Interesting video Tim sometimes I think we have to face the reality that the equipment we have won’t meet the task. An excavator is ideal for this job. I know what you’re trying to do with your own equipment, of course but sometimes it’s better to address the need with something that will give you the results that you want. Thanks for sharing. Stay safe.
I have cleaned cow pond with years of muck with 4 wheel drive tractor. Start at place with least slope. Use loader pull in get scope back out. Keep area working in dry.
You sunk it! I've done that several times as they don't float. Thanks you are trying to teach me what I can do with what I have. So many times people get overwhelmed because they fail to accomplish a goal on the first take. We learn from our failed attempts as the more we try the more we learn.
An alternative that would allow you to continue this project with compact equipment would be to purchase, rent, or build swamp mats. This would allow you to work the backhoe from stable terrain. Would be very time consuming but doable. 😊
also agree with others. Make two or three swamp mats to work off of. Make them small enough you can drag one around with the backhoe so you can move them around and level them as needed while working. start at one end of the pond removing the muck. You should try to get the muck out of the pond (best). If it rains with the muck piled up in the pond you will be back to square 1. The loader bucket or a larger landscape loader bucket will likely work better at getting the muck out. Not a task to rush. At least it is not south Louisiana gumbo mud...
Yeah I was thinking this. How they’d log wetlands when I lived down in Alabama. Another thought would be to build a “long arm” box blade or other scraper that could be pulled from dry ground.
@@philipdamm8850 That's a good idea too. Instead of a long arm I would connect it to a chain or cable and pull it from one side through the muck to the other side from dry land
I had the same problem as you are having and in the end I skimmed away one of the side banks and used my bucket on the front of the tractor. It started off slowly as I had to dig down to get the mud out, but once started it worked well and did a great job.. we use what we have and can afford. It was about standing back after a week and looking at what I had achieved with my farm equipment. 😀🇦🇺
Tim, the way we used to do this on the farm was to use a 40 foot chain between a horse scoop and the tractor. That let the tractor set on dry ground and the scoop be in the muddy pond.
I see a lot of people giving you advice based on a video. Things are not as they seem on video. Reality teaches a hard lesson. Mowing around my pond in what looked like solid dry areas, quickly sucked the zero-turn down to the frame. Glad I had a side by side to pull it out (TWICE). You are right a short tung on an implement is difficult to back. It is much easier to build a pond that to repair or modify one.
You two make such a sweet couple! My wife never pulls me out of the mud. I hope you treat Christy right Tim. Shes a keeper. Keep up the great work guys.
Have you thought about using the loader to clear the pond? Cut in a ramp, work from the edge inward, removing the muck and driving on the cleared bottom? May still be to soft for tractors but if Vennie has a loader, it might work? 🤔
Hey Tim I 2nd this. I've cleared many ponds just like yours in east Texas filled with silt that never dries. If you cut in a ramp and use your backhoe to clear out an area in the clay, then you can use your front loader to scoop out the silt all the way through the pond down to the clay layer. Spread that silt out on your property in a thin layer and let it dry up. The clay will be strong enough to hold your equipment and will dry up quickly once the silt is gone.
15:45 Captain Kleeman taught me that there's an advantage to running turf type tires over R1 ag tires because when you get a small tractor stuck, it's not impossible to get unstuck. Ag tires will let you get so stuck that getting out can be more difficult and dangerous.
Tim I think using the bucket with a tooth bar on your tractor digging down until your at solid ground/clay is your best bet. My concern is where are you going to put the silt and mud without having to keep on moving it. Maybe your dump trailer if you have a place to put it.
Maybe a good solution. When small doesn't work go big. Get dirt perfect to plow in drain tile under the pond. When it dries out, he has plenty of dozer power to push the dirt that originally came out of the pond back into it. Job done.
Tim, I've done something like this before with a utility tractor. The tractor is a 5090r. After every failed attempt to dredge the pond out, I figured to use the loader on the 5090r and I was able to dredge the pond in 10 hours and 48 mins. Try using the loader on johnny 5 and you might be able to get somewhere.
Loader will work if there really is a solid bottom. But you may need to cut your bank down to make backing out successful without a strap. Use 3 series so 5 will pull it out. I cleaned my pond with 4520r branson with a winch on back. Every 6 scoops id be winching so eventually i just kept the cable hooked up. Worked fabulous. Until i wanted a nicer dam. Bought 10k mini for work so i used that and mats this spring and did what took 2 weeks with the tractor in 2 days. Look forward to what you have in mind!
I think your best bet would be to take the silt out with the loader bucket and spread it thin enough to dry out. Then it all depends if you want to allow the pond to fill back up or fill it in. Chris from LetsDig18 does a lot of pond work. He also explains the process very well while doing the work. I believe you are correct in thinking your water level is leaching out through your topsoil. You will probably need to line the sides with clay to the level you are trying to achieve. Good luck with the silt. On the other hand point silt is usually very nutrient rich soil if you can get it to dry. God bless!
I'd do it with the front end loader on the 5 series you have there.. just start digging. We had a catch pond we used to dig out every five years or so with our 1989 2555 mfwd with a cab. Loads of fun and worked great! Good luck.
If it were me, I would try the biggest loader bucket you have, or maybe the 3r bucket if you are worried about weight of the 5e, and start from the shallow end digging out bucket fulls of that muck until you got down to the solid clay. Then you could maybe keep digging across the pond that way a few feet into the muck at a time, keeping that shallow end you started on sloped gently enough to drive down into it. Kind of how material is taken from a bunker silo on one end and worked across till it is empty. All I have with my tractor is my loader bucket, not even a backhoe for it, so I would have to make something like that work, otherwise I would be looking at renting an excavator and a bulldozer...
Tim, While I agree with everyone who has said that the compact equipment is not the most practical choice for your project, it is doable if you think outside the pond. If Christy is an old school cook, ask her what you do if you are making dough and you get it too wet or if you are making gravy and it is too runny. Thinking on the same lines, you need dry material to mix with the wet in order to aid in the drying process. If you take your turning plow and disk or just your disk and start tearing up the banks where your too steep of a slope anyway, then take your box blade, front end bucket, power rake, etc (anything that would allow you to move the tilled up loose dry material into the soup you can mix it enough to allow you to start working the material out of there. The muck with the dead fish will make excellent fertilizer for your yard where you were lacking good organic material to get the grass to grow if you get it out of the pond and spread it thin (maybe even till it in). As you work the material out take the banks and work them in and smooth it out where it doesn't fill back up with the next rain. This is perhaps the reason I find it the least practical is the amount of time taken to complete leaves you exposed to whatever the weather is going to do in the meantime. If this had been a pool built by building a dam in a ravine you could have cut the damn and pulled it all on down the valley, but with dugouts it takes a different line of thinking. Good Luck. Allen
I'm 10 minutes in, and when doing a very similar cutting of grass around an old pond and feeder creek last summer, I used our offset flail mower behind our little 1025R. It did a great job, allowing me to keep the tractor on semi-solid ground while mowing the grass growing on the muck. I did borderline get stuck several times and was able to use the front-end loader, both with the bucket and with the grapple, to help ensure I didn't get actually get stuck. I'm not saying the offset flail is better than your toolset selection, just that it did work for me. To get rid of the water I used the same technique of digging a deep hole with the backhoe and installing an old cast iron sump pump that handles semisolid muck fairly well. By hand i shoveled a few runs into the hole to drain all of the pond. Leaving the pump running for 24+ hours did an incredible job at firming up the bottom of the pond/depression/creek. In my case, when the pump was turned off, the hole filled up with water again in about 2 days. Edit: now that I've finished watching I will say "Don't give up!". Keep your drainage pump (or a smaller one) running non-stop for several days. Each day dig the hole a little deeper and improve the drainage runs that drain from all over the pond, and you will be surprised how well it firms up. After a few days of draining/pumping, our muck turned to a rock hard surface you could drive almost anything on with no risk of sinking. Good luck and don't give up on pumping the water out.
This takes me right back to being a kid and playing in the mud - some things never change! I still fondly remember the bright red rubber boots that my mom bought me, which made me excited about going outside after the rain to use them :)
I am very glad that Yankum rope is working out so well for you Tim! It's a pretty amazing product. I see you have a soft shackle too, they are great too. Your pond project looks like it really has been a trial but your persistence looks to have gotten you almost all the way through. You have learned many things (fortunately) both good and bad.
This episode just made my day! I've been there. My Dad would laugh at me when I got myself into a pickle and I needed his help. I thought you had a sickle bar mower? Perfect for around ponds and slopes. Anyway, you might consider filling the pond with water and using a sludge pump to get down to the clay layer. God Bless and good luck.
I cleaned out a silted pond with a kioti ck2610. I started on the shallow end (water entry end). Started on hard surface cutting a ramp down staying on hard surface down to the clay bottom scooping sludge as I went. It was a slow start with the sludge running back into the scoop I had just taken out but once I got a little working room it went nicely. Occasionally having to stop to pump water off of the clay bottom (dug shallow catch basins as I worked my way from shallow to deep to pump out of). After about a month of digging as I had time, mostly hit it hard on weekends, the finished pond ended up being 40x90 being 5 to 12ft deep.
Start at the shallowest end with the least slope. With the front end loader, scoop out the silt cutting just to the clay layer. When the clay layer gets too greasy you just have to stop for the day and let it crust over again so you get traction. It starts out pretty slow at first but as you get a bigger area uncovered, you have more area to travel and avoid the greasy spots with no traction. You have the right idea about maintaining a hole to pump water out of. As your digging, try to leave a low spot to drop your suction hose each day, especially if rain is forecast.
BTW, an old school method for pulling with chains that we've used for years that gives you the same effects as the yankum rope is to use two chains and put an old tire in between. The puller can take off and the tire will begin to stretch, but tires are extremely strong and will stand up to it, you'll come on out softly with this method as well. Allen
Till around the pond, making a 8-12 foot wide barrier around the pond as a fire break. Then burn the growth using a forestry drip torch with 50/50 diesel/gasoline mix. Side note. You may want to spray the growth with a brush kill herbicide and let it get brown and dry. Then just wait for a day with a very light and stable wind, and appropriate humidity and then set the fire using a drip torch on the downwind side of the pond so the fire has to burn against the wind, this burns slower and doesn’t get as hot.
Maybe dig your water pumping hole where the ground is more solid and not as mucky? Or if you’re going to dig the pond out, start digging where it’s more solid and then work your way into the muck? I don’t know, it’s hard to judge not being there. Love to see Vinny work, he never ceases to amaze me! He probably has an attachment for this!
I installed fence for 15 years ,in swampy high water table. Dig a deep sump,run an electric sump pump inside of a vented drum or bucket. Rinse,repeat and go deeper. I've had to do this many times. You can get a 12v marine bilge pump,and run it off a large battery. A large pickup-sized deep cycle battery will run a 500gph pump for about 12 hrs. My small 500gph $15,and 3500gph $50 from Amazon have at least 30 hrs each.
I woul dig all of the dryer silty soil out that you can get out before the rains get you. Then dig a deeper pit next to whats left that the remaining water can leach into and you can pump out. As whats left dries out dig it out... Luv ya's from Kentucky!!!
If you are going to use what you have, keep digging a ditch & transferring. Move 10 feet ? dig a ditch toward the center & transfer muck to one side, letting it drain & dry. But if you have something coming. Whatever works :) Have fun.
I've had my Ventrac buried 3 times in all my years. Once in Northern Maine during the Spring Thaw back in 2012 and the next two time in a pasture I was grading, again, during the Spring Thaw in SE Pennsylvania in March. The Narrow Tires with Chains would have been helpful here. Those things are amazing!
Love it. Thanks for the scripture message and boldness brother. We must pray for the lost to come to Christ. Thank you for being willing to share your faith.
I did something similar. I dug a little at a time. I used my Yanmar YT235 with a loader and backhoe. I just keep at it and pulled it up and then moved it to a pile away from the low area. And as I did this it would dry up in that area and I would just continue. After I got all of the muck or silt out, I would turn that material about every other day until it was completely dry. I spent alot of time pulling my little tractor out of the mud but once I go a area to work in it went better. My neighbor came over and said he come get my pond rake. So, I did, and I used it to reach out in the middle and pull that material up to the edge where I could get at it. That worked better than anything. Just mounted to my loader bucket and it reaches out about 15 feet. Basically, a landscape rake with a very long square tube tongue. I could not afford renting a big excavator to do the job.
I am so glad I do not have a pond to worry about!!! This is still interesting to watch however, and good luck! Nothing like jumping in to a project and getting stuck waste deep in the muck...
Cutting all of that overgrowth using the Ventrac beats a brush cutter on a weed wacker. That wouldn't have been fun at all. I'm at least happy the poison ivy from the latest tower project wasn't worse for both you and Christy. Bonus lesson was seeing one downside to the hybrid tires, although I saw the 5075 digging in while carrying the box blade. As far as a thought to help the drying of the muck, I'm thinking that an oscillating tiller could do the trick. However, a pull tractor might be needed to help out since the odds of getting stuck are decent..
Bought a house just north of you, previous homeowners started that they had to keep the pond dry for two years before the equipment could get in and clean it out. Good ol Indiana muck.
I think it’s excavator time on tractor time with Tim. ;) It’s kind of cool that you’re doing it without an excavator, more entertaining. What I would probably do if it were me is, I would dig a huge hole next to it and take out a side of the pond and get through the clay, so it would drain and dry out then I would go through and try to take , all the muddy silt out, that would make the pond wider but you could do a nice deep area and if you can get through that Clay maybe at the pond to completely drain out and overtime, it would dry then spread the clay around and let it fill back up once you’ve got a bunch of that salt out of there. It looks fun though. I’m guessing now that you’ve got it mowed down that will help it dry a bit quicker also.
We cleaned out our farm pond using two tractors, one pulling a rollover box blade and the second larger tractor pulling the first using a long cable. The larger tractor never went through the pond, it stayed on the hard ground. It worked but was a slow process.
I think you'll get er done Tim, but this is a job that will test your patience. Living in south Louisiana, very familiar with working in and around muck, a second tractor and chains is a must. Even mowing with the 997 Z Trac can be a challenge, can't tell you how many times I've stuck it. There's even a thread on Green Tractor Talk on where did you stick your Z today.
Hi Tim, Looks like your having fun in the mud! I think your best bet is an excavator. A big one would be nice, especially a long reach unit. But I think a smaller one would do it, and it would simply take longer. Start on a strip and place the muck along side in a pile to dry, going down to firmer ground. However you do it, without some kind of machine to haul it, it's going to take a while. Chris, Lets Dig18, has excavated many ponds but of course he has a haul truck to relocate the muck.
If you're wanting to do it with what you have then make planks and move it little at a time with what you got, is all you can do, when you get to the solid areas and keep working outward from there till you get it done, or get something Bing that can move some dirt, 2 options
I'm looking at it like a giant bath tub. The clay needs to be "punched through" for the water to drain away. I'd try using the auger to drill down through the clay in several spots. If it works and dries out, then go back and remove as much clay as possible, and it should continue to dry quicker from then on. In any case, good luck, and thanks for the video.
You may need to give it some itme to dry and go at it from the driest end and work your way across. Tuff one. You will figure it our I am sure. Keep them coming and the videos on this project and the progress you make.
youre right tim....its nasty. reminds me of mucking the cow barn during the winter.....lol. vinny is an amazing little machine. the dual wheels help distribute the weight and help with the traction. i like the idea of using your equipment. its a good tutorial for us that have the 10 series tractors.
Doing a great job with what you have right now. Sometimes we need to understand our tools limits. Then decide if it’s cheaper to rent or buy the needed tool to get the job done.
I built 8 oak mud mats for that exact reason! I have a connection to get lumber. So they cut me 3" thick timbers, and I bolted together a bunch of mats just in case I needed them
Go in from an end with the front end loader down to bare ground and bucket out the mud. It will take long days for sure. As long as you can maintain some traction you should be good. Also look for a set of chains, they work excellent in mud.
Hi Tim, Your north half of your 10 acres is located on Thra Treaty silty clay loam 0 to 1% slope soil type, according to USDA Soil Survey for Boone County. Treaty silty clay loam is usually a hydric soil, which means these types are notorious for being saturated, and are associated with wetlands and drain very slowly. That smell coming your pond is caused by anaerobic conditions. You’re fighting an uphill battle trying to dry your pond out in those type of hydric soils. You have been making some progress because your area is currently in a moderate drought right now. As soon as we get back to normal rainfall conditions, the pond area will begin to refill again. Call your local USDA office on suggestions on how to drain. Might be easier just to fill it, but that’s expensive, fill material isn’t cheap.
What about driving into it with front loader bucket, filling bucket with muck down to hard clay for tires to grip. Then with loader filled, it would give weight to help pull out. With the muck removed and tires on hard surface and unable to sink, this might work to a degree unless muck from sides fill in the empty spot you just loaded into the bucket. But small bites making the area wider as you go so it doesn't fill in, this could possibly work and removed more muck than the backhoe bucket does and not allowing it to sluff back into the pond in a different area like the backhoe allows. Just a thought. Good luck.
Though this is probably too little too late…washing with Zanfel during the time when you have poison ivy is a great way to get rid of the rash in half of the time. Plus it helps relieve the itch. I also like your comments about Jesus. :)
We got a ventrac at my job. They only use it for snow removal. I showed them your channel and the views bout the attachments. They now have 4 attachments on order.
Mowing cattails is a fool's errand, the roots will pop up new shoots in no time. I doubt that muck will ever dry out, it will rain eventually and back to square one. I had several feet of it in my much smaller pond that went mostly dry (no water source other than rain or snow runoff). The only way I got it out with my then new (for the job) TLB Mahindra 1533 was because the pond bottom (as far as I got anyway, is pure ledge. I don't have a second bigger tractor to pull myself out so I checked the bottom stability frequently. If I couldn't lift the end of the tractor that was at the edge of the pond with whichever bucket was in the muck, I didn't go in further until I dug down to the ledge. I did use some sheets of plywood to give the backhoe stabilizers something to press down on. If you intend to press on with the compact tractor method, I think you need to clean out down to "no muck" in one area and keep working along the firm bottom as you go. Hard slog when you can't move the spoils more than a few feet to the right or left then move it again and again and again but that is how I got mine done.
As others have mentioned, you could lay down timbers such as the ones loggers and others use when working in wet areas, but they usually have heavy equipment to move the lashed together logs around. I applaud your efforts to make do with the equipment you have. But I must admit, when you first started talking about this project, my first thought was that I would rent a big excavator and move a lot of the silt that has settled in the pond over the years to some other area. As you have probably figured out, you are going to continue to have problems until you can dig the pond deep enough with steep sides so weeds will only be an issue right around the edge where you can reach them with one of your offset mowers. Maybe you can stock the pond when it is finished with one of the grass eating varieties that will keep the under water grasses under control.
2 years ago i had the same issue... a pond that would drain by itself... you pretty much know what you need to do, you just either need to commit with what you have or need other equipment(s) to make things easier (big excavator). with what you have, you need to never wet the ground you are wheeling on, need to get all the wet dirt out of the pond and let it dry for months. I would start by one end of the pond with my FEL, making a huge mountain of dirt inside the pond so the ground under me and behind me would be dry and deep, in front of me (an ARC in front of me lets say) would be the mountain of dirt and the more and more i would raise the mountain, it would reach the side of the pond and i could reach it with a backhoe to spread this wet dirt on the grass (need to go to a far spot) .so maybe use your dump trailer to move that dirt?. rince and repeat. the easy way is with a 120+ excavator so you can reach the inside of the pond from the side and turn back and load your trailer. of course, need to manage the water and wet dirt so it doesnt fall back and wet the dry ground you unveiling. its not a small job!!! it took me 1 full week to dig mine and i used a dozer to spread the wet dirt... I did rent a 235 excavator... i know your channel is toward the "gentlemen farmer" but some are a bit more into it and buy 50size+ excavator, would make great content im sure! the hard question is How much time do you have to spare into this project? :) i would love to see a multiple part Video, i loved Neil's one...
Could you dig in a longer, lower ramp with a shallow slope using the front loader that gives you a lower approach angle, then use the front bucket to scoop out the muck from the more stable footing?
love the videos at your house...you live in a such beautiful area :) (I already said it a couple times...whatever...😂) Love your videos as always.I watched them all.:) Thanks Tim and Christy.:)
You need to have your friend @dirtperfect give you a visit....he has a lot of experience dealing with mud! You have really nice equipment and you are a skilled operator but I'm not sure that tractors are the best tool for this particular job.Good luck!
you need an old fashioned muck bucket and some heavy chains. put a tractor on both sides of the pond one tractor drag the bucket across the pond scooping up the muck in one direction, then use the other tractor to pull the bucket back and reset to scoop again.
Even though the Ventrac did get stuck a couple times, overall it did a great job cutting the weeds. I believe better than a tractor and rotary cutter would have done. Using matts as mentioned in some below comments will probably be the best option. Stay in one area and load out into your dump trailer. Once that area is cleaned up pick them up and move over to start again. Going to take a while with small equipment.
The big question in my mind is where is all the muck going to end up? You may have told us and I missed it. The army would use pierced metal grating, I have used 4x4s and plywood platforms to "bridge" over muck. Can't wait to see what you come up with. Good luck.
I'm surprised you didn't use the Ventrac's boom attachment you've used on a number of occasions before to cut the tall reeds around the edges of the pond.
It is heavy. Would not be able to get into the pond with it. Having said that, it would help with some of the remaining parts which we could reach from the bank.
I would start digging from the shallowest point with my loader creating a pathway removing all of the slime leaving the clay for a good base to drive on. You may still have to dig and then wait a day before you can dig again but I believe with patience you can get it done with the equipment you have. Please don’t give up!!
Might be able to turn that box blade in to a cable pulled scrape. Use the yank um and some chain to drag it out with 5 from dry land drag it back with something else.
I’ll be getting a Ventrac to mow pond dams. It’s can be tricky to mow pond dams when they’re damp from morning dew but from every video I’ve seen the Ventrac should be able to handle it.
What about a dump trailer hooked to the 5 series and load it with one of the smaller tractors so that you don't have to worry about the spoils sluffing back in the pond. Then you can haul away the silt.??? Just a thought
Mud is like a magnet. I was doing a gig a month ago. Was told the stream was over there. Welp, it was a lot closer hidden by tall grass. The 1025 with turf tires turned into roller bearings. Luck to ha my son with me. He found a couple small pieces of plywood. I’m still not sure how we got out. A hour later we were back to work.
Tim have you thought about suction dredging to get rid of the silt by having totes with water on your trailer and having a garden hose to a pressure washer to loosen the silt for your trash pump to then suck it out
Timber rafts like letsdig18 uses could allow you a stable surface to use the backhoe from. Not sure how large you could afford to get since the spoils pile would need to be off to the sides. 2 x 6 lumber with 1/2” cable and u-bolts to "stitch" it together might work?
The places that Ventrac CAN go is very impressive!
Tim, Loved video. Thanks for stand for Christ.
Interesting video Tim sometimes I think we have to face the reality that the equipment we have won’t meet the task. An excavator is ideal for this job. I know what you’re trying to do with your own equipment, of course but sometimes it’s better to address the need with something that will give you the results that you want. Thanks for sharing. Stay safe.
Putting clean ,1 one machine!
I think it is time for some RUclips buddies like Mike Morgan to lend a hand. LOL
I have cleaned cow pond with years of muck with 4 wheel drive tractor. Start at place with least slope. Use loader pull in get scope back out. Keep area working in dry.
You sunk it! I've done that several times as they don't float.
Thanks you are trying to teach me what I can do with what I have.
So many times people get overwhelmed because they fail to accomplish a goal on the first take.
We learn from our failed attempts as the more we try the more we learn.
An alternative that would allow you to continue this project with compact equipment would be to purchase, rent, or build swamp mats. This would allow you to work the backhoe from stable terrain. Would be very time consuming but doable. 😊
I agree.
Agreed, or the mats with a mini ex I think would still be considered compact
also agree with others. Make two or three swamp mats to work off of. Make them small enough you can drag one around with the backhoe so you can move them around and level them as needed while working. start at one end of the pond removing the muck. You should try to get the muck out of the pond (best). If it rains with the muck piled up in the pond you will be back to square 1. The loader bucket or a larger landscape loader bucket will likely work better at getting the muck out. Not a task to rush. At least it is not south Louisiana gumbo mud...
Yeah I was thinking this. How they’d log wetlands when I lived down in Alabama. Another thought would be to build a “long arm” box blade or other scraper that could be pulled from dry ground.
@@philipdamm8850 That's a good idea too. Instead of a long arm I would connect it to a chain or cable and pull it from one side through the muck to the other side from dry land
Work isn’t work when you’re having fun. Thanks for the Eternal perspective which we all need to consider.
You need Jerry from Dirt Perfect to use their bulldozer to push the muck out of the bottom to let it dry. Of course a large excavator would be useful.
I had the same problem as you are having and in the end I skimmed away one of the side banks and used my bucket on the front of the tractor. It started off slowly as I had to dig down to get the mud out, but once started it worked well and did a great job.. we use what we have and can afford. It was about standing back after a week and looking at what I had achieved with my farm equipment. 😀🇦🇺
Tim, the way we used to do this on the farm was to use a 40 foot chain between a horse scoop and the tractor. That let the tractor set on dry ground and the scoop be in the muddy pond.
I see a lot of people giving you advice based on a video. Things are not as they seem on video. Reality teaches a hard lesson.
Mowing around my pond in what looked like solid dry areas, quickly sucked the zero-turn down to the frame. Glad I had a side by side to pull it out (TWICE).
You are right a short tung on an implement is difficult to back. It is much easier to build a pond that to repair or modify one.
You two make such a sweet couple! My wife never pulls me out of the mud. I hope you treat Christy right Tim. Shes a keeper. Keep up the great work guys.
Have you thought about using the loader to clear the pond? Cut in a ramp, work from the edge inward, removing the muck and driving on the cleared bottom? May still be to soft for tractors but if Vennie has a loader, it might work? 🤔
Hey Tim I 2nd this. I've cleared many ponds just like yours in east Texas filled with silt that never dries. If you cut in a ramp and use your backhoe to clear out an area in the clay, then you can use your front loader to scoop out the silt all the way through the pond down to the clay layer. Spread that silt out on your property in a thin layer and let it dry up. The clay will be strong enough to hold your equipment and will dry up quickly once the silt is gone.
Amen, brother. You’re an inspiration!
15:45 Captain Kleeman taught me that there's an advantage to running turf type tires over R1 ag tires because when you get a small tractor stuck, it's not impossible to get unstuck. Ag tires will let you get so stuck that getting out can be more difficult and dangerous.
Tim I think using the bucket with a tooth bar on your tractor digging down until your at solid ground/clay is your best bet.
My concern is where are you going to put the silt and mud without having to keep on moving it. Maybe your dump trailer if you have a place to put it.
I got the muck out of my pond this way. As long as you stay on the solid ground and have a low incline you should be fine.
Maybe a good solution. When small doesn't work go big. Get dirt perfect to plow in drain tile under the pond. When it dries out, he has plenty of dozer power to push the dirt that originally came out of the pond back into it. Job done.
Tim, I've done something like this before with a utility tractor. The tractor is a 5090r. After every failed attempt to dredge the pond out, I figured to use the loader on the 5090r and I was able to dredge the pond in 10 hours and 48 mins. Try using the loader on johnny 5 and you might be able to get somewhere.
Loader will work if there really is a solid bottom. But you may need to cut your bank down to make backing out successful without a strap. Use 3 series so 5 will pull it out.
I cleaned my pond with 4520r branson with a winch on back. Every 6 scoops id be winching so eventually i just kept the cable hooked up. Worked fabulous. Until i wanted a nicer dam. Bought 10k mini for work so i used that and mats this spring and did what took 2 weeks with the tractor in 2 days.
Look forward to what you have in mind!
I think your best bet would be to take the silt out with the loader bucket and spread it thin enough to dry out. Then it all depends if you want to allow the pond to fill back up or fill it in. Chris from LetsDig18 does a lot of pond work. He also explains the process very well while doing the work. I believe you are correct in thinking your water level is leaching out through your topsoil. You will probably need to line the sides with clay to the level you are trying to achieve. Good luck with the silt. On the other hand point silt is usually very nutrient rich soil if you can get it to dry. God bless!
I'd do it with the front end loader on the 5 series you have there.. just start digging. We had a catch pond we used to dig out every five years or so with our 1989 2555 mfwd with a cab. Loads of fun and worked great! Good luck.
If it were me, I would try the biggest loader bucket you have, or maybe the 3r bucket if you are worried about weight of the 5e, and start from the shallow end digging out bucket fulls of that muck until you got down to the solid clay. Then you could maybe keep digging across the pond that way a few feet into the muck at a time, keeping that shallow end you started on sloped gently enough to drive down into it. Kind of how material is taken from a bunker silo on one end and worked across till it is empty. All I have with my tractor is my loader bucket, not even a backhoe for it, so I would have to make something like that work, otherwise I would be looking at renting an excavator and a bulldozer...
This what we did and had much better luck not getting stuck!
Tim, While I agree with everyone who has said that the compact equipment is not the most practical choice for your project, it is doable if you think outside the pond. If Christy is an old school cook, ask her what you do if you are making dough and you get it too wet or if you are making gravy and it is too runny. Thinking on the same lines, you need dry material to mix with the wet in order to aid in the drying process. If you take your turning plow and disk or just your disk and start tearing up the banks where your too steep of a slope anyway, then take your box blade, front end bucket, power rake, etc (anything that would allow you to move the tilled up loose dry material into the soup you can mix it enough to allow you to start working the material out of there. The muck with the dead fish will make excellent fertilizer for your yard where you were lacking good organic material to get the grass to grow if you get it out of the pond and spread it thin (maybe even till it in). As you work the material out take the banks and work them in and smooth it out where it doesn't fill back up with the next rain. This is perhaps the reason I find it the least practical is the amount of time taken to complete leaves you exposed to whatever the weather is going to do in the meantime. If this had been a pool built by building a dam in a ravine you could have cut the damn and pulled it all on down the valley, but with dugouts it takes a different line of thinking. Good Luck. Allen
I'm 10 minutes in, and when doing a very similar cutting of grass around an old pond and feeder creek last summer, I used our offset flail mower behind our little 1025R. It did a great job, allowing me to keep the tractor on semi-solid ground while mowing the grass growing on the muck.
I did borderline get stuck several times and was able to use the front-end loader, both with the bucket and with the grapple, to help ensure I didn't get actually get stuck.
I'm not saying the offset flail is better than your toolset selection, just that it did work for me.
To get rid of the water I used the same technique of digging a deep hole with the backhoe and installing an old cast iron sump pump that handles semisolid muck fairly well. By hand i shoveled a few runs into the hole to drain all of the pond.
Leaving the pump running for 24+ hours did an incredible job at firming up the bottom of the pond/depression/creek. In my case, when the pump was turned off, the hole filled up with water again in about 2 days.
Edit: now that I've finished watching I will say "Don't give up!".
Keep your drainage pump (or a smaller one) running non-stop for several days. Each day dig the hole a little deeper and improve the drainage runs that drain from all over the pond, and you will be surprised how well it firms up.
After a few days of draining/pumping, our muck turned to a rock hard surface you could drive almost anything on with no risk of sinking.
Good luck and don't give up on pumping the water out.
This takes me right back to being a kid and playing in the mud - some things never change! I still fondly remember the bright red rubber boots that my mom bought me, which made me excited about going outside after the rain to use them :)
I am very glad that Yankum rope is working out so well for you Tim! It's a pretty amazing product. I see you have a soft shackle too, they are great too. Your pond project looks like it really has been a trial but your persistence looks to have gotten you almost all the way through. You have learned many things (fortunately) both good and bad.
This episode just made my day! I've been there. My Dad would laugh at me when I got myself into a pickle and I needed his help. I thought you had a sickle bar mower? Perfect for around ponds and slopes. Anyway, you might consider filling the pond with water and using a sludge pump to get down to the clay layer. God Bless and good luck.
I cleaned out a silted pond with a kioti ck2610. I started on the shallow end (water entry end). Started on hard surface cutting a ramp down staying on hard surface down to the clay bottom scooping sludge as I went. It was a slow start with the sludge running back into the scoop I had just taken out but once I got a little working room it went nicely. Occasionally having to stop to pump water off of the clay bottom (dug shallow catch basins as I worked my way from shallow to deep to pump out of). After about a month of digging as I had time, mostly hit it hard on weekends, the finished pond ended up being 40x90 being 5 to 12ft deep.
Start at the shallowest end with the least slope. With the front end loader, scoop out the silt cutting just to the clay layer. When the clay layer gets too greasy you just have to stop for the day and let it crust over again so you get traction. It starts out pretty slow at first but as you get a bigger area uncovered, you have more area to travel and avoid the greasy spots with no traction.
You have the right idea about maintaining a hole to pump water out of. As your digging, try to leave a low spot to drop your suction hose each day, especially if rain is forecast.
BTW, an old school method for pulling with chains that we've used for years that gives you the same effects as the yankum rope is to use two chains and put an old tire in between. The puller can take off and the tire will begin to stretch, but tires are extremely strong and will stand up to it, you'll come on out softly with this method as well. Allen
Till around the pond, making a 8-12 foot wide barrier around the pond as a fire break.
Then burn the growth using a forestry drip torch with 50/50 diesel/gasoline mix.
Side note. You may want to spray the growth with a brush kill herbicide and let it get brown and dry. Then just wait for a day with a very light and stable wind, and appropriate humidity and then set the fire using a drip torch on the downwind side of the pond so the fire has to burn against the wind, this burns slower and doesn’t get as hot.
Maybe dig your water pumping hole where the ground is more solid and not as mucky? Or if you’re going to dig the pond out, start digging where it’s more solid and then work your way into the muck? I don’t know, it’s hard to judge not being there. Love to see Vinny work, he never ceases to amaze me! He probably has an attachment for this!
I installed fence for 15 years ,in swampy high water table.
Dig a deep sump,run an electric sump pump inside of a vented drum or bucket.
Rinse,repeat and go deeper.
I've had to do this many times.
You can get a 12v marine bilge pump,and run it off a large battery.
A large pickup-sized deep cycle battery will run a 500gph pump for about 12 hrs.
My small 500gph $15,and 3500gph $50 from Amazon have at least 30 hrs each.
I woul dig all of the dryer silty soil out that you can get out before the rains get you. Then dig a deeper pit next to whats left that the remaining water can leach into and you can pump out. As whats left dries out dig it out... Luv ya's from Kentucky!!!
I appreciate that your doing this with the small tractors and not renting a big excavator or somthing
Dig a ramp down on the outside of the small end so you can get below the muck and front end loader it out.
Don't know much about digging/draining ponds, but you got yourself an interesting task Tim. I'm sure you'll get it done.
If you are going to use what you have, keep digging a ditch & transferring. Move 10 feet ? dig a ditch toward the center & transfer muck to one side, letting it drain & dry. But if you have something coming. Whatever works :) Have fun.
That ventrac footage was fantastic, keep trying Tim love seeing all the different equipment working at one job 👍🏻
I've had my Ventrac buried 3 times in all my years. Once in Northern Maine during the Spring Thaw back in 2012 and the next two time in a pasture I was grading, again, during the Spring Thaw in SE Pennsylvania in March. The Narrow Tires with Chains would have been helpful here. Those things are amazing!
Vinny: "I've fallen and I can't get up!"
Love it. Thanks for the scripture message and boldness brother. We must pray for the lost to come to Christ. Thank you for being willing to share your faith.
I did something similar. I dug a little at a time. I used my Yanmar YT235 with a loader and backhoe. I just keep at it and pulled it up and then moved it to a pile away from the low area. And as I did this it would dry up in that area and I would just continue. After I got all of the muck or silt out, I would turn that material about every other day until it was completely dry. I spent alot of time pulling my little tractor out of the mud but once I go a area to work in it went better. My neighbor came over and said he come get my pond rake. So, I did, and I used it to reach out in the middle and pull that material up to the edge where I could get at it. That worked better than anything. Just mounted to my loader bucket and it reaches out about 15 feet. Basically, a landscape rake with a very long square tube tongue. I could not afford renting a big excavator to do the job.
Thanks for your testimony! I couldn't agree more! Choose life!
I am so glad I do not have a pond to worry about!!! This is still interesting to watch however, and good luck! Nothing like jumping in to a project and getting stuck waste deep in the muck...
Cutting all of that overgrowth using the Ventrac beats a brush cutter on a weed wacker. That wouldn't have been fun at all. I'm at least happy the poison ivy from the latest tower project wasn't worse for both you and Christy. Bonus lesson was seeing one downside to the hybrid tires, although I saw the 5075 digging in while carrying the box blade. As far as a thought to help the drying of the muck, I'm thinking that an oscillating tiller could do the trick. However, a pull tractor might be needed to help out since the odds of getting stuck are decent..
Enjoying your openness tackling some interesting challenges for sure.
Tim I have faith in you and you'll get it figured out.
Bought a house just north of you, previous homeowners started that they had to keep the pond dry for two years before the equipment could get in and clean it out. Good ol Indiana muck.
5:14 shorter trailers and attachments are harder to back up than longer ones. The best thing to do is to practice, practice practice practice.
Use your front end loader, as you scoop the silt out it will get pushed to deeper sections of the pond and keep the tractor on more solid ground
I think it’s excavator time on tractor time with Tim. ;)
It’s kind of cool that you’re doing it without an excavator, more entertaining. What I would probably do if it were me is, I would dig a huge hole next to it and take out a side of the pond and get through the clay, so it would drain and dry out then I would go through and try to take , all the muddy silt out, that would make the pond wider but you could do a nice deep area and if you can get through that Clay maybe at the pond to completely drain out and overtime, it would dry then spread the clay around and let it fill back up once you’ve got a bunch of that salt out of there. It looks fun though.
I’m guessing now that you’ve got it mowed down that will help it dry a bit quicker also.
We cleaned out our farm pond using two tractors, one pulling a rollover box blade and the second larger tractor pulling the first using a long cable. The larger tractor never went through the pond, it stayed on the hard ground. It worked but was a slow process.
I think you'll get er done Tim, but this is a job that will test your patience.
Living in south Louisiana, very familiar with working in and around muck, a second tractor and chains
is a must.
Even mowing with the 997 Z Trac can be a challenge, can't tell you how many times I've stuck it.
There's even a thread on Green Tractor Talk on where did you stick your Z today.
Always love your videos Tim! Any plans on videos out at the family farm again? Those were always good. Thanks for sharing
Always and Interesting CONTENT thanks for the video . LETS GET STARTED
Hi Tim,
Looks like your having fun in the mud!
I think your best bet is an excavator. A big one would be nice, especially a long reach unit. But I think a smaller one would do it, and it would simply take longer. Start on a strip and place the muck along side in a pile to dry, going down to firmer ground. However you do it, without some kind of machine to haul it, it's going to take a while.
Chris, Lets Dig18, has excavated many ponds but of course he has a haul truck to relocate the muck.
If you're wanting to do it with what you have then make planks and move it little at a time with what you got, is all you can do, when you get to the solid areas and keep working outward from there till you get it done, or get something Bing that can move some dirt, 2 options
I made sediment ponds for the coal job,we had a 850 Case with swamp pad tracks ,3 feet wide could go where you could not walk.
I'm looking at it like a giant bath tub. The clay needs to be "punched through" for the water to drain away. I'd try using the auger to drill down through the clay in several spots. If it works and dries out, then go back and remove as much clay as possible, and it should continue to dry quicker from then on.
In any case, good luck, and thanks for the video.
Doing a great job with what you have. Definitely showing what the tractors can and can not do.
You may need to give it some itme to dry and go at it from the driest end and work your way across. Tuff one. You will figure it our I am sure. Keep them coming and the videos on this project and the progress you make.
youre right tim....its nasty. reminds me of mucking the cow barn during the winter.....lol. vinny is an amazing little machine. the dual wheels help distribute the weight and help with the traction. i like the idea of using your equipment. its a good tutorial for us that have the 10 series tractors.
Amazing how the grass is a double edged sword. After a certain height it contributes to the problem of not drying out. Enjoy
Doing a great job with what you have right now. Sometimes we need to understand our tools limits. Then decide if it’s cheaper to rent or buy the needed tool to get the job done.
Great video TTWT! Love watching Vinnie
Agree on your doubt about this being a compact tractor project but it doesn't hurt to try.
I built 8 oak mud mats for that exact reason! I have a connection to get lumber. So they cut me 3" thick timbers, and I bolted together a bunch of mats just in case I needed them
Go in from an end with the front end loader down to bare ground and bucket out the mud. It will take long days for sure. As long as you can maintain some traction you should be good. Also look for a set of chains, they work excellent in mud.
Hi Tim, Your north half of your 10 acres is located on Thra Treaty silty clay loam 0 to 1% slope soil type, according to USDA Soil Survey for Boone County. Treaty silty clay loam is usually a hydric soil, which means these types are notorious for being saturated, and are associated with wetlands and drain very slowly. That smell coming your pond is caused by anaerobic conditions. You’re fighting an uphill battle trying to dry your pond out in those type of hydric soils. You have been making some progress because your area is currently in a moderate drought right now. As soon as we get back to normal rainfall conditions, the pond area will begin to refill again. Call your local USDA office on suggestions on how to drain. Might be easier just to fill it, but that’s expensive, fill material isn’t cheap.
The smell coming from my pond was the dead fish!
You are the king of Stock Long live the king.
What about driving into it with front loader bucket, filling bucket with muck down to hard clay for tires to grip. Then with loader filled, it would give weight to help pull out. With the muck removed and tires on hard surface and unable to sink, this might work to a degree unless muck from sides fill in the empty spot you just loaded into the bucket. But small bites making the area wider as you go so it doesn't fill in, this could possibly work and removed more muck than the backhoe bucket does and not allowing it to sluff back into the pond in a different area like the backhoe allows. Just a thought. Good luck.
Though this is probably too little too late…washing with Zanfel during the time when you have poison ivy is a great way to get rid of the rash in half of the time. Plus it helps relieve the itch. I also like your comments about Jesus. :)
I think getting the grass cut is a big win. How about a drought and then you can use the buckets and haul it out
We got a ventrac at my job. They only use it for snow removal. I showed them your channel and the views bout the attachments. They now have 4 attachments on order.
Congratulations! Which attachments?
They got it with the plow and salter, they got the snow blower, brush mower, finish mower and bucket.
Mowing cattails is a fool's errand, the roots will pop up new shoots in no time. I doubt that muck will ever dry out, it will rain eventually and back to square one. I had several feet of it in my much smaller pond that went mostly dry (no water source other than rain or snow runoff). The only way I got it out with my then new (for the job) TLB Mahindra 1533 was because the pond bottom (as far as I got anyway, is pure ledge. I don't have a second bigger tractor to pull myself out so I checked the bottom stability frequently. If I couldn't lift the end of the tractor that was at the edge of the pond with whichever bucket was in the muck, I didn't go in further until I dug down to the ledge. I did use some sheets of plywood to give the backhoe stabilizers something to press down on. If you intend to press on with the compact tractor method, I think you need to clean out down to "no muck" in one area and keep working along the firm bottom as you go. Hard slog when you can't move the spoils more than a few feet to the right or left then move it again and again and again but that is how I got mine done.
I love the little helipad for the drone
As others have mentioned, you could lay down timbers such as the ones loggers and others use when working in wet areas, but they usually have heavy equipment to move the lashed together logs around. I applaud your efforts to make do with the equipment you have. But I must admit, when you first started talking about this project, my first thought was that I would rent a big excavator and move a lot of the silt that has settled in the pond over the years to some other area. As you have probably figured out, you are going to continue to have problems until you can dig the pond deep enough with steep sides so weeds will only be an issue right around the edge where you can reach them with one of your offset mowers. Maybe you can stock the pond when it is finished with one of the grass eating varieties that will keep the under water grasses under control.
2 years ago i had the same issue... a pond that would drain by itself... you pretty much know what you need to do, you just either need to commit with what you have or need other equipment(s) to make things easier (big excavator). with what you have, you need to never wet the ground you are wheeling on, need to get all the wet dirt out of the pond and let it dry for months. I would start by one end of the pond with my FEL, making a huge mountain of dirt inside the pond so the ground under me and behind me would be dry and deep, in front of me (an ARC in front of me lets say) would be the mountain of dirt and the more and more i would raise the mountain, it would reach the side of the pond and i could reach it with a backhoe to spread this wet dirt on the grass (need to go to a far spot) .so maybe use your dump trailer to move that dirt?. rince and repeat. the easy way is with a 120+ excavator so you can reach the inside of the pond from the side and turn back and load your trailer. of course, need to manage the water and wet dirt so it doesnt fall back and wet the dry ground you unveiling. its not a small job!!! it took me 1 full week to dig mine and i used a dozer to spread the wet dirt... I did rent a 235 excavator... i know your channel is toward the "gentlemen farmer" but some are a bit more into it and buy 50size+ excavator, would make great content im sure! the hard question is How much time do you have to spare into this project? :) i would love to see a multiple part Video, i loved Neil's one...
I never imagined that anyone could get the Ventrac stuck with the duels on!
Could you dig in a longer, lower ramp with a shallow slope using the front loader that gives you a lower approach angle, then use the front bucket to scoop out the muck from the more stable footing?
love the videos at your house...you live in a such beautiful area :) (I already said it a couple times...whatever...😂) Love your videos as always.I watched them all.:) Thanks Tim and Christy.:)
You need to have your friend @dirtperfect give you a visit....he has a lot of experience dealing with mud! You have really nice equipment and you are a skilled operator but I'm not sure that tractors are the best tool for this particular job.Good luck!
you need an old fashioned muck bucket and some heavy chains. put a tractor on both sides of the pond one tractor drag the bucket across the pond scooping up the muck in one direction, then use the other tractor to pull the bucket back and reset to scoop again.
Even though the Ventrac did get stuck a couple times, overall it did a great job cutting the weeds. I believe better than a tractor and rotary cutter would have done. Using matts as mentioned in some below comments will probably be the best option. Stay in one area and load out into your dump trailer. Once that area is cleaned up pick them up and move over to start again. Going to take a while with small equipment.
The big question in my mind is where is all the muck going to end up? You may have told us and I missed it. The army would use pierced metal grating, I have used 4x4s and plywood platforms to "bridge" over muck. Can't wait to see what you come up with. Good luck.
I'm surprised you didn't use the Ventrac's boom attachment you've used on a number of occasions before to cut the tall reeds around the edges of the pond.
It is heavy. Would not be able to get into the pond with it. Having said that, it would help with some of the remaining parts which we could reach from the bank.
You may be okay as long as a major storm does not come through your area and feel your pain right back up.
I would start digging from the shallowest point with my loader creating a pathway removing all of the slime leaving the clay for a good base to drive on.
You may still have to dig and then wait a day before you can dig again but I believe with patience you can get it done with the equipment you have.
Please don’t give up!!
What was the critter in the bottom of the screen at about 3:45 or so?
GM love the “eternal death” analogy. Cannot earn Christ’s perfect gift, Amen! Have a great day
Might be able to turn that box blade in to a cable pulled scrape. Use the yank um and some chain to drag it out with 5 from dry land drag it back with something else.
Talk with letsdig18 to see if he has any ideas for small equipment! He does everything with large equipment but he is the man for ponds!
I’ll be getting a Ventrac to mow pond dams. It’s can be tricky to mow pond dams when they’re damp from morning dew but from every video I’ve seen the Ventrac should be able to handle it.
What about a dump trailer hooked to the 5 series and load it with one of the smaller tractors so that you don't have to worry about the spoils sluffing back in the pond. Then you can haul away the silt.??? Just a thought
Mud is like a magnet. I was doing a gig a month ago. Was told the stream was over there. Welp, it was a lot closer hidden by tall grass. The 1025 with turf tires turned into roller bearings. Luck to ha my son with me. He found a couple small pieces of plywood. I’m still not sure how we got out. A hour later we were back to work.
I like seeing the project. don’t give up!!!!
Tim have you thought about suction dredging to get rid of the silt by having totes with water on your trailer and having a garden hose to a pressure washer to loosen the silt for your trash pump to then suck it out
This job reminds me of a tool room shop moto . "The difficult jobs ,we do right away. The impossible jobs may take a little longer".
Timber rafts like letsdig18 uses could allow you a stable surface to use the backhoe from. Not sure how large you could afford to get since the spoils pile would need to be off to the sides. 2 x 6 lumber with 1/2” cable and u-bolts to "stitch" it together might work?