I totally agree especially because they come out of the factory running so lean. It boggles my mind that they didn't come out of the factory with a fan. If you keep running into the problem that's telling you it should have probably been sorted out at the factory beforehand it's just my opinion though. Amongst many others who believe that as well including yourself
I don't know maybe they figured most people aren't going to be riding in his conditions and doing what he does but I'll tell you what, if you are you are definitely going to need one though
I think it’s important to remember that many riders won’t ever need a fan for the trails they ride, and OEM’s can’t add every option or they wouldn’t be cost competitive. Personally I’d love if they all came with fans, and skid plates, wrap around hand guards, pipe guards, spark arrestors, etc. But not every buyer wants to spend an extra $1,500 on their bike to get those as standard options, and KTM or any other brand would be foolish to build stock bikes like that because they their buyers have different needs. So they leave it up to the aftermarket.
You guys bring up alternative thoughts, I like them!! And stellar as always video on the subject, thanks Kyle I made it to the 3rd ride on my TE250i when watching it get to 230-240 degrees I had to invest into a impeller and fan kit. Could there be as many as 50% or more of the buyers of TE models will do the 1st-2nd gear rides in the heat of the summer, and those bikes will get HOT...
Kyle, I have a friend that constantly dogs on my XCW TPI. He’s heard from the old timers that they stay away from these TPI’s because they’re mostly worried about a fueling failure because they run so lean that would cost in the thousands to repair compared to a carburetor bike. So he’s staying away from a TPI for that reason. I think to each their own but I’m loving my TPI and haven’t had any problems with it besides rider error!
Just rin a relay on the control circuit controlled by ac side of the stator so it will automatically run only when the bike is hot and running. Preferably a timer relay so it could cool for say one minute after engine shut off.
Thanks Kyle. Great information based on real world experience. By the time my 2019 TE 300i spits coolant on a first gear climb I am equally overheated..
Allen Evans Hi Allen. Both types of induction are highly developed. KTM has been building FI bikes for years. Many of the components are similar or the same on both 2T and 4T bikes. Both carb and TPI/FI bikes can be tuned to run great. I have both in the garage.
Solid and comprehensive explanation. I believe Tusk makes a unit that switches off as soon at the thermostat gets 5(?) degrees below the threshold you set. My local shop mounted a TT fan on their first 2020 300i before they rolled it in on the floor. It’s easy to get nervous contemplating spending $11-12k after watching some TPI reviewers that seem to frame these bikes as running too hot and are therefore flawed. They fail to state plainly that these cold-blooded bikes are simply a product of European standards. Kyle your investment in time to compare multiple KTH/HQVs really helps me narrow down what’s important. Thanks!
I know right, not just TPI all carb bikes too. When we have group rides in winter on a slow tech track 80% are boiling the kettle, can imagine what its like up North for you.
Never needed a fan on any of my Beta 2 strokes (2 300's and current 200rr) and all I ride is tight tech trail. My KTM's all boiled over at the drop of a hat. Fan does the trick for KTM's...They should come with them!
The 2017 Beta 300RR I tested boiled over on trails like this one. The 2019 Beta 390RR I'm testing boils over too. They all do when the speeds are slow.
@@DirtBikeChannel I cant speak for the 2017, but my 2014, and 2015 300's never lost a drop when KTM's were spewing all over the place. Could be a difference in your jetting at elevation. I'm on the east coast at 1000' and stock jetting was great. I ride nothing but tight slow stuff and trust me...there is no way you are going slower than me! LOL I do prefer my jetting a bit on the rich side for smooth torque so maybe that helps. Anyway you are right about most bikes needing a fan. My TX300 needed one to get things under control.
Awesome video. Thank you for doing the work that you do so we learn with you. I can not express enough how much I, I'm sure many others as well, appreciate what you do. Keep it it up brother!!
That was my point from the beginning I know a lot of people that have much older bikes, including myself, and nobody has an overheating issue. I mean the last time I rode my bike in the Freetown State Forest it was damn near 90 degrees and humid as a bastard because I do live at sea level though because I live in New England.(I'm sure that makes a big difference)I have a 1997 Honda CR250 old school motocross bike and even that thing doesn't overheat and I'm riding at snail's pace sometimes. especially in those woods. the trails in the woods out here are pretty technical. Granted you don't have to crawl up 6-foot rock faces like Kyle does. LOL to be honest if I had to do that I don't think I'd be able to ride in there, but it can get pretty technical. quarter mile Rock beds. There are some long sections made out of logs that you have to travel over and it's bouncing you up and down so there's a lot of clutch involved so you don't stall. one of the section at the end is like that for about 80 feet or so , also there are a few Sandhills that you have to climb up and if you're not clutching the bike on that you will stall in the middle of the hill. The only bike I've ever seen overheat out there was this guy on a 2009 kx250f. Aside from that I've just not yet seen it yet. between you and me I really tend to believe it's a KTM thing because out of the factory ( especially those TPI bikes ) they are running them extremely lean, and a lean bike runs hotter then a bike that is running richer. and carbureted bikes, especially old Two Strokes not only tend to run richer but tend to run a richer mixture something like 32 to 1 or 40 to 1. Where as KTM and husky run around 50 to 1 or 60 to 1. that alone is a pretty lean mixture. but my buddy has a 2018 husky te300 with a carburetor and he runs his bike at 60 to 1 and I've never seen him overheat his bike. So lately I'm starting to lean towards it being a TPI issue. But I guess only time will tell. all I know, is for me personally, I'm probably going to stay away from the TPI bikes as long as humanly possible I just don't trust them yet, even though by right the technology should be on point, I mean they've been doing it on jet skis and snowmobiles for years. But for some reason it just seems like they really haven't dialed it in for motocross bikes yet. I'm sure the bikes run great right out of the factory. and I wouldn't want to knock anyone who has those bikes that's not what I'm aiming to do I'm just saying for me personally I'll stick with a carburetor for now. I don't have to worry about any separate tank with my oil cracking or the oil pump deciding to not to work all of a sudden and I end up seizing a piston, or have to worry about some weird sensor getting clogged up and all of a sudden my bike runs so lean that it all of a sudden decides to seize up... anyway I just feel like you're safer with a carburetor especially in technical trails and difficult Terrain. If my carburetor decides to clog up, my bike will stop running or start running like shit so bad that I will immediately notice. those signs make me feel better. A TPI bike isn't going to give you many warnings before it decides to seize up. which for me is just a scary thought anyway that's my opinion bluntly though
I have a 2019 ktm 300xc and boiled over 3 times granted I was on very technical steep trails at gold creek lodge in Idaho but was only about 75 out! Came home instantly order a trail tech fan
All manufacturers chasing to make their bikes lighter calls for thinner walls and smaller radiators and two strokes now are like the four strokes...if you are riding gnarly shit you need a fan it’s that simple. I’ve seen plenty of Ktms and bergs as far back as 2012 boil, yes jetting can be a cause but when compare radiators of my 2010 WR300 to 2012 Te300, the old husky had more cores and was slightly heavier...fast forward to today and just about every new 2 strokes have thinner and lest cores in radiators. TPI or not, you want to ride hard enduro style you need a fan, period.
I put an IMS expansion tank and Samco hose kit to delete the thermostat. That way if it does boil over, radiators won't have air in them, which actually lowers cooling abilities to boil over easier time and time again. I don't know why KTM's don't come stock with puke tanks for environmentally friendly alone. KDX and CRX's have for years and I think it's required for the ISDE.
Do you also run ICE coolant in the radiator to help cool it...or have you found it not to be helpful? Gr8 riding area, info, and work U R doin' to help us keep going out there!
Engine Ice is marketing BS. It's Propylene Glycol which is well established as having less heat transfer capability than good old cheap green Ethylene Glycol. It does have the advantage of being non-toxic and some racing bodies require it (or plain water). However Engine Ice is selling you Propylene Glycol at $88 per gallon when you account for the fact it's pre-diluted. You can go to any parts store and get Sierra Brand coolant which is also Propylene Glycol at $17/gallon.
The issue for me is the KTM price tag. There seems to be a lot of R&D being done through the consumer with the TPI specifically. They don’t have the performance of the carbureted models and now aftermarket companies are offering up $1500 upgrades just to make them how they were. Add in a fan and you’re the best part of 2k extra on the cost of a new bike. Simply not good enough in my eyes. I’ll do another year with my 2007!
In fact I’ll expand a little.. I live in Australia and a current ktm300 licensed on the road is $15000 for the base model. Let’s add in some steg pegz $200, 2 new tyres because the standard are purely for making it roll out the door only so $250 for tyres and lets say a mousse front and back $500 and maybe a rear disc saver $150. None of these extras are over the top but we are at $16100. Now it’s boiling over.. cooling fan $400.. At this stage you are using your entire mobile data watching all Kyle’s videos (because they’re awesome) and your keen to get rid of the poor starting and lazy bottom to mid power so you invest in an Australian developed TSP head and ecu package for $1500. Grand total $18000 and haven’t even sprung it for my weight. Fear not, I have three KTM’s in the shed including kids bikes and I go on rides with my local KTM dealer and their service is second to none but the quality of the product on offer at the moment for the price tag is not there for me.
Thanks for the video, on my KTM 4 strokes, if you are going 15 miles an hour, maybe you won't boil over climbing. I've added fans to all my 4 strokes. I'd like a fan controller that allowed me to hit a button to activate the fan, then it would run for a set amount of time, some auto function control too, but I hate killing my starter motor battery(usually not a new battery). My next bike purchase is a 300, I'll fan it up, some single track I can't go fast enough, and some Idaho stuff I ride, the climbs are long(and fun), and are at times HOT(even at elevation) . Would aftermarket large radiators solve the issue?
I don't know about the bike but I'm usually the one overheating certainly could use a fan lolz.... We run engine ice in all our bikes, what are your thoughts on that product? We feel a drop in temperature radiating from the engine and rads while riding that's for sure!!
I have a 500exc that is prone to heating up in the tight stuff it does have a fan but I know heat is a big killer of engines. If it were an older vehicle Id just remove the thermostat and let coolant free flow all the time. No thermostat always ran cooler than an open thermostat. Any consequences you thing on a modern bike other than longer to warm up? Lets get crazy...what about 2 fans if the space existed? Perhaps overkill or too much drain on battery.
I've never seen a KTM 300 that doesn't overheat in the slow technical stuff, starting with 2001 I used to have. I have many friends with 300s ranging from 2005 and up and they all overheat. The radiator fans are the best thing to come out for technical woods riders 2 or 4 stroke IMO. We've tried all of the fancy coolants and water pump impellers etc etc and none of them work like a radiator fan.
our races we have to bring booster cables now for sweepers to pickup the KTM Husqs who kill their batteries with fans. Sometimes kill the battery so much the TPI fuel pumps wont engage, always make sure on a fan and only turn it on when bike is running at higher RPM, Put resistor on to make fan run at 1/2 the speed otehrwise you are always running bike at a charge loss.
I had noticed my 2017 exc 250 carbed model seemed to run a bit warmer than any bike I've had before. It boiled over in some muddy snotty stuff earlier in the year, first time I've actually thought about a fan! I'm sure my 2012 300 ran cooler, still playing about with jetting atm mind. Think I will invest in one when it starts warming up again next year.
Very well done video, good and accurate info. I agree all bikes in low speed situations will benefit from a fan. Especially 4 strokes. I had experience with both 2 & 4strokes.
The fuel tank to radiator clearance is too close as well, not enough room for the air to flow through freely through the back of the radiators...my buddys 2018 300XC over heats way easier than My 2019 YZ250X, so we went 3 teeth taller on the rear sprocket and a higher pressure radiator cap... much better.
My wr250f four stroke has never overheated and I’ve had it buried in sand redlining a lot for 4-5 minutes with absolutely no movement and no issues. No fan either.
I have the exact opposite experience . My 19 TE300i runs cooler than every single carbed bike I ride with. We all stop and check temps and I'm always 5 to 10 degrees celsius lower on my bike.
I’ve got a fan on my 2020 and still have overheating issues - today I boiled over at 190 according to the tusk thermometer. Any ideas @dirtbikechannel ?
Being that its an enduro model, manufacturers should pay attention to what can happen when enduro riders use the bike for what its for, like over heat it and put a fan on the damn thing
Mine YZ250X doesnt... the fuel tank to radiator clearance on the back side of the radiator is too close. a higher pressure radiator cap will do wonders, and gearing the bike down.
My 250X is geared lower as well, and the X has larger cooling jackets in the cylinder, and much more air space behind the radiator. It will get hot...but nothing like the 2018 300XC before we geared it down and put on a higher pressure cap.
@@cooptroop5 Just a little heads up, the higher pressure radiator cap isn't helping the bike run cooler, its just helping keep the coolant in the radiators so it doesn't boil out when it's over heating. This is also true with sime of the coolant out there like Evans waterless, engine ice, etc... The bike still gets just as hot, but those coolants have a higher boiling temp to keep you from losing coolant. This can actually be bad for your bike because you can be over heating and you don't know it because its not showing any signs. Just something to remember with that high pressure cap... I prefer to just run the stock cap, regular old coolant, and a fan to actually keep the engine cool.
KTM price isn't going down,seems parts they are putting on is...not like they are alone in doing this. I imagine they will gladly sell you a 6 day ISDE model tho with all the bells and whistles for a crazy $$$ amount.
Has anyone tried to run a fan off a rc car battery or drill battery. My yz250 has no battery but I think I a fan would be a good idea. I've never overheated it but my friends ktm were pissing out coolant so I had to be close. I e never seen a fan on a yz250. Does anybody run one? What fan did you use?
Is there a way you can richen the mixture of the tpi bike when you don't have to worry about emissions? Because i wonder if those bikes are making the most possible power with the ratio they use.
Hey Kyle you can get the trail tech fan from parts giant for 154$ for a 2017/18 pretty much same fan you just have to shave down the temp censor 1mm and your good to go talked to trail tech personally!
If im overheating somewhere on all kinds of bikes. I would look at my riding style. Have you tried riding this hill in 2nd and slipping the clutch instead of just trying to roost up it in 1st? Remember wwgjd
@@DirtBikeChannel if thats an invite i would love to! Im a pretty big fan lol. I have heard alot of people say that about hill climb overheating and just wanted your take on it. I probably wouldnt even make it to the hill :-)
Running no coolant would prevent boil overs too... Evans will let you run your engine hot enough to hurt it without you ever knowing it until it's too late. Just run standard coolant and get a fan if you need one.
I ride with side by sides and quads alot and the 450RX gets way too hot. Wrong bike for that kind of riding but I really love the bike. I just got the universal from trailtech. Hopefully it works the way I want it to.
The 300 may be too much power and waste heat for your slow riding style...not TPI...the new TPI 150 has plenty of low rpm torque for your speed and won't overheat since it has the same size radiators and less waste heat. Buying too much bike is a common mistake for new riders.
Kirk Richter yeah that’s what I use at the moment but I’ve had cams moving on throttle tube side and sticking throttle open! And the clutch side I’ve had turn in a race and I’m not doing hard Enduro stuff just regular hare & hounds. Looks like Kyle uses something different which is why I asked.
SkillzT dang I have been thru dozens of sets with zero issues on my 4 strokes and my 2 stroke! Good old fashion renthol with hair spray and wire is a good combo! What kind of bars do you use!?
Kirk Richter yeah I think that’s what I’ll go back to. Don’t mind the extra install time. Lock ins seem a great idea but I’ve not had the best experience.
The 2020 XC-W has a thermostatically controlled wiring harness. That means you just need a 'dumb' fan. It's much cheaper, much simpler and a much cleaner install. The ECU will control it. Part #79635941044. See the thread over at thumpertalk.com/forums/topic/1306196-tpi-fan-confusion/ for details.
The XC model is not made for those slow tipe of trails, they have a long 1 and 2 gear and it needs to use to much clutch that make the bike overheat. So go for the XCW/EXC because that bike have 1 and 2 short gears and you guys dont have to use alot of clutch and they dont overheat is simple...but of course that the fan is always neede....
@@suzyamerica4679 Lol. Yes. They really are so tough! They can take much more of a beating. Ktm are deafinatly a better bike but you got to keep putting $$$ into them.
@@DirtBikeChannel Hey Kyle. Look my bike has overheated. But that was only when it was sandy and I got allot of wheel spin. In gnarly technical stuff it also gets hot but there is no real steam and the "boiling" sound. And it doesn't even have a fan! But when I ride with friends many times their KTM's overheat sooner than mine. Haven't noticed it on the Sherco's that much. But never the less. Here is South Africa we love your show and we all watch it often. Come visit us here in Cape Town.
@@20043670 Bingo. I am not quite $2K into a 99 KDX220R with FMF everything, opened airbox, RB Designs high compression head, 48T rear sprocket, Lectron 36HV carb, Shinko trail rubber. Got it ridiculously cheaply. What a trail bike! :)
It's strange I own an old school CR250 1997 and I've never overheated it and I do some pretty hefty trail riding in the Freetown State Forest wonder wow those bikes overheat so fast are they really running That Lean? I know a lean bike is a fast bike but still sounds sketchy to me. For me I just be more worried about roasting the piston. My buddies got one of those bikes it's a husky te300 it's got a carburetor though he's never had a problem with it he's got over 3000 miles on it and it's never done a top end, and it runs beautifully just like the day he pulled it out of the factory
Josh Furness These bikes only get hot when on extreme first gear climbs, slipping the clutch, hot days, etc. Most guys don’t ride these conditions, they are cruising faster on easier ground.
Again, so F'ing hot you don't even want to be outside!! I know all about that one, we have at least three weeks a year you cannot go ride at all because it's over 100 degrees F
@@MotoFamMayhem yeah maybe it just hasn't happened yet I'm sure it will haven't had much riding time on it since I rebuilt the motor. Granted the stuff I write is completely different than the stuff Kyle rides. To be perfectly honest my point was that I'm really surprised it hasn't happened yet
Im a mechanic and a budget "build" is an oil change, new clutch, brake pads, change of brake fluid, new cables, carb cleaning and fork rebuild and new tires.
Aftermarket radiators with a good thermostat solved all my overheating issues 🤷🏼♂️ as long as I’ve been riding I’ve never needed a fan, but then again none of my bikes had a stator powerful enough to run a fan...this must be a rich guys problem ...hey you know what’s cool? For the price of 1 Ktm you can buy 3 older Japanese bikes ...sure you still need to be a man and KICKSTART your motorcycle but my 02 Yamaha eats those overpriced kraut bikes alive ...everywhere on any terrain
All of the TPI bikes should have had a radiator fan from the beginning, from the factory, period. KTM/Husky cheaped out, period....
I totally agree especially because they come out of the factory running so lean. It boggles my mind that they didn't come out of the factory with a fan. If you keep running into the problem that's telling you it should have probably been sorted out at the factory beforehand it's just my opinion though. Amongst many others who believe that as well including yourself
I don't know maybe they figured most people aren't going to be riding in his conditions and doing what he does but I'll tell you what, if you are you are definitely going to need one though
Since all the 4 strokes of all brands run hot, does that mean they all should have fans and that they all cheaped out?
I think it’s important to remember that many riders won’t ever need a fan for the trails they ride, and OEM’s can’t add every option or they wouldn’t be cost competitive. Personally I’d love if they all came with fans, and skid plates, wrap around hand guards, pipe guards, spark arrestors, etc. But not every buyer wants to spend an extra $1,500 on their bike to get those as standard options, and KTM or any other brand would be foolish to build stock bikes like that because they their buyers have different needs. So they leave it up to the aftermarket.
You guys bring up alternative thoughts, I like them!! And stellar as always video on the subject, thanks Kyle
I made it to the 3rd ride on my TE250i when watching it get to 230-240 degrees I had to invest into a impeller and fan kit.
Could there be as many as 50% or more of the buyers of TE models will do the 1st-2nd gear rides in the heat of the summer, and those bikes will get HOT...
Kyle,
I have a friend that constantly dogs on my XCW TPI. He’s heard from the old timers that they stay away from these TPI’s because they’re mostly worried about a fueling failure because they run so lean that would cost in the thousands to repair compared to a carburetor bike.
So he’s staying away from a TPI for that reason. I think to each their own but I’m loving my TPI and haven’t had any problems with it besides rider error!
Just rin a relay on the control circuit controlled by ac side of the stator so it will automatically run only when the bike is hot and running. Preferably a timer relay so it could cool for say one minute after engine shut off.
6:18 looks like you're boiling and need a fan as well :)
I still think your take on dual sporting would be awesome. Especially with the technical riding you do. Thanks for the content as always
Thanks Kyle. Great information based on real world experience. By the time my 2019 TE 300i spits coolant on a first gear climb I am equally overheated..
Hello Garth, I own a 2016 TE-300, great bike, and I will stay with the carb. bikes!!
Allen Evans Hi Allen. Both types of induction are highly developed. KTM has been building FI bikes for years. Many of the components are similar or the same on both 2T and 4T bikes. Both carb and TPI/FI bikes can be tuned to run great. I have both in the garage.
Solid and comprehensive explanation. I believe Tusk makes a unit that switches off as soon at the thermostat gets 5(?) degrees below the threshold you set. My local shop mounted a TT fan on their first 2020 300i before they rolled it in on the floor. It’s easy to get nervous contemplating spending $11-12k after watching some TPI reviewers that seem to frame these bikes as running too hot and are therefore flawed. They fail to state plainly that these cold-blooded bikes are simply a product of European standards. Kyle your investment in time to compare multiple KTH/HQVs really helps me narrow down what’s important. Thanks!
Any Enduro bike being ridden in 1st and 2nd gear often needs a fan.
Good bike companies fit them as standard.
I know right, not just TPI all carb bikes too. When we have group rides in winter on a slow tech track 80% are boiling the kettle, can imagine what its like up North for you.
Never needed a fan on any of my Beta 2 strokes (2 300's and current 200rr) and all I ride is tight tech trail. My KTM's all boiled over at the drop of a hat. Fan does the trick for KTM's...They should come with them!
The 2017 Beta 300RR I tested boiled over on trails like this one. The 2019 Beta 390RR I'm testing boils over too. They all do when the speeds are slow.
@@DirtBikeChannel I cant speak for the 2017, but my 2014, and 2015 300's never lost a drop when KTM's were spewing all over the place. Could be a difference in your jetting at elevation. I'm on the east coast at 1000' and stock jetting was great.
I ride nothing but tight slow stuff and trust me...there is no way you are going slower than me! LOL I do prefer my jetting a bit on the rich side for smooth torque so maybe that helps. Anyway you are right about most bikes needing a fan. My TX300 needed one to get things under control.
Awesome video. Thank you for doing the work that you do so we learn with you. I can not express enough how much I, I'm sure many others as well, appreciate what you do. Keep it it up brother!!
My KDX 220 has never overheated.. And thats in the hot Las Vegas desert.
That was my point from the beginning I know a lot of people that have much older bikes, including myself, and nobody has an overheating issue. I mean the last time I rode my bike in the Freetown State Forest it was damn near 90 degrees and humid as a bastard because I do live at sea level though because I live in New England.(I'm sure that makes a big difference)I have a 1997 Honda CR250 old school motocross bike and even that thing doesn't overheat and I'm riding at snail's pace sometimes. especially in those woods. the trails in the woods out here are pretty technical. Granted you don't have to crawl up 6-foot rock faces like Kyle does. LOL to be honest if I had to do that I don't think I'd be able to ride in there, but it can get pretty technical. quarter mile Rock beds. There are some long sections made out of logs that you have to travel over and it's bouncing you up and down so there's a lot of clutch involved so you don't stall. one of the section at the end is like that for about 80 feet or so , also there are a few Sandhills that you have to climb up and if you're not clutching the bike on that you will stall in the middle of the hill. The only bike I've ever seen overheat out there was this guy on a 2009 kx250f. Aside from that I've just not yet seen it yet. between you and me I really tend to believe it's a KTM thing because out of the factory ( especially those TPI bikes ) they are running them extremely lean, and a lean bike runs hotter then a bike that is running richer. and carbureted bikes, especially old Two Strokes not only tend to run richer but tend to run a richer mixture something like 32 to 1 or 40 to 1. Where as KTM and husky run around 50 to 1 or 60 to 1. that alone is a pretty lean mixture. but my buddy has a 2018 husky te300 with a carburetor and he runs his bike at 60 to 1 and I've never seen him overheat his bike. So lately I'm starting to lean towards it being a TPI issue. But I guess only time will tell. all I know, is for me personally, I'm probably going to stay away from the TPI bikes as long as humanly possible I just don't trust them yet, even though by right the technology should be on point, I mean they've been doing it on jet skis and snowmobiles for years. But for some reason it just seems like they really haven't dialed it in for motocross bikes yet. I'm sure the bikes run great right out of the factory. and I wouldn't want to knock anyone who has those bikes that's not what I'm aiming to do I'm just saying for me personally I'll stick with a carburetor for now. I don't have to worry about any separate tank with my oil cracking or the oil pump deciding to not to work all of a sudden and I end up seizing a piston, or have to worry about some weird sensor getting clogged up and all of a sudden my bike runs so lean that it all of a sudden decides to seize up... anyway I just feel like you're safer with a carburetor especially in technical trails and difficult Terrain. If my carburetor decides to clog up, my bike will stop running or start running like shit so bad that I will immediately notice. those signs make me feel better. A TPI bike isn't going to give you many warnings before it decides to seize up. which for me is just a scary thought anyway that's my opinion bluntly though
Fellow 220r owner cool.
Z Shark remember when anyone asked about shitbox KDX 220 nah boi we talking bout a TPI you idiot
I have a 2019 ktm 300xc and boiled over 3 times granted I was on very technical steep trails at gold creek lodge in Idaho but was only about 75 out! Came home instantly order a trail tech fan
Probably because its faster moving terrain and the bike isnt making nearly as much power as a ktm 250 or 300
All manufacturers chasing to make their bikes lighter calls for thinner walls and smaller radiators and two strokes now are like the four strokes...if you are riding gnarly shit you need a fan it’s that simple. I’ve seen plenty of Ktms and bergs as far back as 2012 boil, yes jetting can be a cause but when compare radiators of my 2010 WR300 to 2012 Te300, the old husky had more cores and was slightly heavier...fast forward to today and just about every new 2 strokes have thinner and lest cores in radiators. TPI or not, you want to ride hard enduro style you need a fan, period.
Awesome vid, I have a 22 sfx450 i looked and couldn't fine one for-this model yet! and any suggestion on a factory fit light kit? Thank an advanced!!
I put an IMS expansion tank and Samco hose kit to delete the thermostat. That way if it does boil over, radiators won't have air in them, which actually lowers cooling abilities to boil over easier time and time again. I don't know why KTM's don't come stock with puke tanks for environmentally friendly alone. KDX and CRX's have for years and I think it's required for the ISDE.
Do you also run ICE coolant in the radiator to help cool it...or have you found it not to be helpful? Gr8 riding area, info, and work U R doin' to help us keep going out there!
Engine Ice is marketing BS. It's Propylene Glycol which is well established as having less heat transfer capability than good old cheap green Ethylene Glycol. It does have the advantage of being non-toxic and some racing bodies require it (or plain water). However Engine Ice is selling you Propylene Glycol at $88 per gallon when you account for the fact it's pre-diluted. You can go to any parts store and get Sierra Brand coolant which is also Propylene Glycol at $17/gallon.
@@doc_d4566 OK, that's good to know; don't fall for the hype! I'll find the SB coolant. Cheers~
is it possible to tune TPI system to make reacher mixture ? Because if not - it sound weird.
The issue for me is the KTM price tag. There seems to be a lot of R&D being done through the consumer with the TPI specifically. They don’t have the performance of the carbureted models and now aftermarket companies are offering up $1500 upgrades just to make them how they were. Add in a fan and you’re the best part of 2k extra on the cost of a new bike. Simply not good enough in my eyes. I’ll do another year with my 2007!
In fact I’ll expand a little.. I live in Australia and a current ktm300 licensed on the road is $15000 for the base model. Let’s add in some steg pegz $200, 2 new tyres because the standard are purely for making it roll out the door only so $250 for tyres and lets say a mousse front and back $500 and maybe a rear disc saver $150. None of these extras are over the top but we are at $16100. Now it’s boiling over.. cooling fan $400.. At this stage you are using your entire mobile data watching all Kyle’s videos (because they’re awesome) and your keen to get rid of the poor starting and lazy bottom to mid power so you invest in an Australian developed TSP head and ecu package for $1500. Grand total $18000 and haven’t even sprung it for my weight. Fear not, I have three KTM’s in the shed including kids bikes and I go on rides with my local KTM dealer and their service is second to none but the quality of the product on offer at the moment for the price tag is not there for me.
Thanks for the video, on my KTM 4 strokes, if you are going 15 miles an hour, maybe you won't boil over climbing. I've added fans to all my 4 strokes. I'd like a fan controller that allowed me to hit a button to activate the fan, then it would run for a set amount of time, some auto function control too, but I hate killing my starter motor battery(usually not a new battery).
My next bike purchase is a 300, I'll fan it up, some single track I can't go fast enough, and some Idaho stuff I ride, the climbs are long(and fun), and are at times HOT(even at elevation) .
Would aftermarket large radiators solve the issue?
I don't know about the bike but I'm usually the one overheating certainly could use a fan lolz.... We run engine ice in all our bikes, what are your thoughts on that product? We feel a drop in temperature radiating from the engine and rads while riding that's for sure!!
I have a 500exc that is prone to heating up in the tight stuff it does have a fan but I know heat is a big killer of engines. If it were an older vehicle Id just remove the thermostat and let coolant free flow all the time. No thermostat always ran cooler than an open thermostat. Any consequences you thing on a modern bike other than longer to warm up?
Lets get crazy...what about 2 fans if the space existed? Perhaps overkill or too much drain on battery.
Cool video. I HATE when some radiator braces do not have enough room for a radiator fan. And from my experience only few of them do🤔😯
I've never seen a KTM 300 that doesn't overheat in the slow technical stuff, starting with 2001 I used to have. I have many friends with 300s ranging from 2005 and up and they all overheat. The radiator fans are the best thing to come out for technical woods riders 2 or 4 stroke IMO. We've tried all of the fancy coolants and water pump impellers etc etc and none of them work like a radiator fan.
our races we have to bring booster cables now for sweepers to pickup the KTM Husqs who kill their batteries with fans. Sometimes kill the battery so much the TPI fuel pumps wont engage, always make sure on a fan and only turn it on when bike is running at higher RPM, Put resistor on to make fan run at 1/2 the speed otehrwise you are always running bike at a charge loss.
I had noticed my 2017 exc 250 carbed model seemed to run a bit warmer than any bike I've had before. It boiled over in some muddy snotty stuff earlier in the year, first time I've actually thought about a fan! I'm sure my 2012 300 ran cooler, still playing about with jetting atm mind. Think I will invest in one when it starts warming up again next year.
What is the ideal temp to set your radiator fan to kick on at? 180? 200?
Kyle
Thanks for the review on cooling but I was wondering what lb. cap do you find works best in the higher elevations?
Very well done video, good and accurate info. I agree all bikes in low speed situations will benefit from a fan. Especially 4 strokes. I had experience with both 2 & 4strokes.
The fuel tank to radiator clearance is too close as well, not enough room for the air to flow through freely through the back of the radiators...my buddys 2018 300XC over heats way easier than My 2019 YZ250X, so we went 3 teeth taller on the rear sprocket and a higher pressure radiator cap... much better.
My wr250f four stroke has never overheated and I’ve had it buried in sand redlining a lot for 4-5 minutes with absolutely no movement and no issues. No fan either.
I have the exact opposite experience . My 19 TE300i runs cooler than every single carbed bike I ride with. We all stop and check temps and I'm always 5 to 10 degrees celsius lower on my bike.
I recognized the shot of Ramey creek. Love riding up there.
Never have figured out why liquid cooling on a dirt bike. My Husky 400 cross never overheated in bottomless sand just working the living devil of it.
Liquid cooled engines run tighter tolerances and produce more power than air cooled engines.
I’ve got a fan on my 2020 and still have overheating issues - today I boiled over at 190 according to the tusk thermometer. Any ideas @dirtbikechannel ?
350 miles, no issue yet. No fan, no boiling. If you do extreme enduro, buy a fun. I used my bike in 1st gear a lot, but no issues
And also when you have a carby bike pulling fuel down through the case and up through the ports its drawing heat out by solvent cooling.
What about the Husky fan thats not adjustable? I’ve just ordered this but I don’t know what temp it comes on at.
I think 300's overheat more than the 250's aswell. My yz250 pushes out coolant only on really gnarly hard enduro stuff.
Being that its an enduro model, manufacturers should pay attention to what can happen when enduro riders use the bike for what its for, like over heat it and put a fan on the damn thing
Hello Kyle, I will stick with my Beta!! you are a gifted rider!! I will try to stick with my carb. bikes
I don't remember you ever having the yz250x over heat. Am I wrong?
Mine YZ250X doesnt... the fuel tank to radiator clearance on the back side of the radiator is too close. a higher pressure radiator cap will do wonders, and gearing the bike down.
Yes, I overheated it multiple times. Fact. I don't show footage of everything I do :)
@@DirtBikeChannel I know you don't, that's why i asked.
My 250X is geared lower as well, and the X has larger cooling jackets in the cylinder, and much more air space behind the radiator.
It will get hot...but nothing like the 2018 300XC before we geared it down and put on a higher pressure cap.
@@cooptroop5 Just a little heads up, the higher pressure radiator cap isn't helping the bike run cooler, its just helping keep the coolant in the radiators so it doesn't boil out when it's over heating. This is also true with sime of the coolant out there like Evans waterless, engine ice, etc... The bike still gets just as hot, but those coolants have a higher boiling temp to keep you from losing coolant. This can actually be bad for your bike because you can be over heating and you don't know it because its not showing any signs. Just something to remember with that high pressure cap... I prefer to just run the stock cap, regular old coolant, and a fan to actually keep the engine cool.
How do you enter on the competition, or is it just based on the viewers??
Why the fan as opposed to an oversized water pump?
Jerry Tenret why not both ha
Because a heat soaked cooling system requires air over the fins of a radiator to cool not a larger circulation of coolant.
KTM price isn't going down,seems parts they are putting on is...not like they are alone in doing this.
I imagine they will gladly sell you a 6 day ISDE model tho with all the bells and whistles for a crazy $$$ amount.
It's a shame that a 10K bike doesn't come with a fan.
Six days come with
Has anyone tried to run a fan off a rc car battery or drill battery. My yz250 has no battery but I think I a fan would be a good idea. I've never overheated it but my friends ktm were pissing out coolant so I had to be close. I e never seen a fan on a yz250. Does anybody run one? What fan did you use?
music in the end?
Man those trails looked fun!!
If you like slow technical stuff radiator fan is a priority!
Currently have a KTM 300 EXC considering beta 350 a 350 exc or a Yamaha wr450. In Australia they are between 14 and 15 grand
I'm planning on getting a Yamaha yz 250 FX can I purchase A Fan kit through you're sponsers?
My KX500 never overheated and I was riding on the surface of the Sun
It was also a piece of heavy shit too
I bought the same fan, and one time i came to my home and the fan was on with out no reason, so my lithium battery dead and couldnt get charge again
Is there a way you can richen the mixture of the tpi bike when you don't have to worry about emissions? Because i wonder if those bikes are making the most possible power with the ratio they use.
Good to know
Hey Kyle you can get the trail tech fan from parts giant for 154$ for a 2017/18 pretty much same fan you just have to shave down the temp censor 1mm and your good to go talked to trail tech personally!
And just installed fits perfect on my 19 xc 300
If im overheating somewhere on all kinds of bikes. I would look at my riding style. Have you tried riding this hill in 2nd and slipping the clutch instead of just trying to roost up it in 1st? Remember wwgjd
Come ride the trail without a fan and see what happens.
@@DirtBikeChannel if thats an invite i would love to! Im a pretty big fan lol. I have heard alot of people say that about hill climb overheating and just wanted your take on it. I probably wouldnt even make it to the hill :-)
Is that Trailbound on the cover photo
It gets worse if you're running a rekluse. I've had good results running Evans coolant, no boilover since.
Running no coolant would prevent boil overs too... Evans will let you run your engine hot enough to hurt it without you ever knowing it until it's too late. Just run standard coolant and get a fan if you need one.
also using the clutch too much in these sections icrease heat dramatically
Also I don't really mind which bike it is but I want to win one so bad!!
8:45 best coold down ever :D
I ride with side by sides and quads alot and the 450RX gets way too hot. Wrong bike for that kind of riding but I really love the bike. I just got the universal from trailtech. Hopefully it works the way I want it to.
The 300 may be too much power and waste heat for your slow riding style...not TPI...the new TPI 150 has plenty of low rpm torque for your speed and won't overheat since it has the same size radiators and less waste heat. Buying too much bike is a common mistake for new riders.
Hey. What grips and bar ends do you use on your KTMs?
SkillzT it’s all about odi lock ons no messing around
Kirk Richter yeah that’s what I use at the moment but I’ve had cams moving on throttle tube side and sticking throttle open! And the clutch side I’ve had turn in a race and I’m not doing hard Enduro stuff just regular hare & hounds. Looks like Kyle uses something different which is why I asked.
SkillzT dang I have been thru dozens of sets with zero issues on my 4 strokes and my 2 stroke! Good old fashion renthol with hair spray and wire is a good combo! What kind of bars do you use!?
Kirk Richter yeah I think that’s what I’ll go back to. Don’t mind the extra install time. Lock ins seem a great idea but I’ve not had the best experience.
How do i enter the giveaway
Did you know that you have an evil twin? His name is Brother Kyleson. I met him out on the trail and he roosted me and flipped me off.
Kyle, I think you need a helmet fan...6:16
6:19 that's alot of steam 😳
6:16 seems like you overheated😂
The 2020 XC-W has a thermostatically controlled wiring harness. That means you just need a 'dumb' fan. It's much cheaper, much simpler and a much cleaner install. The ECU will control it. Part #79635941044. See the thread over at thumpertalk.com/forums/topic/1306196-tpi-fan-confusion/ for details.
The XC model is not made for those slow tipe of trails, they have a long 1 and 2 gear and it needs to use to much clutch that make the bike overheat. So go for the XCW/EXC because that bike have 1 and 2 short gears and you guys dont have to use alot of clutch and they dont overheat is simple...but of course that the fan is always neede....
I Have a kdx 200. All the new ktm's overheat. It never does...
Ssssh, don't let the pumpkin tribe in on the KDX secret ;)
Come ride this trail. You will see your bike overheat :)
@@suzyamerica4679 Lol. Yes. They really are so tough! They can take much more of a beating. Ktm are deafinatly a better bike but you got to keep putting $$$ into them.
@@DirtBikeChannel Hey Kyle. Look my bike has overheated. But that was only when it was sandy and I got allot of wheel spin. In gnarly technical stuff it also gets hot but there is no real steam and the "boiling" sound. And it doesn't even have a fan! But when I ride with friends many times their KTM's overheat sooner than mine. Haven't noticed it on the Sherco's that much. But never the less. Here is South Africa we love your show and we all watch it often. Come visit us here in Cape Town.
@@20043670 Bingo. I am not quite $2K into a 99 KDX220R with FMF everything, opened airbox, RB Designs high compression head, 48T rear sprocket, Lectron 36HV carb, Shinko trail rubber. Got it ridiculously cheaply. What a trail bike! :)
It's strange I own an old school CR250 1997 and I've never overheated it and I do some pretty hefty trail riding in the Freetown State Forest wonder wow those bikes overheat so fast are they really running That Lean? I know a lean bike is a fast bike but still sounds sketchy to me. For me I just be more worried about roasting the piston. My buddies got one of those bikes it's a husky te300 it's got a carburetor though he's never had a problem with it he's got over 3000 miles on it and it's never done a top end, and it runs beautifully just like the day he pulled it out of the factory
Josh Furness These bikes only get hot when on extreme first gear climbs, slipping the clutch, hot days, etc. Most guys don’t ride these conditions, they are cruising faster on easier ground.
Again, so F'ing hot you don't even want to be outside!! I know all about that one, we have at least three weeks a year you cannot go ride at all because it's over 100 degrees F
I guarantee your 97 250 would overheat in these conditions
@@MotoFamMayhem yeah maybe it just hasn't happened yet I'm sure it will haven't had much riding time on it since I rebuilt the motor. Granted the stuff I write is completely different than the stuff Kyle rides. To be perfectly honest my point was that I'm really surprised it hasn't happened yet
@@garthlundquist8316 yeah that sounds like fun. I don't see it being a problem there. (In your situation either.)
Fan kills battery...goes to kick sta....oh shit
Running Lean and Mean, but yes, Fan, agreed.
Can someone in Europe win the bike later in the year
can you please do some more affordability vidieos for us cheap people
some kind of budget japanese build would be awesome
Im a mechanic and a budget "build" is an oil change, new clutch, brake pads, change of brake fluid, new cables, carb cleaning and fork rebuild and new tires.
@@CandEAdventures I just finished with a CR250R build.
@@DirtBikeChannel That was way far from a budget build. lol
@@DirtBikeChannel I'll have to catch up on your channel then.
Aftermarket radiators with a good thermostat solved all my overheating issues 🤷🏼♂️ as long as I’ve been riding I’ve never needed a fan, but then again none of my bikes had a stator powerful enough to run a fan...this must be a rich guys problem ...hey you know what’s cool? For the price of 1 Ktm you can buy 3 older Japanese bikes ...sure you still need to be a man and KICKSTART your motorcycle but my 02 Yamaha eats those overpriced kraut bikes alive ...everywhere on any terrain
First comment ,, I love your vids, keep up the great work Kyle 👍🏽
Of course they run hotter, leaner means hotter.
Just noticed that in one part it was your head that was steaming not the bike when stopped on a trail. Lol.