Good point. I did want to include it under Bethesda because I think it fit in the category better. New Vegas has a pretty close design philosophy to a Bethesda game even though Bethesda's own Fallout games aren't as good. Comparing it to something like Outer Worlds I think that game wasn't open enough to really capture the New Vegas feeling, and I haven't played most of their other games to be able to separate them or give them their own section.
A well done open world can be mind-blowing. A bad or mediocre open world will end up feeling like a chore. And I play games after chores not to keep doing them
I think your right, I feel like Bethesda and Rockstar games had to do a lot with that. The GTA series is basically the most successful AAA series of games and elder scrolls games kept growing from the 90s.
But there's an argument that the quality of the content will necessarily be lower in an open world game because if you have the same resources for a linear game vs an open world one, some of the resources in the OW will be spent on side or filler content to populate the world with tasks, meaning the main quest will have less dedicated resources than in a linear game. The only way to alleviate it would be to pour more time and resources into the open world, and I've yet to see one which has been done without that problem, no matter the resources.
@@lapelcelery42 I think it depends what you want out of game. Really linear games feel artificial which can take people out of the experience because of the limitations or weird barriers the game puts up to stop the player. In other words less can lead to more
@@pleasedontwatchthese9593 I agree with that, but I don't think the Souls series in particular had any troubles there before, and the open world has been a step backward for them IMHO. Also, because your message finished with the word "more" on it's own line on my phone, I spent about a minute trying to click it to show me more text.
I loved how RDR2 had so many hidden stories, quests, and Easter eggs which weren’t marked on the map. It gave me a reason to explore as much of the world as I possibly could
I was going to say the same thing. RDR2 is a really good open world game, I enjoyed it even tho I don't usually like these kind of games, I get too distracted and end up losing interest
Breath of the Wild really was the most focused open world game ever, just because it made the open world the gameplay itself. And it‘s ironic since none of the big developers like Ubisoft ever achieved something like this, but Nintendo, who usually dont make open worlds, just came in and said "you're all doing this wrong!"
@Robert E. Speedwagon "oh look, another Intelligence based spell, perfect, just what I needed for my Dex Faith build..." I'm not attacking or anything, just mentioning that ER's sense of discovery isn't necessarily a step above without its own set of flaws.
@Robert E. Speedwagon This was done on purpose. The empty space in Breath of the Wild is crucial to its tone. Beyond the logistics of a post-apocalypse wiping much of the world out, the empty space is where the game really hammers home the beauty of nature juxtaposed alongside the tragedy of loss. It's a melancholic beauty, serenity born out of pain, and the best moments in Breath of the Wild let me soak that atmosphere in. The title is indicative of this. The developers want the players to pause, they want you to take it in. It's a kind of mood that I don't often see struck nowadays, with games, especially AAA games, constantly clawing for attention with quick hits of dopamine.
@@brycebitetti1402 The empty space is ok, but just because it's mostly empty doesn't mean it has to be mostly pointless like it is in BoTW. You can make irrelevant open space just to be "Pretty" and to show the themes of the game, but that can be done in a more focused space. I don't like being swarmed by contacts like in GTA 5 but the open world of the last Zelda was luckluster, the fact that your imagination fills in that gaping void is not a strength of the game but of yourself.
@@formlessoedon3929 You have the potential of finding something useful (ie for your particular build) which each thing you find in Elden Ring. The same cannot be said about BOTW. The fact the weapons break so easily makes you don't even want to use the cool weapons you find. And even then, they are just weapons that all play out more or less the same. In ER, a different weapon or ash of war can change the entire way your character plays.
The things to find in botw becomes repetitive after 30 hours The beauty of the game’s open world isn’t the emptiness or what you find It’s the interactiveness of the world and the many ways you can play with it. It can be the elements,the physics engine,link’s mobility,the amount of details on how the world can affect you is great. You can be in death mountain and cook food just with the temperature of the area while you burn to death lol Elden ring is better at rewarding the player for the stuff they find but botw is better at world interaction immersiveness. One isn’t better than the other,they both can learn from each other
@@pedrol5004I am a huge zelda fan and yeah the story is great, but the plot is simple. you just have to find the stories yourself through subtext ( the buildings, the people). people cant really tell between story and plot imo.
God I loved Subnautica. The sense of exploration you get when discovering new parts of the map, the mystery, the dread, the intrigue. While I personally didn't find it that scary, I still had a blast exploring the map and learning about all the creatures, and other bits of story and lore. Not to mention the fact that it simply looks gorgeous and truly feels alive
I never really viewed Dying Light (one of my favorite games of all time) as an open world game, but rather a zombie parkour game. I felt a sense of progression, and that was my main focus throughout the game: Can I wander the night without fear? _(Please don't hurt the puppy!)_
In my eyes dying light is the (much better) spiritual successor to Dead Island/Riptide. I loved those games as a kid for the kinda b-movie funny and genuine arcadey fun. Some of the devs from dead island worked on Dying Light, and it feels like theyve really made something great. The dead island game of my dreams as a kid (:
The thing that BoTW, Elden Ring, and Xenoblade games do in which the map starts blank and thinks only fill out once the player actually explores and finds the points of interest in that location should honestly be an open world industry standard. There's not much fun to be had in exploring an already filled out and marked up map. Even if the things to find are still "checklist-y" in nature, there's a lot more joy to be found with "Easter Egg Hunting" than "Grocery Shopping" so to speak.
Really I found it annoying especially in botw , especially when there’s so much to do, it felt fun at first but then it started feeling hollow not finding or figuring out how to do puzzles so I’d look things up and after a while of spending an hour on one shrine (when you need 4 shrines to get a heart or stamina) it felt like a waste of time when it’s only 1of 120 shrines , then the Korok seeds felt fun at first I got around 70 and I thought maybe there’s a 100 more then come to find out there’s 770 something seeds I thought what’s the point most of them they are Copy and pasted and there’s no switch up of dialog or voice lines/phrases so it felt really lazy , then the lack of towns , adventuring felt like a chore like “oh I wonder what’s at the top of that mountain” guess what a shrine or korok seed and then you get in the shrine oh another test of strength for the 12th time , oh a new puzzle boy I can’t wait to figure it out oh wait it’s an awful motion puzzle where your fighting the motion controls rather than the actual puzzle , oh wait a themed shrine here’s the exact same skin as the the past 119 shrines, get to the the divine beasts , a cool boss? Nah copy an paste big bad, cool new enemies late game?nah same enemy just a shiny skin, new outpost? Nah just the same old stable tent, cool sidequest?nah get 20 frogs for dude with no consequence effecting the world , cool dragon?how bout 3 of them reskinned , cool champions? Well there dead , cool current warriors? Nah you’ll speak to them for the divine beats quest and then they’ll say the same line of dialog from then on out
This make ABSOLUTELY ZERO sense, as it's LITERALLY how EVERY other open world game works. 😂🤣 There is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING different in those regards in comparison to how basically EVERY other open-world game works.
Tho it is a nice way to do it, I find more engaging having the map unfolded but the content in it is not, and that part is locked until I reach certain secret mission or main mission so I had a reason to explore the world. Else I just go st4reight to the end of the story. Sort of like NFS U" did with parts of the map not being available at the start
I pre-ordered and played Elden Ring day one of launch and beat it with a friend. We would explore while in a discord call and share what we learned and what weapons we would get. But we wouldn’t spoil story or bosses unless we asked each other for information. Filling out that map and going “Dude the first area is big, but go South and it DOUBLES the size!” It continued like that for a while. Finding the underground, finding Caylid, then finding Liurnia of the Lakes, and just having the entire world expand and unfold. It was awesome and an experience I wouldn’t trade for anything. It taught me to not look anything up in a game unless I got really frustrated and the game was becoming unenjoyable without looking something up. Knowing nothing and finding out > looking things up to finish the game. Played 100 hours in a fucking week. It was bodacious.
Elden ring didn't actually invent it instead they reminded us of this old school style of an open world where the game isn't afraid to hide stuff and allow you to miss things An example of that is morrowind And by the way, we need more of these kinds of open-world games
Another example of that is also Dragon Warrior. The original. Old school games were savage. You’d talk to literally everyone you could multiple times and scan every available space.
I definitely like Bethesda's take on the open world genre. Mainly because you're not locked into a mission once you start it, like GTA or Assassin's Creed. There is no "desynchronization" when going too far from an objective. You can do any quest whenever you want, and once you start them, you don't even have to finish them. You can just leave halfway through. Also major content isn't locked behind the storyline, for the most part at least.
Skyrim really was the last game by BGS I truly enjoyed and got sucked into. Fallout 4, while I had been more excited for that game than probably anyone (I was obsessed with Fallout up to that point), just didn't scratch the same itch and clearly 76 and Starfield are both just disasters. Don't look forward to TES6 cause you'll be let down I promise.
"The open world IS the game" hits so hard right now, I've just been playing Subnautica and just going out into the open world is part of the challenge and fun. Making sure you've got the resources to get where you want to go, but also get back. Exploration is central to everything in the game.
Death Stranding changed my approach to open world games, the map itself is now for me (on every open world I play, even those I played years ago) another character, is now the game itself, where the fun and challenge is, a powerful story telling tool, before Death Stranding, the map was just the place I could put my character in and not fall into the void called skybox. Loved and thanked Death Stranding for that.
This is btw what made EverQuest and EverQuest Online Adventures (The PS2 Version of EQ) so amazing, then WoW went and messed everything up just like Ubisoft messed up the single player open world. It was all about the sense of exploration, danger, finding that rare monster and rare loot drop. Not anymore... now it's a dayum themepark!!!!!
Interestingly, I loved to explore Egypt in Assassin's Creed Origins, just for the sake of exploring. The rewards were meaningless, some quests were nice, but climbing the pyramids or finding an alien like structure out in the desert was really amazing! I wouldn't want to do that all over again, though....
I seriously have more fun running around in the optional no-combat educational tour mode at my own pace than I do in the “well you’re arbitrarily not a high enough level to have fun in this part of the map yet” main game.
I love Shadow Of The Colossus. It makes this entire world, that it doesnt even want you to explore. You can gather fruit to get more health, or hunt chameleons for more stamina. To complete it, though, you only need to kill every Colossi. Like you said about Elden Ring, everything is optional. I loved SOTC.
sotc is seriously a flawless game. and the fact ico was able to pull off the things they did back in 2005 on the ps2 is fuckin insane. it will always be my favorite game of all time. the world is so mystical and expansive. everything is so carefully constructed even though most of the world is useless its fuckin insane. like you can climb into the garden and walk all across the giant bridge
It's interesting to me how SOTC seems like a deconstruction of open world games but done long before they blew up in popularity because all there is to do is kill Colossi and find lizards and apples to increase your health and stamina and the only reward for doing this is access to an area that has nothing of note in it other than fruit that leaves you stuck there forever. It's a giant, gorgeous open world on the surface, but underneath it's just window dressing on a very linear game that tells you exactly where the only thing of interest is. I adore the game, it's probably one of my top 10 games, and the emptiness of the world and its accidental commentary on how most open world games are made is honestly one of my favorite things about it.
For me the difference between good open worlds and bad open worlds are: 1. Environmental storytelling - In Fallout/Skyrim you can find out about an NPC by rummaging through his belongings. A picture frame, a letter in the drawer, a hidden basement, a necklace with dark magic. Bad open world games don't have that attention to detail because their buildings are just there to look at. Some buildings even have a painted door and you can't actually enter. 2. Handcrafted side quests - Megaton in Fallout, the Bloody Baron in Witcher 3. Bad open world games don't have these types of side quests, they have repetitive padding like collect 200 feathers.
@@One.Zero.One101Agreed if the open world has lore its good if i saw an house while exploring and find out that the house actually belongs to someone or has some connection to the story then i like it but when things are just present in open world it just feels empty and less engaging
You spoke directly to my soul on this video. I remember when I was playing Farcry 5 and tried to set up a barricade of cars in front of a farm I holed up in just for fun. The cars just kept disappearing at a certain point and I realized the game was just open world for no reason. The cars werent there to set up barricades, they were there to drive you from one cookie cutter outpost to another and thats it. Meanwhile, in Skyrim, my wife just spent the afternoon dragging all the dead bodies in Dawnstar into the ocean because 7 years ago she got caught stealing and she was tired of looking at all the bodies whenever she went to town.
@@matthewbreytenbach4483 i did this too because my shit was in their chest and i couldn't take it back without facing high-level NPCs, which i could do if the action or RPG side of skyrim as actually fecking developed to let me take on a threat above my level, but because skyrim is skyrim, even if i COULD, they wouldn't fucking die. oh and i was on PS3 so "setownership player" wasn't a thing i could do
The key is to make an open world game with a clear primary objective, mildly clear secondary objectives, and unclear tertiary objectives. Additionally, players need flexible gameplay and freedom to affect the world in positive, negative, and neutral ways.
I like how BOTW didn’t dump quest markers upon receiving map pieces. Just marks them upon discovery/activation. That shit overwhelms me, sometimes to the point I drop real early. Just hide the stuff from me, so it’ll almost always feel fresh to explore.
Idk if it was just me, but climbing a mountain and seeing a cool landmark or a shrine/tower was so interesting and made me want to explore more than a big icon ever would.
Okie botw does this well but like is it just me or is everyone acting like this is revolutionary for botw and Elden ring when even games like Skyrim were doing it years ago. You play Skyrim from the beginning and the only things marked on your map at the start are the capital cities which makes sense and any map marker for a quest you have activated and you can also turn that off if the player wants to. You only unlock markers for let’s say a cave in Skyrim when you travel near the location of the cave and then unlock it on your map which is exactly the same as a game like Elden ring. Yet apparently Elden ring has changed open world games forever and has ruined the old ones, I don’t get it man I must be not seeing what everyone else does. The amount of comments I see saying that ER or BOTW put games like Skyrim to shame is maddening considering Skyrim does practically the same thing and so do many other open world games. The only difference I’d say is that games like botw and er do a better job at hiding there repetitive nature and I’m not even sure that’s a good thing. Sometimes it’s nice to know what your getting into so you can avoid the content you don’t want to do and choose the good stuff in the game to do.
@@TheWrongPerspective hiding repetitiveness is pretty good actually because you don’t get bored of it. Also I didn’t see many comments saying that ER and BOTW are putting Skyrim to shame just how good BOTW and ER are. And I gotta say I agree with them. Being able to explore freely is absolutely stunning doing whatever you want and since you can just simply go back to the main quest is also awesome. And it’s not just plain exploration everything you explore contributes to many things as well. It’s not just some lame trophy after hours of doing something it’s something that feels like it was 100% worth it
@@TheWrongPerspective and technically the repetitive nature in both games are still in some things so technically you still know what your getting into but there’s many things outside the main quest to explore that gives you experience to many other things
My first open world experience was Oblivion. Those memories will forever be engrained in my mind, it was the perfect escape from life and at the time was one of a kind. I really miss the feeling games from 15 years ago used to give me. There was so much hope and hype for upcoming titles, with giant leaps being made at such a fast pace. The fact that we got Oblivion, Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, Skyrim, Red Dead and GTAV all in the same console generation is crazy to me. I think the moment I started to reel in my expectations was when Destiny 1 released. The hype for it was unreal, all to get smacked in the mouth with disappointment, and even more disappointing games followed year after year. Beloved franchises like CoD and Halo started to decline, remakes and remasters became the norm instead of pushing new IPs. What was once a love for making videogames has become a lucrative greedy business. It really does upset me how many game developers and publishers have fallen from grace. I hope in the next decade we see less unfinished games being released, and more passion-fueled and ambitious projects getting the green light
@@thelel6591 Haha, the Super Nintendo era was the best but maybe that’s nostalgia. PS2 days were big (was that during the 360 time as well? I didn’t do Xbox) The jump from PS1 to 2 felt like the beginning of the good polygon graphics. Things didn’t look like blocky crap. and Super Nintendo 16 but still hold up today.
Most of my favorite games ever were from 2005-2010. Everything started to fall in the 2010s as you said. I only look for specific indie titles and older games now, as I also have less time to spend on games these days. My favorite game is Dragon Age Origins, which I discovered much later. Since then I can't really stand open world games, I don't feel a sense of excitement in exploring an open world anymore tbh.
This topic resonates with me. When I said around 6 years ago to my gamer friends that most of the open world games are boring and that not every single game needs to be open just for the sake of being open, they were having a laugh about it. Nowadays, I think most of them are coming to the same realization. Great video btw. It really blew you up ;)
After hearing how great it was, I was surprised to play Assassin’s Creed and be confronted with dull missions and check lists. It was so unfun. Thought it was only me, but thank god the hate is shared
Which AC game did you play? I've heard really terrible things about the newest AC games and I wonder if its just the formula doesnt hold up or if the new games are much worse.
@@GhostEmblem Odyssey and Unity. Both just dull. Ironically, I’d like to make a game that has bustling towns but this was one of the reasons that put me off, albeit a minor one. The games with emptier scenes invite you to explore more and feel far less cluttered
Bet you it was the more recent ones. The earliest games are more story focused so there just isn't enough content to make a checklist. Feathers be damned of course...
I am struggling through them. On brotherhood now and am starting to just do the main quests. The rest is getting tedious. Do like the tomb searching (followers of Romulus I believe). But overall I don't think I can continue much longer. At the very least I need a break.
@@LOTRFAN33 You should go for the armour only if you really want it, it's really unnecessary otherwise. Only in AC2 it makes more sense to get hung up over not having it. AC is really not a series where you want to do "Sidequests" first, it really makes no sense. They were made with the idea that side missions would be done on occasion to not have to do all story missions one by one.
Btw, I also found you after the ER video because I watched Joe Anderson's analysis and wanted to see other peoples takes. I was surprised and delighted to find that not only did you have similar issues with the game and went into depth, it was also a very articulate and nuanced critique. Same for the other media videos on your channel. So I for one would love to see more media analysis / long form essays from you. Let's not kid ourselves, the market for both media critique and broad-topic commentary is highly saturated on YT right now, so....yeah anywayyys
I’m planning on doing a mix of both if the algorithm gods find that pleasing. If I have strong opinions on something you can bet I’m making a video about it. And these broader topic videos serve to fill the gaps so I upload more than once every two months
I get so exhausted of open world games. Fetch quests, defeat x amount of enemies, clear this base, rinse and repeat. Elden Ring and The Witcher 3 were the only ones that stood out to me that I actually finished in the past 8 years.
Thats mmorpg...what other games beside mmorpg got kill x enemy, then other x enemy loops? And fetch quest..well thats in every game..always need to go from A to B back to A or C to do stuff..thats called objective.
I prefer linear gameplay overall because I’m a completionist and when trophies are involved ultimately there’s a most efficient path to every game. I have anxiety when there’s choices that affect the route or may have me miss items. I don’t really have time or desire to replay games I don’t love.
Yes I am a linear person. Make the game hard as hell. Make me choose maybe 1 or two paths to get there and that's it. I don't have 30 hours to put into a game anymore. It's not fun having to travel back and forth. I want to finish the game and move on. There's this sense that you have to keep playing a game. It's annoying. I play games to win at the end.
Not sure if you have yet but I would absolutely recommend going for the platinum in Astro's Playroom for PS5. Has to be one of the best games on that platform so far. Just so much fun and getting that platinum just felt necessary. Along with Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, a bit too short for me but still fun.
I wonder how you would classify the open world in Yakuza games. I wouldn't say they're perfect but they're done well. It kinda feels like they created their own formula of open world. You're in a small district with shops, restaurants, a bunch of play spots (minigames) and lots of side quests. You fight punks, help someone find their cat, then go drinking and sing karaoke, and next you're getting involved in some serious political drama. There's a strong virtual tourism aspect that I personally enjoy. It's like your time in Kamurocho is a trip to Japan's real life Kabukicho and you're enjoying the things it has to offer, both good and bad. It's not realistic (as in the way npcs react and the games do feel very videogame-y) but the district itself is pretty well represented.
yeah i wonder what his take on the yakuza open world is bc like. there’s mission markers to every bit of story i suppose but by far my favourite thing in these games is to just wander around and stumble upon a silly substory and a massive hidden minigame that was just kinda. there for some reason? and it was really fun (for example yakuza 6 spearfishing minigame) like it has nothing to do with the overarching plot but it’s just There and it helps you really emphasise with kiryu as just a human if ygm. also i love how small scale but crazy dense kamurocho is and it feels SO immersive to just walk around and go ‘hm i wanna go bowling’ gosh it’s a really fun open world imo
Yakuza Zero was my first 'open-world' game in 2020 and I loved it. I live in Korea and have been to Japan a fair few times, so during Covid, it was a kind of release to wonder around such a beautifully-designed, accurate city and feel like you're there. The mini-games, like you say, are addictive and you can just play them for a few hours. The random meetings and side-quests were excellent too. After finishing that I went onto Yakuza 6, and again, great. I got lost playing pool and doing the trick shots for money for hours. Loved it, like the first one. Around that time my brother mentioned RDR2, which is another simply stunning world. I've explored it so much and I know the story twist, so I'm just going around before that particular part..... So I should finish it really, but I.....erm....you know....no spoilers.... I'm not into massively zombie/monster/archaic worlds and those kind of shoot 'em ups, so the Yakuza and RDR2 worlds are perfect for me.
ain't nooooooo way this guy is putting Ghost of fuckin Tsushima into the "games like Ubisoft category" edit: ignore everything i just said the puppy is cute
My favorite thing about botw came about because I was playing it at the same time as four of my roommates. One switch, everyone on their own account, all at the same time. We were basically taking turns every day playing this game, and two of them ended up getting their own switch and copy of the game at some point. But what stuck out was hiw everyone navigated the world and played the game differently. We were constantly finding out new things from each other, or when somebody would be stuck on a puzzle we'd all have different solutions. One friend was focused on finding out the history and exploring the ruins of the game, another just wanted to fill out the picture compendium, another still spent all her time obsessively catching and releasing horses, and finally my other friend just wanted to fuck around and find out, resulting in the funniest pictures of lionels I've ever seen. By far the best gaming experience I've ever had, and I wasn't even playing it most of the time!
The "mission select" thing you mentioned at 16:16 would be amazing for a superhero game to where they could have smaller semi-open missions like Hitman and call them "issues" or "arcs"; it'd be huge for replay value, speedrunning, and even DLC later on
Shadow of Mordor/War has so much more than just the Ubisoft open world system. You build an army of orcs by exploring the open world so that you can complete the missions, and the nemesis system is an amazing way to create side stories and explain why you respawn. They are so much more than running from mission to mission endlessly
It really isn't though. I just played the first one for the first time, and it was... fine? Story was short yet felt bloated and underutilised. Gameplay was fun but was literally just the Arkham combat system. Side content was a ubisoft collectathon that didn't really add anything to the experience and I only did them when I needed more points for upgrades. I'll give kudos to the two maps being rather small. The nemesis system was the only interesting part of the game, but even that felt like a slog at times. Had fun with that system though, and the game is at its best when it encourages you to play around with it.
The reason why the shadow games are categorized as a Ubisoft game it's because, in my understanding, the only focus is on fighting. Even the nemesis system (which I love) is for fighting. You can't do anything else but fight. The collectibles, apart from a bit of lore and exp, are pretty useless. I love both shadow games, but they really are just games focusing on killing. That's not to say that they are bad, far from it. But in a sense, they are somewhat basic, in the context of the video.
My problem with open world games is this: A big motivating factor in me playing a game is seeing what's next. Within a few hours of starting an open world game, you've seen 95 percent of the mission types and environments and there is little mystery. AC Odyssey, origins, and GTA 4 are good examples of open worlds that still leave something interesting to be discovered as a carrot. It's also tedious in those games and every open world to check the map every mission and multiple times per mission. As I get older, I don't want to stress over the best order to do everything while trudging through filler. In linear games, you don't know what the next environment or mission type is going to be, keeping me guessing like a good book. It's also a lot more focused. The core single player story of most open worlds is still around 6-15 hours like in the 360 era but there's so much more filler to balloon the "size" of the game.
Interesting you called Odessey a good example, i think its an amazing recreation of Greece (something all the AC games are good at, with the understandable distortion) but i got bored very quickly (the area right after you get off tutorial island) because i realized the entire game was going to just be this slog of fake progression and i had a hundred hours of chores to do just to get the story out of this game. Black Flag on the other hand was amazing and i could happily sail around the Caribbean being a pirate for hours making actual progress on upgrading my ship and ignoring the main missions. (I think my primary driver to do the missions was the elimination of those fog walls saying you can't go here until you advance the main story)
Totally with you - I couldn't even enjoy BotW because I'm so burned out on the open world stuff. I want my linear titles back, or something like GoW which is kind of linear with some degree of choice
Linear games with rpg mechanics are probably my favorite genre. Nothing else matters to me, sci Fi, fantasy, first/third person, action adventure etc. If you have a well thought out linear game with rpg mechanics added for gameplay variety, choices and replayability it will always be better than some open world checklist with a story you don't even care about and boring shallow gameplay.
The ubisoft game that actually has a fantastic open world is immortals fenyx rising. As you explore there are hidden puzzles and activities as well as cut scenes. I am a huge fan of this game because you can just keep exploring.
I cant belive I've finally found the answer to one of the most frustrating questions my friends would always ask me. "Why do you like this open world game but not this one?" This entire video is exactly why! I could never put it into words untill I saw this video 🙏
Shadow of the Colossus is my absolute favorite game, both for the presentation, narrative, and experiences it provides and also for personal childhood escapism reasons. But the empty, barren open world save for scattered wildlife and plant life really adds to the sense of mystery and melancholy to it all. I'd say as far as ice cream goes, it's one of those cursed SpongeBob ice creams. It's inherently kind of sad, but it's still really enjoyable
Best thing of shadow of the colossus for me is the simplicity. No levels, no experience, no grind, no magic, no bullshit. Just you, a sword, a bow and a horse. And a lot of giants to slay
A counter to your Ubisoft like games point. Is that without the open world even if it’s boring the game would feel incomplete without it. Spider man needs building to swing on without them it makes no sense. Jin sakai needs the island of Tsushima in order to understand the world and his connections to his people. Also the Ghost of Tsushima disrespect is CRAZY.
I love the effort put into this ice cream video. The use of open-world video games as an analogy to describe different flavors of sweet goodness is brilliant.
While not extremely open world, Fable is a nice change of pace from other open worlds, especially Fable II. While limited to mainly exploring and combat rather than crafting and other open-world concepts, it always provided an expansive world where I could spend hours doing something as silly as an a-press simulator (ie chopping wood), simply for the peace I could feel watching the in-game days go by.
I disagree with the opinion that Elden Ring's exploration only works on the first playthrough. I'm on my 6th or 7th play through and am still finding so many secrets and suprises that I have never found previously, even after extensively exploring the map before
You explained really well some of my feelings on BotW's open world. To this day that is my #1 favorite open world I have explored in. None of my friends agree with me, and I understand why; many of their criticisms were that the world was too empty or lifeless. I didn't feel that way at all. To me it was a world that was basically my sandbox. I was able to explore whatever I wanted whenever I wanted, approach a new area from any angle and create my own stories and gameplay around it wholly unique to me. I fell in love with Nintendo's incredible landmark skills; every time I reached a new area I would see something else on the horizon that looked interesting or cool, and I would make my way to it. There are so many unique biomes and structures to find in that world that I put nearly 100 hours in before I saw it all, and I probably still missed some places here or there. THAT is the kind of open world that draws me in the most, and I would love to have some more games created that way in the future.
For me, it was that it felt empty in a way that doesn't make sense for a nation that should quite well know that Calamity Ganon is coming back for Round 2 sooner rather than later. The world was okay, but the characters didn't feel like they were living in the same world as the story. Like, we never even find out what the current Hyrulian government is, now that the royal family that ruled the inter-species coalition had vanished for a century, especially when a decently sized faction of one of those races is really pissed off at their former(?) rulers.
@@renren47618 I mean, the Zora have a kingdom and the Gorons are like, a mining company/"city" of some sort. Kakariko Village is run by Sheikah who would know that the Calamity is coming but are largely doing nothing except waiting for Link to save them even while the Yiga Clan is running around unchecked, the Hylian majority Hateno Village has a mayor (and Purah who has apparently not told anyone about the incoming Calamity for some reason) like the also Hylian Lurelin Village, with no indication as to whether or not there is any sort of official relationship between one another or the societies of the other races that made up old Hyrule. I guess the Yiga Clan has a society, too, sort of, though we only see their three room apartment and no explanation as to why they aren't constantly working alongside Ganon's monsters, the corrupted Guardians, and the ancient Sheikah tech that they split from the rest of the tribe rather than lose. By all implications, the Yiga Clan should be an entire army of ninjas using Sheikah Tech 10,000+ years more advanced than anything the Amish Sheikah have access to, since they are just repairing stuff that was made that long ago while the Yiga should have been innovating the entire time. Oh, and Tarrey Town is a corporate town run by Bolson's Carpenters, I guess? They were very nebulous as to what the governing system there actually was.
@@lnsflare1 Yeah, true Maybe the Hylians that once lived in the capital where the Royal Familly was got completely destroyed and now each remaining societies has their own political system
Agreed. I get "open world fatigue" every time I'm near the end of an open world game. Open world games like Morrowind, New Vegas etc were great when they came out years apart and were rare (and I couldn't afford to buy all the games I wanted, so a game that I could spend a lot of time in was very cost effective), but when everything is an open world game it just gets tedious. I am loving Elden Ring, but I will be very ready for a different kind of game when I'm done with it.
I agree. As ive gotten older ive started to notice how little i care for open world and also how impatient i am with games pacing. I would much prefer a really tight and fast experience than an open world that feels like a chore to navigate with boring side objectives
If you want unique open world experiences I'd recommend checking out the Xenoblade series if you haven't yet. They're made by Monolith Soft the co developer of Breath of the Wild and feel very different from that game as well. X in particular has one of the most realized alien worlds I've seen in a game with an insane amount of customizability and traversal options to boot. Since that game is stuck on the Wii U it's kind of inaccessible, but the main series, while technically more segmented open worlds IMO, is just as good. I can't wait to play 3 and that earlier release date has me giddy.
@@Succer X is still one of the most impressive games in the series with a completely open world, not just a bunch of big zones like 3 has. It also has some really fun on foot and mech traversal as well. After I think chapter 3 you can literally go anywhere on the map at your own pace. It does take a while to get the mechs though, 30+ hours into the game. The gameplay is similar to Xenoblade 1's, but the customization is absurd. The main character has 16 classes they can master and when you master them you can use their arts and skills with other classes. Not to mention the mech customization is insane as well. The one downside to the game is that because it focuses on exploration the main story is probably the weakest in the series, the side content and world building on the other hand is some of the strongest in the series. X is a very big game and if you want to ease yourself into the series I'd start with the numbered games over it. I believe it took the play testers of X 300+ hours to beat the game, and my typical playthrough of it is usually 150+ hours.
This video explained my burnout when it comes to videogames, and why i have left so many games unfinished. Articulating my own thinking and feel of some games into words for me, better than i could have done myself. Great video!
Outer Wilds has one of the most beautiful open worlds I've seen in video games, delivering an experience I wish to erase from my memory to play for the first time again
@@vibevizier6512 honestly i agree, is so different from everything I play to actually categorize it, but Open World seemed like a good enoug description
OpenWorld, Exploring, Mystery, Puzzle. I wish there are more games like this, Feel like some grand treasure hunt mystery. You don't get stronger in Outer Wilds like general game. You just know more about the world you explore. The game design here is so different.
I actually like every game you mentioned. They are all open world games but appeal to different people in different ways. Its like a road trip. Some people just want to get to the destination, others want to stop at every tourist trap, and others are just enjoying the scenery along the way. As long as you are enjoying yourself. I'm an old man though, so I still think like I did in the 90s and appreciate games like Horizon Zero Dawn and Skyrim for what they offer and the technical feats. I did have to push through Spider Man though, I agree, I wish there was more to interact with in New York City of all places.
Well said. The problem is that "giant open map" has mostly become just a marketing checkbox, something to be duct-taped onto any game with the budget to allow it. To actually implement it well though, requires it to be the foundation of the entire development process. It's not unlike planning a D&D campaign, where you can plot out the most epic storyline imaginable, but because of the scope of the world and the breadth of what players might decide to try and do, every path must either lead somewhere interesting directly, or drop crumbs towards one. Not a perfect parallel of course, as the DM is also free to add things in the moment, but it's more similar than one might think. Aside from Minecraft, which is kind of in its own category entirely and not really fair to compare anything else to, I think Breath of the Wild is probably the best example by far of this design philosophy. You can wander out into the most random, desolate area of the map, look to the horizon and start turning the camera, and 99.9% of the time SOMETHING cool will catch your eye and a new little personal quest has begun. As big (and sometimes sparse) as the map is, not an inch of it is what I would call "wasted" or "filler".
I've started referring to a lot of open world games as scavenger hunt games. Even Breath of the Wild was one leaving me with a relatively poor impression. While it was better than other scavenger hunt games it was lackluster compared to other Zelda games, in my opinion at least. Elden Ring I really liked.
What else other than that. He 100% knows that those games aren't similar. 1 and 2 are different from every game but not only are they the minority, they're completely forgotten by now because they've been drowned out by far cry 3, 4, primal, 5 and 6
@@yuyualtikriti5746 dont talk unless u played em cuz far cry 2 is a classic that should be remembered for its unique ideas and hardcore gameplay, unlike games today far cry 2 didnt hold ur hand and many games should learn from that
Problem for me is you’re always ALONE.. and most of the space is empty or everything trying to kill you. No sense of wonder. Games like guardian of the galaxy was fun to me because you always have your team with you and the banter was funny.
Man, I really love Death Stranding. While it has a severe lack of interesting things to do and the mechanics other than traversing the environment are quite underdeveloped (imo), the whole thing is just so chill. It's like going on a walk in the woods, or an RV holiday, or a very long drive - nothing especially stimulating, but a nice relaxed break from stimulation. It's all just travelling from A to B, fetch questing, but there's just some combination of the terrain mechanics, the scenery and the atmosphere with minimal intrusive elements that elevates it from flavorless bread to delightful cheese on toast. It's just comfy, more comfy than a game has ever been.
I agree. I didn't quite click with the more engaging elements like combat or the more mechanically driven missions. I got my fun out of the atmosphere and traversal, but my poor attention had me dropping it when I wanted something more. It's why I think I love Red Dead so much, is that I can have that relaxing gameplay and spend hours in it, but then jump back in to some engaging missions or exciting gameplay when I want to.
I got the game right around the time the pandemic really got going in 2020, and at the time I was a doordash courier which was classified as essential in my area so I continued working while almost everyone else was locked away in their homes, and the world was suddenly so empty. In those early days, before the virus had been studied sufficiently to determine what precautions were necessary to prevent spreading it, there was almost a supernatural quality to it, an invisible monster that could strike at any time and our only defense was just making our best guess at how to stay safe. There was a constant anxiety that gnawed at me everytime I made a delivery, wondering if that would be the one that got me infected but having no choice since without the income I couldn't survive. It was absolutely uncanny how much the real world suddenly felt like the world of Death Stranding. The atmosphere, at least for me, was almost an exact match, and my job only added to that. Death Stranding's story of struggling to overcome such an oppressive world with an unknowable enemy and connect with others was exactly what I needed. It kept me going when I was losing hope.
I like how lower-budget studios descope games from open world into linear games so money isn’t wasted and players don’t have to deal with a subpar open world experience. Sniper Ghost Warrior is an example I can think of. It turned from driving cars to objective markers and liberating camps to completing important objectives in small/medium maps
What I don't like about BOtW and RDR2 is the complete lack of compelling gameplay. At no point did I feel challenged or like I was getting better at the game. It was just one useless mechanic after another. I stopped caring about the stupid random dialogue from NPCs, I didn't want to read the 192 piece of paper I found. The games started to remind me of actual life, a long boring chore for no reason. I don't talk to random people on the sidewalk because I don't care, I don'r read every book I see because I don't have the time and a lot of them suck. People seem to like these games because of the quantity of content; unfortunately, only about 10% of that content is good, the rest is just pointless filler. That's my problem with many open world games; they don't respect my time. Just because you have content doesn't mean I'm having fun having to sit through it.
The thing about RDR2 is it’s a great open world built around an amazing story and cast of characters and probably one of the greatest single game protagonists of all time… Elden Ring is amazing in such a completely different way which makes it so unique. Nice vid man. Just subbed
Could you make a video of YOUR perfect Open World game and what would YOU put in it. What new things would you add? I know in this one you say which Open World formulas you like already, but make a video where you take all the stuff from different games you like and add your own ideas to make the Greatest Open World out there… Great commentary!!
I still think RGG studios has one of the best open world formulas for their Yakuza/Like a Dragon and Judgement series. It is fundamentally an open world but where so many open world games focus on big expansive worlds, the cities in RGG games are small but densely packed and this gives so much more character to the world. If you dropped me into Kamurocho I could navigate by memory alone, can I say the same for any far cry game?
Outer Wilds is by far the greatest game of all time that not nearly enough people have played (probably because they all think The Outer Worlds is the same game). It has pretty much everything you said an open world should have; an interesting world that's fun to explore without a whole bunch of empty space or reused content. Everything that's in the game has some purpose and interaction with the world, and yet designed in a way that still makes it feel like it exists without you having to be a part of it. The entire game is literally built on the idea that your exploration is the driving force for your progression, so there is always a reason to go off the beaten path and look for something new, since if it looks interesting, it has something for you to discover. Not to mention the fact that it in no way forces you to do ANYTHING aside from one conversation to end the seamless tutorial, and actually beating the game, which itself can be done in the first half-hour of gameplay if you know what you're doing. All of the puzzles are great, and can be solved before you have everything the game wants you to know for it if your clever enough to figure it out yourself, and the game is even designed around that happening. The only hang ups I could see are that there's pretty much no motivation for playing the game outside of exploration (by design), and the controls for the ship you use to fly around are momentum based, and so the ship flies unlike any other vehicle in any game that I know of, which can be hard to get a hang of for a good while. Pretty much, this game's the epitome of exploration, so if you love exploring in open world games, than this is the game for you. (Also it's really easy to spoil due to how the progression works, so if you're going to play it, go in as blind as possible)
I’m a bit mixed on open world games, I tend to prefer more open area games such as Xenoblade, but there are still some good open world games such as BOTW, but the generic ubisoft open world formula can be a turn off from the formula.
Breath of the wild was my first open world game and being pushed into the open world and exploring the map was amazing. It took me multiple weeks to get to one of the divine beast. It was amazing and every open world game after that didn’t feel the same to. I got horizon zero dawn and didn’t have the drive I thought I had to play it.
I love open world games because it feels like I'm getting rewarded for my adhd self. Getting distracted by something cool looking or a side mission is part of the fun for me because it makes it feel like I'm getting my own personal unique experience. There just has to be some kind of plot to eventually follow, or like in sandboxes where I get to set my own goals or I'll just kinda drop it because I got overwhelmed with not knowing what to do.
ADHD isn’t the same for everybody of course, and its the reason i couldn’t make it past chapter 3 in RDR2. I just wanted to shoot things but i realized every mission didn’t guarantee a long ass shoot out so i got bored fast and never finished it.
🔖I feel the same! I love getting distracted by side missions. I know that sounds counter-intuitive but hear me out. In Witcher 3 I was looking for lost miners when I came upon a closed road. Turns out it was closed because a caravan was attacked by a dragon. So I jumped off my horse and followed the trail. Things like that don't happen in bad open world games because their quests are just a checklist of chores. They have no handcrafted side quests.
Mad Max was such a fun game. Idk if it’s just nostalgia from playing twisted metal as a kid, but the collisions felt brutal and the vehicle customization allowed for some pretty cool combinations. Very Ubisoft-like structure though.
@@Lextorias What about ghost of tsushima, horizion zero dawn, horizon forbidden west, marvel's spiderman and the witcher 3? All of these have some repetition, but also are all phenomenal games imo.
Unironically the best 'checkpoint' open world I've played is LEGO Friends on the DS. There are 5 areas, each has one of the girls' quests mostly in that area, the areas aren't massive, maybe 10 loading screens at most for the horse ranch, and there are enough interactable sections in each that they don't feel like a chore to go through (most of the time.)
This is a VERY good video. Your thoughts are clearly articulated, have purpose and show the points you make are those with merit rather than some angry gamer just talking jazz. I also like your deadpan humor... I look forward to watching more of your content.
You know what at first i was pissed looking at the title. But actually you made really really good points. I do kinda feel that way when playing Spiderman.. Open world games needs more lively feel to it like Red dead redemption and skyrim. Good stuff bro
10:52 The only 2 games using Ubisoft formula that I enjoyed were Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon ...and LEGO City Undercover. At least when stuff is made of bricks, it's easier to forgive the artificial-ity of the world design.
Had no idea you were the Elden Ring guy I listened to for an hour. Love your style! Hope to see the channel continue to thrive. Soon as you acknowledged both BDG and NakeyJakey I knew you were credible
I enjoyed the commentary and agreed with a lot of the points being made, but honestly I don't think Dying Light deserves to be lumped into the boring open world category. The parkour in that game felt amazing, and I feel like mechanically at least, it was enough to set it apart from other generic open world titles of its time.
I feel like why Spiderman and Sonic Frontiers are less icky to me compared to Ubisoft/Bethesda/Rockstar games is that you can swiftly navigate through them. I’m burned out from open world games unless they can make them easy to push through. It felt like these were pushed in response to the “short call of duty campaign” complaints.
I don’t know if you’ll consider the trails of series as open world, but the fact that almost every npc has at least 2 dialogues every new chapter in each game, even returning random npcs from previous games, and a good explanation for why places look the way they do - is far more immersive than anything else I’ve seen these days.
Perfectly described EVERY open world driving/racing game. I am absolutely SICK of seeing any of them with how they waste the player's time with nothing to do except drive from an event to another event, just make it a list i can quickly select that does not waste my time.
I'm glad I found your channel thru the Elden Ring video. Gotta say, you have quality content and a ton of potential to grow a great channel. Your humor is witty and sarcastic, yet the videos still feel very light and easy to watch. Curious to see how you'll be doing in a few years.
It would be really cool to know what flavors of the open world you'll give to the Witcher 3 and Gothic trilogy. Those games are pretty unique, and it would be interesting to listen your thoughts about them.
I was honestly surprised that he didn't mention Witcher 3. It's not a flawless game but I love the random unlisted quests you can find when exploring, and all the story.
The game that actually got me back into Open World games was A Short Hike. A Game so small you can see everything it has to show you in an afternoon. But it's an open world so refreshing that it honestly rivals that of a lot of triple A titles in execution. The game gives you one goal: climb to the peak of Hawk Peak Provincial Park. From there you'll spend the next hour or two scouring the island for feathers in what I can only describe as instant summer vacation in a tin. The platforming is great, exploration is well rewarded, and the characters and stories you come across are heartwarming and memorable. It's everything good about open world games smashed into a bite sized package. One of my favorite parts is how the game helps you navigate. There are no maps, no way points, just you the island, it's various landmarks and... oh yeah... the Soundtrack! Each part of the island has its own song that slowly transforms itself. The swish percussion of the beach, the flowing strings of the forest, the light tickling keys of the marina. One of the most magical moments I've had in gaming has been just getting absolutely turned around early on and suddenly hearing the familiar, upbeat melodies of the starting area welcoming me home. Seriously awesome. Not to mention it's currently the price of a McDonald's meal.
Zelda BOTW is the first Game I played where the world felt real. I almost never did quests on purpose, more of an accident because I was on a mission to explore every inch of that Map 😍 Anyways, good video! Subbed so I look forward to seeing what you produce
@@ronan1686 I need to play that Game again! I did not get very far because I made the typical Gamer mistake of playing too many Games at once and it fell through the cracks
Fantastic Video!! Even though I don't 100% feel the way you do on every game, your great presentation makes your argumentation very clear! And the overall gist is what I agree the most with. Hope your channel continues to grow!
New Vegas' quests were sometimes crazy intricate. With speech options often giving you different outcomes if a particular stat was high enough. Heck, some perks gave you extra dialogue options that could end sidequests differently, like in the Fort, when you're retrieving a little girl's teddy bear, you normally have to fight an attack dog to get it back, but with the perk Animal Friend, you can convince the dog trainer that the dog wouldn't attack you, getting the bear for free. Little things like that give a game that takes ages to complete reason to play it again and again.
You made me understand why I don't like most open world games. Most of them could pass as linear games with filler that are dumbed down moments of main missions. I have the most fun when I'm just blazing through the story missions and ignoring the actual world because the main content have unique moments and set pieces that are actually engaging. Meanwhile, the world is scattered with side missions that are basically chores that you do just because there is a reward at the end. The open world games I do like allow me to interact with the world simply because it's fun while the rewards are residual benefits.
I think the most recent Assassin's Creed games, especially Valhalla, are the worst offenders of this genre. Whenever I play them, I always get this feeling of "is this all there is in this game? Is there really nothing more worth exploring?" I also really liked HFW but I definitely agree that it's not unique. In fact, maybe a nitpick but I swear the main character Aloy just won't shut up about anything. It really is like the game is afraid I'll miss an opportunity to strike an enemy or that I might miss a point of interest or dialogue in the game. Like can't I just have some peace and quiet for once?
I remember when I was a kid, and the concept of open world games just seemed to be the objectively best thing... But as I grew older, I started appreciating more directed gaming experiences a bit more too. There's a place for both, but it can get too much of either one too. As with everything in life, it's all about balance.
I absolutely agree with u.I dont know why whenever a new trend starts every studio has to do the same.That happened with the ww2 trend in the 00s,the battle royal and now with the open world.Is it the lack of creativity or the money that they think they will make?In my view I d like if every studio kept doing their thing without trying to conply to "the new trend"
Spider-Man’s traversal and amazing looking Manhattan is probably the only reason I completed the game til the end. I found myself a getting fatigued a bit toward the end but the sim of its parts made it bearable.
The first console you ever owned was a PS3, fuck me Im getting old, mine was an NES, with the mario bros/duck hunt cart and an orange light gun. So yeah im not tired of open world games, I just want better ones.
i loved the gta 5 side quests. I played the game 4 different times, but during the main story i never played the sides. Once you finish the story though, with one of the best finales in my opinion, you are left with “and now what?”. Side quests were perfect to see the characters again, giving a better and also fun experience by seeing them acting in different situations
Very insightful! I liked when you talked about the open world being no more useful than a mission select screen. I would like to see an open world that doesn't become disposable or useless "after clearing the radio towers and looting all the camps", but at the same time, clearing out such things holds meaning in the game world, even if it were to go on without you. One example would be in BOTW, being able to discover a hidden way to break the curse of the blood moon. You could play the whole game and never know about it, so enemy encounters always remained, and bases continually refilled. Or, you could find it and stop it, making real progress in bringing Hyrule back, so to speak. I've heard other takes that talk about the balance between intrinsic and extrinsic rewards in game, and how not every little thing needs to grant you something tangible/useable in-game; how a nice, optional moment can be it's own reward. There should be a balance of course, but more effort into meaningful actions.
I love open world games, by far my favourite types of games. that being said, not enough open world games have a good, fun and compelling open world to run around in.
I've been looking for an explanation why I can't enjoy Horizon Zero Dawn or AC Mirage but can smash 5000 hours in Cyberpunk and Elden ring. I thought it was age but it's that the world in these games like AC Valhalla and Farcry are dead and exist to cater for the question marks on the map whereas The Witcher 3 and Baldurs Gate 3 are alive whether you're looking or not and that takes so much of the weight and overwhelmingness of the task ahead off your shoulders and allows you to take the game at your pace. Thanks for this.
I disagree with ghost of Tsushima, some of it is really really great world building and has a ton to do, but I get why you put it there. Think about it like this, if you clear all of them you live the combat. I’m aware it’s repetitive, if they added some extra challenges to spice it up it would have fun, but what if it was a level design where you couldn’t control how many you did or did not clear. That would not be fun either
I can agree with most of what you said about the Ubisoft style, but if Spider-Man lost all of its missions, I would still love just swinging around in the NYC that Insomniac games created. Good video 🎉
Part of what we need I think, is to remove the objective markers of most side things (unless you discover them by being right next to them). Let the player mark the map with all kinds of symbols. Don't tell us there are X of thing Y usually. I saw another video about this. Essentially, make it feel like all parts of the map and game are worth doing. It's worth exploring and finding shrines in Zelda BOTW (and TOTK) for example because it improves your health bar or stamina. It's worth finding treasure, items, or parts from those too. It's worth wandering the map and encountering random people and helping them because the rewards feel worth it for the effort and you organically discovered them and feel more invested because you brought your own agency into it. Same with anything you find, you have more incentive to do something with that content because you discovered it on your own instead of being given a map with 1000 pin points on it that someone else put there. Beating up monsters for their parts is worth it because it helps you upgrade your armor. And it's fun. It's fun to explore because the traversal is fun. It's fun to fight. The cooking needs a shortcut. And I wish the music was the music from the snes zelda instead of the music we got. But these two zeldas are my favorite zeldas now. Elden Ring is also amazing. And it taught me things about Zelda, open world games, dark souls games and games in general. I really hope the next ubisoft games will start to experiment in how the maps and content discovery is handled.
I haven’t finished probably the last 3-4 open world games I started. They are almost too complicated and I sometimes can go months without playing video games. At that point I’ve lost interest or can’t even remember how to play! That’s why I’ve come to like the more linear story driven games that take 12 hrs to beat.
Yeah, I am sure open world games are great for people with a lot of free time, but for those who work at least 40hrs a week and have a social life, you have at most several hours every week to play video games. You don't want to devote months to a single open world game, so more linear, less padded out games work the best, or non-story games where you just jump in to the gameplay, have some fun and turn it off (racing, multiplayer shooters, sports games etc.).
@@mrgalaxy396 Yah I work a week on week off schedule. My work week is 12 hr days and 7 days a week (sometimes more if filling in for OT). But then I do get a week off. However I find on my week off I am out doing stuff more, traveling, working on projects etc. So ya I rarely play video games after work so complex open world games just don't work for me.
This makes me remember all of the controversy a few yeas back about whether or not Genshin Impact was going to be Breath of the Wild but homework copied slightly differently. In terms of this video essay, I think it's got a pretty dang unique flavor of its own, but at the same time I feel like the world itself is so crammed with puzzles and sidequests and filler that, unlike botw where everything is naturally integrated into the environment and a fun surprise to discover, Genshin makes all of this extra content into quests about cookie cutter npcs we don't care about, or into world puzzles that stick out like a sore thumb and make the environment less breathtaking (in my opinion). Not to mention the money making aspect with the gacha part of the game is so heavily emphasized in every part of the game, from getting weapons to getting materials for said weapons, etc, that the open world part of the game is sometimes forgettable. I'm curious to hear others' thoughts on Genshin's open world, since it's the main reason I began playing in the first place.
I adore genshin’s open world. I love walking around Cider Lake and the beautiful forests of Mondstadt, I love walking through the streets of Liyue browsing through the street stalls, or chilling around Wangshu Inn… But the peak of world-building for me was Liyue. Inazuma was fun, but the layered terrain was complicated to navigate, and some of the puzzles seemed to divert from the main story/overall lore of the place rather than contribute to it. Whereas Liyue’s puzzles seemed to tell a story about the legend and myths associated with the land, Inazuma’s felt more similar to the puzzles you’d find on the Midsummer Island Adventure islands-puzzles for puzzle’s sake, which can be fun if it’s placed in an event, but can be tiring as a focal aspect of a land. As a side note, I feel that the npcs not being voiced takes away from the immersive experience, making the quests seem like a chore for those who don’t like reading long text. As for the similarities to breath of the wild, I can’t really say anything since I haven’t played bot. As for the gacha aspect taking away from the open world, I honestly don’t see how. I understand if the it affected the gameplay and the combat, as the characters and weapons that you own directly affects how you play. But for the open world aspect, how you interact with the world is the same regardless of which character you play as, none of the areas/quests are blocked by the gacha.
@@m.i7211 I love Liyue too! What I mostly meant was that much of the little bits of exploration such as combat trials, chests, etc require characters good at combat, which can be difficult if you keep pulling poorly. And I agree with what you said about Inazuma, I believe that the puzzles realy aren't connected to Inazuma at all other than many of them being electro based. I like that puzzles in Sumeru play with the extensive landscape and that some puzzles in Liyue and Monstadt require learning more about the land and/or its lore to figure out instead. The open world exploration otherwise is absolutely gorgeous and there are so many hidden details, hehe!
@@Piarte_Anchoritz Ah that makes sense. I do feel that in genshin most of the characters are competent in combat though. Of course there are characters that overpower other characters, but having those characters just mean that you can win battles more quickly because you can deal more damage per blow. Default characters like Noelle and Shangling can also be super strong if built well, although their fighting styles may not be as flashy as the rarer characters. I think that when it comes to puzzles and quests, not having certain characters won’t prevent you from completing them. What bothers me more is that players have to rely on rng to get good artifacts, which affects the combat the most imo. Since Genshin is free and works like a mobile game and relies on gacha/battle pass revenue, they have to keep people playing until the new updates come, so they implement a never-ending grind system that can feel like it’s not worth it sometimes.
I was surprised when he said that Bethesda’d made the one game where there are hundreds of books you don’t have to read, because Genshin also does that. You can collect volumes of books, read them if you want, etc. And even the world bosses and their material drops have connections to the lore. But if you just want to kill them, you don’t have to pay attention to any of that. The story is kind of linear though
I wish Horizon Zero Dawn and the 2018 GoW were just on rails. They slapped open world mechanics and quest design on intimate, character-focused journeys. GoW was far better about this, but large sections of the game still felt forced. Actually playing Zero Dawn was a chore from beginning to end, but there were a few hours of great storytelling sandwiched in there.
Not sure if you've played Xenoblade Chronicles X, but that game has, in my opinion, one of the best and most refreshing open worlds in the genre. Sure, there are a couple of your typical trappings like the towers you can go after that reveal more of the map, but not only is it filled with a wide variety to kill and loot, but also collectables you can gather for experience points, for cash, or for side quests. Later on you also unlock your own mech that you can use to traverse the world, flying through the sky or driving around on the ground. You can also discover new alien races that'll help you out if you help them out as well, selling you new armor sets, weapons, items, costumes. Oh yeah, it also takes place on an alien planet and the environments are honestly awe-inspiring. It may have been on the WiiU but it looks so damn good. The only negatives I can give it is the facial animations are pretty stiff (mostly because this was Monolith's first HD game and had to adapt to new tech.) and the story, while interesting ends on a cliffhanger that may or may not be resolved in the future.
I played Odyssey late because the DLC looked so cool. By the time I finished the main game I was so exhausted with the game I barely touched the DLC. Definitely could’ve stood to be about half the size and half the content. I’m planning to avoid the “UBIsoft formula” from now on. So burnt out on it.
As Extra Credits put it in one of their videos about this very topic, games should not be open world unless it actually adds something. So many games are actively worse *because* of them being open world. Why spread out content far away when people play for the content? Now I'm not a fan of "on rails" games, I actually find them pretty boring. While that's just my personal opinion, I still much rather play a game like that than an empty open world with no purpose. Games like Skyrim do open world right *because* it actually adds to the gameplay. They also put a lot of effort into making the world feel alive and filled in, even when you're out in the middle of nowhere. I could write a whole essay on Skyrim itself, but that's basically my thoughts on how open world should be used, if even. An addendum to this, something was mentioned near the end of this video that made me realize what makes an open world "good". I think open world works best when everything is optional and explorable. "I want games built around their open worlds, not open worlds built around a game." A fantastic way to end the video.
I think one of the most unique open world game and one I would put up there as the best is outer wilds. Its an underrated game that is probably not for most people, its an exploration game with no combat put into it ,the story is told mostly in text but the writing is great at engaging the audience to explore more , the only tools you need to beat the game is only at the start of the game, its unique because you can beat the game less than 30 minutes if you fully understand the whole lore. The game is fully open at the start and the only thing you need to worry about is the vacuum of space and the hazards it brings to your spaceship, don't spoil yourself at all if you're planning to play this unique game,go absolutely blind and take your time
+1 for Outer Wilds. But I think it's a disservice to think of it as an open world game, because of that term's connotations. I prefer to call it open-ended.
Outer wilds is becoming more and more popular and it absolutely deserves it, it was criminally unknown a couple years ago. Still struggle getting friends to give the game a shot
New Vegas was only published by Bethesda. Developed by Obsidian. That’s like saying Elden Ring is a Bandai Namco game. Dope video though!
Came here to say this. New Vegas open world is a cut above the Bethesda open worlds, because it's not a Bethesda open world.
Good point. I did want to include it under Bethesda because I think it fit in the category better. New Vegas has a pretty close design philosophy to a Bethesda game even though Bethesda's own Fallout games aren't as good.
Comparing it to something like Outer Worlds I think that game wasn't open enough to really capture the New Vegas feeling, and I haven't played most of their other games to be able to separate them or give them their own section.
@@Lextorias yea man, I never even bothered with Outer Worlds because of the Ho-Hum reviews
@@Fizzypoptunes hey, outer worlds was pretty good
@@Fizzypoptunes im glad i didnt listen to reviews because the out worlds was super fun. I can't wait for outworlds 2
A well done open world can be mind-blowing. A bad or mediocre open world will end up feeling like a chore. And I play games after chores not to keep doing them
I don’t know. Some of those Power Washing Simulator type games are pretty relaxing.
@@Lextorias lawn mower simulator best game ever actually you're right
days gone felt like a chore to me...
@@Lextorias my favorite of all is PC Building Simulator, just great
You're right, I felt BoTW was a chore the whole time though.
Open world games have been really blowing up for at least two decades. The problem isn't the genre, it's the quality of the content.
I think your right, I feel like Bethesda and Rockstar games had to do a lot with that. The GTA series is basically the most successful AAA series of games and elder scrolls games kept growing from the 90s.
But there's an argument that the quality of the content will necessarily be lower in an open world game because if you have the same resources for a linear game vs an open world one, some of the resources in the OW will be spent on side or filler content to populate the world with tasks, meaning the main quest will have less dedicated resources than in a linear game. The only way to alleviate it would be to pour more time and resources into the open world, and I've yet to see one which has been done without that problem, no matter the resources.
@@lapelcelery42 I think it depends what you want out of game. Really linear games feel artificial which can take people out of the experience because of the limitations or weird barriers the game puts up to stop the player. In other words less can lead to more
@@pleasedontwatchthese9593 I agree with that, but I don't think the Souls series in particular had any troubles there before, and the open world has been a step backward for them IMHO. Also, because your message finished with the word "more" on it's own line on my phone, I spent about a minute trying to click it to show me more text.
@@lapelcelery42 Dude xD Even tho I read your message first for some reason, I still went back and clicked on "more".
I loved how RDR2 had so many hidden stories, quests, and Easter eggs which weren’t marked on the map. It gave me a reason to explore as much of the world as I possibly could
I was going to say the same thing. RDR2 is a really good open world game, I enjoyed it even tho I don't usually like these kind of games, I get too distracted and end up losing interest
Also games need to give us more opportunities to kill klansmen. That just never gets boring.
@@fluffskunkYes.
It gets boring and tideous and later you found out that replaying this game from the beginning is going to be labor felt
I really love games without object markers. They ruin many challenges and surprises out there
Breath of the Wild really was the most focused open world game ever, just because it made the open world the gameplay itself. And it‘s ironic since none of the big developers like Ubisoft ever achieved something like this, but Nintendo, who usually dont make open worlds, just came in and said "you're all doing this wrong!"
@Robert E. Speedwagon "oh look, another Intelligence based spell, perfect, just what I needed for my Dex Faith build..."
I'm not attacking or anything, just mentioning that ER's sense of discovery isn't necessarily a step above without its own set of flaws.
@Robert E. Speedwagon This was done on purpose. The empty space in Breath of the Wild is crucial to its tone. Beyond the logistics of a post-apocalypse wiping much of the world out, the empty space is where the game really hammers home the beauty of nature juxtaposed alongside the tragedy of loss. It's a melancholic beauty, serenity born out of pain, and the best moments in Breath of the Wild let me soak that atmosphere in. The title is indicative of this. The developers want the players to pause, they want you to take it in. It's a kind of mood that I don't often see struck nowadays, with games, especially AAA games, constantly clawing for attention with quick hits of dopamine.
@@brycebitetti1402 The empty space is ok, but just because it's mostly empty doesn't mean it has to be mostly pointless like it is in BoTW. You can make irrelevant open space just to be "Pretty" and to show the themes of the game, but that can be done in a more focused space. I don't like being swarmed by contacts like in GTA 5 but the open world of the last Zelda was luckluster, the fact that your imagination fills in that gaping void is not a strength of the game but of yourself.
@@formlessoedon3929 You have the potential of finding something useful (ie for your particular build) which each thing you find in Elden Ring. The same cannot be said about BOTW. The fact the weapons break so easily makes you don't even want to use the cool weapons you find. And even then, they are just weapons that all play out more or less the same. In ER, a different weapon or ash of war can change the entire way your character plays.
The things to find in botw becomes repetitive after 30 hours
The beauty of the game’s open world isn’t the emptiness or what you find
It’s the interactiveness of the world and the many ways you can play with it.
It can be the elements,the physics engine,link’s mobility,the amount of details on how the world can affect you is great.
You can be in death mountain and cook food just with the temperature of the area while you burn to death lol
Elden ring is better at rewarding the player for the stuff they find but botw is better at world interaction immersiveness.
One isn’t better than the other,they both can learn from each other
Breath of the wild had me actively avoiding the main objectives specifically because I didn’t want the game to end or stop exploring. That’s insane.
@kshamwhizzle that's a nice opinion, but unfortunately i know where you live and i know what you fear
@kshamwhizzle bruh the story in the zelda franchise is great
Honestly botw is one of the few games that did that for me.
@@pedrol5004I am a huge zelda fan and yeah the story is great, but the plot is simple. you just have to find the stories yourself through subtext ( the buildings, the people). people cant really tell between story and plot imo.
@@pedrol5004 🤨
Vanilla isn't bland. Men sailed across the earth for vanilla. It's an exotic spice with tremendous flavor. Bland?
Yes. Bland.
@@Lextorias Then you are a fool.
Subnautica's open world was also pretty unique, where the only "objective" was just to go deeper.
It shouldn’t be that hard….. but the F E A R.
God I loved Subnautica. The sense of exploration you get when discovering new parts of the map, the mystery, the dread, the intrigue. While I personally didn't find it that scary, I still had a blast exploring the map and learning about all the creatures, and other bits of story and lore. Not to mention the fact that it simply looks gorgeous and truly feels alive
Giggity
My most single player hours in any game ever. The "NO MAP GOOD LUCK" open world! Love.
Micheal Scott: THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!!!
I never really viewed Dying Light (one of my favorite games of all time) as an open world game, but rather a zombie parkour game. I felt a sense of progression, and that was my main focus throughout the game: Can I wander the night without fear? _(Please don't hurt the puppy!)_
In my eyes dying light is the (much better) spiritual successor to Dead Island/Riptide. I loved those games as a kid for the kinda b-movie funny and genuine arcadey fun.
Some of the devs from dead island worked on Dying Light, and it feels like theyve really made something great. The dead island game of my dreams as a kid (:
@@johnmarkther2218they were developed by the exact same studio pretty sure
@@Platypus2175 indeed they were both developed by techland
The thing that BoTW, Elden Ring, and Xenoblade games do in which the map starts blank and thinks only fill out once the player actually explores and finds the points of interest in that location should honestly be an open world industry standard. There's not much fun to be had in exploring an already filled out and marked up map. Even if the things to find are still "checklist-y" in nature, there's a lot more joy to be found with "Easter Egg Hunting" than "Grocery Shopping" so to speak.
Really I found it annoying especially in botw , especially when there’s so much to do, it felt fun at first but then it started feeling hollow not finding or figuring out how to do puzzles so I’d look things up and after a while of spending an hour on one shrine (when you need 4 shrines to get a heart or stamina) it felt like a waste of time when it’s only 1of 120 shrines , then the Korok seeds felt fun at first I got around 70 and I thought maybe there’s a 100 more then come to find out there’s 770 something seeds I thought what’s the point most of them they are Copy and pasted and there’s no switch up of dialog or voice lines/phrases so it felt really lazy , then the lack of towns , adventuring felt like a chore like “oh I wonder what’s at the top of that mountain” guess what a shrine or korok seed and then you get in the shrine oh another test of strength for the 12th time , oh a new puzzle boy I can’t wait to figure it out oh wait it’s an awful motion puzzle where your fighting the motion controls rather than the actual puzzle , oh wait a themed shrine here’s the exact same skin as the the past 119 shrines, get to the the divine beasts , a cool boss? Nah copy an paste big bad, cool new enemies late game?nah same enemy just a shiny skin, new outpost? Nah just the same old stable tent, cool sidequest?nah get 20 frogs for dude with no consequence effecting the world , cool dragon?how bout 3 of them reskinned , cool champions? Well there dead , cool current warriors? Nah you’ll speak to them for the divine beats quest and then they’ll say the same line of dialog from then on out
This make ABSOLUTELY ZERO sense, as it's LITERALLY how EVERY other open world game works. 😂🤣
There is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING different in those regards in comparison to how basically EVERY other open-world game works.
Tho it is a nice way to do it, I find more engaging having the map unfolded but the content in it is not, and that part is locked until I reach certain secret mission or main mission so I had a reason to explore the world. Else I just go st4reight to the end of the story. Sort of like NFS U" did with parts of the map not being available at the start
I pre-ordered and played Elden Ring day one of launch and beat it with a friend. We would explore while in a discord call and share what we learned and what weapons we would get. But we wouldn’t spoil story or bosses unless we asked each other for information.
Filling out that map and going “Dude the first area is big, but go South and it DOUBLES the size!”
It continued like that for a while. Finding the underground, finding Caylid, then finding Liurnia of the Lakes, and just having the entire world expand and unfold. It was awesome and an experience I wouldn’t trade for anything.
It taught me to not look anything up in a game unless I got really frustrated and the game was becoming unenjoyable without looking something up. Knowing nothing and finding out > looking things up to finish the game.
Played 100 hours in a fucking week. It was bodacious.
I had the best experience in BoTW just exploring the map. I can still find something new to this day
Elden ring didn't actually invent it instead they reminded us of this old school style of an open world where the game isn't afraid to hide stuff and allow you to miss things
An example of that is morrowind
And by the way, we need more of these kinds of open-world games
Wasn't Fallen Order the first Souls type open world?
@@omsaxena116 *Ashen
Another example of that is also Dragon Warrior.
The original. Old school games were savage. You’d talk to literally everyone you could multiple times and scan every available space.
@@omsaxena116 Nah. Fallen Order isn't open-world.
Dark Souls 1 was the closest we had to open-world Dark Souls before Elden Ring.
Does zelda 1 falls on that definition?
I definitely like Bethesda's take on the open world genre. Mainly because you're not locked into a mission once you start it, like GTA or Assassin's Creed. There is no "desynchronization" when going too far from an objective. You can do any quest whenever you want, and once you start them, you don't even have to finish them. You can just leave halfway through. Also major content isn't locked behind the storyline, for the most part at least.
I liked them. In Skyrim. The only problem is that they never innovated after Skyrim and the games have stayed the same.
@@tj-co9go skyrim even took steps back from the previous two games
Skyrim really was the last game by BGS I truly enjoyed and got sucked into. Fallout 4, while I had been more excited for that game than probably anyone (I was obsessed with Fallout up to that point), just didn't scratch the same itch and clearly 76 and Starfield are both just disasters. Don't look forward to TES6 cause you'll be let down I promise.
"The open world IS the game" hits so hard right now, I've just been playing Subnautica and just going out into the open world is part of the challenge and fun. Making sure you've got the resources to get where you want to go, but also get back. Exploration is central to everything in the game.
Games like subnautica are ''proper'' games. Will play it eventually when it's on sale
Death Stranding changed my approach to open world games, the map itself is now for me (on every open world I play, even those I played years ago) another character, is now the game itself, where the fun and challenge is, a powerful story telling tool, before Death Stranding, the map was just the place I could put my character in and not fall into the void called skybox. Loved and thanked Death Stranding for that.
This is btw what made EverQuest and EverQuest Online Adventures (The PS2 Version of EQ) so amazing, then WoW went and messed everything up just like Ubisoft messed up the single player open world. It was all about the sense of exploration, danger, finding that rare monster and rare loot drop. Not anymore... now it's a dayum themepark!!!!!
Agreed! I’m about 10 hrs in and I’m really enjoying it, I think the fear of the unknown it also creates also makes it what it is
Subnautica is one of the best games of the decade.
Interestingly, I loved to explore Egypt in Assassin's Creed Origins, just for the sake of exploring. The rewards were meaningless, some quests were nice, but climbing the pyramids or finding an alien like structure out in the desert was really amazing!
I wouldn't want to do that all over again, though....
Some of the sights in Egypt were their own reward for exploration. What a beautiful world they built.
I seriously have more fun running around in the optional no-combat educational tour mode at my own pace than I do in the “well you’re arbitrarily not a high enough level to have fun in this part of the map yet” main game.
I wish the gameplay was better, because they did a great job on making Egypt interesting to look at.
@@Mazekial yup, thats why i deinstalled origins, made me me grind levels for almost every story mission
i love assassins creed
I love Shadow Of The Colossus. It makes this entire world, that it doesnt even want you to explore. You can gather fruit to get more health, or hunt chameleons for more stamina. To complete it, though, you only need to kill every Colossi. Like you said about Elden Ring, everything is optional. I loved SOTC.
I am waiting to play
sotc is seriously a flawless game. and the fact ico was able to pull off the things they did back in 2005 on the ps2 is fuckin insane. it will always be my favorite game of all time. the world is so mystical and expansive. everything is so carefully constructed even though most of the world is useless its fuckin insane. like you can climb into the garden and walk all across the giant bridge
It's interesting to me how SOTC seems like a deconstruction of open world games but done long before they blew up in popularity because all there is to do is kill Colossi and find lizards and apples to increase your health and stamina and the only reward for doing this is access to an area that has nothing of note in it other than fruit that leaves you stuck there forever. It's a giant, gorgeous open world on the surface, but underneath it's just window dressing on a very linear game that tells you exactly where the only thing of interest is. I adore the game, it's probably one of my top 10 games, and the emptiness of the world and its accidental commentary on how most open world games are made is honestly one of my favorite things about it.
"if the world doesnt seem alive, the game has failed as an open world" couldnt agree more
Facts
Agreed
For me the difference between good open worlds and bad open worlds are:
1. Environmental storytelling - In Fallout/Skyrim you can find out about an NPC by rummaging through his belongings. A picture frame, a letter in the drawer, a hidden basement, a necklace with dark magic. Bad open world games don't have that attention to detail because their buildings are just there to look at. Some buildings even have a painted door and you can't actually enter.
2. Handcrafted side quests - Megaton in Fallout, the Bloody Baron in Witcher 3. Bad open world games don't have these types of side quests, they have repetitive padding like collect 200 feathers.
@@One.Zero.One101Agreed if the open world has lore its good if i saw an house while exploring and find out that the house actually belongs to someone or has some connection to the story then i like it but when things are just present in open world it just feels empty and less engaging
You spoke directly to my soul on this video. I remember when I was playing Farcry 5 and tried to set up a barricade of cars in front of a farm I holed up in just for fun. The cars just kept disappearing at a certain point and I realized the game was just open world for no reason. The cars werent there to set up barricades, they were there to drive you from one cookie cutter outpost to another and thats it.
Meanwhile, in Skyrim, my wife just spent the afternoon dragging all the dead bodies in Dawnstar into the ocean because 7 years ago she got caught stealing and she was tired of looking at all the bodies whenever she went to town.
Your wife is a menace 🥶
@@Metronomical3 fr I sleep with one eye open ever since she killed Parthurnax
@@terrbear5086
What?! Why?
@@matthewbreytenbach4483 i did this too because my shit was in their chest and i couldn't take it back without facing high-level NPCs, which i could do if the action or RPG side of skyrim as actually fecking developed to let me take on a threat above my level, but because skyrim is skyrim, even if i COULD, they wouldn't fucking die.
oh and i was on PS3 so "setownership player" wasn't a thing i could do
@@dmas7749
The Blades you mean?
That sounds rough.
The key is to make an open world game with a clear primary objective, mildly clear secondary objectives, and unclear tertiary objectives. Additionally, players need flexible gameplay and freedom to affect the world in positive, negative, and neutral ways.
I like how BOTW didn’t dump quest markers upon receiving map pieces. Just marks them upon discovery/activation. That shit overwhelms me, sometimes to the point I drop real early. Just hide the stuff from me, so it’ll almost always feel fresh to explore.
Idk if it was just me, but climbing a mountain and seeing a cool landmark or a shrine/tower was so interesting and made me want to explore more than a big icon ever would.
@@jtc6366 Well yeah of course!
Okie botw does this well but like is it just me or is everyone acting like this is revolutionary for botw and Elden ring when even games like Skyrim were doing it years ago. You play Skyrim from the beginning and the only things marked on your map at the start are the capital cities which makes sense and any map marker for a quest you have activated and you can also turn that off if the player wants to. You only unlock markers for let’s say a cave in Skyrim when you travel near the location of the cave and then unlock it on your map which is exactly the same as a game like Elden ring. Yet apparently Elden ring has changed open world games forever and has ruined the old ones, I don’t get it man I must be not seeing what everyone else does.
The amount of comments I see saying that ER or BOTW put games like Skyrim to shame is maddening considering Skyrim does practically the same thing and so do many other open world games. The only difference I’d say is that games like botw and er do a better job at hiding there repetitive nature and I’m not even sure that’s a good thing. Sometimes it’s nice to know what your getting into so you can avoid the content you don’t want to do and choose the good stuff in the game to do.
@@TheWrongPerspective hiding repetitiveness is pretty good actually because you don’t get bored of it. Also I didn’t see many comments saying that ER and BOTW are putting Skyrim to shame just how good BOTW and ER are. And I gotta say I agree with them. Being able to explore freely is absolutely stunning doing whatever you want and since you can just simply go back to the main quest is also awesome. And it’s not just plain exploration everything you explore contributes to many things as well. It’s not just some lame trophy after hours of doing something it’s something that feels like it was 100% worth it
@@TheWrongPerspective and technically the repetitive nature in both games are still in some things so technically you still know what your getting into but there’s many things outside the main quest to explore that gives you experience to many other things
My first open world experience was Oblivion. Those memories will forever be engrained in my mind, it was the perfect escape from life and at the time was one of a kind. I really miss the feeling games from 15 years ago used to give me. There was so much hope and hype for upcoming titles, with giant leaps being made at such a fast pace. The fact that we got Oblivion, Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, Skyrim, Red Dead and GTAV all in the same console generation is crazy to me. I think the moment I started to reel in my expectations was when Destiny 1 released. The hype for it was unreal, all to get smacked in the mouth with disappointment, and even more disappointing games followed year after year. Beloved franchises like CoD and Halo started to decline, remakes and remasters became the norm instead of pushing new IPs. What was once a love for making videogames has become a lucrative greedy business. It really does upset me how many game developers and publishers have fallen from grace. I hope in the next decade we see less unfinished games being released, and more passion-fueled and ambitious projects getting the green light
360 era was the golden era of gaming imo. mostly all these american companies were ontop of their game.
@@thelel6591
Haha, the Super Nintendo era was the best but maybe that’s nostalgia.
PS2 days were big (was that during the 360 time as well? I didn’t do Xbox)
The jump from PS1 to 2 felt like the beginning of the good polygon graphics. Things didn’t look like blocky crap.
and Super Nintendo 16 but still hold up today.
Most of my favorite games ever were from 2005-2010. Everything started to fall in the 2010s as you said. I only look for specific indie titles and older games now, as I also have less time to spend on games these days. My favorite game is Dragon Age Origins, which I discovered much later. Since then I can't really stand open world games, I don't feel a sense of excitement in exploring an open world anymore tbh.
@@J.B.1982 06-13 was ps3 and 360
@@J.B.1982 ps2 was before 360. but i do agree the jump from ps1 to ps2 was a huge improvement. nowadays ps4-ps5 its really like.. thats it?
This topic resonates with me. When I said around 6 years ago to my gamer friends that most of the open world games are boring and that not every single game needs to be open just for the sake of being open, they were having a laugh about it. Nowadays, I think most of them are coming to the same realization. Great video btw. It really blew you up ;)
After hearing how great it was, I was surprised to play Assassin’s Creed and be confronted with dull missions and check lists. It was so unfun. Thought it was only me, but thank god the hate is shared
Which AC game did you play? I've heard really terrible things about the newest AC games and I wonder if its just the formula doesnt hold up or if the new games are much worse.
@@GhostEmblem Odyssey and Unity. Both just dull. Ironically, I’d like to make a game that has bustling towns but this was one of the reasons that put me off, albeit a minor one. The games with emptier scenes invite you to explore more and feel far less cluttered
Bet you it was the more recent ones. The earliest games are more story focused so there just isn't enough content to make a checklist. Feathers be damned of course...
I am struggling through them. On brotherhood now and am starting to just do the main quests. The rest is getting tedious. Do like the tomb searching (followers of Romulus I believe). But overall I don't think I can continue much longer. At the very least I need a break.
@@LOTRFAN33 You should go for the armour only if you really want it, it's really unnecessary otherwise. Only in AC2 it makes more sense to get hung up over not having it.
AC is really not a series where you want to do "Sidequests" first, it really makes no sense. They were made with the idea that side missions would be done on occasion to not have to do all story missions one by one.
Btw, I also found you after the ER video because I watched Joe Anderson's analysis and wanted to see other peoples takes. I was surprised and delighted to find that not only did you have similar issues with the game and went into depth, it was also a very articulate and nuanced critique. Same for the other media videos on your channel. So I for one would love to see more media analysis / long form essays from you. Let's not kid ourselves, the market for both media critique and broad-topic commentary is highly saturated on YT right now, so....yeah anywayyys
I’m planning on doing a mix of both if the algorithm gods find that pleasing. If I have strong opinions on something you can bet I’m making a video about it. And these broader topic videos serve to fill the gaps so I upload more than once every two months
I get so exhausted of open world games. Fetch quests, defeat x amount of enemies, clear this base, rinse and repeat. Elden Ring and The Witcher 3 were the only ones that stood out to me that I actually finished in the past 8 years.
Breath of the Wild?
Thats mmorpg...what other games beside mmorpg got kill x enemy, then other x enemy loops? And fetch quest..well thats in every game..always need to go from A to B back to A or C to do stuff..thats called objective.
I prefer linear gameplay overall because I’m a completionist and when trophies are involved ultimately there’s a most efficient path to every game. I have anxiety when there’s choices that affect the route or may have me miss items. I don’t really have time or desire to replay games I don’t love.
Yes I am a linear person. Make the game hard as hell. Make me choose maybe 1 or two paths to get there and that's it. I don't have 30 hours to put into a game anymore. It's not fun having to travel back and forth. I want to finish the game and move on. There's this sense that you have to keep playing a game. It's annoying. I play games to win at the end.
Unfortunately we don’t get many of those nowadays
D K I feel you bro. Anxiety in gaming is real.
Not sure if you have yet but I would absolutely recommend going for the platinum in Astro's Playroom for PS5. Has to be one of the best games on that platform so far. Just so much fun and getting that platinum just felt necessary. Along with Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, a bit too short for me but still fun.
The only value they have is what you give them
I wonder how you would classify the open world in Yakuza games. I wouldn't say they're perfect but they're done well. It kinda feels like they created their own formula of open world. You're in a small district with shops, restaurants, a bunch of play spots (minigames) and lots of side quests. You fight punks, help someone find their cat, then go drinking and sing karaoke, and next you're getting involved in some serious political drama. There's a strong virtual tourism aspect that I personally enjoy. It's like your time in Kamurocho is a trip to Japan's real life Kabukicho and you're enjoying the things it has to offer, both good and bad. It's not realistic (as in the way npcs react and the games do feel very videogame-y) but the district itself is pretty well represented.
yeah i wonder what his take on the yakuza open world is bc like. there’s mission markers to every bit of story i suppose but by far my favourite thing in these games is to just wander around and stumble upon a silly substory and a massive hidden minigame that was just kinda. there for some reason? and it was really fun (for example yakuza 6 spearfishing minigame) like it has nothing to do with the overarching plot but it’s just There and it helps you really emphasise with kiryu as just a human if ygm. also i love how small scale but crazy dense kamurocho is and it feels SO immersive to just walk around and go ‘hm i wanna go bowling’ gosh it’s a really fun open world imo
I love yakuza for their small dense maps. So much better than wasting tons of time getting from point a to point b.
Yakuza has one of the best open worlds along with Morrowind
Yakuza Zero was my first 'open-world' game in 2020 and I loved it. I live in Korea and have been to Japan a fair few times, so during Covid, it was a kind of release to wonder around such a beautifully-designed, accurate city and feel like you're there. The mini-games, like you say, are addictive and you can just play them for a few hours. The random meetings and side-quests were excellent too. After finishing that I went onto Yakuza 6, and again, great. I got lost playing pool and doing the trick shots for money for hours. Loved it, like the first one. Around that time my brother mentioned RDR2, which is another simply stunning world. I've explored it so much and I know the story twist, so I'm just going around before that particular part..... So I should finish it really, but I.....erm....you know....no spoilers....
I'm not into massively zombie/monster/archaic worlds and those kind of shoot 'em ups, so the Yakuza and RDR2 worlds are perfect for me.
Yeah I've been playing Judgement lately and I'm kind of blown away at how many things they do better than say Shenmue or something similar.
ain't nooooooo way this guy is putting Ghost of fuckin Tsushima into the "games like Ubisoft category" edit: ignore everything i just said the puppy is cute
My favorite thing about botw came about because I was playing it at the same time as four of my roommates. One switch, everyone on their own account, all at the same time. We were basically taking turns every day playing this game, and two of them ended up getting their own switch and copy of the game at some point. But what stuck out was hiw everyone navigated the world and played the game differently. We were constantly finding out new things from each other, or when somebody would be stuck on a puzzle we'd all have different solutions. One friend was focused on finding out the history and exploring the ruins of the game, another just wanted to fill out the picture compendium, another still spent all her time obsessively catching and releasing horses, and finally my other friend just wanted to fuck around and find out, resulting in the funniest pictures of lionels I've ever seen. By far the best gaming experience I've ever had, and I wasn't even playing it most of the time!
if you’re playing botw just to fill out the pictures……….. you built diff
@@samu-chani mean when i played botw I was tryharding in getting all them pics 😭😭
@@lava3256 Ayo that sounds sus as fuck, not gonna lie
The "mission select" thing you mentioned at 16:16 would be amazing for a superhero game to where they could have smaller semi-open missions like Hitman and call them "issues" or "arcs"; it'd be huge for replay value, speedrunning, and even DLC later on
Shadow of Mordor/War has so much more than just the Ubisoft open world system. You build an army of orcs by exploring the open world so that you can complete the missions, and the nemesis system is an amazing way to create side stories and explain why you respawn. They are so much more than running from mission to mission endlessly
It really isn't though. I just played the first one for the first time, and it was... fine? Story was short yet felt bloated and underutilised. Gameplay was fun but was literally just the Arkham combat system. Side content was a ubisoft collectathon that didn't really add anything to the experience and I only did them when I needed more points for upgrades. I'll give kudos to the two maps being rather small. The nemesis system was the only interesting part of the game, but even that felt like a slog at times. Had fun with that system though, and the game is at its best when it encourages you to play around with it.
The reason why the shadow games are categorized as a Ubisoft game it's because, in my understanding, the only focus is on fighting. Even the nemesis system (which I love) is for fighting. You can't do anything else but fight. The collectibles, apart from a bit of lore and exp, are pretty useless. I love both shadow games, but they really are just games focusing on killing. That's not to say that they are bad, far from it. But in a sense, they are somewhat basic, in the context of the video.
My problem with open world games is this: A big motivating factor in me playing a game is seeing what's next. Within a few hours of starting an open world game, you've seen 95 percent of the mission types and environments and there is little mystery. AC Odyssey, origins, and GTA 4 are good examples of open worlds that still leave something interesting to be discovered as a carrot. It's also tedious in those games and every open world to check the map every mission and multiple times per mission. As I get older, I don't want to stress over the best order to do everything while trudging through filler.
In linear games, you don't know what the next environment or mission type is going to be, keeping me guessing like a good book. It's also a lot more focused. The core single player story of most open worlds is still around 6-15 hours like in the 360 era but there's so much more filler to balloon the "size" of the game.
I don’t want the games you want though
Exploration is apart of open world games
Interesting you called Odessey a good example, i think its an amazing recreation of Greece (something all the AC games are good at, with the understandable distortion) but i got bored very quickly (the area right after you get off tutorial island) because i realized the entire game was going to just be this slog of fake progression and i had a hundred hours of chores to do just to get the story out of this game.
Black Flag on the other hand was amazing and i could happily sail around the Caribbean being a pirate for hours making actual progress on upgrading my ship and ignoring the main missions. (I think my primary driver to do the missions was the elimination of those fog walls saying you can't go here until you advance the main story)
Totally with you - I couldn't even enjoy BotW because I'm so burned out on the open world stuff. I want my linear titles back, or something like GoW which is kind of linear with some degree of choice
Same bro Botw is an amazing game but I just couldn’t finish it.
Linear games with rpg mechanics are probably my favorite genre. Nothing else matters to me, sci Fi, fantasy, first/third person, action adventure etc. If you have a well thought out linear game with rpg mechanics added for gameplay variety, choices and replayability it will always be better than some open world checklist with a story you don't even care about and boring shallow gameplay.
not me. love open worlds and i will stay there.
@@friendlyreaper9012 Have you tried Dishonored? Game has insane replayability
@@friendlyreaper9012 You're gonna love Bioshock then. Liner with rpg elements and a rich storyline.
The ubisoft game that actually has a fantastic open world is immortals fenyx rising. As you explore there are hidden puzzles and activities as well as cut scenes. I am a huge fan of this game because you can just keep exploring.
Agreed. I was sad when they scrapped sequels. It's like a weaker BOTW I imagine.
I just bought that game! I wish there were more friendly NPCs to talk to though.
I cant belive I've finally found the answer to one of the most frustrating questions my friends would always ask me. "Why do you like this open world game but not this one?" This entire video is exactly why! I could never put it into words untill I saw this video 🙏
Shadow of the Colossus is my absolute favorite game, both for the presentation, narrative, and experiences it provides and also for personal childhood escapism reasons. But the empty, barren open world save for scattered wildlife and plant life really adds to the sense of mystery and melancholy to it all. I'd say as far as ice cream goes, it's one of those cursed SpongeBob ice creams. It's inherently kind of sad, but it's still really enjoyable
Team Ico made round 3 games and left such a monumental legacy.. I’m glad I didn’t miss out on discovering them..
Shadow of the colossus can’t be compared to any other games I feel. It’s just art on another level
Best thing of shadow of the colossus for me is the simplicity. No levels, no experience, no grind, no magic, no bullshit. Just you, a sword, a bow and a horse. And a lot of giants to slay
What’s a Shadow of the Collosus
A R T
A counter to your Ubisoft like games point. Is that without the open world even if it’s boring the game would feel incomplete without it. Spider man needs building to swing on without them it makes no sense. Jin sakai needs the island of Tsushima in order to understand the world and his connections to his people. Also the Ghost of Tsushima disrespect is CRAZY.
I love the effort put into this ice cream video. The use of open-world video games as an analogy to describe different flavors of sweet goodness is brilliant.
While not extremely open world, Fable is a nice change of pace from other open worlds, especially Fable II. While limited to mainly exploring and combat rather than crafting and other open-world concepts, it always provided an expansive world where I could spend hours doing something as silly as an a-press simulator (ie chopping wood), simply for the peace I could feel watching the in-game days go by.
I disagree with the opinion that Elden Ring's exploration only works on the first playthrough. I'm on my 6th or 7th play through and am still finding so many secrets and suprises that I have never found previously, even after extensively exploring the map before
You explained really well some of my feelings on BotW's open world. To this day that is my #1 favorite open world I have explored in. None of my friends agree with me, and I understand why; many of their criticisms were that the world was too empty or lifeless. I didn't feel that way at all. To me it was a world that was basically my sandbox. I was able to explore whatever I wanted whenever I wanted, approach a new area from any angle and create my own stories and gameplay around it wholly unique to me. I fell in love with Nintendo's incredible landmark skills; every time I reached a new area I would see something else on the horizon that looked interesting or cool, and I would make my way to it. There are so many unique biomes and structures to find in that world that I put nearly 100 hours in before I saw it all, and I probably still missed some places here or there. THAT is the kind of open world that draws me in the most, and I would love to have some more games created that way in the future.
I’ve got 235 hours and I still have more to explore!
For me, it was that it felt empty in a way that doesn't make sense for a nation that should quite well know that Calamity Ganon is coming back for Round 2 sooner rather than later. The world was okay, but the characters didn't feel like they were living in the same world as the story.
Like, we never even find out what the current Hyrulian government is, now that the royal family that ruled the inter-species coalition had vanished for a century, especially when a decently sized faction of one of those races is really pissed off at their former(?) rulers.
@@lnsflare1 I feel like Hyrule just became an anarchy or something like it lol
Except for the Gerudos and the birds
@@renren47618 I mean, the Zora have a kingdom and the Gorons are like, a mining company/"city" of some sort. Kakariko Village is run by Sheikah who would know that the Calamity is coming but are largely doing nothing except waiting for Link to save them even while the Yiga Clan is running around unchecked, the Hylian majority Hateno Village has a mayor (and Purah who has apparently not told anyone about the incoming Calamity for some reason) like the also Hylian Lurelin Village, with no indication as to whether or not there is any sort of official relationship between one another or the societies of the other races that made up old Hyrule.
I guess the Yiga Clan has a society, too, sort of, though we only see their three room apartment and no explanation as to why they aren't constantly working alongside Ganon's monsters, the corrupted Guardians, and the ancient Sheikah tech that they split from the rest of the tribe rather than lose. By all implications, the Yiga Clan should be an entire army of ninjas using Sheikah Tech 10,000+ years more advanced than anything the Amish Sheikah have access to, since they are just repairing stuff that was made that long ago while the Yiga should have been innovating the entire time.
Oh, and Tarrey Town is a corporate town run by Bolson's Carpenters, I guess? They were very nebulous as to what the governing system there actually was.
@@lnsflare1 Yeah, true
Maybe the Hylians that once lived in the capital where the Royal Familly was got completely destroyed and now each remaining societies has their own political system
Agreed. I get "open world fatigue" every time I'm near the end of an open world game. Open world games like Morrowind, New Vegas etc were great when they came out years apart and were rare (and I couldn't afford to buy all the games I wanted, so a game that I could spend a lot of time in was very cost effective), but when everything is an open world game it just gets tedious.
I am loving Elden Ring, but I will be very ready for a different kind of game when I'm done with it.
I agree. As ive gotten older ive started to notice how little i care for open world and also how impatient i am with games pacing. I would much prefer a really tight and fast experience than an open world that feels like a chore to navigate with boring side objectives
If you want unique open world experiences I'd recommend checking out the Xenoblade series if you haven't yet. They're made by Monolith Soft the co developer of Breath of the Wild and feel very different from that game as well. X in particular has one of the most realized alien worlds I've seen in a game with an insane amount of customizability and traversal options to boot. Since that game is stuck on the Wii U it's kind of inaccessible, but the main series, while technically more segmented open worlds IMO, is just as good. I can't wait to play 3 and that earlier release date has me giddy.
Same! The only reason I still have my Wii U is to go back and play Xenoblade X
Xenoblade is amazing. I feel motivated to explore the entire world
@@keybearer26 i bought a wii u just for xenoblade x haha
X will ported at some point. I have the game I just never got around to it and I've never played xenoblade. Should i play it?
@@Succer X is still one of the most impressive games in the series with a completely open world, not just a bunch of big zones like 3 has. It also has some really fun on foot and mech traversal as well. After I think chapter 3 you can literally go anywhere on the map at your own pace. It does take a while to get the mechs though, 30+ hours into the game.
The gameplay is similar to Xenoblade 1's, but the customization is absurd. The main character has 16 classes they can master and when you master them you can use their arts and skills with other classes. Not to mention the mech customization is insane as well.
The one downside to the game is that because it focuses on exploration the main story is probably the weakest in the series, the side content and world building on the other hand is some of the strongest in the series.
X is a very big game and if you want to ease yourself into the series I'd start with the numbered games over it. I believe it took the play testers of X 300+ hours to beat the game, and my typical playthrough of it is usually 150+ hours.
This video explained my burnout when it comes to videogames, and why i have left so many games unfinished. Articulating my own thinking and feel of some games into words for me, better than i could have done myself. Great video!
Outer Wilds has one of the most beautiful open worlds I've seen in video games, delivering an experience I wish to erase from my memory to play for the first time again
Ehhhhhh, not really "open world". Outer Wilds is a thing of its own, kinda. I dont even know what to call it
@@vibevizier6512 honestly i agree, is so different from everything I play to actually categorize it, but Open World seemed like a good enoug description
OpenWorld, Exploring, Mystery, Puzzle.
I wish there are more games like this, Feel like some grand treasure hunt mystery.
You don't get stronger in Outer Wilds like general game. You just know more about the world you explore. The game design here is so different.
I actually like every game you mentioned. They are all open world games but appeal to different people in different ways. Its like a road trip. Some people just want to get to the destination, others want to stop at every tourist trap, and others are just enjoying the scenery along the way. As long as you are enjoying yourself. I'm an old man though, so I still think like I did in the 90s and appreciate games like Horizon Zero Dawn and Skyrim for what they offer and the technical feats. I did have to push through Spider Man though, I agree, I wish there was more to interact with in New York City of all places.
Well said. The problem is that "giant open map" has mostly become just a marketing checkbox, something to be duct-taped onto any game with the budget to allow it. To actually implement it well though, requires it to be the foundation of the entire development process. It's not unlike planning a D&D campaign, where you can plot out the most epic storyline imaginable, but because of the scope of the world and the breadth of what players might decide to try and do, every path must either lead somewhere interesting directly, or drop crumbs towards one. Not a perfect parallel of course, as the DM is also free to add things in the moment, but it's more similar than one might think.
Aside from Minecraft, which is kind of in its own category entirely and not really fair to compare anything else to, I think Breath of the Wild is probably the best example by far of this design philosophy. You can wander out into the most random, desolate area of the map, look to the horizon and start turning the camera, and 99.9% of the time SOMETHING cool will catch your eye and a new little personal quest has begun. As big (and sometimes sparse) as the map is, not an inch of it is what I would call "wasted" or "filler".
Yeah, marketing is probably a main reason for that. Wonder if that's the case with Halo Infinite for example.
I've started referring to a lot of open world games as scavenger hunt games. Even Breath of the Wild was one leaving me with a relatively poor impression. While it was better than other scavenger hunt games it was lackluster compared to other Zelda games, in my opinion at least. Elden Ring I really liked.
idk how this guy isn’t more popular than he already is this is some great content
he aint very educated in games tbh, like how how he said all the far cry’s are the same even though 1 and 2 r vastly different from 3 and beyond
What else other than that. He 100% knows that those games aren't similar. 1 and 2 are different from every game but not only are they the minority, they're completely forgotten by now because they've been drowned out by far cry 3, 4, primal, 5 and 6
@@yuyualtikriti5746 far cry 2 is a top 2 far cry game😭 id rather play far cry 2 than any other far cry game besides 3
@@yuyualtikriti5746 dont talk unless u played em cuz far cry 2 is a classic that should be remembered for its unique ideas and hardcore gameplay, unlike games today far cry 2 didnt hold ur hand and many games should learn from that
Problem for me is you’re always ALONE.. and most of the space is empty or everything trying to kill you. No sense of wonder.
Games like guardian of the galaxy was fun to me because you always have your team with you and the banter was funny.
Open-world co-op would be amazing. Sea of Thieves tried to be that, but mostly ended up as a battle royale trolling sim.
I think you would also like dragons dogma
You have a character and a crew working together to fight enemies
Xenoblade Chronicles 3 handled inter-party banter shockingly well, probably the best I've seen from an open-world game
yes man elden ring i get bored quickly its just so lonely and mostly everything is trying to kill you.
Final fantasy 15
If you like the freedom elements in open world where you’re given one objective and you can approach it however you want then try Outer Wilds
Man, I really love Death Stranding. While it has a severe lack of interesting things to do and the mechanics other than traversing the environment are quite underdeveloped (imo), the whole thing is just so chill. It's like going on a walk in the woods, or an RV holiday, or a very long drive - nothing especially stimulating, but a nice relaxed break from stimulation. It's all just travelling from A to B, fetch questing, but there's just some combination of the terrain mechanics, the scenery and the atmosphere with minimal intrusive elements that elevates it from flavorless bread to delightful cheese on toast.
It's just comfy, more comfy than a game has ever been.
I agree. I didn't quite click with the more engaging elements like combat or the more mechanically driven missions. I got my fun out of the atmosphere and traversal, but my poor attention had me dropping it when I wanted something more. It's why I think I love Red Dead so much, is that I can have that relaxing gameplay and spend hours in it, but then jump back in to some engaging missions or exciting gameplay when I want to.
I got the game right around the time the pandemic really got going in 2020, and at the time I was a doordash courier which was classified as essential in my area so I continued working while almost everyone else was locked away in their homes, and the world was suddenly so empty. In those early days, before the virus had been studied sufficiently to determine what precautions were necessary to prevent spreading it, there was almost a supernatural quality to it, an invisible monster that could strike at any time and our only defense was just making our best guess at how to stay safe. There was a constant anxiety that gnawed at me everytime I made a delivery, wondering if that would be the one that got me infected but having no choice since without the income I couldn't survive.
It was absolutely uncanny how much the real world suddenly felt like the world of Death Stranding. The atmosphere, at least for me, was almost an exact match, and my job only added to that. Death Stranding's story of struggling to overcome such an oppressive world with an unknowable enemy and connect with others was exactly what I needed. It kept me going when I was losing hope.
@@ladams391 That was a wonderful read. Thanks for sharing. :)
It's the euro truck simulator of walking.
I like how lower-budget studios descope games from open world into linear games so money isn’t wasted and players don’t have to deal with a subpar open world experience. Sniper Ghost Warrior is an example I can think of. It turned from driving cars to objective markers and liberating camps to completing important objectives in small/medium maps
What I don't like about BOtW and RDR2 is the complete lack of compelling gameplay.
At no point did I feel challenged or like I was getting better at the game. It was just one useless mechanic after another. I stopped caring about the stupid random dialogue from NPCs, I didn't want to read the 192 piece of paper I found.
The games started to remind me of actual life, a long boring chore for no reason.
I don't talk to random people on the sidewalk because I don't care, I don'r read every book I see because I don't have the time and a lot of them suck.
People seem to like these games because of the quantity of content; unfortunately, only about 10% of that content is good, the rest is just pointless filler.
That's my problem with many open world games; they don't respect my time. Just because you have content doesn't mean I'm having fun having to sit through it.
The thing about RDR2 is it’s a great open world built around an amazing story and cast of characters and probably one of the greatest single game protagonists of all time… Elden Ring is amazing in such a completely different way which makes it so unique. Nice vid man. Just subbed
Could you make a video of YOUR perfect Open World game and what would YOU put in it. What new things would you add?
I know in this one you say which Open World formulas you like already, but make a video where you take all the stuff from different games you like and add your own ideas to make the Greatest Open World out there…
Great commentary!!
That’s a good idea. I’ve had ideas for hypothetical game videos, but I’m still thinking of how to make one work.
Yes! What a great idea!
I still think RGG studios has one of the best open world formulas for their Yakuza/Like a Dragon and Judgement series. It is fundamentally an open world but where so many open world games focus on big expansive worlds, the cities in RGG games are small but densely packed and this gives so much more character to the world. If you dropped me into Kamurocho I could navigate by memory alone, can I say the same for any far cry game?
Outer Wilds is by far the greatest game of all time that not nearly enough people have played (probably because they all think The Outer Worlds is the same game). It has pretty much everything you said an open world should have; an interesting world that's fun to explore without a whole bunch of empty space or reused content. Everything that's in the game has some purpose and interaction with the world, and yet designed in a way that still makes it feel like it exists without you having to be a part of it. The entire game is literally built on the idea that your exploration is the driving force for your progression, so there is always a reason to go off the beaten path and look for something new, since if it looks interesting, it has something for you to discover. Not to mention the fact that it in no way forces you to do ANYTHING aside from one conversation to end the seamless tutorial, and actually beating the game, which itself can be done in the first half-hour of gameplay if you know what you're doing. All of the puzzles are great, and can be solved before you have everything the game wants you to know for it if your clever enough to figure it out yourself, and the game is even designed around that happening. The only hang ups I could see are that there's pretty much no motivation for playing the game outside of exploration (by design), and the controls for the ship you use to fly around are momentum based, and so the ship flies unlike any other vehicle in any game that I know of, which can be hard to get a hang of for a good while. Pretty much, this game's the epitome of exploration, so if you love exploring in open world games, than this is the game for you. (Also it's really easy to spoil due to how the progression works, so if you're going to play it, go in as blind as possible)
I’m a bit mixed on open world games, I tend to prefer more open area games such as Xenoblade, but there are still some good open world games such as BOTW, but the generic ubisoft open world formula can be a turn off from the formula.
Breath of the wild was my first open world game and being pushed into the open world and exploring the map was amazing. It took me multiple weeks to get to one of the divine beast. It was amazing and every open world game after that didn’t feel the same to. I got horizon zero dawn and didn’t have the drive I thought I had to play it.
I love open world games because it feels like I'm getting rewarded for my adhd self. Getting distracted by something cool looking or a side mission is part of the fun for me because it makes it feel like I'm getting my own personal unique experience. There just has to be some kind of plot to eventually follow, or like in sandboxes where I get to set my own goals or I'll just kinda drop it because I got overwhelmed with not knowing what to do.
ADHD isn’t the same for everybody of course, and its the reason i couldn’t make it past chapter 3 in RDR2.
I just wanted to shoot things but i realized every mission didn’t guarantee a long ass shoot out so i got bored fast and never finished it.
@@MysticMayne lol almost me. but the sorry was so worth it. currently replaying it
🔖I feel the same! I love getting distracted by side missions. I know that sounds counter-intuitive but hear me out. In Witcher 3 I was looking for lost miners when I came upon a closed road. Turns out it was closed because a caravan was attacked by a dragon. So I jumped off my horse and followed the trail. Things like that don't happen in bad open world games because their quests are just a checklist of chores. They have no handcrafted side quests.
Mad Max was such a fun game. Idk if it’s just nostalgia from playing twisted metal as a kid, but the collisions felt brutal and the vehicle customization allowed for some pretty cool combinations. Very Ubisoft-like structure though.
I had a lot of fun with the game, but the open world was one of the most boring. Car combat was awesome though.
@@Lextorias oh yeah the open world was definitely its worst element lol
@@Lextorias What about ghost of tsushima, horizion zero dawn, horizon forbidden west, marvel's spiderman and the witcher 3? All of these have some repetition, but also are all phenomenal games imo.
Mad Max was a blast a hidden treasure for sure
Unironically the best 'checkpoint' open world I've played is LEGO Friends on the DS.
There are 5 areas, each has one of the girls' quests mostly in that area, the areas aren't massive, maybe 10 loading screens at most for the horse ranch, and there are enough interactable sections in each that they don't feel like a chore to go through (most of the time.)
This is a VERY good video. Your thoughts are clearly articulated, have purpose and show the points you make are those with merit rather than some angry gamer just talking jazz. I also like your deadpan humor... I look forward to watching more of your content.
You know what at first i was pissed looking at the title. But actually you made really really good points. I do kinda feel that way when playing Spiderman.. Open world games needs more lively feel to it like Red dead redemption and skyrim. Good stuff bro
10:52 The only 2 games using Ubisoft formula that I enjoyed were Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon ...and LEGO City Undercover.
At least when stuff is made of bricks, it's easier to forgive the artificial-ity of the world design.
Had no idea you were the Elden Ring guy I listened to for an hour. Love your style! Hope to see the channel continue to thrive. Soon as you acknowledged both BDG and NakeyJakey I knew you were credible
Gotta pay homage to the GOATs
I enjoyed the commentary and agreed with a lot of the points being made, but honestly I don't think Dying Light deserves to be lumped into the boring open world category. The parkour in that game felt amazing, and I feel like mechanically at least, it was enough to set it apart from other generic open world titles of its time.
I feel like why Spiderman and Sonic Frontiers are less icky to me compared to Ubisoft/Bethesda/Rockstar games is that you can swiftly navigate through them.
I’m burned out from open world games unless they can make them easy to push through. It felt like these were pushed in response to the “short call of duty campaign” complaints.
I don’t know if you’ll consider the trails of series as open world, but the fact that almost every npc has at least 2 dialogues every new chapter in each game, even returning random npcs from previous games, and a good explanation for why places look the way they do - is far more immersive than anything else I’ve seen these days.
I absolutely love the trails series
(My profile pic is Lloyd bannings from crossbell)
"One of the first consoles I got was the Playstation 3..."
Man, I feel really old now.
Perfectly described EVERY open world driving/racing game. I am absolutely SICK of seeing any of them with how they waste the player's time with nothing to do except drive from an event to another event, just make it a list i can quickly select that does not waste my time.
I'm glad I found your channel thru the Elden Ring video. Gotta say, you have quality content and a ton of potential to grow a great channel. Your humor is witty and sarcastic, yet the videos still feel very light and easy to watch. Curious to see how you'll be doing in a few years.
It would be really cool to know what flavors of the open world you'll give to the Witcher 3 and Gothic trilogy. Those games are pretty unique, and it would be interesting to listen your thoughts about them.
I was honestly surprised that he didn't mention Witcher 3. It's not a flawless game but I love the random unlisted quests you can find when exploring, and all the story.
I think Witcher 3 is a mix between the Bethesda and Rockstar open worlds.
The game that actually got me back into Open World games was A Short Hike. A Game so small you can see everything it has to show you in an afternoon. But it's an open world so refreshing that it honestly rivals that of a lot of triple A titles in execution.
The game gives you one goal: climb to the peak of Hawk Peak Provincial Park. From there you'll spend the next hour or two scouring the island for feathers in what I can only describe as instant summer vacation in a tin.
The platforming is great, exploration is well rewarded, and the characters and stories you come across are heartwarming and memorable. It's everything good about open world games smashed into a bite sized package.
One of my favorite parts is how the game helps you navigate. There are no maps, no way points, just you the island, it's various landmarks and... oh yeah... the Soundtrack! Each part of the island has its own song that slowly transforms itself. The swish percussion of the beach, the flowing strings of the forest, the light tickling keys of the marina. One of the most magical moments I've had in gaming has been just getting absolutely turned around early on and suddenly hearing the familiar, upbeat melodies of the starting area welcoming me home. Seriously awesome.
Not to mention it's currently the price of a McDonald's meal.
Sounds pretty good.I'll have to get it.
Based game, finished it in under an hour. Will return to it eventually, it really feels like vacation
Zelda BOTW is the first Game I played where the world felt real. I almost never did quests on purpose, more of an accident because I was on a mission to explore every inch of that Map 😍 Anyways, good video! Subbed so I look forward to seeing what you produce
For me it is Rdr2
@@ronan1686 I need to play that Game again! I did not get very far because I made the typical Gamer mistake of playing too many Games at once and it fell through the cracks
Fantastic Video!! Even though I don't 100% feel the way you do on every game, your great presentation makes your argumentation very clear! And the overall gist is what I agree the most with.
Hope your channel continues to grow!
New Vegas' quests were sometimes crazy intricate. With speech options often giving you different outcomes if a particular stat was high enough. Heck, some perks gave you extra dialogue options that could end sidequests differently, like in the Fort, when you're retrieving a little girl's teddy bear, you normally have to fight an attack dog to get it back, but with the perk Animal Friend, you can convince the dog trainer that the dog wouldn't attack you, getting the bear for free. Little things like that give a game that takes ages to complete reason to play it again and again.
You made me understand why I don't like most open world games. Most of them could pass as linear games with filler that are dumbed down moments of main missions. I have the most fun when I'm just blazing through the story missions and ignoring the actual world because the main content have unique moments and set pieces that are actually engaging. Meanwhile, the world is scattered with side missions that are basically chores that you do just because there is a reward at the end. The open world games I do like allow me to interact with the world simply because it's fun while the rewards are residual benefits.
I think the most recent Assassin's Creed games, especially Valhalla, are the worst offenders of this genre. Whenever I play them, I always get this feeling of "is this all there is in this game? Is there really nothing more worth exploring?" I also really liked HFW but I definitely agree that it's not unique. In fact, maybe a nitpick but I swear the main character Aloy just won't shut up about anything. It really is like the game is afraid I'll miss an opportunity to strike an enemy or that I might miss a point of interest or dialogue in the game. Like can't I just have some peace and quiet for once?
I remember when I was a kid, and the concept of open world games just seemed to be the objectively best thing... But as I grew older, I started appreciating more directed gaming experiences a bit more too. There's a place for both, but it can get too much of either one too. As with everything in life, it's all about balance.
I absolutely agree with u.I dont know why whenever a new trend starts every studio has to do the same.That happened with the ww2 trend in the 00s,the battle royal and now with the open world.Is it the lack of creativity or the money that they think they will make?In my view I d like if every studio kept doing their thing without trying to conply to "the new trend"
Spider-Man’s traversal and amazing looking Manhattan is probably the only reason I completed the game til the end. I found myself a getting fatigued a bit toward the end but the sim of its parts made it bearable.
The first console you ever owned was a PS3, fuck me Im getting old, mine was an NES, with the mario bros/duck hunt cart and an orange light gun. So yeah im not tired of open world games, I just want better ones.
i loved the gta 5 side quests. I played the game 4 different times, but during the main story i never played the sides. Once you finish the story though, with one of the best finales in my opinion, you are left with “and now what?”. Side quests were perfect to see the characters again, giving a better and also fun experience by seeing them acting in different situations
Glad that you talked about MGSV favourably, it definitely deserves more credit for what it is.
Very insightful! I liked when you talked about the open world being no more useful than a mission select screen. I would like to see an open world that doesn't become disposable or useless "after clearing the radio towers and looting all the camps", but at the same time, clearing out such things holds meaning in the game world, even if it were to go on without you.
One example would be in BOTW, being able to discover a hidden way to break the curse of the blood moon. You could play the whole game and never know about it, so enemy encounters always remained, and bases continually refilled. Or, you could find it and stop it, making real progress in bringing Hyrule back, so to speak.
I've heard other takes that talk about the balance between intrinsic and extrinsic rewards in game, and how not every little thing needs to grant you something tangible/useable in-game; how a nice, optional moment can be it's own reward. There should be a balance of course, but more effort into meaningful actions.
Everything you say is absolutely right to me. But you forgot a fundamental and best example of open world, The Witcher 3.
I love open world games, by far my favourite types of games. that being said, not enough open world games have a good, fun and compelling open world to run around in.
About RPG’s such as xenoblade?
I've been looking for an explanation why I can't enjoy Horizon Zero Dawn or AC Mirage but can smash 5000 hours in Cyberpunk and Elden ring. I thought it was age but it's that the world in these games like AC Valhalla and Farcry are dead and exist to cater for the question marks on the map whereas The Witcher 3 and Baldurs Gate 3 are alive whether you're looking or not and that takes so much of the weight and overwhelmingness of the task ahead off your shoulders and allows you to take the game at your pace. Thanks for this.
I disagree with ghost of Tsushima, some of it is really really great world building and has a ton to do, but I get why you put it there. Think about it like this, if you clear all of them you live the combat. I’m aware it’s repetitive, if they added some extra challenges to spice it up it would have fun, but what if it was a level design where you couldn’t control how many you did or did not clear. That would not be fun either
I can agree with most of what you said about the Ubisoft style, but if Spider-Man lost all of its missions, I would still love just swinging around in the NYC that Insomniac games created. Good video 🎉
Part of what we need I think, is to remove the objective markers of most side things (unless you discover them by being right next to them). Let the player mark the map with all kinds of symbols. Don't tell us there are X of thing Y usually.
I saw another video about this. Essentially, make it feel like all parts of the map and game are worth doing. It's worth exploring and finding shrines in Zelda BOTW (and TOTK) for example because it improves your health bar or stamina. It's worth finding treasure, items, or parts from those too. It's worth wandering the map and encountering random people and helping them because the rewards feel worth it for the effort and you organically discovered them and feel more invested because you brought your own agency into it. Same with anything you find, you have more incentive to do something with that content because you discovered it on your own instead of being given a map with 1000 pin points on it that someone else put there. Beating up monsters for their parts is worth it because it helps you upgrade your armor. And it's fun. It's fun to explore because the traversal is fun. It's fun to fight. The cooking needs a shortcut. And I wish the music was the music from the snes zelda instead of the music we got. But these two zeldas are my favorite zeldas now.
Elden Ring is also amazing. And it taught me things about Zelda, open world games, dark souls games and games in general. I really hope the next ubisoft games will start to experiment in how the maps and content discovery is handled.
I haven’t finished probably the last 3-4 open world games I started. They are almost too complicated and I sometimes can go months without playing video games. At that point I’ve lost interest or can’t even remember how to play! That’s why I’ve come to like the more linear story driven games that take 12 hrs to beat.
Yeah, I am sure open world games are great for people with a lot of free time, but for those who work at least 40hrs a week and have a social life, you have at most several hours every week to play video games. You don't want to devote months to a single open world game, so more linear, less padded out games work the best, or non-story games where you just jump in to the gameplay, have some fun and turn it off (racing, multiplayer shooters, sports games etc.).
@@mrgalaxy396 Yah I work a week on week off schedule. My work week is 12 hr days and 7 days a week (sometimes more if filling in for OT). But then I do get a week off. However I find on my week off I am out doing stuff more, traveling, working on projects etc. So ya I rarely play video games after work so complex open world games just don't work for me.
This makes me remember all of the controversy a few yeas back about whether or not Genshin Impact was going to be Breath of the Wild but homework copied slightly differently. In terms of this video essay, I think it's got a pretty dang unique flavor of its own, but at the same time I feel like the world itself is so crammed with puzzles and sidequests and filler that, unlike botw where everything is naturally integrated into the environment and a fun surprise to discover, Genshin makes all of this extra content into quests about cookie cutter npcs we don't care about, or into world puzzles that stick out like a sore thumb and make the environment less breathtaking (in my opinion). Not to mention the money making aspect with the gacha part of the game is so heavily emphasized in every part of the game, from getting weapons to getting materials for said weapons, etc, that the open world part of the game is sometimes forgettable. I'm curious to hear others' thoughts on Genshin's open world, since it's the main reason I began playing in the first place.
I adore genshin’s open world. I love walking around Cider Lake and the beautiful forests of Mondstadt, I love walking through the streets of Liyue browsing through the street stalls, or chilling around Wangshu Inn…
But the peak of world-building for me was Liyue. Inazuma was fun, but the layered terrain was complicated to navigate, and some of the puzzles seemed to divert from the main story/overall lore of the place rather than contribute to it. Whereas Liyue’s puzzles seemed to tell a story about the legend and myths associated with the land, Inazuma’s felt more similar to the puzzles you’d find on the Midsummer Island Adventure islands-puzzles for puzzle’s sake, which can be fun if it’s placed in an event, but can be tiring as a focal aspect of a land.
As a side note, I feel that the npcs not being voiced takes away from the immersive experience, making the quests seem like a chore for those who don’t like reading long text.
As for the similarities to breath of the wild, I can’t really say anything since I haven’t played bot.
As for the gacha aspect taking away from the open world, I honestly don’t see how. I understand if the it affected the gameplay and the combat, as the characters and weapons that you own directly affects how you play. But for the open world aspect, how you interact with the world is the same regardless of which character you play as, none of the areas/quests are blocked by the gacha.
@@m.i7211 I love Liyue too! What I mostly meant was that much of the little bits of exploration such as combat trials, chests, etc require characters good at combat, which can be difficult if you keep pulling poorly. And I agree with what you said about Inazuma, I believe that the puzzles realy aren't connected to Inazuma at all other than many of them being electro based. I like that puzzles in Sumeru play with the extensive landscape and that some puzzles in Liyue and Monstadt require learning more about the land and/or its lore to figure out instead. The open world exploration otherwise is absolutely gorgeous and there are so many hidden details, hehe!
@@Piarte_Anchoritz Ah that makes sense. I do feel that in genshin most of the characters are competent in combat though. Of course there are characters that overpower other characters, but having those characters just mean that you can win battles more quickly because you can deal more damage per blow. Default characters like Noelle and Shangling can also be super strong if built well, although their fighting styles may not be as flashy as the rarer characters.
I think that when it comes to puzzles and quests, not having certain characters won’t prevent you from completing them.
What bothers me more is that players have to rely on rng to get good artifacts, which affects the combat the most imo. Since Genshin is free and works like a mobile game and relies on gacha/battle pass revenue, they have to keep people playing until the new updates come, so they implement a never-ending grind system that can feel like it’s not worth it sometimes.
@@m.i7211 agreed!
I was surprised when he said that Bethesda’d made the one game where there are hundreds of books you don’t have to read, because Genshin also does that. You can collect volumes of books, read them if you want, etc. And even the world bosses and their material drops have connections to the lore. But if you just want to kill them, you don’t have to pay attention to any of that.
The story is kind of linear though
I wish Horizon Zero Dawn and the 2018 GoW were just on rails. They slapped open world mechanics and quest design on intimate, character-focused journeys. GoW was far better about this, but large sections of the game still felt forced. Actually playing Zero Dawn was a chore from beginning to end, but there were a few hours of great storytelling sandwiched in there.
Not sure if you've played Xenoblade Chronicles X, but that game has, in my opinion, one of the best and most refreshing open worlds in the genre. Sure, there are a couple of your typical trappings like the towers you can go after that reveal more of the map, but not only is it filled with a wide variety to kill and loot, but also collectables you can gather for experience points, for cash, or for side quests. Later on you also unlock your own mech that you can use to traverse the world, flying through the sky or driving around on the ground. You can also discover new alien races that'll help you out if you help them out as well, selling you new armor sets, weapons, items, costumes. Oh yeah, it also takes place on an alien planet and the environments are honestly awe-inspiring. It may have been on the WiiU but it looks so damn good. The only negatives I can give it is the facial animations are pretty stiff (mostly because this was Monolith's first HD game and had to adapt to new tech.) and the story, while interesting ends on a cliffhanger that may or may not be resolved in the future.
Assassins creed Odyssey was my breaking point i've really struggled to enjoy open world games since it was beyond bloated.
I played Odyssey late because the DLC looked so cool. By the time I finished the main game I was so exhausted with the game I barely touched the DLC. Definitely could’ve stood to be about half the size and half the content. I’m planning to avoid the “UBIsoft formula” from now on. So burnt out on it.
As Extra Credits put it in one of their videos about this very topic, games should not be open world unless it actually adds something. So many games are actively worse *because* of them being open world. Why spread out content far away when people play for the content? Now I'm not a fan of "on rails" games, I actually find them pretty boring. While that's just my personal opinion, I still much rather play a game like that than an empty open world with no purpose. Games like Skyrim do open world right *because* it actually adds to the gameplay. They also put a lot of effort into making the world feel alive and filled in, even when you're out in the middle of nowhere. I could write a whole essay on Skyrim itself, but that's basically my thoughts on how open world should be used, if even.
An addendum to this, something was mentioned near the end of this video that made me realize what makes an open world "good". I think open world works best when everything is optional and explorable. "I want games built around their open worlds, not open worlds built around a game." A fantastic way to end the video.
I think one of the most unique open world game and one I would put up there as the best is outer wilds. Its an underrated game that is probably not for most people, its an exploration game with no combat put into it ,the story is told mostly in text but the writing is great at engaging the audience to explore more , the only tools you need to beat the game is only at the start of the game, its unique because you can beat the game less than 30 minutes if you fully understand the whole lore. The game is fully open at the start and the only thing you need to worry about is the vacuum of space and the hazards it brings to your spaceship, don't spoil yourself at all if you're planning to play this unique game,go absolutely blind and take your time
I’ve heard lots about it but never played. I’ll have to check it out!
+1 for Outer Wilds. But I think it's a disservice to think of it as an open world game, because of that term's connotations. I prefer to call it open-ended.
@@sgbench true, open ended does sound better for a game like outer wildd
+1 for outer wilds it's so good, although it's DEFINETLY not underrated, I see people praising it almost daily!
Outer wilds is becoming more and more popular and it absolutely deserves it, it was criminally unknown a couple years ago. Still struggle getting friends to give the game a shot