so. That’s fine. Your mmr won’t change. Just go next and you’ll be alright
BINGO. It should say he the team with the rogue on it won 80% of the rounds lets give the rouge a big rating bonus but it doesnt it just lets the shitty player tank everyone with 0 gains
Holy shit, I was literally about to comment the same thing. I'm floating at 1800 and starting to get games where there is 1 person that loses all 6 rounds (always a DPS) and is complete deadweight. And after about two games the other 5 players know it and the dps just jump on them and stick to it. So I'm starting to go 3-3 over and over.
So for example: As a healer, if the deadweight DPS is on my team, it is pretty much a loss and there is not much you can really do about it, unless you have a "star" DPS along with them that can carry the damage and you and the DPS can somehow coordinate CC enough? But, Solo q is more about surviving and doing consistent damage throughout and winning through dampening (a lot of the time), rather than trying to line up triple CCs and coordinating your teams CDs at the same time like a normal 3s. So if you have a DPS that is just an absolute meat bag, no matter how good of a healer you are, eventually dampening will make it impossible to deal with so you just.. lose. Just my experience at lower ratings right now.
@@jeremybowles9330 What exactly do you want the DPS to do when they are hard focused? even if they use defensives, LoS, they are still getting pummeled. People in arena would rather talk shit about someone being hard focused than actually do something to help.
give us 2v2 solo shuffle
With dps only would be so nice, without 30 minutes Q
@@matheusalmeida6592 could even have a healer and just shuffle best 2 out of 3. Don’t need to have the healers every match. But if healers queue they must be on both teams
terrible idea all you will face is fury warriors and dhs have fun getting recked as anything else.
if you dont think so just look at solo shuffle now.
@@hvdiv17 lol fury + dh its a horrible comp
@@hvdiv17 it's this thing called learning how to counter play. The guy that makes these videos does it all the time
my problem is that I queued 5-6 games around 1900 as a healer. Every time there was 1 guy who was significantly worse than everyone else and just died every match and won 0. So this was default 3/3 for both healers. Rating unchanged for playing for almost 2 hours. Feels like a waste of time
makes me want to skip solo and queue 3s where there is always a winner and loser
It’s definitely need work but once u get to 2100mmr plus it gets better
the same happens as a dps bro, some games 1 of the 2 healers is just significantly worse than the other one, so 1 healer goes 6-0, the other goes 0-6. And all the dps go 3-3.
Well, this is why solo shuffle is so unpopular. I've been sitting whole day in a queue and got to play 4 games. 2s or 3s are definitely the way to go for proper and fun experience.
@@TGShunai U mean the healer isn't evoker vs evoker... siiigh.
Relatively new to PvP, you’re one of the guys that make feel like it could be chill and fun. Keep it up Venruki!
This tilted my to the point of insanity. In one session, I went from 1830 to 1400, having won twice as much as I lost.
I hope this goes viral ive been explaining this to people since pre patch daily and theres 1000s more people asking the same thing.
I think it's just the MMR that makes it confusing for everyone and thank you for the explanation, I've got a better understanding on how solo shuffle works.
You've helped me shake off the salt of shuffle, thanks Ven :)
I'm queueing as a healer, stuck at about 1400-1500 because 3/6 gets me nothing, a 4/6 gets me like +10 but a 2/6 loses me like 40-50. For one bad game I need to do well in 5 other games just to get back to where I was. And my cr is not even that high...
Thanks Venruki, I needed to hear this. No joke. Time to get 1800 rating.
This is just the same system used in RBG, 3v3 and 2v2. Except the match MMR is the same thing as enemy team MMR in rated.
The game basically calculates your MMR. MMR basically meaning the rating where the game expects you to play with 50% winrate, based on current information. If you win a lot of games in a row, the game raises your MMR to find the rating that you would be going 50-50 at. Once you go 50-50 at that rating your MMR stays there and your current rating, your actual rank raises there.
You don't lose current rank from losing a game, if your MMR and the match MMR are much higher. Your MMR will be affected, but the game still wants you to get out of like 1400 real fast if you're currently winning half of your games against 2400 players.
On the flip side, if you're 2400 current rating and 2400 MMR, but you end up in a match with 2200MMR players? If you lose or go even there, you lose rating. You're expected to come on top in a match played at rating level which you're supposed to be above.
This is why healers are having a rough time climbing. Since there are so few healers compared to dps, they get stuffed into lobbies with much wider MMR differences than is optimal. And since there are MANY more lower rank dps than lower rank healers, more commonly healers get sucked down in MMR. And when a 2100mmr healer is playing in a 1600mmr match, the expectation is that he wins. But in DF, damage is so high, that it only takes one unlucky round where your dps just suicides. You lose one match against the 1600 healer, and your rating tanks. Your MMR also tanks and you're set back significantly.
Thank you for making this vid. It is incredibly frustrating playing with people only to learn they're delusional, arrogant, or egotistical.
It's extremely rampant in RBGs too. Coming from a background in League of Legends and Super Smash Brothers, so many people across any platform will make every excuse why
hmm so what's the common denominator? :P
2 ilvl will make almost no noticeble difference, so it's definitely not that.
@@bestpinoza oh that's my bad on the word choice, I thought it was implied that when I mentioned the item level or composition it was me quoting what the bad players would say lol.
I'll edit that in to clarify
@@stephen12188 the players are bad because they're bad lol
It’s like that across all aspects of life, find the people who are trying to improve and succeed!
This doesn't make sense because my warrior alt is at 1500 in 1650 mmr match making and I still lose rating if i only win 2 games
How do I gain rating when I'm losing every match because I'm bad?
win 3 games and getting 0 rating like actually 0 is incredibly frustrating then you factor in 30-45 min ques, plus ppl leaving sometimes, i just played for almost 2 hours and gained nothing lol, 2 leavers, 2 games where i got 0 rating, im at 2k rating.
Just won 4 rounds, got 0 rating, my rating was middle of the pack compared to the other players in the match. my mmr was 37 lower than the average matchmaking value?
Its making it hell for healers, i keep getting 0 rating when i win 5 or 6 of the rounds and i do this for like 3-5 games in a row like this and gain 0 literally 0, then i play one game and lose and i drop 70 rating... its bullshit it makes it unfun, because i dont get any reward for winning but sufer for losses
As someone who plays both dps and healers in solo shuffle there’s no way it works as straightforward as you described. My dps gains significantly more rating for wins than my healer.
I don’t think the average matchmaking value matters. I think the average match making value of the players in the lobby that you win with, and lose to matters. So if you win matches against lower rated players you gain less.
There is something fishy going on with healers.
It's probably because healers actually get into queues. As a dps you need to wait so fucking long to get a match that if the mmr gains were the same youd never have a chance.
You are right. Each invidual rounds mmr matters
This is why your healer feels different. If the other healer has lower mmr than you than he is tanking the mmr of his group EVERY round
Therefore as a healer you have an even tighter window of how well you're expected to play or not play depending on the other healers mmr
Healers don't get to play with the entire lobby.
Thanks ven, well Said!
I watched this the first time and didn't agree, but after watching a second time and really listening it makes a lot of sense. What you said about the 3-3 thing is so spot on and it makes me feel a lot better about myself. I see your point, my whole problem was how can I be expected to win more then 3 rounds with teammates that dont press basic defensives? Feeling like I was doing bad for going 3-3 like it's a loss cause not getting rating but like your saying, 3-3 means you did your best with the chances you had, 50% of the game you don't have the bad player on your team so yeah I agree 100% that 3-3 is a win unless it's a lot lower rank. I'm glad I watched this again. Maybe now I can stop stressing so much and enjoy it. I have no idea how or why but since the DF release it's been a roller coaster and frustrating, I had no idea a game could do that. Now I know and had to pull back. Embarrassing thing is I am a 38yr old retired man that's only started gaming since stopping work!
Retired at 38 how’d that happen
@@pjtyra2106 was about to ask the same after reading his comment lol
I watched this with Gekz and his struggles in mind. I laughed my ass off the entire time 🤣
I've just had 4 games in a row where I've won 4-5 and someone leaves last round and "rating unchanged". I'm fuming right now. 30 min queue times just for that, and no rating change. I'm really sad.
Thanks for the information I was about to make a ticket :D ! cheers
Major flaw to it. as my raiting is below the MMR and Im still not gaining rating.
We need more venrukis to queue up.
I'd like to see a video where you talk about how to "carry" a lobby. Like what do I need to do to move up, because when your CR and MMR are close, even going 4-2 isn't enough to move up. I don't really know what I'm doing wrong. It's not damage, I am topping damage most games, so how do I carry a warrior who doesn't use defensives? Do I just need to focus on CC? But then I am not doing max damage and we lose anyway. So I'm sort of stumped. I'm still learning, so I know I can do better, it just feels like I am going to get hard stuck. Like what's the difference between a 1600, 1800, 2k, 2.4k frost mage?
One thing that might help if ur mage is to make sure to be hyper aware of ur teammates cool downs so when u guys are bursting be sure secure cc on healer and perhaps root off target. Things of that nature. And then just spam pollying dps on their offensive cool downs. If you learn to time that well it will really allow you to put you're ability to dps well to use. Hope this was helpful. Glhf
An important thing to think about is that 'topping damage' isn't always the most important. You might want to focus on doing alot of dmg at the right moments. So don't pump your offensives into someones defensives, or pop all your dmg while the enemy healer is free to just spam heal. I had a game where me and another guy did the same dmg at the end of 6 rounds, but I went 5-1, and he went 1-5. Because he was just mindlessly doing dmg the whole time, while I focus my damage during certain windows of opportunity to score a kill.
@@TGShunai Thanks!
as a healer yesterday i won 3/3 games - someone left - no rating for me
next game i won 5/5 games - someone left - no rating for me
next game i won 4/6 games - i got 1 rating
and thats why i wont que solo as a healer anymore fk this lol
Ikr, everytime my winrate is positive somone leaves... And healing shuffle is absurdly hard, because abilities shud obviusly oneshot x)
The problem is that in my last 6 games ive won between 4-5-6 wins and still only loosing point at around 1800 cr.. I'm a healer
I love this solo shuffle system sooo much. Finally all these (boosted) "2.4 exp" players get what they deserve. ELO DOES NOT LIE. It never has. Not in LOL, not in Sc2, not in Chess. It's the ultimate Mirror and players don't like what they see in its reflection.
ngl tho its a melee fest... try playing as a caster in solo shuffle and tell me how it works out lol. not impossible but ngl the caster has to play like 10x better than all the melee or try that much harder cause every round is gonna be the caster being trained into the ground and sub optimal comps for them, meanwhile fury/dk/dh can go with just about anything and just cleave with their brains turned off and do same or more damage... just seems kinda dumb how much easier it is for some classes to do same or more damage. idk how they could fix it without pruning certain classes tbh cause cant just buff caster damage so yeah, just weird spot to be in as a caster... every time i que up on a caster of mine its 3 other melees, and i play melee as well and just seems so much easier. (i have more exp on caster btw but have played both at glad rating)
@@ImperviouslyGaming I don't disagree. But as long as you measure your rating within the ladder of your spec, that should be fine. You can't compare a resto shaman rating with a fury warrior.
it's not like in 3v3 there was no ELO. It's just a different game mode with different skills.
That's why there are more DHs over 2400 than all healer specs put together right?! DH players are obviously just better at the game.
@@EndoPvP yeh it's a melee zugzug bracket. Lame af tbh if the game was like cata/mop then casters would be more able to carry but instead melee he 8 gapclosers, similar cc and more damage/uptime than b4 with better healing besides lock tbh.
Anything to add for the 3-3 healers at 2.1 cr in 2.5 lobby not gaining rating?
They say healer are only affected by enemy healer mmr
This is my situation, I would like if someone could confirm or deny my assumptions: I play shaman, I'm currently 1400+ rated on my enhancement solo shuffle spec and I got there in like 10 matches. Then I swapped to elemental and my rating was 0 since I didn't play any games as ele, but I noticed I was gaining waaaay less rating in 10 matches... Truth be told I found it very hard to survive for a few first matches as ele until I got to understand how to counter pressure as ele. Now, is that because my MATCHMAKING RATING is shared between specs but CURRENT RATING for that spec isn't, is that the reason I'm gaining was less rating as ele? I hope I didn't overcomplicate the explanation and thanks to anyone who answers me.
I do think that the MMR is somehow shared / class wide to certain extent (maybe only for role specs? since if you play 1 dps spec and then another on same class it is similar playstyle ????), because my friend who switched from fury to arms got into very similar situation
That shit was driving me nuts. Thanks for breaking it down barney style for my dumb ass :)
You know it's an instant like when Ven gets the notepad out
So explain how my win rate is about 50% and my rating only goes down? :/
didnt watch it all but just by 2min i can see u get it. But the big thing thats annoying is that it makes so incredibly high jumps up and down atm and thats beacuse its not a big enough player base in solo shuffle. for example ive played like 10-12 solo shuffles since release first 5-6 games i sky rocketed to 1600 but now my last 4-5 games ive been qued into an mmr matchmaking of below 1600 and lost alot rating when going 4-2 and 3-3 and it felt so bad that ive not qued more and i actually loved the first 5-6games but im a competetive guy so when the matchmaking sucks i kinda stop giving a f. thats just my take hope blizzard finds a fix to it beacuse the idea behind soloq is great i just wanna play and not have to lf a group,if i have a group to play with great awesome but being forced to lfg sucks as a duelist peaker.
If you are a due list player then if you kept playing you would get there. By not playing you are admitting you aren’t that good. Every glad player climbed to 2400+ easily. It’s not the mm
yeah ss is working great.
@@CheyTacHD by being duelist peak i meant that im bad at the game, and its hard to find groups in lfg.thats fun to play with id enjoy more a solo shuffle matchmaking that doesnt give 0rating change and 30 min que times.
I def think I should always be 1500-1600 because I keep going 3-3 and getting 0 rating. last 5 full games I have only gained 5 rating.
if your Current raiting and mmr is the same,going 3-3 will get you 0 ,it means you belong there,4-2 should give you some ,5-1 bit more and 6-0 a better chunk
The most important thing in any bracket is mmr just shoot for 4-2 everytime and you will eventually get that mmr up and start gaining
Current I’m 2100cr but my mmr is 2500
I absolutely dislike the rating system, does not matter if I gain 4 wins or 2 wins or 5 wins, the last 10 games maybe in total gained 50 rating but lost like 100,. It makes it impossible to get higher rating if does not matter how well you perform you still get shafted. Kind disincentives and de-motives me to not play anymore of it if I can't get anything out of it regardless of performance.
like i understand thiis but like, how come i can win all 6 matches, be top dps, and kill 6 people, but yet loose raiting?
That's all fine, the thing that's killing me is waiting 30 minutes for a game! I wanted soloq to escape the lfg hell, in the end it's the same thing if they don't fix it.
İn last clip the mw healer got 0rating although his mmr was 100 less. İ think the previous arena match effects the next arena which is weird.
Just wondering how mmr works in df. Got 70 for the first time today and did one shuffle with 5 or 6 wins. Next game was almost on 2k mmr with 480 personal rating. What the heck is going on?
excellent video by THE excellent mage. nice clear explanation Ven. I was wondering what the outcry was about but I guess it makes sense that a lot of WoW players may not have the same level of SoloQ mmr experience from other games because they probably just don't play those other games so they were just extremely confused on how it was all working.
I got 2100 as arms in solo shuffle and working on it.
not only does solo shuffle matchmaking take 20-40 minutes, not only do you not gain rating if someone leaves, but i have to deal with this system as well-.-
I agree with you but they need to implement another layer to the point system depending on classes. For example, someone who goes 3-3 with a shit spec for solo shuffle like an affliction lock or frost dk and how they aren’t represented that much in 2400+ compared to the other classes like a DH or Unholy DK. I get what you mean by “you should be in that rank because that’s what you should be” but if they made it a point system that is also based off of the top classes to lower classes then that would be more fair. Gives the classes who aren’t flavor of the month a reason to continue on while punishing the classes that are literally free points.
I was 1900+ rating today and my game bugged so i leave the match in the first battle, i got warned and lost 200 mmr
Just dont wanna play anymore
I need to wait a 30 minutes Q just to play one game and then the game bugs and i lost all my rating
Sorry that happens but there must be a huge punishment for leavers. Collateral damage is bad but most people leaving aren't getting bugs they are trolls
I have gone 3/6 and lost 56 points and done 4/6 and got 0 rating change I hate it :(
Keep getting ret pally healers just trying to dps as well.
Just enjoy the game, practice and pray. 🌞
Have lobbies where my "MMR" is 120 rating higher than my CR. I go 3-3 and still gain 0 rating...
best in the business
I'm getting super frustrated healing solo shuffle. It feels like it's impossible to keep people alive. I am spending every gcd and it just feels hopeless.
I’m stuck between 1600-1800 😢
Yea i had one last night where i won 3 at 1672 cr and average mmr was like 1600 and i lost 33 rating, next game i won 3 and gained 2 rating
That being said 2 nights ago i won 4 rounds in a row like 4 games in a row and on the 5th round the guy with like 0 or 1 left and i got nothing its fkn stooppid
Currently stuck at 2300-2500. Super frustrating lol
honestly im done with solo shuffle, as a player that has very little play time, i dont have the luxury to have fixed mates to play with in rated arena... and solo shuffle seemed to me like a ray of hope. But now it honestly feels like a cancer... i went up in rating the first week, felt very nice, but then the 2nd week people with very low mmr started showing up, not only low mmr but some with also very low CR too, i won 5/6 and got nothing, then anotzher game a managed to win 6/6, go a rediculous 3+, and worse was when people decide to focus a poor ret that queued up with us by god only knows how is that even possible a ret pally at 1100 cr queueing against people at 1900 cr and 2000 mmr... The ret became a punching bag, every roudn he died and i automatically got 3 win 3 loses and lost a woping -208 pts... this doesnt motivate me to continue playing it at all, im going back to 2v2, solo shuffle can burn alive for all i care. Funny thing is, blizzard took freaking 6 months to find a good rating system for it, and all they did was copy paste the system from 3v3 in it... but guess what? it's not how it should be, because on the meantime while you're trying your best to survie helping your mates, there'll always be that one dude, that will run into everyone burst head on and died in 3 secs and because of him, you're gonna lose rating, it's way too much unfair of a system, there's the word "SOLO" in it, and to me i think the system should analyse players by their individual perfs or else this thing should had never been created
Please just acknowledge how many huge issues there are with this elo system. I feel like I’m taking crazy pills over here. I’ve played ranked online multiplayer since I was a child and I’ve never seen such a poorly designed system.
Whats bad about it? People just genuinely don't understand the system. A lot of people are also realizing the reason they can't climb past 1400 is because they suck and playing solo makes them realize it really was them when they were hardstuck and not their teamates.
@@jayfaulkner2602 hahaha mean brother
Amen*
@@jayfaulkner2602 Because MMR is a stupid way to measure things. You're in a match with 5 other people not solo. You could get matched 3-4 times in a row with incompetent people that just play bad & tank your MMR. Then you're stuck in MMR hell. Matches should always be based of current rating with like a 50 rating flex.
@@Wishxinever
You’re talking short term. These systems are designed to be accurate long term. Do you reject the law of averages?
The only way that the 5 players on your team could affect your MMR over hundreds of games is if you rolled bad RNG on most of your games, which is unlikely at best and almost impossible at worst.
Agree with most of it. But the example of borngood was pretty bad. There are varying levels of “good” and comparing one of, if not the best hpal, ro everyone else is silly imo.
The healing situation in solo shuffle is a different problem altogether though. It’s healer vs healer and you’re just praying you can make “the bad” dps win one game. Then heal your team while they kill said dps the other 3.
No wonder there are less than 10% of the pop playing heals in higher games. I mean the BEST players struggle to turn these losing games into winning games from the streams I’ve watched. Are they higher rated on average? Definitely. But they’ve also played TONS more games on that specific character or have multiple of “x class”.
I have been consistently climbing in solo queue with no clear walls yet...
except.
Leavers and 35 minute queue times. I spent 4 hours I had to play last night on 2 leave groups a failed +12 key w someone absolutely refusing to interrupt and a single 5-0 shuffle game where both teams just took turns training the mm hunter while ignoring the completely immortal 2 affliction locks.
The tuning still isnt right. I'll say that. Aff with a priest is nearly unkillable. Warrior and aff are still too strong as sustain. Dh and mm have too much burst but are weaker in survivability. Ww monk seems to be the sweet spot. Rogues are still broken with no sign they will not be anytime soon. Mages seems to be coming up the higher I go. Probably just a high skill ceiling I imagine. Lower ratings they fall over.
+49 rating in 4 hours. Oof.
Anyone know the song at 10:30?
Ah and i'm still cofused. Just finished shuffle: my matchmaking 1085 - average matchmaking 1115, 4 won, 0 rating gained (screenshot available). I think there is no simple rule to calculate rating loss or rating gained.
Thank you for clarifying ven. I went 2-4 twice In a row and lost 48 ratings each game. Last game I went 3-3 and gained 246. Now I - kind of - know why.
As a side note, you need to at least win 3 out of 6 for vicious mount bar to go higher no matter you lose or gain rating.
Worth mentioning imo.
My mmr is stuck at 1500 after going 3-3 for 3 games I gained nothing but one round of 2-4 I dropped 57 rating
YEAH BUT IF I GO 5-1 I SHOULD GAIN RATING REGARDLESS BECAUSE ITS THE EQUIVALENT TO WINNING 5 MATCHES AND LOSING 1. Shits broken.
just annoying when your winning your matches than somebody leaves, Than being sent back to a 20 minute queue.
Good video ven I’m 2230 on my ww I love solo because it’s the only rating you can’t buy in the game 😊
it's also rating that is significantly easier to gain. Being 2400 in solo q atm is probably like being 1750 on the actual 3s ladder. Somehow the system is incredibly inflated.
@@TGShunai SoloQ is the only rating that truly shows how good you are because rated arenas you can get carried solo you can’t . Plus rated you can swipe your debit card and get any rating you want. SoloQ is designed to expose the boosted trashcans that’s why I love it lol
@@marcusdddd4285 Well, it's not that easy. For example, as I said, the rating is INCREDIBLY inflated at the moment. And solo Q also favours certain classes over others. For example, you can see multiple DH's above 2400 how have never been close to 2400 in normal 3s. Why is this? Because you get way to much CR to easily (just like RBG when it first came out in 2010 or something) AND because DH can carry a game due to it's dmg being highly tuned, aoe, and have multiple instant CC's to use.
So the only thing you can say is, how good is a DH compared to other DH players in the solo Q ladder. You can't think 'wow this demon hunter must be good because he is 2400 in solo Q' when he has never been over 2.1 in normal 2s/3s AND there are so many DH's over even 2600, being 2400 turns out to be mediocre as a DH, while 2400 might be really high for a boomkin or frost mage for example.
So you can't just say 'solo q shows truly who is good and who isn't. It's not actually that straight forward.
this is such a dumb system. Like you said, if you're playing at your rating then you should be winning roughly half your games. It sucks when you can't get over 4/6 because it'll give you 0 rating(even when you have 3 killing blows and the highest dps), and even if you go 5/6 your rating goes up minimally. ESPECIALLY in a que with randos who have no idea what they're doing. There's no comm system to talk to them and say "hey, come on this spriest" but they zugzug the wwm who is spinning around a pillar and leading them on as a troll. Or triple druids in the que plus an evo. You could go 2/6 and because of the system in place, your rating tanks. But you can't get back up because you had a good streak at the beginning of the season, so even if you win a majority of the matches you get 0 rating; so now everything is literally outside of your control when it should be based on merit. dps, killing blows, and of course wins should be taken into account and it shouldn't be so dependent on randos who suck and your initial rating. You can tell blizz likes the idea of an "average grade", because they probably depended on one when they went to school to develop this pos game.
Can we just get the entirety of the WorldofPvP subreddit to watch this video so we stop getting posts about it every 30 seconds? Thanks Ven, now I have a video to point them to if they're still confused.
After climbing in some solo shuffle games (most 4 wins), I had a lobby as retri only with S tear classes (shadow, unholy, mm hunter & two heals, Druid and Drag). No chance… 😂 I lost all games… And no, it was not me who always died.
As a maybe B class, it‘s crazy to play against only S classes…. 😢
I lost so much cr and mmr….
They need to fix punishing the whole lobby for someone quitting... I won 4/5 and the guy quit on round 6 and the whole lobby got 0 CR
bro. I'm consistently 2k-2.2k with no voice randoms as a healer with little effort........ and I have queue'd solo all day as a prevoker struggling to get 1300. win 5 games, get 3 points. win 2 games, lose 70 points
Me, healer: going 6-0 and no rating changed. Tell me how this is fair. Please tell me. What sort of mental gimnastics to I need do employ for this to seem "fair" in this reality. Lets not fool ourselves, the system is crap and needs fixing.
I understand how it works and it is stupid. There are skilled players at low levels because they are on alts or just decided to start a bit later this season. MMR is a stupid system for a video game.
If you gain nothing from 6-0 it means your Mmr was super low compared to your raiting,you prob lost a lot the last few shuffles so it will increase highly (mmr) even if you gain nothing and the next few games you will gain more ,Like legit just look at those 3 stats and its pretty easy to see what you will need to do
System is working as intend like @mikael Boileau said, you didnt get point but you gain mmr
@@zzzzzz-rn3oh its not stupid. Is one of the best ways to make it somewhat fair. But you have to use some of your brain power to understant it. You are literally commenting under video where he explained it. If you are not gaining much rating for winning it means you belong on rating you are right now or should be lower ( of course depends on enemies rating) if you win a lot good games arrow your actual rating will skyrocket and you will start to get more and more rating for wins. Its simple
Sounds pretty clearly like in the given example you were not only expected to win, but didn't perform as well as you could've. Heals is ranked against the other heals.
Just because you won the round doesn't mean you played better than their healer, fyi. Perhaps the enemy DPS played like absolute dogs etc.
Same story in the wotlk
the system makes sense.. but my god.. not getting any point for gfoing 3 out of six is silly
yes but thats impossible i mean.. ques takes like 1h and when u get a game there will be ppl all from 0 rating to 1700 EVEN if ur on 1700 urself.. so the system is broken..
What's the point?
It's so easy to get fucked over in this system, sometimes people just throw a game and you're completely screwed.
Nice video thanx! But just one thing: when in 4 shuffle in a row (24 matches) you find temmates who think is not important to cc healer, is not your fault. Imho who play shuffle are 60% bored pvers who passing the time waiting teammates for M+. I can understand a bad positioning for average pvper, slowness in momentum, ecc ecc....but if u are pvper u cc healer....no doubt. A champion can survive and carry all of them (expecially healer) but average player like me, lose rating galore.
TLDW; What he wants to say but doesn't want or can't. If you are on a lobby that has lower mmr than your CR is.. just leave at round 5 or 6 because chances are very high you won't get any rating at all. And leaving = -150 rating BUT your MMR will not get touched at all and therfore you can just climb after 1-2 matches very easy. Welcome to Blizzard "esport" and matchmaking. Isn't it great?
what about 3-0 and someone left
i wouldnt mind the system if it didnt require me to win ATLEAST 5/6 rounds to gain half the rating i lose if i go 3/3 some games, the system just feels like a waste of time honestly, the rating win/loss ratio just feels way the fuck off, you would think winning the majority of rounds would give you rating but it just straight doesnt unless its 5/6 or 6/6 for me, your damage or killing blows doesnt seem to matter at all either, terrible ranked system honestly
It's a dumb system, tbh. How do I see "current rating" values?
I win 5 games: I gain 10 rating each or no rating
I lose 1 game: I lose 50 instantly
it's a loop that I can't get out of
this should be common sense
My first 9 battles i had rating 974 i lost a game and i was 830 after that i manage to go 850 every game ai dont earn rating
Like the video, end of it was kida cringe. We all know there is actually approx 300 rating difference between EU and NA. So 2k NA is similar to 1.7k in EU
LMAOOOOOOOOO
ven im playing 2v2 60% win rate and I lose 13 and gain 12 with every game its exhausting to play 2s with this rating gains and loses
This doesnt seem to be the case for healers. I've been in a match 200 under my CR went 1-5 and lost 60 cr. Litterally makes 0 sense.
fucking exactly. Friend sent me this and I was like absolutely BULLSHIT. I went 1-5 because my MMR was 1300 (I know ... healer issues) and theirs were 1000. Because I had people running around like fucking idiots and running out my links and just dying. ZERO CC. It was horrible. I lost nearly 80 rating from that and when I win 3 I get nothing, 4 maybe 10 rating??? Fuck this game
To be clear, I was 1400 CR, Avg. MMR was 1600, i went 1-5 and lost 60.
regulary I agree with everything venruki says but dude, come to EU 1700 in fact is the new 2400 here
all solo shuffle comes down to is if you get a dh or fury warrior on your team and for how many rounds because of the class imbalance this expansion.
thats all solo shuffle is.
But my match matchmaking rating is 2 k, my mmr is 1700 and my cr is 1700. I go 3-3 and its unchanged. so im playing 3-3 against people 300 rating higher than me , and it says unchanged. how the actual fuck am i suppose to climb.
Sounds like chat has been getting carried by gear for the past few expansions.
okay but why my solo shuffle showing RATING 0 even when i win 5-6 rounds
because your current rating and mmr is way higher than the game mmr, that mean you're "supposed" to win 5 to 6 games since you play against lower rating/mmr opponents.
Also even if you gain 0 rating, you still gain mmr who will help in the long run.
MMR > current rating in solo q in every game
Solo S is broken, i allways leave if i dont get 4 + wins. then you dont lose mmr
i play eu and solo q is 50 min per game to just go in as sub and have the guy break all my cc zug zug and fuck me over they don't care about me at the start i was able to get 2270 like a week ago but when i won 5 games the other guy leaves and i get 0 and then i have to wait 50 min q just to have the guy leave if i win or try to fuck with my utility and i am mostly the guy with hightst cr once it paired me up as 2.2 with sb 0 cr an d that is bad. Ppl DC and decline when the q pops it is just a shihole in eu idk about NA
thats kinda true EU > NA and im not even EU fan, its just facts. the ppl in NA take the game less srs thus difficulty is lower at any given mmr mostly
Yes when you are higher and everyone is way lower then winning doesn’t make you go up 😂😂😂😂 just like everything
The issue there is clearly a matchmaking issue as you shouldn't be put in a game where everyone is 200 points lower or something. Maybe at very high mmr where there's no games. If you're 1800 with 1600 lobby I'm wondering why. I played only 6 rounds this whole season and won 5 as disc so this isn't personal lol I've just seen it and read about it.
@@7128jml While i completely agree, we already lack healers and the queue time is already so long.
Plus the fact that WoW PvP has always been a minigame who lacks a large pool enough of players.
Ajusting the matchmaking to fit more accuratly your current rating to have more "gains or loses" of rating would also implies waiting 2x/3x the current queue time we have as dps (personnaly beetween 10 to 20 minutes at any time given around 1k9 cr)
3v3 solo shuffle is problematic-queue timers/team comps. If Blizzard wants to save this game make 2v2 solo shuffle and new rated pvp game types. This game will only then reclaim the throne
I'm at 467. Do I deserve to be at 467?
The worst matchmaking in the entire game, you win 3 and usually get 0, you win 2 you insta lose 50+ , you win 4 you get less than 30 and you gotta win 5+ to get 50+ , someone leaves you get 0 even after the changes. Worst system in the game
feels wrong you can go 6-0 and get 0 rating ;-/, tilted me too
So basically you always wanna win so you're always winning