Since the graphic shows that both Ivey and Oppenheim have the 7d, I really think that Ivey had in fact QJo with the J of diamonds which would make his play standard on all streets. Also it says 24% on the flop for Ivey which would we correct for top pair vs overpair.
Hey Doug, I could totally say that you are not only good poker player, but also a very talented presenter. I really enjoy the way you model your videos, since they catch attention on multiple steps, forcing audience to think and in many cases smile. That is definitely fantastic!! Also, I was watching you as a poker pro in HU back in late 2010~, and even though I am already retired from poker, these videos are very very interesting to watch!:) Keep going!
Things have to be a little bit akward for Doug now, right? He thought Ivey was bad/tilted enough to make that awful river call when it was actually a somewhat standard call. Yuck. :/
Doug, 7 days ago I was just thinking to myself, "Damn, I'm going to have to promote Doug a bit higher than just being my 7th favourite RUclipsr", because you were doing such a great job, giving us more than 7 videos a week, and really giving us value for money. And by money I mean the $7 a week I pay to have internet. Thank you Doug... ...7
If we assume Phil has QJo, I like his line okay. That said, I like Viffer's smooth call much less. Always good to cull the field. Slow playing a smashed flop is one thing; slow playing pre is dangerous.
Nice. This vid is a total mindf*** because the graphic gets Phil's cards wrong. It would be awesome to see if some pros could figure it out just by watching. Ivey actually played well.
Any possibility Ivey calls to see what the hell Viff took that odd line with, for future info? There just aren't enough reasons otherwise that he'd call here. He rarely beats any bluff, only other option might be he misread his hand.
and since i am looking these videos i made an other step foreward. playing more agressive more tricky (like bluffraising the turn with a gut shot) and in many situations i am right. but its still taff to grind a lot.
if the equity shows 14% on turn it means 6 outs, only hand that has 6 outs there to river is QT I think so he called with open-ended and queen high on river, I can be worng of course
Lot of people commenting that Doug got confused with this video. Dudes, he was just drunk! Don't believe me? click on the gear icon on the video and select 0.5 speed. Enjoy! lol p.s. Doug we all love you! :-D
I know man :-) I just used the misreading for let you see that the slow version of the video is funny ;-) You are doing a fantastic job on this channel! Keep going (y)
It's obvious that there's a graphical glitch in this hand, because the equities doesn't add up and there are two 7 of diamonds in the hand. It's highly likely that Ivey's hand isn't displayed correctly. A hand that would fit the percenatges is Q10 without a flushdraw. It matches both on the flop and the turn. If that's the case, it's a good open preflop, a good cbet and on the turn Phil might have planned to checkraise. If Peat plays all his draws like this, calling the river with Q high isn't THAT crazy, not good, but not outrageous
As mentioned below, you are clearly right: Oppenheim is supposed to have a 7d as well. Also, while he would be drawing dead with Q7 against kings, his equity on the turn is stated to be 14% , so he had 6 (?) outs at this point, like either QJ or QT.
Ok so funny thing is, its pretty safe to assume Phil Ivey actually had 10-Q here. If you look at the percentages they show he has 24% equity with his hand. he only has 20% equity with JQ, so if the 7d is a typto and the equities are accurate that leaves his hand to be Q10. funny he called with Q high still though.
The graphics are right guys. With the thousands of videos of Phil Ivey on youtube, you can see that he regularly plays Qc7d. It's his signature hand. Virtually every video on youtube shows that he has this in his range. David Peet also almost always goes for value with 10-8 off here so his call makes a lot of sense. C'mon guys.
i don't understanding the idea of knowing when to bluff as you describe it. post flop on the ivey/peat hand you begin to list a range of hands that he could bluff with it that spot..but he doesn't have those hands so how is that relevant? if you could, i would love to see a video better explaining your thought process on this idea. thanks, love the videos
What was up with the graphics in the broadcast? They said both Ivey and Oppenheim had the 7 of Diamonds? Also, it mentioned Ivey having a 14% chance of winning after the turn. What were his outs if that was the case? I can't think of them.
Doug, I think they screwed up the production on this hand. Note that there are two 7 of diamonds listed.. I think Ivey had QT. Notice that on the turn they list the percentages as 86:14, which is wrong if Q7 is truly Ivey's holdings. However, if Ivey has the QcTd (which I think is what he actually had) then he would indeed be 14% to win the hand, and this hand would make a LOT more sense.
There are two 7d in the graphics, so I think Ivey did not have Q7o. His actions make much more sense if he has QJo, and because both he and Oppenheim has the 7d I think it´s valid to think that they just got it wrong this time. I know it happens that the deck has two of the same card, but it´s less likely than the graphics being wrong.
dude doug, I kinda doubt ivey had Q7d, it was most likely the screen error (as Oppenheim had the 7d), Ivey like have Td (which can be mistaken for another number card) for OESD which make sense for the turn to be 14% on the screen (around 6 outs?), or even just J, which makes sense here. I can't see ivey randomly calling Q high
Viffer flatting KK is ok imo because on the button hes going to call wide with so many junky hands so it's good to mix in some strong hands, also if Ivey is opening too wide (like he is with Q7o) then he's his going to win the pot preflop a lot and not he the chance to play post flop in position with a disguised hand with a spewy image
Hey Doug, if you were in Viffers spot after the flop, what would you opt to raise to in order not to scare off Ivey? I was thinking raise to 7-8K but would like to hear your opinion
It's quite clear what happened here. Given that we know how these top pros generally play, we can feel confident in our assumptions by watching the hand play out. Ivey is more aggressive than most top pros. His opening range and bluffing range are as aggressive as possible without being a maniac. He bluffs in big spots and big pots more than most aggressive top pros dream about. We know this, Viffer knows this. Viffer is more passive than most top pros. His base line of play is more of a trap, pot-control, defensive strategy. He is very knowledgeable about his opponents play, and adjusts his play accordingly. We know this, Ivey knows this. Ivey opens for a raise from the hijack with Q7 off. Durrr is in the cutoff, also very aggressive. Viffer has the button, tigher player. For Ivey, the cards don't matter here. Why did he pick this spot, idk. Is he bored? Is he tilty? Doesn't matter. If he raises from the cutoff in this spot, it looks stronger than usual. Dwan is on his left. Most players won't raise with Dwan on their left without at least marginally good cards, right? And Viffer is basically a nit that won't call on the button unless he actually has a good hand, right? So situationally, the range for this raise, even from Ivey, looks stronger than usual. The other players at the table are aware of this. Viffer flats on the button with KK. Some players do this with the intention of 'offensively' trapping. Being coy to extract the most chips possible. Viffers flat is a 'defensive' trap. It's hard for him to narrow Ivey's range. He could have any two cards. But raising into Dwan and himself, it's possible he could have a big hand also. Not wanting to lose his stack to a player who could have anything here, he pot-controls and takes a defensive line by flat-trapping. Flop changes nothing, as most will. Ivey c-bets. Sticking with his strategy of using the situation (and boredom? lol) to emulate stronger holdings than reality allowed, he bets the flop. With a rather wet bored and no help to his KK, Viffer sticks with his natural pot-controlling line, just calling. He knows he's prob still good here, but continues to keep the pot small with one good pair against the unpredictable Ivey. The ace on the turn is normally a great 2nd-barrel turn card for the aggressive bluff here. This often looks to the the player that called the c-bet as if the aggressive preflop raise just air c-bet the flop, then got lucky, right? Ivey knows this. He's done it too many times to count. But being flatted by Viffer on the flop sent a red flag up in Ivey's mind. Ivey knows most of his range is one decent pair, prob a J, or one of a few draws out there. The 9 and J fall well within Viffers preflop flatting range, and there's hearts. So a lot of Viffers range now is 9 through A combinations, and two hearts. The ace is a bad card for Ivey to bluff in this spot. If Viffer can call the flop, the ace may very well have helped him, or at the least given him more outs. Ivey checks. Viffer checks back. Still pot-controlling and now a scary ace on the turn, he checks back. This is polarizing to Ivey, who is prob expecting a bet here from Viffer. Ivey narrows his range to one pair with the 9 or J, Q 10, or a flush draw with no Ace. River is basically a blank here. It brings the third diamond and straight card, but given the way the hand has played down, these are very slim possibilities. Ivey checks. He knows he can only bluff if Viffer missed a draw, but knows even if that's the case, he has high-ish cards and may make a hero call. Ivey checked the turn and river to Viffer, which to any good player is a sign of giving up. A bet here would inherently be perceived as a bluff by Viffer. He may have to talk himself out of making a hero call here after Ivey basically gave up after being called on the flop. Viffer quickly bets 10k, laying Ivey 3 to 1 odds. Viffer normally checks hereafter how he's played the hand, but it's going to be televised and he has to redeem how meekly he's played the hand and throw a timid, weak value bet into the pot. If he checks back again after Ivey gave up, he just looks weak. It's easy to see he doesn't want to bet, but feels obligated to do so in defiance of himself and his image. lol. Ivey calls. With Q 7. HIgh cards, nothing really. Why? After playing the hand and narrowing his opponents range, he was prob 99% sure Viffer was checking back again to showdown. Viffer strangely tosses 10k into the pot. This changed a lot of things to Ivey. He knew at best Viffer was thinly value betting. And now it was more a possibility that he had Q 10 or medium hearts and was trying to bluff. He rarely bluffs, so why is he attempting to thinly vb now on the river, after Ivey had raised pf and c-bet the flop? Viffer was now attempting to extract a little value out of a pot that Ivey had taken the aggressive line on? Hmmm, something just doesn't add up. So Ivey calls, knowing he's prob lost 10k, but knowing he can now beat a bit more of Viffers range to bet here...but mostly out of curiosity. For future hands in that session and more. The thin vb Viffer makes on the river is the weird play. Ivey is curious what Viffer has bc Viffer is either suddenly bluffing him, or he's meakly value betting something he was previously content to call with. If I'm Ivey, and I know Viffer is apprehensive about playing big pots after the flop with me, and he's now value betting in this spot after the way the hand came down, i'm very curious. We know how Viffer plays, and for him to play this way against Ivey is unusual. Knowing what Viffer has here is a big, permanent piece of information about his game for the future. Good call Ivey
Sean Ó Briain doug see all hands like an online poker grinder multi tabling while life poker is totaly different. he never mention reading people while ivey is great at it obviously
I think Ivey noticed a tell and was paying him off to confirm that tell... I have done that before, noticed a consistent set of behaviors from a person when playing and payed them to confirm that my thesis was indeed correct
he said ivey had a reasonable spot tot Bluff on the river, one of the reasonable being that het has a diamond making it less likely that peat has a flush. But really how much does the zeven of diamond reduce the likely Hood that peat has two diamond? ( Just ignoring the fact that ivey probably did nog had the zeven of diamond)
Is it possible Ivey paid the river to see his opponent's cards? That's the only reason, right? I know I'm late to the party, and Doug's hand breakdowns are brilliant, but watching this hand there might be a lot to say about the table dynamics and wider player dynamics.
Everyone's a general after the battle is over. From Phil's Pov, Peat could have absolutely anything. Missed AK, bad AxSuited, 8s, 7s, KQ, QxSuited, even KxSuited or weaker Suited connectors that might miss and be able to be stolen. The only mistakes I see is that Q7 is horrible to try to steal with from the start, but keep in mind that you can still hit with this hand and be paid for it. That and of course calling on the river, which was very strange O.o Idk, I find it hard to judge Phil for his plays regardless of how bad they seem sometimes. He's obviously massively successful and I guess sometimes playing junk like Q7 works into his system overall. I think for players like Phil, its a lot less about what you're holding at the time and a lot more about the timing itself. He felt that for whatever reason, he needed to try to take down a pot at that given time and I think he would have tried to do it with virtually anything, even 7-2o. This was probably all part of some advanced table image / info farming meta game that we just don't really wrap our heads around completely. The call at the end doesn't make sense no matter what context its in, though. That I can agree was bizarre, maybe the info was just that valuable, who knows xD I want to say that the players at this table know each other well enough that they wouldn't be buying information? But I really don't know, it just really looked like Phil actually didn't give a damn about the money, going by the look on his face lol
Doug, that's the difference between an online player and a live player. It's very obv here why Phil calls here. There r two reasons why Phil calls here. 1) David's body language is completely different in this hand. The way he throws his chips in the pot is different from how he normally does. So Ivey can be calling for info. I.e. To make a mental note as to how David plays certain hands. 2) normally when people snap bet rivers when checked to them it's a bluff. K and q highs all have show down values so if we go by the theory that snap bets are usually bluffs Ivey could have the best hand here.
Doug - Isn't this call more about Viffer's image? Isn't possible that Viffer could have floated with total air on the flop, would check behind on the turn while intending to give up, but then decided to overbet the pot on the river when Ivey checked again and showed so much weakness? (I admit, with anyone else this would be HIGHLY questionable.)
Slightly above average players like Poke will say " I don't get it" in regards to Iveys snap call on river. Ivey was calling for information. Not because he thought he had the better hand. He did beat a couple of legit draws, but this was an information call. Differ did a lot of physical tells and moves this hand. Ivey's photographic memory remembers all of them. This is why Ivey is one of the greatest and a commentator literally said " I don't get it"
i think Ivey just wanted to build his image. He probably knew he was beat, but if he folded, Peat would have known Ivey had nothing or something like this
Sometimes pros even check out sometimes. or he knew he was beat and paid 10k to see the hand the Viffer was making that kind of bet with for future hands against him.
Maybe he just miss read his own hand, and thought the 7 was a jack. I’ve betted with the best hand before, then when I turned over my hand it turned out I was bluffing. I had no idea, but I thought I was so strong that so did everyone else. It’s not that I’m rubbish, I just forgot to take in my cards when I looked at them 😅😂
omg , i've never played live probably will at some point ,hope to never play K's that badly omg and to what ivey was thinking couldn't have been poker lmao
A player did called me with Q high and won. Cause he wanted to see wat I play with. He went on to take most of my money later. Needless to say, that day I didn't perform my best.
You should watch the videos The Poker Guys have they don't spend a lot of time talking but their analysis is very similar to yours. I like the video but it could be better
Lur Tor Doug mentioned in an older video that those ads are targeted at people who have watch one of his vids, but are not subscribed. This often updates slowly he said
![Twenty One Pilots - The Line (from Arcane Season 2) [Official Audio]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/XCz7WUotXs8/mqdefault.jpg)
Since the graphic shows that both Ivey and Oppenheim have the 7d, I really think that Ivey had in fact QJo with the J of diamonds which would make his play standard on all streets. Also it says 24% on the flop for Ivey which would we correct for top pair vs overpair.
you are right. cause then ivey's play makes absolutely sence.
to the top
lokwidator Yeah, and they give Ivey 14% on the turn, but if he had Q7 he's drawing dead. Oops. The river call makes much more sense with a J.
Maybe someone should have checked the deck. ;)
Q10 is the hand. He's supposed to have 6 outs on the turn. QJ is only 5 outs = 19% on the flop and 11% on the turn.
The graphics are wrong. This wasn't even a poker hand. It was a naked mud wrestling match between two Scandinavian women.
AHAHAHA Im dead
The graphics are wrong. The player is Tom Dwan, not Phill Ivey.
Literally such a funny comment
He called to see what Viffer had
Exactly
Hey Doug,
I could totally say that you are not only good poker player, but also a very talented presenter. I really enjoy the way you model your videos, since they catch attention on multiple steps, forcing audience to think and in many cases smile. That is definitely fantastic!!
Also, I was watching you as a poker pro in HU back in late 2010~, and even though I am already retired from poker, these videos are very very interesting to watch!:)
Keep going!
Thanks! Appreciate it dude.
The graphics show that both Phil Ivey and Oppenheim have the 7 of dimonds. WTF m8
They also show Ivey with 14% on the turn when he's definitely dead
I was wondering that I thought I was just crazy.
Things have to be a little bit akward for Doug now, right? He thought Ivey was bad/tilted enough to make that awful river call when it was actually a somewhat standard call. Yuck. :/
Hard to blame Doug for it when Ali Nejad makes the same mistake
😱😱 you are right, didn't even notice. thanks for the comment!
The graphics for Ivey's cards in the hand are wrong. Ivey has QJ IIRC.
That would make sense since Ivey should of been drawing dead on the turn with Q7 off and the percentages showed him at 14%
The graphics showed both ivey and hoffenheim had 7 of diamonds, maybe ivey was holding another card instead of the 7 of diamonds
Doug, 7 days ago I was just thinking to myself, "Damn, I'm going to have to promote Doug a bit higher than just being my 7th favourite RUclipsr", because you were doing such a great job, giving us more than 7 videos a week, and really giving us value for money. And by money I mean the $7 a week I pay to have internet. Thank you Doug...
...7
Why not call it Polker after Dark?
Why not call it Holecard Cams After Dark? :P
You might fool the new guys but only one comment can be stolen we all know that one, make your original stuff dude ;)
Like Poker Alfter Doug?
poker after crack
If we assume Phil has QJo, I like his line okay. That said, I like Viffer's smooth call much less. Always good to cull the field. Slow playing a smashed flop is one thing; slow playing pre is dangerous.
Trane Francks Thanks where do I send the check for this lesson?
Hey Doug. Can you make video about top three mistakes to avoid in poker table? Thanks, Love.
offtopic - Why did it show 86%-Vif , 14%-Ivey on the turn when clearly Ivey is drawing dead?
Great vid as always , Sir !
oh yes and doug tx for no spoiler this time - you are getting pretty good on that yt thing - love your channel
ivey forgot more poker than ull ever know
So much great content Doug - keep it coming!
This was a very good analysis of the hand
I think it's pretty clear that they got the graphics wrong or Ivey missred his hand. They say oppenheim and Ivey both had the 7 of dimonds
Nice. This vid is a total mindf*** because the graphic gets Phil's cards wrong. It would be awesome to see if some pros could figure it out just by watching. Ivey actually played well.
both players have 7 of diamonds and Ivey has 14% equity on turn but he is drawing dead, WTF?
It doesn't matter that there were 2 Seven of diamonds in the deck and Phil loses his mind with the Queen-Seven - Doug's analysis is priceless.
0:53 Viffer looking real strong
I'm glad you got your hair cut. Your other hair cut was tilting the hell out of me haha. Love your channel btw.
Any possibility Ivey calls to see what the hell Viff took that odd line with, for future info? There just aren't enough reasons otherwise that he'd call here. He rarely beats any bluff, only other option might be he misread his hand.
woah you have a reasonable haircut finally
He has the computer hand. His hand will be good on river exactly half the time
... that's not how that works?
Patrick Laffey yes specifically heads up against 100% of combos and you're pretty much right
sure it is but its on the wrong end of a coin flip no fold might as well play bac at casino
Love the ending Doug!
1:20 how exactly do you get suited aces?
Suited Aces means your two hole cards are suited with one ace.
and since i am looking these videos i made an other step foreward. playing more agressive more tricky (like bluffraising the turn with a gut shot) and in many situations i am right. but its still taff to grind a lot.
Did we actually SEE Iveys hand ?? I mean, the graphics was clearly wrong .! Would make some sense if Ivey had QJ or Q9
if the equity shows 14% on turn it means 6 outs, only hand that has 6 outs there to river is QT I think so he called with open-ended and queen high on river, I can be worng of course
love your vids and the poker guys:)
I think he just called to see his hand, im sure the great phil ivey didnt think he had a slight chance of winning
Lot of people commenting that Doug got confused with this video. Dudes, he was just drunk! Don't believe me? click on the gear icon on the video and select 0.5 speed. Enjoy! lol
p.s. Doug we all love you! :-D
+DionisOdam I just didn't know it was a card reading error
I know man :-) I just used the misreading for let you see that the slow version of the video is funny ;-) You are doing a fantastic job on this channel! Keep going (y)
It's obvious that there's a graphical glitch in this hand, because the equities doesn't add up and there are two 7 of diamonds in the hand. It's highly likely that Ivey's hand isn't displayed correctly.
A hand that would fit the percenatges is Q10 without a flushdraw. It matches both on the flop and the turn. If that's the case, it's a good open preflop, a good cbet and on the turn Phil might have planned to checkraise. If Peat plays all his draws like this, calling the river with Q high isn't THAT crazy, not good, but not outrageous
As mentioned below, you are clearly right: Oppenheim is supposed to have a 7d as well. Also, while he would be drawing dead with Q7 against kings, his equity on the turn is stated to be 14% , so he had 6 (?) outs at this point, like either QJ or QT.
6 outs is correct, though I think Q10 is the only match. QJ is only 5 outs(2xJ,3xQ) T8 is 8 outs etc.
the pot should have been divided evenly 3 ways since there was two 7 of diamonds in the deck
Ok so funny thing is, its pretty safe to assume Phil Ivey actually had 10-Q here. If you look at the percentages they show he has 24% equity with his hand. he only has 20% equity with JQ, so if the 7d is a typto and the equities are accurate that leaves his hand to be Q10. funny he called with Q high still though.
wow i just clicked an mma video on my phone and a doug polk advert came up!? does that cost alot??
The graphics are right guys. With the thousands of videos of Phil Ivey on youtube, you can see that he regularly plays Qc7d. It's his signature hand. Virtually every video on youtube shows that he has this in his range. David Peet also almost always goes for value with 10-8 off here so his call makes a lot of sense. C'mon guys.
@Doug Polk Poker may need to contact PAD personnel to check up on this to see what the mistake was as this channel depends on reliable data.
i don't understanding the idea of knowing when to bluff as you describe it. post flop on the ivey/peat hand you begin to list a range of hands that he could bluff with it that spot..but he doesn't have those hands so how is that relevant? if you could, i would love to see a video better explaining your thought process on this idea. thanks, love the videos
What was up with the graphics in the broadcast? They said both Ivey and Oppenheim had the 7 of Diamonds? Also, it mentioned Ivey having a 14% chance of winning after the turn. What were his outs if that was the case? I can't think of them.
Ivey had qt not q7. Makes a lot more sense
Not on the river though.
He still beats nothing
Yeah that makes perfect sense. Call 10k into a 30k pot on the river with high card.
Doug, I think they screwed up the production on this hand. Note that there are two 7 of diamonds listed.. I think Ivey had QT.
Notice that on the turn they list the percentages as 86:14, which is wrong if Q7 is truly Ivey's holdings. However, if Ivey has the QcTd (which I think is what he actually had) then he would indeed be 14% to win the hand, and this hand would make a LOT more sense.
doug surprised to see new content right after your bday..your not hungover?
Could you do a Poker Hands on some hands from 2 Months 2 Million? Seeing Viffer reminds me of them figuring out one of his tells and destroying him.
two 7 of diamonds
I ask Phil about this hand a while ago, he said he had Q’s. Make sense too how the hand played out
It would be 💯 better if you didn't pause the video so long for your commentary
To be fair it's Viffer and Ivey probably has lot's of history here with him. But yeah great to see Ivey tilt :) even though he hides it well.
There are two 7d in the graphics, so I think Ivey did not have Q7o. His actions make much more sense if he has QJo, and because both he and Oppenheim has the 7d I think it´s valid to think that they just got it wrong this time. I know it happens that the deck has two of the same card, but it´s less likely than the graphics being wrong.
dude doug, I kinda doubt ivey had Q7d, it was most likely the screen error (as Oppenheim had the 7d), Ivey like have Td (which can be mistaken for another number card) for OESD which make sense for the turn to be 14% on the screen (around 6 outs?), or even just J, which makes sense here. I can't see ivey randomly calling Q high
Guyssss Ivey had QTo not QJo, you can check the % it in poker calculator it matches the % in video as if Ivey had QTo...
I remember this hand when it happened and I couldn't figure out what Ivey was doing lol
Viffer flatting KK is ok imo because on the button hes going to call wide with so many junky hands so it's good to mix in some strong hands, also if Ivey is opening too wide (like he is with Q7o) then he's his going to win the pot preflop a lot and not he the chance to play post flop in position with a disguised hand with a spewy image
Hey Doug, if you were in Viffers spot after the flop, what would you opt to raise to in order not to scare off Ivey? I was thinking raise to 7-8K but would like to hear your opinion
OK the comments explained a lot here. Lol, Doug must have been shocked when he saw that hand, even Bill Perkins wouldn't mess up a hand like this.
It's quite clear what happened here. Given that we know how these top pros generally play, we can feel confident in our assumptions by watching the hand play out.
Ivey is more aggressive than most top pros. His opening range and bluffing range are as aggressive as possible without being a maniac. He bluffs in big spots and big pots more than most aggressive top pros dream about. We know this, Viffer knows this.
Viffer is more passive than most top pros. His base line of play is more of a trap, pot-control, defensive strategy. He is very knowledgeable about his opponents play, and adjusts his play accordingly. We know this, Ivey knows this.
Ivey opens for a raise from the hijack with Q7 off. Durrr is in the cutoff, also very aggressive. Viffer has the button, tigher player. For Ivey, the cards don't matter here. Why did he pick this spot, idk. Is he bored? Is he tilty? Doesn't matter. If he raises from the cutoff in this spot, it looks stronger than usual. Dwan is on his left. Most players won't raise with Dwan on their left without at least marginally good cards, right? And Viffer is basically a nit that won't call on the button unless he actually has a good hand, right? So situationally, the range for this raise, even from Ivey, looks stronger than usual. The other players at the table are aware of this.
Viffer flats on the button with KK. Some players do this with the intention of 'offensively' trapping. Being coy to extract the most chips possible. Viffers flat is a 'defensive' trap. It's hard for him to narrow Ivey's range. He could have any two cards. But raising into Dwan and himself, it's possible he could have a big hand also. Not wanting to lose his stack to a player who could have anything here, he pot-controls and takes a defensive line by flat-trapping.
Flop changes nothing, as most will. Ivey c-bets. Sticking with his strategy of using the situation (and boredom? lol) to emulate stronger holdings than reality allowed, he bets the flop.
With a rather wet bored and no help to his KK, Viffer sticks with his natural pot-controlling line, just calling. He knows he's prob still good here, but continues to keep the pot small with one good pair against the unpredictable Ivey.
The ace on the turn is normally a great 2nd-barrel turn card for the aggressive bluff here. This often looks to the the player that called the c-bet as if the aggressive preflop raise just air c-bet the flop, then got lucky, right? Ivey knows this. He's done it too many times to count. But being flatted by Viffer on the flop sent a red flag up in Ivey's mind. Ivey knows most of his range is one decent pair, prob a J, or one of a few draws out there. The 9 and J fall well within Viffers preflop flatting range, and there's hearts. So a lot of Viffers range now is 9 through A combinations, and two hearts. The ace is a bad card for Ivey to bluff in this spot. If Viffer can call the flop, the ace may very well have helped him, or at the least given him more outs. Ivey checks.
Viffer checks back. Still pot-controlling and now a scary ace on the turn, he checks back. This is polarizing to Ivey, who is prob expecting a bet here from Viffer. Ivey narrows his range to one pair with the 9 or J, Q 10, or a flush draw with no Ace.
River is basically a blank here. It brings the third diamond and straight card, but given the way the hand has played down, these are very slim possibilities. Ivey checks. He knows he can only bluff if Viffer missed a draw, but knows even if that's the case, he has high-ish cards and may make a hero call. Ivey checked the turn and river to Viffer, which to any good player is a sign of giving up. A bet here would inherently be perceived as a bluff by Viffer. He may have to talk himself out of making a hero call here after Ivey basically gave up after being called on the flop.
Viffer quickly bets 10k, laying Ivey 3 to 1 odds. Viffer normally checks hereafter how he's played the hand, but it's going to be televised and he has to redeem how meekly he's played the hand and throw a timid, weak value bet into the pot. If he checks back again after Ivey gave up, he just looks weak. It's easy to see he doesn't want to bet, but feels obligated to do so in defiance of himself and his image. lol.
Ivey calls. With Q 7. HIgh cards, nothing really. Why? After playing the hand and narrowing his opponents range, he was prob 99% sure Viffer was checking back again to showdown. Viffer strangely tosses 10k into the pot. This changed a lot of things to Ivey. He knew at best Viffer was thinly value betting. And now it was more a possibility that he had Q 10 or medium hearts and was trying to bluff. He rarely bluffs, so why is he attempting to thinly vb now on the river, after Ivey had raised pf and c-bet the flop? Viffer was now attempting to extract a little value out of a pot that Ivey had taken the aggressive line on? Hmmm, something just doesn't add up. So Ivey calls, knowing he's prob lost 10k, but knowing he can now beat a bit more of Viffers range to bet here...but mostly out of curiosity. For future hands in that session and more. The thin vb Viffer makes on the river is the weird play. Ivey is curious what Viffer has bc Viffer is either suddenly bluffing him, or he's meakly value betting something he was previously content to call with. If I'm Ivey, and I know Viffer is apprehensive about playing big pots after the flop with me, and he's now value betting in this spot after the way the hand came down, i'm very curious. We know how Viffer plays, and for him to play this way against Ivey is unusual. Knowing what Viffer has here is a big, permanent piece of information about his game for the future.
Good call Ivey
Maybe it's just some meta game, Ivey trying to get a solid read on Viffer?
Sean Ó Briain doug see all hands like an online poker grinder multi tabling while life poker is totaly different. he never mention reading people while ivey is great at it obviously
Ivey just called, to get some info. Polk!!! Thats what I think
Can`t find any other explanation for that call.
I think Ivey had QJ since the graphic incorrectly had two players with the 7 of diamonds
I thought we were about to see a huge move lol.
I think Ivey noticed a tell and was paying him off to confirm that tell... I have done that before, noticed a consistent set of behaviors from a person when playing and payed them to confirm that my thesis was indeed correct
the graphics also show that ivey has outs on the turn? where is the 14% from?
So glad that Phil Ivey could not claim his winnings vs Genting Casinos, that gave me a good basis for the coursework for my Law Degree.
he said ivey had a reasonable spot tot Bluff on the river, one of the reasonable being that het has a diamond making it less likely that peat has a flush. But really how much does the zeven of diamond reduce the likely Hood that peat has two diamond? ( Just ignoring the fact that ivey probably did nog had the zeven of diamond)
Is it possible Ivey paid the river to see his opponent's cards? That's the only reason, right? I know I'm late to the party, and Doug's hand breakdowns are brilliant, but watching this hand there might be a lot to say about the table dynamics and wider player dynamics.
Everyone's a general after the battle is over.
From Phil's Pov, Peat could have absolutely anything. Missed AK, bad AxSuited, 8s, 7s, KQ, QxSuited, even KxSuited or weaker Suited connectors that might miss and be able to be stolen.
The only mistakes I see is that Q7 is horrible to try to steal with from the start, but keep in mind that you can still hit with this hand and be paid for it. That and of course calling on the river, which was very strange O.o
Idk, I find it hard to judge Phil for his plays regardless of how bad they seem sometimes. He's obviously massively successful and I guess sometimes playing junk like Q7 works into his system overall.
I think for players like Phil, its a lot less about what you're holding at the time and a lot more about the timing itself. He felt that for whatever reason, he needed to try to take down a pot at that given time and I think he would have tried to do it with virtually anything, even 7-2o.
This was probably all part of some advanced table image / info farming meta game that we just don't really wrap our heads around completely.
The call at the end doesn't make sense no matter what context its in, though. That I can agree was bizarre, maybe the info was just that valuable, who knows xD I want to say that the players at this table know each other well enough that they wouldn't be buying information? But I really don't know, it just really looked like Phil actually didn't give a damn about the money, going by the look on his face lol
Questioning Phil Ivey is like questioning Tiger Woods golf swing or MJs jump shot.
Doug, that's the difference between an online player and a live player. It's very obv here why Phil calls here. There r two reasons why Phil calls here. 1) David's body language is completely different in this hand. The way he throws his chips in the pot is different from how he normally does. So Ivey can be calling for info. I.e. To make a mental note as to how David plays certain hands. 2) normally when people snap bet rivers when checked to them it's a bluff. K and q highs all have show down values so if we go by the theory that snap bets are usually bluffs Ivey could have the best hand here.
Move over Doug..... u should start ur own channel.... did u teachnDan Blitzerian how to play poker too.... do tell
Just in case no one noticed, the graphics were wrong.
You heard it here first.
I watched this like three days ago, I thought he misread his hand or the graphics were wrong lol
I wonder if Doug Polk hair sticks up more when Jennifer Tilly is playing at table?
You should show the whole hand first and then go over it with your comments after. You’ll get and keep more subscribers that way.
"Who the hell is David Peat? Ohhh it's VIFFER!" =p
Doug - Isn't this call more about Viffer's image? Isn't possible that Viffer could have floated with total air on the flop, would check behind on the turn while intending to give up, but then decided to overbet the pot on the river when Ivey checked again and showed so much weakness? (I admit, with anyone else this would be HIGHLY questionable.)
Slightly above average players like Poke will say " I don't get it" in regards to Iveys snap call on river. Ivey was calling for information. Not because he thought he had the better hand. He did beat a couple of legit draws, but this was an information call. Differ did a lot of physical tells and moves this hand. Ivey's photographic memory remembers all of them. This is why Ivey is one of the greatest and a commentator literally said " I don't get it"
i think Ivey just wanted to build his image. He probably knew he was beat, but if he folded, Peat would have known Ivey had nothing or something like this
how does he have 14% chance of winning with no pair and no draw?
must've been a mistake, the chance of him winning that pot is 0% :D
from what the chat is saying Phil had Q10 and it was just a typo by the production crew.
this hand should def be in your TOP 3 worst CALLs hand
only beat random 6 high flush draw.. lose to Q10
Sometimes pros even check out sometimes. or he knew he was beat and paid 10k to see the hand the Viffer was making that kind of bet with for future hands against him.
This is a missed up .. Really Doug .. you are analyzing hand and you didn't noticed the mistake in graphics with 7 D :))
Maybe he just miss read his own hand, and thought the 7 was a jack. I’ve betted with the best hand before, then when I turned over my hand it turned out I was bluffing. I had no idea, but I thought I was so strong that so did everyone else. It’s not that I’m rubbish, I just forgot to take in my cards when I looked at them 😅😂
Doug your haircut iceberg is melting 🤔
It's obvious that either Ivey misread his hand or the graphic is wrong. He likely had a hand like QJ.
omg , i've never played live probably will at some point ,hope to never play K's that badly omg and to what ivey was thinking couldn't have been poker lmao
The graphics are wrong Ivey had AA and misclick mucked the best hand again
A player did called me with Q high and won. Cause he wanted to see wat I play with. He went on to take most of my money later. Needless to say, that day I didn't perform my best.
2 x 7 of diamonds.....that is a trick deck and the odds change huge.
You should watch the videos The Poker Guys have they don't spend a lot of time talking but their analysis is very similar to yours. I like the video but it could be better
Surely you can get some more recent hands
I just don't get it. When the turn card shows up how does ivey still have 14%? I mean what outs does he have?
Dear Doug, I gotta ask why would RUclips put an ad for your channel before your video?
Lur Tor Doug mentioned in an older video that those ads are targeted at people who have watch one of his vids, but are not subscribed. This often updates slowly he said
Conor Fitzpatrick are you his spokesman? If not, please do not speak his mind.
he is his spokesman actually
he probably just wanted to see his hand
Unfortunately I have done this myself from time to time.
Someone told me that Ivey's 7D is actually in fact a jack and oppenheim had the 7D for real
and you missed the opportunity to use the Gavin Smith flat call joke
there is obviously a problem coz Queen 7 is normaly drawing dead on this board on the turn.... so the weird 14 percent over iveys head is really weird
Now we know Ivey has QJo, so the optimal river play would be check-shove right?
Another example of a call just for TV to confirm he's a legend if he was right...he very well knows he's beat 99,99999% of the time
Hair looks way better here Doug