Jedi: I have an update. I tried the Sunset Amnesia and I don't find it any better than the Big Game Trilene. I made two Skagit shooting heads from each end of one 11 wt. DT floating Orvis Wonderline I got for ten dollars. One is 20 feet long, the other is 23 feet long. I whittled the last couple inches of the thick ends where I lopped off the lines in order to fit the braided loops on, like you mentioned you did. They both work great on my 9 foot, six wt. fly rod.The 20 footer works great on a five wt. fly rod too. I can turn over weighted #8 and #6 streamers with either head. And I can turn over a homemade sink tip/leader made of 5 feet of Cortland LC-13(a five foot MOW tip?) and three feet of fluoro with the 23 footer. I also bought a 20 foot generic 300 grain Skagit head on Ebay for my 7 and 8 weight fly rods. It works great and doesn't seem any different than my homemade DT heads except it's heavier. I don't have a grain scale and can't tell you the grain weight of the homemade heads. I use these lines on traditional trout streams in upstate New York. I'm Skagit casting tons of water I could never get to before because of lack of backcasting room for a traditional fly line.
Correction: I meant to say Skagit spey heads, not shooting heads, although I can use the 20 footer as a shooting head in a pinch, much like a Lee Wulff Ambush or Rio Outbound line.
One thing I've never heard anyone mention is that even overhand casting with this system has advantages. You don't need all that much room to make an overhand backcast with a short shooting head. Plus it's just easier to make one cast and strip the line in if you're fishing a streamer, even if you're out in the open.
big ron Good question. I like fast rods (stiff) but also like soft rods! I would say stiffer rods might be easier to learn on for touch and go type casting, while more moderate rods for Skagit style. But almost always I want a stiff tip, especially in a softer rod!!!
Impressive, Jedi. My guess is you took a 6-8 weight dt or wf line head and chopped it down. Am I close? I did something similar with a 12wt. wf and an 11 wt. dt for my six weight rod.
Thanks for the info. I took a 12 wt. wf cheapo floating line from China and cut the front shooting head section off just behind the rear head taper where the running line starts, then I took three foot sections out of the center of the head until I could spey cast it easily with my six weight fly rod. It was important to preserve the front and rear tapers, hence the chopping down and resplicing in the center of the head. My running line is Berkley big game, like yours, except it's either 30 or 35 lb test.
Thanks for the info. I cut off the heads right behind the rear tapers where the running line part of the fly line starts on the above mentioned lines then I ended up cutting out about 8-9 feet in the center of the head and respliced it together, thus preserving the front and rear tapers so it would roll cast as smoothly as possible. The basic formula is to end up with a spey head that's three line weights higher than the fly rod you're using.
Jedi: I've been trying something similar. I've got a 7'6" 3wt and I tried the OPST but to me it's too heavy. The OPST is 150 grains plus the 5' floating tip adds up to 17' and 175 grains'. Also I tried the OPST 35# lazar mono line but it seems too thin. I just ordered some 50# lazar line and the 8wt RIO 15' replacement tip. It's 109 grains. I'm hoping this combo will work. I don't need to cast 100' but if I could get an ultralight setup that casts 50' without needing room for a backcast, that would be my ideal rod.
So far this is my favorite setup (7'6" 3wt + 50# lazar + 15' 8wt rio tip). I really like how it casts overhand plus I can still skagit cast it. I'm hoping I can even use this with dries.
After further experiments I feel like the OPST is too heavy and the rio tip is a little light so I've been trying to make my own by using the end of cheap WF line. I'm trying to figure out the right length/weight combination. The weight is pretty easy to tell when it's about right, but I'm not sure about the length. What do you think are the advantages/disadvantages of longer vs shorter heads?
I think the 50# lazar line will be too heavy for the 150g head set up. When you are on the micro end of things the 25# lazar line will allow the line to fly out of the end of the rod. I use 50# lazar line for striped bass in salt water with the biggest commando heads. You need to spend some time getting used to handling the lighter stuff. It will pay off.
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Jedi: I have an update. I tried the Sunset Amnesia and I don't find it any better than the Big Game Trilene. I made two Skagit shooting heads from each end of one 11 wt. DT floating Orvis Wonderline I got for ten dollars. One is 20 feet long, the other is 23 feet long. I whittled the last couple inches of the thick ends where I lopped off the lines in order to fit the braided loops on, like you mentioned you did. They both work great on my 9 foot, six wt. fly rod.The 20 footer works great on a five wt. fly rod too. I can turn over weighted #8 and #6 streamers with either head. And I can turn over a homemade sink tip/leader made of 5 feet of Cortland LC-13(a five foot MOW tip?) and three feet of fluoro with the 23 footer. I also bought a 20 foot generic 300 grain Skagit head on Ebay for my 7 and 8 weight fly rods. It works great and doesn't seem any different than my homemade DT heads except it's heavier. I don't have a grain scale and can't tell you the grain weight of the homemade heads. I use these lines on traditional trout streams in upstate New York. I'm Skagit casting tons of water I could never get to before because of lack of backcasting room for a traditional fly line.
Correction: I meant to say Skagit spey heads, not shooting heads, although I can use the 20 footer as a shooting head in a pinch, much like a Lee Wulff Ambush or Rio Outbound line.
One thing I've never heard anyone mention is that even overhand casting with this system has advantages. You don't need all that much room to make an overhand backcast with a short shooting head. Plus it's just easier to make one cast and strip the line in if you're fishing a streamer, even if you're out in the open.
Is it better to use a fast rod while single handed skagit casting?
I'm also curious about this as I have 2 rods to choose from
big ron Good question. I like fast rods (stiff) but also like soft rods! I would say stiffer rods might be easier to learn on for touch and go type casting, while more moderate rods for Skagit style. But almost always I want a stiff tip, especially in a softer rod!!!
Impressive, Jedi. My guess is you took a 6-8 weight dt or wf line head and chopped it down. Am I close? I did something similar with a 12wt. wf and an 11 wt. dt for my six weight rod.
Thanks for the info. I took a 12 wt. wf cheapo floating line from China and cut the front shooting head section off just behind the rear head taper where the running line starts, then I took three foot sections out of the center of the head until I could spey cast it easily with my six weight fly rod. It was important to preserve the front and rear tapers, hence the chopping down and resplicing in the center of the head. My running line is Berkley big game, like yours, except it's either 30 or 35 lb test.
Thanks for the info. I cut off the heads right behind the rear tapers where the running line part of the fly line starts on the above mentioned lines then I ended up cutting out about 8-9 feet in the center of the head and respliced it together, thus preserving the front and rear tapers so it would roll cast as smoothly as possible. The basic formula is to end up with a spey head that's three line weights higher than the fly rod you're using.
Sorry for posting twice the same message. The first one got lost temporarily so I rewrote it(roughly).
Jedi: I've been trying something similar. I've got a 7'6" 3wt and I tried the OPST but to me it's too heavy. The OPST is 150 grains plus the 5' floating tip adds up to 17' and 175 grains'. Also I tried the OPST 35# lazar mono line but it seems too thin. I just ordered some 50# lazar line and the 8wt RIO 15' replacement tip. It's 109 grains. I'm hoping this combo will work. I don't need to cast 100' but if I could get an ultralight setup that casts 50' without needing room for a backcast, that would be my ideal rod.
So far this is my favorite setup (7'6" 3wt + 50# lazar + 15' 8wt rio tip). I really like how it casts overhand plus I can still skagit cast it. I'm hoping I can even use this with dries.
After further experiments I feel like the OPST is too heavy and the rio tip is a little light so I've been trying to make my own by using the end of cheap WF line. I'm trying to figure out the right length/weight combination. The weight is pretty easy to tell when it's about right, but I'm not sure about the length. What do you think are the advantages/disadvantages of longer vs shorter heads?
I think the 50# lazar line will be too heavy for the 150g head set up. When you are on the micro end of things the 25# lazar line will allow the line to fly out of the end of the rod. I use 50# lazar line for striped bass in salt water with the biggest commando heads. You need to spend some time getting used to handling the lighter stuff. It will pay off.