In Conversation with David Frum: How should Canada understand Trump's 25 percent tariff threat?
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- Опубликовано: 15 янв 2025
- Leading author, journalist and thinker David Frum and The Hub's editor-at-large Sean Speer discuss President-elect Donald Trump's announcement that his incoming administration will impose a 25 percent tariff on all Canadian imports and how Canadian policymakers ought to understand the threat and its underlying motivations.
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David Frum grew up in Toronto, Ontario. His mother, Barbara was the top news anchor in the 1970's on CBC, the Canadian national broadcast network. He attended Harvard and Yale and became an American citizen. As a Canadian I have always appreciated his grasp of issues and the way he presented a conservative viewpoint in a clear and well presented way. Regarless of where you stand on the political spectrum we need voices such as his.
huggy
He prefers to live in Canada. I think the Trump period is unlikely to extend beyond his term. The two economies are far too integrated in terms of supply chains and technology. Ownership, too, is bilateral as far as public shares are concerned.
This brief note regarding David Frum's history goes a long way to explaining his total misunderstanding of people like JD Vance. Vance is not seeking to oppress women - Vance speaks very highly of his wife as a corporate litigator in a major US law firm, for example - a position in which she makes multiples of JD's income. Vance supports real manufacturing because the US economy needs value-added work, both to put income in households and to support the US as a whole. Finally, Frum skips over the entire religious element of the issue, which is very important to Vance and people like him. When Frum says that is where one needs to start from, he is starting from a very wrong set of assumptions.
Correction. David's mother was not a newscaster per se but a top broadcaster. Barbara was fearless incredible on "The Journal" (CBC-TV) and wonderful on CBC radio "As it Happens".She was American by birth upper NY state, so David had US citizenship by birth right I believe.
@@Cuhulin1 Vance has made it clear he sees women as wives and baby factories, he also recommended that women stay in an abusive relationship and concentrate on housework and baby making.
As for religion, Vance is a Catholic convert, always the most extreme version, who would love to bring back the Latin Mass and get a Bible in every classroom to be taught as "history".
"Real manufacturing" is a chimera. It left the U.S. because labor costs were lower abroad. Tell us how you make manufacturing work in the U.S. without persuading American workers to accept Chinese, Taiwanese or Korean wage levels and working conditions...
The Trump Administration contains extreme ideologues who will treat human beings as "work units" to be manipulated or discarded at will, what little social welfare exists will be wiped out to provide funds for more top earner tax breaks.
I’m a farmer in Ontario. About 80% of potash imported into USA is from Saskatchewan. The alternative sources are Russia and Belarus. Corn, wheat, soybeans, rice, and cotton will not grow without it. So…a powerful lever in negotiations.
huggy
The same goes for petrol: 60% of US imports come from Canada. At first I thought: “What a stupid idea, Trump doesn’t know what he is doing, he will create inflation in the US, etc..” Then I heard the theory about the effects of tarrifs: they devalue the currency of the tariffed country. This means that the Canadian dollars loses value and in fact the increase in inflation in the US will be negligible. So what this means? The tarrifs is an hostile and predatory act against all Canadians that, them, will see the value of their money go down to pay the taxe that, effectively, Trump, has raised on us.
I had the same thought when I heard about the tariffs. Also will there be tariffs on hydro electricity coming from Quebec to the northeast US?
Interesting thought.
1. Crops will grow. But just at a lower yield, yeah ?
So … spitballing here. If they produce less corn - might be a good thing. Don’t have to subsidize the begeezus out of it. Perhaps ?
2. Could we sell the K to Mexico, or more to EU, Asia. (But then it gets costly … shipping.)
3. Potash Corp would scream if Canada throttles sale of potash. End up with a Corp bailout if the Gov’t prevents them from selling their production.
Tough stuff. Why it’s such a mess when populists (orange politicians with far too much power) throw their excessive weight around.
How does one understand the actions of a madman? Thanatos = death wish. The gods make mad those they who wish to destroy.
Living in Australia, I really think Canada should join our free trade and free-movement arrangement we have with New Zealand. Our joined economies would be double the size overnight, as well as our internal markets and population. With the new reality we’re going to be living with, I don’t think it’s a good thing to be a small player anymore.
A Pacific Rim conglomerate with Oz/NZ in the South and Canada/Taiwan in the North and Japan, Korea and Vietnam in the middle could be very successful.
As a Canadian I would vote for that in a second. Man this would make so much sense!
@@robertlees883 Actually it has been under discussions for a number of years and now the focus on it will be more of a priority. Trump has taken the US into a dark place and has started to isolate itself…they get what they voted for!
We are 100% attached at the hip to America, since free trade of 1988.
Our industry, our energy, our food, 100% integrated.
@@powderfinger1963 An "integration" caused by proximity to resources and to markets for both Canada and the USA.
A trade agreement with nations as far away as New Zealand and Australia would require a new, and entirely different "blueprint". A trade agreement requires a business model with a chance to succeed for all nations within the agreement. It would have be "reason free from passion".
Friendships, relationships, and loyalty are ALL ABOUT "passion". They cannot be successful for all of the nations involved UNLESS that "passion" can be matched by "reason" and arithmetic that adds up to a profitable "bottom line" for all of the signatories. IMHO
As a United States citizen, I am so sorry, Canada and Mexico. One of the things I've always treasured about living here is that we had good neighbors. The trump years are going to be a nightmare, and I just hope we get through them intact.
I am so sorry, I am going to buy appliances made in Canada for my new home in New Orleans.
just joanish you should be saving some of that sympathy for yourself. You do realize that you will be paying more for goods now.
This doesn't just hurt Mexico and Canada it also hurts US consumers.
I love the Mexican president, Claudia Sheinbaum standing up to Trump. It's very good to show him he's not going to push other countries around.
As a canadian this is good once trudeau is gone things will be better for the relationship....remember 2000 terrorists on the global watch list came from canada in the last year only 200 from Mexico
You got it right! A nightmare is coming to the Western Hemisphere with Trumpism.
Great insights from David Frum! I am an European woman, macro-economist, socially more on the left than David, but this analyses makes totally of sense to me. Canada is now in the frontline of MAGA aggression, but we in Europe have no illusions that we will be spared in the upcoming trade war. America First = America Alone. It hurts me to say, but America has completely gone untrustworthy. The rest of the free world has to work together to protect our common interest and avoid being taken on one by one. We have to protect ourselves and let America be in their isolationist fever dream until they recover from this mental illness and delusional thinking.
'America First = America Alone. ' I love that. Perfectly explains things. And I agree with your post completely.
Yes,they are piss off due trans mountain pipelines is open now sold more oil overseas and prices is higher because before they said oilsands was too dirty yup! Not anymore.😊
Absolutelly right, unfortunatelly.
But make no mistake, it's going to be very difficult, America with her protection made it possible for "the western world" to concentrate on other things than defense, but it looks like that won't be anymore.
But I believe that at the end of Trump II administration things will get much better, the problem is that what will broken will be difficult to put it together again.
For a European you seem rather ignorant. Why on Earth was there an insistence to put Ukraine in NATO? Merkel and Sarkozy both knew that was crazy, but that was the neocon dream- and Frum is a neocon.
Trump is promoting an American version of Brexit.
Always a pleasure to hear David Frum's perspectives, even when I don't agree. His logic and insights are of high quality.
lol what? he has no insights. he's using NPR language to 💩 on trump
Yes, this was a very good interview.
lol.the neocon psychopath
We need, in this soundbite age, more people to think in paragraphs and act in sentences.
With Trump and his ilk, they think in sentences and then waffle in paragraphs until we accept out of exhaustion.
Brian Marshall 2718--
I agree with you except I don't consider it a "pleasure" to listen to Frum. A necessity, though...
I would like to say something more significant than, ‘Wow!’
But I’m at a loss for more words that express my admiration for this podcast.
Hahaha! I have just finished watching, and my response was wow! I concur with you absolutely!
What’s really disappointing are the Canadians who cheer on trump as some kind of punishment of Trudeau. Even if you don’t like Trudeau, have some pride in our country
Yeah they don’t understand you can dislike Trudeau and hate Trumps guts…What part of he is a criminal,rapist, failure..this is an idiot that bankrupted five times and one was a casino. The guy is worse less than pond scum and they put him back in ffs. So we can make a decision in this country to shut the door for four years and take the lumps. Companies and investment drive the economy so we just move to a more welcoming trade policy with others. It’s not a great outlook but we will move out from under the US thumb. They had their chances and time for change
Exactlly
This is not against Trudeau it is against all of us, against Canada.
Unfortunately that is what has become of the PC party ... A MAGA AMPLIFIER thinking that it will play into their hand. How dumb is Smith, Ford and Mr. P. P. to not see this coming from Trump and his administration. Really hurts their long-game credibility!!!
Morons
Now what's really disappointing is that you go along with neocon/neolib US foreign policy. That is of course what led to the needless Ukraine war.
Let's hope Trump can put a stop to that.
I think, as painful as it will be, we need to decouple from the US and aggressively pursue other markets. We also need to invest in a robust military and not rely on Americans for our national defence. I'm starting to fear that they're our biggest threat.
No duh, heard of manifest destiny? Only reason Canada hasn't been annexed yet is because it became a US client state.
We should have been doing that the first time Trump was in power!
Chretien tried with China ; we'd be better off with smaller less powerful partners more willing to cooperate
The EU could be a great opportunity, exploit the existing trade deal
BRICS
David Frum, a conservative voice I always pay attention to. He helps me not to silo in my liberal bubble.
Do you follow The Bulwark? Recommend. I am a CanAmerican with American republican dad and Liberal mom and it has given me comfort and balance. David Frum is on there often.
I was never a fan of David Frum, I have a different political view. US Conservative politics really starting pissing me off in the 1990s, Frum was part of this. Flash forward, Frum is one of the few sane conservatives around, and his opinion is valuable.
@@rb239rtr His mother was Barbara Frum, news anchor for The National, the CBC flagship newscast. She couldn't stand Brian Mulroney, Prime Minister in the 80's for the Tories, two-time majority mandates. Interesting that her son is a Conservative - one would have presumed a Liberal.
@@rb239rtr He's the same person he was before. He's a neo-con nightmare. Yes, he doesn't like Trump. Wow...
@@avenuePad name calling is counter productive. Listen. Think, pay attention to what is actually happening, then make your judgment. You aren’t compromising your values when you think about ideas coming from a voice that differs from yours. This isn’t a team sport!
The apple does not fall far from the Barbara Frum tree. As a Montrealer, I always listened to his mom, a great journalist. Thank you David. I feel secure.
Same here.
I always understood he was a strong conservative. Republican even.
The tariffs are a shakedown. Trump has never had any other interest in government but to line his pockets.
Then you're in trouble
@ Who’s in trouble?
@@glenrotchin5523 You're in trouble
@@lewisvogel466 why?
Because you're on the losing side. If you live in America, you're going to really hate Donald Trump even more when he goes after the people who tried to put him in jail. If you live in Canada or Europe, Americans probably won't be buying your stuff if you raise your prices because of our tariffs.@@glenrotchin5523
Tariffs will increase costs of finished goods and components used throughout US manufacturing. This will be an immediate and huge hike in inflation. To fight inflation the Fed will have to hike interest rates which will be wonderful for the billionaires but possibly take away the middle class. Inflation is so high that consumers are literally taking debt for basic life necessities. Collapse has indeed begun..
The U.S. economy relies on ongoing credit and debt generation for sustenance. The Federal Reserve is expected to increase the money supply, leading to further debt accumulation for the average American. So how exactly can we guard against the coming financial reset Like what are really the best strategies to make our portfolio recession proof against the incoming financial reset? I'm very worried about my $310k stock portfolio.
Safest approach i feel to tackle it is to diversify investments. By spreading investments across different asset classes, like bonds, real estate, and international stocks, they can reduce the impact of a market meltdown
Accurate asset allocation is crucial with an Experts guidance. I have $850k in equity, 75 cash earning 5.25 interest, $685k in roth ira, $120k in 401k, Gold and silver bars. age is 68. My advisr helped me realign my portfolio to my risk tolerance and it boomed shortly.
Can you share details of your adviser? I want to invest my increased cash flow in stocks and alternative assets to achieve financial goals.
Rebecca Lynne Buie is the licensed advisor I use and i'm just putting this out here because you asked. You can Just search the name. You’d find necessary details to work with to set up an appointment.
Chiming in from Canada, many of us are planning to boycott anything American.
I'll boycott anything from the U.S. accept blue states like California. Because California supports Canada and vice versa! They're also the most defiant against Trump!
The streaming services are the easiest. And then I find most canned prepared foods are product of America
So are going to boycout the operations systems on your phone and computer? Pipe dream, buddy.
We can start with You Tube, Google, Facebook, Reddit, Twitter / X, Apple cell phones, Instagram, American films, American music, American television shows
No more vacations in the U.S. for us. No more driving over the border to go shopping in Vermont or New York State, no more buying any America products. It is called taking a stand against a country so flawed that they elected a felon to the presidency. God help Americans for they know not what they’ve done. Only in Nov 2026 at the mid-term elections will it become apparent how disillusioned American citizens have become with Trump’s policies. However, by that time serious damage will have been done to the American, Canadian and Mexican economies, to human rights, to international trade,to international relations and to world peace. God help us all, for the repercussions will be vast.
As an American I think Canada should seek other markets and hit back with 25% tariffs.
Canada Australia New Zealand and the UK have CANZUK trade deal. And it's best they expand it.
Other markets has been a goal for decades. We are entirely integrated with America. Since free trade of 1988.
Like car parts crossing the border 6 and 8 times before going into the final product.
Also, as Frum said, we need to join together with Mexico to do any trading with the U.S. That will make our position stronger.
From a Brit living in the UK it nice to listen to common sense discussion on issues that are and will effect the world for the foreseeable future
I always like to hear David Frum. Thank you for this conversation
My politics and David Frum's could not be farther apart, but I do like listening to his opinions also.
@@lawrencejeffrey9245same
@@lawrencejeffrey9245 I hadn't thouhgt about changing the US economy on gender lines. Formerly, guys as high school drop outs,
could find works, better paying than women. New works doesn't reward poorly educated.
@@Gzoratto yes , fascinating perspective and makes a lot of sense given Project 2025 ; an agenda which suppresses international free trade fits with an agenda which reduces internal intranational free market competition for jobs favoring education and liberating women... very.scary
No concessions to trump. Please work with individual states where possible.
Who wrote this? And how are they connected to the Alberta premier?
Good idea.
Hold the line, Canada! Be strong. Time not to be so nice. You are dealing with a nasty bully.🇨🇦
I think there are lots of Americans who most definitely underestimate our collective Canadian pride and our resolve for our independence. There is no way that Canada (under anyone's leadership) will cave in to Trump. We Canadians have a quiet strength that Trump apparently does not understand at all. He will realize that he has just picked the wrong fight. Canada has a surprising way of saying "sorry" when it is pushed the wrong way.
Responding with concession to a malignant narcissist is seen as recapitulation and weakness. Expect further predation to occur.
Not just to malignant narcissists who are pathological liars (and I mean that literally - he lies even when there's no need, indeed even when it's going to be harmful to his own interests, his mind just goes straight to dishonesty, lies, preposterous anti-fact conspiracy theories and so on) ---- but the entire contemporary conservative/R movement is almost without exception dishonest and NEVER either acts nor converses in good faith... anything that helps "their team" is a good thing, the ends always justify the means, and no amount of corruption, lies, or other fuckery is seen as immoral or beyond the pale if it furthers their "team".
So as you say, you can't do things as if you're working with an honest individual/regime, because there's never anything to be gained by trying to compromise, "meet them half way", or in any other way trying to build a coalition - they always see honesty, cooperation, compromise, etc, as weakness.
Wexit. The pieces can apply to join BRICS
@@geocam2 The west is sinking fast. You didn't notice?
@geocam2 the zyomuricanwest is sinking fast. They got you fooled though
@geocam2 How hard it is to say anything critical about the west on here
As an American, I am SO depressed that Trump, the destroyer is back in office, aided and abetted by the Supreme Court and a court in Florida, not having served a day in prison...which is where he should be for the rest of his life. David, thank you for pointing out the male dominance over female issue, which I think was a huge part of this election issue.
I think you are right , but I’m guessing you still support American capitalism? Greed, materialism and self interest is the American way, and until you’ve been through the fascism of trump you won’t change and the planet and world democracy probably won’t survive it.
@jeankroeber2481. You nailed it exactly! tRUMP is threatened by strong women. He lashes out while European call girl Melanoma hides with her Asperger's son.
Trump is the best thing to happen to North America in last 70 years…
@@bob1519There's a bed and room for you in a sanitarium in your home town. There's a tin foil hat on the bedside table - it'll fit your head. You apparently have a death wish. Good luck. Get well soon.
@ - you know it’s all lies - you like those lies. Just like German fascism a hundred years ago.
I hope Canada and Mexico have the balls to hold the line.
Oh…we WILL!!!
Never under estimate under dogs. They can turn and bite the tender bits hardest where it hurts most. Canada can ALWAYS 'cut the cord' from it's generating stations.
By all counts, Canada supplies most of it's surplus electricity to the US from the North Eastern Seaboard to Washington, & west to Chicago, And..."Winter is Coming".!
Canada does. Our PM though? I have my doubts :( The guy is weak as hell.
@@angellayaright9009 Think so? What happened in 2018 regarding tarrifs - look it up. Also, Trudeau met with trump and agreed to more border security - Canada was doing that anyway. What would Poilievre do?
@@speedrunfantasychess- Not sure. The split has allready started, Alberta with the oil, Saskatchewan with the potach and so on.
We will see.
As an American, who did not vote for Trump, I would like to apologize to Canada and the world.
If you did not vote for Trump you are noyt really an American ?just a communist lackey.
I would like to apologize to Canada, and all Democratic countries also, for the election here, of someone who is not fit to be president.
@@jeremyway-ue1xqYou're screwed. Your president isn't fit for office. That makes several in a row. Too bad.
HENPECKED VOTED FOR THE NAME GAME LADY
@@jeremyway-ue1xq When are you leaving?
What's happening since the happy times when the 3 Amigos were in charge ?
Now we have only one senorita, one amigo and one villain left.
Never a truer word, "with friends like Trumpian America, Canada & Mexico have no need for more enemies"!
It's really a sad state of affairs when most of the world used to believe in the United States as good strong country, to see for itself that there are so many dumbed down people in this country who would elect a president who doesn't care about the people, only about himself, the rich and corporations. He's definitely a good conman and this is just another shakedown by Trump! They may eventually come to realize what Trump really is, but it will be too late to save America. It's a country that has plotted it course and it's heading down in about 20 years.
David, I could not agree with you more. A self-sustaining Canada, with a Bully Pulpit and to look East for closer alliances with Europe, etc. I still have nightmares picturing Mulroney and Reagan singing "When Irish Eyes Are Shining" while Reagan managed to get first dibs on practically all our natural resources. This will come back to haunt us I fear. My fear is we have no strong political figure to lead us. The thought of our present Justin Trudeau facing Trump et al. at the White House makes me cringe. However, I see bankruptcy and dangerous overtones of extreme Conservatism mimicking Trump.
Great insight and I agree
@@brucecameron4694
" I still have nightmares picturing Mulroney and Reagan singing "When Irish Eyes Are Shining" while Reagan managed to get first dibs on practically all our natural resources."
I've railed against free trade since 1988. How it was done in particular. Same nightmares.
Poilievre is not going to be better.
First dibs on natural ressources +25% ......if it comes to that!
Never understood why 80% of countries dislike or just hate USA. Now I do.
I cannot believe all this effort to try to "understand" or "triangulate" Trump.
There is no need for that. He is not worthy, he is unfit.
Two quotes: "I would no sooner have a serious policy discussion with Trump, than I would ask a dog to do my tax return."
And... "Everything Trump touches dies."
I agree he is not worthy. And no use trying to have a policy discussion with him when he is so...unstable. But it is important to discuss possible outcomes and try to plan for them. Just ignoring him and the threat he poses is not an option.
Very true
This commercial war will be devastating, but is unavoidable since it is rooted in idiology, not pragmatism. No way around. So, if your opponent is bigger than you are, you need to outsmart him and be strategic. Trade between Canada and US is highy assymetrical. Not in terms of dollars or values, but in terms of strategic importance, Canada is a small market compared to US, so of limited importance for them. And almost everything US sells, can be bought somewhre else without disrupting the market. You dislike Ford trucks, you buy a Toyota, and having Canadian buying Toyota will not disrupt Toyota's or Ford's markets. However, inversely, US is a huge market, meaining that when it buy something somewher,e, this can be disruptive to global trade, and rerouting trade logistic on such scale is never an easy task. Three commodity that Canada shall target and restrict exports ar bituminous oil from tar sands, high purity aluiminium and potash. US oil producton shifted toward ultra-sweet oil from fracking, which cannot be refined directly by US refinery without being blended with heavy bituminous oils, Refurbishing US rafineries is a trillion dollars decade long endeavour. And the almost only other source of bituminous oil, aside of Canadian Tar Sand, is Venezuella Orimulsion. Make your choice, or park your car along the highways. . Second, there is a small aluminium smelter in my hometown laterrière), which is among the smallest of the 9 we have in Canada, and this very smelter produces more aluminium than the entire US. Canadian aluminium, thanks to its high purety, is essential for aeronautics. If you wish to switch to Russian or Chinease aluminium, you need to built aluminium refineries to upgrade its quality. Again, billions of dollars and years to built. So, again, make your choice, or park your Boeings on the tarmack. And third, Potash. All the potash used in the US is imported from Canada. There is only two other producing countries: Russia and Belarus. The rest of the world produces less than what US consumes. And there is not stockpile in US. Potash is essential for manufacturing fertilizer. No substitute. And fertilizer are essential for industrial farming. No substitute. If Canada block potash export, trumpist farmers will not fertilize their field next spring, and wil experience crop failure next summer. Again, make your choice. Deal with your allies, or flirt with your ennemies, or import your BigMacs!
Sorry, this is called tit-for-tats!
wuggy
Russia is getting what it wants with Trump.
If trump is trying to hurt canada,
l hope they can hurt america tenfold more. Trumps just a bully and a grub who won't be around to see all the damage his narrow mind will cause.
Trump would love an excuse to get potash from his buddy Putin.
Best canadian answer to Trump: abandon 100% tariffs on Chinese EV. Let canadians drive better and cheaper cars. Make more deals with China. Decrease american influence in Canada. Let’s side with China for good. They are the new rulers. USA is now run by felons, criminals, and a narciscic oligarch. USA is the most frightened country in the world, look at its military, look at their 466 millions of firearms owned by particulars, look at how they fear Putin and Xi. USA is the past, China is the present and the future! F k Trump and Musk! Never buy a Tesla, never fly a spacex rocket, cancel x. PS sell your properties in USA, invest in Canada, China and Mexico. Canada, apply for BRICCS!
I don’t always agree with David, even in the before times *but* he is thoughtful and I am glad he’s around. He’s absolutely right about what MAGA wants re: male labor value imo.
Thank you for having just the right guest on for this outrageous issue.
Canada must make military alignments and agreements with Europe. Particularly the European countries with atomic weapons. I have thought this for years.
For decades, the Canadian government has tried to broaden our trade relationships with other countries so that we can avoid dependency on the U.S. but to no avail. We have more multilateral trading agreements than any other country in the world but still can't alleviate the problem. Countries like Russi--and others-- have many of the same resources we do but sell them a lot cheaper. It is difficult for us to complete on the world stage.
@@lesliesanger4255Canada should look at what Europe and other western countries would need and then become the best at it. Just like Bombardier for an example.
I am writing from Norway.
Invest in Ukrainian industries and gain good relationship after Canada has supported Ukraine to Victory.
Canada can't exist in opposition to America. Like it or not Canada has only one foreign policy, aligning with the USA, all else is fluff.
As another commenter has pointed out, Canada has many trade deals with many other nations and nation-trading blocks. However, despite this, we have taken little advantage of them. Part of the problem is that in some cases those countries produce many of the same things we do, but at a cheaper price (largely due to lower labour costs). The other issue is that Canadian companies and governments (at all levels) are too lazy, too complacent, and too indifferent to be bothered courting other markets. The American market is big, it is culturally similar, and because of the NAFTA (and its update) much less bureaucratically difficult to deal with. It is also geographically right next door, so transportation costs and in-person communications and the like are just easier.
Trump's tariff plan may well be the force that shifts the lethargy that has plagued Canadian businesses, but it will come at a cost and many years of suffering. Without the US market, Canadians well have to accept a shrunken GDP, lower standard of living, higher debt, and probably many years of increased unemployment, inflation, and higher interest rates.
Eventually the ship will right itself, but we won't be as rich as we could have been and our neighbour to the south will likely be regarded more as an enemy than an ally.
There is one elephant in the room but Canadians won't mention it or do not want to know it!
Thank you both. We Canadians need to hear what David Frum is thinking, especially now. I am disappointed that his Atlantic articles do not appear to be distributed freely on the internet anymore. The best information needs to be freely accessible, especially now. David Frum’s integrity is always center stage. Thank you.
Free? So just how is he supposed to make a living?
I strongly advise getting "The Atlantic" at a paid annual subscription rate, it's less than $2/week. Cheaper than the NYTIMES. The writing is better as the format is more analysis and exposition rather than just "news" and op-ed pieces. Frum is one of many of their excellent contributors : Tom Nichols, David Graham, McKay Coppins, Hanna Rosin, Elaine Godfrey...Podcasts...Washington Week. And, of course, the latest article by David Frum.
*Phew*... That is intense, intelligent and kinda devastating.
Just saying as a Canadian...
Here's how you handle Trump, threats of tariffs, you name it. Tell him to pound sand. Call his bluff.
Canadians are fed up with Trump!
@@alainrouleau Canadians fed up with Trump? You kidding? Americans have been vomiting him out since h his name was first printed in a newspaper. NewYorkers had his number for years. We knew what he was.
@@judiburnett6527yet your system and people put him back in power
And tell him there’s stuff stuck to his shoes!
@@judiburnett6527PLEASE keep him on YOUR side of the border! 🇨🇦
Oh you precious socialist😂😂
Canada should impose an export tax of essential imports to the US.
Oil and gas would be good ones to start. Say 25% export to the US
Hydro-Québec supplies New York with 10.4 terawatt-hours (TWh) of electricity annually through the Champlain Hudson Power Express. %20 of what NY uses
I can think of an essential oil that they need. Copiously.
Also a plant, whose leaves & buds are in high demand.
wuggy
We actually did that with softwood lumber during the Reagan years. We imposed the tariff on our own products so the feds could keep money back and reinvest or assist the affected industries.
You have to realize that unreliable and far right Alberta would scream blue murder if Canada interrupted the flow of gas and oil to America even to the extent of betraying our Confederation
Watching from the UK. Lots of talk about whether Trump will do all that he says he would.My rule of thumb would be prepare for the worst and you probably won’t be disappointed or surprised.On the plus side there are midterms which will probably see a shift in the disappointed US electorate and hence a change in the balance of power in Congress. Also - and this May grasping at straws Trump will be 80 soon and not in good health, he may very well not see out his full term.
as a american i hope your right. were not all crazy lunatics and the other half are not happy to be dragged down by the stupid assholes who treated the election like a game
Watching from Australia and I agree with you about preparing for the worst. I call it positive pessimism. A lot of damage can be done in the two years between now and the midterms and if Trump gets his way, there may not be any midterms or need for a congress.
And, if Trump does succumb to his unhealthy lifestyle, the world will then have to deal with a Vance presidency, which could be far worse.
I see nothing good coming out of this decision that Americans have foisted upon themselves and the world. 2025 will be a very consequential year for all of us.
And munching on more burgers and fries, let's hope for a better world after!
@@MsLilBit8344 I agree very much. Vance has the potential to be more radical and thus more abrasive to the world community.
he'll be demented in a while. Wont last even year. Trouble is what is left is not much better. We're all so depessed here.
Just remember TRUMP disbanded the pandemic program
Do you mean the program to treat the pandemic, or something else?
@@roberthanks1636 He disbanded the Directorate of Global Health Security and Biodefense; he disbanded the Global Health Response Unit, all in 2018. So Trump inexplicably reduced America's ability to respond to epidemics and pandemics before the COVID-19 pandemic. This should put his nomination of RFK, Jr. in a new light.
@@OsmiumSaint❤ I am a Canadian. "Measle" disease and the "MONKEY POX" disease are 2 very contagious diseases and rise in Canada and in the USA right now. I know Canada is supposed to watch those diseases carefully , but I doubt it. 🤔 . I don't understand WHY they don't vaccinate people who want the vaccine??? I know in the USA these 2 diseases are higher than in Canada. Google the images of those diseases, it is scary...
@@OsmiumSaint Thanks for the clarification. Those are all important points.
It's 4 years. Stretch everything out and delay, delay, delay.
Yep the trump playbook
Except, the extremists that surround him have been preparing to start running on the first day and get as much destroyed before the hundreds of Court cases can even reach fruition.
Trump: an isolationist in a global economy. America was isolationist all through the 1930s and into the 1940s. Then Pearl Harbor happened.
Boy. Well said.
@@janetmacleod7948
Out of Topic.🙄
Does it only plan to sell it's good to it's people and nobody else on the outside? If so, I don't they can survive on that alone. You need access to world markets and they won't have it without trading partners.
@rosaalba1660 O believe you mean off, but irregardless, it is exactly on point. Trump wants to be an isolationist in America first policy. It is proven isolationism does not work! Example Pearl Harbor brining America into WW2.
@@rosaalba1660It's "off topic" and no, it's actually not.
Canada should impose a 100% export tax on uranium and electricity sent to the US. The tax would be used to remedy domestic dislocations caused by Trump's 25% tariff.
Come home to Canada and help us David.
Please don’t blame ALL AMERICANS. Many of us fought hard against him. Trump is a true danger to the entire world! It’s not just the tariffs, but so much worse 😩. Please have a little empathy for those Americans, like myself, who actually want out of here! Canada…can we move there?
Sorry Trump does not want Canada to have more immigrants, so get in line like everyone else. First what do you have to offer? What qualifications do you have? Then face a mountain of paperwork and if you are older than 40, don't speak both official languages at a certain level (we have a different spelling too) or don't have serious dollars to invest to qualify for an investor's visa, good luck ? And please leave your beloved guns at the door too. Canada should provide DT with stats on the number of illegal guns, coming into Canada from the US, especially around Lake Ontario and shall we send a bill for the number of migrants who left the USA in fear of Trump 45 and came to Canada, essentially Quebec. Signed an immigrant to Canada since 1992.
Not all Canadian will paint you with the same brush. I feel emensly sorry for you.🤗 however you should be aware of the fact that we are going to be facing a similar crisis. We have a leader of the conservative party that has some of the same ideas. 😞
Love to have the sane among you become part of the brain drain moving back north, but the lack of affordable housing is an issue here too.
90 million non voters are highly culpable.
We may face an initial setback, but in the long run, Canada will emerge stronger from this departure. Our natural resources will only be secured by the nation that proves most successful in the coming global trade conflict with the U.S. Meanwhile, Americans risk losing the one ally who has consistently had their back during times of need. This is not just a temporary shift, it’s a pivotal moment with lasting consequences.
Likewise Australia. We need to become the Sweden of Asia.
I agree with you thoroughly. I'm hoping that Europe will foresee, in real-time, how to plan economically and militarily for the future without America.
Agreed. This could be a rare opportunity - we can attract investment and businesses that are nervous about the US adminstration direction - attract them with very favourable terms. Time for Canada to stop being a doormat to the US and to begin to regain our Mojo. Back in the 60's 70's etc, Canadians were very proud and we had the confidence to do great things. We made great things. We can regain that.
Yeah may be time for a renegotiation of use of the Canadian airspace in time of crisis and access to various bases up north should also be taxed at 25 %, preference given to Airbus for aviation whether civil or military that Canada does not have, and of course 25% tax on the price of electricity sold to New England by Hydro Quebec would definitely impact some utility bills in that corner but who cares they are blue states so enemy, right !,
Unless our rural uneducated MAGAts wanna-bes elect someone like Poilievre in 2025 😢 Believe me, I saw the right wing, US extremist funded trucker convoys in Ottawa first hand ugh (ironically facilitated by universal income during COVID, people could afford to spend weeks in Ottawa), those people were so brainwashed, using kids to circumvent bans on carrying fuel jugs around, they’d strap gas cans to lil kids (awful), and chained an apartment building front door closed and tried to set it on fire. I don’t think people understand how messed up that all was. And their camps were a public health hazard. Saddest part is some of our top military took part (they rightfully got the boot for being a security risk). The hate and anti-trans rhetoric is already spilling north of our border, I fear I’ll lose health care. As a severely disabled veteran, the system is already broken and am not getting the healthcare I need. Ie. left to get life threatening infections before I get surgery I need, when it was totally preventable but because system is f’ed, you wait until it becomes life threatening with sepsis to have emergency surgery and put on rare antibiotics costing thousands (very much gives me the vibes of letting pregnant women to bleed out in parking lot until they get an abortion in the US, minus the politics, it’s just a broken system). Just there isn’t outrage here, people naively assume they can just call 911 and everything will be taken care of. LOL, no. Ugh. Just wait, the cancer coming from the US is going to fester here too.im seriously applying for MAID, just being unable to get wheelchair accessible housing qualifies you these days, and with how much Veterans Affairs is denying me healthcare, well, only one way out. Makes me sick how we send out people to countries who take care of their veterans and got more rehab than I ever got, when they leave their own people no better than dead in appalling living conditions and zero help. If I was on provincial disability? I’d have 24/7 on call nursing care as I’m functionally quadriplegic. But nah, stuck with Veterans Affairs denying everything wherever they can using every loophole and dealing with this alone. No wonder vets are homeless and off themselves! Screw this! Wish Canada gave a shit about veterans who sacrificed everything for the country. I’m ashamed I did, just got used and tossed like garbage. But yeah peeps, vote NOT for the crazy conservatives that will take away healthcare, LGBTQ rights, and further screw veterans…
"Tariffs" are cleverly disguised TAXES on the consumer who ends up paying for them in higher prices.
Happy to pay $2 more for maple syrup.
Thank you very much for this conversation.
This was excellent and informative and thoughtful. More like this, please.
I remember following David's mother on television.
She was well respected also.
David's mother, Barbara Frum was WAY more Liberal in her views. I remember what an impact she made on Canadian thinking by her interviews and journalism.
Barbara Frum became famous as the outstanding host of As It Happens - on CBC radio.
Will never forget her.
BABRA FRUM WAS A ICON OFF JOURNALISM LOVE WATCHING AND LISTENING TO HER ON CBC .
The six times bankrupt orange pumpkin will now bankrupt America!!! Way to go America!!! 😂😂
It's OK to leave if you're in America and don't like what Trump is doing. But if you're in Canada, you don't have to sell us your stuff.
When America has a cold, the rest of the world catches the flu. Well now they have stage 4 cancer. If you see that as something funny, just wait a few years.
@@lewisvogel466 you need our oil and steel and uranium and so on where are you going to get your oil from Russia
Imagine getting 473$ MILLION in various forms from daddy, never working a day in your life, getting elected to the most powerful office in world history, and yet still spending every day complaining about how unfair life is to yourself.
@tilaman3 No, we have our own oil in Alaska and on Federal land throughout our country. Trump will make the federal land available to the oil companies
Excellent conversation. Thanks.
What kind of free trade agreement allows the U.S. to impose tariffs?
Good question. The CUSMA Trade agreement was ratified by Congress, so according to my understanding of international treaties, Trump does not have the authority to unilaterally slap giant tariffs on foreign goods. On the other hand, the US Supreme Court's immunity ruling basically means that Trump can break any law he wants to with impunity, so is he just going to ignore Congress? So what is the legal basis for Trump's threats to impose tariffs?
@@roberthanks1636It is simpler than that. All US trade deals include a provision that the President can ignore them in case of a national emergency like a war or invasion. So Trump just says, "national emergency!" As magic words, after which he can do whatever he wants. All perfectly legal.
@@PxThucydidestrump really doesn’t care if it’s legal or not. He would love to have an excuse to get rid of congress under a pretence of an “emergency”.
Betting that will happen before the midterms so he can suspend the Constitution and all pertinent ammendments
@@roberthanks1636 There is a mechanism to resolve disputes, but it takes years and can't be enforced.
How is he not in prison?
It only shows how you are rewarded for manufacturing consent for war & genocide..
Canada must find new markets!
David from is an inspiring intellect, extraordinarily articulate and a restorative hope in our country
Well, this discussion is great if you care about the actual facts of economic policy and what the US should do. The problem is, none of this matters. The discussion should be about how to deal with a sociopathic, petulant president and his knee-jerk policies based on his insecurities, hatred, and ignorance.
David...... You do your Mothers' Legacy Proud. And by Proxy, Canada. Keep up the good work, and speaking the TRUTH to Power.!
David Frum, thank you for your talks! I m so gratefull a man can see so clearly on what is going on,thank you!
I turn to this channel when Mr Frum is on board ❤.
Canada and Mexico need to impose 50% tariffs on U.S. goods until the U.S. stops sending their guns.
Do you want to pay 50% more
Canada should impose export taxes and or product embargo which place the price increases on the US not Canada
@@duanedrouillard2495 Start with Potash, - it's fertilizer. That is something the American must have to grow food for export and consumption, cannot do without and cannot get elsewhere easily as there is global shortage. We supply over 60% of the US requirement. There is leverage there. Their economy would tank if they ran out of food to sell on global markets. Maybe China will buy our Soybeans etc.
@RocketRon7779 : Don't worry about trying to come up with more ways to tank the American economy; Trump, Musk, Project 2025 architects, all Trump's friends, family, and supporters have the express goal of grabbing all the wealth and power they can, while simultaneously destroying the country as we know it now, and reducing all it's expendable population (those who are not wealthy) to desperate people living in chaos, violence, starvation, and disease, so they will be more controllable, and willing to do anything if promised survival.
I believe there will be a thriving business in assisted $ui side. There are not enough words of apology to express how sorry I am that Canada and Mexico are becoming victims of the U.S.'s self-destruction project.
Thank you David. I shared this with my 39 year old son for him to hear your viewpoint, historical references and just great journalism. Thank you
If unionised wages are “artificially high”, then non-unionised companies have artificially high profits.
Another great interview! 🙏✌️
Canada, don't capitulate to Trump. You're too good for that! Don't be so nice. Be strong!!!!!
Great David Frum !
Cut the gas and oil Canada.
4 m barrels of bitumen a day the best heavy crude their refineries need. XL pipeline coming soon. No more rebates for Elon
Increase the production of oil
Pipelines both east and west
Produce our our vegetables and fruit through greenhouses
No water sold to the Americans
We don't sell water to the US. How are you going to stop rivers from flowing, duh.
@@MsLilBit8344Wow! What we don’t know about what our government is doing behind the scenes.
Canada doesn't even have free trade with its own provinces
@@johnarnold893actually we do.
We produce more oil than any other country. But we cannot refine it, so we export it.
Young women, please make sure you are financially self-sufficient so that you are not stuck with a Trump supporter, because that would be the worst kind of hell.
I'm eleven minutes into this video and have heard Frum refer to unionized labour in a negative context on more than one occasion. His disdain for the working class is made apparent when he blames unions for men making wages "artificially high wages by artificial scarcities." Frum doesn't mention the fact that collective bargaining agreements are collective -- i.e. ownership class agreed to a contract. Also, look into collective agreements between, say, auto workers and management. The amount of money that goes into labour is low relative to everything else. Frum also fails to mention how well paid workers benefit an economy by having buying power. Well paid auto workers can put their kids through college and buy a boat to go fishing with. What's wrong with that?
Frum is an elitist and has utter disdain for people who work with their hands. Frum would like a society with no middle working class who he blames for putting Trump in office. This type of thinking is dangerous and has led to genocides in the past (Cambodia Pol Pot).
Well, this is really about Trump, because Trump's plan is to wipe unions out and I have no doubt he will be successful. The middle class are in for some very big hits!
Whoa, not sure you and I watched the same podcast. I didn’t get that context at all, although your point is valid in a different context. Yes, David Frum is an Uber conservative and anti-union generally goes part and parcel with the ideology. But he discussed unionized jobs in context to traditional gender employment. With his mention of Vance, I saw it more in the context of Project 2025, i.e., bringing back an outdated gender inequity when it comes to wage earners. Tariffs would impose scarcity, and a new emphasis on manufacturing, thereby implementing Project 2025 resolutions of restoring men, as major breadwinners, as heads of their households.
Nothing is "wrong" with that but, unless I'm sadly mistaken, the US has been eviscerating unions for the last 20-30 years (at least). When the majority of factory jobs went overseas the unions's bargaining sway went with them. American consumers got used to paying cheap money real quick for cheaply-made overseas goods. Thank you Walmart and all those big box stores. Those jobs aren't coming back. And if people voted for Trump because they believed that, they too will be badly mistaken.
@@donnaoneil4985 MAGA aspouse to the Great Replacement Theoy, couple that with their views on abortion, and Frums perspective makes a lot of sense.
That was an insightful discussion with David Frum. Hopefully Tudeau sees it
I hope Poilivre sees it ... he is trump look alike
@@chairmanmike5858
Hopefully those who might support PP will see it and think again. We can not follow the USA back in time to a misogynistic society.
Well said and totally accurate. This message should be targeted towards Canadian conservatives as this party is tilting towards maga. You can compare the differences between traditional conservatives like a Reagan and Mulroney. Trump and PP have some similarities in their style. Absolute loyalty within the ranks. Do not have any kind of a relationship with other political partys and view them as the enemy. The free press ie evil and fake news. Never compliment your opponent has ever putting forward a good idea or legislation. Be negative and angry most of time. See yourself has someone who can fix everything without putting forward policy.
best wishes, always, our David
As usual, so interesting, insightful and well articulated
Thanks for sharing Frum's thoughts. Whether I agree or not, he always makes me see things I may not have considered and I like that he has a lot of historical knowledge to back his ideas.
Wow, finally someone who understands what's really going on with Trump's latest tariff threats.
Until now I haven't heard one Canadian politician, pundit, or amateur pundit who understands Trump's fentanyl & illegal immigration tariff reasons are just a ruse.
If Canadian positions don't understand what's going on, we won't get a solution, if that's even possible.
Best insight I've heard in a while.
What an insightful conversation. I had never thought about the sexualization of labour in the US. It’s easy to understand when you think of it. Thank you Mr. Frum. Great channel.
Interesting aspect of a much broader problem, namely the disruption of the way of life since 1968. Judging by the plunging birthrate, it's a fundamental problem of survival for all nations.
How right you are David
Has everyone forgotten the American doctrine of Manifest Destiny?
Thanks David!
First time I've heard Frum's theory about the sexual politics underlying the drive for more unionized manufacturing jobs. Very interesting. It certainly sounds plausible.
But it seems so outdated? And I'm 50 years old. Most MAGA boosters are people with inherited wealth, and often rent-seekers (people who own property, or who make money off of owning money), they may lack for higher education, but would not choose physical labour or the trades ever, either.
It won't work but Trump's Koolaid Klan wants to go back to the 50's. They will have a Civil war before that would ever happen Even with some sort of American Stasi, you can't lock up half the population
That premise is actually laid out in Project 2025.
@@JakeNorth24so what's the point? Locking the working class into blue collar jobs? Control wages and opportunity for people in order to keep them from participating in the economy as capitalists?
Blue collar labour only succeeds in the context of an organization: a person whose only skill involves operating a rivet gun, or a rock drill, usually only gets paid to operate those tools for someone else, who owns them. If the factory closes, or the mine closes, or if it relocates to a jurisdiction where other people do that job cheaper, those workers lose.
Is that the point? I don't get it.
You haven't been listening to JD Vance because he's been yelling just this. MAGA thinks women should be barefoot and pregnant and subservient to men.
Excellent. Why can't MSM have this level of anaysis and explanation??
The working class knows none of this!
What do you know that I don't?
I mean the intricates of politics and frump's shenanigans!
What's more I don't give a damn! We'll end up paying through the nose no matter!
Thank you for a good discussion.
Now only if Canadian politicians could listen to this insightfullness
would the people in the Trucker Convoy hear it? They didn't just "go away."
@@brianjennings7644
They are a present danger to democracy and that can’t be overstated.
David has some very incredible insights. Don't agree with everything he says but his voice is refreshing and the conservative movement here in Canada which is tilting towards maga should listen to him.
Very interesting interview
David Frum is great
Always informative
David Frum on point!
Here is David Frum. He came right out with it and said MAGA is focused on bring back the superior status of The Man in our society. Patriarchal Society. How could we go backward on this perspective? Also Kamala Harris made the announcement in the last couple days that she is returning to politics. She is not done.
Wow! Fascinating!
Thank you David and Sean. ❤
Loved it! Thanks
American listener here. Apologies for your having to share a continent with us today - hope this fever breaks soon.
huggy
Back in the 1980s David Frum's mom Barbara was the Canadian equivelant of American apple pie. Ms Frum was poutine, she was a beaver she was maple syrup. In my hippy days I was quite horrified after her premature death to find out she leaned rightwing and was religious, just like her son she raised. Well here we are now and wow have times ever changed. I appreciate David's thoughtful responses here and elsewhere and I can't belive he and I are on the same page now on the things that are important. I've grown older, leaning further to the right, David doesn't think I'm a menace to society anymore because I'm gay. I'm worried about what lies ahead, but I'm glad there is people like David around talking about how it is. Your mom would be so proud of you and I'm proud of the fact your are still a Canadian. Keep up the good work.
It easy to lean right when one is mega rich like Barbara.
David Frum is one of the most insightful and original political analysts I have ever listened to. I think he's nailed the motivation of MAGA vis vis masculine power. (I'm a man, btw.)
In 1988, before NAFTA was signed by Mulroney, there was an general election in Canada on the topic. Although he won and proceeded to sign the treaty with chummy Reagan, in fact the plurality had voted against him and his deal. Liberal leader John Turner warned it would effectively turn Canada into the 51st state. Almost 20 years later, faced with hostile Trump, seems. he was perfectly right.
The answer is democratic allies need to create a new global democratic union for trade; food, energy, goods etc. America won't join, but with a combined economy > America it will need to make due with that reality
How true...so insightful David...Canada can look no further than Doug Ford, Ontario...for someone who loves Trump and I believe would appease Trump rather than stand up for Canada. We are in dangerous waters....stay with us for your very insightful take on our politics.
Canada and Mexico should realign trade toward China and the BRICS nations.
@williamkevinjames Trade and defence are separate. Do you really think the U.S. and other NATO countries will give the Northwest Passage to Russia as part of a trade war with the U.S.?
We in México might benefit from BRICS, but as you are in bed with the gringos since WW2 (and culturally it would seem since Confederation ), BRICS is not an option for Canada.
And Europe is part of it too, the trade negation between Europe and China is coming to fruition, I'm sure the European are worried and need to bolster links with China.
Boycott American made products. Stop buying Ford, GM. Buy cars made in Canada from good partners. Canada also needs to target key American products for reciprocal tarrifs...to piss off a few higher profile congressman and or senators. We should never forget what he is capable of...so we need to broaden our trade with EU...even China. Global trade has been around for 2000 years....isolation equals death.
@@XE1GXG Canada adjusted after WWII, it can do so again. There was never the same sentiment toward the U.S. as toward the UK. Canada's Chinese population is now 5% and much higher in Toronto and Vancouver, while there's many Canadian companies such as Manulife and professional bodies, such as in accounting, operate in China.
Canada's largest province, Ontario, began as a colony for refugees from the American Revolution. So while the culture might be the same, political attitudes have always differed to some degree. And of course French Canada and aboriginal Canadians, who form a much larger percentage of the Canadian population than in the U.S., are not as culturally close to Americans as the rest of the country.
Maple syrup, while very expensive now, will be out of reach for me with tarrifs.😢
Mr Frum has an interesting thesis about JD Vance wanting to create manufacturing jobs that would provide well paying jobs so that single earner families can thrive in America. It would seem that none of these politicians understand that modern manufacturing is done with very few people. Tesla is using as much automation/robotics as possible just like new Chinese plants.
Absolutely well thought through!
John Turner is turning over in his grave about free trade. He was right and all it has done is lead Canada more into the United States orbit. Hopefully Trump will do what Turner could not do and that is to see the end of free trade.