My word! I could watch these two upstanding gentlemen talk for hours and hours about a rock and I wont be dissapointed. On a serious note,we really need these types of conversations, instead of blaming each other for our own issues.
I firmly believe we can be proud of our individual culture without looking down on others, to me it's a sign of weakness if you can't be proud of your own culture without belittling others. I was brought up Afrikaans so that is my culture, having hard time from my Portuguese in laws. But I stand my ground
I have always considered the 'Rainbow Nation' concept to mean how Ernst interprets it here. There was never going to be one single South African culture - the very point of it is the freedom to be yourself in a diverse nation. Awesome episode, thank you.
As a boer in Europe, I am proud of the different cultures in SA, explaining it to other countries. Sadly the racist politicians make sure this doesn't happen in SA
Open minds lead to open acceptance of other cultures & communities. From Maslows hierarchy of needs, respect for others, respect by others, this is the only way we will overcome our differences. God speed.
What you gents are doing here is what is needed in this country, honest hard truths without emotional baggage. This kind of mutual respect for each other gives me hope for this country. Well done.
There is a lot of truth in this conversation... Especially the analysis about us as African and South African💯and its sad 🥹. But I do believe in one SA if everyone ( black & white)is willing and put effort, I also think blacks are more willing than white... Stand to be corrected 🙏
Oh my gosh, why aren't the so called policians as intelligent and truthful as Penuel and even Katlego in Citizens Concerned? Penuel really had an amazing conversation with the extremely informative and well balanced host! Thank you Ernest Roets, I've always loved your podcasts❤❤ Go Roets, Go Penuel❤
Great discussion between two open minds. Skills? Professionalism? Unknown meaning for most today's "positioned" leaders. Cognitive abilities not there. Not just SA... Concept of equality as "all the same" general interpretation is devaluating everything positive various civilizations achieved 🤔
Thank you Ernst and Penuel. I think a session with Penuel and Citizen Concerned in one pod cast discussion dilutions created by the politicians to keep the poor South Africans voting for the criminal politicians
Cultures are different, races are different, values are different. We are inherently different. Diversity, Inclusion and Equity does not work. It was tested out and failed. Only when each group can make their own rules and live in their own societies will they thrive.
I think the forcing together of cultures is just as evil as the forcing apart. Apartheid was inorganic, but so too the status quo. There's a level of forcing that needs to give way to more organicness, where men weigh up men, and not wait for government to bring its low-res scale. Different cultures will always trade, but at the end of a hard day, you want to put your head down in a place you understand culturally, where your physical and metaphysical structures aren't neglected and left to ruin or torn down by those who don't understand why you hold them dear or revere it. We've all bumped our heads enough to know that we need to work together going forward, but so too to know what we don't want, there where we rest and recharge.
Rainbow Nation is a real, genuinely achievable dream. What is trying to be forced by governing elite though, that is NOT rainbow anything, that is straight up design to sow tension and division, divide and conquer tactics to stay in power, feed their selfish lusts for wealth etc. Different cultures (culture not 'race') living in different communities is not racism or tribalism or discrimination or any of that. Allowing different cultures their own spaces is respect and understanding for ALL, it is a show of wanting everyone able to be themselves, in one nation, WITHOUT stepping on eachothers cultural beliefs and traditions. By forcing cultures to co-habitat the same small community areas etc you create furnance for tension, for conflict, as you inevitably, always end up in a situation where cultures will clash, and you left with a situation where one culture is given status over others, just plain fact, which is usually the more vocal, more aggressive culture, culture more willing to 'fight', pushing the softer ones out. That some areas have better schools, better uni, better whatever to this day, after 30 yrs, is a failure of present government at this point now. Many previous governments, both locally and abroad achieved FAR more with less, both in resources and time.
A topic that concerns all South Africans to be discussed please “Unemployment especially youth unemployment is a ticking time bom” How can the citizens and business help to improve this as our government seems unable to address this problem.
The ANC government received a glass half full standing on a well-structured foundation. All they had to do was to slowly build upon it in a structured way. Unfortunately, the glass was emptied and the foundation broken down over the past 30 years due to greed, theft, corruption and mismanagement. This caused that we, irrespective of colour, lost respect for each other and for the law. This reignited racism fuelled by the Julius Malema's and Jacob Zuma's of this world. To keep on blaming each other will never get us anywhere and as Peneul stated us to get back to respecting each other. The Rainbow Nation has become a pipedream.
It is indeed necessary to address concerns surrounding "being South African." However, I would caution against ignoring or underplaying the power of the post-World War II consensus that still seeks to dismantle all forms of nationalism and invalidate any independent norm-forming communities. This influential post-World War II consensus has dismantled communities worldwide under the pretext of eradicating nationalism, resulting in atomized individuals who, unable to develop into genuinely social and loving beings, end up seeking to be worshipped by all individuals because their sexuality, race, claims on wealth, and other personal traits and behaviours are now their religion and their gods.
Invite people in the comments section to say one thing about their perception of other groups/cultures. I will start by asking why a lot (not all ) of black people seem to be soft on corruption.
29:12 - 31:06 We have to fully acknowledge the problem and its cause before we could even hope to solve it. Fatherlessness isn't inherently a cultural thing amongst black people, Ernst. Colonialists were very intentional about separating fathers from their families, either through labour or jail. Same thing was done in the states during chattal slavery. The slave masters were intentional in tearing down families because most black fathers (present fathers)are actually strong fathers, who tolerate very little, and always impart strength and knowledge unto their children. This is why the breaking down of black family units was a priority for the colonists. Now there's a whole new culture of Fatherlessness cause most black men haven't grown up with their fathers and have no blueprint to follow on what it takes to be a present father. A real father, due to external factors, social or economical. Before colonization, the idea of a father abandoning his children was unheard of. Unfathomable, one might say. Black family units were strong, because they were linked to clan lineage.
The Rainbow nation is nonsense. We are different tribes with vastly different cultures BUT we want similar things. Thus, a federal state would be best. Central government works towards what we all want - jobs, decent healthcare, quality education, safety - while we build our own communities according to our different cultures.
What are these people even talking about?SA is working just fine.Everybody and every country has it own problems.Problems are what makes life worth living.
If you approach your job like Gayton you can only move forward. If you approach the job like Malema, you end up being a hater and breaker and very alone
Yes, because according to the Bible, God created boundaries for nations: ' Acts 17:26 "From one man he created all the nations throughout the whole earth. He decided beforehand when they should rise and fall, and He determined their boundaries". Deuteronomy 32:8 "When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of men, he fixed the bounds of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God". The Bible also states clearly that God established boundaries for Israel as a community, including ceremonial, moral, and social/civil boundaries." We will never be successful as long as people deny God's Will and purpose for nations, instead build Towers of Babel.
You clearly don't understand it. Since you bring up Acts. Acts 10:34 King James Version 34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: Are YOU aware what chapter 10 is ALL about? How about Acts 2? and Acts 19?
Wow you spoke for an hour and failed to define what the rainbow nation actually is, what a singular South African identity actually is and then failed to come with any real solutions on how to create these?
Congratulations best discussion i have heard in a long time sober and in structive thank you
Absolutely love Penuel!! 😊
One of the most constructive chats I have seen in a long time.
My word! I could watch these two upstanding gentlemen talk for hours and hours about a rock and I wont be dissapointed. On a serious note,we really need these types of conversations, instead of blaming each other for our own issues.
Great great conversation! Thank you guys.
Respect speaks loud... love speaks louder.
God bless you both 🕯🕯⚘🍁💕
I firmly believe we can be proud of our individual culture without looking down on others, to me it's a sign of weakness if you can't be proud of your own culture without belittling others. I was brought up Afrikaans so that is my culture, having hard time from my Portuguese in laws. But I stand my ground
I have always considered the 'Rainbow Nation' concept to mean how Ernst interprets it here. There was never going to be one single South African culture - the very point of it is the freedom to be yourself in a diverse nation. Awesome episode, thank you.
As a boer in Europe, I am proud of the different cultures in SA, explaining it to other countries. Sadly the racist politicians make sure this doesn't happen in SA
Open minds lead to open acceptance of other cultures & communities. From Maslows hierarchy of needs, respect for others, respect by others, this is the only way we will overcome our differences. God speed.
EXCELLENT excellent coversation!!!
What a breath of fresh air . Great conversation.
Two of my favourite people - both wise and both real.
What you gents are doing here is what is needed in this country, honest hard truths without emotional baggage. This kind of mutual respect for each other gives me hope for this country. Well done.
Goeie gesprek en baie insiggewend. Penuel het vanaf 49:49 punt-vir-punt die oplossing tot ons probleme uitgelig. Sy raad is op almal van toepassing.
There is a lot of truth in this conversation... Especially the analysis about us as African and South African💯and its sad 🥹. But I do believe in one SA if everyone ( black & white)is willing and put effort, I also think blacks are more willing than white... Stand to be corrected 🙏
UITSTEKENDE GESPREK !! Dankie julle ❤
I've been following Pen on RUclips
Me too
Here for penuel the black pen 🙏 great conversation btw
Oh my gosh, why aren't the so called policians as intelligent and truthful as Penuel and even Katlego in Citizens Concerned? Penuel really had an amazing conversation with the extremely informative and well balanced host! Thank you Ernest Roets, I've always loved your podcasts❤❤ Go Roets, Go Penuel❤
Now we talking!
Great discussion between two open minds. Skills? Professionalism? Unknown meaning for most today's "positioned" leaders. Cognitive abilities not there. Not just SA...
Concept of equality as "all the same" general interpretation is devaluating everything positive various civilizations achieved
🤔
White and black conservatives must unite.
Fantastic conversation guys👏
Thank you Ernst and Penuel. I think a session with Penuel and Citizen Concerned in one pod cast discussion dilutions created by the politicians to keep the poor South Africans voting for the criminal politicians
This is the solution. We need good ppl from both sides to have the talk one on one. We need perspective.
2:33 The data bundles are finished😂😂😂 Het nou lekker gelag👌
Amazing conversation!! You could have gone on for hours and I would still be listening.
Damn Mr Penuel is sharp as a tack
True, I had a guy from Zim that could build like a wizard. Built my whole house with his skills . I would hire him again tomorrow. Skills !
ANC catastrophically failed the youth of the new South Africa. They should have instilled family and education in our next generation.
Cultures are different, races are different, values are different. We are inherently different. Diversity, Inclusion and Equity does not work. It was tested out and failed.
Only when each group can make their own rules and live in their own societies will they thrive.
So you sit on the fence and go with the flow.
The only thing that goes with the flow is dead fish.
I think the forcing together of cultures is just as evil as the forcing apart. Apartheid was inorganic, but so too the status quo. There's a level of forcing that needs to give way to more organicness, where men weigh up men, and not wait for government to bring its low-res scale.
Different cultures will always trade, but at the end of a hard day, you want to put your head down in a place you understand culturally, where your physical and metaphysical structures aren't neglected and left to ruin or torn down by those who don't understand why you hold them dear or revere it. We've all bumped our heads enough to know that we need to work together going forward, but so too to know what we don't want, there where we rest and recharge.
loved it & please more :)
Well done gents 👌🙏
Rainbow Nation is a real, genuinely achievable dream.
What is trying to be forced by governing elite though, that is NOT rainbow anything, that is straight up design to sow tension and division, divide and conquer tactics to stay in power, feed their selfish lusts for wealth etc.
Different cultures (culture not 'race') living in different communities is not racism or tribalism or discrimination or any of that. Allowing different cultures their own spaces is respect and understanding for ALL, it is a show of wanting everyone able to be themselves, in one nation, WITHOUT stepping on eachothers cultural beliefs and traditions.
By forcing cultures to co-habitat the same small community areas etc you create furnance for tension, for conflict, as you inevitably, always end up in a situation where cultures will clash, and you left with a situation where one culture is given status over others, just plain fact, which is usually the more vocal, more aggressive culture, culture more willing to 'fight', pushing the softer ones out.
That some areas have better schools, better uni, better whatever to this day, after 30 yrs, is a failure of present government at this point now. Many previous governments, both locally and abroad achieved FAR more with less, both in resources and time.
I want to braai with you two gents
In my opinion the politician who carries the most trauma from his past is Lesufi. He will be a “remskoen” in building a peaceful SA.
And Helen Zile
A topic that concerns all South Africans to be discussed please “Unemployment especially youth unemployment is a ticking time bom” How can the citizens and business help to improve this as our government seems unable to address this problem.
I would have enjoyed a lot more *interrogation* from both sides
The ANC government received a glass half full standing on a well-structured foundation. All they had to do was to slowly build upon it in a structured way. Unfortunately, the glass was emptied and the foundation broken down over the past 30 years due to greed, theft, corruption and mismanagement. This caused that we, irrespective of colour, lost respect for each other and for the law. This reignited racism fuelled by the Julius Malema's and Jacob Zuma's of this world. To keep on blaming each other will never get us anywhere and as Peneul stated us to get back to respecting each other. The Rainbow Nation has become a pipedream.
It is indeed necessary to address concerns surrounding "being South African." However, I would caution against ignoring or underplaying the power of the post-World War II consensus that still seeks to dismantle all forms of nationalism and invalidate any independent norm-forming communities. This influential post-World War II consensus has dismantled communities worldwide under the pretext of eradicating nationalism, resulting in atomized individuals who, unable to develop into genuinely social and loving beings, end up seeking to be worshipped by all individuals because their sexuality, race, claims on wealth, and other personal traits and behaviours are now their religion and their gods.
🎉
If only Anc and their associates can leave the laziness behind; hiding behind the race card😢
Invite people in the comments section to say one thing about their perception of other groups/cultures. I will start by asking why a lot (not all ) of black people seem to be soft on corruption.
Wonderlike gesprek so jammer daar is so min daarvan geen eensydigheid en agresie nie ongelooflik dankie
Can we have these nice talks after we have addressed the Land Question?
😂 don't start
Penuel must never talk about land again. This topic is out of his reach, akayeke 😭😭
All those who seriously want land they get easily. But those who see land question as a political tool to get votes will cry for land forever.
Pen man's up, when wrong he takes it on the nose, cries and gets over it quick,
❤true...rather be alone as to be with the wrong ppl...the hate for white ppl are to strong😢❤️💔❤️🩹
Divide and rule
29:12 - 31:06
We have to fully acknowledge the problem and its cause before we could even hope to solve it.
Fatherlessness isn't inherently a cultural thing amongst black people, Ernst. Colonialists were very intentional about separating fathers from their families, either through labour or jail.
Same thing was done in the states during chattal slavery. The slave masters were intentional in tearing down families because most black fathers (present fathers)are actually strong fathers, who tolerate very little, and always impart strength and knowledge unto their children.
This is why the breaking down of black family units was a priority for the colonists.
Now there's a whole new culture of Fatherlessness cause most black men haven't grown up with their fathers and have no blueprint to follow on what it takes to be a present father. A real father, due to external factors, social or economical.
Before colonization, the idea of a father abandoning his children was unheard of. Unfathomable, one might say.
Black family units were strong, because they were linked to clan lineage.
Settler meets sellout 🤐😱
The Rainbow nation is nonsense. We are different tribes with vastly different cultures BUT we want similar things. Thus, a federal state would be best. Central government works towards what we all want - jobs, decent healthcare, quality education, safety - while we build our own communities according to our different cultures.
I think it's an illusions..specially with the likes of mkp eff anc act and some others.. we out numbered im afraid
Nothing will work unless you do
What are these people even talking about?SA is working just fine.Everybody and every country has it own problems.Problems are what makes life worth living.
Increased complexity = Increased cognitive dissonance (Social awareness inertia)
If you approach your job like Gayton you can only move forward. If you approach the job like Malema, you end up being a hater and breaker and very alone
Yes, because according to the Bible, God created boundaries for nations:
' Acts 17:26
"From one man he created all the nations throughout the whole earth. He decided beforehand when they should rise and fall, and He determined their boundaries".
Deuteronomy 32:8
"When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of men, he fixed the bounds of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God".
The Bible also states clearly that God established boundaries for Israel as a community, including ceremonial, moral, and social/civil boundaries."
We will never be successful as long as people deny God's Will and purpose for nations, instead build Towers of Babel.
You clearly don't understand it.
Since you bring up Acts.
Acts 10:34
King James Version
34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
Are YOU aware what chapter 10 is ALL about?
How about Acts 2? and Acts 19?
Rainbow nation was a scam
It's not a pipe dream it's delusional
Wow you spoke for an hour and failed to define what the rainbow nation actually is, what a singular South African identity actually is and then failed to come with any real solutions on how to create these?
This is y I don't like This sellout
I WORK ALL THE HOMELANDS! WHILE! SPONSORED!😢 ORANIA DID IT!!
!! WHY YOU DO NOT STEP UP!
The masses are going to be so triggered by this 😂