I have an ENOG2 Pro behind my Yamaha a-s1100 and it's the perfect companion for PC audio in via optical. The folks at Geshelli are wonderful to work with and I'm happy to see they are still going strong.
I hope you will be able to listen to the new J2 with the AK4493EQ chip! It has come full circle. I have mine powered by a decent 12V linear power supply in my main system - and it is fantastic! Better than the Ares II in my opinion, and it has better bass than the Bifrost 2, as well. The J2 AKM bests both those other DACs at their own strengths - which is simply amazing given that it costs about half as much, even with the third party power supply.
@@PassionforSound That's great - please do try a linear 12V power supply, with 2A minimum to equal the stock wall wart. 3A may even be better. I can't express how much the soundstage and clarity are improved with the linear power supply.
@@EeeTeePwnHome I am using a dual voltage unit to power both my Geshelli J2 AKM DAC and my Node 2i - 12V 50W for the J2 and 5V 50W for the N2i. [Edit: I got a power supply interface board from a company called PD Creative, for the Node 2i. This replaces the internal switching PS, and lets you plug in an external 5V PS of your choice. This cost me $107US everything included.] I got [the dual voltage PS] from Ali Express, and it looks like a little amp, with heatsinks on both sides. If I was just powering the J2, I would recommend a BRZHiFi 12V 25W with a Talema brand toroidal transformer. [Edit: the dual voltage linear PS cost me $210US total. The 12V 25W unit costs about $75US total.]
I was looking forward to this as the JNOG was discontinued due to the unfortunate circumstances. However got one on the 2nd hand market unsealed. I love it, will get the J2 in time to support Geshelli regardless. Amazing review!!
Ordered the newest J2 with AKM chip. Geshelli provided great customer service for me and Im glad to support this growing USA mom & pop company. Enjoyed the interview with them here too. Hard working people who found a nich in this competitive market.
@@beslemeto Id say it is an upgrade from my Bluesound Node 2i internal DAC. My quality vinyl pressing have much better sound though. If you have a mid to higher end system, youd probably have to really setup to the $1k range for a significant upgrade.
@@bryfar6178 Well i guess i will go with Gustard R26 then.They hyped that J2 so much, but i doubt it will perform anywhere near as the performance of R26.
This was a great review! I enjoy that you put the same amount of effort and detail when reviewing a $250 geshilli Dac as you do a $1150 Burson Dac. In fact it makes sense as more of the population will be able to afford the entry level gear so def makes your channel for accessible. If one wanted to follow the 70 / 20 / 10 rule they could a Jnog 2 + Soloist 3XP might actually be the move to make of you have harder to drive headphones. Burson really excels as their amp stages and sounds like the j2 is an incredible value for a Dac.
I don't always get excited about all products so sometimes it's a bit of effort to apply the same amount of attention to all of them, but it's rarely about their price for me thankfully. I find I can be just as excited by a cheap product like the J2 or upcoming Ikko OH10 review as I do about the super high-end gear. It probably comes down to that first listen and whether the product captures my attention for being great value, great to use, unique in some way or just sounds great. No doubt the J2 and Soloist would sound great, but I personally don't subscribe to the idea of spending certain amounts on each product. I think it's best to spend as much as you can on each product (with well considered decisions, not just spending for the sake of it). For example, a Bifrost 2 will be clearly better than the J2 and the Qutest will be better again so the Soloist won't provide maximum performance with the cheap DACs even though it will sound good.
@@PassionforSound Thanks for your response Lachlan! I think that split is meant to be a rule of thumb for people new to hifi for setting priority of budget that the headphone/speaker/transducer is the most impactful to sound quality, then amplification, then dac. But I do agree with your take.
I 100% agree with placing emphasis on the transducer. I'd probably go something like 40-50% of budget on the transducer and then roughly split the remainder between DAC and amp knowing that you can then upgrade the source chain a bit before you need better transducers. 🙂
@@PassionforSound I was looking through my electronics chain and found besides burson I have one other aussie product (I'm American). My active Speakers are Event 20/20 BAS v3 which I've had since 2012. They are a fantastic set for my listening room (midfield listening 8 feet away) but wouldn't be great for a studio monitor (neutral mixing). At some point Event was purchased by Freedman Electronics and move to Aussie along with Rode Microphones. They 20/20 was end-dated but they have an active monitor called the Opal. Anyway thought that might be an idea for a future review as I believe you only excluded passive speakers and power amps from the channel.
Thanks for letting me know, Ace! You're right that I haven't specifically excluded actives from my reviews because I'm technically equipped to review them. My only issue is lack of space so nearfields are all I could take on at this stage.
I am glad you mentioned the Cymbol sounds natural. That is one of the key things I listen to assess Digital Audio. I love a good sizzling cymbals. And bad digital kills it. The new Topping E50 is another one to compare now.
@@PassionforSound cool! Although I rarely get to compare DACs, when I do, I use the Ewok Feast from Return of the Jedi and most deep purple recordings to check the Cymbols. Deep purple because they are recorded so well the Cymbols shimmer. And The Ewok Feast has a distant Cymbol crash that I am wondering if one day I will have a system that makes it sound like there is someone in the next room. Rather than a distant sound. I Look forward to your review. My DACs are old and and by reviews I've seen lately I believe that mine are out of date.
@@PassionforSound I can wait no rush. I am working on repairing my old tape decks at the moment. I am going to video it and start a new audio channel based on repairs and tweaks
Great review! Have both this and the original JNOG both are outstanding. I actually think this new J2 is better than the original JNOG (which was also incredible) for everything other than live acoustic recordings. The original JNOG nails live acoustic recordings so well, it can trick you into thinking you are at the performance when combined with the Erish. The J2 doesn't make you think you are at the concert but that you are hearing a top notch recording of it. Geshelli did an amazing job of capitalizing on the strengths of the respective chips, (ESS and AKM) while minimalizing their weaknesses.
Glad you liked it! Thanks for sharing your impressions of the two DACs. Great to hear that there's not a drop-off from the original so much as just differences
There must be something wrong with your J2. A DAC is only converting digital to analog. It shouldn't have any sound signature if it is properly implemented. The sound signature should come from your amp not the DAC. You should buy a DAC based on features among other things.
Michael, it's true that a DAC shouldn't add significant colouration to the sound, but every DAC (and every individual electrical component that makes up any device) has its own sonic character. A DAC's sound is influenced by the quality and design of its power supply and power filtering, processing of the incoming signal, filters used to reconstruct the analog waveform and then the output stage to connect the DAC chip to the amp downstream. The infinite variables created by these combinations mean that every DAC will have different characteristics, even if the frequency response measures flat (which it should). Some DACs will sound almost identical and others will be more different
@@michaellucas4953 A DAC actually has to have an amplification stage in order to produce an output even though it is not very powerful. And the amp stage isn't the only thing that influences the sound as Passion for Sound points out. With a revealing system you can hear the differences quite clearly. Also the human ear is very sensitive and can pick sonic characteristics that measuring devices can't. A measuring device doesn't hear the infinite variables and only focuses on a singular variable. Identical twins can have the same body characteristics, weight and measurements but they can be night and day different in ways the measuring devices cannot detect.
I've just sub'd and partly because of your recommendation I have a J2 on the way to me, can't wait to get it plugged in! I really like the channel hello from FL USA.
With your enthusiastic response to a DAC equipped with the AKM 4599EX duel design chip, I am surprised that you didn’t also review A26 when checking out the R26. I hope you will soon in the future as well as other 4499EX equipped DACs.
A bit late to the party, but just wanted to comment that your prior review of linear power supplies and the D50 led me to purchase a separate power supply and, yeah, the difference is night-and-day compared to the stock one that came with the D50s. In one respect, it makes me appreciate the D50s more because now I know I'm getting the best performance out of it. However, in another respect, it's frustrating because it's marketed as a cheap, affordable DAC with great performance, and yet, that level of performance is only realizable if you spend a bit more. Granted, you don't have to spend much more (as you demonstrated), but still-I imagine that a lot of folks new to DACs would be scratching their heads as to what it's all about when it doesn't meet their expectations out of the box. It sounds like, based on your current review, the J2 at least performs to expected levels without the need for an alternative power supply. That, to my mind, is more in keeping with expectations at this price point.
I definitely feel like the J2 meets expectations without swapping the power supply, largely because it comes with a quality SMPS wall wart. You can improve it with a LPS, but it's definitely not needed like it is with the D50S to avoid the poor quality USB power. 🙂
Met the Awesome #GeshelliLabs crew at AXPONA chicago today. Heard the J2 DAC. I did not have a 2d sound to my ears. I'm also familiar with the Yamaha Studio monitors used in the room they set up. The J2 had a nice soundstage and didn't suffer in the imaging department. Basically it's a very full sounding Dac with a nice punch. Great price even with the classy wooden casework option and USB . I might snag one soon.
It's been a year now, and a new one with an AKM 4493 is now being offered, as are the two others. Would be interesting to hear your take on the newer AKM 4493 model.
Haha. Thanks, T D. Not sure there's much money in podcasting alone (is there?) and I don't have time for a third gig unless it can replace my paid day job 🙂
Just received my Geshelli J2S Socketed AKM with a Sparkos 3602 in the RCA output. In a word itis brilliant. I own the OG ESS Pro version which is excellent but the AKM version is smoother. The Sparkos op amp takes it to another level with layering and instrument separation I thought not possible from streaming. p.s. The DAC requires at least 6 hours of break in to reach its full potential IMO.
So glad you're enjoying it! Sadly, built in DACs are rarely as good as a separate unit, but it's great that you can do easily and (relatively) cheaply get a big upgrade
Guess what my brother... Another new chip! J2 with AKM 4499 is on the way! With a followup around Q1 2024 where they will have a new button scheme similar to the Archel 3 Pro. I signed on to the soft launch and should have this new J2 in about a week or so.
@@PassionforSound Did you get the stock options? Or did you go all out with all Sparkos? Also looking into the Gustard P26 We should do email Lachlan...
@@PassionforSound not sure if you have the Sparkos SS2590 dual pro S though. You "can" get that into the SE section of the J2 but not the balanced they say
You forget you mention how customizable they are! The case is offered in multiple colors or wood options (extra.) Same with the plexiglass. I also think the USB option adds $50. Regarding performance, I wonder if might have run into the limits of my portable dac (Ear Studio ES100 using the USB connection) I thought I couldn't always pick out instruments on busy tracks because my HD560S was at its limit or that I didn't know what I was doing. And crash cymbals always sound weird and sometimes nasty. But I'm afraid to drop a bunch of money and then hear no difference.
That's a good point about the customisation! I forget that people don't know that already (this is my third or fourth Geshelli review). As for the performance, the DAC will be your limiting factor I think. Upgrading even to something like an SMSL SU-6 or Khadas Tone 2 would be a step up I think, but the J2 would look so much better 🙂
*I am new to the channel, could you tell me what chip sounds better than AKM or ESS families? So I don't go backward engineering through the rest of the videos* I have Cirrus Logic 4272 chip on my Focusrite Saffire Pro 40, and it does sound very 3D. They still use it in modern Focusrite 18i20 Gen 3 interface. I am having issues with Firewire though, so I have been buying and returning DACs recently. From SMSL SU-9 Pro, to Toppic E70 Velvet, to RME ADI-2 DAC FS I just see the sound pulled back on them. More 2D than my old Focusrite. They have better detail and separation though compared to my Saffire. SU-9 Pro was easily the best out of them in terms of tangible space though, and I would repurchase it if I used Master Bus EQ. SU-9 Pro: (bass was great, midrange was way to subdued, and high though clear, were harsh somewhere in 1-3.5 khz range),
Sadly, it's not as simple as choosing based on the chip. I've heard ESS, Cirrus and AKM chips all sound great. So much of the sound of a DAC comes down also to the power supply quality and also the output stage after the DAC chip. Sorry that I can't help make it simpler.
They've recently made both chips available I think. My unit was an early one so it's the chip that's the standard inclusion because the option didn't exist for an alternate chip back then
@@PassionforSound yes it is good indeed but maybe it is my ears lol but i don't find the sound difference so amazing with my onboard, i have a marantz pm 25 amplifier and 2 cabasse mt 32 full tower and with a very good rating from the classical music magazine le diapason d'or. so not too shabby...
@@PassionforSound i had much trouble to have sound as well on my rear speakers.. (same sound not 4.1 but i like to be immersed in it) for that i use another sound card in parallel and put it in tape in mode in my amplifier
I just remembered that I changed the op-amp in my D50S to get better sound. It's a fiddly job, but upgrading to a Muses or other high quality op-amp can make a significant difference
I hope you could help with answering this. I have the J1 and I was curious about upgrading to an Ares 2 or Bifrost 2, I'm using a Singxer SA-1. Could you compare the J2 with bifrost 2 and Ares 2? I know Bifrost and Ares are more expensive but I wanted to know if it was worth upgrading to. Thank you
I don't have the Ares 2 because that was on loan, but I do own the B2. The B2 has a more refined sound with a greater sense of depth and 3-dimensionality. I personally do think it's worth the upgrade because the SA-1 is good enough that you'll be able to enjoy the improvements. I'm not so much a fan of the Ares 2 so I'd definitely focus on Bifrost 2.
The J2 is great! Nice choice. I don't believe the gain makes a significant difference to the sound so it's more about how much volume range you need. Use full output as a default and then pull it back if you need more range on your amp volume.
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the reply, I just find the low gain on amps like JDS atom to be too low powered (ineffecient?) or too quiet for my taste. For now Im good with the 2nd gain and my knob to 12:00- 1:00. The Beyer t1.2 just whisper out tiny details out of nowhere. Hope you'll grow big!
Amazing review. I have a Samsung tv that I’m using a Spotify app on it to steam into a intergraded Amp for now. Would you recommend this DAC to help improve the sound. Or recommend something els. Thanks again for any advice and help.
The internal DACs in TVs are generally pretty average so an external DAC will be a nice upgrade. If you're happy with your amp then that's a good option
Hi. Which do you think would be a better dac in terms of realistic sound, 3D Soundstage, instrument separation? Cant decide if i should get the Geshelli J2 akm, Schiit MMB 2 or the Modius. I listen to jazz, acoustic guitar music, drums. Etc. Thank you so much! Keep up the awesome work!
For a 3D soundstage, you really need to get away from chip-based Delta Sigma DACs which means the MMB is your only choice in that list. The J2 and Modius are both limited in soundstage depth by their use of AKM/ESS chips
@@PassionforSound i see. Thank you so much for your response. So MMB or maybe the bifrost. I was really considering the J2. I've seen so much rave reviews on it. In terms of sound quality, which do you prefer, the J2 or the MMB? Thanks again for your help.
I'm currently working only with the ESS version J2 so it's possible that this could change slightly, but the J2 has the edge on sheer sense of detail/resolution, but the MMB has the depth and layering in the soundstage for sure. I've got the AKM J2 coming soon and their new AK4499 based DAC as well so stay tuned...
Great review! I got a question and I need expert advice. If money wasn’t an issue what dac would you suggest for best soundstage? You were mentioning the J2 is more 2D than 3D. I’m on a quest to find the best audio setup for pinpointing footsteps in games.
The best soundstaging and imaging DACs that I've found are the Chord DACs. My personal favourite is the TT2 with the M-Scaler, but the Qutest is also excellent if you're not wanting to go all out straight away
@@PassionforSound Another question I got for you. I’m currently looking at the Mojo 2 or the Qutest/Anni stack, would you consider the stack or would the Mojo 2 be sufficient for FPS games?
Hey, great review! I'm looking at getting one of these but have a couple of questions that you may have the answer to. I'm Australian so need a power plug that supports Australian sockets. I didn't see this as an option when ordering, only US and European. I think you are Australian as well, so how did you get around this? Also can the DAC be powered off the USB and if so does it make a difference to the sound? I would be using optical as an input from my pc. Cheers man
Hi Drex, they can't be powered by USB so you do need a separate power supply. What I've done with mine (and I can't recommend it because it may not be entirely safe) is to get the US plug and carefully twist the power pins so they go in an Aussie socket. The actual adapter handles 240V so it's just a matter of getting it to fit. Alternatively, you can buy a US to AUS adapter which is cheap and simple - just makes the plug a little chunkier
@@PassionforSound Ah ok cool, thanks for the info and speedy reply. I don't think I want to be twisting pins and from previous experience US to AU voltage converters are usually massive and an eyesore. I might just let them know their products are in demand down here and keep my fingers crossed they will support AU plugs in the future. Cheers
@@drex128 Hey Drex. I think you may have misunderstood - you don't need an Aus to US power converter, just an adapter that plugs into an Australian power socket and has a US style socket on the back. These are often called travel adapters and are not much bigger than a standard power plug. You don't need to convert the voltage as the power adapter that comes with the Geshelli should work fine with Australian mains voltages.
Thanks for the excellent and informative review. I am new to streaming and do not own a DAC at present. I have a Schiit system (Vidar, Freya S and Mani). I did not want to pop USD 700 for the Bifrost 2, so I just ordered the Geshelli J2 with USB (not yet received) as a lower cost alternative. Do you have a recommendation for a headphone amp to power most headphones. Would you go with Geshelli or Schiit, or does that depend on the specific headphone?
I'd go with the E2 so it will stack nicely with your J2 and it also happens to be one of the very best amps at the price. Keep in mind that it requires as balanced headphone cable (and a headphone that can run balanced). Otherwise, the Archel 2.5XL from Geshelli would likely be just as good, but in single-ended form.
Thanks for your response. How do you compare the Geshelli J2 with the Schiit Modi Multibit, which are similarly priced? The J2 has balanced outputs, whereas the Modi MB has Multibit technology and a linear power supply?
I haven't tried them side by side, but the Ares II has quite a different sound - overly smooth and with a large soundstage. The J2 is a drier/more neutral sounding DAC that will come across more detailed and resolving, but with less soundstage size.
Based on the J2 ESS, the Z8 is clearly better, but I'm expecting a J2 AKM socketed version soon so that might mix things up a bit... Sub and ring the bell (if you haven't already) to catch that one.
I think you need to order Geshelli direct from Australia. As for vs the Arcam, it's been a long time since I tried the R-DAC, but I'd expect the J2 to offer greater refinement and detail retrieval.
This guy needs to try some 2 channel set ups. The J2 has layers of depth, with a well paired 2 channel system i feel like i can walk between the musicians but the wall behind the speakers is in the way, not sure how Geshelli pulled that off, i guess you call that Magic.
It's not whether I agree or disagree, it's that my channel is focussed on headphone-based listening because I'm not in a position to use or review loudspeakers. The loudspeaker listening experience IS very different and I definitely acknowledge that, but I can only discuss what I hear through headphones. My experiences suggest that these impressions do translate to speakers in the sense that DACs that produce better depth and layering on headphones produce outstanding layering and depth from speakers while DACs like the J2 (which I really like so this isn't a knock against it) will produce depth and layering more than through headphones, but not to the same level as those other DACs (i.e. Schiit Multibit, Chord or R2R DACs)
I'm eyeing this one, although it was a bit more expensive than I thought. I saw somewhere it's $250 + $50 for USB? How does this compare to Schiit Modius?
That sounds about right as the list price was $299 and may have included USB at that price I think. I can't directly compare to the Modius, but I think it's comparable rather than clearly better/worse
Its going to be a choice based on preference assuming you are using the XLR output. Having had both the Modius XLR output is as good as the j2s xlr/rca outputs but its RCA output is rather weak IMO. If you are going to be using the RCA, I think Geshelli is a better bet personally. Via XLR Modius is kind of a bass cannon. It has more bass, slam and sounds a little more "studio neutralish" outside of the bass which sounds boosted compared the J2. its got a hint of the AKM velvet style transients going on, which are slightly less aggressive than the j2. If a recording sounds bad, it will sound bad on the Modius. Modius RCA sounds like a fairly average AKM dac, its a little better than a Modi but not by much. J2 handles sibilance better (less annoying), to me sounds a little more natural and has a more neutral level of bass. I dont think its quite as "studio neutral" as some recordings which I know sound like crap, actually sound pretty good on J2. Its a little more dynamic and has harder hitting transients (ESS vs AKM mostly). The XLR and RCA are just as good as Passion for Sound said in his review.
Ok, turns out that their shipping provider hiked up the prices so they're in the process of finding a new shipping company and will be able to sell direct to us again soon.
@@PassionforSound thanks for the reply. The are probably surface mount, which requires some more work but still doable. Do you think the burson v6s will fit in the enclosure?
Hi Theo, I imagine it would with the right adaptation because I do believe they're SMDs (but not certain) and that also means they're quite possibly the smaller size chips.
It's a plain silver case and a teal (a sort of green) cover plate. You could ask Sherri at Geshelli for whatever is in this video and she'd likely be able to match it for you I expect
Sorry about that. Some videos are harder to produce and edit than others because I have a toddler and sleep has been a rare commodity at times for the last couple of years. I'm not always as fluent as I'd like 🙂
I have an ENOG2 Pro behind my Yamaha a-s1100 and it's the perfect companion for PC audio in via optical. The folks at Geshelli are wonderful to work with and I'm happy to see they are still going strong.
They are wonderful people making great products! Glad you're enjoying your Geshelli gear 🙂🙂
I hope you will be able to listen to the new J2 with the AK4493EQ chip! It has come full circle. I have mine powered by a decent 12V linear power supply in my main system - and it is fantastic! Better than the Ares II in my opinion, and it has better bass than the Bifrost 2, as well. The J2 AKM bests both those other DACs at their own strengths - which is simply amazing given that it costs about half as much, even with the third party power supply.
I'll reach out to Geno and Sherri and see if we can arrange one... Great to hear how much you're enjoying it.
@@PassionforSound That's great - please do try a linear 12V power supply, with 2A minimum to equal the stock wall wart. 3A may even be better. I can't express how much the soundstage and clarity are improved with the linear power supply.
I found that when I tried the E2 or J2 ESS with an LPS for my LPS review. Nice upgrade
Hi Neil, what LPS are you using for your DAC?
@@EeeTeePwnHome I am using a dual voltage unit to power both my Geshelli J2 AKM DAC and my Node 2i - 12V 50W for the J2 and 5V 50W for the N2i. [Edit: I got a power supply interface board from a company called PD Creative, for the Node 2i. This replaces the internal switching PS, and lets you plug in an external 5V PS of your choice. This cost me $107US everything included.] I got [the dual voltage PS] from Ali Express, and it looks like a little amp, with heatsinks on both sides. If I was just powering the J2, I would recommend a BRZHiFi 12V 25W with a Talema brand toroidal transformer.
[Edit: the dual voltage linear PS cost me $210US total. The 12V 25W unit costs about $75US total.]
I was looking forward to this as the JNOG was discontinued due to the unfortunate circumstances. However got one on the 2nd hand market unsealed. I love it, will get the J2 in time to support Geshelli regardless. Amazing review!!
I never got the chance to try the original JNOG. It will be interesting to see which one you prefer. Glad you liked the review!
Ordered the newest J2 with AKM chip.
Geshelli provided great customer service for me and Im glad to support this growing USA mom & pop company.
Enjoyed the interview with them here too. Hard working people who found a nich in this competitive market.
Nice! Great choice. Hope you love it
You like the sound?
@@beslemeto Id say it is an upgrade from my Bluesound Node 2i internal DAC.
My quality vinyl pressing have much better sound though.
If you have a mid to higher end system, youd probably have to really setup to the $1k range for a significant upgrade.
@@bryfar6178 Well i guess i will go with Gustard R26 then.They hyped that J2 so much, but i doubt it will perform anywhere near as the performance of R26.
awe man so awesome you have video on this DAC as well!
I try to mix things up and get a little bit of everything where I can 🙂
Excellent review! Thanks for the info on the output power button!
My pleasure
Great content 👍
Glad you like it!
This was a great review! I enjoy that you put the same amount of effort and detail when reviewing a $250 geshilli Dac as you do a $1150 Burson Dac. In fact it makes sense as more of the population will be able to afford the entry level gear so def makes your channel for accessible. If one wanted to follow the 70 / 20 / 10 rule they could a Jnog 2 + Soloist 3XP might actually be the move to make of you have harder to drive headphones. Burson really excels as their amp stages and sounds like the j2 is an incredible value for a Dac.
I don't always get excited about all products so sometimes it's a bit of effort to apply the same amount of attention to all of them, but it's rarely about their price for me thankfully. I find I can be just as excited by a cheap product like the J2 or upcoming Ikko OH10 review as I do about the super high-end gear. It probably comes down to that first listen and whether the product captures my attention for being great value, great to use, unique in some way or just sounds great.
No doubt the J2 and Soloist would sound great, but I personally don't subscribe to the idea of spending certain amounts on each product. I think it's best to spend as much as you can on each product (with well considered decisions, not just spending for the sake of it). For example, a Bifrost 2 will be clearly better than the J2 and the Qutest will be better again so the Soloist won't provide maximum performance with the cheap DACs even though it will sound good.
@@PassionforSound Thanks for your response Lachlan! I think that split is meant to be a rule of thumb for people new to hifi for setting priority of budget that the headphone/speaker/transducer is the most impactful to sound quality, then amplification, then dac. But I do agree with your take.
I 100% agree with placing emphasis on the transducer. I'd probably go something like 40-50% of budget on the transducer and then roughly split the remainder between DAC and amp knowing that you can then upgrade the source chain a bit before you need better transducers. 🙂
@@PassionforSound I was looking through my electronics chain and found besides burson I have one other aussie product (I'm American). My active Speakers are Event 20/20 BAS v3 which I've had since 2012. They are a fantastic set for my listening room (midfield listening 8 feet away) but wouldn't be great for a studio monitor (neutral mixing). At some point Event was purchased by Freedman Electronics and move to Aussie along with Rode Microphones. They 20/20 was end-dated but they have an active monitor called the Opal. Anyway thought that might be an idea for a future review as I believe you only excluded passive speakers and power amps from the channel.
Thanks for letting me know, Ace! You're right that I haven't specifically excluded actives from my reviews because I'm technically equipped to review them. My only issue is lack of space so nearfields are all I could take on at this stage.
I am glad you mentioned the Cymbol sounds natural. That is one of the key things I listen to assess Digital Audio. I love a good sizzling cymbals. And bad digital kills it. The new Topping E50 is another one to compare now.
Yeah, cymbals can be tricky. The E50 review is actually the next one up for recording right now so stay tuned... 🙂
@@PassionforSound cool! Although I rarely get to compare DACs, when I do, I use the Ewok Feast from Return of the Jedi and most deep purple recordings to check the Cymbols. Deep purple because they are recorded so well the Cymbols shimmer. And The Ewok Feast has a distant Cymbol crash that I am wondering if one day I will have a system that makes it sound like there is someone in the next room. Rather than a distant sound. I Look forward to your review. My DACs are old and and by reviews I've seen lately I believe that mine are out of date.
Recording the E50 review today and releasing it towards the end of October. Hope the wait isn't too long 🙂
@@PassionforSound I can wait no rush. I am working on repairing my old tape decks at the moment. I am going to video it and start a new audio channel based on repairs and tweaks
Great idea! Hope the channel is a hit!
Great review! Have both this and the original JNOG both are outstanding. I actually think this new J2 is better than the original JNOG (which was also incredible) for everything other than live acoustic recordings. The original JNOG nails live acoustic recordings so well, it can trick you into thinking you are at the performance when combined with the Erish. The J2 doesn't make you think you are at the concert but that you are hearing a top notch recording of it.
Geshelli did an amazing job of capitalizing on the strengths of the respective chips, (ESS and AKM) while minimalizing their weaknesses.
Glad you liked it! Thanks for sharing your impressions of the two DACs. Great to hear that there's not a drop-off from the original so much as just differences
There must be something wrong with your J2. A DAC is only converting digital to analog. It shouldn't have any sound signature if it is properly implemented. The sound signature should come from your amp not the DAC. You should buy a DAC based on features among other things.
Michael, it's true that a DAC shouldn't add significant colouration to the sound, but every DAC (and every individual electrical component that makes up any device) has its own sonic character. A DAC's sound is influenced by the quality and design of its power supply and power filtering, processing of the incoming signal, filters used to reconstruct the analog waveform and then the output stage to connect the DAC chip to the amp downstream. The infinite variables created by these combinations mean that every DAC will have different characteristics, even if the frequency response measures flat (which it should). Some DACs will sound almost identical and others will be more different
@@michaellucas4953 A DAC actually has to have an amplification stage in order to produce an output even though it is not very powerful. And the amp stage isn't the only thing that influences the sound as Passion for Sound points out. With a revealing system you can hear the differences quite clearly. Also the human ear is very sensitive and can pick sonic characteristics that measuring devices can't. A measuring device doesn't hear the infinite variables and only focuses on a singular variable. Identical twins can have the same body characteristics, weight and measurements but they can be night and day different in ways the measuring devices cannot detect.
Great analogy!
I've just sub'd and partly because of your recommendation I have a J2 on the way to me, can't wait to get it plugged in! I really like the channel hello from FL USA.
With your enthusiastic response to a DAC equipped with the AKM 4599EX duel design chip, I am surprised that you didn’t also review A26 when checking out the R26. I hope you will soon in the future as well as other 4499EX equipped DACs.
It all comes down to what I can get my hands on
A bit late to the party, but just wanted to comment that your prior review of linear power supplies and the D50 led me to purchase a separate power supply and, yeah, the difference is night-and-day compared to the stock one that came with the D50s. In one respect, it makes me appreciate the D50s more because now I know I'm getting the best performance out of it. However, in another respect, it's frustrating because it's marketed as a cheap, affordable DAC with great performance, and yet, that level of performance is only realizable if you spend a bit more. Granted, you don't have to spend much more (as you demonstrated), but still-I imagine that a lot of folks new to DACs would be scratching their heads as to what it's all about when it doesn't meet their expectations out of the box. It sounds like, based on your current review, the J2 at least performs to expected levels without the need for an alternative power supply. That, to my mind, is more in keeping with expectations at this price point.
I definitely feel like the J2 meets expectations without swapping the power supply, largely because it comes with a quality SMPS wall wart. You can improve it with a LPS, but it's definitely not needed like it is with the D50S to avoid the poor quality USB power. 🙂
Another great review!! 👍👍
Thanks Sasha!
Met the Awesome #GeshelliLabs crew at AXPONA chicago today. Heard the J2 DAC. I did not have a 2d sound to my ears. I'm also familiar with the Yamaha Studio monitors used in the room they set up. The J2 had a nice soundstage and didn't suffer in the imaging department. Basically it's a very full sounding Dac with a nice punch. Great price even with the classy wooden casework option and USB . I might snag one soon.
With speakers, it will produce a better sense of depth than with headphones so that makes sense. Glad you enjoyed it. Great people and great products
God bless, thank you for the info; friend.
My pleasure 🙂
It's been a year now, and a new one with an AKM 4493 is now being offered, as are the two others. Would be interesting to hear your take on the newer AKM 4493 model.
I've got one organised with Geshelli Labs for next year (once they get the backorders cleared). I'm excited to try it out!
@@PassionforSound EXCELLENT! Looking forward to that review!
You have a very dreamy voice my dude; might wanna get into podcasts and make a killing.
Haha. Thanks, T D. Not sure there's much money in podcasting alone (is there?) and I don't have time for a third gig unless it can replace my paid day job 🙂
Just received my Geshelli J2S Socketed AKM with a Sparkos 3602 in the RCA output. In a word itis brilliant. I own the OG ESS Pro version which is excellent but the AKM version is smoother. The Sparkos op amp takes it to another level with layering and instrument separation I thought not possible from streaming. p.s. The DAC requires at least 6 hours of break in to reach its full potential IMO.
I've got one of those coming too - can't wait!
Just got my J2. Sound is blowing me away vs the Hegel H80 built in DAC.
So glad you're enjoying it! Sadly, built in DACs are rarely as good as a separate unit, but it's great that you can do easily and (relatively) cheaply get a big upgrade
Is there a sub $500us DAC that has a more 3 dimensional sound ?
The Schiit Modi Multibit might do this, but otherwise the nearest thing I'm aware of is the Chord Mojo
Guess what my brother... Another new chip! J2 with AKM 4499 is on the way! With a followup around Q1 2024 where they will have a new button scheme similar to the Archel 3 Pro. I signed on to the soft launch and should have this new J2 in about a week or so.
J2 AKM (incl. 4499) review drops on Sunday (Australia time). Watch out!
@@PassionforSound Did you get the stock options? Or did you go all out with all Sparkos?
Also looking into the Gustard P26
We should do email Lachlan...
I had the Sparkos op-amps so I could test from the most basic to the most upgraded options.
@@PassionforSound not sure if you have the Sparkos SS2590 dual pro S though. You "can" get that into the SE section of the J2 but not the balanced they say
I've only got what can come specced from the factory which is the SS3602
Great review! I would love to hear a comparison of the J2 with the Soncoz LA-QXD1. Same $200 price, both fully balanced, both with ESS chips.
I need to try to get my hands on the Soncoz - I keep getting asked about it so I'll see what I can arrange...
You forget you mention how customizable they are! The case is offered in multiple colors or wood options (extra.) Same with the plexiglass. I also think the USB option adds $50.
Regarding performance, I wonder if might have run into the limits of my portable dac (Ear Studio ES100 using the USB connection) I thought I couldn't always pick out instruments on busy tracks because my HD560S was at its limit or that I didn't know what I was doing. And crash cymbals always sound weird and sometimes nasty.
But I'm afraid to drop a bunch of money and then hear no difference.
That's a good point about the customisation! I forget that people don't know that already (this is my third or fourth Geshelli review).
As for the performance, the DAC will be your limiting factor I think. Upgrading even to something like an SMSL SU-6 or Khadas Tone 2 would be a step up I think, but the J2 would look so much better 🙂
@@PassionforSound Ok, thank you. I don't have much experience with dacs so I wasn't sure where the weak link, if any, was.
*I am new to the channel, could you tell me what chip sounds better than AKM or ESS families?
So I don't go backward engineering through the rest of the videos*
I have Cirrus Logic 4272 chip on my Focusrite Saffire Pro 40, and it does sound very 3D. They still use it in modern Focusrite 18i20 Gen 3 interface.
I am having issues with Firewire though, so I have been buying and returning DACs recently.
From SMSL SU-9 Pro, to Toppic E70 Velvet, to RME ADI-2 DAC FS
I just see the sound pulled back on them. More 2D than my old Focusrite. They have better detail and separation though compared to my Saffire.
SU-9 Pro was easily the best out of them in terms of tangible space though, and I would repurchase it if I used Master Bus EQ.
SU-9 Pro: (bass was great, midrange was way to subdued, and high though clear, were harsh somewhere in 1-3.5 khz range),
Sadly, it's not as simple as choosing based on the chip. I've heard ESS, Cirrus and AKM chips all sound great. So much of the sound of a DAC comes down also to the power supply quality and also the output stage after the DAC chip. Sorry that I can't help make it simpler.
ES9026PRO or ES9038Q2M which is the chip to get in the J2?
They've recently made both chips available I think. My unit was an early one so it's the chip that's the standard inclusion because the option didn't exist for an alternate chip back then
Would be interesting to compare the J2 to the Soncoz LA QXD1. Both cheap balanced ESS based DACs, not to mention they both measure very similarly.
I agree. I'll contact Soncoz and see what I can arrange 🙂
thx i am trying the d50s though i am pretty sure it will be an upgrade from my alc1200 onboard anyway
The D50s is a great DAC. Hope you enjoy it
@@PassionforSound yes it is good indeed but maybe it is my ears lol but i don't find the sound difference so amazing with my onboard, i have a marantz pm 25 amplifier and 2 cabasse mt 32 full tower and with a very good rating from the classical music magazine le diapason d'or. so not too shabby...
@@PassionforSound i had much trouble to have sound as well on my rear speakers.. (same sound not 4.1 but i like to be immersed in it) for that i use another sound card in parallel and put it in tape in mode in my amplifier
I just remembered that I changed the op-amp in my D50S to get better sound. It's a fiddly job, but upgrading to a Muses or other high quality op-amp can make a significant difference
Looking forward to this review!!
It's a great product so hopefully worth the wait 🙂
@@PassionforSound Wonderful review, great to see Geshelli out with another quality product! Thank you for the review!
My pleasure. They've had to put a short halt on supply due to a power regulator supply issue, but hopefully it will be rolling out again soon
I hope you could help with answering this. I have the J1 and I was curious about upgrading to an Ares 2 or Bifrost 2, I'm using a Singxer SA-1. Could you compare the J2 with bifrost 2 and Ares 2? I know Bifrost and Ares are more expensive but I wanted to know if it was worth upgrading to. Thank you
I don't have the Ares 2 because that was on loan, but I do own the B2. The B2 has a more refined sound with a greater sense of depth and 3-dimensionality. I personally do think it's worth the upgrade because the SA-1 is good enough that you'll be able to enjoy the improvements. I'm not so much a fan of the Ares 2 so I'd definitely focus on Bifrost 2.
@@PassionforSound this is very helpful, thank you!
My pleasure
I got the Geshelli J2 instead of the schiitt modius, what do you think is the best Gain stage for the J2? Is it the highest or medium?
The J2 is great! Nice choice.
I don't believe the gain makes a significant difference to the sound so it's more about how much volume range you need. Use full output as a default and then pull it back if you need more range on your amp volume.
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the reply, I just find the low gain on amps like JDS atom to be too low powered (ineffecient?) or too quiet for my taste. For now Im good with the 2nd gain and my knob to 12:00- 1:00. The Beyer t1.2 just whisper out tiny details out of nowhere. Hope you'll grow big!
Glad you've found a setup you're happy with. Thanks for the kind wishes!
Amazing review. I have a Samsung tv that I’m using a Spotify app on it to steam into a intergraded Amp for now. Would you recommend this DAC to help improve the sound. Or recommend something els.
Thanks again for any advice and help.
The internal DACs in TVs are generally pretty average so an external DAC will be a nice upgrade. If you're happy with your amp then that's a good option
@@PassionforSound Thank you very much.
I'm curious how it compares to the Soncoz LA-QXD1. It looks like you haven't review the Soncoz. Any plans for that review?
No current plans - I'm swamped until February 2022!
Hi. Which do you think would be a better dac in terms of realistic sound, 3D Soundstage, instrument separation? Cant decide if i should get the Geshelli J2 akm, Schiit MMB 2 or the Modius. I listen to jazz, acoustic guitar music, drums. Etc. Thank you so much! Keep up the awesome work!
For a 3D soundstage, you really need to get away from chip-based Delta Sigma DACs which means the MMB is your only choice in that list. The J2 and Modius are both limited in soundstage depth by their use of AKM/ESS chips
@@PassionforSound i see. Thank you so much for your response. So MMB or maybe the bifrost. I was really considering the J2. I've seen so much rave reviews on it. In terms of sound quality, which do you prefer, the J2 or the MMB? Thanks again for your help.
I'm currently working only with the ESS version J2 so it's possible that this could change slightly, but the J2 has the edge on sheer sense of detail/resolution, but the MMB has the depth and layering in the soundstage for sure.
I've got the AKM J2 coming soon and their new AK4499 based DAC as well so stay tuned...
@@PassionforSound Awesome! Looking forward to the review. The Akm version is what most prefer i noticed. Thanks again for answering my questions.
Great review! I got a question and I need expert advice. If money wasn’t an issue what dac would you suggest for best soundstage? You were mentioning the J2 is more 2D than 3D. I’m on a quest to find the best audio setup for pinpointing footsteps in games.
The best soundstaging and imaging DACs that I've found are the Chord DACs. My personal favourite is the TT2 with the M-Scaler, but the Qutest is also excellent if you're not wanting to go all out straight away
@@PassionforSoundThank you 🙏
@@PassionforSound Another question I got for you. I’m currently looking at the Mojo 2 or the Qutest/Anni stack, would you consider the stack or would the Mojo 2 be sufficient for FPS games?
Either would be great. I haven't tried the Anni, but I trust Chord to make good products so you should do great either way
Additional USB will cost $50，is it worth it？I want to run it on my pc🤔
If you're running from your PC then you'll probably need USB (unless you have coax or optical from your PC)
Hey, great review! I'm looking at getting one of these but have a couple of questions that you may have the answer to. I'm Australian so need a power plug that supports Australian sockets. I didn't see this as an option when ordering, only US and European. I think you are Australian as well, so how did you get around this? Also can the DAC be powered off the USB and if so does it make a difference to the sound? I would be using optical as an input from my pc. Cheers man
Hi Drex, they can't be powered by USB so you do need a separate power supply. What I've done with mine (and I can't recommend it because it may not be entirely safe) is to get the US plug and carefully twist the power pins so they go in an Aussie socket. The actual adapter handles 240V so it's just a matter of getting it to fit. Alternatively, you can buy a US to AUS adapter which is cheap and simple - just makes the plug a little chunkier
@@PassionforSound Ah ok cool, thanks for the info and speedy reply. I don't think I want to be twisting pins and from previous experience US to AU voltage converters are usually massive and an eyesore. I might just let them know their products are in demand down here and keep my fingers crossed they will support AU plugs in the future. Cheers
@@drex128 Hey Drex. I think you may have misunderstood - you don't need an Aus to US power converter, just an adapter that plugs into an Australian power socket and has a US style socket on the back. These are often called travel adapters and are not much bigger than a standard power plug. You don't need to convert the voltage as the power adapter that comes with the Geshelli should work fine with Australian mains voltages.
@@johnvandyke4503 Oh nice, thanks for clarifying.
Just seconding what John said. They're very small adapters with no active components. Also quite cheap.
Thanks for the excellent and informative review. I am new to streaming and do not own a DAC at present. I have a Schiit system (Vidar, Freya S and Mani). I did not want to pop USD 700 for the Bifrost 2, so I just ordered the Geshelli J2 with USB (not yet received) as a lower cost alternative. Do you have a recommendation for a headphone amp to power most headphones. Would you go with Geshelli or Schiit, or does that depend on the specific headphone?
I'd go with the E2 so it will stack nicely with your J2 and it also happens to be one of the very best amps at the price. Keep in mind that it requires as balanced headphone cable (and a headphone that can run balanced). Otherwise, the Archel 2.5XL from Geshelli would likely be just as good, but in single-ended form.
Thanks for your response. How do you compare the Geshelli J2 with the Schiit Modi Multibit, which are similarly priced? The J2 has balanced outputs, whereas the Modi MB has Multibit technology and a linear power supply?
@@sopasadena1499 So?Did you like it?
Really like the J2. I have the ess version. Very realistic with no harshness. Some like the akm version better
I haven't fired up the Modi MB2 yet, but hope to get to it today. For clarity, the Modi MB2 uses an external switch mode power supply, not LPS.
Jnog2 I don't know how they come up with their naming system but I would have changed the J to an S.
Lol. Check out my interview with Geno and Sherri from Geshelli Labs for that answer. 🙂
@@PassionforSound thanks. It's amazing they can compete against mass-produced Chinese products.
Geshelli J2 or Topping E50 for desktop setup running both headphones and speakers ?
I think I just answered you on a different video, but I'd take the E50.
Is there any difference in SQ when using this balanced vs single ended?
Very little if any. I always test this, but only comment on it if there's a significant difference
how does the J2 compare to Aries 2 Sound quality wise ?? please im in buying mode
I haven't tried them side by side, but the Ares II has quite a different sound - overly smooth and with a large soundstage. The J2 is a drier/more neutral sounding DAC that will come across more detailed and resolving, but with less soundstage size.
@@PassionforSound Thanks may buy both lol
They'd be a good compliment
how about J2 vs EverSolo Z8
Based on the J2 ESS, the Z8 is clearly better, but I'm expecting a J2 AKM socketed version soon so that might mix things up a bit... Sub and ring the bell (if you haven't already) to catch that one.
@@PassionforSound yes The cheapaudioman reviewed the AKM version and highly recommended it. He also compared it with the ESS dac chip version
I’m looking to upgrade my dac
I’m currently using Arcam r dac
How does this geshelli dac compare?
Where can you purchase the geshelli in Australia?
I think you need to order Geshelli direct from Australia. As for vs the Arcam, it's been a long time since I tried the R-DAC, but I'd expect the J2 to offer greater refinement and detail retrieval.
@@PassionforSound
I tried looking for a distributor in Australia however no luck ?
That's what I thought. Ordering direct is quick and easy so unless you're somewhere remote you should be fine to do that
This guy needs to try some 2 channel set ups. The J2 has layers of depth, with a well paired 2 channel system i feel like i can walk between the musicians but the wall behind the speakers is in the way, not sure how Geshelli pulled that off, i guess you call that Magic.
This guy does headphone reviews and states it pretty clearly at the start of every single video.
@@PassionforSound so you agree, cool
It's not whether I agree or disagree, it's that my channel is focussed on headphone-based listening because I'm not in a position to use or review loudspeakers. The loudspeaker listening experience IS very different and I definitely acknowledge that, but I can only discuss what I hear through headphones. My experiences suggest that these impressions do translate to speakers in the sense that DACs that produce better depth and layering on headphones produce outstanding layering and depth from speakers while DACs like the J2 (which I really like so this isn't a knock against it) will produce depth and layering more than through headphones, but not to the same level as those other DACs (i.e. Schiit Multibit, Chord or R2R DACs)
I'm eyeing this one, although it was a bit more expensive than I thought. I saw somewhere it's $250 + $50 for USB? How does this compare to Schiit Modius?
That sounds about right as the list price was $299 and may have included USB at that price I think.
I can't directly compare to the Modius, but I think it's comparable rather than clearly better/worse
Just FYI...NOBODY on RUclips cares that you're "eyeing this one".
Its going to be a choice based on preference assuming you are using the XLR output. Having had both the Modius XLR output is as good as the j2s xlr/rca outputs but its RCA output is rather weak IMO. If you are going to be using the RCA, I think Geshelli is a better bet personally.
Via XLR Modius is kind of a bass cannon. It has more bass, slam and sounds a little more "studio neutralish" outside of the bass which sounds boosted compared the J2. its got a hint of the AKM velvet style transients going on, which are slightly less aggressive than the j2. If a recording sounds bad, it will sound bad on the Modius. Modius RCA sounds like a fairly average AKM dac, its a little better than a Modi but not by much.
J2 handles sibilance better (less annoying), to me sounds a little more natural and has a more neutral level of bass. I dont think its quite as "studio neutral" as some recordings which I know sound like crap, actually sound pretty good on J2. Its a little more dynamic and has harder hitting transients (ESS vs AKM mostly). The XLR and RCA are just as good as Passion for Sound said in his review.
@@stephenoverton8352 Thanks for contributing to the conversation, I hope you have a great day.
@@Vishmaw Very interesting, thanks for the opinion!
Sound wise how does this compare with ifi zen dac version 2?
I haven't heard the Zen DAC - sorry!
The ZEN V2 sounds like pure pain paired with the Erish 2.
The Erish 2 sounds pretty good with my ESS UDA38Pro, but I am looking to upgrade.
Is there an Australian distributor?
I don't think so. The shipping from the US is very fast though so just order direct.
@@PassionforSound I tried that, but when you enter your shipping details, Australia doesn’t come up as an option..
Hmmm... That's strange. Let me check in with Geshelli for you
Ok, turns out that their shipping provider hiked up the prices so they're in the process of finding a new shipping company and will be able to sell direct to us again soon.
Is it possible to change out the op amps easily?
Hi Theo, I don't think so, but I've never popped it open to look.
@@PassionforSound thanks for the reply. The are probably surface mount, which requires some more work but still doable. Do you think the burson v6s will fit in the enclosure?
Hi Theo, I imagine it would with the right adaptation because I do believe they're SMDs (but not certain) and that also means they're quite possibly the smaller size chips.
@@theovonskeletor3709 Hey, i was thinking about doing just that.
Any progress on the topic?
@@Spawned4Dinner idk man. it would be a lot cooler if there was.
Arya VS Ether 2 VS LCD-3, please :))
That would be a great battle. Not sure if I can get them all here at the same time, but we'll see what the future holds...
I’m considering this in a hifi setup and the chord mojo 2. How do they compare, is the mojo 2 significantly better?
I love the J2, but the Mojo 2 is clearly better in detail retrieval and soundstage depth / 3-dimensionality
What glass panel and amp cover is that ?
It's a plain silver case and a teal (a sort of green) cover plate. You could ask Sherri at Geshelli for whatever is in this video and she'd likely be able to match it for you I expect
@@PassionforSound Did not reply. I am waiting for their email reply. Is there still plain glass look ?
Give them time - it's the weekend over there. You'll need to chat to them about what is/isn't available
@@PassionforSound Alright they are probably busy
Good thing you're 'unbiased' because otherwise...
This is good info man, but the editing between each and every sentence is just too much. Jump... Jump... Jump. It's not natural, just distracting.
Sorry about that. Some videos are harder to produce and edit than others because I have a toddler and sleep has been a rare commodity at times for the last couple of years. I'm not always as fluent as I'd like 🙂
very poor talking, too much talking and nothing said... dont watch, waste of time.
I got a question. So I have the Archel 2.5XL (Unbalanced) can I pair this with the J2?
Absolutely! The Archel 2.5XL has XLR inputs on the back so you can run either RCA or XLR from the J2