In an ideal world we would all have a dedicated listening room, but we don't, we have an area that is generally smaller than we would like, and we have stuff, a partner, pets, crap that we bought on holiday that we thought would look good at home. Unless you're super rich, everything is a compromise, just learn to live with it.
Thanks for answering my question Paul. I was asking because I am setting up my listening/home office room and I have the choice or either front wall/short cables or side wall/longer cables. Will go for side !
I’ve always read that it’s important for the main L&R speakers to be able to “see” each other, meaning that there should be an unobstructed line between the fronts of the speakers, with any gear or furniture being behind that line. In practice, this should not usually be that difficult to achieve. Most of your audio gear will be backed up near to the front wall (i.e., the wall behind the front speakers), while the speakers should generally not be directly against the front wall. Then, if your speakers are pulled out a little from the wall behind them, the gear and/or TV between them will be behind that line between the fronts of the speakers. As well, if the speakers are even just 6”/15 cm. from the wall, their bass response will be smoother, because the peak-causing boundary gain from the front wall will be reduced. The imaging also tends to improve if the speakers are a bit further from the wall. So, moving the speakers away from the wall, even a little bit, improves their sound in two ways: smoother and less peaky bass response, and better soundstage imaging. Win-win! As for putting a blanket over the TV, I’ve often read that it’s helpful, but I haven’t tried it, so I can’t truthfully comment on it.
Maybe not ruin it but it doesn't optimize it either...studio spaces attempt to have most flat reflective wall surfaces covered with acoustic treatment if at all possible for a reason. If you don't have the option due to space or lifestyle, it's just a trade-off most of us can live with...but that doesn't mean the improvement isn't possible.
@@ddrenth studio spaces try to eliminate parallel reflective surfaces, but the ones of the last decade+ also usually specifically put a computer screen between the monitors they're mixing the album on. the ones that don't have that usually don't because they have some combination of a large glass window to watch the live room, or a large flat metallic console providing it's own reflections. and then at the mastering stage there's once again almost always flat faced racks of gear and/or a computer screen right in the sweet spot between the speakers.
Thanks for your comments Paul they're very valid but unfortunately sometimes you can't do anything about it I personally don't have a separate room thank you very much for your show.
I have tried it, and I've found that as long as you keep your gear below ear level or around shoulder height (when you're seated) it wont have any negative affect on imaging, even if you place them between speakers, just keep them below ear level and you should be fine.
It's quite easy to determine via an ETC measurement. This is the industry standard for determining whether there's early energy reflected to the listener, how early, and at what level and what frequency spectrum. There's so much speculation in the audio enthusiast community and the same tools studio acousticians use are available so inexpensively ... it's quite easy. For a $100 mic and free software that's state of the art (REW), one can measure. Or for $300 OmniMic product is even easier ... seriously less than 5 minutes and you're measuring! Knowing what's ACTUALLY going on and addressing it, is a force multiplier in audio unlike anything else.
I can vouch for this. I used to have my TV in between my speakers, but then mounted it over a fireplace on an adjacent wall. I am now getting much better imagining from my system, even when swapping two sets of different speakers. My A/V rack is still there, but its low to floor and space between the speakers is freed up. I also have the speakers about 5 feet from the wall. Music has really come alive in this setup.
For Home Theater, it's fine and it doesn't matter. The sound of a movie is not hampered at all. However, for two channel stereo, i made an absorber out of ordinary foam board by installing two plastic hooks that attaches to my 55 inch tv and glued two inch acoustic foam to the front side of the board. It drapes over the tv and looks and sounds great. When im done, i remove the foam board and store it until next time i do two channel stereo listening.
That may be true for music only rooms, but for a media room where you watch movies with surround sound the TV has to be between the main speakers. Few of us can afford a dedicated music room.
I have a TV on the wall and a curtain that I can pull in front of it when not in use. Seems fine. Perfect - maybe not, but I like to look at all the gear and the symmetry.
well, I prefer to watch live discs to studio - blu Ray of Opera's Anna Netrebko , La Traviata for instance. and the speakers are about 2 ft on each side. works for me. practical rules.
Paul, you are so honest! hahaha.. In Hong Kong, our apartment is so small that we consider ourselves lucky to have a wall that is dedicated to listening.
Setting everything up in an ideal manner is virtually impossible for those of modest financial means. Fitting a decent system into a small space AT ALL is hard enough to do. In my longest-lasting residence so far (over 15 years), I had the audio equipment off to the side and most of the video equipment (all but the LD player) between, but well behind, the speakers. The arangement came about not because I wanted it that way but because that was the only way I could get it to fit. Sound-wise it was pretty good, I thought, though I'm sure there were many errors and deficiencies of which I was blissfuly unaware.
Because so many people complain about this and are probably misinterpreting Paul here, I am going to try to clarify here. I don't believe Paul is talking about reflections and interferences when placing a TV in the center behind speakers.The things you are looking at while listening to music could distract you when trying to imagine the soundstage right between the speakers.For home theatre this is the opposite of course. You want to attach the sound to the screen there.
@Fat Rat Hi FR. His analogy has to do with necessity. If you have a TV and stereo gear, like most of us, you have just one room to enjoy them and positioning is limited. So, if you want to drive your car, there's little choice but to drive on the roadway supplied.
@Fat Rat My "great" room is quite small. About 20x18 with the TV in the corner and the speakers to each side. The divan is along the long wall opposite a slider patio window. I'll send you a picture soon. It's not sonically perfect by any means ;-)
My TV Is around 1.5 meters behind speakers, and I noticed big improvement when i lowered it below ear level. But the biggest difference is when TV is turned off. I think that distraction from music that TV can make, even if it is only some static picture is quite big, just having something to look at takes away that feeling of empty space behind speakers.
I'm someone who just doesn't care about getting the best possible sound quality or the best sound imaging. Having my TV between my speakers works well enough for me. I play my music just to enjoy it, not to worry about how real it sounds, whats wrong with that?
Thanks for clearing that up, mostly. So my followup question is, how much would putting a TV on the wall at the opposite end of the room, say one that is 16'W x 30'L? thanks so much.
Perfect world' even the speakers would be behind an acoustically transparent barrier. I'd have nothing other than a tablet controlling Roon and the rest would either be a pitch black room or a view out into the garden. No indoor plants. No artwork. Like I said.- perfect !
I can't say that I've found much issue with having my main speakers set up with my TV. Regarding reflections in general I have luckily not had much issues when measuring the frequency curve. The center image is so good that I've abandoned any thoughts of getting a center speaker for the set up (not that I would have used that with music, but for other media) and, when playing recordings with detailed soundstages I can clearly pick out detailed changes in the sound placement. I can't say that it's an issue that there's equipment where the musicians might be because I can see just as well that they aren't there if the space is empty, so I don't think the visual aspect matters. The positive for me is that I can have full access to my home media server (with lossless music and UHD Bluray rips) on my TV, so when listening to music I have a nice GUI that displays big album covers and so on, plus that I get to use my best speakers for viewing video material. Concert videos are especially amazing. I won't say that it's the absolutely optimal solution, but I think it's the best compromise.
@@HareDeLune Yes, I could perhaps have expressed myself more clearly on that but since I was talking about my situation I automatically figured it would be seen as the compromise for just that - my situation. Setting up an audio system is always about making yourself (and any other persons living with you that care about it) happy with how it sounds and works in your home. :)
@@Evil_Peter You got me to thinking. Hi-Fi and the pursuit of good sound really *is* such a personel thing. My opinion is that it would be better in general for audiophiles to talk about it in a more personal way. For example, saying "Doing/adding 'x' in my system, I noticed a considerable improvement."; instead of "Doing/adding 'x' in your system will make a considerable improvement." The problem then falls to the salesmen and reviewers, who simply cannot use that perspective effectively for what they are trying to achieve. I have to wonder if that's what screwed things up to begin with? XD At any rate, the DIY community is becoming more appealing to me these days. : )
@@HareDeLune It's a tricky matter since there is of course a scientific part to the hobby, and it's not sound to ignore it entirely. It is of course nearly impossible for most people to get a perfect listening room and be able to buy any equipment they desire, so there will always be compromises, and there you have to go by your own taste. There is also no system that sounds exactly like having musicians in your room, and most recordings don't even try to replicate that feeling either, so the goal should just be to get a system that sounds good, which will by definition be a personal thing. I guess one should listen to others to learn, but in the end make one's own decisions. As long as you enjoy your system it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.
Thank you sir for your clean language pronounce, so other ppl can understand your videos. Also thank you for your effort sharing your expierence. This is absolutely brilliant and i appreciate that. I just purchased hifi system, but for the upgrade i'll definately consider products of your company. Peace. Vladimir, Russia
I agree with this. I still live with my parents in my room. I have a pair of mission 753 speakers. They sound beautiful. But i still have to put all my stuff in one room. I have my tv in the middle of my speakers and it seems that this puts the soundstage above my tv instead of in the middle. My speakers stand at least one foot in front of my tv and this still affects the soundstage. Its just that i dont have a better solution. But i still notice the difference. Iisten mostly with my eyes closed so i can visualize the image more effectively but still there is some difference in the soundstage.
This episode is mind-blowing. I look at hi-fi reviewers like steve Gutenberg, Zero Fidelity, Thomas and Stereo, Z reviews etc, and all of them have gear between the speakers!
We all have to live in the real world and make compromises. I mean as long as you pull the speakers out from the wall and they can "see" each other, it shouldn't be a problem.
i have a 75 inch flat screen betweet (slightly behind) my tannoys. my friends cant believe that the voices come from the speakers. imaging is sharp as heck.
Today's flat TV's affect sound even more due to the larger reflective surface they present to sound waves. That's the whole point of room treatment for walls and corners also...
@@amitraam1270 Yes, you are correct, a flat panel TV isn't much different than a flat back wall...but a treated back wall is 100% better than an exposed flat panel TV. Any of these audiophile youtubers including John Darko, Steve Guttenberg, Andrew Robinson, New Record Day, Zero Fidelity will all highly prioritize room treatment for your listening area...and that will always include the back wall, corners, side walls, and floor (some go as far as ceiling installations). I think every single one of them has a dedicated video on this topic...including Darko's release just today. I get some people simply don't have the option for a separate listening setup without a TV, but for those who do have the space, and the ability to install even basic treatment, it is an advantage.
I don't know Paul. Like many others have said in the comments, I, too have my tv (a big box) and stereo equipment in between both speakers and it sounds fine to me. The sound stage seems to go behind the back wall (music) and vocals are projected forward (depending on the mix) with sounds happening on the left and right. Watching tv, the sound seems to come right from the tv and my speakers are not spaced evenly. One speaker is 4 ft from tv the other is 5 ft from the tv. And I've heard lots of super expensive hifi systems when they had hifi shows in LA back in the early 90's.
No winning with this an empty room would echo like made with all reflective walls and no damping.ive just bought a 3d wall panel that would be act like a defuser and doesn't look as bad as foam or acoustic panel all over your living room walls.
A good way to test see if your Volume is louder behind the tv if so move the speakers in front. Thank u for the video I was wondering what I was doing wrong
I have had the equipment in the middle, behind, next to, on top, underneath and even in the next room from the speakers. Never once was the imaging "soundstage" affected. If you set your speakers up properly you will not have a problem, unless your wife stands in front of the speaker. It's so nice being single. ))))
I cover my 55” screen (centered between my speakers on the wall) with a table cloth when listening. Kills the reflections nicely. Center image is very good.
Keep in mind that, while killing reflections, it also acts as an absorbtive room treatment in an area where you ideally want to disperse, rather than absorb. : )
@@graxjpg Have you ever heard the sheet of foil resonate at certain frequencies? I have it on good authority that random pieces of rough-cut wood, placed in totally random positions covering the area behind the speakers and the point of first reflection on the side walls is one of the best solutions. : )
I get it for music but home theater makes no sense without your left, right and center on both sides of screen and below it.So many people can afford only one system thus home theater doubles as music system.
I stream my Tidal from an app on my Sony TV right to my Denon, works great, only need one remote to control everything, sounds just as good as when I was using my laptop
I agree. I have a small room, so I have 2 x two shelves audio racks and the amplifier in between the 2 audio racks to solve the cable issue. All placed in the front wall about 2.5 feet behind & in between the speakers. Its not perfect because it gets a bit of sound wave on the equipment but a compromise.
I understand what you're saying Paul, but I have my system in such a small room that I have no choice. I will say that I do still notice the effects of any upgrades that I make, and my enjoyment of music is undiminished. P.S. I love your content and I watch every day!
Decades ago I bought a Solid Steel 5 shelf rack, long before I understood the negatives. Worse, it has been well out in the room interfering with speaker imaging. Recently, I FINALLY moved it back near the front wall. The speakers are now some 3ft in front of the rack, minimizing imaging issues. Moving it to the side is very expensive as HQ interconnects or speaker cables are uber expensive. Plan B is to replace the vertical rack with a 2 shelf horizontal rack, which aren't cheap either
I think the true meaning of "Audiophile" is "one who has enough room to not crowd the imaging location"😂 Here in the states it's a bit easier as homes are built with an insensible amount of extra space. I would recommend to start with 86'ing the spouse!
What is an acceptable height limit for anything between the speakers ? If one does not stack audio equipment, you may get a call from the Royal Society For Putting Things On Top of Other Things.
normally the speakers have diferent types and they are made to be used in a perfect position so it can give you the best sound putting them in front of you with a tv or hi-fi system inbetween you would have 20% of it´s quality and stereo efect , i´m going to writte about normal speakers 2 or 3 ways and bass reflex, normally it also depends on the size of the room ,the better way is using the corners of the room to put each speaker and left a 30 cm espace between the wall and the box of the speaker no matter how big is the room, it starts to give you a more rich sound in high and low frequencies ,you´ll notice that by having the bass knob on defeat or 0 position while if in front of you with the hi-fi or tv equipment, you need to increase at least four in the scale to have the same bass level but also you´ll feel the bass not as a direct sound but cleaner coming to you and bass either than listening to it you also feel it, if powerfull enough it makes vibration on the windows of your furniture or even in your body, the treble is the same you want the sound to come natural as if the band was playing in the room so the more apart they are, the sensation of quality in the sound increases if next to eachother it doesn´t give you the sound they were built for as the sound controls don´t have a strong response as it should, this is the basic instalation ,there ´s other types of speakers and normally they come with instructions for it´s instalation, but if you have a 4 speaker system you would put the other two behind you in the same position of the front ones if possible, normally with early 70´s 4 channel matrix is the same type of instalation, but i would writte for hours to explain how diferent speakers are to be installed on your listening room, regards
Yep, as much as it looks nice and symmetrical, that's the only benefit, but it's up to the owner to decide if that benefit outweighs the cons, I guess. Maybe modern flat TVs, mounted on walls isn't so bad though (apart from high frequency reflection of the screen), but not on the floor between the speakers.
The flush mounted monitor is usually not a big deal. Unused tv speakers passively re-emitting sound may very well deteriorate your main speakers' sound
I've got a 48" OLED TV between my speakers and I drape a dark grey towel over the TV when I'm listening to music: it takes away the visual distraction of looking at reflections on a blank screen and I think it helps with the sound quality as well. Plus, it helps keep dust off the TV so there's that as well. My TV is obviously exposed when I'm watching films but when it comes to listening to music, draping a towel over the TV is a simple, real-world solution when it comes to having a TV between a pair of speakers :)
How about instead like i do . You put the cover and/or description of the album. Or a nice photo slide of the concert details, or the performance. Finally a nice relaxing video in 4K on youtube (of course without sound!)
There is absolutely no problem placing a TV and other equipment between the speakers. Firstly, many people play their TV sound through their stereo system because the sound quality is much better than the tiny TV speakers. The TV needs to be dead centre for the correct effect. Secondly, the sound does not “cross over in the centre”. The centre sound image is an illusion caused by the direct sound from both speakers, it does not actually come from a point between the speakers.
4:55 "If in the middle where the speakers combine and shoot back and give us that beautiful center image . . ." Yes, I got a chuckle from that one, too.
Marianne Oelund It is concerning that a so called expert clearly does not understand the subject. Objects placed between and slightly behind speakers will have little effect on sound quality. It is surfaces in front of speakers, such as walls, windows etc. that can affect stereo imaging. Objects between speakers may have a visually distracting effect, but there will be no audible issues. I often listen in a darkend room as performance sounds more realistic but I know turning off lights has a purely psychological effect.
@@geoff37s38 I find it more concerning that a response includes personal judgments. Now back to the topic of discussion - It depends on how the interposed objects do, or do not, align with reflected signal paths, and then whether they add any new reflective paths between speaker and listener. The exercise of imagining the room has reflective walls, was meant to aid in visualizing object locations which can impact the sound. Speakers diffract a portion of their sound in all directions - and some speakers even have rear ports or radiators.
@@geoff37s38 No Geoff, I am sorry but you did not understand Paul's intention here. He was not talking about demonstrating Home Theater Systems. When you are listening to music while looking at a TV that has nothing to do with the music that is being played it could be very distracting and take away from the listening experience. Of course you would want a TV being perfectly centered for home theater display.
@@geoff37s38 That would be physiological. When the brain doesn't have to process the dominate sense of sight it can focus more brain cells on sound. Stay in the dark long enough and brains will physically change to improve hearing and other senses.
Well.. I want the best sound and I do put my equipment between the speakers and the TV hangs on the wall ;P It's more convinient for me and makes the room look better and it works really, really great :P Not ideal but still better than 99% of people I know :P
My Flat Screen HD TV is between my Infinity QLS-1’s But it is slightly back from the front axis of the speakers !! It DOES NOT INTERFERE WITH THE IMAGING AT ALL !!!!! MATTER OF FACT, WHEN WATCHING A MOVIE USING MY STEREO SYSTEM, WHAT SHOULD SOUND LIKE IT IS COMING FROM THE TV DOES, AND WHAT IS OFF AXIS ALSO IS IN THE FIELD !!! MY SPEAKERS HAVE BLOWN MY MIND FOR OVER 40 YEARS !!!
I am lucky to have two complete systems in the same room, a 5.2.2 and a 2ch only, the home cinema components are on a rack to the side and the two channel is on a low level rack in front of the TV, is there a difference in sound quality, of course there is but I like to think it's down to the different amplifiers used and not where in the room my equipment racks are located.
Ahhh sorry Mark, however what you just stated above makes no sense. Did you miss type something, or do you not understand the question / root issue? OK, well sorry... but yeah, makes no sense.
I remember the early days of stereo TV. There was much confusion on the studio's part of where to place the microphones. Early attempts resulted in many flanger sounds as the two mics with small spaces between made comb filters of the sound. Sound engineering for stereo is much different than for mono when you consider the typical speaker placement for a television receiver. Due to the problems of dual microphone pickup patterns in the same sound field, most studios have returned to Mono for the news and related broadcasting. Music and ambiance is in stereo. Televisions should reproduce in kind. The stereo signal should be processed in a matrix just the same as FM radio with Main, which is L+R, and played on the center speaker. Any difference information should be on side speakers or on side facing speakers to produce the L-R difference signal. This would work exactly as the Mid/Side capsule for the Zoom H6 recorder but for playback. TV sound is best processed to produce the center main channel with a center speaker. This is the heart of the soundbar concept, but that bar is undersized for full fidelity. TV sound is not high fidelity, so not an audiophile subject for the most part. If you build a home theatre for sound, consult the THX specifications and find the DVD's with the THX test signals on them. forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/987776 Surround Sound Test CD (DTS) - Lasertrak CD2500 - For surround and home theater sound setup
I live in a condo apartment situation but good tip because I'm moving soon and I will try to put my gear to the side of the room or near a separate room set from my main speakers. It's the space issue.is it ok to have a screen between the speakers from your recent video you talked about transparent.
All of my equipment is to the side of my right speaker but my power amplifier is on the floor between them. It doesn't seem to affect the soundstage. I can even keep my eyes open and picture of the full soundfield.
This is why I´ll be getting a projector instead of a new TV, well part of it.. Having a projector screen and maybe some acoustic panels behind it (along with the centre speaker) is probably better than a hard tv screen.
Like many others, ive never noticed an issue as long as the equipment is behind the speakers and not interfering with the main dispersal sound. Maybe my systems are simply not revealing enough to notice (im a 15k system kinda guy). I spent a long time in my youth both installing and working in studios and they follow none of this logic, which is baffling if its easy to hear...
Didnt really ans the question again. These days, flat screen TV is set on the plane of the wall behind the speakers. What effect do their built in speakers have on the main speaker's output? I cover my living room with a throw for serious listening, just in case. No tv in the music room!
Watching you on You Tube with TV between speakers. The tv has become a pre amp. With HDMI inputs TV has computer, blueray player, and TV over internet going to it. Now it gets confusing. If that is all a power amp connected to the headphone out jack makes life simple and it sounds better than the tv speakers. However if I want to add a CD, Tape, MP3, and source from another system, I use an integrated amp or receiver. I know it's a compromise. It's a relationship.
i want to upgrade the midrange drivers in my cerwin vega D9s, but i don't know how that works at all. can i put any driver of the same size in there and hook it up? thanks
@Fat Rat You've crossed over...that's for sure. I suggest a coffee to loosen up those brain cells. Then come back and talk about crossdressers. Wait....you'd best not tell us if your daily escapades. 😷
Does it matter that much for near field listening? I have my whole desktop and monitor between my bookshelf speakers. I wish I could put the desktop in another place but I can't.
I noticed zero difference in the imaging when i removed my 60inch Panny plasma from the rack. Speaker front baffles are well in front of the screen of course. I think only if the TV is well in front of the baffles and the speakers are toed in more causing obstruction would i notice it. Even then i suspect most of what id notice would be from the toeing in anyway. No removal of my TV is ever going to fool me into thinking a band is suddenly playing live in my room. Hifi and live music in any room or venue is easy to distinguish apart regardless of hifi cost. I recall an expensive Audio note system at north west audio show last yr playing a violinist Cd. Said violinist then came and played live. It was easy to tell them apart.
A TV behind the speakers is no more an audible obstruction that the wall. I hear you re the illusion of stereo, for sure - close your eyes if you need to. But for enjoying a good blu ray concert, film etc- the TV is in the right place!! - sits back and continues Hans Zimmer live in Prague -
This is disappointing to me. I take great respect in what Paul says so I said "Oh No... " out loud when I watched this lol. Not only would I not be able to do this practically but also financially because I have a set budget for my cables - and longer ones would be more expensive. I don't really want to have the equipment off to the side because the entire plan was to have the equipment be the showcase so to speak (kind of like how you guys do at trade shows) and have it right in the middle. But my plan was to have the speakers in Front of the furniture - and also towed in a little towards the listener. Wouldn't this be a good compromise? Note there won't be TV there, just the equipment on furniture. The speakers I am getting are floorstanders which were made taller from the previous version and are intended to be placed on the ground. They are already tall but should I also get stands so the height of the speaker can bypass the height of the furniture? I just want to enjoy and I've already had too much overthinking this setup. I had to retype this entire thing because my damn phone erased three paragraphs - grrr lol. Thanks
I wouldn't sweat it. Most of us have to compromise in setting up our systems. You can get fantastic sound without your system being set up 100% perfectly. My system has a tv stand and a flat screen tv in the middle of the speakers. The sound is incredible and I still get the center imaging that Paul describes.
I have a low bench that is 2 feets (60 cm) high to the top, where I only have my Elac CC501 Center, and I can't imagine how a low bench like the one I have can affect the sound.
An interesting opinion, but I have to say that with wall-mounted TVs the problem doesn't exist (despite the always susceptible John Darko seeming to think it will somehow affect the soundstage - lol). Sure, if you have a sofa, or a lump of solid furniture between the speakers and standing proud of them then you'll have some issues, but if you keep your rack low, and behind the level of the speaker grilles, then there is really no impediment to aural pleasure.
Moving the equipment rack to the side from center is a compromise, not a full solution. Youre trading a change in sound from the middle to a change in sound from only one side. Youre losing out on the symmetry with the rack on the side wall. The absolute best solution would be to have the equipment rack behind the listener dead center.
The reason Paul puts the system up by where he sits and not between the speakers is because that system has a the turn table. Tone arms will pick up sound waves and bounce.
Do not have anything between the speakers, except a tv behind the speakers against the wall, especially between the tweeter & woofer, is the greatest thing you can do to help the imaging! The smooth glass on the tv makes the sound waves of the tweeter & woofer bounce off the glass harder, faster & smoother, more clear & imaging. Practically empty spaces all around the speakers & on the sides of the speakers helps. A tv against the wall doesn't clutter or harm anything. It's the absolutely best thing you could ever do to help the 3 dimensional sound! I am not great on electronics. I am great on understanding invisible sound waves.
@Fat Rat You need short speaker wires too sound good. keep them at 10 fot each, dont make them real short. Kepp stereo on ground between speakers is best. A rak is maybe ok, if nothing on rack is between tweeters & woofer. only in small room for imaging, experiment with a mattress standind up between speakers. I knew a guy who put a wall between speakers. It seperates streo that's more clear not running into each other. I had speakers on fireplace that actually improve the sound. Cruthfield just ran out of the older PSB Alpha B1 speakers. The best cheap speaker you can buy. Twice PSB has been Stereophile product of the year. The Alpha sold over 100,000 pair in 20 years, that must be good. Look for them on Ebay or buy PSB on crutchfield. Go to www.morrow.com to buy great cheap interconnects. He has half price specials once a month. He send specials to your email if you call him. In a good system interconnects make a huge difference. Or use the thinnest dvd player interconnects. You can experiment by hooking all my friends stuff together to see what gets the best tone. Tone is a less harsh low frequency. I will send you a playlist of the best sounding cds to buy. Almost all my cds were records in 1971 & before that was recorded with all tubes.
@Fat RatI'll put my best lps up later. Every single stereo shop I have talked to, I have asked them, if u were on a desert island, which would u pick of these 100 cds, which would you pick as the best sounding cd. Every single stereo shop said that the best of these 1 out of the 100 cds is all 100 of the them. Listed in alphabetical order. 1. Baden Powell- baden plays Vinicius (1973) Spanish, best acoustical guitarist I have ever heard 2. Baden powell-solitude (1971) 3. Don baker_ duckin & Divin (2006) worlds best harmonica 4. bamboo (1971) as clear as flute can get 5. Beatles-love 6. Beatles- revolver Beatles- yellow submarine 7. bud Shank-magical mystery (1971) Absolutely perfect sound, I keep this under beatles, its beatles songs 8. beck-sea change MFSL 92003) much better remaster, the lp goes for $300 9. George benson& jack mcduff (1964) jazz 10. blind faith(1971) Deluxe Edition, the extra cd worth it 11. dave Brubeck-time further out (1961) 12.dave Brubeck-time out (1958) jazz 13. Kenny burrell midnight blue (1961) jazz 14. tracy chapman tracy chapman (1994) this can be on lp, too 15. John Coltrane a love subpreme (1958) jazz !6. John Coltrane-ole (1963) elvin jones drums 17. Ry cooder- a meeting by the river (19990 pure analog, better than the later digital remaster. The remaster is the only one u can get on lp that's great must have cd 18. Keith cooper- sacred dance (2000) strums guitar with both hands 19. Mike cooper-trout steel(1970) great acoustic guitar 20. Cure- disentigration, mixed up, 7 wish cds, not perfect sound 21. the exotic sounds of martin den- primativa (1958) perfect sound 22. willie Dixon-I am the blues. walter Horton on harmonica 23. Dylan- blood on the tracks- not perfect sound (1968) 24. Dylan-hard to handle (1995) not perfect sound 25. Dylan MTV Unplugged (1996) perfect sound 26. Bill frisello with dave Holland & elvin jones (2001) must have for great sound 27. Emmylou harrisspyboy live (1999) dont get this mixed up with plain spyboy. clearest ever heard at all frequencies 28. Michael hedges-oracle (1996) 29. jimi Hendrix-blues new cd of old stuffgreat sound 30. dave Holland-hands (2010) great acoustic guitar 31. the best of HOOKER N HEAT (1971) 32. lightnin' Hopkins- blues hoot (1961) DCCCD remasteranalog steve Hoffman 33. Freddie hubbard-straight lifejazz. George bensen on guitar. This is CBS original, I dont like remaster 34. dave grusin-discovered again (1976) direct to disc, great 35. James gang-rides again(1971) lp is great 36. Jazz at the pawnshop)1979)analog recorded in café in open box for sound 37. J. K. & Co.-suddenly one summer(1968) boy played all guitars 38. Elton john-tumbleweed connection (1971) mick ronson guitar lp is great 39.albert king-I'll play the blues for you (1970) 12 track version 40. Leo kottke 6 & 12 string (!969) 41. Led Zeppelin 3 (1971) lp is better 41. The Maureeny Wishful album (1967) jimiie Page, better than led zed albums 42. Little feat-waiting for Columbus- (1973) perfect sound recorded in cathedral. MFSL analog tube remaster with better tone 43. Nils Lofgren-acoustic live (1998) 44. Antonio Lysy at the Broad-music from argentina (2009) analog recorded. cellos. Great audiophile 45. herbie mann- live at the whiskey a go go (1961) flute, great sound 46. dave Matthews & tim Reynolds-live at luther college (2008) 47. medicine head-new bottles old medicine (1970) 48. Mississippi fred mcdowall- I dont play no rock & roll (1969) black acoustic guitar blues 49. modest mouse-this is a long time (1996)analog recorded 50. van morrison-astral weeks (1968) remaster. one of the finest albums recorded all acoustic in 2 days. acoustic bass is wild 51. Penguin café orchestra- a brief history (1971) 52. Autumn Shuffle-Per af Ugglas (2007) analog recorded, hybrid sacd or xrcd, I like both 53. Quicksilver messenger service-happy trails (1968) 54. Quicksilver messenger service- live at the filmore (1968) 55. quicksilver messenger service-quicksilver messenger service (1968) 56. rolling stones-letit bleed (1969) ry cooder guitar. bob lutz 2002 remaster. a great remaster. sold unmarked in storesas a hybrid cd, as all of stones cds. 57. sonny Rollins-thebridge 91962 jazz just only greaton saxophone 58. Santana1, abraxas, & 3. abraxas on lp is mind blowing, especially the 1st lps. 59. shanti (1971) amazing inside your head mid east recording 60. Horace silver - cape Verdean blues (1964) rudy van gelder 24 bit 2003 remaster.Rudy made his own electronics & was afraid thieves would steal it, he guarded it. 61. Son house-father of the delta blues (1965) black acoustic guitar 62. Jeremy steig-howling for judy91971) blue note, great flute 63. Jeremy steig-wayfaring stranger ( blue note, best flute air I have heard. 64. cat stevens-tea for the tillerman (1971) 65. Steve Stills-super session (1968) 66. taj mahal-live & direct (1975) direct to disc 67. taj mahal - taj mahal (1968) 68. ten years after-recorded live (1971) 69.traffic-welcome to the canteen (1971) I'm crazy on this jazz rock cd. 70. U2- Joshua tree. not perfect sound. 71. the string quartet tribute to U2 Joshua tree (2004) 72. peter walker-rainy day raga (1966) mind blowing India like acoustic guitar 73. war-all day music 74. war-war (1971) worth getting for great 10 minute track 75. jennifer warnes-the hunter 919920 raincoat is better, but I like deep bass on some tracks 76. Jennifer warnes- raincoat the remaster is much better, the MFSL remaster by analog tube remaster has better tone. 77. who- live at leeds (1971) Deluxe Edition, any remaster has better sound 78. who-now & zen (2005) best sound hits version 78.who-quadrophenia (1971) the 2nd remaster 10 years ago has better sound than the bob lutz remaster. fans complained they couldn't find the analog version of tapes. 79. wilco-being there (1999) This sounds analog 80. George Winston-December (1985) 20th anniversary remaster. has a crisper sound hdcd best piano cd made 81. Gretchen yanover-bow & cello black lady beautiful cello tone
Speakers close to a brick wall acting as a diffusor with average speakers will sound much better than the greatest speakers in the world in a sheetrock room. It amazes me how people spend a fortune on stereos in a sheetrock room & I am one of them, but my parents house has a brick walled room. Average speakers positioned correctly will sound than the best speakers not positioned correctly. The greatest upgrade is not equipment. Its the position of the speakers. If the speakers are positioned correctly the greatest up grade is a hard & diffused law. Having the greatest stereo is little benefit without a hard diffused wall. Unless one has tried it, one dont know. Stereo shops dont want people to spend money on a room, they'd rather one spend it on their equipment. I have a friend that been in stereos over 50 years & spent over $100,000 on stereos. He is not the smartest, but he is good.
@Fat Rat My friend built his home for his stereo. He has a bathroom between 2 bedrooms. He sits in the middle of his living room. He opens his bathroom, & 2 bedroom doors. In the living room, he places the speakers between the doors right against the wall. With the doors open, it tricks the speakers that's against the wall into thinking that they are far away from the wall. The benefit is his wife doesn't have to get mad & shove the speakers in the middle of the floor in her way against the wall. I hate bright stuff, so I call the opposite of bright deep tone. I have to have at least a tube pre amp om my system. The deeper the tone, the better. I noticed on ebay people wont buy this up sampling bright stuff that loses bass. People want deep tone stuff. I make stuff for my friends. I can enjoy cheap speakers as long as they image good. I have a cheap Sony receiver I didnt care much for. So I bought another cheap Sony receiver that made the tweeter have a deep tone. So I bought 2 more exactly like it for another friend & me. I play around with wires, cheap cd players, receivers, & speakers to get the best tone. I have some speakers with 4 inch woofers that many say they are the best big clear like sound from a small speaker they ever heard. These speakers aren't cheap & over the years I found 4 pairs of them. The bigger the woofer, the muddier the sound get, like a muddy sub. Most of my cd"s are from 1971 & before, recorded with tubes. In 1972 harsh digital transistors crept into harsh recorded albums that I hate. On Ebay I bought cheap a bunch of Nakamichi stasis receivers that Nelson Pass designed the stasis circuit. Runs cool at Class A at low volumes & has 4 power supplies in 1 receiver. Sounds as good as my krell or better. The old Nad 3020 receiver was cheap with great tone & people bought them like crazy. The Nad is high priced used on Ebay! Why did they quit making it? Fourth order distortion in music is better & natural in tubes & lps with hiss. Remember Dolby Noise reduction that removed the hiss & made tapes sound awful.
I'm not totally agreeing with the notion that equipment between speakers degrades Hi-Fi Sound. My speakers are about a foot further into the room than my equipment rack. My system sounds perfectly fine, even better than some which have equipment rack elsewhere than between the speakers. In the real world it's not practical in most households for such freedom to place speakers and equipment as we see fit. Would it sound better elsewhere?.. May be... but that's the least of my worries.
OK Paul - you seemed to skip this -- assuming the speakers are located in the best spots in one's room and these is a lot of space between them - certainly enough for a 65+ inch TV or screen then the vast majority of "us" who live in the real world of not having a dedicated listening space will put a screen there and a centre channel or sound bar. Some like Steve Guttenberg very clearly do this - but when one sees this on his vids it is clear he has placed a thick quilt over the TV -- presumably to provide a better look, but also to reduce reflections. Since this setup is reality for so many my hope was you would address reflections and other sonic issues. In my case my speakers are about 11 feet apart and I have an 8' wide AV unit which contains a matching centre channel, large TV, my amplifiers and digital sources. My analogue sources are more accessible off to one side. Obviously I have couches, chairs, 2 large ottoman, curtains wall hangings/pictures and a host of other crud in my lounge/listening room -- the best deal I could strike was to bring the mains into the room away from front and side walls.
If more directional speakers are used, the television is no problem. It is only an issue when one believes the myth of wide dispersion being better for a bigger sweet spot. Wide dispersion only increases room problems.
Are you saying I should put my stereo equipment and my DVD player in front of me on my coffee table? Dang man that's making it look like I'm in a concert with cables going from the back behind the crowd in a sound booth to a stage where the performance is 😂😂😂😂😂
@Fat Rat The way it sounds you can't have nothing in the room with you bout a sofa. After looking at other videos on this topic they make it sound like you can't have nothing in the room. Seems a bit extreme because we have my speakers set away from the wall they always sound good for me as long as it makes noise makes the neighbors complain calls the law on me I'm okay I'm doing good It's all I'm after noise 😂😂😂😂😂
In an ideal world we would all have a dedicated listening room, but we don't, we have an area that is generally smaller than we would like, and we have stuff, a partner, pets, crap that we bought on holiday that we thought would look good at home. Unless you're super rich, everything is a compromise, just learn to live with it.
I put a 70" picture of a better hifi system between my speakers. It optimizes my listening experience, it's basically science.
Top comment 🤣
Thanks for answering my question Paul. I was asking because I am setting up my listening/home office room and I have the choice or either front wall/short cables or side wall/longer cables. Will go for side !
I am more concerned with the clutter between my headphones
I used to be concerned about that clutter but at my age my concern there is nothing left!
I'm concerned about the empty space between my headphones.
Hook up a kilowatt amp and blow that clutter away.
Most of us are wishing that the television between our speakers was the worst problem with our room.
If you put a video of the band that’s playing on the television then you have a better image of the band than looking at the wall i suppose.
hologram or nothing
@@cougias 😆
@@cougias How about a nice thin/soft/flexible projector screen.
I’ve always read that it’s important for the main L&R speakers to be able to “see” each other, meaning that there should be an unobstructed line between the fronts of the speakers, with any gear or furniture being behind that line. In practice, this should not usually be that difficult to achieve. Most of your audio gear will be backed up near to the front wall (i.e., the wall behind the front speakers), while the speakers should generally not be directly against the front wall.
Then, if your speakers are pulled out a little from the wall behind them, the gear and/or TV between them will be behind that line between the fronts of the speakers. As well, if the speakers are even just 6”/15 cm. from the wall, their bass response will be smoother, because the peak-causing boundary gain from the front wall will be reduced. The imaging also tends to improve if the speakers are a bit further from the wall.
So, moving the speakers away from the wall, even a little bit, improves their sound in two ways: smoother and less peaky bass response, and better soundstage imaging. Win-win!
As for putting a blanket over the TV, I’ve often read that it’s helpful, but I haven’t tried it, so I can’t truthfully comment on it.
I don’t think a flat tv-set on the wall, 2-3 feet behind the speakers alignment is going to ruin your soundstage.
Maybe not ruin it but it doesn't optimize it either...studio spaces attempt to have most flat reflective wall surfaces covered with acoustic treatment if at all possible for a reason. If you don't have the option due to space or lifestyle, it's just a trade-off most of us can live with...but that doesn't mean the improvement isn't possible.
@@ddrenth studio spaces try to eliminate parallel reflective surfaces, but the ones of the last decade+ also usually specifically put a computer screen between the monitors they're mixing the album on. the ones that don't have that usually don't because they have some combination of a large glass window to watch the live room, or a large flat metallic console providing it's own reflections. and then at the mastering stage there's once again almost always flat faced racks of gear and/or a computer screen right in the sweet spot between the speakers.
Thanks for your comments Paul they're very valid but unfortunately sometimes you can't do anything about it I personally don't have a separate room thank you very much for your show.
I have tried it, and I've found that as long as you keep your gear below ear level or around shoulder height (when you're seated) it wont have any negative affect on imaging, even if you place them between speakers, just keep them below ear level and you should be fine.
Negative effect. :-)
It's quite easy to determine via an ETC measurement.
This is the industry standard for determining whether there's early energy reflected to the listener, how early, and at what level and what frequency spectrum.
There's so much speculation in the audio enthusiast community and the same tools studio acousticians use are available so inexpensively ... it's quite easy.
For a $100 mic and free software that's state of the art (REW), one can measure.
Or for $300 OmniMic product is even easier ... seriously less than 5 minutes and you're measuring!
Knowing what's ACTUALLY going on and addressing it, is a force multiplier in audio unlike anything else.
How about 4-5 mannequins between the speakers?? Would I get a better image of a R&R band or jazz quartet??
If they have long 70s hair you will get great sound absorption!
You could call your mannequin quartet or quintet The Dispersions.
Gotta love those have naked chicks
@Mark Victor No treble!
No, the performers have already been captured by the microphones, so you're just adding people who aren't there.
Sometimes it is also ideal to fill the room with some extra nitrogen. It allows speakers to breathe better and thus enhances soundstage.
Pros put the nitrogen IN the speaker cabinets, not the room.
Without a doubt, the best advice of the day!
@@hxhdfjifzirstc894 I think it's best to put the nitro in the listener!
I can vouch for this. I used to have my TV in between my speakers, but then mounted it over a fireplace on an adjacent wall. I am now getting much better imagining from my system, even when swapping two sets of different speakers. My A/V rack is still there, but its low to floor and space between the speakers is freed up. I also have the speakers about 5 feet from the wall. Music has really come alive in this setup.
I don't believe it.
Paul:
And neither do I.
The last place for a TV, of any type or size, is above a FUCKING FIREPLACE mantle!
Seems to me like the best way to test the best position of speakers is with your eyes closed, not knowing exactly where they are.
For Home Theater, it's fine and it doesn't matter. The sound of a movie is not hampered at all. However, for two channel stereo, i made an absorber out of ordinary foam board by installing two plastic hooks that attaches to my 55 inch tv and glued two inch acoustic foam to the front side of the board. It drapes over the tv and looks and sounds great. When im done, i remove the foam board and store it until next time i do two channel stereo listening.
I'm working on something similar, maybe that hinges down from the ceiling.
@@TheAgeOfAnalog awesome...i like doing that kind of stuff.
That may be true for music only rooms, but for a media room where you watch movies with surround sound the TV has to be between the main speakers. Few of us can afford a dedicated music room.
I have a TV on the wall and a curtain that I can pull in front of it when not in use. Seems fine. Perfect - maybe not, but I like to look at all the gear and the symmetry.
Remember to pull the curtain back to optimise movies!
To each their own I guess
well, I prefer to watch live discs to studio - blu Ray of Opera's Anna Netrebko , La Traviata for instance. and the speakers are about 2 ft on each side. works for me. practical rules.
Paul, you are so honest! hahaha.. In Hong Kong, our apartment is so small that we consider ourselves lucky to have a wall that is dedicated to listening.
Hi Paul, thanks for your great videos and inspiring ideas!
Best regards from Mexico!
Setting everything up in an ideal manner is virtually impossible for those of modest financial means.
Fitting a decent system into a small space AT ALL is hard enough to do.
In my longest-lasting residence so far (over 15 years), I had the audio equipment off to the side
and most of the video equipment (all but the LD player) between, but well behind, the speakers.
The arangement came about not because I wanted it that way but because that was the only way I could get it to fit.
Sound-wise it was pretty good, I thought, though I'm sure there were many errors and deficiencies of which I was blissfuly unaware.
Because so many people complain about this and are probably misinterpreting Paul here, I am going to try to clarify here. I don't believe Paul is talking about reflections and interferences when placing a TV in the center behind speakers.The things you are looking at while listening to music could distract you when trying to imagine the soundstage right between the speakers.For home theatre this is the opposite of course. You want to attach the sound to the screen there.
This is a bit like saying asphalt damages your tires when you drive. Okay, but I need to use my car on asphalt if I want to drive it.
Other's call it bitumen.
@Fat Rat Have you tried using just the built in speakers on today's televisions? I don't think that should be anyone's choice.
@Fat Rat Hi FR. His analogy has to do with necessity. If you have a TV and stereo gear, like most of us, you have just one room to enjoy them and positioning is limited. So, if you want to drive your car, there's little choice but to drive on the roadway supplied.
@Fat Rat My "great" room is quite small. About 20x18 with the TV in the corner and the speakers to each side. The divan is along the long wall opposite a slider patio window. I'll send you a picture soon. It's not sonically perfect by any means ;-)
@Fat Rat There, there, little rat.
My TV Is around 1.5 meters behind speakers, and I noticed big improvement when i lowered it below ear level. But the biggest difference is when TV is turned off. I think that distraction from music that TV can make, even if it is only some static picture is quite big, just having something to look at takes away that feeling of empty space behind speakers.
I use my 70" TV as a baffle for my horn system. Thus it's part of the speaker and adds to the overall sound quality.
Novel concept - I like it.
I'm someone who just doesn't care about getting the best possible sound quality or the best sound imaging. Having my TV between my speakers works well enough for me. I play my music just to enjoy it, not to worry about how real it sounds, whats wrong with that?
Nothing! Keep it that way, you’ll live a happier life.
Thanks for clearing that up, mostly. So my followup question is, how much would putting a TV on the wall at the opposite end of the room, say one that is 16'W x 30'L? thanks so much.
Perfect world' even the speakers would be behind an acoustically transparent barrier. I'd have nothing other than a tablet controlling Roon and the rest would either be a pitch black room or a view out into the garden. No indoor plants. No artwork. Like I said.- perfect !
I can't say that I've found much issue with having my main speakers set up with my TV. Regarding reflections in general I have luckily not had much issues when measuring the frequency curve. The center image is so good that I've abandoned any thoughts of getting a center speaker for the set up (not that I would have used that with music, but for other media) and, when playing recordings with detailed soundstages I can clearly pick out detailed changes in the sound placement. I can't say that it's an issue that there's equipment where the musicians might be because I can see just as well that they aren't there if the space is empty, so I don't think the visual aspect matters.
The positive for me is that I can have full access to my home media server (with lossless music and UHD Bluray rips) on my TV, so when listening to music I have a nice GUI that displays big album covers and so on, plus that I get to use my best speakers for viewing video material. Concert videos are especially amazing.
I won't say that it's the absolutely optimal solution, but I think it's the best compromise.
If it is the best compromise for *you,* or gives you the most pleasure; that's all that matters. : )
@Fat Rat
I thank you, good sir!
* tips hat *
@@HareDeLune Yes, I could perhaps have expressed myself more clearly on that but since I was talking about my situation I automatically figured it would be seen as the compromise for just that - my situation. Setting up an audio system is always about making yourself (and any other persons living with you that care about it) happy with how it sounds and works in your home. :)
@@Evil_Peter
You got me to thinking.
Hi-Fi and the pursuit of good sound really *is* such a personel thing.
My opinion is that it would be better in general for audiophiles to talk about it in a more personal way.
For example, saying "Doing/adding 'x' in my system, I noticed a considerable improvement."; instead of "Doing/adding 'x' in your system will make a considerable improvement."
The problem then falls to the salesmen and reviewers, who simply cannot use that perspective effectively for what they are trying to achieve.
I have to wonder if that's what screwed things up to begin with? XD
At any rate, the DIY community is becoming more appealing to me these days. : )
@@HareDeLune It's a tricky matter since there is of course a scientific part to the hobby, and it's not sound to ignore it entirely. It is of course nearly impossible for most people to get a perfect listening room and be able to buy any equipment they desire, so there will always be compromises, and there you have to go by your own taste.
There is also no system that sounds exactly like having musicians in your room, and most recordings don't even try to replicate that feeling either, so the goal should just be to get a system that sounds good, which will by definition be a personal thing.
I guess one should listen to others to learn, but in the end make one's own decisions. As long as you enjoy your system it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.
Stereo 👍 Promotes Brain Health and well being.
Television 👎 Makes your brain become a zombie.
YESSSS!!!
Thank you sir for your clean language pronounce, so other ppl can understand your videos.
Also thank you for your effort sharing your expierence. This is absolutely brilliant and i appreciate that.
I just purchased hifi system, but for the upgrade i'll definately consider products of your company.
Peace.
Vladimir, Russia
I agree with this. I still live with my parents in my room. I have a pair of mission 753 speakers. They sound beautiful. But i still have to put all my stuff in one room. I have my tv in the middle of my speakers and it seems that this puts the soundstage above my tv instead of in the middle. My speakers stand at least one foot in front of my tv and this still affects the soundstage. Its just that i dont have a better solution. But i still notice the difference. Iisten mostly with my eyes closed so i can visualize the image more effectively but still there is some difference in the soundstage.
I don't believe it.
This episode is mind-blowing. I look at hi-fi reviewers like steve Gutenberg, Zero Fidelity, Thomas and Stereo, Z reviews etc, and all of them have gear between the speakers!
We all have to live in the real world and make compromises. I mean as long as you pull the speakers out from the wall and they can "see" each other, it shouldn't be a problem.
so what if they do ! it's not a real issue
i have a 75 inch flat screen betweet (slightly behind) my tannoys. my friends cant believe that the voices come from the speakers. imaging is sharp as heck.
With old box Tv's this may have been relevant, but with today's flat TV's I don't see it affects the sound much.
Today's flat TV's affect sound even more due to the larger reflective surface they present to sound waves. That's the whole point of room treatment for walls and corners also...
@@ddrenth please explain, i mean, there is a wall, or a screen, both hard reflective surfaces, no?
@@amitraam1270 Yes, you are correct, a flat panel TV isn't much different than a flat back wall...but a treated back wall is 100% better than an exposed flat panel TV. Any of these audiophile youtubers including John Darko, Steve Guttenberg, Andrew Robinson, New Record Day, Zero Fidelity will all highly prioritize room treatment for your listening area...and that will always include the back wall, corners, side walls, and floor (some go as far as ceiling installations). I think every single one of them has a dedicated video on this topic...including Darko's release just today. I get some people simply don't have the option for a separate listening setup without a TV, but for those who do have the space, and the ability to install even basic treatment, it is an advantage.
@@ddrenth sure, vs treated surface, no competition.
I don't know Paul. Like many others have said in the comments, I, too have my tv (a big box) and stereo equipment in between both speakers and it sounds fine to me. The sound stage seems to go behind the back wall (music) and vocals are projected forward (depending on the mix) with sounds happening on the left and right. Watching tv, the sound seems to come right from the tv and my speakers are not spaced evenly. One speaker is 4 ft from tv the other is 5 ft from the tv. And I've heard lots of super expensive hifi systems when they had hifi shows in LA back in the early 90's.
No winning with this an empty room would echo like made with all reflective walls and no damping.ive just bought a 3d wall panel that would be act like a defuser and doesn't look as bad as foam or acoustic panel all over your living room walls.
One of Paul's best videos and all those room and setup related.
Is moving your loudspeaker more forward not a solution or an improvement?
Grtz Phil
A good way to test see if your Volume is louder behind the tv if so move the speakers in front. Thank u for the video I was wondering what I was doing wrong
In a perfect world. Never heard this one before. Happy music!
That's not what's really important. What's really important is there's a tree coming out of Paul's head!
It's a hi fidelitree.
@ Charles....head transplant. It's one of Paul's new business ventures.
Sure beats a toupee
Haha
@@davej9228 well done!
I have had the equipment in the middle, behind, next to, on top, underneath and even in the next room from the speakers. Never once was the imaging "soundstage" affected. If you set your speakers up properly you will not have a problem, unless your wife stands in front of the speaker. It's so nice being single. ))))
I cover my 55” screen (centered between my speakers on the wall) with a table cloth when listening. Kills the reflections nicely. Center image is very good.
I wouldn't have thought a table cloth had enough mass to do much of anything.
I'll give it a go.
DARKFiB3R it’s a pretty dense weave
Keep in mind that, while killing reflections, it also acts as an absorbtive room treatment in an area where you ideally want to disperse, rather than absorb. : )
Hare deLune that’s why I prefer a crinkled mess of aluminum foil instead of a tablecloth.
@@graxjpg
Have you ever heard the sheet of foil resonate at certain frequencies?
I have it on good authority that random pieces of rough-cut wood, placed in totally random positions covering the area behind the speakers and the point of first reflection on the side walls is one of the best solutions. : )
I get it for music but home theater makes no sense without your left, right and center on both sides of screen and below it.So many people can afford only one system thus home theater doubles as music system.
I stream my Tidal from an app on my Sony TV right to my Denon, works great, only need one remote to control everything, sounds just as good as when I was using my laptop
My Marantz SR7012 was just pushed an update today. Any idea what it included? Hopefully to allow my Heos Tidal App to play Atmos music! 😉👍
I agree. I have a small room, so I have 2 x two shelves audio racks and the amplifier in between the 2 audio racks to solve the cable issue. All placed in the front wall about 2.5 feet behind & in between the speakers. Its not perfect because it gets a bit of sound wave on the equipment but a compromise.
I understand what you're saying Paul, but I have my system in such a small room that I have no choice. I will say that I do still notice the effects of any upgrades that I make, and my enjoyment of music is undiminished. P.S. I love your content and I watch every day!
Decades ago I bought a Solid Steel 5 shelf rack, long before I understood the negatives. Worse, it has been well out in the room interfering with speaker imaging. Recently, I FINALLY moved it back near the front wall. The speakers are now some 3ft in front of the rack, minimizing imaging issues. Moving it to the side is very expensive as HQ interconnects or speaker cables are uber expensive. Plan B is to replace the vertical rack with a 2 shelf horizontal rack, which aren't cheap either
I think the true meaning of "Audiophile" is "one who has enough room to not crowd the imaging location"😂
Here in the states it's a bit easier as homes are built with an insensible amount of extra space. I would recommend to start with 86'ing the spouse!
What is an acceptable height limit for anything between the speakers ?
If one does not stack audio equipment, you may get a call from the Royal Society For Putting Things On Top of Other Things.
normally the speakers have diferent types and they are made to be used in a perfect position so it can give you the best sound putting them in front of you with a tv or hi-fi system inbetween you would have 20% of it´s quality and stereo efect , i´m going to writte about normal speakers 2 or 3 ways and bass reflex, normally it also depends on the size of the room ,the better way is using the corners of the room to put each speaker and left a 30 cm espace between the wall and the box of the speaker no matter how big is the room, it starts to give you a more rich sound in high and low frequencies ,you´ll notice that by having the bass knob on defeat or 0 position while if in front of you with the hi-fi or tv equipment, you need to increase at least four in the scale to have the same bass level but also you´ll feel the bass not as a direct sound but cleaner coming to you and bass either than listening to it you also feel it, if powerfull enough it makes vibration on the windows of your furniture or even in your body, the treble is the same you want the sound to come natural as if the band was playing in the room so the more apart they are, the sensation of quality in the sound increases if next to eachother it doesn´t give you the sound they were built for as the sound controls don´t have a strong response as it should, this is the basic instalation ,there ´s other types of speakers and normally they come with instructions for it´s instalation, but if you have a 4 speaker system you would put the other two behind you in the same position of the front ones if possible, normally with early 70´s 4 channel matrix is the same type of instalation, but i would writte for hours to explain how diferent speakers are to be installed on your listening room, regards
Yep, as much as it looks nice and symmetrical, that's the only benefit, but it's up to the owner to decide if that benefit outweighs the cons, I guess. Maybe modern flat TVs, mounted on walls isn't so bad though (apart from high frequency reflection of the screen), but not on the floor between the speakers.
@Fat Rat you dissing my tv fella? 😯
The flush mounted monitor is usually not a big deal. Unused tv speakers passively re-emitting sound may very well deteriorate your main speakers' sound
I've got a 48" OLED TV between my speakers and I drape a dark grey towel over the TV when I'm listening to music: it takes away the visual distraction of looking at reflections on a blank screen and I think it helps with the sound quality as well. Plus, it helps keep dust off the TV so there's that as well. My TV is obviously exposed when I'm watching films but when it comes to listening to music, draping a towel over the TV is a simple, real-world solution when it comes to having a TV between a pair of speakers :)
How about instead like i do .
You put the cover and/or description of the album. Or a nice photo slide of the concert details, or the performance. Finally a nice relaxing video in 4K on youtube (of course without sound!)
OMG! Scientific and audio studies have shown that dark grey is the worst color of drape over a tv you can use.
There is absolutely no problem placing a TV and other equipment between the speakers. Firstly, many people play their TV sound through their stereo system because the sound quality is much better than the tiny TV speakers. The TV needs to be dead centre for the correct effect. Secondly, the sound does not “cross over in the centre”. The centre sound image is an illusion caused by the direct sound from both speakers, it does not actually come from a point between the speakers.
4:55 "If in the middle where the speakers combine and shoot back and give us that beautiful center image . . ."
Yes, I got a chuckle from that one, too.
Marianne Oelund It is concerning that a so called expert clearly does not understand the subject. Objects placed between and slightly behind speakers will have little effect on sound quality. It is surfaces in front of speakers, such as walls, windows etc. that can affect stereo imaging. Objects between speakers may have a visually distracting effect, but there will be no audible issues. I often listen in a darkend room as performance sounds more realistic but I know turning off lights has a purely psychological effect.
@@geoff37s38
I find it more concerning that a response includes personal judgments. Now back to the topic of discussion -
It depends on how the interposed objects do, or do not, align with reflected signal paths, and then whether they add any new reflective paths between speaker and listener.
The exercise of imagining the room has reflective walls, was meant to aid in visualizing object locations which can impact the sound. Speakers diffract a portion of their sound in all directions - and some speakers even have rear ports or radiators.
@@geoff37s38 No Geoff, I am sorry but you did not understand Paul's intention here. He was not talking about demonstrating Home Theater Systems. When you are listening to music while looking at a TV that has nothing to do with the music that is being played it could be very distracting and take away from the listening experience. Of course you would want a TV being perfectly centered for home theater display.
@@geoff37s38 That would be physiological. When the brain doesn't have to process the dominate sense of sight it can focus more brain cells on sound. Stay in the dark long enough and brains will physically change to improve hearing and other senses.
Well.. I want the best sound and I do put my equipment between the speakers and the TV hangs on the wall ;P It's more convinient for me and makes the room look better and it works really, really great :P
Not ideal but still better than 99% of people I know :P
He is probably right in a technical and aesthetic sense, and it would be a fun experiment to hear the difference.
how about putting rack in between speakers but it is quite low about 50cm tall. is it still bad?
My Flat Screen HD TV is between my Infinity QLS-1’s But it is slightly back from the front axis of the speakers !! It DOES NOT INTERFERE WITH THE IMAGING AT ALL !!!!!
MATTER OF FACT, WHEN WATCHING A MOVIE USING MY STEREO SYSTEM, WHAT SHOULD SOUND LIKE IT IS COMING FROM THE TV DOES, AND WHAT IS OFF AXIS ALSO IS IN THE FIELD !!!
MY SPEAKERS HAVE BLOWN MY MIND FOR OVER 40 YEARS !!!
I don't understand why so many folks are sucked in by this man's bullshit.
@Fat Rat... and name calling is so progressive,, FM. It's my opinion,, your welcome to yours.
@Fat Rat nither did I say you were progressive, you do realise Neanderthals are extinct don't you.
Same setup as me, who the hell puts equipment in between and in front of the speakers ?? 🤷♂️
@Fat Rat nice edit,
I'm curious as to the consequence of placing speakers on either side of a window & indeed a heat source, such as a radiator?
A window would create a more transparent image, while the radiator would produce a warmer sound.
@@thegrimyeaper 🤣💖it.
That is so hilarious 😂 I could not stop laughing thank you for that
Looks like you're sitting on a contemplation bench. It's certainly placed in a beautiful setting around your home
I am lucky to have two complete systems in the same room, a 5.2.2 and a 2ch only, the home cinema components are on a rack to the side and the two channel is on a low level rack in front of the TV, is there a difference in sound quality, of course there is but I like to think it's down to the different amplifiers used and not where in the room my equipment racks are located.
Ahhh sorry Mark, however what you just stated above makes no sense. Did you miss type something, or do you not understand the question / root issue? OK, well sorry... but yeah, makes no sense.
same
I have a Samsung “Frame” tv between the speakers. Flush to wall and only projects about 1.5 inches. How bad could they be?
@Fat Rat So what if you place your speakers further up and away from your components... say 6-8 inches ahead?
Is there a difference if the wall behind the speakers is black or white or which color do you prefer.....
I remember the early days of stereo TV. There was much confusion on the studio's part of where to place the microphones. Early attempts resulted in many flanger sounds as the two mics with small spaces between made comb filters of the sound. Sound engineering for stereo is much different than for mono when you consider the typical speaker placement for a television receiver. Due to the problems of dual microphone pickup patterns in the same sound field, most studios have returned to Mono for the news and related broadcasting. Music and ambiance is in stereo.
Televisions should reproduce in kind. The stereo signal should be processed in a matrix just the same as FM radio with Main, which is L+R, and played on the center speaker. Any difference information should be on side speakers or on side facing speakers to produce the L-R difference signal. This would work exactly as the Mid/Side capsule for the Zoom H6 recorder but for playback.
TV sound is best processed to produce the center main channel with a center speaker. This is the heart of the soundbar concept, but that bar is undersized for full fidelity.
TV sound is not high fidelity, so not an audiophile subject for the most part. If you build a home theatre for sound, consult the THX specifications and find the DVD's with the THX test signals on them.
forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/987776
Surround Sound Test CD (DTS) - Lasertrak CD2500 - For surround and home theater sound setup
I remember the days of CRT TVs... now those produced quite some noise 😅
I've seen blankets drapped over TVs between speakers. This would stop reflections heading to the listening position?
I live in a condo apartment situation but good tip because I'm moving soon and I will try to put my gear to the side of the room or near a separate room set from my main speakers. It's the space issue.is it ok to have a screen between the speakers from your recent video you talked about transparent.
All of my equipment is to the side of my right speaker but my power amplifier is on the floor between them. It doesn't seem to affect the soundstage. I can even keep my eyes open and picture of the full soundfield.
Hey Paul, Never mind equipment between the speakers, the way you're sitting on that bench, I can almost see YOUR EQUIPMENT! 😂😂😂
New cameras? Video quality is awesome. When can we start ordering the books?
Probably the light outdoors is the thing making the image better
Perfection can be a burden
This is why I´ll be getting a projector instead of a new TV, well part of it.. Having a projector screen and maybe some acoustic panels behind it (along with the centre speaker) is probably better than a hard tv screen.
It is essential not to put one's spouse in between the speakers!.She (or he) should be right next to you enjoying the awesome audio!
Its a question of space Paul most of us live in the real world!
Like many others, ive never noticed an issue as long as the equipment is behind the speakers and not interfering with the main dispersal sound. Maybe my systems are simply not revealing enough to notice (im a 15k system kinda guy). I spent a long time in my youth both installing and working in studios and they follow none of this logic, which is baffling if its easy to hear...
Yeah I’m with everyone else in the Comments - a Flat Screen TV on the Wall is not going to be an obstruction
Didnt really ans the question again.
These days, flat screen TV is set on the plane of the wall behind the speakers.
What effect do their built in speakers have on the main speaker's output?
I cover my living room with a throw for serious listening, just in case.
No tv in the music room!
Watching you on You Tube with TV between speakers. The tv has become a pre amp. With HDMI inputs TV has computer, blueray player, and TV over internet going to it. Now it gets confusing. If that is all a power amp connected to the headphone out jack makes life simple and it sounds better than the tv speakers. However if I want to add a CD, Tape, MP3, and source from another system, I use an integrated amp or receiver. I know it's a compromise. It's a relationship.
Tks Paul though it'd be easier said than done say in Hong Kong where I'm from!
i want to upgrade the midrange drivers in my cerwin vega D9s, but i don't know how that works at all. can i put any driver of the same size in there and hook it up? thanks
Fat Rat you could with a crossover upgrade right?
@Fat Rat You've crossed over...that's for sure.
I suggest a coffee to loosen up those brain cells.
Then come back and talk about crossdressers. Wait....you'd best not tell us if your daily escapades. 😷
No
@Fat Rat 😂
What about headphones? Is it ok to put your head in the middle of the sound stage or should I just hang them up and play them really loud?
how about a TV mounted to the wall above the speaker level?
Does it matter that much for near field listening? I have my whole desktop and monitor between my bookshelf speakers. I wish I could put the desktop in another place but I can't.
I noticed zero difference in the imaging when i removed my 60inch Panny plasma from the rack. Speaker front baffles are well in front of the screen of course. I think only if the TV is well in front of the baffles and the speakers are toed in more causing obstruction would i notice it. Even then i suspect most of what id notice would be from the toeing in anyway. No removal of my TV is ever going to fool me into thinking a band is suddenly playing live in my room. Hifi and live music in any room or venue is easy to distinguish apart regardless of hifi cost. I recall an expensive Audio note system at north west audio show last yr playing a violinist Cd. Said violinist then came and played live. It was easy to tell them apart.
A TV behind the speakers is no more an audible obstruction that the wall. I hear you re the illusion of stereo, for sure - close your eyes if you need to. But for enjoying a good blu ray concert, film etc- the TV is in the right place!! - sits back and continues Hans Zimmer live in Prague -
Makes sense, but no equipment between the speakers is just not practical in most real world settings.
This is disappointing to me. I take great respect in what Paul says so I said "Oh No... " out loud when I watched this lol. Not only would I not be able to do this practically but also financially because I have a set budget for my cables - and longer ones would be more expensive. I don't really want to have the equipment off to the side because the entire plan was to have the equipment be the showcase so to speak (kind of like how you guys do at trade shows) and have it right in the middle. But my plan was to have the speakers in Front of the furniture - and also towed in a little towards the listener. Wouldn't this be a good compromise? Note there won't be TV there, just the equipment on furniture.
The speakers I am getting are floorstanders which were made taller from the previous version and are intended to be placed on the ground. They are already tall but should I also get stands so the height of the speaker can bypass the height of the furniture? I just want to enjoy and I've already had too much overthinking this setup.
I had to retype this entire thing because my damn phone erased three paragraphs - grrr lol.
Thanks
I wouldn't sweat it. Most of us have to compromise in setting up our systems. You can get fantastic sound without your system being set up 100% perfectly. My system has a tv stand and a flat screen tv in the middle of the speakers. The sound is incredible and I still get the center imaging that Paul describes.
I have a low bench that is 2 feets (60 cm) high to the top, where I only have my Elac CC501 Center, and I can't imagine how a low bench like the one I have can affect the sound.
An interesting opinion, but I have to say that with wall-mounted TVs the problem doesn't exist (despite the always susceptible John Darko seeming to think it will somehow affect the soundstage - lol). Sure, if you have a sofa, or a lump of solid furniture between the speakers and standing proud of them then you'll have some issues, but if you keep your rack low, and behind the level of the speaker grilles, then there is really no impediment to aural pleasure.
Moving the equipment rack to the side from center is a compromise, not a full solution. Youre trading a change in sound from the middle to a change in sound from only one side. Youre losing out on the symmetry with the rack on the side wall. The absolute best solution would be to have the equipment rack behind the listener dead center.
Remove listener & all furniture from the room. Sound is reflected from listener's body messing with speaker image. Just have empty room & hifi gear.
The reason Paul puts the system up by where he sits and not between the speakers is because that system has a the turn table. Tone arms will pick up sound waves and bounce.
To prevent feedback the best place for a turntable is in another room.
@@paulsebring7242 In another building on a concrete floor to Nasa spec's for levelness and stability. lol
Do not have anything between the speakers, except a tv behind the speakers against the wall, especially between the tweeter & woofer, is the greatest thing you can do to help the imaging! The smooth glass on the tv makes the sound waves of the tweeter & woofer bounce off the glass harder, faster & smoother, more clear & imaging. Practically empty spaces all around the speakers & on the sides of the speakers helps. A tv against the wall doesn't clutter or harm anything. It's the absolutely best thing you could ever do to help the 3 dimensional sound! I am not great on electronics. I am great on understanding invisible sound waves.
@Fat Rat You need short speaker wires too sound good. keep them at 10 fot each, dont make them real short. Kepp stereo on ground between speakers is best. A rak is maybe ok, if nothing on rack is between tweeters & woofer. only in small room for imaging, experiment with a mattress standind up between speakers. I knew a guy who put a wall between speakers. It seperates streo that's more clear not running into each other. I had speakers on fireplace that actually improve the sound. Cruthfield just ran out of the older PSB Alpha B1 speakers. The best cheap speaker you can buy. Twice PSB has been Stereophile product of the year. The Alpha sold over 100,000 pair in 20 years, that must be good. Look for them on Ebay or buy PSB on crutchfield. Go to www.morrow.com to buy great cheap interconnects. He has half price specials once a month. He send specials to your email if you call him. In a good system interconnects make a huge difference. Or use the thinnest dvd player interconnects. You can experiment by hooking all my friends stuff together to see what gets the best tone. Tone is a less harsh low frequency. I will send you a playlist of the best sounding cds to buy. Almost all my cds were records in 1971 & before that was recorded with all tubes.
@Fat RatI'll put my best lps up later. Every single stereo shop I have talked to, I have asked them, if u were on a desert island, which would u pick of these 100 cds, which would you pick as the best sounding cd. Every single stereo shop said that the best of these 1 out of the 100 cds is all 100 of the them. Listed in alphabetical order. 1. Baden Powell- baden plays Vinicius (1973) Spanish, best acoustical guitarist I have ever heard 2. Baden powell-solitude (1971) 3. Don baker_ duckin & Divin (2006) worlds best harmonica 4. bamboo (1971) as clear as flute can get 5. Beatles-love 6. Beatles- revolver Beatles- yellow submarine 7. bud Shank-magical mystery (1971) Absolutely perfect sound, I keep this under beatles, its beatles songs 8. beck-sea change MFSL 92003) much better remaster, the lp goes for $300 9. George benson& jack mcduff (1964) jazz 10. blind faith(1971) Deluxe Edition, the extra cd worth it 11. dave Brubeck-time further out (1961) 12.dave Brubeck-time out (1958) jazz 13. Kenny burrell midnight blue (1961) jazz 14. tracy chapman tracy chapman (1994) this can be on lp, too 15. John Coltrane a love subpreme (1958) jazz !6. John Coltrane-ole (1963) elvin jones drums 17. Ry cooder- a meeting by the river (19990 pure analog, better than the later digital remaster. The remaster is the only one u can get on lp that's great must have cd 18. Keith cooper- sacred dance (2000) strums guitar with both hands 19. Mike cooper-trout steel(1970) great acoustic guitar 20. Cure- disentigration, mixed up, 7 wish cds, not perfect sound 21. the exotic sounds of martin den- primativa (1958) perfect sound 22. willie Dixon-I am the blues. walter Horton on harmonica 23. Dylan- blood on the tracks- not perfect sound (1968) 24. Dylan-hard to handle (1995) not perfect sound 25. Dylan MTV Unplugged (1996) perfect sound 26. Bill frisello with dave Holland & elvin jones (2001) must have for great sound 27. Emmylou harrisspyboy live (1999) dont get this mixed up with plain spyboy. clearest ever heard at all frequencies 28. Michael hedges-oracle (1996) 29. jimi Hendrix-blues new cd of old stuffgreat sound 30. dave Holland-hands (2010) great acoustic guitar 31. the best of HOOKER N HEAT (1971) 32. lightnin' Hopkins- blues hoot (1961) DCCCD remasteranalog steve Hoffman 33. Freddie hubbard-straight lifejazz. George bensen on guitar. This is CBS original, I dont like remaster 34. dave grusin-discovered again (1976) direct to disc, great 35. James gang-rides again(1971) lp is great 36. Jazz at the pawnshop)1979)analog recorded in café in open box for sound 37. J. K. & Co.-suddenly one summer(1968) boy played all guitars 38. Elton john-tumbleweed connection (1971) mick ronson guitar lp is great 39.albert king-I'll play the blues for you (1970) 12 track version 40. Leo kottke 6 & 12 string (!969) 41. Led Zeppelin 3 (1971) lp is better 41. The Maureeny Wishful album (1967) jimiie Page, better than led zed albums 42. Little feat-waiting for Columbus- (1973) perfect sound recorded in cathedral. MFSL analog tube remaster with better tone 43. Nils Lofgren-acoustic live (1998) 44. Antonio Lysy at the Broad-music from argentina (2009) analog recorded. cellos. Great audiophile 45. herbie mann- live at the whiskey a go go (1961) flute, great sound 46. dave Matthews & tim Reynolds-live at luther college (2008) 47. medicine head-new bottles old medicine (1970) 48. Mississippi fred mcdowall- I dont play no rock & roll (1969) black acoustic guitar blues 49. modest mouse-this is a long time (1996)analog recorded 50. van morrison-astral weeks (1968) remaster. one of the finest albums recorded all acoustic in 2 days. acoustic bass is wild 51. Penguin café orchestra- a brief history (1971) 52. Autumn Shuffle-Per af Ugglas (2007) analog recorded, hybrid sacd or xrcd, I like both 53. Quicksilver messenger service-happy trails (1968) 54. Quicksilver messenger service- live at the filmore (1968) 55. quicksilver messenger service-quicksilver messenger service (1968) 56. rolling stones-letit bleed (1969) ry cooder guitar. bob lutz 2002 remaster. a great remaster. sold unmarked in storesas a hybrid cd, as all of stones cds. 57. sonny Rollins-thebridge 91962 jazz just only greaton saxophone 58. Santana1, abraxas, & 3. abraxas on lp is mind blowing, especially the 1st lps. 59. shanti (1971) amazing inside your head mid east recording 60. Horace silver - cape Verdean blues (1964) rudy van gelder 24 bit 2003 remaster.Rudy made his own electronics & was afraid thieves would steal it, he guarded it. 61. Son house-father of the delta blues (1965) black acoustic guitar 62. Jeremy steig-howling for judy91971) blue note, great flute 63. Jeremy steig-wayfaring stranger ( blue note, best flute air I have heard. 64. cat stevens-tea for the tillerman (1971) 65. Steve Stills-super session (1968) 66. taj mahal-live & direct (1975) direct to disc 67. taj mahal - taj mahal (1968) 68. ten years after-recorded live (1971) 69.traffic-welcome to the canteen (1971) I'm crazy on this jazz rock cd. 70. U2- Joshua tree. not perfect sound. 71. the string quartet tribute to U2 Joshua tree (2004) 72. peter walker-rainy day raga (1966) mind blowing India like acoustic guitar 73. war-all day music 74. war-war (1971) worth getting for great 10 minute track 75. jennifer warnes-the hunter 919920 raincoat is better, but I like deep bass on some tracks 76. Jennifer warnes- raincoat the remaster is much better, the MFSL remaster by analog tube remaster has better tone. 77. who- live at leeds (1971) Deluxe Edition, any remaster has better sound 78. who-now & zen (2005) best sound hits version 78.who-quadrophenia (1971) the 2nd remaster 10 years ago has better sound than the bob lutz remaster. fans complained they couldn't find the analog version of tapes. 79. wilco-being there (1999) This sounds analog 80. George Winston-December (1985) 20th anniversary remaster. has a crisper sound hdcd best piano cd made 81. Gretchen yanover-bow & cello black lady beautiful cello tone
@Fat RatClick on links below to hear a few of my best sound cds of my playlist. Entire cds are great, maybe entire cd aint on youtube. ruclips.net/video/HKjOOPViCIs/видео.html ruclips.net/video/EGxsCCuZtr8/видео.html ruclips.net/video/Hqq1t0F-zSI/видео.html ruclips.net/video/QP1EtSVnZRE/видео.html ruclips.net/video/GNyw6yRf93c/видео.html ruclips.net/video/QP1EtSVnZRE/видео.html ruclips.net/video/EGxsCCuZtr8/видео.html ruclips.net/video/1Q1D0y6GLq0/видео.html ruclips.net/video/91Gnd4chPlA/видео.html ruclips.net/video/7tbs7ufg-Ig/видео.html ruclips.net/video/5MoocnRh2-E/видео.html ruclips.net/video/Mmk6Q_1rwWA/видео.html ruclips.net/video/iJHQnfThjGA/видео.html ruclips.net/video/j67ZJ51w8s0/видео.html ruclips.net/video/tlF7uX4TKbw/видео.html ruclips.net/video/2wLmOZdiSu0/видео.html ruclips.net/video/kFLkHmGfFlg/видео.html ruclips.net/video/keNHTo2hhQg/видео.html ruclips.net/video/EGxsCCuZtr8/видео.html ruclips.net/video/QP1EtSVnZRE/видео.html ruclips.net/video/GNyw6yRf93c/видео.html ruclips.net/video/ll3CMgiUPuU/видео.html ruclips.net/video/rf_bJuhIcxM/видео.html ruclips.net/video/k77DL9S1Ocw/видео.html ruclips.net/video/kot5N5WFBAU/видео.html ruclips.net/video/vDgyJbc66tI/видео.html ruclips.net/video/j496ooaIiQs/видео.html ruclips.net/video/-mHuTXS05t0/видео.html ruclips.net/video/_wBOtnQ9R7Q/видео.html ruclips.net/video/DK9jyXD5yWA/видео.html ruclips.net/video/TfUcKo-T5Xw/видео.html ruclips.net/video/15SR2fRqKVU/видео.html ruclips.net/video/f7Ks6ZgaYK8/видео.html ruclips.net/video/N5O6TEcXS3A/видео.html ruclips.net/video/etOrYtQ3EGc/видео.html ruclips.net/video/mHpcA_510UM/видео.html ruclips.net/video/fsvy5BV4AzM/видео.html ruclips.net/video/4JUKYwXALrk/видео.html ruclips.net/video/wbita-lKkL8/видео.html ruclips.net/video/2xJYuPtxiG0/видео.html ruclips.net/video/zD1dW7gJfPE/видео.html ruclips.net/video/3NRr2QrXn7s/видео.html ruclips.net/video/nzuoJVij9BQ/видео.html ruclips.net/video/gNvnfbLMu3k/видео.html ruclips.net/video/4pK2dea6Enw/видео.html ruclips.net/video/fPXOcxDdL4s/видео.html ruclips.net/video/Q-rJ36o9Sds/видео.html ruclips.net/video/Ci52Iq_IQso/видео.html ruclips.net/video/6pe8ukYc4LU/видео.html ruclips.net/video/atseImSMIWs/видео.html ruclips.net/video/EAUG8WU4lyg/видео.html ruclips.net/video/VjOqpY8Z1Ow/видео.html john Hammond paris concert ruclips.net/video/lTs6DC3byWc/видео.html ruclips.net/video/glT-z8XANwM/видео.html ruclips.net/video/1tadKC6l2es/видео.html
Speakers close to a brick wall acting as a diffusor with average speakers will sound much better than the greatest speakers in the world in a sheetrock room. It amazes me how people spend a fortune on stereos in a sheetrock room & I am one of them, but my parents house has a brick walled room. Average speakers positioned correctly will sound than the best speakers not positioned correctly. The greatest upgrade is not equipment. Its the position of the speakers. If the speakers are positioned correctly the greatest up grade is a hard & diffused law. Having the greatest stereo is little benefit without a hard diffused wall. Unless one has tried it, one dont know. Stereo shops dont want people to spend money on a room, they'd rather one spend it on their equipment. I have a friend that been in stereos over 50 years & spent over $100,000 on stereos. He is not the smartest, but he is good.
@Fat Rat My friend built his home for his stereo. He has a bathroom between 2 bedrooms. He sits in the middle of his living room. He opens his bathroom, & 2 bedroom doors. In the living room, he places the speakers between the doors right against the wall. With the doors open, it tricks the speakers that's against the wall into thinking that they are far away from the wall. The benefit is his wife doesn't have to get mad & shove the speakers in the middle of the floor in her way against the wall. I hate bright stuff, so I call the opposite of bright deep tone. I have to have at least a tube pre amp om my system. The deeper the tone, the better. I noticed on ebay people wont buy this up sampling bright stuff that loses bass. People want deep tone stuff. I make stuff for my friends. I can enjoy cheap speakers as long as they image good. I have a cheap Sony receiver I didnt care much for. So I bought another cheap Sony receiver that made the tweeter have a deep tone. So I bought 2 more exactly like it for another friend & me. I play around with wires, cheap cd players, receivers, & speakers to get the best tone. I have some speakers with 4 inch woofers that many say they are the best big clear like sound from a small speaker they ever heard. These speakers aren't cheap & over the years I found 4 pairs of them. The bigger the woofer, the muddier the sound get, like a muddy sub. Most of my cd"s are from 1971 & before, recorded with tubes. In 1972 harsh digital transistors crept into harsh recorded albums that I hate. On Ebay I bought cheap a bunch of Nakamichi stasis receivers that Nelson Pass designed the stasis circuit. Runs cool at Class A at low volumes & has 4 power supplies in 1 receiver. Sounds as good as my krell or better. The old Nad 3020 receiver was cheap with great tone & people bought them like crazy. The Nad is high priced used on Ebay! Why did they quit making it? Fourth order distortion in music is better & natural in tubes & lps with hiss. Remember Dolby Noise reduction that removed the hiss & made tapes sound awful.
I'm not totally agreeing with the notion that equipment between speakers degrades Hi-Fi Sound. My speakers are about a foot further into the room than my equipment rack. My system sounds perfectly fine, even better than some which have equipment rack elsewhere than between the speakers. In the real world it's not practical in most households for such freedom to place speakers and equipment as we see fit.
Would it sound better elsewhere?.. May be... but that's the least of my worries.
totally agree, doesn't make a difference where your equipment sits.
Visually it makes a difference because there is nothing to trick your mind by what you see. Not sure if the sound changes...
OK Paul - you seemed to skip this -- assuming the speakers are located in the best spots in one's room and these is a lot of space between them - certainly enough for a 65+ inch TV or screen then the vast majority of "us" who live in the real world of not having a dedicated listening space will put a screen there and a centre channel or sound bar. Some like Steve Guttenberg very clearly do this - but when one sees this on his vids it is clear he has placed a thick quilt over the TV -- presumably to provide a better look, but also to reduce reflections.
Since this setup is reality for so many my hope was you would address reflections and other sonic issues. In my case my speakers are about 11 feet apart and I have an 8' wide AV unit which contains a matching centre channel, large TV, my amplifiers and digital sources. My analogue sources are more accessible off to one side. Obviously I have couches, chairs, 2 large ottoman, curtains wall hangings/pictures and a host of other crud in my lounge/listening room -- the best deal I could strike was to bring the mains into the room away from front and side walls.
If more directional speakers are used, the television is no problem. It is only an issue when one believes the myth of wide dispersion being better for a bigger sweet spot. Wide dispersion only increases room problems.
You got the pronunciation almost right!
His pronunciation of "Claude" is perfect at 0:20"
Are you saying I should put my stereo equipment and my DVD player in front of me on my coffee table? Dang man that's making it look like I'm in a concert with cables going from the back behind the crowd in a sound booth to a stage where the performance is 😂😂😂😂😂
@Fat Rat The way it sounds you can't have nothing in the room with you bout a sofa. After looking at other videos on this topic they make it sound like you can't have nothing in the room. Seems a bit extreme because we have my speakers set away from the wall they always sound good for me as long as it makes noise makes the neighbors complain calls the law on me I'm okay I'm doing good It's all I'm after noise 😂😂😂😂😂