Why I'm not using Element (or equivalent) extinguishers in my track cars - 3 Concerns
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- Опубликовано: 2 июл 2024
- In deciding what type of extinguisher to use in my track cars, I found I had a few concerns that pushed me away from the Element / solid-state stick-style fire extinguisher (in spite of their longevity and form factor) in favor of a more traditional Amerex Halotron unit. As stated in the video, I'm sure the solid state extinguishers work fine. I have no qualms about their quality, just their "handling". Please take everything here as the opinion that is is, do your own research, and make your own decisions regarding your own safety. I'm simply expressing my own concerns and rationale. If I am ever legitimately in a vehicle that is actively on-fire, my first priority will be to exit the vehicle as fast as possible, only resorting to using an extinguisher to aid those ends or potentially help someone else.
Amerex 2.5lb Halotron Extinguisher (affiliate link)
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Element E50 Extinguisher (affiliate link)
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I had a basal ganglia stroke. My left arm and hand are affected.
I've used the Element 3 times with just my right hand. Just like with a diving regulator that stops, stay calm, don't panic, and follow the steps you've learned.
👍🏆🙏
Thank you for the very-relevant comment! It's good to know that's possible for those who have adopted the 'solid state' extinguishers. Had you practiced or mock-trained using it prior to when you needed to, or was your first use 'cold' and just proceeding intuitively?
@@LapoftheWorld I read the directions, watched videos, examined it closely... Before, I was in an emergency situation and wasted valuable time trying to figure it out.
I did the same thing with my Glock pistol. With jeans, I use the pocket to rack the slide, and if no jeans, the edge of my shoe sole, or the edge of the shoe close to my ankle. Can also clear a stovepiped hull that didn't clear. 👍
Great thought process and tip for anyone inexperienced: most fire extinguisher stores will sell expired extinguishers dirt cheap. I wouldn’t trust them unless it’s over nothing, but they are great to practice with. Putting out a life saving fire shouldn’t be the first time you use one. Plus starting a few campfires with friends or family to put them out is fun. Just don’t breathe the fire extinguisher spray because it will make you cough the rest of the day
Excellent video, great thoughts. Definitely shed light on some things I didn’t think of.
With that, I will probably put a couple in my Hurricane supplies and have a couple at home for residential use, to supplement my traditional style I have in shop/kitchen.
Thanks again for taking the time to share!
If you are racing and concerned about a crash and a fire, then what you probably need is a manual mechanical fire suppression system which you can pull a handle to start the fire suppression or a self contained system which is electrically activated by a push button, both systems would be pressurized and would be similar to what you would find on a car specifically designed as a professional racing vehicle and can be operated with one hand. If you're knocked unconscious before activation by a crash, then NONE of these systems are going to save you if you are on fire, so you had better hope the corner/track marshal is fast on their feet.
"Handling" either a stick fire extinguisher or a pull the pin and squeeze the handle pressurized system would be ridiculous to try and operate in a racing crash situation. You can always also carry a stick or pressure fire extinguisher, as well as, the mechanical or push button fire system, but it would be to put out fire in a vehicle that has been or is stopped, and the driver has exited the vehicle, not a situation where the driver is still in the vehicle.
For those that are concerned about damage to the vehicle from the extinguisher in a fire/crash, remember the vehicle and components can be replaced, a person cannot, so the whole idea of a fire system should be to save the driver, not to save the vehicle.
10/10 automatic fire system is the "one best way". I've seen Mark Petronis' accident. The intent here was a discussion about two low-effort and readily available options people might consider for on-road use or HPDE (something is better than nothing). As an aside, the one disadvantage of a fire system is it's only any good for your car. With my chief priority being getting out of the car in a fire, I figure I may be more likely to use my hand held extinguisher to help someone else. At a track you have corner workers etc. Less so in the mountains around here or at drives and events. I suppose the ideal would be an automatic system AND a hand held of some kind.
I think a potential solution to the one handed problem could be to mount the striker cap somewhere accessible in the cab of the vehicle and strike against it one handed.
Definitely a potential option!
or to have two hands ... I guess...
One-handed Me: "dammit, of course the fire would be where I put the striker!"
For us, we work around fuel filtration equipment. During filtration we have three ABC extinguishers placed at quickly accessible positions around the work area footprint. Since the fuel being filtered is primarily diesel, a fire would burn excessively hot. Seconds of deployment are essential in putting out such a fire before possible explosion. Only a extinguisher of the pull pin and actuated handle type would be effective in keeping the responder at a safe distance and being able to effectively put the fire out. Of course we train every quarter on fire suppression and the inspection of suppressive equipment. Great video.
What? Diesel fuel doesn't explode in ambient pressure, ambient temperature air. lol.
Thanks for the video. I really enjoyed that you present it in an unbiased fashion and welcome comments. I also love the Acura glasses while driving the Gallardo!
I can't afford Lamborghini glasses 😎😅. The car is one thing. That officially licensed merch tho...
Thank you for the great video. I was researching the service life of my automatic AFFF engine compartment fire suppression system in my Class A diesel pusher engine compartment when my research took me down a rabbit hole on Element Fire Extinguishers [nothing to do with what I was looking for], which eventually led me here. Great channel, by the way.
The top discussion point here, and the one I most agree with, is the intuitiveness of the product; before yesterday, I had never heard of an Element fire extinguisher, let alone ever used one. So had I been involved in a fire-related emergency, I would have immediately failed to recognize this device as a fire extinguisher. With added duress, lack of recognition, and training could have been catastrophic to me or someone I attempted to rescue.
However, recognition is the only significant fault with this device. You will still need two hands to initially retrieve and pull the pin [and possibly aim other extinguishers - if it has a discharge hose]. Try one-handed, removing a 3lb to 10lb traditional fire extinguisher from a band clamp mount, pulling the pin, and aiming and discharging. It will be challenging, with or without duress. Costs to service or replace after use are close enough not to be a detraction from the benefit of either device.
Fire extinguishers only need to work once, and I'd rather have one that works for a minute vs. a few seconds, but either way, training is vital, even if it's just by video. Most of us will never benefit from any degree of frequent live training, let alone once; it's costly and messy. Which one will be best for each of us? Well, that will certainly depend on many potential circumstances with too many variables to address here; ultimately, with some forethought and research, the best extinguisher will be the one you have.
Great review!! Very good points. I was thinking the same thing when I first saw it on someone’s 4x4
Nice video and you have the Gallardo looking great! I have a halotron extinguisher in another car and like how it's not caustic (esp to paint), but also have element in my G - the positives of the element outweighed it's striking activation for me (biggest plus being much longer working time). Main thing is be prepared, be safe, and have something!
Definitely be prepared! I think my concerns probably are pretty specific to potential track scenarios. For a road-side mechanical issue I think the Element might even be superior. (and it never expires so you can just chuck it somewhere and not worry about it).
Great points, I just ordered 4 traditional fire extinguishers and the element style just doesn't appeal to me as well for the same reasons. Thanks for posting.
Brilliant. Never thought of what you talked about!
A lot of people working at factories or even offices with factory spaces get trained in standard fire extinguishers today. Our company does yearly extinguisher training which we all have to do. I would guess most people on track will have some rough idea of how to use a standard extinguisher.
Not sure a striker based system would be my preferred choice when I was racing/instructing only because I have seen fuel spray everywhere.
Familiarity is the problem: Another person may not know how to use it, or think it was a road flare. If I came running towards someone's car with an Element extinguisher going, and they were not familiar with that type of extinguisher, they might wonder why I was sticking a road flare in their already aflame car, screaming and useless explanations would result, wasted time in an emergency. A regular fire extinguisher is easily recognized and they would realize that I am trying to help. I have been in this situation in real life where a car was on fire in traffic and I exited my vehicle with my fire extinguisher and put the fire out. BTW, I have the same Halotron extinguisher mounted in my car.
Good information that the average person would not likely consider. I do not KNOW, but I am guessing that you can strike the element on pavement or something similar.
I've been considering carrying these as a media guy. In drift car media we are frequently the first to respond at small events. It would be incredibly easy to carry 2-3 of these on my vest.
Definitely a time where the Element would shine I think with their light/compact packaging.
Great assessment of real world use! Especially hit home, since my father raced formula cars (often at the "Ledges") for around two decades with only one arm! Also occurred to me, as an international airline Captain, that there must be a reason the airlines haven't jumped on these - probably training and the the issues of use by someone with no training...
Fair point on the airlines and yes, although they're admittedly very simple to operate, simple doesn't preclude the need for training when usage needs to be reflexive.
That's some very valid points 🤔 💭
"Probably also my thumbnail"
Well played sir! 😄
In my life I have put out three fires. One with your typical fire extinguisher (Microwave had an electrical fire), a large fire extinguusher we use for aircrafts and ground equipment (operates the roughly the same, pull the pin, pull the pin at the nozzle rotate release forward). Then this stick style fire extinguisher. The company was not Element but Ultra Compact. Same exact design, or so it appears. My two complaints is you have to get closer to the fire than a traditional extinguisher. The power, if you will, just isn't there. It definitely put the fire out, but yeah no way to do it with one hand. I had no issue using it under stress. I never thought about one handed use until I went to a fire arms training course and we had to learn to use our gun one handed. Now all my emergency items I look at differently. What I didn't think of until you brought it up was a passer byer (if that is a word) being able to figure out that it is in fact a fire extinguisher and having the knowledge to use it. They definitely will put out the fire, but you have to be a little closer to it.
I think a potential solution to the one handed problem would be to mount the striker cap somewhere accessible in the cab of the vehicle and strike against it one handed. The passerby issue is a potential problem for sure. I don't realistically see someone recognizing that it's an extinguisher in an emergency situation much less being able to quickly ascertain how to operate it. I wouldn't bet my life on it anyhow...
thanks for your insight. I was wondering the same thing, how close do I have to be to try to put the fire out with the stick?
You need 2 hands to operate a standard fire extinguisher. One to hold the extinguisher theo ther to pull the pin. You the need 2 hands again one to hold extinguisher and squeeze the handle the other to aim the hose
By the book, yes. In reality you can thumb the pin out while already holding the handle without needing your other hand (I have practiced such with the extinguisher I have). Also, the Halotron extinguisher in this video does not have a hose on the tip, so it's just point/shoot which can, again, be accomplished with one hand. That will definitely depend on the specific model/style of extinguisher though so definitely something to consider.
Thank you for taking the time to make this video, however additional notes must be taken to review a product.
1. Most conventional fire extinguishers go in the trunk or under the seat on a base that holds it to prevent it from being a projectile and hurting you in an accident. (There is no place in sports cars, I have a Lamborgini)
2. A conventional fire extinguisher is difficult for an older person to maneuver.
3. When you have a fire in your own car, the first thing you instinctively do is get out of the car and give yourself a second to see where the smoke is coming from, this forces you to return to the car for the extinguisher and open the hood, 90 % of a fire in a car starts in the engine area and 10% inside the dashboard.
This is my personal opinion and I have no commitment to any brand, I just know that there are better products and this innovation has more benefits that I think can be useful for everyone.
I want to be clear that this wasn't intended as a full-on product review, (maybe I'll do one at some point) but rather a use-case exploration as a jumping-off-point for the amazing conversation that's happened in the comments. Definitely some valid point there about the weight of a conventional extinguisher vs. the Element/stick, and 100% get out of the car first if at all possible.
I have already decided not to get one based on another RUclips video.
But you bring up valid points that I hadn’t thought of.
If I had seen these advertised on vinwiki and been curious, it’s likely I would have cast one of these aside during a moment of need mistaking it for a flare.
Something is generally better than nothing.
But inadequate often has similar results as nothing.
Great points for sure! Another downside to the Element fire extinguisher is that it can only be used once. A re ignition is always possible, especially after an accident. If the Element is used on one fire and then another fire develops a minute or more later once it's used up, you are totally defenseless. With a traditional extinguisher, if you didn't totally empty it, you can still stand by and be prepared to deal with any potential reignition that could occur. I also wonder about the long term stability of he Element. Would it still be usable after sitting for 10+ years or would it have degraded from heat, absorbing moisture from the air, or some other unknown reaction? This may be a non issue, but definitely a consideration.
I saw a fire department video demonstrating the Element against a grease fire and a wood fire. It failed to extinguish EITHER. The demonstrator depleted the entire Element device, even kicking the wood fire to 'break it up' a bit. Didn't help. That's a NO for me on the Element.
Breathing capability (oxygen mask) is probably one of the first issues one might want to address prior to which extinguisher to use.
So last summer, a car paddocked near me (tweaked street car at track day) came back to the paddock after having a stumble at pit out. I was in the process of belting up, and saw him get out and pop the hood.
Flames shot up (it got air). I jumped out and grabbed the element from my glove box and put out his fire. Maybe 30sec from popping his hood till I got there. Nobody had an extinguisher or were nearby.
Saved his car. He bought me a replacement
100% Biggest point FOR the Element, IMO is the form factor that you can just toss in a glove box or door pocket and "forget" about until you need it, at which point it's there for you.
@@LapoftheWorld I do need to ‘practice’ (muscle memory) for if ever I’d need it myself in a scenario such as you describe.
I’ve had onboard fire systems in race cars, as well as easy to reach extinguishers in my own track car. But it was on a whim that I threw one in the glove box of latest street car that I also drive on track. Same type of thinking that I have a flat repair kit in a cubby.
Thanks for the comment. I was interested to see if it worked. The vendors always demonstrate on petrol fires in metal containers that are easy to extinguish. But I saw an independent video on this platform where uploader tried to stimulate engine bay fire with a barrel, petrol, plastics, rubber, etc, and the device failed. I think it was Fire Safety Stick 50. Sure he wasn't skilled, but I think the issue is there is a high risk of reignition, since gas doesn't remove heat from the source. In fact it might be hot itself, as the reaction seems to be quite energetic.
Clubs like PCA and NASA still only approve the traditional type so that is what I am going with. Thanks for your very valid points of view!.
PCA approved Element February 2020 by the PCA National DE Committee Chair
I would still rather have the element. It has the steps on it how to use it plus I’d rather be concerned that the ordinary extinguisher isn’t filled, expired or doesn’t have enough juice.
Also, the striking piece might be able to be striked on pavement using one hand?
Valid point about the expiration. That is definitely a pro for the Element.
I agree that this is a very good video! I read good reviews on the Element, so I ordered a couple today, but then it occurred to me to check out youtube videos. I've seen some other videos that show some of the apparent deficiencies of the product, so I'll be using my Element only as a backup to a more conventional extinguisher, which will be the first thing I reach for in an emergency. I don't have supercars like you, but only old vintage cars, but they have their own fire risks and hazards. One of the deficiencies of the Element is that it has a less powerful discharge than a standard extinguisher, so in very windy conditions the stream is hard to keep on target. I really like the logic based, common sense approach you took in assessing this product. I try to do that when I buy products...sometimes I succeed, sometimes I don't. I'll check out some of your other videos.
So if I use the stick to put out a fire and extinguish the fire in let's say 10 seconds. What do I do for the other 40 seconds? Statue of Liberty standing there with it pointed up in the air? So it's a 1 time use and time to buy another! I'm sure it has times where it does what you need it to and you can make a case for and against for both extinguishers. I like old school where when the fire is out, stop squeezing and it's over and possibly still usable or rechargeable.
To be fair, all traditional fore extinguisher.are one time use as well. Once if you use even a little bit, you need to re charge it. The seals and stuff are all compromised.
I did as you described with a fire in my shop. Pulled the trigger and stopped once the fire was out. I am talking a *SMALL* fire - about the size of 4 candle flames. Well, wouldn't you know. A short while later, the fire lit back up.
So the lesson learned? With either method, traditional tank or Element, once the fire is "out" keep pointing the extinguisher at the fire until it runs out. Use it all up. Either way, they need to be replaced , or recharged once used.
Mine flared up because very fine sawdust was smouldering down inside a crack. It was initially ignited by grinder sparks. The small space kept the heat in long enough to reignite.
Agreed. I've worked for the fire department for 22 years and carry a 2.5 pound ABC Dry Chemical. It's the right tool for the job. Cheers!
I have both in my track car and pray I never need either one as an automatic system is best.
I wouldn't know what to do with the smaller one.
Great video. One very important thing to remember though is how halon(hcfc-123) works on fires. It’s method of suppression is to remove oxygen from the equation. In large spaces this is fine but in a closed cockpit or small space this isn’t ideal at all especially if you’re pinned in the vehicle. Just food for thought.
Definitely worth noting. My personal thought is if it's bad enough I feel the need to trigger it in the cockpit then I'm probably not wanting to breath what's there before hand either....but definitely important to know how things work.
Wrong. Halon does not remove oxygen from the room. That's not how Halon works at all. It works by disrupting the chemical process itself. It was best used in computer server rooms because no mess or water is going into the electronics. The only thing Halon is considered dangerous for is ozone.
Don't mix Halon or Halon alternative clean agents like Halotron with CO2. CO2 does indeed smother and displace oxygen but halon/clean agents act by chemical inhibition (acting on the fire tetrahedron not the fire triangle) which is why a 3lb Halon can outperform a 10lb CO2. Yes there are toxicity issues with clean agents and their by products when used on fire, but Halon and it's replacements are far less toxic than it's (long disused) predecessors Carbon Tetrachloride, Methyl Bromide and chlorobromomethane. Almost all halon extinguisher deaths have been attributed to deliberate direct inhalation of the pure gas by substance abusers (a bit like glue sniffing, it affects the CNS) not use in a fire situation.
try using a Stopfyre extinguisher from AKE safety equipment
so when you have the big extinguisher in front of the passenger seat and the passenger is there you'll need to get the passenger to open her/his legs so you can extract the big ass tube then hit him/her in the face with it while you try to pull the pin , further start displacing it everywhere but at the base of the fire because it is way too big for your car and can't manipulate it in a contained space. Of course another option is not to have a passenger or to buy a bigger car ...all in all when shit hits the fan some lose it some don't if you're the type that lose it you can have the most intuitive extinguisher short of one that deploys by itself you'll be running leaving the car to burn. What I mean is all the "inconveniences" listed are bullshit really but it is a choice and everyone can chose to lie to themselves the way it tickles them.
I just tried to use an element fire extinguisher and it failed.
Hope everyone is ok! Do you mind sharing specifics of how it failed?
@@LapoftheWorld Thanks for asking. Everyone is OK, but it was enfuriating watching a man's new truck burst into flames while I was holding a supposed fire extinguisher that did nothing.
The tip of the extinguisher broke off, and there's no secondary mechanism for igniting the flare. Neither of us had a lighter, though i dont know if that would have worked. I've got a picture of the tip if you want me to send it. Please let people know. I think they are a scam. I just realized there are no reviews on their site. I contacted their customer support. I'll let you know the outcome.
I'm thinking here about ordinary folks who need access to a fire extinguisher in their kitchen, shop or their daily driver.
Traditional fire extinguishers are a pita because they must be maintained. I once tested a 3-year-old ABC powder extinguisher (that I'd intended to replace) that read "good" on the gauge but was 100% dead. I've known others who've had the same experience. Seals can leak. Valves can fail. Nozzles clog. And gauges can lie. They simply must be inspected and tested to be trusted. Most homeowners or hobbyists will neglect this, partly because its damn expensive and requires a schedule.
I once watched a group of about 10 chemistry teachers being trained to use traditional fire extinguishers. It's shocking how poorly the majority performed when actually putting out a waste basket fire, even after instruction and watching others do it. Dry runs were easy, but once it was lit, hands got shaky and minds went blank. Everyone was shocked at how quickly a 5lb extinguisher is emptied. Even that type of equipment is not as intuitive to folks as it might seem. Had the instructor suddenly said, "Only one hand this time!"...the fail rate would have been real high.
I guess if you're fighting small kitchen fires, small ones under the hood or in the shop, choose the one you're comfortable using and review how to use it. Every type has its "what ifs," and no fire is like the one you might practice on. Have something that gives you the best chance. Ideally, have both available, but figure out how you're going to schedule maintaining your pressurized one.
Does the Element work? Lambo driver...its $80!! Less than half of what you'd spend to change your oil. Test it and show us. :)
To be fair, at no point did I question if an Element extinguisher would put out a fire. The one I'm holding in this video is now mounted to my garage wall for many of the reasons you cite above. My reasons for not mounting one in my cars for track use, are pretty specific to that use case. I'll say it again though, on or off track ANY extinguisher is better than none.
Just Google fire extinguisher stores in your area refill a used fire extinguisher or one that is no longer in the green on the dial. Or drop them off at your nearest fire department
My biggest concern with these outweighs everything else you said. Fires are hot, and wind exists.
That may seem obvious, but every time you see someone demonstrating these they’re wearing fire protection gear, so they don’t suffer from the heat of the flames. Even on a calm day, they get very close to the fire in order to extinguish it. With wind blowing in the wrong direction, you almost have to stick your hand in the fire in order to be able to do anything.
There are advantages though. The operating time is fantastic for the size, and it doesn’t go out. That means you could throw it at a fire, or pop your bonnet slightly, throw it in and then retreat, and I imagine in the confines of an engine bay with a closed bonnet it’d extinguish anything, and maintain an unviable atmosphere for long enough to be able to prevent reignition. For me I’d carry a pair, one to throw, one to hold.
The issues with one handed use are valid though, but most flares are like this, perhaps a twisting cap would be better as you could use your thumb and forefinger to operate it?
I think a potential solution to the one handed problem would be to mount the striker cap somewhere accessible in the cab of the vehicle and strike against it one handed. I like the twist idea but you'd have to design it so it wouldn't accidentally be set off.
I have. Ferrari 430 and I decided to go with the Element brand vs the red can a:10-b:c model. I had had a bad can malfunction in my kitchen once. I did not have a fire but I wanted to test it. The fire gauge was in the green and I pulled the pin and nothing came out. The hose was not clogged. I like the fact the Element last 3 times longer. Jay Leno puts the Element in all his cars and recommend this brand too. I understand your points and have valid advice. My stick is close to my drivers seat and ready to go any time I need it. It’s also next to the rear engine release handle too.
Like I said, anything is better than nothing! The Element (and equivalent) have their place and not having an expiration is a great feature. Totally understand your choice given that experience. Love the '430 as well!
And if you really want to increase the effectiveness of that 2 1/2lb extinguisher switch to Halon, which is still available. According to the FAA test done in 1995 It requires 1.5 times as much Halotron to put out a fire as it does with Halon. No matter what you use, Halon, Halotron, or Element, it needs to be securely mounted in a place that you can reach while fully belted in.
Once the halon is gone the fire can restart. So, if there's something electrical that's sparking or shorting or hot metal being dripped on then it could restart. The stick seems better because it leaves a chemical behind for a while that keeps working. I think I'll get one for the race car. I think the guys arguments are weak.
Never thought of these points. I guess you sold me on the tried and true extinguisher.
Any extinguisher is better than none. My goal isn't to sell anything (not sponsored and I hope that was clear), but rather to start a discussion or trigger some critical thinking. My hope is that everyone considers the choice in context of how/where they might need an extinguisher and evaluates the choice based on their needs. There are, I'm sure, use cases where the solid state extinguisher is 100% the better option.
The tried and true are fine if you always remember to have them tested and serviced every year.
It would be wise to carry both extinguishers if you have the space. It looks like that Element will fit on my motorcycle.
100% the Element's strength is in the packaging, one of them will definitely fit where you couldn't just stash a traditional bottle of any useful size. Cheers!
You do have some very good points , but the best thing for me with the Element is piece of mind , I know it will always work, Maintenance free, there have been several times we’re a tank style Extinguisher didn’t discharge and that sucks
Definitely a valid point with the maintenance. I think the choice will come down to any given individual's use case. For something to toss in the glove box of a work truck, I think the Element is brilliant. I keep the one I bought in my garage and it's nice to know I won't have to think about checking it's charge.
@@LapoftheWorld Agreed! They both have there pros and cons
But will it always work? So many videos of the element failing 2 extinguish basic fires..I have zero faith after what I have seen
@@Turnersspeedshop Send me link please, Thanks
No idea why I'm watching Ron Jeremy's little brother review a fire extinguisher.
🤣🤣🤣 that's a new one, lol.
Carry both. You seem intelligent so can use the element, others can use the halitron and run out quick. :)
😆 Fair enough, lol
place striker plate on surface.
then any time you grab the stick, the striker plate is ready to go. Ta da.
I think you have good points for street spirited driving but at the track I think the element is better. At the track I need something for use in that minute between something going wrong and the safety workers getting to me. If the thing that went wrong is a bad wreck and my motor control is shot I would just leave my car to the safety workers as I am put in an ambulence but if the problem is Im sitting there watching my car burn. I want something to try to fight the fire with while I wait for the safety workers.
So I've been a part of that exact (second) scenario....with a Halon extinguisher and the driver and I were able to save the car. I think the Element could do just as well if I swapped it into that situation as there was no challenge getting out of the car that time. I'm not trying to sell anything (I mean if it means more people put any kind of extinguisher in their car, my job is done), more trying to bring up some points and start a dialogue. The hope is that you never need whatever you have, but "hope" also doesn't prevent burns or property damage.
@@LapoftheWorldAs someone that has an element I appreciate you saying it would do just as well in that situation. I agree that I ordered an element and threw it in the glove box much quicker than mounting a bigger fire extinguisher. Maybe element could improve on the design with a handle or pull clip that stricks the tip as u pull it off.
@@dakotafire24 The key in our scenario was that the Halon didn't need to "see" the fire to put it out. Similarly I think we could have discharged an Element under the car in the same way to probably similar effect (the latch for the engine bonnet had melted, so dry chem extinguishers weren't doing much).
Another thing that you could have added is using the thing if the place you are is full of smoke. Do everything that is required blind? I was in a burning aircraft on its side. That thing would have killed me. By the way, my 100K A/C was toast.
Good video with good points, but you talk about activating the unit in the car and I am pretty sure that your HALON extinguisher will take your oxygen too! In contrast you can breath the ELEMENT Media all day long....
Valid point, and definitely something to keep in mind with any extinguishing media, but I'd conjecture that if you're to the point of needing to trigger it in the car that may not be your chief concern.
Great video and good points, but some arguments are sketchy! Towards the end of the video, you said you can't train on a fire safety stick because of a non-standard form factor? This is why you train! ;) The alternative company from the UK provides 25, 50, and 100 second discharge sticks. The smallest ones are perfect for training. However, whether the bystanders would know how to use it or even recognize it as a fire extinguisher is a valid point! Watching videos is good enough, but until recently I wasn't aware of such products!
One, your “old” style extinguisher should be weighed and serviced at least once a year, and has a limited shelf life . And B, you could teach a monkey to use it ,so what’s the problem ? It’s an amazing product, if your motor home was on fire, you just fling it in, not climb inside and try to fight it, where the toxic fumes from the fire would have you !
A standard ABC extinguisher will generally last well over a decade. They need to be inspected monthly, recertified every year, and then usually serviced after six years; only if they are actually in a public building or place of business. If you are just throwing them in your car or your home, then do whatever you want. As long as it is fully charged and undamaged, it will last a very long time.
And I imagine that if these element ones ever become accepted into safety regulations for buildings, that the same exact rules and regulations would apply for them as well.
They are both good products with their own upsides and downsides, and I personally have one of each in my Jeep: An Element one in my armwrest compartment and an ABC one mounted on the roll cage in the back. The element one is what I would reach for if I am in the driver's seat and something in front of me catches fire on my own car to where it is risking my own life. It is small and convenient compared to the much larger traditional ABC one. But if I am assisting someone else or dealing with anything that is not directly in front of me on my own car, I will grab the traditional ABC one from the back.
And D, if you have both why not have both in the car…. After all you never know which side of the car is going to be crushed
As a inspector that has used both of these extinguishers, you must factor that the Halotron extinguisher will NOT harm any components in the vehicle and is VERY effective. The Element can actually harm components it comes in contact with if used improperly. I personally would not use the Element in an enclosed space. Don't get me wrong, The Element is a great product and easy to use but Halotron is the most effective if you don't want to totally destroy what you are using it on.
Halotron extinguishers are charged with Argon gas and not nitrogen, thus making them a bit more expensive to recharge than ABC extinguishers. $60-300 depending on the size.
Thanks for the qualified data points there!
How would someone use it "improperly"? Strike, point, extinguish?
After watching several failed videos I have ZERO faith in the element extinguisher 2 save my car
10:32 Whoaaaah, how come you're sure? Sure does look like the Element works well at all with grease nor with wood in this example dCaPUYKs5Zc
I like it but honestly the ignition sequence is too complicated for the average person which is a moron typically. They should integrate a pull tab or draw string that will pull the igniter across the top. Remember that in a panicky situation people lose all their calm and sense. No one should need to read any instructions in an emergency situation to know what to do.
Being a Lamborghini you’ll need a fire extinguisher of any kind.
Italian car problems, lol. (lucky so far)
The elements do not work well the Halatron works Great
Well that was a waste of time , best you google the effectiveness of the Element and make up your own mine . I personally would use the standard extinguisher.
Some people just don’t like CHANGE 😢 and never try anything new😂
Why I am against the element but by all means use my affiliate link so I get paid. RUclips is more and more like commercial TV with annoying ads these days.
Hello Comrade, welcome to capitalism. 😉
...also the whole point was any extinguisher is better than none but, for the specific use I describe, I prefer the bottle to the stick. I linked to both and if I'm going to link to anything I may as well use an affiliate link, no? The only "pitch" here is to carry an extinguisher in your car. 🔥🚒
@@LapoftheWorld duly noted!
There's all of that and the pos doesn't work worth a damn, either.
I literally had it in my cart ready to checkout and this video came up while I was looking for a coupon code.
It's no longer in my shopping cart.
To be clear this wasn't intended as any hit-piece and I'm sure they'll extinguish fire in base terms. I bought the one pictured with my own money and I've got it next to the door into my garage. In the garage, I'll have both hands available, I don't have to worry about wind, and there won't be the urgency involved with being belted into in a car on fire. There it can sit, never needing to be recharged, and it ads a layer of safety to the shop. Although I don't carry one in any of our track cars, they are still better than nothing in a vehicle and definitely have a place elsewhere.
@@LapoftheWorld 100% agree. You just pointed out a few things I overlooked. (Or maybe in this case, turned a blind eye to since it seemed like a cool product).
That's a dumb reason not to use it. Because during the fire you might all of a sudden lose a hand.
There are many plausible scenarios where a high speed crash could result in an arm or hand being broken or otherwise immobilized. Remember, I'm talking here about on-track use specifically in my case (hence video title) so there's pretty much a wreck assumed before a fire vs. spontaneous combustion in traffic where you'd just stop the car and get out.
I'm sorry, but what is the point of this video other than to "discuss" non-existent issues? Also the timestamp titles are misleading AF (overviews aren't half the video with the "demo" literally showing nothing)
Striking large, ready-to-be-struck surfaces together is the point, plenty of differently-abled people are able to manipulate 2 caps off of a tube and strike away from the body. And if they can't, they should probably have an assistant/caretaker anyways
This video speaks as 'look at me in my Lambo, wearing Acura branded shades, poor peasant'
Its sad that one cant use a common English, nonvulgar word. Boomstick. Wow
I am not sure how intelligent you are, but it doesn’t talk a bunch of common sense to understand the fire safety sticks. As for training you can simulate taking the caps off and striking the end without actually setting it off. Lastly the effectiveness of the sticks and the potential lack of damage to your car if you ever need to use it should make it a no brainer
I'm no genius, but I have a few brain cells to rub together. The goal here wasn't a hit piece on stick style extinguishers, but rather to have a conversation about things to consider when picking an extinguisher. My pretty-specific use case may be vastly different than yours or the commenter's below. I still keep the Element on the wall next to the door to my garage because there I, or my family, are likely the only people who would have occasion to use it, we all understand how it works, and I don't have to worry about keeping it charged, or using it in blustery conditions. Meanwhile the one in my car move around with the car, so out in the world some actual idiot might have to use it and they might not be able to figure out something new/foreign as quickly as something that works basically the same as the one under their sink back home. (Also in the wind, etc as others have pointed out). Is this over-thinking? Probably. Did you think about your own fire extinguisher situation after watching? Hopefully. If so, mission accomplished 🍻
take off your sunglasses… don’t use them as a mask to hide
Yahshua - you know Him as Jesus - was born to a virgin, turned water to wine, taught, healed the sick, raised the dead, casted out demons, walked on water, calmed the storm, and fed a crowd of thousands with a few fish and a few loaves of bread, among many other things. He was killed on the cross as payment for the sins of all mankind, three days later He rose from the dead. Forty days later He ascended into heaven where He sits at the right hand of the Father. He is returning very soon, but before He does, Satan, the devil, is coming to pretend to be Jesus/God (2 Thessalonians 2:1-4). Satan is an angel, and he will have certain supernatural powers with which to try to fool everyone. He will, for example, be able to make fire come down from heaven in the sight of men. He will only be on earth a short time before the real King of Kings, Jesus Christ, God in the flesh, returns. When the real Jesus comes we will all be transformed into our spiritual bodies at the same moment. Jesus came in the flesh to offer forgiveness of sins and eternal life to anyone who believes and calls on His precious name!
if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. - Romans 10:9
Now when Jesus was in Bethany, in the house of Simon the leper, There came unto him a woman having an alabaster box of very precious ointment, and poured it on his head, as he sat at meat. But when his disciples saw it, they had indignation, saying, To what purpose is this waste? For this ointment might have been sold for much, and given to the poor. When Jesus understood it, he said unto them, Why trouble ye the woman? for she hath wrought a good work upon me. For ye have the poor always with you; but me ye have not always. For in that she hath poured this ointment on my body, she did it for my burial. Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this gospel shall be preached in the whole world, there shall also this, that this woman hath done, be told for a memorial of her. - Matthew 26:6-13
Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon....
To anoint your self, the sick, or a building for spiritual protection:
Get a small bottle of olive oil and pour off a small amount into a smaller vessel like a vial or baby food jar. Use the rest of the bottle for cooking. Ask the Lord to bless your vial of oil in Jesus name. Anoint yourself with the oil by placing a dab of oil on tip of finger and touch it to your forehead, and ask the Lord to bless you/heal you. To anoint your home or other building: place a dab of oil on your finger and anoint the door posts and order all negativity and evil out of the house, and order that nothing negative or evil can enter into your home including piggybacking on a person entering, order it to be so in the name of Jesus. Anoint all potential entrances to your home. To anoint the sick: place oil on tip of finger and touch it to the head of the sick and say a prayer of healing over them in Jesus name. See James Chapter 5:14-15...........
Look, I get it. Beard, long hair, video about saving yourself from being burned alive, but I think you've got the wrong guy 😉.
Sooooo.... you are saying we *SHOULD* all sin. Otherwise Jesus died for nothing?? Got it.
@@marceld6061 Read Romans chapters 5 and 6. Here is Romans 6:1-4 "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life."
OK let’s get to it I think this video is more about your car then that fire extinguisher do you need to put the Lamborghini in this video for this no! You said your fire extinguisher was $200 those element fire extinguishers cost about 60 bucks so you can get three of the elements for that and test it out Next how many people use a fire extinguisher from the inside out very rarely happens but OK Next you said you can use your fire extinguisher one handed while it’s still in the holder.. wonder if the nozzle is not pointed at the direction of your fire then a defeats the whole purpose I get the Things you have to go through to strike it but people buy this for space saving convenience and it doesn’t leave a residue normal fire extinguishers leave a bad residue and you can breathe this stuff its non-harmful so this Video was 12 minutes of a Lamborghini my man you didn’t even show its effectiveness then you showed your self driving in the Lamborghini why Next time actually put the work in for the video
I mean if the Lamborghini is why someone clicked, and they're now considering putting a fire extinguisher of some kind in their car, then that's a win in my books. My goal here was to start a conversation and express some concerns about a specific use case (track use). As to cost. The Amerex halotron extinguisher was $187. The Element extinguishers range from $80 to $160 depending on the model. To your other concern, the Amerex extinguisher is gas based (no corrosive residue, matters less which way it's pointed) so works similarly in that way. There are definitely advantages/disadvantages to each. Again though, the goal here was to create a dialogue for people to decide for themselves which to carry and as I stated, either one is better than whatever pee stream one could manage if it came to putting out a fire 😁
Those are good points. Good job.