Fishing Waders are a Ripoff
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- Опубликовано: 20 ноя 2022
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In my 12+ years of fishing in the Pacific Northwest I've owned many pairs of waders. All eventually fail but many, even expensive models, failed far too quickly especially when compared to other similar technical garments.
Here is a list of the waders I've owned ranked from best to worst:
- Simms G3 Guide Waders (100+ trips): bassproshops.vzck.net/Yg6dGO
- USIA Waders (70 trips): Out of business
- Simm Freestone: (60 trips): amzn.to/3tRt55g
- Orvis Pro Waders (60 trips): bassproshops.vzck.net/jWk10n
- Frogg Toggs Hellbender: (less than 5 trips X 2): amzn.to/3TUr6aL
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The trick to making waders last is to get married and have kids! All kidding aside, you’ve got a great Chanel with great content. Thank you for making these videos.
Haha 😂
@@spiltmilt I’ve had simms primarily also Patagonia (least favorite) Dan Bailey waders lasted a surprisingly long time (I was impressed) current simms I’m fishing have worked well and I would recommend sending waders to Simms for professional patch work repair. When I’ve done this simms knew exactly what I was wearing under the waders just through wear.
So true haha
Bwahaha 😂
I loved that joke
I have a $50 pair of garbage waders, with a little wax melted onto the seams. 8 years later, my garbage waders still work great.
Same here! I fish steelhead in the Midwest so I don’t care if they breathe (rubber waders are warmer). No way in hell am I paying 100s of $$ for something that lasts only a couple of years.
I’ve gotten 5-6 seasons out of a cheap BiMart Allen wader and then had to patch seams on more expensive waders. Honestly, at this point I’m going to stick with comfortable waders that cost $100 and keeping a $12 can of Flex Seal on hand.
Yeah, I had some micro leaks I had trouble finding and sealing, and I just sprayed the area with Flex Seal and they held up fine all summer. I don't really expect that to be a long term fix, but easy and at least works for a while!
Have you guys tried patching with Freesole? Just curious.
@@outdoorloser4340 I have not
Cool tip thanks
Flex seal and Gorilla duct tape will make a $99 set of waders last an extra season or 2 for sure
Same experience as a lot of other commenters here. I am a biologist and have spent hundreds of days in the field in waders. Work that’s hard on gear like wilderness redd surveys and building and maintaining fish fences. 20 years ago all the waders were crap then simms started making these amazing models like the guides, then g3/4s. Those lasted forever and were way more comfortable. I bought a new pair last year and they are much flimsier than older models despite being much more expensive. Cost has gone up far beyond consumer price index so it doesn’t make sense. Maybe there’s a new better brand of top of the line stuff now, I don’t know?
I can't agree more. My old G4s finally gave up the ghost. I bought a pair of G3s (couldn't afford G4s) and I have been less than impressed.
Dryft blows any Simms waders out of the water
Typical corporate find a way to make it cheaper and charge more..
Grunden’s?
It's because of the material advancements. Modern gortex pro is significantly more light weight and supple than what they were using 20 years ago. And its breathable so you're not wearing a water balloon on your lower half. It does the job without having to be 20lbs and half an inch thick. Nobody wants that. However, they COULD make them more durable, but then they wouldn't be able to sell you new $700 waders every 2 years.
I’ve been fishing since I could walk, so 40 ish years lol! And I have never had a pair of waders last more than two seasons. I’ve spent anywhere from $60 to $400 on a pair, and the only difference I noticed was comfort. Price seems to have zero effect on longevity 🤣
Google backcountry skinz
I'm hearing two things. Buy low cost waders. Or, buy a dry-suit, cut off the top, add suspenders!
My Dad bought a second hand diving drysuit that had a damaged zipper about 20 years ago. He got it quite cheap, I forget what he paid for it, anyway he cut the top off below the zipper (It was across the shoulders) and sewed the inbuilt braces at the top where he cut it down (to stop it flopping down). He's still using them!
Awesome 👏
Thanks for making this video. I’ve been looking into waders. As a guy on a budget I won’t feel like I’m wasting money on the less expensive brands/models when I pull the trigger to buy.
On a side note, you’re comment about Patagonia made me think of something. I’d love to see you do a video about the whole “hatchery vs wild” argument. I hear tons of opinions out there, but almost none of them educated. I’d love to hear someone like yourself come at it with science and statistics.
I'm ignorant on this. What's the argument about "hatchery vs wild"? Please educate me
@@kirkhuffstater5565Is fishing for stocked fish really fishing? Is it sporting to follow the hatchery truck? Are you a real man if you hoist out a dazed and confused old hatchery breeder, and put it on your stringer?
@@kirkhuffstater5565it’s like hunting on a ranch that breeds deer to be killed. You are going where there is 100% going to be game, the guides know where the game is at all times, the game is not shy, and your chances of success are excessively high. Basically, you’re “shooting fish in a barrel”. You don’t have to hunt at all. It’s handed to you. Same with fishing in a hatchery. There are excessive amounts of fish, and you know what type and where they’re going to be.
It’s like how you would set up a game for a child. You make it easier for them so they enjoy it. It’s the same here. Take the challenge out of it so these city guys can come give you money to say they did something over the weekend with low effort and high yield.
Google backcountry skinz
I totally agree with you. I had a pair of high end neoprene waders. After 2 seasons of moderate fishing, the developed the rub leak. And, you don’t know the rub is till you are in the coldest water of the fishing season.
I bought my first set of waders back in about 1974 or 75. Just out of grad school, and not a whole lot of income, I got a pair which were booted, thick-walled - and cheap. They are still holding up, in spite of stream fishing for steelhead and surf fishing for red tail perch. Heavy as all get out, cumbersome and not as "nice" as the expensive stuff I saw older (then) fishermen wearing, while they plied the waters with their expensive rods and reels or fly gear. Not sure if that makes any difference to the conversation; I have looked at the far lighter waders, but have never been able to justify the expense when what I have still works. And if that newer lighter stuff wears leaks quickly, it is even less of an incentive to change up. Oh, and the only time mine breathe is when I step out of them.
I've had same problem with waders lasting. My best luck was actually with cheaper frogg togs.
Frogg toggs don’t even last me 2 weeks on the bank. I buy a pair every season and throw them away every year 😩 The glue seams just fall apart
There's an industry term for that, though I think I'm spelling it wrong, "Planned Obselences." If was originally introduced with household appliances; vacuums, refrigerators, water heaters, washers and dryers. Then it extended to other industries. Put a 5 year warranty on an item that, on average, will fail in 6 years. Build it in a way, that it'll last just beyond whatever warranty period is chosen. Many manufacturers will intentionally build a product, with a part that, when it fails, is just expensive enough, that replacement is cheaper than the fix.
I just experienced that very thing with a refrigerator. Luckily i'm retired and had the time and enough know-how to do a repair that cost me $60. To have it repaired would have likely run $400-$500 minimum. Planned obselences indeed !
Obsolescence programmée. Absolument.
Spot on and it seems to be getting worse. Always loved simms waders, but their new G3 & G4 waders are paper thin compared to the old reliable ones from just a few years ago. We want thicker, warmer; longer lasting waders not $600 throw away ones
Agreed! My current G3s are junk compared to my old ones.
Agree! My favorite waders were the original guide waders from years ago. These lasted soo long I didn't need to look for new ones until the quality started to drop off. The new so called "guide classic" are no where near the same wader, I can't believe they are pretending they are the same
Love your reviews and topics that matter.
Personally I buy cheap waders and replace when needed. A $600, two season wader is not in my wheelhouse and agree they are built to fail.
Great post. I feel the same. I also use the same philosophy when buying rain jackets. I get 5yrs out of $30 Frogg Togg jackets while guys I know who have $200 jackets have to replace them over the same period.
@@rustyknott-W.Drain jackets have never failed me in the way he described waders failing. Ive ONLY seen High end rain jackets get ruined if people walk through a raspberry patch or gorse or sitting too close to a sparky fire.
A friend told me the story of Caterpillar Inc. builders of heavy equipment. Their equipment was too well built and lasted too long so they switched to inferior materials -- reducing the equipment's life span and increasing sales for parts, services, new orders etc... It's the same for many industries too. For example, how long do today's kitchen appliances last vs 20 years ago...and so on... Thanks for the video...I'm thinking about buying cheap waders and wearing a wet suit underneath....
Could Not agree more, god it’s insane. The price of these things are crazy now. I refuse to spend more then 300 dollars on a pair now. I’ve been fishing for 20+ years and haven’t had a pair last more then 2 years. Was running G3’s and Redington’s the last few years both are beyond shot at 2 years old. Covered in aqua seal at this point and I’m still soaked.
I have had the same problems, they al leak after awhile. Bill Wetzel the surf casting guide from L.I.had a similar video. Like yourself I am forced to use waders with an inseam longer than my legs and that has impacted both the wear and comfort. You put out good and well thought out content.
I've had the Dryft S14 for 3 years now. They probably get ~25 days of use mostly in the winter with some spring and summer on the Oregon coast. The wader material itself seems pretty stout. It has taken some thick brush, including blackberry, and more than a handful of falls with no leaks or holes. I did have to send my first pair back in due to leaking neoprene booties but Dryft was great and sent me a new pair. I was planning on trying Simms whenever these Dryfts give up the ghost but this video has me thinking twice.
stick with dryft 100% and support a small business my next pair will be dryfts only heard good things
Well, it's comforting to know that at least I'm not the only one...I don't feel that I do anything excessive to wear these products out but waders and wading boots seem to be my nemeses.....I feel that I care for my gear reasonably well, yet I feel lucky to get a season out of either waders or boots- to the point that I've stopped buying boots at all and just use Chucks, or the same sandals I wear for wet wading in summer ( Tevas, Chacos)...
...I have had multiple brand name waders and have been fortunate with Orvis Products... I walk long distances through some heavy brush , wear them wade and drift fishing from a one man pontoon.... A few things I do practice... Hang them to dry as much as possible when fishing a few days back to back...and afterwards make sure to dry them thorougly... I also wear either Fleece or Soft Cotton lounging pants to avoid inside wear from rubbing.... I also found purchasing a size that allows easy bending or knelling to help..
As for Company Warranty's ?? When purchasing a pair of Waders it pays to know when they were manufactured..?? How long have they been In-Stock..It does come into play for warranty it seems.... Thank You.... Tight Lines // Dry Waders..
Google backcountry skinz
Really interesting video.
I fish out of a boat most often. I own a set of cheap set of Allen waders that are mostly used when fishing out of my small pontoon on no motor lakes. I probably only have 15 days of walking rivers on these waders as when it is warm out I just wet wade.
I expect the lower end outer wear to leak after time but I did not expect the more expensive brands to fail so quickly.
Tyler, I think you're both spending too much and expecting too much. I purchased a pair of Simms Zip up the front waders and after 4 years they began to leak. I sent them back to Simms for repair and was pleased when they said they couldn't be repaired at the seam and sent me a brand new pair! Wow! Out of warranty! That's darn good customer service. So, learning my lesson, I decided to buy less expensive waders in the $125 range and have been really pleased with my new Reddingtons not leaking after 5 years of use mainly in the salt for Oregon surf perch as well as in the Deschutes, Wilson and Necanicum for steelhead. What I've learned about waders is don't spend too much, take extra good care of them and just expect failure, usually fixable by yourself, after 4 years or so. Good video Tyler. Hope to see you on the Willamette next spring! Tight lines, Mark in Portland
I'm on my 3rd season with a set of simms headwaters mid price. Hopefully they last a while longer . No leaks yet knock on wood 😂. I don't have the rubbing issue between my legs though and I'm sure that helps. Great video man!!
I think overall the point you are making is valid which is that waders are a consumable item that are not lasting as long as they should for the price, but a few thoughts:
1 - I would guess the motion of hiking in the waders creates more abrasion than the pedaling motion in a kayak. Having done both (walk in waders and pedal in a dry suit), there's a lot more "swishing" when walking in waders than when I pedal my Hobies. Hiking in waders seems to me the #1 cause of premature wear of waders. Something i have done to keep my duck hunting waders around longer is to not hike into the blind in them as much as I can (I also do that to not overheat). I would wager that if you were were not hiking miles in fishing waders that they would last a bit longer. I would also guess that your dry suits probably have more pin hole leaks than you normally realize since you aren't typically subjecting them to constant submergence.
2 - From what I understand, breathable fabrics/membranes have essentially zero stretch. As such, if they are bit tight, you will really pull on the seams which is an easy way to cause premature leakage. So it is important to make sure the fabric is abit looser in those areas (like knees) so that you move within the wader rather than stressing the seams. Problem is, loose fabric = abrasion wear. Seems like companies could add reinforcements in key areas (like a lot of fishing dry suits are) to help there. They could also just make the face fabric in the 3 layer construction a higher weight to improve durability. This would add weight to the wader, but if done in key areas it could help with durability (I have seen this in some jackets, like an Arcteryx I have where they use heavier face fabric on the shoulders and elbows where you see wear from backpacks and brushing into things).
3 - If I recall, these days you aren't the biggest fan of Kokatat these days, but have you tried their line of bibs (essentially stocking foot waders)? It looks like Level 6 and NRS also make a similar bib/wader.
4 - I don't think I saw it mentioned in the video, but in your opinion, what is a reasonable life for waders? I think measuring in trips is a bit hard just because 1 trip could mean hop out of the car and walk to the river or 1 trip could be a 3 mile hike each way.
Great vid, Thank you. All great points and could not agree more the industry does seem to make the products for "job security" not product longevity. I live on the east coast , fish lake Ontario and tribs through the fall and a lot of the time it's bush wracking to get to other spots, last pair of waders I threw away was patched with silicone over 14 times. Not everyone can afford 200 to $ 500 every other season for waders. My nxt pair will prob be a dry suit.
I am using $100-140 breathable stocking foot waders - the best has been the Cabelas with a zipper, now going on 12 uses. One problem surfaced at 10 uses - the elastic cord at the top pulled into the sleeve. Now, most of the time I am using them to launch and recover a duckboat, minimal walking around streambanks. So with your information, I will just keep going with what I have. The waders you describe cost way more than my shotgun and waders combined. The drysuit comparison is interesting, never considered them as an alternative. I have used a lot of neoprene waders for work, fishing and hunting and still have 3. They need to be a little oversize or they will open up in the crotch area.
When I started fishing 40 years ago I was a kayaker. And I would just use my neoprene Farmer John's because I couldn't afford waiters too. They worked great for years and years. They had some holes in there but I was always warm. And if I got too hot I could just roll the top down. When I got my first pair of neoprene waders they seemed so much more clunky.
I came across those farmer johns in the garage the other day. I don't think they could stretch far enough to fit now. Haha
110% accurate. Been thinking this for years and years after countless pairs of waders.
I’m so glad I found this video and your channel,I am with you on the lack of reliability of 6-7-8 hundred dollar waders. If fact I’m in the market for a new set, since my Simms waders are failing , I will say I’ve had them for 6 years.
Went through two pairs of stocking foot waders while steelheading all week on a trip. Of course my feet started to go numb when the water starting leaking in slowly. At this point I feel like fishing out of boats more with muck boots on and regular pants with all weather bibs. I will only wade in the summer months when its more fun anyways. I loved my Steelheader titaniums before they died.
I've recently purchased a pair of Dryft waders. Been out once so far. I've heard good things about these folks. Priced less than Simms. I feel like any wader you buy they will eventually leak. Especially around the neoprene boot seams. That gets me every time! I think Dryft adds an extra seam to their products.
I’m on my 3rd pair of waders in 3 years. First pair were Patagonia’s, lasted about 14months. Next pair Orvis Pro’s, lasted 18 months. Now on my 3rd pair, Orvis Pro’s again. I fish 50 plus days a year, year round. I’m out in summer’s heat and briars and winter’s snow & cold. Agree, sometimes I think there is obsolescence built in. A dry suit’s not a bad idea! Not sure where I’ll go next time. Maybe Simms.
Tony
Dang i feel your pain
I wonder if it would be a good option to just wear a dry suit but then have some kind of hook/thorn protection on top (loose wetsuit, broke waders, or something).
Looking at my fishing logs, I did 76 trips last year and have done 63 trips this year. The vast majority using my dry suit. My current pair of waders I got from Cabela's last October and they're already leaking a bit.
Edit: I've worn the Cabela's waders 17 times.
I guess I'm old school. I've never wasted money on that stuff. I'm 73 years old and I've worn either shorts or jeans right into the water since I was a kid.
I’ve had some simms G3’s for three years now of hard use. I probably have ~200 days on them, lots of walking, lots of blackberry brush bashing. The key is to send them in for repairs each year. Simms will fix all pinhole leaks, reinforce seams, replace booties and pressure test the waders before sending them back. First ones free, $60 after that. Makes them last a lot longer and is worth it. Plus you can find them on sale from time to time. Paid 330 for mine.
I got mine on clearance because I'm a midget. Half price baby.
Like many others here, I get failures mostly in the booties. I have begun wearing waterproof stockings (pants too) whenever I am in waders. That way, if there are small leaks, the water never touches my skin. I can always extend my wader use that way. Have never bought an expensive pair as it has always been the opinion that those don't last any longer. I can get up to three seasons with mine but I don't fish as much as you guys. I am in waders maybe 30 times a year.
Hopefully, the company's see this video and read the comments. That way they can get educated on their products. Personally they should last at least five years and not cost an arm and a leg.
My original Simms Guide waders were fished 200+ days with no leaks until we ran into submerged barbwire on Taylor River in Colorado. The next pair of Simms Guides and Orvis waders both leaked within a season. Now I have Frogg Toggs and Paramount. I take both pair on every trip, and have yet to have an issue. (Knock on wood.)
40 years ago my Dad bought my brother and me each a pair of Cabelas 330 Cordura waders. Those were incredibly rugged. Wore them when rabbit hunting through all kinds of thorns. Lost them so tried to find the same. They use much heavier Cordura now. I liked the light weight and certainly didn't need heavier to resist tears. I would still recommend looking for a Cordura pair. Mine lasted 20 years of heavy use before I lost them probably when moving.
That was because they were then mad in the USA !
I dont much use waders but I'd wonder just for kicks whether or not a altertered dry suit could last longer than a set of waders. Someone who alters cloths could easily remove the sleeves, change the cut and add a set of suspenders to a dry suit.
I used to duck hunt and wear Hodgeman canvas faced rubber waders. I hated them for warm water times of year fishing because they did not breathe at all, yet they were extremely durable as I would walk to ponds in woods through areas of briars/thorns and just tree branches beating them. They lasted 10 years until an exposed nail in a duck blind d poked a whole in them, but all I did was patch them. They wore in-between the thighs and crotch area just like you mentioned, but still lasted. They were just cumbersome and you needed to wear heavy soft fleece to make them comfortable.
Interesting you mentioned using your waders in a Kayak and pedaling. The breathable waders I used I would sometimes ride my mountain bike with them. The motion of my legs pedaling is not the same scissor type motion of walking. I have not tested this theory out, but just think if you walked in your dry suit as much as your waders (or vice versa), would the wear and tare be the same or at least similar. As I said, I don't know for sure, but I'm just putting that out there for consideration. Oddly enough my Hodgeman waders were less than a hundred bucks and literally took a beating. I just delt with their design but made it work. Unfortunately I would not recommend them for fishing which is primarily done in warmer times of the year.
I don't fish with waders but I sail a lot in the cold months and my current drysuit lasted 4 years before I sold it to my friend which he is still using. It ran me $600 but has held up fine. I'd recommend Gill if anyone is looking for a drysuit since they use neoprene gaskets which are in my opinion a lot more comfortable and durable than the latex ones. Sandiline also makes a really good drysuit.
I personally haven't had seams etc burst on me. My main issue is the sole. Gets worn down to the point it leaks.
I bought a pair of dryft this year and they se well made. I bought them because my nephew is tough on his gear and they hold up. Caddis waders for the price lasted for 3 years and bought a new pair of hodgeman. They are tough but out of business now I think. Simms does make nice warm items but as said 700.00 is ALOT for 3 years use. Have also found inexpensive waders honor warranties well into the purchase. I do like the dryft and also purchased last years rain jacket for 150.00 new it's 350.00 plus dryft plants a tree for every purchase. They have the BEST customer service as well . Thanks for the vids! Time to get ready for early Steelie trip! Cheers gentlemen.👍🎣🎣🎣💯
Great Video especially those looking to step into expensive waders. Would love to see you try the high end Dryft Waders. I'm on year 2 of my Simms G3 and so far I like them, but yes, I'm dreading the day they fail.
What's interesting about the Dryft waders is they specifically describe their more expensive zipper front wader as a 3 season wader and their less expensive non-zip wader as a 4 season wader. I actually spend more of the winter/shoulder seasons in waders than the summer when I prefer to wet wade.
@@spiltmilt The leave out summer when they say 3 season for their top tier waders.
I have been on the fence for quite some time about buying waders, and believe me I have looked at them all. I finally considered some called DRYFT from a company north of Seattle. But now after watching this video I will probably pass on those too. Thanks for saving me $500.
My Orvis Silversonic waders are still going strong after several years of 40+ hour fishing weeks. I feel super lucky. Still my first pair. My patagonia ultralight boots (same use as the waders and my first pair) have both of the soles superglued back on but are still putting the miles in, although might be time to retire those as they feel like concrete after an hour now...
I've got the same problem with the inseam size. I've got a long torso and shorter legs so the Large Short size fit my legs almost perfectly but then the torso is too short and it's confining if I need to bend or crouch. On the other end the regular size fit perfectly in the body but bunch up in the legs and then they rub and wear out. For this reason I don't spend more than 250$ on waders because I know I'll be replacing them once every year or two. That said I get my moneys worth because I fish a lot. I grew up surfing so for the surf fishing I do now I often just wear a wetsuit and neoprene booties which last for years compared to waders. I spent $180 on a rip curl wetsuit 4 years ago and it's still going strong. It is a lot safer to wade in the ocean in a wetsuit too. that said I understand that wearing a wetsuit isn't ideal for all fishing situations. Regarding which waders I've found to be the best after trying Orvis, Reddington, and Patagonia in the past... Simms Freestone seem to be the best balance of durability and cost effectiveness in my experience.
Failure point for me has been in the stocking foot, the neoprene just wears out from friction within my boots.
Its all about the "price point", "profit margins" and "planned obsolescence".
Every user has a "price point". That is what they are willing to pay. That applies all the way through the market. As the cost of materials and labour go up the manufacturers try to maintain the price point thinking that if the cost goes up the buyer will go "no thanks" and look elsewhere. They maintain the price point and their profit margin by lowering material and production costs. So overtime the production quality of waders at every price point will get worse whenever the cost of labour and materials go up.
I will point out that companies do not make more profit by selling you waders every ten years. They make more profit by selling your new waders every three years.
There is a constant battle between reputation, quality and profit. So this is "planned obsolescence". Your waders are made to fail at a certain point. It's all dependent on how a manufacturer decides to place itself in the market. From premium to cheap and nasty.
The world wide economy is suffering at the moment so I am expecting a drop in production quality across many, many goods in order to maintain profit margins. Waders are not immune to these issues.
I have $160 redingtons (that are great) and $900 simms g4’s. Because my local fly shop only ever had mediums simms for me to try on, I had to blindly order size Large in the g4’s. Well they fit like skinny jeans and I dread the process of taking them off after fishing. I know one of these times I am going to hear the unmistakable ripping sound of a seam loosening or actually tearing. Also I bought them through a friend (long story, combined orders) so I don’t really even have a proper receipt if I tried to warranty them. I really appreciate my redingtons more now
I had a perfectly good pair of Reddingtons that had the entire welded seam from front to back fail after a couple seasons, with minimal use and walking in them. What shocked me more than the premature failure was the fact they wouldn't replace them under warranty and wouldn't even repair them for a fee if i shipped them back.
Very disappointing.
Luckily mine are paid for by my employer.
Yeah I think most wader companies see 2 years of use as a normal lifespan of a technical garment. Which is absolutely absurd for the amount they charge
Wow thats crazy. I have only owned one pair of waders and so far no leaks in them. I have a pair to Patagonia, bought 2019 and fished four seasons in them already. Your pairs look nice and clean almost like new. Mine are much harder worn it seems and still hanging in there. Wonder how long mine will go. Maybe you need to start a company and build waders out of the dry suit tech.
Anytime I’ve gotten a hole in my waders I figured out the best patch on accident. I use automobile gasket sealer. The stuff stays flexible and is durable. It doesn’t look pretty but be a man the goal is to catch fish not a fashion show.
Between hunting, fishing, and clam digging in the PNW I pretty much wear my waders every weekend. I’ve had the Rogers outdoors (made by frogg togg) going on my 3rd year now and haven’t had a single problem.
Hi bye inexpensive Cabela's waiters, and before I ever put them in the water, I seam seal, all of the seams and all of the wear spots that I have experienced over 40 years on the water. This seems to be the most economical way to deal with the waiter problem that you describe I get about 150 to 200 days on the water out of a pair of Cabelas waiters at half the price of the major brands. I haven't tried seem sealing the major brands before I wear them because I don't buy them.
I buy the mid priced Simms and I usually get 5 seasons before a leak. I’ve taken to just simply going over the seams with aqua seal to begin with, if anything, for the added peace of mind.
I think it’s a hit or miss thing I’ve hade several pairs of Simms G-3 waders and have gotten hundreds of day of us out of them without an issue. I had a pair where I wore the neoprene boot out and they replaced it for a charge , one thing I have noticed is warranties say they will do a lot but when it comes down to it they don’t or in cases like Simms it takes three to 4 weeks to get them repaired which is not acceptable when you in the middle of the best spring or fall fishing when you really need them .
Interesting video. Have you done any videos on wader repair? I’d be interested in that
I will post one up soon
@@spiltmilt, Hi I hope this message finds you since this video is a year old, Anyway I've checked all the comments and haven't seen anyone mention,
High N Dry wader's.
They redesigned how wader's are made, by putting the seam on the outside of the legs instead of through the crotch!
They (two buddy's) were featured on
Outdoor GPS.
Really enjoy your channel! Thank You.
What’s your thought about kayaking pants or bibs as an alternative to fishing waders?
I've tried some but found they didn't have the same range of motion as waders.
Regarding warranty, I will say that Dryft is great. They shipped me new waders within a few hours of emailing them, no questions asked. Just had to send my damaged ones back and they even paid the return shipping.
That is good to hear.
Agreed. Great customer service. My primo zip fronts needed repair at the zipper and inside one of the pockets after 3yrs. And they sent me the brand new model!
Depending on the times of the year you fish, have you considered wearing a surfing wet suit? You will remain warm, but wet at the end of the day. I've watched the Japanese Tenkara fishermen and women use what I think are wet suit pants when they hike to their fishing destination and make many stream crossings. I've asked them what they are wearing in the best way I could. They replied and I figured that they are wearing wet suit pants for their hikes and creek crossings. There is now a company called Wader Skins that make them. Check them out.
I fish in the winter a lot
You are right, they all will leak sooner then you expected. Buy cheap one and if it won't leak the first year - that is typical the warranty period, then stick with the brand. I am happy with any brand that last 2-3 years with a patching kit.
I have Caddis, in about 2 years they started leaking in a couple of spots...I fish way less then Tyler here...since then been just dealing with that...fixed leaks once, lasted a trip or two and back to leaking...
Great article and bang on! That's why I buy a couple pairs of Chinese @Aliexpress for a total of a $100 and lasts me about the same as Simms worth $500.
I have sevral sets of simms. The lower end that are not goretex and I can see leaking I'm sure. But with my g 3s and g4s. I'm having zero issues with over 200 days a yr in each pair!! I fish the pnw and bust brush. If u use and good wash such as Nik wax. You will have a long life. Also hang dry them after each use. Washing goretex is a must to keep it working. Also when u buy the real good stuff it has a warranty if your the original owner.
I sold Simms for many years. The G3 and G4s definitely had the least issues of the models we sold. Freestones and Tributary models not so much. Simms warranty was generally good on the higher models but not always and I do feel they screwed over customers on a few occasions. We had many Patagonias returned for leaks but they were consistent about getting them replaced.
@@spiltmilt I have a older set of the g3s also and those bastards are bulletproof!!! I just after about 3 to 4 uses hit them in the tub with the nik wax and there tuts
Simms G3 and G4’s I’ve had for year. Normal maintenance as recommended per the manufacturer, has helped mine last. I do not work for simms or get any benefits from them.
I use a “short” in both as I’m a 29.5” inseam and no holes.
I spend 50-60 days per year on water in waders.
Thanks
Honestly I've had my frog togs Waiters, this year will be my 6th year using them. I use them for surf fishing and also when I go to the snow. I've had great luck with them and they work today just as good as they did the first time. When I purchase them they were $85
Yeah I honestly have never had a good pair of waders. No matter what brand I've tried they've all leaked at some point. I even had a pair of Hodgman's that leaked right out of the box. At this point I've basically decided to just buy cheap waders and replace them when I have to, I've discovered buying expensive ones doesn't even really make a difference. It's not a matter of if your waders are going to leak, it's a matter of when.
There are two kinds of waders.
Those that leak and those that are going to leak. No way around this fact. Learn to repair and patch them or pay out the A.
Same gripe here! I now go with the Scheels brand...$169 Last the same time as my Simms did
My G3 lasted 2 seasons. Major leak in the material. Sent them in for evaluation, after months past I received an email stating that the material lasted it's life expectation and nothing they were going to do. Before I could reply, the first email was followed up with a second email with a UPS tracking information sending them back to me. It's unfortunate when they got bought out their reputation as one of the world leaders in waders went with it. Just doesn't make sense that the price point goes through the roof, quality lacks, and customer support hides behind some big corporate lawyers nonsense.
This was what happened to me with Orvis.
Sorry to hear that. I wish I could give you some advice on a different wader company. I think you are on to something with a wet suit company making waders. I would happily pay $1000.00 if I could get what I paid for.
If drysuits have held up much better why not use drysuit bibs instead? Kokatat NRS and others make drysuit bibs that have the same coverage as waders and are more versatile as you could add a dry top so you wouldn't need to buy a drysuit and waders.
I could at the same time the drysuit bibs lack a lot of the key features I really want in my waders.
full rubber feet or fabric feet on dry suit what is your preference? and why do you think they do not do full neoprene feet on dry suits in the first place, would be more durable no? . own dry suit with the exception of getting out of it beats waders any day
I've always been curious about this too. You almost never see neoprene feet on drysuits. I am not sure why. I don't think its necessary but the added warmth in cold water wading is nice.
4 years of heavy use in my Dryft Primos with no problems. Haven't had to use their warranty but I've heard it is above the best.
I ended up with a pair Dryft. One year in no leaks.
I gave up on expensive waders. I was going to buy a new pair and patch the same area from new so it would wear the patch first but I just purchased a cheap pair to test so far they have lasted longer. They are not as nice fitting and a lot heavier but still dry. My cheap $50 pair is still going strong 3 years later and I fish all year around. They must be about 2cents a fish and still going strong.
Totaly agree ive had lots of waders bought a pair of top end waders and they leaked first hour of use as you said they all leak.
Manufacturers could easily improve quality and durability, but they won't. Getting a constant stream of new purchases is their goal. I've tried a number of brands and every single pair have leaked. I've mostly owned Simms, but the quality is really terrible now, so currently I am wearing Vision and one year with those, no leaks, yet...
I have the same issue as you with the short 30" inseam. I recently bought a Pair from Cabelas and it was the Stout line of waders that have a shorter inseam. I am surprised how many companies have that one size fits all body style.
I fish a lot since retirement. I bought expensive waders thinking they would last. They lasted no longer than the cheap ones. I can only get two years or less from waders. I will never buy expensive waders again. Better to buy dirt-cheap waders every year.
I had a pair of Simms G3’s for 20 years and the next pair I bought lasted 3 years. I’m honestly thinking the heat of my garage in the summer is what ruined my last pair.
One thing I’ve noticed about the G3s is that the early models were tanks. So much so as I’d recommend them to everyone. My fishing partner has 8 years on his without a leak 1. However, in the last 4 years I’ve seen a common trend with people buying the G3s and they ALL have leaked within the first 3 trips out. One was so bad on the first trip out I thought my friend was just mistaking sweat for a leak but when he dumped out his leg it was full of river water.
I had similar experiences with the Simms headwaters. I bought a pair in 2012 and just retired them in 2021. I wish they still made them the same
@@Gaffneydaniel92 Agree the older models where tough, still use my G3 from 2008 and not a single leak so far.
Luckily my Orvis clearwater waders have been great. I bought them when I moved to the mountains so I could do field work during my MS Biology (fishery focused program). I bought these in 2021 and they are still holding up great today and I am rough on my stuff. I have been out in the "field" for my MS research many hours and days in addition to all the fishing I do. Currently, I've been fishing probably 3 times a week and probably over 100 trips this year. I am surprised how well they have held up especially since I am shorter too. Which means I sometimes have to slide down banks or over the tops of logs etc. During this time I have been through two sets of boots and I have just now bought some Korkers. My Orvis Pro boots only lasted a little under a year before I had to start gluing them back together with Barge Cement. I even had a local cobbler glue them back together and it only took two trips before they were coming apart again if that tells you anything about how well I durability test my items.
Very happy with my Vision Koski waders. I bought them in late 2020 and they are still going strong. I do try to take good care of them though. I use them in salt water exclusively and always rinse and dry them after use. At €200/$235 back then they were very reasonably priced but I'm sure the price has gone up since 2020.
Those problematic seams in the inner thigh area are unnecessary, and the wader makers know that they’re weak points. I’ve been fortunate to have my USA made G3s hold up very well with lots of hiking and bushwhacking. One solution I’ve found to help prevent the friction damage is to use a little wax on the fabric. It helped the laces of my work boots as a groundskeeper big time. You’d lose the breathability of the fabric in that area.
I have seen many buy expensive with their buy once cry once to get leaks in their waders in less time than what my cheap chest waders do, which they have sent waders back and they either had them sealed up or replaced. The ones who were able to get waders replaced had leaks happen in a short time again. I have always questioned how can more expensive be so much better when I have personally heard of them leaking in a short time. I have had some cheap chest waders last 3 or 4 seasons of hard use during a season, which I also do take care of my waders with cleaning them, then using something that helps revitalize the water repelling and many do not even do that to have their waders looking waterlogged because they do not take care of their waders. Anyways, the seeming like things made to last only so long to force people to spend more money is common these days in fishing, which a big fly rod company seems to be discontinuing rods to tell people that their fly rod that came with info that said lifetime warranty has to dish some money out for a fly rod in the new lineup, which is a fly rod that seems to only have a few cosmetic changes. That type of baloney seems to be spreading throughout gear for fishing and complete BS if you ask me. Some companies are great on treating their customers right, then like you said, some end up with new owners to screw things up for people who bought gear before the company was sold. The worst thing other than some waders not lasting is wading boots for the ones like me here in Alaska that have spent money on vibram soled wading boots to have the soles wear down so fast that the wading boots are trashed, which I have bought hiking boots with vibram soles that outlasted the hiking boots and wonder why these companies cannot produce a wading boot that can have vibram soles that outlast the life of other materials on the boots for the price that they charge for wading boots.
Where did you find a Kokatat dry suit for 300 bucks
Kids sizes actually fit small women better and cost significantly less
The big issue ive found with people and waders is not knowing how to put them on. They arent pants. If you pull them on like pants, you will weaken the seams and cause leaks. Work them on slowly, one leg at a time. I have a used pair i got, 5 yrs old, and they are still solid. And they are from academy. Ive seen folks pull them on right where the neoprene boot and wader material comes together so hard i could see the material fail. Same with taking them off. Also, hang them up when done to let them dry.
I only get maybe 2-3 trips before my waders get holes in them. I’ve owned 5 pairs in the last 2 years. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong
I've done alright buying xl youth waders. The legs are skinnier so less fabric to bunch up and chafe. Even did a season guiding in Alaska with kid's waders. Much cheaper. Never met a pair of Simms that didn't leak.
Cabelas/bass pro $120.00 waders go on sale for $69.99 CAD. Been out 10 times no signs of wear. Better to buy 10 pairs of cheap ones than one pair of expensive ones that will leak just as quick.
Vote with your dollars. Stop buying expensive waders if they’re junk. If people keep paying nothing will change.
I use waders and a dry top for kayaking (I have not used my waders to wade in a long time). I probably get ~150 trips out of a pair of waders (about 8 years). I think the reason my waders last so long is the same reason your dry suits last so long. The range of motion is much smaller in the kayak (as compared to hiking in waders). In the kayak you are seated and only moving your legs through a small range of motion (compared to hiking). I think if you wore your dry suit for wader fishing you would see similar (lack of) durability.
Maybe but trolling is the primary thing I do in my kayak and I am pedaling my kayak all day. With waders I walk and stop for long periods of time. In terms of time in motion and opportunity for abrasive wear I think is greater in a kayak. I agree the range of motion in walking is different than pedaling and maybe that makes all the difference.
Here in the Uk I have a pair from a tackle company called fox that cost £59.99 or $72 usd had them for the best part of 4 years without a single leak. I’ve used the in a range of temperatures and in both fresh and salt water. They just keep going
I've been very happy with my neoprene bare supra waders for more than 10 years and hundreds of days in the water. Unfortunately no more built. I have also Patagonias, but I don't really need them. Neoprene has a better insulation in water vs insulation on land ratio than a thin breathable layer plus fleece/merino layer because it does not compress under water pressure. That means I get less hot on land/walking at the same insulation-level for wading. At least for fishing situations where you're wading permanently it's superior and cheaper in my opinion. I'm also a sea kayaker and surf-ski paddler and had gore tex drysuits. Same here. A modern flexible surf-wetsuit does the job perfectly and is much
cheaper. Gore tex stuff is great when it's fresh, but I can not afford to replace that stuff all the time. I used to work in a flyfishing store, my Impression is that many people need their 4digit- europrice G3 waders for the same reasons as their mercedes suv to get to the water...
I think it's time to speak with a drysuit manufacturer and see if they would be willing to build a wader prototype.
What would be the cost though? Even if they guaranteed to never leak or free replacement, I don’t see myself paying $1200 up front for waders. I paid that for my dry suit, but that will save my life. Just my first thought. I do think they have the technology to do it
Have you looked at some of the dry suit company bibs like mustang taku dry bibs or the level 6 breakwaters? Im wondering if they'd hold up better
I tried the Breakwater. The cut was all wrong and really restricted my mobility. I returned it.
I had my pair of reddington waders for 5 years and they finally sprung a leak last weekend. I used aquaseal on all of the foot seams and it seems to be holding up well so far. Don't buy new ones if you can repair your old ones folks
Whwn needed, I've been going to Academy and picking a pair of their Magellan pro waders every summer when they go on Clearence for 50% off. They're decent waders and come down to $75. I usually get around 100 trips on them before any issues.
Interesting topic. I have owned several different sets of waders too. What peaked my curiosity in your video is the disparity in longevity of the dry suits vs waders made of similar materials and sheets of thickness. One of the big differences between the two suits is duration of water exposure-waders with much more time spent immersed in water of various chemistries and dry suit far less water exposure. Makes me wonder if there might be something about the chemistry and physics of the water's prolonged interaction with wader material contributing to faster rotting of the material vs the dry suit that in general remains dry. IDK-could be nothing, could be something. Maybe you should try a season fly fishing in the dry suit and see how it holds up in comparison to waders.
Several people have suggested this immersion factor. If that were true whitewater kayakers would be complaining about the durability of these drysuits more than anglers would but they do not have this issue because if they did they wouldn’t be in business long
Very glad I saw this video . I’ve been going through inexpensive waders like cheap Sox and was planning on buying a high end pair this spring. I’ll stick with the inexpensive ones and a can of flex seal and Gorilla Duct Tape !!
Yup that is what I do. If you get tow years out of a pair, you win.
The only way to have your waders never leaking , is never use them , we as fisherman are duped by good advertising , my advice never pay more than £150 for a pair , if you get 2 seasons out of them , youve done ok , you could £800 plus , and they last the same time ,it is not a case of the more you pay the better they are , absolute nonsense
Sadly Tyler, many, many, many things today are engineered to fail as opposed to being engineered to last. My wife and I have been buying shell jackets for over 25 years made by Arcteryx and they've never failed. We wear them snowshoeing and hiking (buskwhacking through berry bushes, beech saplings; we rarely use an actual trail), mountain biking, kayaking, etc. and in more than 30 years we've never torn one or had a hole develop despite routinely hearing the sound of twigs and bramble scraping across them as well as the occasional scrape with granite. The jackets are made of multi-layer GoreTex with welded seams; similar to what high end waders are made with. We have to reapply DWR 2-3 times per year after we wash them but they still bead water like a freshly waxed car. The jackets are not cheap (average around $6-$700) but I've got one that I've had for 15 years that has no holes, no fraying at the cuffs, no tears, etc. and we're in the woods all the time either hiking, snowshoeing or mountain biking. I've only owned one pair of waders about 10 years ago and they lasted 2 seasons and then leaked...I got so annoyed at the prospect of having to buy them again that I never did. I absolutely agree with your assessment of the situation.
You nailed. I have a ton technical garments that get far more beat-up that last for far longer with minimal maintenance. Big fan of Arcteryx as well.