when the director actually knows what romance looks like
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- Опубликовано: 11 фев 2025
- Here’s today’s question. What is the genre that is least represented in what is considered to be the canon of film history? I'll give you an answer: romance.
But when you think about it, it is not so strange that romantic films are underrepresented. Because romance is the most difficult genre of cinema. Why? You didn't take part in the building of the atomic bomb, and you were never Spider-Man, but I bet you were in love with someone at least once.
It is more difficult to portray something that you are up to your neck in. And the audience is up to its neck in it.
Today I want to analyze what makes Past Lives, by Celine Song, a special movie about love and romance, so different from most of romance movies.
Films shown in order of appearance
La La Land
Titanic
Singing in the Rain
Vertigo
Notorious
Oppenheimer
Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse
(500) Days of Summer
Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
Sabotage (1936)
OldBoy (2003)
The Handmaiden (2016)
Lady Vengeance
Decision to Leave
Mind Game (2004)
Call me by your Name
The Notebook
Shots from the "Before Trilogy"
Marriage Story
Past Lives
In the mood for love
Chungking Express
Music
Julian Sartorius - 12 beats per hour
Otis McDonald - Not for nothing
Past Lives Soundtrack - If you leave something behind
Past Lives Soundtrack - Why are you going to New York?
Video reference
When I talk about the canon, I used footage taken from this video:
• Sight & Sound reveals ...
"being in love is not passion, it is the moments when you feel at peace being with them."
If only it were that simple being in love.In love does not even mean loving someone you can hate them with all your core and still in love with them and offcourse that of passion its hardly distinguishable from love
@@virekhyadav1423no??
Amen.
@@virekhyadav1423I like you man, you create a lot of theories go tell your mommy that
I find this similar to Hayao Miyasaki's concept of "ma" which translates to 'emptiness' or 'negative space'. He emphasizes how important it is to have space between the action shots. By using silence and space, he creates meaningful, breath-taking moments that stay with the viewer.
great comment! I'm happy you noticed it, it was strong in my mind while I wrote the script
@@fforframe It's something I really adore seeing in film
it isn't hayao miyazaki's concept. it is a general concept in japanese art and culture.
@@etchrikiit's a general concept not specific to japan. in Chinese it's called 留白 （white spaces）
I’m Japanese and I think you meant “mu” or 無.
I keep telling people "romance is not by itself a boring movie subject, it's just that we don't really know how to make them". There have been good romance movies, but sadly love is the most drowned-in-cliches subject EVER.
It reminds me of the fact that more than 50% of human communication is non-verbal. Me as a guy always wanted to entertain because "if the girl laughs she likes you right?". Shouldve invested more in silence and the moment itself. About what she might be feeling and what I am feeling. Ive just wasted a lot of time with talk.
A brilliant video essay that is shorter than 10 minutes? A rare sight indeed on youtube. Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I love this film a lot.
after 10 minutes you just repeat the same thing you already said, and if you need more than 5 minutes to say them in the first place, they are not clear in you mind. Thank you! Check out my other videos, they all are about 5 minutes long ;)
You got a subscriber here. I'll check them out when I can today during work.@@fforframe
@@fforframewhen a youtube channel actually knows what viewers thought and wanted
Earned my respect, sir 👍
Don't ever change ya hear.
youtube video under 10 minutes are not monetized, right? anyways great video
The kind of love that is dealt in reality, not a mere expectation from fictions.
It is not always the butterflies in the stomach or orgasms that drives our emotions like crazy and intense.
Not a chaos or confusion.
Lust, Insecurity, and Delusions.
Love that feels free & in clarity.
A comfortable presence of someone.
Like you said, the walk and no talk.
Awkward silences.
Words never spoken.
No kisses, no big fights.
No sex.
A love that is attached to reality.
It slows down the pace, and makes you feel the weight of time passing by, of life's seemingly empty, boring, & embarassing moments.
It is the empty spaces that balances out the full moments.
And there's more love in those void.
Damn
Wow
Poignant😮
nice
Crying while reading this
i like what celine song said about the ending, Nora cried because she said goodbye to korea for the little girl she left behind. You see for her it wasn't love that she felt for hae sung at the end but reality check of detachment from her homeland and roots. She bluntly shuts hae sung without hesitation when he confessed to her at restaurant. As for Arthur, he felt the needed to know Nora better which he did seeing her being a " crybaby " . Nora moved on but Hae sung couldn't. So for last goodbye, it was his proper goodbye to his childhood friend which was pending for all this time.
If you see, the theme of movie isn't even about love but making efforts and saying goodbyes to what has past.
*Celine song is the Director and writer of the movie. She said this in an interview
thanks for the good comment!
Well explained.
Wait when did Celine bluntly shut down Hae sung? I thought he was talking about a 'what if' possibility. He was stuck in the past so seeing her with Arthur was the reality check for him.
idk what u mean but hae sung had to say buy to to child Nora too and the love that could have been but never was@@wylser
I also think the movie is a lot more about culture and migration than it seems. Hae Sung is the homeland, the culture Nora came from but that doesn't resonate completely with who she is in the present.
Wow. Thank you for this analysis! It reminded me of seeing PAST LIVES for the second time and crying EVEN MORE because I was both savoring the characters' present moments while also knowing that their time togehter/the film was finite; a sort of viewer re-emerging of how the cinematography shows love
Thank you. This is what my videos are intended to be: make discover or re discover with new eyes movies and make them fresh
@@fforframe hey, if you are open to watching movies from other cultures while understanding the context, I highly recommend a Tamil movie called "96". Past lives and 96 have quite a similar tone. Please do check it out.
This exactly! I thought I was strange for one thing to find a show that represented love in the way I crush on people, it seems so rare! and you’ve put it into words, so thank you. The almost lingering touches words never spoken and open ending at the end because there are bigger fish to fry or 10 times more valuable in my eyes
Thank you!
Love how you said that the long shots allow Song to show the value of time. I agree. The protagonists had so little time together and you could feel the weight of each minute.
All the frames from the Before movies. *chef's kiss*
yess the whole touches never made and words never spoken and time slowing down becoming more meaningful really hits what made the love in this movie so special! it’s the time they spend together, the memories and knowledge shared, the way they know each other, what they choose to communicate, the distance they choose to keep, and the circumstances that either allow the love to be pursued or broken off. so much more romantic and heartfelt than explosive feelings and touches and drama.
I haven't seen Past Lives yet, and I started to appreciate In the Mood for Love only on the second watch. But I saw more Korean and Japanese movies and even though I'm from Europe (but lived in Japan), I think that these nations can convey more emotional depth in movies with less actions and words. Amazing.
it might have something to do with high context cultures ("reading the air" and what is implied/not said in words rather than expressing things directly)
I watched Past Lives and 'Oh my god, it was even better than I hoped for'. So clever and again, very impactful.
I feel like this is the distinct difference between East Asian and Western portrayals of love. Maybe it's a cultural difference, but I've never really understood western romances, and never felt the love in it. They feel like stories about people experiencing strong attraction for one another, and then eventually strong attraction for other people, and these feelings seem intense but fleeting.
Maybe that’s why everyone is so busy cheating on each other in the West…. OH WAIT, Japan has more cheaters per capita than the US 😂 FOH
that is definitely possible that this is the cause for the difference. I have found that a lot of the shows from Asia that I have watched have a more deep way of talking about love, and when I first started watching these shows, it kinda felt like something clicked that the realization that these kinds of more realistic (not always, but still) exist.
I don’t think cultural differences play that much into this - it’s more Hollywood playing to the lowest common denominator. Deep thoughtful romance is appreciated worldwide by thoughtful audiences, which is why many of these films make it big worldwide. I guess what I’m saying is that the non-vulgar romantic notions you’re talking about are popular in the west, but just don’t come out of the Hollywood fast-cash machinery very often, but we do see them often in the indy and foreign film scenes where massive profits are less the driving force in their production, which is also likely why there are many western indy and foreign film clips used as references of “good romance” throughout this piece.
loved this video, movies like these actually make love more grounded and realistic, and we get to feel the sense of longing the characters are feeling. i get similar feelings watching Ghibli movies and reading murakami, they just have a deeper impact on me
i think nora did love hae song. but it just didnt work out, and nora did the best with what she had. she moved forward, instead of drowning in her love for him. hae song didnt tho. him going to new york was the best thing he could do to move on. and when hae song finally left, it hit her, and she couldnt control herself. arthur is the best tho. even tho he knew that maybe deep down nora loved hae song, he still consoled her, because he knew that she was with him and that was all that mattered. i believe that the movie is about how life is not meant to be seen as something that should happen, but just living in it. nora did exactly that.
there was a scene where hae sung stands near his hotel window after arriving in new york. rain is falling on the window and the shadow of a raindrop sliding on the window, which is falling on his face, looks like a teardrop and he looks like hes crying, which he probably was, internally, as due to the weather he couldnt meet nona. i dont think ive ever seen something so intricate, so simple, and yet so emotional and sad in a movie before. the cinematography is out of this world. the way its directed, it brings something out from inside you, it invokes something. it invokes this sadness, this melancholic feeling i cant quite explain.
In the Mood for love is a Hong Kong film:)
i don’t think she really loved hae since she didn’t really know him, only the way he was as a child and vice versa. Celine Song also spoke out about how in the end she doesn’t cry because of hae but rather because she’s grieving the little girl she once was. it’s a movie about identity and as an immigrant having another side of you that not many can understand
I translated it as she loved the idea of that love but she’s a realist and was sad she never had a chance to explore that love and not even because of Arthur but because it just wasn’t meant to be in this life as she said
It's not about the length of the video essay, but what's left unsaid.
Oh man, I was readying myself to sit down and to immerse myself in an hour long video essay. Imagine my surprise when only 5 minutes have passed by and the film was already over. Great work, and you're absolutely correct. It's the mundane that makes the beautiful, splendid moments stand out and shine. They're limited for a reason.
I really liked you video, but the part that really resonated with me is the relationship between love and time. Yes, love can almost transforme time, making it slower or faster, but I don't think that's it. I believe that love is also the victim of time in a way. The very principle of the "love at first sight" and the "meet-cute" is based on the rights persons, in the right place, at the righ time. But what are the chances ? Maybe it is mostly my experience and if that is not your case than I'm reallly happy for you, honestly, but for me, a big part of romance is the missing words, missing timings, or "missing touch" as you said. We could be walking past the perfect person for us regularly in our lives, and never realise it. How many times did we gave up because we thought the other person wasn't interested, or because we didn't feel like it ? Romance and love, has so many variables, it is difficult to understand how so much romance movies are the same, when you could make a million and never run out of ideas. That's why I think I will enjoy watching Past Lives (thanks to this video), the silences, the missed chances, the smiles, and the slowing of time that still isn't enough... There is something beautiful about it, something real.
This was so beautiful, and actually explained to me what an elder photographer said when I asked him what to study to train my film eye: “study Japanese block printing”. “It is the emptiness that emphasizes fullness,” as you said. WOW. 🙏🏽
Great!
Romantic relationships is either people who feel like being alone is like drowning or trapped, stuck in the bond. And the golden area where two people share the same purpose and live to fulfill it together.
I wish more video essays were like this. Straight to the point with substance! Amazing video! ❤
I think that's why I kinda hate western romance film.
I'm Asian. And in my culture, love is not only something vulgar where others can voyeur into it. It's intimate moment between two people, where their feelings are not meant to be consumed by the masses.
It is rare in my culture where love is shown through kisses and sex. Usually it's through symbolism, words, songs, dances.
When I first watch western romance movies, I feel quite uncomfortable, because it feels like kisses and sex are the highlight of the movies. Not the romance, not the couple. It feels voyeuristic some times, because kisses in western movies can be quite vulgar, in a way.
I'm a western and I also particularly dislike how vulgar romance has become in the west, that's why I usually don't watch western romance, but I enjoy some romance anime (the ones that aren't vulgar)
I'm also western, but I dislike western romantic movies because they often depict sex as the price and goal of successfully romancing a person. Of course, sex is part of love for most (not all) people. But it is just one part and not the whole purpose and goal of love.
I agree. Love is all about very carefully choreographed spontaneous dance routine with complete strangers on the street.
Thank you for stating this so eloquently! I also live in a western region and feel the same way, not just about the film industry but about romance in general. Many couples who are publicly affectionate are less happy behind closed doors than the couples who prioritize time and intentionality.
@@hb1949 Love what you wrote here
‘Portrait of a Lady on Fire’ - a film by another Celine.
This discussion also reminded me in a way of ‘Decision To Leave’. Such palpable tension.
I still have to watch the other Celine but I agree with Decision to Leave, it is what happens to Past Lives if it goes thriller
"But there's more love in those voids, than in all the stuff of the classic romance film." - F for Frame
I immediately thought of in the mood for love when I watched past lives. So glad I'm not the only one.
Wow, this video brought back Every Frame a Painting vibes back to RUclips again.
That’s the idea! Thank you for noticing :)
@@fforframe Looking forward watching your other videos, keep up the good work :)
I also made an explicit reference to it in the last video about the animated films on Spider-Man
This use of time and absence was the same thing I felt watching Drive by Winding Refn. Things that went unsaid between Gosling and Mulligan gave such a heavier feeling of longing and the need for closeness than anything else would. So much so that when I think of that movie, I naturally think of it as a romance when it is clearly a crime drama.
Such a powerful video essay. You nailed it. Nothing really to add just wanted to share my appreciation for it ! Definitely subscribed.
So true! I feel like this video accurately captured why this film felt so real and raw for me.
I watched this movie last night and loved it, but I felt like you left out some crucial details when describing their relationship: mainly, you made it seem like Nora and Hae Song were so intimate and close that they didn't need to hold hands or talk all the time or be sexually passionate in order to know that they loved each other. In actuality, they have a really good reason not to be affectionate (namely, her husband). The tension in that situation is heartbreaking, but it definitely wasn't what I expected from watching this video. Glad you convinced me to watch it though!
This is actually what got me into romance (anime mostly tho). The formula that is presented in this video always felt too artificial and uninteresting, but when I saw a romance where it was just about the characters living their daily ordinary lives while creating an stronger bond together and caring more for each other through time with you being able to feel the meaning of the interactions of the characters, that's when I started to appreciate romance.
And while it's not all romance anime that are able to do it, the ones that do are the ones I appreciate.
My heart is broken and relieved at the same time after i watch Past Lives.
I saw the trailer for Past Lives before, but never got around to see it. Now you made me curious to watch it after this video lol!
Super suggested
It's pretty great. Really plays around with the concepts of hope and expectation in a new way.
I've been wanting to watch past lives for a while, the way you describe it is beautiful
Thanks for this essay. It put into words something that I've never been able to explain to myself quite properly, the reason why I usually dislike romantic movies. It's like someone else in the comments said: it's not that the subject is boring, it's just that filmmakers often don't know how to approach it in a meaningful and relatable way.
I generally disagree with people when they call this a romantic movie or characterize their connection as a simply romantic one. It may be, in the first half of the movie, before they meet; however what happens next is so much deeper and more interesting than simple, romantic love. I think Greta Lee portrayed this feeling exquisitely, and it's the people who want this to be as easy as that: romantic. In this regard I disagree, however I loved the video and your point stands, especially with the In the Mood for Love!
Correct, there I more to people than just romantic connection.
Now I understand why I love slow-paced movies. Maybe that's also why I loved "Portrait of a lady on fire", but I should re watch it to confirm if what you said actually make sense with that movie.
As someone who doesn't really like romantic movies at all, this comment section is kinda whacky. Some people say that all Westerns romantic movies are dirty/porn-like and all that, I can't help but ask maybe the problem is you? One of my fav romantic movie (the one I actually tolerate and like) is Before Sunrise. There's nothing vulgar about that movie. In fact, it has all properties of what makes a good romantic movie - dialogs, focus on emotions and connections between people. Exactly what Past Live is doing. Past Lives to me is a deeply sad movie about being stuck in the past, to dwell on something that long gone. The worst part, being the one who stuck on lost feeling, lost opportunity for love meanwhile the other person is moved on long time ago and happy with their new life, focusing on what's present and given.
When my ex girlfriend broke up with me, my thoughts were not filled with us having sex, or long, passionate eye contact. No slow motion view of her in the sunlight or the way her voice sounded perfect every time.
My thoughts were filled with quiet walks with her hand in mine, the warmth of her cheek on my chest, our stupid conversations about Vtubers, and sharing a quiet meal together.
Love, when genuine, is always in the little things.
I was shocked you included the brief eye contact moment from Mindgame. I've always thought that was an amazing visual representation of sexual connection, just in the eyes
Wow, very glad you recognized it!
Past Lives made me miserable. It wasn't a bad movie but I was more depressed by the end of it than I was at the start. And I loved it.
This was so beautiful and profound, thank you for making this!! 💯
The Bulgarian film Ága has very little dialogue, while not entirely a romantic film, I found the representation of the protagonists marriage life beautiful.
I love this video. Thank you for sharing this
this is a beautiful analysis. There is another recent film that made me feel somewhat the same, which would be Avinash Arun's 'Three Of Us'. Slow, steady, love, grief, acceptance, closure, it is very well made and in every way manages to depict this genre wonderfully. If Past Lives got a 5 star from me, Three of us would be at a 5 too.
I’ll give it a watch, Thank you :)
Beautiful, thank you.
I’m gonna check this movie out of the back of this lovely essay.
This was amazing, great analysis on what love is. Great examples of famous romance films, where's Her though!
it is missing ahaha
This video is simply lovely. Brilliant 👏
beautiful analysis absolutely spot on
The most annoying romance films are the ones that are basically pornos in disguise. Exploiting basic libido and parading it as ordinary art is serious clownery. Glad you covered these subtle and more thoughtful pieces. Nice video essay.
This is such a perfect explanation! Great video :))
Eu sou praticamente obcecada por esse tipo de abordagem em romance, a sutileza, o quase toque, a agonia de saber que eles poderiam se beijar, mas tem um abismo muito grande entre eles. É por isso que Orgulho e Preconceito é tão ipinotizante. Eu ando escrevendo sobre isso e no meio de tantos filmes e livros com cenas de sexo exageradas, isso é um respiro de alívio. Afinal, que anseio é esse de ver dois corpos se tocando? A arte mora nas sutilezas ❤
Thank you for the recommendation. I wouldn't have watched this movie for a bunch of reasons - one of which is that I am almost always turned off when I see the cliche of romance. Instead my wife and I thoroughly enjoyed "Past Lifes".
And we went through a proper walk through memory lane regarding our own story (which was also long distance for a few years).
i was fully expecting just a 5 minute clip of some movie, but this was cool too
This "real" representation of love makes me feel like the characters are kind of sad rather than being happy or at peace. I don't know what it really feels like to be in love with somebody, but I sure have felt those 'voids', those long silences walking side by side. They don't feel good.
I love this, thank you for making my day
Past lives haunt all of our what ifs
Amazing video. I am going to watch this japanese/korean movie.
1 feedback, the background music in first half of video was quite misplaced with the theme - romance. It was more like gossip music. Second half background music choices were really good.
You nailed it... Have a like and subscription!
I felt a similar thing watching You Hurt My Feelings. Its quiet nature felt like real marriages on screen
great analysis! thanx
AMAZING VIDEO i anticipated you would say mood for love
Great stuff my friend ❤
let's take this journey together
@@fforframe we got this my friend ❤️ I was contemplating doing a video on Past Lives but after seeing this video I definitely shall, although I will approach it in a completely new way ☺️
@@AuteurCinema looking forward to watching it
Past lives is definitely inspired by an Indian film of tamil language called '96. It is more emotional and explores more of the backstory but that's our Indian way of telling a story.
You should check that out as well.
PS- I love '96 little bit more than past lives.
Wow, thank you for the comment. I will definitely watch it
I don't think it's inspired by 96 ... I think just the plot of childhood sweethearts meeting each other is the same ... other than thattt I think past lives is more about Nora and her closure ... But 96 is more about movie leads past lovers meeting each other... !!! 😊😊
nah, ma bollywood bro
Oh wow, do you think it borders on plagiarism?
@@BrendaGarcia-ty2ml no
Hey awesome vid. Just a suggestion, would maybe turn down the background music just a tad, but otherwise great work. Subscribed
thank you for the suggestion, I will improve the sound mixing
I read the title as 'when a dictator actually knows what romance looks like' and I was really confused for a few seconds of my life.😂
I watched past lives on the airplane. It was solid
same and im so glad i decided to watch it
I recommend you adult kdrama, the title is "somebody" it's the silence that build the tension so well. but some character kinda dumb. still my favorite romance (thriller) kdrama
great observation. thank you for sharing
I smell Every Frame a Painting.
👀
Thank you for this
this very void in actions in romantic scenes of movies was always made out to be a musical or generally been romanticized little dramatically or as it is in Indian movies in general.
very nice observation
Nice editing! Subbed
As an aside, what I've noticed about foreign (non-American) journalists and vloggers is that they are far more international in their scope than Americans whose idea of 'international' is almost exclusively European. An American would be extremely unlikely to use an Asian film as the prime example, as the means to illustrate their point.
That’s what cinema is for: breaking the cultural barriers and makes us closer through art
You actually just described your own videos, which are cinema to me. Wonderfully and beautifully made, with many insights, always. @@fforframe
thank you, I really appreciate your words!
You're welcome! @@fforframe
Another way the film WALL-E was so great 😉
I get the same feeling when I saw any matoko shunkai film
God now I’m sad again. great video about a great film
This movie made me cry
0:49 what was that beat!
makato shinkai's every movie is a example of romance ..
especially your name..
Was there seriously a romance film between Armie Hammer and Timothée Chalamet? Never would’ve expected that.
Hey man you are clearly talented and video was great. But please choose background music better it almost fully ruined a great video. Keep it up !!!
American Romance is different from Asian Romance
Woah the idea of love has been so skewed by the media 💀
'Paterson' (2016) has the same approach. Much solidity on this topic 👍
True!
Paterson is so stressful because the language of film just tricks us that something bad will happen in the lives of these people, and even though it never happens I was anxious
Before Sunrise (1995)
this was great
i think it should be mentioned that celine song's partner is the potion seller guy
I love this video
This movie is a masterpiece ❤
great essay i am definitely gonna watch past lives today
Watch 96, a Tamil film..epitome of love
Beautiful
And I LOVE this video
I love everything about the vidéo but the sound in the back i hate it so much it will be nice if u put a calm music or just ur voice and the films sounds in the back
Love this video
I think im the only one who hasn't ever been in love
Keep up the good work 🫡
Excellent point about love and time.
Could I ask, the track that starts playing 4:16, is there a song name or is it just a stock track?
It’s “Why are you going to New York?” from the film’s soundtrack