Including a programming tutorial with home computers was brilliant… my Amstrad CPC 6128 came with one, and this changed my life (interests and career). Times have changed. Even though RUclips has a ton more info than the 1 book you got back then, you also did not have any distractions. As a kid you stared at your new computer and its manual, and chances are that you learned to program. Special times
Learned programming with _Getting Started With Color BASIC_ and _Getting Started With Extended Color BASIC_ for the CoCo. Those books were really well done (and a lot of fun!).
Yup i also feel old now its 40 years ago! Playing Raid over Moscow after 15 minutes loading using the tape recorder. I saved my pocket and birthday money to buy an additional 1451 diskdrive. Using a diskette punch device you could use your 5 1/4" floppy disk on both sides. Later i even bought the 1451 Mk2 (square one) so you could copy floppy disks even faster.
@@obelic71 Re: _Raid over Moscow_ That was the one with the space planes (shown as dots/sprites over the arc of the Earth) as one phase of the game, right? Also, was that the same game as _Rush 'n Attack_ ?
@@alexhajnal107 yes at first you had to get your aircraft out of the hangar out of the space station, then fly to the launch site of the ICBM's to destroy the site, then you went to Moscow to get into the kremlin to destroy the robot who did feed the reactor core. If you destroyed the robot the ICBM's were destroyed.
Commodore and Atari were hampered by Tramiel's pissing off retailers, and his habit of holding payments way past deadlines meant that parts suppliers didn't want to work with them either. Commodore of course could have fixed this with a good leadership team, but that was definitely not what they had. Only Rattigan was actually competent, so obviously Gould got rid of him. Ali was an absolute joke, and he was just going to fleece what he could, and Gould's reputation meant that no good CEO would ever take that job. Commodore still had a great brand recognition at the end, yet even the bankruptcy was such a disaster that it just became a trashy yard sale.
Of all the Presidents Commodore had post Jack, Thomas Rattigan was actually the best, because under his direction, that Amigas ACTUALLY started selling in numbers, with the decision to spilt the Amiga into one model for the home market, and one for the higher end (Amiga 500 and Amiga 2000). But was pushed out of company because of a possible power play Rattigan attempted to gain control of the company (Mehdi Ali had a hand on his removal, as he was hired as a consultant). To be fair to the Amiga CD32, the hardware is pretty god for the game console, because it's really just a console version Amiga 1200 with a CD player. The CD32 was actually selling pretty ok in Europe, but because of supply issues (mainly because of lack of money), they could never make and sell the amount needed to help keep the company afloat. Doesn't help that Commodore was being extremely cheap, and didn't pay for patent royalties for some patents used the CD32, leading to Commodore being banned banned from bringing the CD32 into the US. Additionally, I just want to point out that the Amigas has the ability to run Mac OS at speed, or faster then the Macs of the day, while still running it's own OS, ruclips.net/video/8v4BaWwoyA0/видео.htmlsi=htmtT98V4HY2iZRt ruclips.net/video/Jph0gxzL3UI/видео.htmlsi=3bOfd_qd2H8O1L3s
It happens in many forms, throughout history. Winning the war, winning an empire, rising to the top, being #1 as hard as it was, turned out to be incredibly easy as compared to holding on to the #1 spot, maintaining the empire and preventing its collapse. Many leaders or people are not prepared for what comes after victory.
I keep learning something new about non-railroad companies thanks to your branched out videos. Keep up the good work! If you’re looking for more computer companies, may I suggest looking up Coleco? From what I understand, they used to produce toys, like those Cabbage Patch dolls, but they did in fact also make computers towards their end, like the Colacovision video game console.
18:50 _"… plus the affordability of their products …"_ On screen: the 1541 floppy drive, costing ⅔ as much as the C64 itself! [ The 1541 is pretty neat though, being essentially a second, albeit stripped-down and memory-restricted, C64 dedicated solely to disk I/O. IIRC, some enterprising individuals hacked it using software alone into working as a general-purpose coprocessor/second processor. ]
I was an Atari ST fan, back in '86 when I bought mine. But not so much anymore, since I learned that it was mostly a vengeance project by Jack Tramiel against Irving Gold.
I liked mine (especially the m68k CPU at its core) but the designs really stagnated. The few improvements they offered were very minor for the most part. When they released the TT it was out of most people's reach (got mine used, direct from Atari when they were shutting down). With the TT they were targeting the professional workstation market and while one could treat/use the TT as an _über-ST_ (I did) it was really intended for running Unix.
My first computer was a Commodore Plus 4. A bit of an in-between machine. Compatible with C16 but before the C64. I’m still playing games 40 years later so it did something right.
@@vinceely2906 The Plus/4 and C16 actually came out AFTER the C64. They were supposed to be cost reduced machines to compete with the Sinclair Spectrum, but by the time they came out there was no real cost savings to be had -- just building and distributing the machine was the bulk of the cost vs the chips they saved on.
C64 omg i used that system till it fell apart in the late 90's! I vividly remember that a Commodore assembly plant in Europe (UK or Germany) burned to the ground causing a severe supply shortage in Europe. All the major networks reported for weeks daily over it. My and other C64's who were on order couldn't be deliverd for at least 6 months due to the fire! I and other kids who ordered one were totaly devestated. So when after 2 months i was informed that i was one of the lucky ones to get a C64 out of a batch original build for the US/Canadian market i was super happy. That batch of C64's had a total different powersupply as al other C64's because it was converted from US to European specs.
Where the commodore got edged out was by very advanced word processing typewriters of the mid 80s. Both the working professional and the average family desperate wanted basic word processing functions. But computers were expensive and worst of all VERY hard to use! Even the easier ones like Commodore were still pretty complex to learn. Word processors are truly forgotten and it's a shame because they were a big part of daily life for so long and bridged the gap between mere typewriters and computers. They likely urged computer companies to make basic systems like Word or Apple's now defunct Word Perfect so easy to use they're almost impossible to screw up.
The first computer I played around on was either a Radio Shack TRS-80 Model III or a Brazilian clone of that computer Prologica CP-500. The first computer I actually owned was a TI 99/4A that I got nearly 41 years ago. My second was a Commodore Amiga 2000HD.
The Amiga 300T with a Video Toaster was a great video processing platform around Y2K. I wanted one but since I had a Macintosh Plus and a young child I couldn't justify it.
When the C64 was first being shown at trade shows, people said that there wasn't anything in there that was revolutionary, which was true, but they couldn't figure out how they could sell it for $600. Owning your own chip plant helps.
Look up videos about the Commodore brand name trademark. Quite a crazy (and ongoing) story My Amiga was the CDTV, although I mainly used it as a 500, with the disk drive, mouse and keyboard. One cool thing was that the CDTV had built-in MIDI connectors. I hooked up a keyboard controller and had fun triggering pitches samples with Oktalyzer, a tracker. A friend built me an 8 bit sampler box. Anyway! Fond memories, although the CDTV titles were not good at all. The best one might have been an encyclopedia. Thanks again!!
I had a Commodore VIC-20 complete with tape drive, then a Commodore C-16. I wanted an Amiga but then had my head turned by consoles and ended up buying a Sega Mega-Drive (Genesis) instead.
Ohh I suggested this in one of your recent videos! I’ll take credit for the idea 😂 j/k I bet you have a list. Can’t wait to watch this! As always, thank you so much
Fun fact: the C64 versions of the original Elite (released in 1985, one year after the original BBC Micro version) was the first one to use the Blue Danube Waltz in homage to 2001: A Space Odyssey.
13:40 _"in Germany it was the VC-20"_ They dropped the *I* since in German the *V* is pronounced like an *F.* If they'd kept the *I* it would have sounded like *FICK-20,* I'll let you guess what that word means in English.
13:00 The ZX Spectrum came out an entire FIVE YEARS after the Commodore PET. You simply cannot directly compare their price points because of that. 🤷 (Computers and computer parts were DRAMATICALLY CHEAPER in 1982 than they were in 1977.)
Imagine a company run by people who hated their own customers. That was Commodore under Irving Gould and Medhi Ali. There were plenty of good people in Commodore desperately trying to do the right thing, like Dave Haynie. But you couldn't do much with those two IDIOTS at the top.
I see your talking shit about my best childhood friend, The Commodore 64. Prepare to throw hands... Long live ESI...Eagle Soft Inc. (If you know, you KNOW)
You completely missed out the impact of the Amiga 500, particularly in Europe, and how it destroyed Jack Tramiel's Atari ST sales. Also, you said the CD32 was a terrible console - actually it was considered a fantastic console at the time, but the reason sales were low was because Commodore was on the verge of bankruptcy and they couldn't get enough components to build the numbers they needed. It could have saved Commodore, but it was killed at birth. I'm really disappointed in this video - I thought it would fill in the gaps, but it left way more gaps than it filled.
Sinclair was squeezed out by PCs. The only home computer company that survived the IBM/Microsoft take over was Apple. Amstrad, who bought Sinclair, made PCs. They went under as good quality brands reduced in price. There was no market for cheap design. Commodore was seen as more of a gaming machine and was destroyed by the consoles on one side and the PCs on the other. Had they ploughed money into R&D and concentrated on a gaming console they would have survived.
I have a objection that CD32 was auwfull. It launched 1993. same year as 3DO, Sega X32 and jaguar. CD32 have a 14Mhz with a scalarity of 0.5 and 2MB of combined memory (And like 32kB of additional buffer) 3DO a 12.5Mhz processor with a scalarity of 0.67 and 3MB of ram. X32 have a 23Mhz processor with a scalarity of ~1, and 0.5MB of ram Jaguar have a 26Mhz CPU with a scalarity close to 1 and 2MB of ram. its also worth saying that both the 3DO and the X32 was consideraly more expensive than the CD32 (considering you needed both a megadrive and a CD drive to the X32, and the unit it self was quite costly). The Jaguar was quite a bit cheaper, but it also lacked the CD player. The main contender., sega, nintendo and sony was a bit better, but also launched later. Sega was launched 18 month after CD32, and 26 month later in Europe. It had a 28Mhz CPU with a scalability of just under 1 and 4½MB of memory. Sony was launched in the same time frame as the sega but with a 33Mhz CPU scalarity of just under 1 and 3½MB of memory. The nintendo was launched more than 3 years later (basically half a cycle) 94Mhz CPU with a scalarity of just under 1. Worth saying is that X32, Jaguar, saturn, Playstation and N64 all used a Mips processor or a Hitachi clone of the same processor. Nintendo used one with a newer CPU with slightly longer pipline, hence higher core speed, but still only a scalar design. 3DO used a ARM CPU, and CD32 useda a 68k derivative. Worth saying that a lot of 4th gen consoles used 68k CPU, but the one in CD32 was 2 generations newer. This may make it sound like the CD32 was just as fast, or just slightly slower than the competition. And that is sort of true. CD32 had a hardwired very fast Grapics chip that could do sprites in almost arbitrary size and a lot of other effects. This is also true for the 3DO (while the grapics chip was quite a bit slower). All the other systems, including the 32X used a standard programmable DSP, but they was programmed by a secondary CPU. Basically a GPU. in 2D this was not really any better than what CD32 could offer. but when it came to 3D the CPU+DSP mix had a quite significant edge. CD32 had a added DSP that could be used for 3D, but it was powered from the main CPU. The issue here is not really the brute power, but the availability of interrupts.
What tanked the Jaguar (at least in technical terms) was that it used a heavily-multiprocessor design reminiscent of the PS1 (IIRC). Lots of [heterogeneous] custom chips that were really good at accelerating sound, graphics, etc. along with a (pretty slow) 68000 that was meant to be used for housekeeping, coordination, and the like. Most programmers though used the 68k to run pretty much all of their games' code.
@@alexhajnal107 Yupp. 68020 could do 1 instruction every second clock, just like a 286 or 386 CPU. IN theory. Some instruction need more clocks. Most RISC CPU can do one instruction per clock. The issue with RISC CPU is that they due to there design typically need more instructions to do the same task, specially if its complex. For just random compiled code, a scalar (1) CISC processor would typically be a bit faster than a RISC, but we talking like 15-20%, so the diffrance is not large. During the mid 90s, RISC CPU Typically had higher core clocks, so they where typically faster. What killed the RISC architecture is that a RISC CPU is more cache heavy. So when Cashing and bandwidth become a problem in late 90s, the CISC architecture just pulled away. For mobile devices where cash and memory is closer to the core, this is less so a problem and RISC still have a power to predominance adavantage.
@@alexhajnal107 Almost all the gen 5 consolles worh the same way. They had a MIPS or Hitatchi processor (that is basically a MIPS clone) as a main CPU, than a secondary MIPS or Hitachi processor as a graphic slave CPU. Most of them had basically the same CPU as main CPU and GPU slave. Both the X32 and the Saturn use two SH-2 CPU at 23 and 29Mhz (for respective console). Saturn also used a 3rd SH-1 as additional controller. X32 used the M68k from the megadrive and the Saturn had a additional M68k as well. X32 had a additional DSP and Saturn had 2 clocked at the same core as the main processors. The Jaguar have two "custom" RISC CPU, in reality its just a clone MIPS CPU, just like the SH-2 at 27Mhz, and a additional M68k CPU. The two CPU works the same way as on the saturn and the X32, one main CPU and one Grapical processor feeding a DSP at the same core clock as the other two processors. Effectivly Jaguar, X32 and Saturn all work the exact same way. Saturn just have one more processor and one more DSP. PS1 have a MIPS R3000A CPU, that is basically the CPU the SH-2 is a clone of, running at 33Mhz. PS1 have a costum chip running at 33Mhz with a integrated CPU (probobly a R3000, but its not offical) with a built in DSP. PS1 work exactly like a X32 or Jaguar, part from the lack of M68k and the DSP is now integrated with the secondary CPU. N64 have a NEC VR4300 CPU that is a MIPS 4000 series licences by NEC. If the R3000 series is a 486 33Mhz, the R4000 series is a 486DX4 100MHz. It also have 64 bit register, but its not a true full 64 bit CPU (or rather, the VR4300 is not, the true R4000 series have support for full 64 bit processing). The GPU of the N64 uses the same setup as the PS1. Its not known exactly what it is, but it uses the same instruction as the main processor so its probobly some fork of a R4000 or possibly R3000 series CPU. It may be a R3000 becasue the core clock is only 63Mhz, the only gen 5 console that have a slower GPU than CPU. On the other hand it have a 8 piple vector DSP built in, so it have very high performance, but its very ram and cache starved. So the two processor setup with a conected DSP was very standard for that generation. And this is basically how a GPU works to this day. Jaguar was first with the concept on the console. but the core concept predate Jaguar with like a decade and was used on professional workstations already in the 80s.
@@matsv201 _"68020 could do 1 instruction every second clock"_ On the 68000 it was 4 to 6 clocks (16-bit Word or 32-bit Long, respectively) for basic instructions, complex ones and ones hitting memory took longer. _"RISC CPU … typically need more instructions to do the same task"_ Somewhat mitigated by much simpler decode and scheduling circuitry. One big advantage that RISC has is that it can have much larger register sets than CISC due to the smaller number of opcode encodings leaving more room in the instruction words for register numbers. With x86 this was partially worked-around via arbitrarily-sized instructions (which brought multiple penalties); the 68k exclusively had single-word instructions (ignoring the address Long when applicable) but its smaller suite of instructions [citation needed] left more room for register specification within the opcode (4 bits for the 8 D and 8 A registers). Still, CISC chips usually had far fewer registers than the 31+ typical of RISC chips. [Re: 31+ registers not 32+ Having one register, conventionally R0, always read as 0 and discard on write allows many additional instructions to be synthesized, e.g. the pseudo-op BNZ Rn, ADDR could generate CMP Rn, R0; BNE ADDR. Likewise, the CMP instruction itself could be synthesized from SUB A, B, DEST as SUB A, B, R0. Another one I recall encountering (different architecture) is BRA ADDR being encoded as a BEQ R0, R0, ADDR.]. _"During the mid 90s, RISC CPU Typically had higher core clocks"_ Indeed, for a time the fastest platform for running *x86* Windows software was emulated under NT on Alpha (native code was even faster, natch). It was the much simpler circuitry needed to implement RISC instructions that allowed for higher clock speeds (without needing huge pipelines). [Pipelines are their own kettle of worms.] re: Cache constraints killing RISC during the 90s I'd say there's more too it than just that. Intel could devote extensive resources to x86 development due to high revenues from PCs and economies of scale. In contrast, the RISC market was highly fragmented which limited the resources that each vendor could devote to chip development. Realizing that they couldn't compete on their own, most of the vendors bet the farm on a common VLIW architecture [Itanium] rather than cooperate on a common RISC architecture (likely due to avoid not-invented-here roadblocks); when that failed the survivors switched to x86-64 as that was all that was left. It goes without saying though that RISC [ARM and MIPS, now also RISC-V] did find a highly successful niche in the embedded and low power/mobile spaces. Hasn't seen too much success in (relatively) high performance computing although that's been improving recently.
11:30 Calculators just couldn't evolve anymore? At the time this theory was correct but by the 90s calculators were becoming extremely advanced, doing many things computers could do and many things we rely on smart phone doing today. Eventually these would evolve into the PDA which would evolve into the smart phone.
Nope. not on facebook, I killed that account over 10 years ago. But am listening to you while playing doom 2. Still got them old floppies for doom 1 and cdrom for doom 2 :D
most business's fail business they either get sold or different management takes over they start doing things different cause company to fail. electronics costed more back then can't say back then money verses today money.
Great script and well researched, thanks. Please consider having someone else read it, though. Preferably someone with a neutral accent, better tone and more gravitas? Had to give up after 15 mins. Shame because this is well put together with good images.
Im glad youve gotten some sponsors, your a great channel, but can i get a thumbs up from people who deliberatly never buy anything ive seen in a ad on youtube?
During the C64 era a Amiga 1000 was a super expensive rare computer. i still remember i played north and south at an Amiga 1000 at a friends house. ruclips.net/video/-S2QbzVvTXE/видео.html
You don’t know all the story of Commodore, specially Amiga line. You need investigate more instead talking badly of the Amiga. It was the really first you call computer. The Amiga was used in discos, bars, in Hollywood for movies… the first park Jurassic used the Amiga, Robocop used the Amiga, Babylon 5 used the Amiga… slots of movies… and the Amiga hardware was years ahead from any consoles and computers between 1985 and 1992…. Go on vacation and try to investigate more about Amiga… but, I recognize that you try to do the best in this video
Go to surfshark.com/inthedark for 4 extra months of Surfshark at unbeatable price!
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Including a programming tutorial with home computers was brilliant… my Amstrad CPC 6128 came with one, and this changed my life (interests and career). Times have changed. Even though RUclips has a ton more info than the 1 book you got back then, you also did not have any distractions. As a kid you stared at your new computer and its manual, and chances are that you learned to program. Special times
Learned programming with _Getting Started With Color BASIC_ and _Getting Started With Extended Color BASIC_ for the CoCo. Those books were really well done (and a lot of fun!).
I remember playing on a Commodore computer in school.
Wow. Suddenly I feel old.
Yup i also feel old now its 40 years ago!
Playing Raid over Moscow after 15 minutes loading using the tape recorder.
I saved my pocket and birthday money to buy an additional 1451 diskdrive.
Using a diskette punch device you could use your 5 1/4" floppy disk on both sides.
Later i even bought the 1451 Mk2 (square one) so you could copy floppy disks even faster.
@@obelic71 Re: _Raid over Moscow_ That was the one with the space planes (shown as dots/sprites over the arc of the Earth) as one phase of the game, right? Also, was that the same game as _Rush 'n Attack_ ?
@@alexhajnal107 yes at first you had to get your aircraft out of the hangar out of the space station, then fly to the launch site of the ICBM's to destroy the site, then you went to Moscow to get into the kremlin to destroy the robot who did feed the reactor core.
If you destroyed the robot the ICBM's were destroyed.
Commodore and Atari were hampered by Tramiel's pissing off retailers, and his habit of holding payments way past deadlines meant that parts suppliers didn't want to work with them either. Commodore of course could have fixed this with a good leadership team, but that was definitely not what they had. Only Rattigan was actually competent, so obviously Gould got rid of him. Ali was an absolute joke, and he was just going to fleece what he could, and Gould's reputation meant that no good CEO would ever take that job. Commodore still had a great brand recognition at the end, yet even the bankruptcy was such a disaster that it just became a trashy yard sale.
Of all the Presidents Commodore had post Jack, Thomas Rattigan was actually the best, because under his direction, that Amigas ACTUALLY started selling in numbers, with the decision to spilt the Amiga into one model for the home market, and one for the higher end (Amiga 500 and Amiga 2000). But was pushed out of company because of a possible power play Rattigan attempted to gain control of the company (Mehdi Ali had a hand on his removal, as he was hired as a consultant).
To be fair to the Amiga CD32, the hardware is pretty god for the game console, because it's really just a console version Amiga 1200 with a CD player. The CD32 was actually selling pretty ok in Europe, but because of supply issues (mainly because of lack of money), they could never make and sell the amount needed to help keep the company afloat. Doesn't help that Commodore was being extremely cheap, and didn't pay for patent royalties for some patents used the CD32, leading to Commodore being banned banned from bringing the CD32 into the US.
Additionally, I just want to point out that the Amigas has the ability to run Mac OS at speed, or faster then the Macs of the day, while still running it's own OS,
ruclips.net/video/8v4BaWwoyA0/видео.htmlsi=htmtT98V4HY2iZRt
ruclips.net/video/Jph0gxzL3UI/видео.htmlsi=3bOfd_qd2H8O1L3s
It happens in many forms, throughout history. Winning the war, winning an empire, rising to the top, being #1 as hard as it was, turned out to be incredibly easy as compared to holding on to the #1 spot, maintaining the empire and preventing its collapse. Many leaders or people are not prepared for what comes after victory.
I keep learning something new about non-railroad companies thanks to your branched out videos. Keep up the good work!
If you’re looking for more computer companies, may I suggest looking up Coleco? From what I understand, they used to produce toys, like those Cabbage Patch dolls, but they did in fact also make computers towards their end, like the Colacovision video game console.
Ah the Adam. An _interesting_ design. Oddly it was considered highly desirable at the time (and then it was gone).
18:50 _"… plus the affordability of their products …"_
On screen: the 1541 floppy drive, costing ⅔ as much as the C64 itself!
[ The 1541 is pretty neat though, being essentially a second, albeit stripped-down and memory-restricted, C64 dedicated solely to disk I/O. IIRC, some enterprising individuals hacked it using software alone into working as a general-purpose coprocessor/second processor. ]
Okay, you called me out. I'm not watching the video. You're actually in my pocket while I'm doing yard work.....
@@Hex_Dex Hey, I often listen to RUclips videos while working outside.
I was an Atari ST fan, back in '86 when I bought mine. But not so much anymore, since I learned that it was mostly a vengeance project by Jack Tramiel against Irving Gold.
I liked mine (especially the m68k CPU at its core) but the designs really stagnated. The few improvements they offered were very minor for the most part. When they released the TT it was out of most people's reach (got mine used, direct from Atari when they were shutting down). With the TT they were targeting the professional workstation market and while one could treat/use the TT as an _über-ST_ (I did) it was really intended for running Unix.
Shockingly, I've never used a Commodore 64. My first computer was a 286. I feel like that's what ultimately killed them, was the IBM compatibles.
My first computer was a Commodore Plus 4. A bit of an in-between machine. Compatible with C16 but before the C64. I’m still playing games 40 years later so it did something right.
Ditto for Atari. Went through a series of STs, then a TT030. When Atari tanked I switched to a PC running Linux.
@@vinceely2906 The Plus/4 and C16 actually came out AFTER the C64. They were supposed to be cost reduced machines to compete with the Sinclair Spectrum, but by the time they came out there was no real cost savings to be had -- just building and distributing the machine was the bulk of the cost vs the chips they saved on.
@@NozomuYumeI had a plus 4 and the family computer was a 64, dad had a 128, the games on the plus 4 we had were better.
Are you gonna die with the Commodore? Cause the Commodore Is gonna die with you! Lmao that ad never aged well now but catchy tune though
C64 omg i used that system till it fell apart in the late 90's!
I vividly remember that a Commodore assembly plant in Europe (UK or Germany) burned to the ground causing a severe supply shortage in Europe.
All the major networks reported for weeks daily over it.
My and other C64's who were on order couldn't be deliverd for at least 6 months due to the fire! I and other kids who ordered one were totaly devestated.
So when after 2 months i was informed that i was one of the lucky ones to get a C64 out of a batch original build for the US/Canadian market i was super happy.
That batch of C64's had a total different powersupply as al other C64's because it was converted from US to European specs.
Where the commodore got edged out was by very advanced word processing typewriters of the mid 80s. Both the working professional and the average family desperate wanted basic word processing functions. But computers were expensive and worst of all VERY hard to use! Even the easier ones like Commodore were still pretty complex to learn. Word processors are truly forgotten and it's a shame because they were a big part of daily life for so long and bridged the gap between mere typewriters and computers. They likely urged computer companies to make basic systems like Word or Apple's now defunct Word Perfect so easy to use they're almost impossible to screw up.
I used to work with Commodore Canada's VP of sales. The stories he would tell...
The first computer I played around on was either a Radio Shack TRS-80 Model III or a Brazilian clone of that computer Prologica CP-500. The first computer I actually owned was a TI 99/4A that I got nearly 41 years ago. My second was a Commodore Amiga 2000HD.
Carolco Pictures video, please?
24:58 Third monitor FTW!
25:20 Linux/X11 FTW!
25:00 that's funny you mention that, as I was playing Forge of Empires at that moment while listening to you.
The Amiga 300T with a Video Toaster was a great video processing platform around Y2K. I wanted one but since I had a Macintosh Plus and a young child I couldn't justify it.
When the C64 was first being shown at trade shows, people said that there wasn't anything in there that was revolutionary, which was true, but they couldn't figure out how they could sell it for $600. Owning your own chip plant helps.
Look up videos about the Commodore brand name trademark. Quite a crazy (and ongoing) story
My Amiga was the CDTV, although I mainly used it as a 500, with the disk drive, mouse and keyboard. One cool thing was that the CDTV had built-in MIDI connectors. I hooked up a keyboard controller and had fun triggering pitches samples with Oktalyzer, a tracker. A friend built me an 8 bit sampler box. Anyway! Fond memories, although the CDTV titles were not good at all. The best one might have been an encyclopedia. Thanks again!!
Hey look at that! A sponsor!! Nice... Movin on up! 👍
Banger after banger after banger! Thank you, sir!
Please cover the Texas Instruments PCs at some point?
These videos are excellent on the weekend. By the way sir: your music selection in this one is impeccable
Commodore (my first computer was a C64) and K-Mart (where my parents bought my C64) are both no longer around. That makes me so sad. 😢
I had a Commodore VIC-20 complete with tape drive, then a Commodore C-16. I wanted an Amiga but then had my head turned by consoles and ended up buying a Sega Mega-Drive (Genesis) instead.
Ohh I suggested this in one of your recent videos! I’ll take credit for the idea 😂 j/k I bet you have a list. Can’t wait to watch this! As always, thank you so much
I'd like to think I can be credited for the bit about what tanked the (3rd-party) calculator market.
I had the C128
Liked it quite a bit!
I used my Commode-doot up until college. My instructors loved getting dot-matrix printed assignments they could actually read.
3:55. Shows a "CBM II" series pc, built for serious business use and as a replacement for the PET in the 1980s. HUGE FLOP.
Seems that was the case for pretty much all the 8-bit computer companies who tried that tack. ('cept in Japan, but they were more diversified)
Two ideas:
Atari
Atari oddities (TT030 and Transputer)
Still amazes me how CBM managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
Jack Tramuiel is one of my heroes
Fun fact: the C64 versions of the original Elite (released in 1985, one year after the original BBC Micro version) was the first one to use the Blue Danube Waltz in homage to 2001: A Space Odyssey.
13:40 _"in Germany it was the VC-20"_
They dropped the *I* since in German the *V* is pronounced like an *F.* If they'd kept the *I* it would have sounded like *FICK-20,* I'll let you guess what that word means in English.
And VC was backonym'ed to Volks Computer
Ok I'm gonna do my best Jack Tramiel here: "We make cumpyudahs for de masses, not de classes."
Mac, Dual monitor setup, yep just listening to you while I play solitaire.
I grew up poor. Always wanted a 64
Ah, this brings back some memories.
13:00 The ZX Spectrum came out an entire FIVE YEARS after the Commodore PET. You simply cannot directly compare their price points because of that. 🤷
(Computers and computer parts were DRAMATICALLY CHEAPER in 1982 than they were in 1977.)
ah man, this one is gonna hurt
The Commodore 64 is an brilliant computer 🖥. 😀👍🎮
Imagine a company run by people who hated their own customers. That was Commodore under Irving Gould and Medhi Ali. There were plenty of good people in Commodore desperately trying to do the right thing, like Dave Haynie. But you couldn't do much with those two IDIOTS at the top.
I seen that they re-released the Commodores 64 a few years ago. I'm not really too sure about the specs or anything I just remember hearing about it
25:04 Nope. I am playing Captain of Industry...
I see your talking shit about my best childhood friend, The Commodore 64.
Prepare to throw hands...
Long live ESI...Eagle Soft Inc.
(If you know, you KNOW)
You completely missed out the impact of the Amiga 500, particularly in Europe, and how it destroyed Jack Tramiel's Atari ST sales. Also, you said the CD32 was a terrible console - actually it was considered a fantastic console at the time, but the reason sales were low was because Commodore was on the verge of bankruptcy and they couldn't get enough components to build the numbers they needed. It could have saved Commodore, but it was killed at birth. I'm really disappointed in this video - I thought it would fill in the gaps, but it left way more gaps than it filled.
Sinclair was squeezed out by PCs. The only home computer company that survived the IBM/Microsoft take over was Apple. Amstrad, who bought Sinclair, made PCs. They went under as good quality brands reduced in price. There was no market for cheap design.
Commodore was seen as more of a gaming machine and was destroyed by the consoles on one side and the PCs on the other. Had they ploughed money into R&D and concentrated on a gaming console they would have survived.
And Acorn, who went all-in on their ARM CPU architecture (as a design house/licensor, not as a manufacturer).
@@alexhajnal107 the BBC was an incredible computer.
If you think the cd32 was bad, it had nothing on c64 console that could not play it's pack in title and cdtv
_"could not play it's pack in title"_
Wait, what? Did it require keyboard input or somesuch?
FWIW, Tramiel is pronounced tra-MELL.
I still always read it as tra-MEEL.
@@alexhajnal107 It's Polish. The "I" in Tramiel is silent.
@@ilexgarodan Yea, I know.
Still have mine. Still works.
Back in the day I had a 128 and it was the craze!
Ah....the early days of personal computing. Now, they don't hold a candle to the smartphones of today.
I have a objection that CD32 was auwfull.
It launched 1993. same year as 3DO, Sega X32 and jaguar.
CD32 have a 14Mhz with a scalarity of 0.5 and 2MB of combined memory (And like 32kB of additional buffer)
3DO a 12.5Mhz processor with a scalarity of 0.67 and 3MB of ram.
X32 have a 23Mhz processor with a scalarity of ~1, and 0.5MB of ram
Jaguar have a 26Mhz CPU with a scalarity close to 1 and 2MB of ram.
its also worth saying that both the 3DO and the X32 was consideraly more expensive than the CD32 (considering you needed both a megadrive and a CD drive to the X32, and the unit it self was quite costly). The Jaguar was quite a bit cheaper, but it also lacked the CD player.
The main contender., sega, nintendo and sony was a bit better, but also launched later.
Sega was launched 18 month after CD32, and 26 month later in Europe. It had a 28Mhz CPU with a scalability of just under 1 and 4½MB of memory.
Sony was launched in the same time frame as the sega but with a 33Mhz CPU scalarity of just under 1 and 3½MB of memory.
The nintendo was launched more than 3 years later (basically half a cycle) 94Mhz CPU with a scalarity of just under 1.
Worth saying is that X32, Jaguar, saturn, Playstation and N64 all used a Mips processor or a Hitachi clone of the same processor. Nintendo used one with a newer CPU with slightly longer pipline, hence higher core speed, but still only a scalar design. 3DO used a ARM CPU, and CD32 useda a 68k derivative. Worth saying that a lot of 4th gen consoles used 68k CPU, but the one in CD32 was 2 generations newer.
This may make it sound like the CD32 was just as fast, or just slightly slower than the competition. And that is sort of true. CD32 had a hardwired very fast Grapics chip that could do sprites in almost arbitrary size and a lot of other effects. This is also true for the 3DO (while the grapics chip was quite a bit slower).
All the other systems, including the 32X used a standard programmable DSP, but they was programmed by a secondary CPU. Basically a GPU.
in 2D this was not really any better than what CD32 could offer. but when it came to 3D the CPU+DSP mix had a quite significant edge. CD32 had a added DSP that could be used for 3D, but it was powered from the main CPU.
The issue here is not really the brute power, but the availability of interrupts.
When you say _scalarity_ do you mean instructions dispatched per clock?
What tanked the Jaguar (at least in technical terms) was that it used a heavily-multiprocessor design reminiscent of the PS1 (IIRC). Lots of [heterogeneous] custom chips that were really good at accelerating sound, graphics, etc. along with a (pretty slow) 68000 that was meant to be used for housekeeping, coordination, and the like. Most programmers though used the 68k to run pretty much all of their games' code.
@@alexhajnal107 Yupp. 68020 could do 1 instruction every second clock, just like a 286 or 386 CPU. IN theory. Some instruction need more clocks.
Most RISC CPU can do one instruction per clock. The issue with RISC CPU is that they due to there design typically need more instructions to do the same task, specially if its complex.
For just random compiled code, a scalar (1) CISC processor would typically be a bit faster than a RISC, but we talking like 15-20%, so the diffrance is not large.
During the mid 90s, RISC CPU Typically had higher core clocks, so they where typically faster.
What killed the RISC architecture is that a RISC CPU is more cache heavy. So when Cashing and bandwidth become a problem in late 90s, the CISC architecture just pulled away.
For mobile devices where cash and memory is closer to the core, this is less so a problem and RISC still have a power to predominance adavantage.
@@alexhajnal107
Almost all the gen 5 consolles worh the same way. They had a MIPS or Hitatchi processor (that is basically a MIPS clone) as a main CPU, than a secondary MIPS or Hitachi processor as a graphic slave CPU.
Most of them had basically the same CPU as main CPU and GPU slave.
Both the X32 and the Saturn use two SH-2 CPU at 23 and 29Mhz (for respective console). Saturn also used a 3rd SH-1 as additional controller. X32 used the M68k from the megadrive and the Saturn had a additional M68k as well.
X32 had a additional DSP and Saturn had 2 clocked at the same core as the main processors.
The Jaguar have two "custom" RISC CPU, in reality its just a clone MIPS CPU, just like the SH-2 at 27Mhz, and a additional M68k CPU. The two CPU works the same way as on the saturn and the X32, one main CPU and one Grapical processor feeding a DSP at the same core clock as the other two processors.
Effectivly Jaguar, X32 and Saturn all work the exact same way. Saturn just have one more processor and one more DSP.
PS1 have a MIPS R3000A CPU, that is basically the CPU the SH-2 is a clone of, running at 33Mhz.
PS1 have a costum chip running at 33Mhz with a integrated CPU (probobly a R3000, but its not offical) with a built in DSP. PS1 work exactly like a X32 or Jaguar, part from the lack of M68k and the DSP is now integrated with the secondary CPU.
N64 have a NEC VR4300 CPU that is a MIPS 4000 series licences by NEC. If the R3000 series is a 486 33Mhz, the R4000 series is a 486DX4 100MHz. It also have 64 bit register, but its not a true full 64 bit CPU (or rather, the VR4300 is not, the true R4000 series have support for full 64 bit processing).
The GPU of the N64 uses the same setup as the PS1. Its not known exactly what it is, but it uses the same instruction as the main processor so its probobly some fork of a R4000 or possibly R3000 series CPU. It may be a R3000 becasue the core clock is only 63Mhz, the only gen 5 console that have a slower GPU than CPU. On the other hand it have a 8 piple vector DSP built in, so it have very high performance, but its very ram and cache starved.
So the two processor setup with a conected DSP was very standard for that generation. And this is basically how a GPU works to this day.
Jaguar was first with the concept on the console. but the core concept predate Jaguar with like a decade and was used on professional workstations already in the 80s.
@@matsv201 _"68020 could do 1 instruction every second clock"_
On the 68000 it was 4 to 6 clocks (16-bit Word or 32-bit Long, respectively) for basic instructions, complex ones and ones hitting memory took longer.
_"RISC CPU … typically need more instructions to do the same task"_
Somewhat mitigated by much simpler decode and scheduling circuitry. One big advantage that RISC has is that it can have much larger register sets than CISC due to the smaller number of opcode encodings leaving more room in the instruction words for register numbers. With x86 this was partially worked-around via arbitrarily-sized instructions (which brought multiple penalties); the 68k exclusively had single-word instructions (ignoring the address Long when applicable) but its smaller suite of instructions [citation needed] left more room for register specification within the opcode (4 bits for the 8 D and 8 A registers). Still, CISC chips usually had far fewer registers than the 31+ typical of RISC chips.
[Re: 31+ registers not 32+ Having one register, conventionally R0, always read as 0 and discard on write allows many additional instructions to be synthesized, e.g. the pseudo-op BNZ Rn, ADDR could generate CMP Rn, R0; BNE ADDR. Likewise, the CMP instruction itself could be synthesized from SUB A, B, DEST as SUB A, B, R0. Another one I recall encountering (different architecture) is BRA ADDR being encoded as a BEQ R0, R0, ADDR.].
_"During the mid 90s, RISC CPU Typically had higher core clocks"_
Indeed, for a time the fastest platform for running *x86* Windows software was emulated under NT on Alpha (native code was even faster, natch). It was the much simpler circuitry needed to implement RISC instructions that allowed for higher clock speeds (without needing huge pipelines). [Pipelines are their own kettle of worms.]
re: Cache constraints killing RISC during the 90s
I'd say there's more too it than just that. Intel could devote extensive resources to x86 development due to high revenues from PCs and economies of scale. In contrast, the RISC market was highly fragmented which limited the resources that each vendor could devote to chip development. Realizing that they couldn't compete on their own, most of the vendors bet the farm on a common VLIW architecture [Itanium] rather than cooperate on a common RISC architecture (likely due to avoid not-invented-here roadblocks); when that failed the survivors switched to x86-64 as that was all that was left.
It goes without saying though that RISC [ARM and MIPS, now also RISC-V] did find a highly successful niche in the embedded and low power/mobile spaces. Hasn't seen too much success in (relatively) high performance computing although that's been improving recently.
11:30 Calculators just couldn't evolve anymore? At the time this theory was correct but by the 90s calculators were becoming extremely advanced, doing many things computers could do and many things we rely on smart phone doing today. Eventually these would evolve into the PDA which would evolve into the smart phone.
Nope. not on facebook, I killed that account over 10 years ago. But am listening to you while playing doom 2. Still got them old floppies for doom 1 and cdrom for doom 2 :D
Ah, I see you are a man of culture as well.
So Yakov Smirnof made this ad? In Soviet Russia, Commodore keeps up with YOU!
most business's fail business they either get sold or different management takes over they start doing things different cause company to fail. electronics costed more back then can't say back then money verses today money.
You cannot see other things with VPN software anymore.
I had one.
As I recall, Apple sacked founder Steve Jobs likewise, but were smart enough to bring him back.
I actually thought the C64 was British. Because my cousin had one.
Tramiel was a Schelmiel!😂
Music interrupted research sorry
Great script and well researched, thanks. Please consider having someone else read it, though. Preferably someone with a neutral accent, better tone and more gravitas? Had to give up after 15 mins. Shame because this is well put together with good images.
06:42 - Massive fraud scheme involves CP Morgan??? Hum... This is not new with the Morgans name...
I love your videos but please invest in a decent microphone with some bottom end. It makes your videos hard to watch.
I'm watching! You have the voice of an angel tho Darkness
Im glad youve gotten some sponsors, your a great channel, but can i get a thumbs up from people who deliberatly never buy anything ive seen in a ad on youtube?
When did apple get big ??
I had you full screen and full attention. Am I doing this wrong?
Interesting, but I can't listen to the overly emphatic voice over. Sorry.
amiga 1000
During the C64 era a Amiga 1000 was a super expensive rare computer.
i still remember i played north and south at an Amiga 1000 at a friends house.
ruclips.net/video/-S2QbzVvTXE/видео.html
You don’t know all the story of Commodore, specially Amiga line. You need investigate more instead talking badly of the Amiga. It was the really first you call computer. The Amiga was used in discos, bars, in Hollywood for movies… the first park Jurassic used the Amiga, Robocop used the Amiga, Babylon 5 used the Amiga… slots of movies… and the Amiga hardware was years ahead from any consoles and computers between 1985 and 1992…. Go on vacation and try to investigate more about Amiga… but, I recognize that you try to do the best in this video
Amazing how you completely forgot about one other standard besides windows and Apple LINUX!