My man the flanker in a 1 circle is a joke cant pull the nose even half as decently as the F15E for that matter not even the A, and they literally ignore all supposed evidence of flight manuals no matter how many times they are brought up. Couple this with how a single complaint from US mains can give em a whole new engine you can literally see they are just doing it for money.
That's the thing I mean this from a Sim perspective, sure you get crazy AoA when you use manual controls but the bigger issue is the low speed handling once the flanker goes bellow 200 knots it can't pull its nose any further meanwhile something like an f16 or 15 will be ripping their nose all over the place while you can't even complete your own circle. It's not like it's useless in dogfights, most matches you'll meet players that just don't manage their speed at all, or have to high fuel load and just beat em. Issue comes when you meet a decent pilot, the jet just isn't what it's supposed to be, this was fine when the ER was meta cos then Nato jets had the advantage in a dogfight now, you just have a flanker that no one is afraid to fight coz the missile has no range (this is fine coz the 77 never had good range anyways until the 77-1) and a bad FM. This just makes the plane unfliable.
f15e is an easymode larpers flock into, but 90% of people flying it honestly arent any challenge, some even continue to fly straight after shooting of their missile to make sure they headbutt an r77. only problem is their numbers are always 3:1 or greater and having someone at 10km, another at 6km and rest on the deck and you get a missile warning before the runway ends. flanker would be totally competetive with a decent radar, currently it goes like this: when you find something on your radar and IFF it, before youre achieving a radar lock the nato plane already shot a missile that outranges you. I got shot at by so many aim-120's today ill be hearing the rwr in my sleep. - If something, id love for redfor to get that r77 variant with 2 phase booster (that fires up in terminal guidance phase) cant remember if its r77-1 or r77m. but su30 and su35 should have it.
R-77-1 wont help, since gaijin failed to model the physics of grid fins properly. Same goes for french ARH, bleeding too much speed cause of poorly modelled thrust vectoring
If they were to give all planes their "correct" FM and capabilities the Blue side would have an even greater advantage over Red. Unfortunately the balance is off and it seems they have run out of quirks to give the Red side ie IR tracking
This isn’t true tho, with correct flight models red side would at least do good in one circles. Currently the flanker and MiG-29 lose to nearly everything one circle and two circle. Coupled with weaker radars and fox 3s its leaves a ton to be desired
That is what I say about "game breaking" or the "game is actually over, this vehicle will end ARB" shit. If it were actually real we're into the place in history and technology where it would be 1 sided and dog fighting wouldn't happen. The advance in weapon systems make the so lethal to one another that dog fights would happen 100+ km away and be over.
The source that the Su-27 is underperforming in terms of energy retention and generation is from the flight manual itself and from comparing HUD footage irl to in-game HUD footage. There is also airshow footage of the plane doing a 360 degree turn in x amount of seconds and the plane in-game cannot complete the same turn in the same time. On top of that there is also CL/CD diagrams that can be generated from the game files and compared to IRL simulations. These methods aren't perfect but give coarse estimations...and the plane is so far off that they are sufficient to tell that it is underperforming.
Yeah this tends to happen when some nations are more "balanced" than others Gaijin with all their wisdom decided to add the DOA J-11A and Su-27SM when they knew they had F-15C and later F-15E in the pipeline which blow these two out of the water completely And also Still no Mig-29M
They should just.add the R73 late or R73M becuase were basically on the R73 early which only has limited thrust vectoring.Because the R73 late and R73M are known to have dual band seekers better IRCCM better flight controlls(like flight computer) and better thrust vectoring
I don’t mind mixed matches in general. But when they are mixed to the point of a country facing itself (ie: usa vs usa) it just becomes a bandaid that doesn’t fix anything.
It only will get worse for REDFOR besides CN honestly. Su-35 even by Chinese evaluation was seen as outdated when they acquired some and that is RU's top dog. Maybe export variants of the Su-30 with Israeli/French avionics mixed in but Russian avionics have always been their kryptonite. Gaijin probably will make the R77M/PL15 wonder missiles since all radars and supporting avionics right are severely gimped. If we had even an inkling of actual NATO radar sets and LINK 16 as someone pointed out down below in a well written explanation then REDFOR besides CN with the J15T/J16 would be absolutely unplayable. People are chafing at the pre nerf and even current F15E flight model, and even if it is overturned or inaccurate imagine ANY advanced Eagle variant such as the F15EX or once we get the Typhoon with it's eye-watering performance. So you have NATO with the ability to slowly gain their actual avionics features that nearly ALL REDFOR aircraft minus the most modern CN ones can only dream of so the only way Gaijin to buff the Reds back are missiles and that's where we potentially get into a repeat of the R27ER fiasco again. If you want an actual real world scenario with "fair" simulations between REDFOR/BLUEFOR aircraft you can look up the Chinese/Thai joint air exercises and see the results charts in BVR and the explanations given honestly on why they were so lopsided. The data at least when I last saw was still public. Even from DCS people should have already seen what was coming. Besides the wonder weapon mods that are obviously hyper biased, the base game REDFOR/BLUEFOR fights were super lopsided. You wouldn't have Mig-29s lobbing AASM/Gbu39s in blue/yellow if RU aircraft had anywhere near the capabilities they are said to have. As shit as game balance is, at least honestly it's more balanced than it was during the heyday of Fox 1 metas with 4th gen fighters. Gripens with 1000000000 CM and a flight model others could only dream of, R27ERs that made any high altitude gameplay completely pointless and so on and so on. If people don't want lopsided balance issues then we had to have started back then and caused a bigger fuss over it but everyone wants to play the most broken minus the severely autistic so Gaijin get's away with it. It's obvious what they do by cultivating a dev created meta on purpose so people have to grind out a nation all the way to top tier to feel better about themselves then once their data shows enough players have moved on over, they give another nation a shiny toy that forces a large number of players to grind a whole new tech tree for and probably buy premiums for. We can bemoan balance all we want but the simple fact is players vote with their wallets and most War Thunder players do not even wince when swiping for a 80 dollar dorito or even for a squadron vehicle and putting a talisman on it lmao. Honestly man I just miss Mig Alley and rping in Sabres and Mig-15s, jk who am I kidding it's hilarious nuking plebs going mach jesus 2.2 from space cackling as people keep on flying low thinking it'll save them.
"hilarious nuking plebs going mach jesus 2.2 from space cackling as people keep on flying low thinking it'll save them." I will admit. This is fun as hell. In terms of realism. Gaijin needs to focus on gameplay more. We don't have all the supporting assets that make air combat realistic.
@@AeroTurtle Oh I agree, which is why I find the realism crowd super cringe. War was never meant to be balanced or fair. Life isn't fair either, why we play games to escape reality and go mach jesus bopping plebs. Better gamemodes/map design would be the best way imo to aid REDFOR. You can already see it in Ground RB/SIM. Due to the presence of Pantsirs and other supporting elements, REDFOR flyers rarely ever complain as much as the purely air mode players. R77 having dogshit range/energy retention? Doesn't matter when almost any launch range in ground battles means your missiles are going pitbull mad dogging off the rail. Terrain is also much more varied allowing terrain masking and other strats to close the gap if need be. War thunder really needs better modes man.
Funny statement, considering how artificially nerfed the R-77 is in the game. Depends on what gaijin decides to add. R-77M should be on par with the AIM-120D. Then there is the R-37M and the AIM-260, with the latter being rather inferior. Of course it also depends on gaijins fm, since US FMs overperform, soviet ones underperform currently.
The way I look at War Thunder is that it's not historically accurate to the wars but it is pretty accurate to the technology eras of war vehicles hints for the reason Germany has really badass props but it's off for the Jets. It's one of the reasons why I like this game is that a try to stay accurate but still keep it in a game form where you're not having to read a manual to operate the game. I definitely think it's better than world of whatever😂
This is somewhat true. Wt is missing a lot of advanced and straight up classified technology in their aircraft. With that being said they make educated guesses on how a lot of the technology works. Giving the illusion of realism. Edit: they also take gameplay into consideration. For example the tornado brimstone missiles should be fire-and-forget. But instead they are laser guided to balance the game.
Crazy how a better aircraft beats a worse aircraft. There isn’t much you can do besides change BR’s. Changing flight models like this doesn’t work. It would be so much easier if they just got flight models as accurate as possible instead of changing them, which isn’t how they are supposed to balance their game.
The issue is that missiles like the MICA and R-77 are just artificially nerfed(they bleed speed too much/R-77 grid fins have insane drag even at supersonic speed, since gaijin cant work out how to model them properly) Seems so that gaijin just wants milk more of all of those premium US top tier jets. Seriously, they have like 4 top tier premiums.
If I'm correct the radar is somewhat correct, but the system overall is scuffed. For example, In DCS locking a target will give target information; speed, altitude and heading. You can also lock using both the IR and radar system. If gaijin were to add these features, it would be very helpful. But alas The US mains have the bigger wallets and the loudest cries
@r3tr0a82 in WT due to map sizes and player quantity you need a refresh rate to find and lock the targets fast, and to check IFF. When you have to wait for 6+sec to understand if it is an enemy or friendly it is too much. Other characteristics are secondary imho
@@r3tr0a82All that info is missing on western sets too and many more. Russian jets are actually gaining from lack of information as there would be even more info on western MFDs.
@@honzavasicek I'm unsure about western aircraft, but whenever I play something like an F-16C, My time to ID the enemy and lock them up then fire a missile doesn't take more than 8 seconds, which gives western aircraft much better capabilities then russian aircrafts like the Su-27. My point is, some electronic upgrades in war thunder are overdue
Italian F-16 doesn't even have correct missiles, not to mention we dont have typhoon and we didn't get the upgraded Tornado, which both UK and Germany Got
Love the mass effect soundtrack. Tbh the flanker is bad. Especially it's radar. I stopped playing it and started using the F15s and F14s. I'm racking up a larger amount of kills with NATO planes.
TBH gaijin just should add Su-30SM which would be much much better aircraft than Su-34. Redfor really needs modern fighter with something better than N001 radar. And u said Su-37 etc, at first Su-35 aka Su-27M would be great addition do tech tree, we just need better platform with N011 or N011M radar with better FM.
Bluefor jets are already nerfed in case of avionics heavily. They implemented russian logic and downsides of soviet 80-90s tech into western radar sets. APG-63/70/68/65 are missing bunch of filters for notching targets, they miss bunch of AACQ modes like F15s super search, helmet long "boresights" and so on. The APG-63PSP/V1 and 70 have same HPRF downside as russian radars of 80s-90s even though they did not have these irl and thats absurdly high min range, bad notch resistance and poor cold aspect target performance. NONE of these were present. In fact APG-63s notch filter is around 45-50kts both in MPRF and HPRF ON TOP of kalman filters, angle, velocity and range tracking in case of 70. Its nearly impossible to notch APG-63v1 and 70 in STT. They lack HPRF and ILV TWS modes, reducing their detection ranges in TWS on top of already artificially nerfed detection ranges and significantly nerfed lock on ranges (another downside brought up from russian significantly inferior radar tech of the day). APG-70 is missing high data rate TWS with quick refresh rates (only slightly slower than what is currently on pesa of 34 in WT), not entirely confident it was present on APG-63v1 too. Hud info on western jets with STT or primary TWS target is crippled a lot too. We miss a LOT of info about target western radar UIs provide on already significantly obsolete APG-63 screen, TWS is so simplified, it outrigt negates its actual use. We cant designate primary and secondary targets before launch. If we had properly done avionics of western radar sets, the sim wouldnt be even possible to be flown in flanker or mig29. 29 and Flanker used MLC filter even in STT and were piss poor easy to notch. You cant do that with APG-63 PSP, V1 or god forbid you trying to notch APG-70. They are tracking so many informations about you, that MLC filter is one of the last things they actually care of. I dont even think we have HPRF/MPRF amraam switching... pitbull at long range and once they close down enough, they would switch to MPRF and made themselves nightmare to notch. There is nothing like that in R-77 family. Western jets underperform in everything exept flight performance which is questionable quite a lot (F15A and 16 fms are busted) in some cases but thats where it ends. Cant wait when we get eurofigter with advanced captor-M... Rafale with reliable high tech pesa. F-15C with APG-63v2 and v3. There are literally no jets in russian service with kinematics and radar sets that can match these exept mig-31, thats literally only russian plane capable to face late 4+ and 4,5 gens of west in BVR with chance of winning that fight. But wait, they will again nerf their avionics to the ground... not adding major radar modes or outright cripple detection based on how russian radars work. Not to mention all eurocanards employ stealth technlogy in materials and specifically designed airframe, some more than others. Rafale should be an absolute cancer to be detected at longer ranges. Its one of the stealthiest 4,5 gens out there. God help russian teams once Link-16 on JHMCS is introduced on fighters and not only few attackers. I would rather see fixed FMs and mainly, fixed avionics than overperforming FM and totally crippled avionics. WT sim will be china with germany and optionally with SWE/IT/FR against US/GB/IL. Russian tech tree will start falling off the moment they receive Su-30 and 35 as there wont be nothing better and this will most likely happen with addition of euro canards and these nations will have remaining blocks and tranches of those jets to be addded with significantly improved weaponry and avionics. Redfor in sims is gone. It will be NATO vs NATO + china.
@@kurnass2000 Add 120C5 ( i dont know why russians shoul have 2010-15's missile when US is stuck at 91 one), fix all radars on western jets, give them proper UI and Link 16 when you want to push it so forward. F15E exept turning performs as it should and probably is worse without CFTs than it should be as we dont have charts with no CFTs. Problem solved. Western stuff was already heavily nerfed in BVR to cater to russian fanboy cucks.
@@M0LOCK Pretty much every single mechanical radar of russians is based on N019 with its downsides, every single russian mechanical radar filters mainly by MLC filter, with more modern ones having few ranging techniques. Russian pesa is nowhere near in quality of tracking of mechanical APG-70 or Captor-M.... let alone french pesa or US/EU AESA units. Egyptians critiqued pesa on Su35 heavily while testing it and comparing it to Rafale. Wherever they can afford to choose between US and russian tech, they choose US, if they cant buy US, they choose french. There is only handful of nations buying from russia and thats mostly due to politicians being stuck 100km deep in putins ass. Half of typical russian customers in asia are now turning towards french or chinese exports as russian tech is absurdly unreliable and lacking behind western or chinese competition.
I know you are a US main but your knowledge on warsaw pact aircraft FMs is stageringly bad considering you are a sim pilot, the su27 irl is amazing, every pilot that ever flew it says so, you can look at interviews on youtube... it and the the f15C and su27S have a 1° per second rate difference, with the su27 having the major one circle advantage, and lets not even talk about the shitbrick that is the E model and later EX that add even more weight, the su27 and mig29 should run laps around nato aircraft, maybe not against skilled pilots who know their stuff to a T but certainly against an average ameriboo larper, like they did in 1989 when former east german mig29s swept the floor with f16 f15 f18 and i think eurofighters too, they had no answer for it, THAT is reality, read up on it, i stand to gain nothing from lying.
The F-15E is a bit of a shit brick but the EX? No, just no. The EX has better manoeuvrability thanks to its more powerful engines, new flight control systems, etc. As for the East German MiG-29s they didn’t win over NATO aircraft because of manoeuvrability, the won because of HMD and R-73. In terms of manoeuvrability they were similar to the US jets but the R-73 gave them an edge
Are you a fighter pilot? 🤔 The combat record of Soviet/Russian aircraft are enough to tell you how they fly. And yes, I have seen interviews and even results of when American fighters actually had a chance to duel the Soviet Air Force. With that being said. Its a video game. I don't expect it to be realistic. I expect the game to be balanced. Do the flankers need a buff. Yes. Am I going to listen to armchair warthunder fighter pilots expertise. No.
I think you forget that REDFOR fights with NATO jets 90% of the time anyway. It doesn't need to be 100% balanced with BLUEFOR fighting jets that are 30 years newer than their own because they have our jets fighting for them. Learn to use unorthadox tactics. REDFOR was using the r27er uncontested for nearly a year, and people complained about it, but Gaijin did nothing. You can't pick and choose when you advocate for balance to suit your needs only. And what is fair about REDFOR getting shiny new toys from the 2000s while the U.S. is stuck with gimped technology from the 80's to compete with them. Split the teams down the middle and cut the crap when it comes to mixed teams, and I'll be the first to advocate for more balance, but you can't have your cake and eat it too.
The 27ER wasn't really a big deal since we had 100m multipathing that made it trivial to defeat any radar guided missile. The 9M was the better missile.
I have to agree with redfor on this one. The R-27ER wasn't as op as people think. All you had to do was multpath at mach and you would merge everytime. NATO had better FM at the time so you would win most of your dogfights. Not only that the U.S has technology from the 2000's. And this is coming from a U.S main. I want something competent to kill, not an easy flanker that bleeds all it's speed and dies.
@AeroTurtle a flanker bleeding its speed and dying is a user error at this point. It's has good characteristics in the 1 circle and less than favorable 2 circle characteristics with insane nose authority and insane high off boresight capabilities. The problem is that it's not easy to fly like the U.S. planes are. You need energy management and good dogfight awareness, which a lot of WarThunder players in general don't have or care to learn. The F-16C first flew in 1984, the Block 50s in 1991, and the Aim-9m was made in 1983. Not to mention the U.S. faces all of their own tech in 90% of SIM matches. Your take is a bad one, but we can respectfully agree to disagree. I have both the Russian and U.S. air trees maxed and over 3000 hours in the game, btw.
just give the Su27 the correct FM so that when you manage to close the distance you can actually be rewarded for defeating BVR spam
I agree!!!
My man the flanker in a 1 circle is a joke cant pull the nose even half as decently as the F15E for that matter not even the A, and they literally ignore all supposed evidence of flight manuals no matter how many times they are brought up. Couple this with how a single complaint from US mains can give em a whole new engine you can literally see they are just doing it for money.
The F-16 beating MiG-29s/Flankers in one circle is beyond me...
Use full controls and you can get crazy AOA
more so than most Jets
The clanker could beat the eagle in a 1 circle. But you will bleed all your speed, and never regain it back
@@AeroTurtle That's the problem. It isn't supposed to bleed it so quickly.
That's the thing I mean this from a Sim perspective, sure you get crazy AoA when you use manual controls but the bigger issue is the low speed handling once the flanker goes bellow 200 knots it can't pull its nose any further meanwhile something like an f16 or 15 will be ripping their nose all over the place while you can't even complete your own circle.
It's not like it's useless in dogfights, most matches you'll meet players that just don't manage their speed at all, or have to high fuel load and just beat em. Issue comes when you meet a decent pilot, the jet just isn't what it's supposed to be, this was fine when the ER was meta cos then Nato jets had the advantage in a dogfight now, you just have a flanker that no one is afraid to fight coz the missile has no range (this is fine coz the 77 never had good range anyways until the 77-1) and a bad FM. This just makes the plane unfliable.
"There's no way that they'd add an F-18 and a eurofighter without any way to counter it" *John Cena: Are you sure about that?*"
(they're gonna do it)
The motion blur effect is so good, literally the 2nd best addition to the game after the Burners
Ikr!!! It looks so nice!
since we have ka-50 premium(a prototype) getting su-37 premium would be possible too.(idk how balanced it will be though)
f15e is an easymode larpers flock into, but 90% of people flying it honestly arent any challenge, some even continue to fly straight after shooting of their missile to make sure they headbutt an r77. only problem is their numbers are always 3:1 or greater and having someone at 10km, another at 6km and rest on the deck and you get a missile warning before the runway ends. flanker would be totally competetive with a decent radar, currently it goes like this: when you find something on your radar and IFF it, before youre achieving a radar lock the nato plane already shot a missile that outranges you. I got shot at by so many aim-120's today ill be hearing the rwr in my sleep.
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If something, id love for redfor to get that r77 variant with 2 phase booster (that fires up in terminal guidance phase) cant remember if its r77-1 or r77m. but su30 and su35 should have it.
This is 100% true. Most nato jets will always have the first shot in BVR which is a huge advantage. A new radar would be nice for the flankers.
Then they'll have to add the C variants for the aim 120
R-77-1 wont help, since gaijin failed to model the physics of grid fins properly.
Same goes for french ARH, bleeding too much speed cause of poorly modelled thrust vectoring
If they were to give all planes their "correct" FM and capabilities the Blue side would have an even greater advantage over Red. Unfortunately the balance is off and it seems they have run out of quirks to give the Red side ie IR tracking
I agree with you. But I will take gameplay over realism.
Red side has comparable or exceeds blue side missile capabilities in the modern day actually.
But doubt we would see something like the R-37M.
@@VIT-ey8woNo they don’t, because there’s more to missile capabilities then speed and range. Plus the AIM-174 exists
This isn’t true tho, with correct flight models red side would at least do good in one circles. Currently the flanker and MiG-29 lose to nearly everything one circle and two circle. Coupled with weaker radars and fox 3s its leaves a ton to be desired
Oh god aero did you forget that you should never ask warthunder players for a source
Someone boutta to to a military prison over wt 😭 💀💀💀
That is what I say about "game breaking" or the "game is actually over, this vehicle will end ARB" shit. If it were actually real we're into the place in history and technology where it would be 1 sided and dog fighting wouldn't happen. The advance in weapon systems make the so lethal to one another that dog fights would happen 100+ km away and be over.
Exxxxxxxxxxxxxxxactly!
The source that the Su-27 is underperforming in terms of energy retention and generation is from the flight manual itself and from comparing HUD footage irl to in-game HUD footage. There is also airshow footage of the plane doing a 360 degree turn in x amount of seconds and the plane in-game cannot complete the same turn in the same time. On top of that there is also CL/CD diagrams that can be generated from the game files and compared to IRL simulations.
These methods aren't perfect but give coarse estimations...and the plane is so far off that they are sufficient to tell that it is underperforming.
Yeah this tends to happen when some nations are more "balanced" than others
Gaijin with all their wisdom decided to add the DOA J-11A and Su-27SM when they knew they had F-15C and later F-15E in the pipeline which blow these two out of the water completely
And also
Still no Mig-29M
Yeah they plan this stuff way in advance. I don't think they actually test it though.
They should just.add the R73 late or R73M becuase were basically on the R73 early which only has limited thrust vectoring.Because the R73 late and R73M are known to have dual band seekers better IRCCM better flight controlls(like flight computer) and better thrust vectoring
This would be nice ngl
I don’t mind mixed matches in general. But when they are mixed to the point of a country facing itself (ie: usa vs usa) it just becomes a bandaid that doesn’t fix anything.
It only will get worse for REDFOR besides CN honestly. Su-35 even by Chinese evaluation was seen as outdated when they acquired some and that is RU's top dog. Maybe export variants of the Su-30 with Israeli/French avionics mixed in but Russian avionics have always been their kryptonite. Gaijin probably will make the R77M/PL15 wonder missiles since all radars and supporting avionics right are severely gimped. If we had even an inkling of actual NATO radar sets and LINK 16 as someone pointed out down below in a well written explanation then REDFOR besides CN with the J15T/J16 would be absolutely unplayable. People are chafing at the pre nerf and even current F15E flight model, and even if it is overturned or inaccurate imagine ANY advanced Eagle variant such as the F15EX or once we get the Typhoon with it's eye-watering performance. So you have NATO with the ability to slowly gain their actual avionics features that nearly ALL REDFOR aircraft minus the most modern CN ones can only dream of so the only way Gaijin to buff the Reds back are missiles and that's where we potentially get into a repeat of the R27ER fiasco again.
If you want an actual real world scenario with "fair" simulations between REDFOR/BLUEFOR aircraft you can look up the Chinese/Thai joint air exercises and see the results charts in BVR and the explanations given honestly on why they were so lopsided. The data at least when I last saw was still public. Even from DCS people should have already seen what was coming. Besides the wonder weapon mods that are obviously hyper biased, the base game REDFOR/BLUEFOR fights were super lopsided. You wouldn't have Mig-29s lobbing AASM/Gbu39s in blue/yellow if RU aircraft had anywhere near the capabilities they are said to have.
As shit as game balance is, at least honestly it's more balanced than it was during the heyday of Fox 1 metas with 4th gen fighters. Gripens with 1000000000 CM and a flight model others could only dream of, R27ERs that made any high altitude gameplay completely pointless and so on and so on. If people don't want lopsided balance issues then we had to have started back then and caused a bigger fuss over it but everyone wants to play the most broken minus the severely autistic so Gaijin get's away with it. It's obvious what they do by cultivating a dev created meta on purpose so people have to grind out a nation all the way to top tier to feel better about themselves then once their data shows enough players have moved on over, they give another nation a shiny toy that forces a large number of players to grind a whole new tech tree for and probably buy premiums for. We can bemoan balance all we want but the simple fact is players vote with their wallets and most War Thunder players do not even wince when swiping for a 80 dollar dorito or even for a squadron vehicle and putting a talisman on it lmao.
Honestly man I just miss Mig Alley and rping in Sabres and Mig-15s, jk who am I kidding it's hilarious nuking plebs going mach jesus 2.2 from space cackling as people keep on flying low thinking it'll save them.
"hilarious nuking plebs going mach jesus 2.2 from space cackling as people keep on flying low thinking it'll save them." I will admit. This is fun as hell. In terms of realism. Gaijin needs to focus on gameplay more. We don't have all the supporting assets that make air combat realistic.
@@AeroTurtle Oh I agree, which is why I find the realism crowd super cringe. War was never meant to be balanced or fair. Life isn't fair either, why we play games to escape reality and go mach jesus bopping plebs. Better gamemodes/map design would be the best way imo to aid REDFOR. You can already see it in Ground RB/SIM. Due to the presence of Pantsirs and other supporting elements, REDFOR flyers rarely ever complain as much as the purely air mode players.
R77 having dogshit range/energy retention? Doesn't matter when almost any launch range in ground battles means your missiles are going pitbull mad dogging off the rail. Terrain is also much more varied allowing terrain masking and other strats to close the gap if need be. War thunder really needs better modes man.
Funny statement, considering how artificially nerfed the R-77 is in the game.
Depends on what gaijin decides to add.
R-77M should be on par with the AIM-120D.
Then there is the R-37M and the AIM-260, with the latter being rather inferior.
Of course it also depends on gaijins fm, since US FMs overperform, soviet ones underperform currently.
The way I look at War Thunder is that it's not historically accurate to the wars but it is pretty accurate to the technology eras of war vehicles hints for the reason Germany has really badass props but it's off for the Jets. It's one of the reasons why I like this game is that a try to stay accurate but still keep it in a game form where you're not having to read a manual to operate the game. I definitely think it's better than world of whatever😂
This is somewhat true. Wt is missing a lot of advanced and straight up classified technology in their aircraft. With that being said they make educated guesses on how a lot of the technology works. Giving the illusion of realism.
Edit: they also take gameplay into consideration. For example the tornado brimstone missiles should be fire-and-forget. But instead they are laser guided to balance the game.
Mig 25 and 31 would be interesting
Fr fr
Hii Aeroturtle its Ria from the 29 SMT in the fight! Enjoyed it a lot and was fun flying against you 👋
Had some awesome fights indeed!!!!
What graphics settings/post fx settings do you use? Your game looks amazing and i'm looking at getting into SIM more
6:50 fligga got absolutely demolished by long rod aim-9
Poor fligga didn't see it coming
Crazy how a better aircraft beats a worse aircraft. There isn’t much you can do besides change BR’s. Changing flight models like this doesn’t work. It would be so much easier if they just got flight models as accurate as possible instead of changing them, which isn’t how they are supposed to balance their game.
The issue is that missiles like the MICA and R-77 are just artificially nerfed(they bleed speed too much/R-77 grid fins have insane drag even at supersonic speed, since gaijin cant work out how to model them properly)
Seems so that gaijin just wants milk more of all of those premium US top tier jets.
Seriously, they have like 4 top tier premiums.
If war thunder was as realistic as in real life I would not be able to take off ( love the vids )
yup xDDD Thank you!!!
if warthunder was realistic the US mains should have their SL taken away to pay the repair bills for players using israeli vehicles
At least give an adequate radar to SU-27, it'll be already a huge relief
If I'm correct the radar is somewhat correct, but the system overall is scuffed.
For example, In DCS locking a target will give target information; speed, altitude and heading. You can also lock using both the IR and radar system.
If gaijin were to add these features, it would be very helpful. But alas The US mains have the bigger wallets and the loudest cries
@r3tr0a82 in WT due to map sizes and player quantity you need a refresh rate to find and lock the targets fast, and to check IFF. When you have to wait for 6+sec to understand if it is an enemy or friendly it is too much.
Other characteristics are secondary imho
@@r3tr0a82All that info is missing on western sets too and many more. Russian jets are actually gaining from lack of information as there would be even more info on western MFDs.
@@D0gEAtD0g Just to repeat one point.
The simultaneous IR and Radar lock actually speeds the search process significantly.
It's called EORL in DCS
@@honzavasicek I'm unsure about western aircraft, but whenever I play something like an F-16C, My time to ID the enemy and lock them up then fire a missile doesn't take more than 8 seconds, which gives western aircraft much better capabilities then russian aircrafts like the Su-27.
My point is, some electronic upgrades in war thunder are overdue
America mains already fight Sweden so it balances
It's super rare though. And even when this does happen redfor teams still lose the game.
Italian F-16 doesn't even have correct missiles, not to mention we dont have typhoon and we didn't get the upgraded Tornado, which both UK and Germany Got
I have a 7% winrate with the yak141 in sim and 42 battles lol
Brooo 💀
they could just add r77-1 or r77-m or m1 and/or r74
Perhaps
Р-74 это просто 73 собираемая в РФ. При Союзе она собиралась быть а Украине
Love the mass effect soundtrack. Tbh the flanker is bad. Especially it's radar. I stopped playing it and started using the F15s and F14s. I'm racking up a larger amount of kills with NATO planes.
The flanker new flight modle change is nice tho
@@xdhollowpointxwhat it’s drag rate went from 300% to 299%? Helpful
@kurnass2000 no the rudders are stronger and low speed handling got increase
@kurnass2000 mainly a sim buff
Thank you!!! Yeah NATO planes have an easier time for sure. If you wanna play redfor. Try the J-10
TBH gaijin just should add Su-30SM which would be much much better aircraft than Su-34. Redfor really needs modern fighter with something better than N001 radar. And u said Su-37 etc, at first Su-35 aka Su-27M would be great addition do tech tree, we just need better platform with N011 or N011M radar with better FM.
I 100% agree!
6 hours from release and only 80 likes guys? come on... you can do better than that. 19.7k subs for god's sake...
Thank you man! I'm happy with whatever yall give me 07
I’m assuming su-35 is gonna be counter to f-15e
It’s likely a counter to the F-15EX or something. MiG-29K/Su-33 for the hornets, so on and so forth.
@@christopherchartier3017I think you’re correct here SU-35 for F-15EX and perhaps SU-30 of some variant for current F-15E
@@mrsteel250 Yeah, I’d like to see an Su-30
It'll likely be a counter to the F-15E, F-18, and Eurofighter
Bluefor jets are already nerfed in case of avionics heavily. They implemented russian logic and downsides of soviet 80-90s tech into western radar sets. APG-63/70/68/65 are missing bunch of filters for notching targets, they miss bunch of AACQ modes like F15s super search, helmet long "boresights" and so on. The APG-63PSP/V1 and 70 have same HPRF downside as russian radars of 80s-90s even though they did not have these irl and thats absurdly high min range, bad notch resistance and poor cold aspect target performance. NONE of these were present. In fact APG-63s notch filter is around 45-50kts both in MPRF and HPRF ON TOP of kalman filters, angle, velocity and range tracking in case of 70. Its nearly impossible to notch APG-63v1 and 70 in STT. They lack HPRF and ILV TWS modes, reducing their detection ranges in TWS on top of already artificially nerfed detection ranges and significantly nerfed lock on ranges (another downside brought up from russian significantly inferior radar tech of the day). APG-70 is missing high data rate TWS with quick refresh rates (only slightly slower than what is currently on pesa of 34 in WT), not entirely confident it was present on APG-63v1 too.
Hud info on western jets with STT or primary TWS target is crippled a lot too.
We miss a LOT of info about target western radar UIs provide on already significantly obsolete APG-63 screen, TWS is so simplified, it outrigt negates its actual use. We cant designate primary and secondary targets before launch.
If we had properly done avionics of western radar sets, the sim wouldnt be even possible to be flown in flanker or mig29.
29 and Flanker used MLC filter even in STT and were piss poor easy to notch. You cant do that with APG-63 PSP, V1 or god forbid you trying to notch APG-70. They are tracking so many informations about you, that MLC filter is one of the last things they actually care of.
I dont even think we have HPRF/MPRF amraam switching... pitbull at long range and once they close down enough, they would switch to MPRF and made themselves nightmare to notch. There is nothing like that in R-77 family.
Western jets underperform in everything exept flight performance which is questionable quite a lot (F15A and 16 fms are busted) in some cases but thats where it ends.
Cant wait when we get eurofigter with advanced captor-M... Rafale with reliable high tech pesa. F-15C with APG-63v2 and v3. There are literally no jets in russian service with kinematics and radar sets that can match these exept mig-31, thats literally only russian plane capable to face late 4+ and 4,5 gens of west in BVR with chance of winning that fight. But wait, they will again nerf their avionics to the ground... not adding major radar modes or outright cripple detection based on how russian radars work. Not to mention all eurocanards employ stealth technlogy in materials and specifically designed airframe, some more than others. Rafale should be an absolute cancer to be detected at longer ranges. Its one of the stealthiest 4,5 gens out there.
God help russian teams once Link-16 on JHMCS is introduced on fighters and not only few attackers.
I would rather see fixed FMs and mainly, fixed avionics than overperforming FM and totally crippled avionics.
WT sim will be china with germany and optionally with SWE/IT/FR against US/GB/IL. Russian tech tree will start falling off the moment they receive Su-30 and 35 as there wont be nothing better and this will most likely happen with addition of euro canards and these nations will have remaining blocks and tranches of those jets to be addded with significantly improved weaponry and avionics.
Redfor in sims is gone. It will be NATO vs NATO + china.
Beautifully written.
Add r77-1, give su27 and mig29 accurate flight models, nerf the overpeforming f16 and f15e, problem solved
@@kurnass2000 Add 120C5 ( i dont know why russians shoul have 2010-15's missile when US is stuck at 91 one), fix all radars on western jets, give them proper UI and Link 16 when you want to push it so forward.
F15E exept turning performs as it should and probably is worse without CFTs than it should be as we dont have charts with no CFTs. Problem solved. Western stuff was already heavily nerfed in BVR to cater to russian fanboy cucks.
Bro thinks theres only N001V and N019...prob lives in a bubble with zero sense of reality as every american...
@@M0LOCK Pretty much every single mechanical radar of russians is based on N019 with its downsides, every single russian mechanical radar filters mainly by MLC filter, with more modern ones having few ranging techniques. Russian pesa is nowhere near in quality of tracking of mechanical APG-70 or Captor-M.... let alone french pesa or US/EU AESA units. Egyptians critiqued pesa on Su35 heavily while testing it and comparing it to Rafale.
Wherever they can afford to choose between US and russian tech, they choose US, if they cant buy US, they choose french. There is only handful of nations buying from russia and thats mostly due to politicians being stuck 100km deep in putins ass.
Half of typical russian customers in asia are now turning towards french or chinese exports as russian tech is absurdly unreliable and lacking behind western or chinese competition.
Dude you sound like spoonkid. Are you spoonkid?
Whom????????????
@AeroTurtle he is a rust youtuber. I swear he talks and sounds exactly like u
USA #1
Yessir!!!
No balance stick to whatever realism we have left. If you want complete balance go play battlefield.
I wouldn't say battlefield is balanced
If sim was realistic half of the blue side planes would be nerfed because they’re mostly over performing f16, f15e, gripen etc
people want realism really only when it suites their causes, game balance is important especially for those who dont play multiple nations
enjoy the empty lobbies then. its a game at the end of the day
w
Thank you!
Muh tussian bias
Yezzur
I know you are a US main but your knowledge on warsaw pact aircraft FMs is stageringly bad considering you are a sim pilot, the su27 irl is amazing, every pilot that ever flew it says so, you can look at interviews on youtube... it and the the f15C and su27S have a 1° per second rate difference, with the su27 having the major one circle advantage, and lets not even talk about the shitbrick that is the E model and later EX that add even more weight, the su27 and mig29 should run laps around nato aircraft, maybe not against skilled pilots who know their stuff to a T but certainly against an average ameriboo larper, like they did in 1989 when former east german mig29s swept the floor with f16 f15 f18 and i think eurofighters too, they had no answer for it, THAT is reality, read up on it, i stand to gain nothing from lying.
The F-15E is a bit of a shit brick but the EX? No, just no. The EX has better manoeuvrability thanks to its more powerful engines, new flight control systems, etc.
As for the East German MiG-29s they didn’t win over NATO aircraft because of manoeuvrability, the won because of HMD and R-73. In terms of manoeuvrability they were similar to the US jets but the R-73 gave them an edge
Are you a fighter pilot? 🤔 The combat record of Soviet/Russian aircraft are enough to tell you how they fly. And yes, I have seen interviews and even results of when American fighters actually had a chance to duel the Soviet Air Force. With that being said. Its a video game. I don't expect it to be realistic. I expect the game to be balanced. Do the flankers need a buff. Yes. Am I going to listen to armchair warthunder fighter pilots expertise. No.
its redfor btw
Obv a typo
thanks! Made this sleep deprived and missed it xD
I think you forget that REDFOR fights with NATO jets 90% of the time anyway. It doesn't need to be 100% balanced with BLUEFOR fighting jets that are 30 years newer than their own because they have our jets fighting for them. Learn to use unorthadox tactics. REDFOR was using the r27er uncontested for nearly a year, and people complained about it, but Gaijin did nothing. You can't pick and choose when you advocate for balance to suit your needs only. And what is fair about REDFOR getting shiny new toys from the 2000s while the U.S. is stuck with gimped technology from the 80's to compete with them. Split the teams down the middle and cut the crap when it comes to mixed teams, and I'll be the first to advocate for more balance, but you can't have your cake and eat it too.
The 27ER wasn't really a big deal since we had 100m multipathing that made it trivial to defeat any radar guided missile. The 9M was the better missile.
Like aim9m wasn’t more op than the ER. Cry me a river mate.
Isn't the F-16C Block 50 from 2006?
I have to agree with redfor on this one. The R-27ER wasn't as op as people think. All you had to do was multpath at mach and you would merge everytime. NATO had better FM at the time so you would win most of your dogfights. Not only that the U.S has technology from the 2000's. And this is coming from a U.S main. I want something competent to kill, not an easy flanker that bleeds all it's speed and dies.
@AeroTurtle a flanker bleeding its speed and dying is a user error at this point. It's has good characteristics in the 1 circle and less than favorable 2 circle characteristics with insane nose authority and insane high off boresight capabilities. The problem is that it's not easy to fly like the U.S. planes are. You need energy management and good dogfight awareness, which a lot of WarThunder players in general don't have or care to learn. The F-16C first flew in 1984, the Block 50s in 1991, and the Aim-9m was made in 1983. Not to mention the U.S. faces all of their own tech in 90% of SIM matches. Your take is a bad one, but we can respectfully agree to disagree. I have both the Russian and U.S. air trees maxed and over 3000 hours in the game, btw.