I was born into the 2x2's church - 3rd generation. I left in 2023 at age 65! ..after the Dean Bruer debacle, & subsequent revelations of how CSA & SA is handled.The victim is to forgive & be quiet😢 A victim or anyone who speaks out can get in trouble for telling.I feel duped by the leadership also for not admitting a man started the religion. Once the scales fell from my eyes - I couldn't unsee the similarities to other high-control groups / cults. You did a great job, insightfully telling the basics. I had wondered when you would feature my former "faith."
Thank you so much for reacting to this, I was born & raised 4th generation in the 2x2’s and left the group when I was 18. I always knew the religion was secretive but I never realized it was a full blown cult until 2023, when one of the overseers, (dean bruer), was exposed as having been a perpetrator of sexual abuse himself, and all the lies and coverups dating back decades started to come out. I, myself, was groomed by cult elders and thankfully never was abused but was still subject to being around these inappropriate men while I was still a child, essentially I was responsible for keeping myself safe, even after I exposed the adults grooming me to my parent & local church leaders. When I say the FBI has their work cut out for them, I mean it will likely take the better part of a decade for them to sort out all the negligence, wrong doing, and falsifying of legal documents that this cult has been involved in.
Growing up, my family had Wednesday night meeting in our home, and my dad was the elder. The worker pairs who were in our area for 6 months at a time came and lived in our home and others members homes, for 2-3 days at a time. Plenty of these workers are being abused themselves, and plenty of them are the abusers -of other members, and other workers. As a child, I had no fewer than 10 known sexual abusers live in my home from time to time, not known to my family at the time, but found out in the last 2 years. The car they drive, the technology they use, the bank accounts they have access to -all belong to the wealthy members in the group.
The meetings are Sunday and Wednesday, and the elders are simply chosen based on convenience of the area for the mtg to be held in and if the workers deem you a respectable and upstanding member of the group. It has a lot to do with monetary contributions & just favoritism from the overseers & workers. Sam is absolutely correct when he says the women’s appearance is all about control. Some families, like my own, allowed school activities like choir and band & sports, so long as they didn’t interfere with mtg attendance.
Thank you so much for your kind and gentle way of discussing this church. I'm 4th generation born and raised and left at 48. The reason people don't speak up is because they literally believe that there is no other route to salvation. They are literally clinging to their salvation with a death grip! Also, the workers knew. We have been absolutely shocked to see the willingness of some people to bury their head and pretend nothing is happening. It's also been shocking to her the workers blatantly lie to us.
Absolutely they knew. One of the workers maintained repeatedly on a news interview that he didn’t know about a specific perpetrator, and I was a teenager at the time and knew. There was no possible way he wouldn’t have, being a senior worker in a neighboring state. It has been one of the most devastatingly disappointing things I’ve delt with…Finding out that so many people that I was taught to trust with no hesitation either abused children I grew up with, or covered it up. Not to mention just finding out that so many people I know were abused by people we trusted and were taught were God’s one true people and our only way to heaven.
I would love to hear your full story Mainstream LDS is no different- they just have lots of money and lawyers to cover up -- as members, we also have been conditioned to hold on to the church and leadership with a death grip. Thankfully I too saw the light
I’ve been waiting for you guys to cover this one! I was never part of this group, but my mom grew up in it and didn’t even know what church it was. She left when she turned 18. I went digging a few years ago and was shocked. When I was a kid my grandparents moved from where we lived. Years later I found out it was because of the church. My great grandmother was the first in the family to join. When I went on my search for information I found pictures of my family members at a yearly conference. My grandparents house was the main meeting house in their area. About the hair… my grandmother was 96 when she passed and had been out of the church since the 80’s. Her hair was past her waist my entire life and always styled just perfectly. When she turned 92 she called me and asked me to take her to my hair stylist. I will forever remember that day. She cut her hair short and was glowing! I’ll be forever grateful for sharing that moment with her because it meant much more than could ever be expressed.
Thank you for discussing the 2x2’s !! There is so much evil . My husband’s family is 2x2 and it makes me physically ill thinking about what he had to deal with growing up. I know there are good people in the 2x2’s (1000’s have left !) but there is so much destruction here
David Alink has a RUclips channel-he was raised in the 2x2 church and later his wife Merissa joined-they have since left. The name of his channel is David Alink. You could learn a lot from his channel, but I think he would talk with you as well. Thank you for talking about this group!
Watching this is utterly surreal. Watching an ex flds review of the church I was in. A decade ago it was the reverse for me. I watched in utter fascination of everything flds. How could these people be so blind? Now I understand the intrigue. I was watching myself.
I grew up in this group and left about a year ago. Almost all of my family is still a part of it. Watching ex-Mormon content has been extremely helpful for me since there isn’t too much ex 2x2 content yet, and I’ve been a long-time watcher of your channel. Thank you for covering this! I’m not the most knowledgeable on church history, but I can speak to the structure and culture in the church!
Ex Mormon content isn’t a valid source of truth some people that have had their feelings hurt have valid feelings but there are some that just want to tear it down and are pretty vicious in their attack
@@tessieroberts8753you sound like yet another LDS defender, it's so painfully obvious when people come onto exmo content and start trying to tear down everyone who has shared their real stories of abuse and bring light to very serious issues
Oh my deal akeisha…thank you for telling us about your situation and I’m wishing peace of mind for you and you’ve taken the biggest step already by leaving. 💕
Thank you for covering this! My mom grew up in the 2x2’s and left in her early 20s, my grandparents are still in it and I have grown up going to some of their meetings and it is unlike any church I have been to
It appears that the stars have aligned for you two to cover my group! I have been watching your channel from the beginning and absolutely love you guys! I left the 2x2's a year and half ago, and it's definitely been the hardest thing I've ever had to do. Part of my family are still in and seem to be even more ingrained. Some actually refer to it as "The Truth", so it's crazy seeing this hot pink hoody with TRUTH printed on it! I became fascinated with Escaping Polygamy back in 2020 and started watching all the documentaries about the FLDS which led me to your channel. I began to see many parallels with how the women look and how the people are kept in due to fear. The language used is a bit different, but the meanings are pretty similar. Those of us who have left the church are considered "lost out" which means that we've lost our salvation and have no hope of eternal life unless we repent and come back to the meetings. Most of us are not shunned near as much as you "apostates", but there is still a huge separation that is felt. It's an extremely painful process, and choosing to leave can have pretty severe repercussions for some of us. Thanks so much for talking about this group. You have no idea how much this means to us that are aware of what is going on and want the truth to be known about these predators!
Yes that word apostate gets thrown around way too much. I had a conversation with my 17 year old daughter a month or so ( her dad is faithful LDS I am former LDS. She goes with her dad and has become fully converted to the church) in that discussion I asked her if she thought I was lost- she said “ not lost because there is still hope” when I told her there will never be a time I will come back to the LDS church she told me that “yes, you will lose the celestial kingdom but I will come and visit you” I didn’t know whether to laugh or cry. I was so angry at the lies of this church and how they divide families. My daughter now fully embraces the idea that without the temple and obeying church leadership- you cannot be saved Thankfully I know better- but it hurt that after everything I have shared with her- she has still been deceived and embraces a CULTure that will ultimately bring her sadness
❤️❤️ We're so sorry for the pain you've had to endure because of this group. We hope that by spreading awareness, we can all help each other through these hard times! Thank you for your comment. This means the world to us ❤️
Y’all did a great job explaining this 2x2 church. I grew up in it and was 5th generation. I left at 38 years old and now am 52. Most of my family are still in.
Thank you for taking the time to discuss this group. My father was an Elder in the 2 x 2s and also an ex-worker. Many Elders were Workers. Otherwise, Elders are picked for their homes and space for parking. Or, those willing to purchase/rent a large enough home to host meetings and provide parking for the "Friends" attending the meetings. Overseers will also consider putting meetings into apartments as long as there is enough parking. Typically, they prefer all family members to be professing but for sure the Elder and his wife must be professing to host meetings.
It honestly doesn't seem very sinister to me! Obviously some members might have felt limited and opressed, but many others probably got something out of their particupation. It is not like it was set up with a sinister purpose. Clearly the purpose was to live biblical lives --- but some of the elders were bad apples.
I haven't finished this video yet, but there is a RUclipsr named David Alink who came out of this church. He shares his story and also travels around and interviews a lot of other people who also came out of it.
It bothers me that people are looking to find faults with Christian biblical groups and attack them until they fall apart. It is destructive - and is Mainstream society so much better? All we learn hear is that this church has sexists and some abusers - just like mainstream society, possibly less.
Meetings are Sunday and Wednesday (not Monday). Many of the workers are definitely known to the people, some of them very well known (as in, have known them much of their lives, etc). Other times, if there were visiting workers, those workers would be complete unknowns. Born and raised; it's been a very eye-opening, wrenching couple of years. Crazy times. Many many similarities. Thanks for your perspective.
Yes. Sunday morning ‘fellowship meeting’ in a home. A small local group decided by ‘the workers’ Gospel meeting were always on Sunday afternoon or evening, open to the public, and for the members of the whole field/geo-area
I grew up in the truth and my dad is an elder. I left in 2014. I think a large part of being an elder is based on how restrictive you are and if you live a more conservative lifestyle. I feel like elders and their families are held to a little bit of higher standard. Women are definitely held to a strict standard because we didn’t want to be “worldly” and ever put a man in a position to be tempted.
I second this. My dad was an elder for years. He came from a very high standard, extremely judgmental family. He had 3 siblings in the work & all his siblings still profess along with nearly most of his extended family as well. Having a child go into the work, Coming from lineage traced back to when the gospel was first brought to a certain area of first "converts" gives you "status".....Or just being in the Truth long enough & having your whole family profess, or just having money. Sad but true..money always speaks volumes. I am 4th Gen 2x2. I left when I was 19 in 2009.
Thank you so much for creating awareness and being willing to discuss the heavy topic of CSA and high control groups. Thank you so much for what you are doing and the time, effort and energy you put into it!
This is wild. I’m barely 3 mins in & I gotta say 3 things before I continue… 1. I love the compassion you guys have while still continuing on n with difficult topics. We should never stop talking about abuses… I heal loudly so other won’t suffer silently. 2. I have never heard of this cult… I have the feeling I’m about to be “ugh” 😮 3. Melissa - You know I love the sweater.. lol preach!
I was born and raised in this church me entire life until I left when I was in my 20's but most of my family is still involved in this church. So crazy to watch you guys talking about this. I personally know Andy Scholl from this documentary.
Sunday morning meetings are in Elders homes. Wednesday night meetings (Bible studies) are in other members home who the workers have selected to host the meeting. Elders should be selected based on proven character as described in the Bible however often it isn’t that way. Overseers are workers themselves that are also responsible for a region. Workers go 2x2 into an assigned field. A region has several fields. William Irvine from Ireland started the whole thing in 1897. I highly recommend the book “Preserving the Truth” by Cherie Kropp if you want the whole history. It is excellent. I was born and raised in it. Left in April 2024. Leaving was tied for the hardest thing I have ever done in my life. Thank you for your caring and pretty accurate report. God Bless you!
Our family was friends with two by twos. My dad came from the same town, and knew them almost his whole life. I have tried to find info on their religion on RUclips. I found there was not much out there. What I found was out of Australia I believe. Thank you so much for covering this.
Check again now by searching 2x2. There are so many now! Cult discussions. Telling the Truth. Advocates for the Truth. Exposing Truth. Many podcasts and interviews, etc.
@ggrace1133 true I live by the Golden rule. Be good to others so they will be good to you. You never know what someone's going through at home. I have been very blessed because I have met many good people in this life and I've needed those interactions. Not only do i have a full time job but I also have a disabled son who requires full time care. Just getting out of the house to go to the store can be hard if he's having a bad day. It can cause anxiety for me. It seems to be those days that I meet the kindest people.
What an interesting video! Comparing them with both LDS and FLDS beliefs made it easier to understand this group that I've never heard of before! Keep bringing these kinds of things into the light, we need less darkness in our world.
Oh man, when I saw you on Alyssa’s video I commented then and hoped maybe y’all would pick up on “us”. Growing up in this way, it’s crazy to see how similar we were but also my goodness, don’t dare say that to our “workers” (I made that mistake once). Thanks for covering this.
Thank you Melissa and Sam for being vulnerable out here, educating the general public, including people from different countries like myself, about the dangers and tragedy of having your freedom taken from you. I have learned a lot from both of you in the last year or year and a half of watching. I’m sure we can reach the 100k!❤
Sending love to you both. You have big hearts & are doing great work. While watching it hit me that even though this is about high-demand religion/s, all types of coercion & abuse can be found in the most mainstream protestant churches: forcible touching etc, insidious behavior that flies under radar & is easily denied. It's hard enough to speak up in those cases so it must be much harder to speak up about & break out of the extreme indoctrination you're discussing here & have discussed in other episodes. You're helping so many people. Thanks & Happy New Year! 🙏
I honestly love you guys so much and all your content touches my heart in a unique way. I left my religious upbringing when i became a teenager and I'll admit to having a lot of religious anger and even being kind of judgmental towards religious people at times. The way you guys discuss your respective backgrounds, compassionatley share dialouge about high control groups, and work to spread information on these topics is really powerful. You both expand my world view so much through your content.
I started watching you guys when I was still attending church and found you through Amanda Rae. I left just over a year ago after finding out that major information was being withheld three months after it became public.
Super interesting listening to your description of 2x2 vs FLDS/LDS church. The subject of child sa is completely disgusting and horrific😡. I’m thrilled that this has come to light by the powers that be who can and are doing something about it.
I always hate to push the 👍button when the topic involves abuses etc. I know that it is showing good for you in stepping up to report these atrocities and not for the crimes being committed. It is just always so sad to learn of these things. Thank you to the two of you and your continued support and drawing attention to these crimes and directing people towards a way to find and receive help. May you be richly blessed in the New Year and may many people find the help they need thanks to your willingness to continue to shed light on the situations.
I have a friend who grew up in this community ( in a small east coast canada town). He hasnt shared much about it with me but i know hes working through it all as best he can and is living a much happier life these days. Excited to learn with yall!
As someone who grew up, the elders are usually the owner of the home. The workers would ask them to hold the meeting. The workers are not necessarily at every meeting. The Sunday morning the congregation would each speak on what they had read that week (whatever was on their mind, or the area of the Bible they were reading). Wednesday nights, we are all reading and speaking on the same chapter. They were investigated as a cult in the 70s (or something) and found not to be a cult. I think technically the government wouldn’t call them a cult but as someone now looking at it, they are on the edges and do many of the harmful actions.
Born and raised - 4th generation. I was born into worker family royalty under intense stress to offer for the work. Members would often encourage the youth in our family to become workers...but of course, this was an individual calling from God, not intimidation and programming. It was devastating to be pressured to offer for the work (to escape a lost eternity). I'm in permanant therapy unwinding the fact that those who were supposed to love me were pressuring me to kill off my bloodline through permanant celibacy. We were to be child sacrifices to bring pride and joy to our parents. Every bad day, every hard feeling you had was "God troubling you." So unless you could exist in constant toxic positivity, you were destined for the permanant celibate ministry.
Love and light to you two in all you do to advocate for those in these situations. Go get a massage! Self care is important after these heavy subjects! ❤
I also grew up in this religion but have been out for almost 30 years. It’s very hard to have family still in and defending such horrific behavior! So enjoy watching you two with all your videos and thanks for covering this religion.
Thank you for this. I was a part of the 2x2s for 13 years. So little known about outside their group. You are changing that. I don’t know your Christiology but you refer to them as Christian. They are not trinitarian. They believe Jesus was created and could lose his salvation. I confirmed this with the overseer here in Texas years ago. So given that in the strictest sense they are Christians by name only. They do not worship the same God as those who hold the trinity as being biblical. Love your stuff so far. I subscribed to do my part in getting you to 100,000!! Go git em!!
There are so many similarities to what has gone on in the Catholic Church as well. I know you both are speaking from your own experience, but having looked into several cults recently something like this also has happened in the church of Scientology (not that I believe it’s really a church), the Kingston clan, and many others. It breaks my heart every time I hear of another group that uses “religion” as a free ticket to commit these abuses on others that find themselves in their midst ether because they have been born into it, or because they are looking for a place to belong, or even because they actually believe the teachings. Believing the teachings does not give ANYONE a free pass to pry on others. Point blank, full stop. Thank you both for helping to bring awareness to what is going on in these groups that are trying to stay secretive and hidden. I’ve watched your channel off and on for a couple years now and you have given fact, and shared your experiences without pushing what you believe and that is a hard balance to achieve. Much respect to you both.
You guys are doing an important job. I'm sure it must take a bit of a toll looking at the corruption and the Darkness in so many different groups that claim to profess love. Please always remember but although what you do is difficult it is also truly making a difference.
I watched a news special a while ago about this group. At the time I remember thinking it would be great if you guys could watch it and compare this group to the FLDS, since cults seem to have so many similarities, even though they are different. I'm excited to see you guys are looking into this group. I have not seen the hulu documentary. Maybe I should go check it out.
An Elder is just a word the 2x2 church uses when a meeting is given to a home ..soy Sunday meeting home both the man and wife were called elders .. None of the Elders in my meetings never had any say in our lives or actions ..they were just suppling a meeting in their home .. The workers in the area are the ones who choose the homes for meeting .. Both couples have to be professing and both baptized to have a meeting in their home .. The name! "Elderer" ..is just that .. A name they hold no power.per say Hope this helps .. I left 5 months ago but am still good friends with all the friends in my field In Canada...we ALL talk about what's going on ..
Members will refer to the church as “The Way” or “The Truth” and there’s quite a few people in this church in Saskatchewan. I’m not a member of the group but have family that are, and they have gone and stayed with members of this church in Saskatchewan.
I've never heard of this cult? Thanks for your work on exposing these communities. I'm sure you are helping many people. Sam, do your parents think that Warren committed crimes and deserves to be in jail?
Meetings on Sunday and Wednesday- elders don’t really have any role besides having the mtg in their home- only the workers are “pastors”… but it was a special privilege to have mtg in their home
I was the 3rd generation born into the 2x2’s and left when I was 37. We were told that women having long hair was also a sign of submission and to allow it to grow as long as God wanted it. Mine was thick to my ankles! Try putting that up on your head! It also makes women unattractive to “outsiders” of the group.
I’m so glad you are out. My husband too grew up in it. The control, the secretiveness, the control and lack of information in the money - I am so glad that people are seeing the REAL truth amount the 2x2’s
I’m so glad you are out. My husband too grew up in it. The control, the secretiveness, the control and lack of information in the money - I am so glad that people are seeing the REAL truth amount the 2x2’s
I’m so glad you are out. My husband too grew up in it. The control, the secretiveness, the control and lack of information in the money - I am so glad that people are seeing the REAL truth amount the 2x2’s
I really want to thank you both for the Trigger Warning 🙏 nothing worse than watching something and half way into it I have to shut off the show. I watch everything you put up and enjoy it all. Keep putting them out. Your doing great 👍 bless you both 🙏
This sounds very much like the church my grandmother belonged to many years ago. No name or church buildings - that was considered a false idol. No clergy, just elders. Meetings in people’s homes. Women couldn’t wear makeup or cut their hair. We’ve always called it “grandma’s church”. My father had no interest in being in the church, thank goodness! Group was Organized across the country, from 1960-67 we lived in NE, IL, CT, back to IL as my dad advanced his career. Every place we moved a church member would call on us within a few weeks of our arrival. They considered it the one true church. Very interesting video - thank you!
If abuse goes on and hidden, tells ya its a cult and NOT a "Christian" church. I live in southern utah. So many child sexual abuse in the Catholic church too. Thank you s9 much for the warning before hand.
About your comment about hair and religion. I was a psych major. Decades ago, way back in the pre-internet world, I read that the parts of the brain that lit up while thinking about God and thinking about hair were right next to each other. There was speculation that this might be why religions have all sorts of rules about hair -- if neurons were so close together that they cross ignited each other. I just googled and nothing comes up for me. I don't know how simplistic that finding was. We know so much more about the brain now. I don't even remember clearly what I read or what was being investigated. But I have often wondered since then if they were on to something.
So interesting! I grew up in a small community in Saskatchewan, Canada where this group (2 x 2s) is large and strong. As you mentioned, no real name to the religion, but exactly as you describe it!
I went thru the abuse but I decided to left five years ago and resigned the Mormon church.. They are denied.. i knew that they are cult.. thanks for sharing.
Just to clarify a point about the workers, they can choose to be workers their whole lives but I have heard many don’t. I’m not a part of this group but personally know a former worker who left the work to date and then marry a man from the group.
Yeah leaving the work was looked at as failure. It was more of an "that's so sad they couldn't stay willing" event than an approved departure from a temporary position.
It is never a good idea or good advice to ask someone to stay calm, no matter how difficult a situation the person is in; to deny their emotions, for example grief,Anger, fear is condemning yourself to suffer even more.
I grew up in this ‘cult’, I left, was kicked out, when I was 18 years old. So about 28 years ago!! Molested by 2 members!! 1 an elder & other was brother in law!! Elder died years ago, BIL only got kicked last year!!🤦♀️🤦♀️🤷♀️🤷♀️ Workers knew about it & did nothing🤷♀️🤷♀️
Another great video. Would you elaborate on the FLDS/LDS meaning "receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit"? I'm a member of the Global Methodist denomination, and we interpret this as "speaking in tounges" as members of Apostolic/Pentecostal believe. Thank you.
I can see the similarities but the keep sweet, pray and obey is the polygamous Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, an offshoot of mainstream Mormonism. It’s leader is Warren S. Jeffs. It’s a different situation yet has its similarities.
My father was not allowed to be and Elder and was told he would never be one because he was divorced from my mom when I was very young. Even though he never remained or dated anyone ever again.
I think the control stems from making the women feel like a uniformed group not an individual. Allowing different hair styles allow self expression. It also uses up more of her time so that she has less time to herself.
I've heard Christian missionaries called "workers" before, but it's like a sort of code word, when they are in a country that's not welcoming to christian missionaries. Or they say "lifting" instead of praying. There's a lot of jargon. This is from a more mainstream church, not this 2x2 group. So maybe it's a more common phrase.
Oh my gosh that’s crazy! I was a part of IBLP and within that group there was something called umbrellas of authority. It was more localized basically so you know children are under the umbrella of the mother, mother‘s are under the umbrella of the father‘s, fathers are under the umbrella of the church leaders, etc. I have never heard anyone else. Use the umbrella terminology until today and I just thought that was crazy. Is it actually taught that way in the LDS church or is that just like a example you were given by a family member or something like that?
I was born and raised (4th gen) in 2x2s (left March 23). I’ve done a little digging into IBLP and listened to Tia Levings book so I’ve heard of the Umbrellas you’re referring to but we didn’t have that sort of spoken terminology in our group. I think the host was just using the word umbrella herself to describe it. Just wanted to clear that up 🫶🏼 IBLP is intense! So glad you got out.
@ thanks for the reply, that’s so interesting. And yeah, the two groups seem pretty similar to be honest. Im so glad to hear you got out too! I have so much respect for anyone leaving these high demand groups.
@ oh and Tia Levings is amazing, ive not read her book - I didn’t find out about it until after I left and by then I really didn’t want to be reminded of all those teachings - but I’ve seen her videos and she always does such a great job of breaking down the dangers of Christian fundamentalism and IBLP.
I watch a program called, "Polygamy What Love Is This?" Are you aware of it? The host is Doris Hanson was raised in a polygamy group and got out at age 18.
❤ Guys you are so beautiful ❤ and helpful for the whole world ❤ We are a hurting people who are hurt by people that speak the name of God from their evil lips but deceive and sin in secret and darkness, destroying innocent lives 😢 mocking the One True God 😮 and God will not be mocked and he'll bring punishment as justice for all the evil deeds committed by these perverse reprobates destined for hell and eternal hell fire 🔥 indeed we should weep 😢
Sam, your description of the Sunday morning family meeting at your home on Mormon Stories, especially when other families would join you, has many of the same aspects of the 2x2 Sunday morning meeting. We used (I’m out now, they still do) bread and grape juice instead of wine. I had commented before, but I can’t find it now, that you would likely find the podcast Trust Me interesting. One host is ex Mormon and one is ex 2x2. Two of the four founders of the ex 2x2 Facebook support group did a two part series. I linked them in my other comment that I don’t think is showing up. Kyle & Kari Part 1 from August 16, 2023 and Part 2 from August 23, 2023.
I was born into the 2x2's church - 3rd generation. I left in 2023 at age 65! ..after the Dean Bruer debacle, & subsequent revelations of how CSA & SA is handled.The victim is to forgive & be quiet😢 A victim or anyone who speaks out can get in trouble for telling.I feel duped by the leadership also for not admitting a man started the religion. Once the scales fell from my eyes - I couldn't unsee the similarities to other high-control groups / cults.
You did a great job, insightfully telling the basics. I had wondered when you would feature my former "faith."
I hope you will allow them to interview you. I would love to hear your story
Thank you so much for reacting to this, I was born & raised 4th generation in the 2x2’s and left the group when I was 18. I always knew the religion was secretive but I never realized it was a full blown cult until 2023, when one of the overseers, (dean bruer), was exposed as having been a perpetrator of sexual abuse himself, and all the lies and coverups dating back decades started to come out. I, myself, was groomed by cult elders and thankfully never was abused but was still subject to being around these inappropriate men while I was still a child, essentially I was responsible for keeping myself safe, even after I exposed the adults grooming me to my parent & local church leaders. When I say the FBI has their work cut out for them, I mean it will likely take the better part of a decade for them to sort out all the negligence, wrong doing, and falsifying of legal documents that this cult has been involved in.
Growing up, my family had Wednesday night meeting in our home, and my dad was the elder. The worker pairs who were in our area for 6 months at a time came and lived in our home and others members homes, for 2-3 days at a time. Plenty of these workers are being abused themselves, and plenty of them are the abusers -of other members, and other workers. As a child, I had no fewer than 10 known sexual abusers live in my home from time to time, not known to my family at the time, but found out in the last 2 years. The car they drive, the technology they use, the bank accounts they have access to -all belong to the wealthy members in the group.
The meetings are Sunday and Wednesday, and the elders are simply chosen based on convenience of the area for the mtg to be held in and if the workers deem you a respectable and upstanding member of the group. It has a lot to do with monetary contributions & just favoritism from the overseers & workers. Sam is absolutely correct when he says the women’s appearance is all about control. Some families, like my own, allowed school activities like choir and band & sports, so long as they didn’t interfere with mtg attendance.
Thank you so much for sharing this information with us! ❤️
Thank you so much for your kind and gentle way of discussing this church. I'm 4th generation born and raised and left at 48. The reason people don't speak up is because they literally believe that there is no other route to salvation. They are literally clinging to their salvation with a death grip!
Also, the workers knew. We have been absolutely shocked to see the willingness of some people to bury their head and pretend nothing is happening. It's also been shocking to her the workers blatantly lie to us.
Absolutely they knew. One of the workers maintained repeatedly on a news interview that he didn’t know about a specific perpetrator, and I was a teenager at the time and knew. There was no possible way he wouldn’t have, being a senior worker in a neighboring state. It has been one of the most devastatingly disappointing things I’ve delt with…Finding out that so many people that I was taught to trust with no hesitation either abused children I grew up with, or covered it up. Not to mention just finding out that so many people I know were abused by people we trusted and were taught were God’s one true people and our only way to heaven.
I would love to hear your full story
Mainstream LDS is no different- they just have lots of money and lawyers to cover up -- as members, we also have been conditioned to hold on to the church and leadership with a death grip. Thankfully I too saw the light
I’ve been waiting for you guys to cover this one! I was never part of this group, but my mom grew up in it and didn’t even know what church it was. She left when she turned 18. I went digging a few years ago and was shocked. When I was a kid my grandparents moved from where we lived. Years later I found out it was because of the church. My great grandmother was the first in the family to join. When I went on my search for information I found pictures of my family members at a yearly conference.
My grandparents house was the main meeting house in their area.
About the hair… my grandmother was 96 when she passed and had been out of the church since the 80’s. Her hair was past her waist my entire life and always styled just perfectly. When she turned 92 she called me and asked me to take her to my hair stylist. I will forever remember that day. She cut her hair short and was glowing! I’ll be forever grateful for sharing that moment with her because it meant much more than could ever be expressed.
That's sweet 😢
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Thank you for discussing the 2x2’s !! There is so much evil . My husband’s family is 2x2 and it makes me physically ill thinking about what he had to deal with growing up. I know there are good people in the 2x2’s (1000’s have left !) but there is so much destruction here
David Alink has a RUclips channel-he was raised in the 2x2 church and later his wife Merissa joined-they have since left. The name of his channel is David Alink. You could learn a lot from his channel, but I think he would talk with you as well. Thank you for talking about this group!
Watching this is utterly surreal. Watching an ex flds review of the church I was in. A decade ago it was the reverse for me. I watched in utter fascination of everything flds. How could these people be so blind? Now I understand the intrigue. I was watching myself.
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I grew up in this group and left about a year ago. Almost all of my family is still a part of it. Watching ex-Mormon content has been extremely helpful for me since there isn’t too much ex 2x2 content yet, and I’ve been a long-time watcher of your channel. Thank you for covering this! I’m not the most knowledgeable on church history, but I can speak to the structure and culture in the church!
Ex Mormon content isn’t a valid source of truth some people that have had their feelings hurt have valid feelings but there are some that just want to tear it down and are pretty vicious in their attack
@@tessieroberts8753you sound like yet another LDS defender, it's so painfully obvious when people come onto exmo content and start trying to tear down everyone who has shared their real stories of abuse and bring light to very serious issues
The truth hurts?@tessieroberts8753
I do hope that life is getting better for you.
Oh my deal akeisha…thank you for telling us about your situation and I’m wishing peace of mind for you and you’ve taken the biggest step already by leaving. 💕
I was born and raised in the 2x2's and left over 30 years ago. Thank you for discussing the hard topics.
I'm happy to help explain. It's all fresh. We just left last summer 2024. I grew up in this.
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This video has been shared on our main FB group for ex 2x2’s.
Thank you for covering this! My mom grew up in the 2x2’s and left in her early 20s, my grandparents are still in it and I have grown up going to some of their meetings and it is unlike any church I have been to
It appears that the stars have aligned for you two to cover my group! I have been watching your channel from the beginning and absolutely love you guys! I left the 2x2's a year and half ago, and it's definitely been the hardest thing I've ever had to do. Part of my family are still in and seem to be even more ingrained. Some actually refer to it as "The Truth", so it's crazy seeing this hot pink hoody with TRUTH printed on it! I became fascinated with Escaping Polygamy back in 2020 and started watching all the documentaries about the FLDS which led me to your channel. I began to see many parallels with how the women look and how the people are kept in due to fear. The language used is a bit different, but the meanings are pretty similar. Those of us who have left the church are considered "lost out" which means that we've lost our salvation and have no hope of eternal life unless we repent and come back to the meetings. Most of us are not shunned near as much as you "apostates", but there is still a huge separation that is felt. It's an extremely painful process, and choosing to leave can have pretty severe repercussions for some of us. Thanks so much for talking about this group. You have no idea how much this means to us that are aware of what is going on and want the truth to be known about these predators!
Yes that word apostate gets thrown around way too much. I had a conversation with my 17 year old daughter a month or so ( her dad is faithful LDS I am former LDS. She goes with her dad and has become fully converted to the church) in that discussion I asked her if she thought I was lost- she said “ not lost because there is still hope” when I told her there will never be a time I will come back to the LDS church she told me that “yes, you will lose the celestial kingdom but I will come and visit you”
I didn’t know whether to laugh or cry. I was so angry at the lies of this church and how they divide families. My daughter now fully embraces the idea that without the temple and obeying church leadership- you cannot be saved
Thankfully I know better- but it hurt that after everything I have shared with her- she has still been deceived and embraces a CULTure that will ultimately bring her sadness
❤️❤️ We're so sorry for the pain you've had to endure because of this group. We hope that by spreading awareness, we can all help each other through these hard times! Thank you for your comment. This means the world to us ❤️
I’m from this group and have lots of family still in. I left about 13 years ago. Happy to share my experience and what I know.
Y’all did a great job explaining this 2x2 church. I grew up in it and was 5th generation. I left at 38 years old and now am 52. Most of my family are still in.
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Thank you for the compassionate way you both handle the significance of these cults.
Thank you for taking the time to discuss this group. My father was an Elder in the 2 x 2s and also an ex-worker. Many Elders were Workers. Otherwise, Elders are picked for their homes and space for parking. Or, those willing to purchase/rent a large enough home to host meetings and provide parking for the "Friends" attending the meetings. Overseers will also consider putting meetings into apartments as long as there is enough parking. Typically, they prefer all family members to be professing but for sure the Elder and his wife must be professing to host meetings.
It honestly doesn't seem very sinister to me! Obviously some members might have felt limited and opressed, but many others probably got something out of their particupation. It is not like it was set up with a sinister purpose. Clearly the purpose was to live biblical lives --- but some of the elders were bad apples.
This was great coverage.
Hugs to anyone reading this who has been badly affected by this group.
So interesting that so many comments are from former members! Thanks for being here everyone- you are much needed!!!
Thank you for being dramatic free. I have been wondering about this cult but hadn’t been brave enough to delve into it.
I haven't finished this video yet, but there is a RUclipsr named David Alink who came out of this church. He shares his story and also travels around and interviews a lot of other people who also came out of it.
It bothers me that people are looking to find faults with Christian biblical groups and attack them until they fall apart. It is destructive - and is Mainstream society so much better?
All we learn hear is that this church has sexists and some abusers - just like mainstream society, possibly less.
I love your sweatshirt TRUTH OVER TRADITION
says so much.
Ohhhh so much of the 2x2 is tradition!!
Meetings are Sunday and Wednesday (not Monday). Many of the workers are definitely known to the people, some of them very well known (as in, have known them much of their lives, etc). Other times, if there were visiting workers, those workers would be complete unknowns. Born and raised; it's been a very eye-opening, wrenching couple of years. Crazy times. Many many similarities. Thanks for your perspective.
The worker worship is one of the biggest issues after the CSA
Yes.
Sunday morning ‘fellowship meeting’ in a home. A small local group decided by ‘the workers’
Gospel meeting were always on Sunday afternoon or evening, open to the public, and for the members of the whole field/geo-area
I grew up in the truth and my dad is an elder. I left in 2014. I think a large part of being an elder is based on how restrictive you are and if you live a more conservative lifestyle. I feel like elders and their families are held to a little bit of higher standard. Women are definitely held to a strict standard because we didn’t want to be “worldly” and ever put a man in a position to be tempted.
I second this. My dad was an elder for years. He came from a very high standard, extremely judgmental family. He had 3 siblings in the work & all his siblings still profess along with nearly most of his extended family as well. Having a child go into the work, Coming from lineage traced back to when the gospel was first brought to a certain area of first "converts" gives you "status".....Or just being in the Truth long enough & having your whole family profess, or just having money. Sad but true..money always speaks volumes. I am 4th Gen 2x2. I left when I was 19 in 2009.
Thank you so much for creating awareness and being willing to discuss the heavy topic of CSA and high control groups. Thank you so much for what you are doing and the time, effort and energy you put into it!
This is wild. I’m barely 3 mins in & I gotta say 3 things before I continue…
1. I love the compassion you guys have while still continuing on n with difficult topics. We should never stop talking about abuses… I heal loudly so other won’t suffer silently.
2. I have never heard of this cult… I have the feeling I’m about to be “ugh” 😮
3. Melissa - You know I love the sweater.. lol preach!
I admire your empathy and desire to support those that need it so much!
I was born and raised in this church me entire life until I left when I was in my 20's but most of my family is still involved in this church. So crazy to watch you guys talking about this. I personally know Andy Scholl from this documentary.
Sunday morning meetings are in Elders homes. Wednesday night meetings (Bible studies) are in other members home who the workers have selected to host the meeting. Elders should be selected based on proven character as described in the Bible however often it isn’t that way. Overseers are workers themselves that are also responsible for a region. Workers go 2x2 into an assigned field. A region has several fields. William Irvine from Ireland started the whole thing in 1897. I highly recommend the book “Preserving the Truth” by Cherie Kropp if you want the whole history. It is excellent. I was born and raised in it. Left in April 2024. Leaving was tied for the hardest thing I have ever done in my life. Thank you for your caring and pretty accurate report. God Bless you!
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Thank you so much! 🙏
Never heard of this group before! Absolutely wild stuff. Thanks for all you do!
Our family was friends with two by twos. My dad came from the same town, and knew them almost his whole life. I have tried to find info on their religion on RUclips. I found there was not much out there. What I found was out of Australia I believe. Thank you so much for covering this.
Check again now by searching 2x2. There are so many now!
Cult discussions. Telling the Truth. Advocates for the Truth. Exposing Truth. Many podcasts and interviews, etc.
I was born into the 2x2 church and just left in 2018 at the age of 34 so I’d be glad to answer questions for you!
Thank you so much! 😊
It's so sad to see there's this kind of abuse. What has happened to being good to eachother. This world is scary
I ask this too every day. Let us hold on and stay strong in common sense and healthy faith and hope.
@ggrace1133 true I live by the Golden rule. Be good to others so they will be good to you. You never know what someone's going through at home. I have been very blessed because I have met many good people in this life and I've needed those interactions. Not only do i have a full time job but I also have a disabled son who requires full time care. Just getting out of the house to go to the store can be hard if he's having a bad day. It can cause anxiety for me. It seems to be those days that I meet the kindest people.
What an interesting video! Comparing them with both LDS and FLDS beliefs made it easier to understand this group that I've never heard of before! Keep bringing these kinds of things into the light, we need less darkness in our world.
Oh man, when I saw you on Alyssa’s video I commented then and hoped maybe y’all would pick up on “us”. Growing up in this way, it’s crazy to see how similar we were but also my goodness, don’t dare say that to our “workers” (I made that mistake once). Thanks for covering this.
We were talking to some JWs who were shocked to learn about another "one true way" they didn't know about. :D
Thank you Melissa and Sam for being vulnerable out here, educating the general public, including people from different countries like myself, about the dangers and tragedy of having your freedom taken from you. I have learned a lot from both of you in the last year or year and a half of watching. I’m sure we can reach the 100k!❤
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Sending love to you both. You have big hearts & are doing great work. While watching it hit me that even though this is about high-demand religion/s, all types of coercion & abuse can be found in the most mainstream protestant churches: forcible touching etc, insidious behavior that flies under radar & is easily denied. It's hard enough to speak up in those cases so it must be much harder to speak up about & break out of the extreme indoctrination you're discussing here & have discussed in other episodes. You're helping so many people. Thanks & Happy New Year! 🙏
I honestly love you guys so much and all your content touches my heart in a unique way. I left my religious upbringing when i became a teenager and I'll admit to having a lot of religious anger and even being kind of judgmental towards religious people at times. The way you guys discuss your respective backgrounds, compassionatley share dialouge about high control groups, and work to spread information on these topics is really powerful. You both expand my world view so much through your content.
Thank you so much! ❤️
I enjoy y'alls take on many topics. I listen to every podcast with a sincere heart. Sam and Melissa thank you!
David Alink has a RUclips channel with a recent video with a lady that left LDS joined the 2x2’s then left the 2x2’s. You’d enjoy it immensely.
I started watching you guys when I was still attending church and found you through Amanda Rae. I left just over a year ago after finding out that major information was being withheld three months after it became public.
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Thank you both so much for your service 💜☮️
Much Love for you!
Super interesting listening to your description of 2x2 vs FLDS/LDS church. The subject of child sa is completely disgusting and horrific😡. I’m thrilled that this has come to light by the powers that be who can and are doing something about it.
I always hate to push the 👍button when the topic involves abuses etc. I know that it is showing good for you in stepping up to report these atrocities and not for the crimes being committed. It is just always so sad to learn of these things. Thank you to the two of you and your continued support and drawing attention to these crimes and directing people towards a way to find and receive help. May you be richly blessed in the New Year and may many people find the help they need thanks to your willingness to continue to shed light on the situations.
Thank you ❤️
I have a friend who grew up in this community ( in a small east coast canada town). He hasnt shared much about it with me but i know hes working through it all as best he can and is living a much happier life these days. Excited to learn with yall!
I grew up in this religion. Ive been out a long time but Two brothers & one sister still in it & other family
Sounds like our family too
What good hearts you both have those are tears of compassion
As someone who grew up, the elders are usually the owner of the home. The workers would ask them to hold the meeting. The workers are not necessarily at every meeting. The Sunday morning the congregation would each speak on what they had read that week (whatever was on their mind, or the area of the Bible they were reading). Wednesday nights, we are all reading and speaking on the same chapter.
They were investigated as a cult in the 70s (or something) and found not to be a cult. I think technically the government wouldn’t call them a cult but as someone now looking at it, they are on the edges and do many of the harmful actions.
Born and raised - 4th generation. I was born into worker family royalty under intense stress to offer for the work. Members would often encourage the youth in our family to become workers...but of course, this was an individual calling from God, not intimidation and programming. It was devastating to be pressured to offer for the work (to escape a lost eternity). I'm in permanant therapy unwinding the fact that those who were supposed to love me were pressuring me to kill off my bloodline through permanant celibacy. We were to be child sacrifices to bring pride and joy to our parents. Every bad day, every hard feeling you had was "God troubling you." So unless you could exist in constant toxic positivity, you were destined for the permanant celibate ministry.
Horrific abuse! I am so sorry. ❤️🩹
We're so sorry to hear what you've been through! ❤️❤️
The hoodie, Melissa! Bold and true statement.
Follow those who seek the truth! And RUN - as fast as you can - away from those, who've found it.
So true!!!
Love and light to you two in all you do to advocate for those in these situations. Go get a massage! Self care is important after these heavy subjects! ❤
I also grew up in this religion but have been out for almost 30 years. It’s very hard to have family still in and defending such horrific behavior! So enjoy watching you two with all your videos and thanks for covering this religion.
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Born and raised in this church. Reach out to David Alink for sure
Thank you for this. I was a part of the 2x2s for 13 years. So little known about outside their group. You are changing that. I don’t know your Christiology but you refer to them as Christian. They are not trinitarian. They believe Jesus was created and could lose his salvation. I confirmed this with the overseer here in Texas years ago. So given that in the strictest sense they are Christians by name only. They do not worship the same God as those who hold the trinity as being biblical. Love your stuff so far. I subscribed to do my part in getting you to 100,000!! Go git em!!
Break the silence. Break the cycle.
Abuse of children is everywhere. Come, Lord Jesus come.❤
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There are so many similarities to what has gone on in the Catholic Church as well. I know you both are speaking from your own experience, but having looked into several cults recently something like this also has happened in the church of Scientology (not that I believe it’s really a church), the Kingston clan, and many others. It breaks my heart every time I hear of another group that uses “religion” as a free ticket to commit these abuses on others that find themselves in their midst ether because they have been born into it, or because they are looking for a place to belong, or even because they actually believe the teachings. Believing the teachings does not give ANYONE a free pass to pry on others. Point blank, full stop.
Thank you both for helping to bring awareness to what is going on in these groups that are trying to stay secretive and hidden. I’ve watched your channel off and on for a couple years now and you have given fact, and shared your experiences without pushing what you believe and that is a hard balance to achieve. Much respect to you both.
You guys are doing an important job. I'm sure it must take a bit of a toll looking at the corruption and the Darkness in so many different groups that claim to profess love. Please always remember but although what you do is difficult it is also truly making a difference.
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Love you guys!! Thanks for covering this. ❤❤❤❤❤
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I just stopped organized religion. I found it hypocritical. 🥴
I watched a news special a while ago about this group. At the time I remember thinking it would be great if you guys could watch it and compare this group to the FLDS, since cults seem to have so many similarities, even though they are different. I'm excited to see you guys are looking into this group. I have not seen the hulu documentary. Maybe I should go check it out.
As a former Catholic I’d love to hear your thoughts on the documentary “the keepers” on Netflix
The nun was a good woman, RIP sister.
@@auntyfluffy100%! The sister was the only one who was really holy and lived by the teachings.
Ow good point. Keep everyone focused on all the fine details so they never have time to look up and see the big picture
An Elder is just a word the 2x2 church uses when a meeting is given to a home ..soy Sunday meeting home both the man and wife were called elders ..
None of the Elders in my meetings never had any say in our lives or actions ..they were just suppling a meeting in their home ..
The workers in the area are the ones who choose the homes for meeting ..
Both couples have to be professing and both baptized to have a meeting in their home ..
The name! "Elderer" ..is just that ..
A name they hold no power.per say
Hope this helps ..
I left 5 months ago but am still good friends with all the friends in my field
In Canada...we ALL talk about what's going on ..
What part of Canada are you in? Iam in Saskatchewan and have never heard of this group before this video
@@mienafriggstad3360It is definitely in Saskatchewan, along with abuse.
🙋♀️ Hi from Saskatchewan 🇨🇦 I have never heard of this group before.
Members will refer to the church as “The Way” or “The Truth” and there’s quite a few people in this church in Saskatchewan.
I’m not a member of the group but have family that are, and they have gone and stayed with members of this church in Saskatchewan.
Hi!!
Also from Saskatchewan… but an ex-member 😛
I've never heard of this cult? Thanks for your work on exposing these communities. I'm sure you are helping many people.
Sam, do your parents think that Warren committed crimes and deserves to be in jail?
Unfortunately, my parents don't believe that he did anything wrong and believe that he is falsely imprisoned.
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Meetings on Sunday and Wednesday- elders don’t really have any role besides having the mtg in their home- only the workers are “pastors”… but it was a special privilege to have mtg in their home
I was the 3rd generation born into the 2x2’s and left when I was 37. We were told that women having long hair was also a sign of submission and to allow it to grow as long as God wanted it. Mine was thick to my ankles! Try putting that up on your head! It also makes women unattractive to “outsiders” of the group.
I’m so glad you are out. My husband too grew up in it. The control, the secretiveness, the control and lack of information in the money - I am so glad that people are seeing the REAL truth amount the 2x2’s
I’m so glad you are out. My husband too grew up in it. The control, the secretiveness, the control and lack of information in the money - I am so glad that people are seeing the REAL truth amount the 2x2’s
I’m so glad you are out. My husband too grew up in it. The control, the secretiveness, the control and lack of information in the money - I am so glad that people are seeing the REAL truth amount the 2x2’s
Workers have MONEY . Don’t for a minute think that they do not.
It isn’t ‘young’ men generally that are the CSA perpetrators……. Also workers are revered and to be trusted and worshiped.
I really want to thank you both for the Trigger Warning 🙏 nothing worse than watching something and half way into it I have to shut off the show. I watch everything you put up and enjoy it all. Keep putting them out. Your doing great 👍 bless you both 🙏
This sounds very much like the church my grandmother belonged to many years ago. No name or church buildings - that was considered a false idol. No clergy, just elders. Meetings in people’s homes. Women couldn’t wear makeup or cut their hair. We’ve always called it “grandma’s church”. My father had no interest in being in the church, thank goodness! Group was Organized across the country, from 1960-67 we lived in NE, IL, CT, back to IL as my dad advanced his career. Every place we moved a church member would call on us within a few weeks of our arrival. They considered it the one true church. Very interesting video - thank you!
If abuse goes on and hidden, tells ya its a cult and NOT a "Christian" church. I live in southern utah. So many child sexual abuse in the Catholic church too. Thank you s9 much for the warning before hand.
Look at the people who support a leader with known offenses. It makes you wonder how easily people can follow terrible humans.
The PI said she could only trace this group back to Ireland around 1900.
PS i think seeing some more reaction videos to cults from you guys would be interesting
About your comment about hair and religion. I was a psych major. Decades ago, way back in the pre-internet world, I read that the parts of the brain that lit up while thinking about God and thinking about hair were right next to each other. There was speculation that this might be why religions have all sorts of rules about hair -- if neurons were so close together that they cross ignited each other.
I just googled and nothing comes up for me. I don't know how simplistic that finding was. We know so much more about the brain now. I don't even remember clearly what I read or what was being investigated. But I have often wondered since then if they were on to something.
Thank you❤🙏🏼
B&R 2x2 and lost my family too it. Thanks for covering this
So interesting! I grew up in a small community in Saskatchewan, Canada where this group (2 x 2s) is large and strong. As you mentioned, no real name to the religion, but exactly as you describe it!
@@ArleneLangley-h2r I have family there. SO many people.
I went thru the abuse but I decided to left five years ago and resigned the Mormon church.. They are denied.. i knew that they are cult.. thanks for sharing.
Wow.
Thanks for keeping us informed.
Can we get another Beast Games video? It was so fun to root for Sam!
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Just to clarify a point about the workers, they can choose to be workers their whole lives but I have heard many don’t. I’m not a part of this group but personally know a former worker who left the work to date and then marry a man from the group.
Yeah leaving the work was looked at as failure. It was more of an "that's so sad they couldn't stay willing" event than an approved departure from a temporary position.
Thank you
It is never a good idea or good advice to ask someone to stay calm, no matter how difficult a situation the person is in; to deny their emotions, for example grief,Anger, fear is condemning yourself to suffer even more.
Megan Elizabeth from the Don't trust me podcast is from this religion. She's hilarious and I am sure a great contact for you both!
I grew up in this ‘cult’, I left, was kicked out, when I was 18 years old. So about 28 years ago!! Molested by 2 members!! 1 an elder & other was brother in law!! Elder died years ago, BIL only got kicked last year!!🤦♀️🤦♀️🤷♀️🤷♀️
Workers knew about it & did nothing🤷♀️🤷♀️
Another great video. Would you elaborate on the FLDS/LDS meaning "receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit"? I'm a member of the Global Methodist denomination, and we interpret this as "speaking in tounges" as members of Apostolic/Pentecostal believe. Thank you.
I always heard it as keep sweet and obey..
I can see the similarities but the keep sweet, pray and obey is the polygamous Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, an offshoot of mainstream Mormonism. It’s leader is Warren S. Jeffs. It’s a different situation yet has its similarities.
That's interesting to know. I know that the FLDS used that specific phrasing. There's even an FLDS documentary with that as it's title.
The phrase was originally introduced as "keep sweet no matter what" and later became "keep sweet pray and obey"
My father was not allowed to be and Elder and was told he would never be one because he was divorced from my mom when I was very young. Even though he never remained or dated anyone ever again.
Wow, I am shocked that movement for missionaries is that quick. I would think investing in communities is more important.
The eldest of the pair tend to stay on one “field” for three yrs on average; the younger sent on to another field with a different elder worker.
I think the control stems from making the women feel like a uniformed group not an individual. Allowing different hair styles allow self expression. It also uses up more of her time so that she has less time to herself.
16:00 Sunday and Wednesday is correct 👍🏻
I've heard Christian missionaries called "workers" before, but it's like a sort of code word, when they are in a country that's not welcoming to christian missionaries. Or they say "lifting" instead of praying. There's a lot of jargon. This is from a more mainstream church, not this 2x2 group. So maybe it's a more common phrase.
Happy New Year!❤
Happy new year!!
Oh my gosh that’s crazy! I was a part of IBLP and within that group there was something called umbrellas of authority. It was more localized basically so you know children are under the umbrella of the mother, mother‘s are under the umbrella of the father‘s, fathers are under the umbrella of the church leaders, etc. I have never heard anyone else. Use the umbrella terminology until today and I just thought that was crazy. Is it actually taught that way in the LDS church or is that just like a example you were given by a family member or something like that?
I was born and raised (4th gen) in 2x2s (left March 23). I’ve done a little digging into IBLP and listened to Tia Levings book so I’ve heard of the Umbrellas you’re referring to but we didn’t have that sort of spoken terminology in our group. I think the host was just using the word umbrella herself to describe it. Just wanted to clear that up 🫶🏼
IBLP is intense! So glad you got out.
@ thanks for the reply, that’s so interesting. And yeah, the two groups seem pretty similar to be honest. Im so glad to hear you got out too! I have so much respect for anyone leaving these high demand groups.
@ oh and Tia Levings is amazing, ive not read her book - I didn’t find out about it until after I left and by then I really didn’t want to be reminded of all those teachings - but I’ve seen her videos and she always does such a great job of breaking down the dangers of Christian fundamentalism and IBLP.
Is there an organization like Holding out Hope for abuse victims of the 2 x 2 Group?
I watch a program called, "Polygamy What Love Is This?" Are you aware of it? The host is Doris Hanson was raised in a polygamy group and got out at age 18.
❤ Guys you are so beautiful ❤ and helpful for the whole world ❤ We are a hurting people who are hurt by people that speak the name of God from their evil lips but deceive and sin in secret and darkness, destroying innocent lives 😢 mocking the One True God 😮 and God will not be mocked and he'll bring punishment as justice for all the evil deeds committed by these perverse reprobates destined for hell and eternal hell fire 🔥 indeed we should weep 😢
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Sam, your description of the Sunday morning family meeting at your home on Mormon Stories, especially when other families would join you, has many of the same aspects of the 2x2 Sunday morning meeting. We used (I’m out now, they still do) bread and grape juice instead of wine.
I had commented before, but I can’t find it now, that you would likely find the podcast Trust Me interesting. One host is ex Mormon and one is ex 2x2. Two of the four founders of the ex 2x2 Facebook support group did a two part series. I linked them in my other comment that I don’t think is showing up. Kyle & Kari Part 1 from August 16, 2023 and Part 2 from August 23, 2023.
Thank you so much! We'll look into it 😊
Great public service.