A Whistle Stop Tour of Mounted Spear Combat
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- Опубликовано: 6 сен 2024
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You should look up Longobard cavalry. They did make a point of using cavalry, it's not like there's nothing between the Romans and the Normans. Also the Carolingians did use cavalry quite a lot.
I once read that Charles Martel used heavy infantry until facing the Umayyad army at Tours (that was cavalry heavy). After that the Franks developed cavalry very quickly.
Can't remember the source.
The Byzantine use of heavy cavalry in the 10th and 11th century is super interesting. They likely used couched lances before the normans and would advance silently as a large block of men. Not a canter like you mentioned, but they were devastating. One period tactician likened them to a javelin that has one throw. Devastating and terrifying, but you only get one charge in an engagement
The development of the knightly lance continued in Poland, and arguably it is where this weapon has reached its pinnacle.
They wanted to make it longer, but you couldn't do it out of solid wood, because it would become either too flexible, too heavy, or both. So they sawed through the whole shaft lengthwise, dug out all the wood from the center, then glued both halves back together. Some cloth wrapping was glued all over the shaft, to make sure the glue joint won't come apart.
That allowed for crazy length, up to 6.5 meters (21 feet).
They added long colorful pennants to the end, which scared the enemy horses, that at the time were not used to this sight anymore.
As the arm support they used a big wooden ball, which distributed the force of the hit somewhat, though probably not as good as a lance rest.
But it wasn't needed much, because they used a dedicated lance stirrup attached to the front of the saddle. It's possible (albeit difficult) to used the lance while still keeping it in the stirrup, which transfers all the force of the impact to the horse, not to the rider.
It all made it an expensive weapon, considering it was mostly a single use thing. But it did work extremely well.
BTW - The Poles were responsible for reappearance of the lance in the West. That's why so many cavalry units still carry red and white colors.
Thanks for the review. I saw a documentary on this. Great that you brought this to the discussion, esp the lance technology.
@@kaoskronostyche9939 Well, they considered the lance to be their primary and the most effective weapon. At some point the king got a bit nervous, so they consoled him, that even if the heavens above would fall on him, they'd prop it back up with their lances.
Oh, they never served the king. They served *with* the king. And had free access to his private chambers at all times. Fascinating people.
@@bakters Fascinating people is right. And if my poor education serves me correctly, were they not regarded as the most fearsome and effective cavalry in Europe for for decades and decades? Largest cavalry charge in History, wasn't it? Huge influence on all of Europe vis cavalry use, arms, application and all other things cavalry including sword design? Even a huge influence on not only Uniform design but on civilian clothing fashions as well?
Correct me if I am incorrect. Cheers!
From what Ive seen, a lot of Europe maintained heavy lancers well into the 17th century, but there was also a fair amount of debate between the use of lancers or cuirassiers.
@@Specter_1125 " *debate between the use of lancers or cuirassiers* "
This shouldn't even be a debate, because one option does not exclude the other. Lancers can have a brace of pistols, cuirassiers could carry a lance.
It's only a "choice" if you want to save money. Which Western armies had to do, because the soldiers tried to rely on their pay for living. The nobility was not as powerful and rich as in Poland, so they had no reason to equip and train their sons in order to protect their privileged social position.
Similar situation with armor. I think even Zack stated here, that "firearms were better at penetrating armor". That's true, but misleading. It's *easy* to make and wear armor which protects you from blackpowder smallarms, and you do not have to "penetrate armor" in order to win a joust. When the other guy hits the deck, he's out, even if his armor held up. As opposed to surviving a musket shot to the breastplate, which might have scared him for a moment, but that'd be it.
Really interesting video! I think many people think of cavalry being quite static and unchanging, but in reality ancient cavalry was quite different to medieval. Nicely demonstrated!
One thing Mongol heavy cavalry did that seems to have been different from what a lot of heavy cavalry did is they used hooks on their lances to hook opposing riders off their horses. I am not at all an expert on horse combat and I have very little (but some) experience riding but I presume this is done if you initial thrust misses (or perhaps deliberately if you are trying to capture someone). I imagine perhaps the pull back motion to hook someone might be quite similar to pulling a lance out of someone or bringing it back if you miss anyway and it seems to have been quite effective. This is mentioned in Korea and by European writers so it seems to have been a widespread weapon. Keeping in mind that Mongols would have used the spear differently than contemporary European riders. They would deploy their lances primarily two-handed but they of course had the stirrup being some of the first adopters of the technology centuries earlier so they could ride up at speed and deliver the lance that way.
The hook might have been inspired by Chinese polearms but it seems like while hooks are common on polearms elsewhere, the idea of adding hooks to a lance is less universal and I suspect that is down to method of use. It probably would not cross your mind to go through the extra effort of adding a metal hook (not trivial in a pre-industrial economy!) if you are intending to also use your spears as javelins or if you either use it "normally" one-handed with a shield, or you couch it just as they did in Europe. Hooking then does not seem very practical but if you are using it two-handed and you are stable on your horse then it is more practical I assume.
I'd love to see a more in-depth video on this topic. Also it's awesome when you have your armor and weapons with you when you discuss the various pieces of armor and weapons.
most interesting
In Japan, where materials on medieval Europe are scarce, this video is much appreciated.
My question is, is it possible to attack with a lance in each of the right and left hands in mounted combat?
If not possible, is it possible to have two scimitars in a mounted combat?
You said whilstle-stop tour and indeed it was. Good broad strokes, concise discussion. You brought forth some very interesting comments as well. I am wanting to get around to mounting a spearhead and butt cap on a good hardwood shaft. I have two different lengths of wood so I can experiment too. So anything about spears ... . Cheers!
So, some comments:
1. Javelins / throwing spears definitely were used from chariots, both by Bronze Age Greeks and by Celts. As for melee spears, I've read that it is possible to use them against other charioteers and against fleeing infantry, and there are some descriptions in the "Iliad" that may be interpreted as melee spears used from chariots, but it is hart to tell for sure without practical experiments.
2. Cataphracts/cataphractarii (very heavy cavalry with very long spears) that the (Late) Romans were adopted from the Sarmatians and/or the Parthians definitely should be mentioned. The Byzantines used cataphracts till 10th or 11th century, before adapting more Western European heavy cavalry.
3. Goths, Franks and other Germanic peoples definitely used cavalry (actually Germanic cavalry existed since the times of Caesar ant Tacitus). There also are some mentions of Anglo-Saxon cavalry. Celts, such as Picts, Welsh and Bretons, also used cavalry in the post-Roman Europe. I've read that the Bretons were famous as mounted javelin throwers.
4. Polish winged hussars and lancers definitely are important. If I understand correctly, Western European cavalry started use pistols instead of lances in 16th century and cavalry charges with swords became popular in the 17th century, while Polish cavalry continued to use lances, and lancers became more popular in Europe during Napoleonic wars because of Polish influence.
5. And while in the Eurasian Steppe the main cavalry weapon was the bow and Steppe horse archers are pretty famous, there were some Steppe peoples who used spears and lances very successfully. Firstly, Sarmatians during late Antiquity had a lot of heavy cavalry with spears. And later Kalmyks used lance charges very successfully in the 17th century.
got the point, for the algorithm
Were the Franks not big users of cavalry? Though I don't know that their use of them differed that much from other people of the periods you mentioned, I have the impression that they were a cavalry power of the early medieval period. Also, you went into how a light lance withdraws the weapon after striking the enemy, but with those heavy couched lances, once you've driven it through a person(!) how do you get it back, or is it discarded after that/usually broken? It seems the same maneuver wouldn't be possible.
I've seen many examples of the first in demonstrations of various kind, but never the second.
I missed the cataphracts of the late roman, early medieval period.
Nothing to say just an obligatory algorithm boost for the channel 👍👍
A topic I’ve been wondering about is the difference in power between hitting a target straight on with the lance rather than at an angle like you would in a joust.
you are doing a great job, with these videos.
What injuries have you had jousting? Any broken thumbs?
yessssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
What horse breed do you feel is best for modern mounted combat?
I like cobs generally, because they're calmer than what was originally used, so as we're not actually trying to kill anyone that's a good thing.
🗿👍