🔴Attention 🔴 All the printed files can be downloaded here right now: www.printables.com/social/631255-rack-robotics-official/models CAD Files are included as STEP and Fusion360 Archive. All printed parts are creative commons public domain.
@@V1P3RSlab The printed files have been released, and are free to download and modify. We will be releasing the KiCAD files, GRBL files, and schematic when revisions are finished.
If that will be like the famous VORON project - this will be great, where all the parts can be obtained off the shelf in any country or from Aliexpress. I already collected for my Voron 2.4 part 2. Chinese manufacturers makes incredible help by making a prototype boards with all sensors combined, especially amazing is Bigtreetech product parts in quality, work and value.
@@alejandroperez5368 I don't think that's what Snek was talking about. More, adding sheet metal parts that have been made with precision would be nice to have in addition to standard 3D printing for people who have relatively cheap set up
If it would ship outside the U.S. I would absolutely back this. There sure is a market for consumer EDM. I hope this turns into a product sooner than later.
If I can offer a suggestion. To limit and control the current to the electrode I would recommend driving the PWM into an inductor. You can get extremely accurate currents without much in the way of heat losses. There is another incredible advantage to using an inductor that most people don't know about, the output voltage of the inductor will fly up when the current is interrupted such that pulse will generate a spark even if the gap widens.
That won't work as you need a sharp current pulse, and inductors drop in impedance as the core saturates. The best option is to use switch capacitors. You charge up a cap, open the charging Mosfet, and close the load mosfet dumping the charge into the work piece. You end up with a nice sharp pulse that doesn't overload the Mosfet.
I could not believe it when I checked the GitHub repository and I found the hardware schematics and layouts for the motherboard and the PCB resistor. The "EDM bottleneck" as you described it has been persistent for years, not due to the technological challenges in my opinion as much as it is due to the commercial appeal of this technology (again, just my opinion). So I am very grateful to see that you have taken the generous path of sharing your design and the results of your hard work. One crucial question at this point though is: "what are the licensing terms for this hardware?" I could see that the software is released under an attribution license, but what about the hardware. Can I start locally fabricating these machines, improve them, make a profit, and contribute back to the design? So fundamentally my question is: is this design source-available or open-source? I would encourage you to clear that up to set the tone and make it clear for contributors, what they are stepping into.
Unfortunately not available outside of the US right now but very excited to see this come to reality, I believe it’s critical for us small scale fabricators to have access to this technology. Congratulations on reaching your kickstarter goal and please keep Making these!
Might I suggest you add in a "port saver" for the Pico? The USB connection port physical connection on the pico is not that great, it's micro-USB (so people will plug it in wrong twice before plugging it in right), and recessed in there, people will forget it's just a pico and tend to jam the cable in with force. A panel-mount USB port (USB-C, even?) would save the physical stress on the pico's port. And, of course, I wanted to say that this whole thing is freakin' awesome!
Extremely cool. Designing your own PWB instead of using a power resistor for current limiting is a clever idea that I never would have thought of. I've been kicking around the idea of a DIY EDM machine for the better part of 2 years. It seems like a fun electrical project and, for the reasons you've described, is extremely appealing for a hobbyist who does not have the space for large conventional machines.
The power resistor PCB saved the project. Without it, the Powercore would have been much more expansive. We know that there are 100 improvements like this we can make for wire EDM machines. We do not think that a wire EDM machine should cost $100,000
I don’t know much about EDM- but i’d just like to say I’m proud and impressed at just how much a leap rev1 -> rev2 was for your pcb! especially since it was your first design. Printed power resistor was also a clever solution.
I applaud your efforts in bringing this to our open source community. I am about to back your kick starter just for that but can you please include some specs? what can you machine? how fast? how long do the electrodes last etc. You are showing sheet metal work which would be an interesting thing between plasma cutting and fiber lasers but to make it practical you need to go up to say 3mm thick tool steel. Please tell us what materials you experimented with
The specs for the Powercore are simple: 72 Volts, and it comes pre-programmed for 2 Khz with a 80% duty cycle. Those settings are optimized for cutting aluminum. We do not recommend using steel or titanium yet. Thin aluminum is recommended because it minimizes the required water flushing. With a wire mechanism, and good flushing, you should be able to machine much thicker aluminum. We have not tried this yet. However, Dominik Meffert has used a similar power supply design (60 volts, 2 Khz, 80% duty cycle) to do wire EDM. The fastest we have cut thin aluminum (0.5 mm) is 15 mm / min. We generally stick to 8 to 10 mm / min. Cuts succeed 50% to 80% of the time. We use a 1/16" brass electrode (1.5 mm). We have a gcode post processor to compensate for electrode wear by moving the electrode down as the cut progresses. With this method, you can cut a length of 800 mm of aluminum with 40 mm of brass rod. The first hobby 3D printers could only print PLA. Then people improved the machines over time. We expect the same development path with EDM. Aluminum is our equivalent to PLA.
@@markos3803 BaxEDM is real EDM, if you look at the sidewall surface finish at 1:58 this is a complete joke in comparison, but a bunch of suckers will undoubtedly throw a bunch of money at it and then be disappointed later - such is the fate of every scam-starter project
@@gorak9000 You sure are going in hard on something that is described as a "rudimentary EDM mill built from a 3D printer" It's designed for hobbyists to tinker with and make things at home. It's also open hardware so (in theory) once they run their campaign they are releasing the design into the public domain. I'm not saying it might not still be a scam, but it doesn't have the hallmarks of all the dumb sh*t people throw millions at on kickstarter all the time.
I did the exact same routine about 6 years ago with PCB design. From inception to working product in 8 months. What a brutal project that was, you can teach yourself a lot in a short time while in a time crunch
It was key to create formal timelines and feature lists. Our team sat down every day and listed out our tasks. That kept development on schedule. I originally tried to learn Fusion360 electronics CAD, but the file management system was unusable. KiCAD Was easy to setup and maintain by comparison.
@@TechnologistAtWork It was extremely slow with ECM material removal. The way to think about this is that instead of a complex curved path to get a small compliant mechanism, you can get a mostly straight line profile cut, and then pressed into shape in a shop vise with 3d printed dies.
Backed for 600. Good job Something like this was on my project list. But now I can be saved from that headache a support you and your developments! I really hope this goes the way of 3D printing. Can't wait to see what's in store 5 years down the road.
It's always just a matter of time before hobbyiest tackle and succeed at many techs normally only available only at industrial levels. Once somethign becomes open source a solid community developes to help improve on it. All things the big companies dread to see.
@@dev-debug Nailed it right on the head. We stopped by a commercial EDM facility today to talk with the owner. Their machines still use CD drives to store programs, and do not have touch screens. It was like going back in time to the year 2000.
@@MorlockEngineering My PC has a DVD/BR drive but I can't think of the last time I used it lol I'm getting up there, started programming in the 70s in 7th grade. If I recall my 1st CD burner drive cost me almost $300 and my first 20 MB MFM HD was about the same price. Anyway good luck with your project, curious to see how to works out. I have CNC mill and lathe but an EDM would be a nice addition to my shop. Maybe cut some reed valves for a pulse jet and avoid the slow etching process.
And im outside the US, so I'd rather not have to bother with sending what could just as well be a bomb though an agent and paying another 20% customs to get it into the EU...
What I wonder about is where the burned metal goes. Because that's alot of aluminium going somewhere. Is it in the water? is it vaporized? I don't want to breathe aluminium nor do I know what to do with water with disolved aluminium.
This is incredibly cool! I have a huge soft spot for making industrial processes affordable for DIYers, but the fact that this is feasible with EDM is incredible. 👍
This comment will probably get buried in the sea of other comments, but i noticed some minor mistakes in the PCB design. You may or may not take my advice, and thats up to you. I am electronic engineer and im currently working in BLDC controller designs. 1)Use mosfet driver. Its more reliable, you can achieve higher switchin speeds and higher reliability in such noisy system as EDM driver 2)If you are using 2 or more mosfets, make sure you have same track leinght to the connector pins that leads in and out of the PCB. Therefore you can achieve higher reliability of the pulse 3)If temperatures are your concern, use mosfets with lower RDSOn value, you can even save money on using some PQFN mosfets, and with couple of thermal VIAs you can achieve cooling trough the PCB itself and the ground pad. 4)You have square wave of couple of KHZ passing right under the resistors. This is not good, it can mess up the signal, i belive Phil's Lab channel have good stuff on this topic. 5)Are you sure about those tracks between C3 and R8? :D 6)What is that GND track from Q1? Slap some via's around, and ground everything on lower layer, dont run GND tracks around :) And, also, keep them same thickness Again, i may be mistaken, im literally just watching this video as anyone else, maybe you have everything under controll... so....yeah :) Good luck!
Great job guys! We've needed a revolution in low-force machining for decades. That's the best way to open up precision metal fabrication for the masses.
Pretty much all the questions I had as well. Also are they planning to sell full systems in the future and not just the Powersupply? Any price estimates for that yet? What about future expansion to ship outside of the US? Like you said SOFTWARE is a VERY big questionmark for me regarding this project. What will the pricing be like after the kickstarter? Are they using off the shelf electrodes or will buying from them be the only way to get replacement parts? And as a person who doesn't know much about EDM: What's the maximum possible thickness for the material? Which metals/alloys can/can't be cut with it? What's the speed?
The electrode erosion rate is 1:20 for brass-to-aluminum on our setup. We have a gcode post processor that moves the electrode downward as it travels during a cut. So we are continuously replenishing the electrode. I call this, "virtual wire" EDM. In 0.6 mm aluminum, 40 mm of brass rod will allow you to cut 800 mm of aluminum. It is not as good as using a wire mechanism, but our method costs basically nothing to build. The gcode is generated with Laser Web 4, using milling tool paths. Then we feed that gcode into the post processor. We are really excited to see someone 3D print a good wire EDM mechanism for the Ender 3. It would be a game changer. We have not tried tungsten-copper yet, but I hear it works well on many materials. Tolerances are mostly dependent on your setup, and kinematics. The size of the spark is 1.1 microns, so that is the upper limit for resolution. Surface roughness will change depending upon frequency, cutting speed, and rigidity of the electrode. The smallest electrode we have tried is 1/32" brass. It was too flexible to work well. That is why wire, under tension (8 - 10 Newtons), is used on industrial machines.
@@Esablaka The electrodes are off-the-shelf 1/16" brass. We recommend only using thin aluminum, unless you incorporate more powerful flushing into your machine.
Open source EDM accessible to domestic independent manufacturers, designers, and engineers is a fantastic idea. Nice job upping the production value on the videos too, the presentation of this was pretty professional while being really open and transparent about the process and I, as well as many others I'm sure, greatly appreciate that. Keep up the awesome work Morlock.
I was a wire edm operator for 5 years and a programmer for 3. What you’re doing is pretty dang awesome! It’s like a sinker edm and a wire edm had a baby and gave birth to that. I wonder how tight of a tolerance you can hold, can you control the spark gap? How do you figure out the speeds and feeds?
@@martincerny3294 the metal turns into fine fine dust/grit. It is advisable to use latex gloves and not to also not dump your waste water/ filters down the drain. It’ has to be disposed carefully. When I worked at my last shop, it was fine to dunk your hands in the water and touch the parts with your bare hands. But ideally you should wear gloves. Also, don’t drink the water.
@@cheeriomartinez Dust is fine, I was wondering about aluminium oxide creation for example but I'm not a chemist so it's just me being very cautious because this machine looks exactly like something I'd need :D
This project is so advanced the motherboard has travelled back in time from 22-12-24. Seriously though. What an impressive project. Now I just need to convince myself I have a need for one.
As a former machinist who has been taking a journey into 3D printing the last couple years, this is incredibly impressive, you just gained a subscriber. Can't wait to see even more and with 13 days left, I may just be able to convince my lady to let me join the KickStarter 😅
This is really impressive I’ve been wanting to build a wire/sinker edm for a while now. I just have two questions 1 could that power supply be used for a wire edm 2 is it possible to get a better edge finish with this power supply. Does the finish come down to the power supply or is it a result of machine rigidity?
We based our design off of some work done by Dominik Meffert. His wire EDM machine is on Hackaday. Our power supply design is similar. I do not see a reason why the Powercore would not work for wire EDM. We have not had a chance to try it out yet.
@@MorlockEngineering Using a machined Graphite sinker (maybe done on a cheap 3018 type machine, or something more like a Makerspace scale CNC Router) would be neat too! Does it have enough “ooomph” to do Die Sinker EDM?
Do you really need the resistor? You could use a capacitor and series inductance to limit the dI/dt, and then switch the mosfet to act like a software current limiter. You just traded a few hours of writing code in return for halving the size and price of your device. You'll also reduce your power supply requirements dramatically - as long as you're willing to cut slowly, you can now have a super small cheap power supply costing just a dollar or two. And even if you want to cut fast, you'll be able to use a cheaper supply because all the energy will be going into the workpiece not into a power resistor. Give me a shout if you want me to send over a circuit and code.
been subscribed to your channel for a while now and I wish you'd upload more frequently. Watching your content is like watching a mad scientist, I don't know if there's another channel doing more with less rn.
Why did you need the large power resistors or the PCB resistor? Is it to limit the current to the electrode? If so would a current controlled power supply be a better solution? You could maybe make one that is relatively high efficiency by using a buck or boost converter that has a constant current mode.
for a cheap DIY power resistor, I suggest what I call a "washboard", it's basically 2 threaded rods wrapped in kapton tape (or not depending on the resistance), between which you string nichrome wire, it's basically how cheap heater fans are made, and you also can simply use wire from a broken heater. manufacturing this at scale is probably more costly though than pcb+aluminium extrusion. another option you can use is air dry clay around the threaded rod as an insulator. you can also use mika as they do in heaters you can make a 120x120 grid and suspend it in front of a regular pc fan, and it will work really well. (I tested up to 2kw on 240V) heat elongation at higher power may be a problem, so you may want to mount the bars on springs if it droops too much. in a pinch you can also use regular steel wire. probably the easiest option would be to use a 2kw 240V heater and add 3 taps, connecting the 4 sections in parallel for a ~7 ohm resistor if 7.8 ohm is good, you could also use a regular 110V 1550W radiator with no modifications.
Oh wow, I was actually thinking about this sort of thing not too long ago. It would be an incredible gift to small scale fabricators if this takes off like 3D printing has!! Also, to assist with fundraising, you might want to look into taking orders for custom injection molds/small parts? That way various real world use cases can be tested for improvements, and reliability can be measured too.
Honestly, the price of 3D prints is really competitive. We have enormous design freedom. There is a lot less work and lead time associated with running our print farm, compared to contacting injection molders.
I've used an 10m long trace on a PCB as a power resistor, because I needed to keep the temperature of that device above 10°C. What I've found is that there can be pretty huge difference in the copper height deppending on the manufacturing process. Most boards were within +-10% range, but there were some with more than 20% difference from the nominal value.
Good point. For consistency's sake one could make the trace 10% longer than optimal then add multiple junctions, measure the resistance of them with a Kelvin probe so that you could wire each board appropriately.
@@ExtantFrodo2 Yeah, that is what I've done. There are three junctons that you can connect with solder and they make the whole thing shorter by -10 and -20%.
I thought about doing something similar some time ago. I know how to make boards, that's my actual job, but I didn't have the money to invest. What you did is very impressive, specially considering none of you had experience designing PCBs!
This is amazing... I am absolutely dumbfounded by the limits people are pushing in the at home manufacturing technology. If you would have told me 10 years ago the things we can do from home at the price point we are able to do it at.... I don't know if I would believe it.
smart machines > dumb machines Microcontrollers, sensors, and automatic calibration can compensate for almost anything on a machine tool. Vibration resonance tuning is an excellent example from the world of additive manufacturing.
Just some thoughts thought, While this is cool I think you may have gotten some of your information a little incorrect or not quite explained how it necessarily is Firstly when you talk about compliant mechanisms, While they can benefit from being EDM machined they are not necessarily an exclusively EDM manufactured part. Not really even close. Methods like conventional CNC and Laser cutting along with Sintered metal 3D printing are all methods being used to complaint mechanisms, Though I'm not familiar with designs at the microscopic scale I believe it's going to use a different method than EDM machining. That being said we also don't necessarily have a bottle neck on the EDM side for complaint mechanisms. A lot of work in the industry is moving towards Microscopic scale, or 3 dimensional objects like NASA's multi directional thruster which can't be made using an EDM machine either just from how the routing of tubes work. Next to address your statement on injection molds. Well In industry yes we Can and will sometimes use EDM to manufacture molds, but we certainly don't have to. In fact entire careers are built around getting those parts to final mirror polish but also designing the molds because there is a lot of engineering and precision involved with making them. EDM is also slow and can't take of nearly enough material as CNC can so for this application you would need to use a CNC machine anyways to start it off and then hire someone to do the EDM work to get it to a mirror polish. There is of course the alternative of making a separate copper electrode to machine the part without needing CNC machines to make the cavity, but someone still needs to make that custom electrode to EDM into the stock material. There's a lot of work involved with making injection molds at an industrial level so it's not really a bottle neck of EDM machines that make things expensive. It's the labour behind all of that work that makes EDM machined parts so expensive. Overall I commend your efforts and love that you're bringing an EDM machine to the hobby market but they way you're presenting these problems really isn't the full story and a little misleading to those who might not know as much about the industry. If you really want to fix this so called "EDM" bottle neck which I would personally disagree we even have you would need to focus making machines with incredibly high level of precision far more affordable and cost efficient than what's currently available while still maintaining the same high degree of compatibility with industrial software and industry flexibility.
that is SOOOO freaking bad ass!!!! i work in a machine shop and have a row of 5 edm's in the shop, this is so freaking cool how small yyou shrunk it down too! if i had one of these and brought it to my shop and showeed the edm guys i guaruntee they would get a massive kick out of it and love it. i bet if i showed my boss/owner of machine shop he would be interested in buying! we have tons of jobs that are perfectly sized for this edm
How do you deal with erosion/deformation of the electrode? Why is the resistor necessary? Can't you control discharge time and current through more sophisticated means? Do you have (or want) a proper electronics guy who can help?
This is the most amazing thing I've seen all week -well done guys and good luck with the Kickstarter! +Please consider shipping to Europe (inc. London, we are still in Europe just... ;o)
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! I was considering doing this and knowing you accomplished it makes me more confident moving forward in my project! I'll be sure to review all of your public information on your project before moving forward. Thank you again!
It prevents instantaneous increases in current, which can damage the power supply. In 5 years there will probably be smarter solutions on the market. But right now this works and is really cheap to manufacture in bulk.
I never ordered anything from Kickstarter, but this had me intrigued. Only to find out it's US only. Such a bummer. Do you have the BOM and PCB designs available for purchase or download?
Whoa. This is awesome. Video is packed with information and clever, inexpensive solutions! You're definitely onto something great here. Mahalo for sharing! : )
I know almost nothing about electronics but i enjoyed your adventure and was captivated by your enthusiasm and commitment. I did industrial design many years ago and it's fascinating to see how accessible these sophisticated manufacturing processes have become.
Absolutely amazing that these types of devices can be made by a small team instead of large corporations. twofold that by enabling small fabricators the ability to make metal parts in house. great job with this.
fascinating! would this be able to drill into larger blocks? i only see sheet metal being worked here, and i dont expect any sort of 3d application work, but can this do long holes through solid pieces?
How do you do spark gap control? Is there feedback for the 3d printer to control the distance? What do you do if the electrode contacts the work piece?
We do not yet have any custom firmware for closed loop control. Right now we just avoid shorts by machining slowly (12 mm / min). Any sort of closed loop control would be a game changer, especially with Klipper firmware.
I'm not familiar with the circuit of an EDM. Can someone tell me what the purpose of the huge power resistor? It seems so much energy is wasted as heat, is it necessary?
A good source for cheap pure water in bulk is reef aquarium shops. All day every day they are making their own reverse osmosis distilled (RO/DI) water and selling it in 5 gallon reusable jugs.
I wonder, if it would be possible to use an off the shelf hair dryer as the power resistor. I'm sadly not from the US, so I can not participate in the kickstarter and I'm also broke, but I wish you the best luck with your project!
People under estimate the importance of price. "Price" just means resources. Making something with less resources is good for everyone. In five years, we want to see an affordable EDM machine in every fab shop and laboratory. The world will be a more interesting place is everyone can make hardened steel or aluminum parts same-day.
🔴Attention 🔴
All the printed files can be downloaded here right now:
www.printables.com/social/631255-rack-robotics-official/models
CAD Files are included as STEP and Fusion360 Archive. All printed parts are creative commons public domain.
Is there a way to get the machine shipped to México?
Are PCB files available so the bill of materials or the ender firmware / gcode software somewhere on the net? What do you mean for "open source"?
What is the location of the PCB design files? Do you have a GitHub page somewhere?
@@V1P3RSlab The printed files have been released, and are free to download and modify.
We will be releasing the KiCAD files, GRBL files, and schematic when revisions are finished.
If that will be like the famous VORON project - this will be great, where all the parts can be obtained off the shelf in any country or from Aliexpress. I already collected for my Voron 2.4 part 2. Chinese manufacturers makes incredible help by making a prototype boards with all sensors combined, especially amazing is Bigtreetech product parts in quality, work and value.
I went into this video 100% convinced that you made an Electronic Dance Music machine
Same here, and now I have a new RUclips rabbit hole to explore.
Same here 🥲 But the engineering content is so intriguing nonetheless
It wont be long before we have an AI that makes EDM on request 😁
SHOFAR IS THE VOICE OF GOD !!
SING HIS SONG ... REJOICE !!
MARANATHA !!
~ Jesu M Christo, KMK
*Electronic
I feel like having precision metal parts that you can make at home will be a great addition to 3D printing
Correction: sheet metal parts *
This is not 3D metal parts.
@@alejandroperez5368
I don't think that's what Snek was talking about.
More, adding sheet metal parts that have been made with precision would be nice to have in addition to standard 3D printing for people who have relatively cheap set up
@@alejandroperez5368 You can cut kinda thick stuff with an EDM if you got the power to do so.
@@vincentli9106 or time lllloooootttttssss of time
@@alejandroperez5368 he never said "3D metal parts". sheet metal parts are metal parts.
Came for Electronic Dance Music, stayed for the Metal 🤘
best comment! -
I'm still waiting for the bass to drop
If it would ship outside the U.S. I would absolutely back this.
There sure is a market for consumer EDM.
I hope this turns into a product sooner than later.
Ditto.
Me too !
Since he's not shipping to EU, he simply creates demand for Chinese clones of this, which will ship.
Open Source Hardware in many of the pcb's. Where can I download the gerbers and schemas in EU, I NEED THIS.
+1
If I can offer a suggestion. To limit and control the current to the electrode I would recommend driving the PWM into an inductor. You can get extremely accurate currents without much in the way of heat losses. There is another incredible advantage to using an inductor that most people don't know about, the output voltage of the inductor will fly up when the current is interrupted such that pulse will generate a spark even if the gap widens.
That won't work as you need a sharp current pulse, and inductors drop in impedance as the core saturates. The best option is to use switch capacitors. You charge up a cap, open the charging Mosfet, and close the load mosfet dumping the charge into the work piece. You end up with a nice sharp pulse that doesn't overload the Mosfet.
I could not believe it when I checked the GitHub repository and I found the hardware schematics and layouts for the motherboard and the PCB resistor. The "EDM bottleneck" as you described it has been persistent for years, not due to the technological challenges in my opinion as much as it is due to the commercial appeal of this technology (again, just my opinion). So I am very grateful to see that you have taken the generous path of sharing your design and the results of your hard work. One crucial question at this point though is: "what are the licensing terms for this hardware?" I could see that the software is released under an attribution license, but what about the hardware. Can I start locally fabricating these machines, improve them, make a profit, and contribute back to the design? So fundamentally my question is: is this design source-available or open-source? I would encourage you to clear that up to set the tone and make it clear for contributors, what they are stepping into.
Have you been able to get an answer to your question yet? I'm also curious
Unfortunately not available outside of the US right now but very excited to see this come to reality, I believe it’s critical for us small scale fabricators to have access to this technology. Congratulations on reaching your kickstarter goal and please keep
Making these!
Disappointing to hear.
Thank you. We have been working on this 12/6 for half a year!
Pity that its US only.
Is it possible using colisexpat ?
I can watch it in
Australia.
Might I suggest you add in a "port saver" for the Pico? The USB connection port physical connection on the pico is not that great, it's micro-USB (so people will plug it in wrong twice before plugging it in right), and recessed in there, people will forget it's just a pico and tend to jam the cable in with force. A panel-mount USB port (USB-C, even?) would save the physical stress on the pico's port.
And, of course, I wanted to say that this whole thing is freakin' awesome!
Extremely cool. Designing your own PWB instead of using a power resistor for current limiting is a clever idea that I never would have thought of.
I've been kicking around the idea of a DIY EDM machine for the better part of 2 years. It seems like a fun electrical project and, for the reasons you've described, is extremely appealing for a hobbyist who does not have the space for large conventional machines.
The power resistor PCB saved the project. Without it, the Powercore would have been much more expansive. We know that there are 100 improvements like this we can make for wire EDM machines. We do not think that a wire EDM machine should cost $100,000
and here i am wanting to try the ECM conversion when he drops this
too bad i dont live in the usa for shipping
I don’t know much about EDM- but i’d just like to say I’m proud and impressed at just how much a leap rev1 -> rev2 was for your pcb! especially since it was your first design. Printed power resistor was also a clever solution.
I applaud your efforts in bringing this to our open source community. I am about to back your kick starter just for that but can you please include some specs? what can you machine? how fast? how long do the electrodes last etc. You are showing sheet metal work which would be an interesting thing between plasma cutting and fiber lasers but to make it practical you need to go up to say 3mm thick tool steel. Please tell us what materials you experimented with
The specs for the Powercore are simple: 72 Volts, and it comes pre-programmed for 2 Khz with a 80% duty cycle. Those settings are optimized for cutting aluminum. We do not recommend using steel or titanium yet. Thin aluminum is recommended because it minimizes the required water flushing. With a wire mechanism, and good flushing, you should be able to machine much thicker aluminum. We have not tried this yet. However, Dominik Meffert has used a similar power supply design (60 volts, 2 Khz, 80% duty cycle) to do wire EDM.
The fastest we have cut thin aluminum (0.5 mm) is 15 mm / min. We generally stick to 8 to 10 mm / min. Cuts succeed 50% to 80% of the time. We use a 1/16" brass electrode (1.5 mm). We have a gcode post processor to compensate for electrode wear by moving the electrode down as the cut progresses. With this method, you can cut a length of 800 mm of aluminum with 40 mm of brass rod.
The first hobby 3D printers could only print PLA. Then people improved the machines over time. We expect the same development path with EDM. Aluminum is our equivalent to PLA.
@@MorlockEngineering you are familiar with BaxEDM right? the only problem is that he did not open source the power supply though
@@nerdworld8211 what's 14000?
@@markos3803 BaxEDM is real EDM, if you look at the sidewall surface finish at 1:58 this is a complete joke in comparison, but a bunch of suckers will undoubtedly throw a bunch of money at it and then be disappointed later - such is the fate of every scam-starter project
@@gorak9000 You sure are going in hard on something that is described as a "rudimentary EDM mill built from a 3D printer" It's designed for hobbyists to tinker with and make things at home. It's also open hardware so (in theory) once they run their campaign they are releasing the design into the public domain. I'm not saying it might not still be a scam, but it doesn't have the hallmarks of all the dumb sh*t people throw millions at on kickstarter all the time.
I did the exact same routine about 6 years ago with PCB design. From inception to working product in 8 months. What a brutal project that was, you can teach yourself a lot in a short time while in a time crunch
It was key to create formal timelines and feature lists. Our team sat down every day and listed out our tasks. That kept development on schedule. I originally tried to learn Fusion360 electronics CAD, but the file management system was unusable. KiCAD Was easy to setup and maintain by comparison.
Hogging out that much metal in 30 minutes is impressive.
It is many thousands of times faster than electrochemistry.
They're just tiny thin pieces of metal though.
@@TechnologistAtWork It was extremely slow with ECM material removal.
The way to think about this is that instead of a complex curved path to get a small compliant mechanism, you can get a mostly straight line profile cut, and then pressed into shape in a shop vise with 3d printed dies.
@@TechnologistAtWork even with real industrial edm machines its slow.
@@TechnologistAtWork sounds like you went in with overly high expectations.
Very unique approach. Have kicked around the idea of an EDM for a few years for some smaller projects. Will be watching this and see where it goes.
Backed for 600. Good job
Something like this was on my project list. But now I can be saved from that headache a support you and your developments! I really hope this goes the way of 3D printing. Can't wait to see what's in store 5 years down the road.
It's always just a matter of time before hobbyiest tackle and succeed at many techs normally only available only at industrial levels. Once somethign becomes open source a solid community developes to help improve on it. All things the big companies dread to see.
@@dev-debug Nailed it right on the head. We stopped by a commercial EDM facility today to talk with the owner. Their machines still use CD drives to store programs, and do not have touch screens. It was like going back in time to the year 2000.
@@MorlockEngineering My PC has a DVD/BR drive but I can't think of the last time I used it lol
I'm getting up there, started programming in the 70s in 7th grade. If I recall my 1st CD burner drive cost me almost $300 and my first 20 MB MFM HD was about the same price.
Anyway good luck with your project, curious to see how to works out. I have CNC mill and lathe but an EDM would be a nice addition to my shop. Maybe cut some reed valves for a pulse jet and avoid the slow etching process.
@@dev-debug Similar here. Started programming on paper tape and a timesharing service in the 60s. The tech available to hobbyists now is amazing.
If my financial situation were different this would have been the first Kickstarter I ever backed. Amazing work.
likewise,. the best is yet to come, fortitude and perseverance, we hope for beter times for all
Same here hopefully I have some money soon! Opens up a whole new world of manufacturing possiblities
Same, once i have the money to get one (*and more bedrooms to convert into workrooms lol*) I’m DEFINITELY backing this.
And im outside the US, so I'd rather not have to bother with sending what could just as well be a bomb though an agent and paying another 20% customs to get it into the EU...
@@unpaidintern6652 Open source though so you could probably self source from the BOM and whatnot though. Albeit that is harder than a kit.
This is impressive. And I'm pretty sure I don't even know enough about EDM to know how impresive this actually is.
It is the Makerbot cupcake of EDM. It works, but is far less capable than a $250,000 EDM.
What I wonder about is where the burned metal goes. Because that's alot of aluminium going somewhere. Is it in the water? is it vaporized? I don't want to breathe aluminium nor do I know what to do with water with disolved aluminium.
@@martincerny3294 It condenses into the water as a uniform powder.
Amazing. Consider shipping to Europe, I'd love to purchase one of these for my own workshop! Wish you all the success with your project! Super cool.
hint: parcel redirection services
This is a gorgeous build! The possibilities are literally endless.
This is incredibly cool! I have a huge soft spot for making industrial processes affordable for DIYers, but the fact that this is feasible with EDM is incredible. 👍
This is amazing!! I can't get over how impressed I am by you and your team's work on this. Congrats on reaching your Kickstart goal!
Crazy interesting. Thanks for looking into this, doing this work and sharing it.
As a machinist and Tool maker and lover of all things making stuff, this excites me far more than the 3D printer ever did ❤
and yet, this stuff was made possible by commercial 3D printing
This comment will probably get buried in the sea of other comments, but i noticed some minor mistakes in the PCB design. You may or may not take my advice, and thats up to you. I am electronic engineer and im currently working in BLDC controller designs.
1)Use mosfet driver. Its more reliable, you can achieve higher switchin speeds and higher reliability in such noisy system as EDM driver
2)If you are using 2 or more mosfets, make sure you have same track leinght to the connector pins that leads in and out of the PCB. Therefore you can achieve higher reliability of the pulse
3)If temperatures are your concern, use mosfets with lower RDSOn value, you can even save money on using some PQFN mosfets, and with couple of thermal VIAs you can achieve cooling trough the PCB itself and the ground pad.
4)You have square wave of couple of KHZ passing right under the resistors. This is not good, it can mess up the signal, i belive Phil's Lab channel have good stuff on this topic.
5)Are you sure about those tracks between C3 and R8? :D
6)What is that GND track from Q1? Slap some via's around, and ground everything on lower layer, dont run GND tracks around :) And, also, keep them same thickness
Again, i may be mistaken, im literally just watching this video as anyone else, maybe you have everything under controll... so....yeah :)
Good luck!
length matching is really no big deal at 2Khz
This is impressive. Very well done. Looking forward to seeing this progress
Fantastic attention to detail
Your work is both functional and also aesthetically very pleasing.
Something I aspire to be better at myself.
Most of the aesthetic detail was done by my co-founder Zurad, from Zurad Engineering on RUclips. The project as a two man effort.
Great job guys! We've needed a revolution in low-force machining for decades. That's the best way to open up precision metal fabrication for the masses.
Always wanted to build one! I have MANY questions, though. Electrode errosion rate? Longer-lasting electrode material alternatives W, Mb? Tolerances, surface roughness? Smallest usable electrode (which lasts at least minutes)? Electrode erosion compensation? Bottom surface milling? Electrode errosion compensation? Software?
Pretty much all the questions I had as well.
Also are they planning to sell full systems in the future and not just the Powersupply? Any price estimates for that yet?
What about future expansion to ship outside of the US?
Like you said SOFTWARE is a VERY big questionmark for me regarding this project.
What will the pricing be like after the kickstarter?
Are they using off the shelf electrodes or will buying from them be the only way to get replacement parts?
And as a person who doesn't know much about EDM:
What's the maximum possible thickness for the material?
Which metals/alloys can/can't be cut with it?
What's the speed?
The electrode erosion rate is 1:20 for brass-to-aluminum on our setup. We have a gcode post processor that moves the electrode downward as it travels during a cut. So we are continuously replenishing the electrode. I call this, "virtual wire" EDM. In 0.6 mm aluminum, 40 mm of brass rod will allow you to cut 800 mm of aluminum. It is not as good as using a wire mechanism, but our method costs basically nothing to build.
The gcode is generated with Laser Web 4, using milling tool paths. Then we feed that gcode into the post processor.
We are really excited to see someone 3D print a good wire EDM mechanism for the Ender 3. It would be a game changer.
We have not tried tungsten-copper yet, but I hear it works well on many materials. Tolerances are mostly dependent on your setup, and kinematics. The size of the spark is 1.1 microns, so that is the upper limit for resolution. Surface roughness will change depending upon frequency, cutting speed, and rigidity of the electrode. The smallest electrode we have tried is 1/32" brass. It was too flexible to work well. That is why wire, under tension (8 - 10 Newtons), is used on industrial machines.
@@Esablaka The electrodes are off-the-shelf 1/16" brass. We recommend only using thin aluminum, unless you incorporate more powerful flushing into your machine.
Open source EDM accessible to domestic independent manufacturers, designers, and engineers is a fantastic idea. Nice job upping the production value on the videos too, the presentation of this was pretty professional while being really open and transparent about the process and I, as well as many others I'm sure, greatly appreciate that. Keep up the awesome work Morlock.
Thank you so much for developing this. The world really needs it.
Amazing. Stoked to see the use of common parts(printer frame). Congratulations on all your hard work paying off!
I was a wire edm operator for 5 years and a programmer for 3. What you’re doing is pretty dang awesome! It’s like a sinker edm and a wire edm had a baby and gave birth to that. I wonder how tight of a tolerance you can hold, can you control the spark gap? How do you figure out the speeds and feeds?
Do you know what happends with the burned metal? Is this thing safe?
@@martincerny3294 the metal turns into fine fine dust/grit. It is advisable to use latex gloves and not to also not dump your waste water/ filters down the drain. It’ has to be disposed carefully. When I worked at my last shop, it was fine to dunk your hands in the water and touch the parts with your bare hands. But ideally you should wear gloves. Also, don’t drink the water.
@@cheeriomartinez Dust is fine, I was wondering about aluminium oxide creation for example but I'm not a chemist so it's just me being very cautious because this machine looks exactly like something I'd need :D
This project is so advanced the motherboard has travelled back in time from 22-12-24. Seriously though. What an impressive project. Now I just need to convince myself I have a need for one.
As a former machinist who has been taking a journey into 3D printing the last couple years, this is incredibly impressive, you just gained a subscriber. Can't wait to see even more and with 13 days left, I may just be able to convince my lady to let me join the KickStarter 😅
I love how the video is peoples introduction to engineering and design. It makes me so happy:)
This is great! Maybe send some machines to the big 3d printing/crafting RUclipsrs to try out, for more reach
I truly respect the knowledge and effort that went into this project. Thanks for the really cool video!
This is really impressive I’ve been wanting to build a wire/sinker edm for a while now.
I just have two questions
1 could that power supply be used for a wire edm
2 is it possible to get a better edge finish with this power supply.
Does the finish come down to the power supply or is it a result of machine rigidity?
One more question How bad is the inference created by this power supply?
We based our design off of some work done by Dominik Meffert. His wire EDM machine is on Hackaday. Our power supply design is similar. I do not see a reason why the Powercore would not work for wire EDM. We have not had a chance to try it out yet.
@@MorlockEngineering Using a machined Graphite sinker (maybe done on a cheap 3018 type machine, or something more like a Makerspace scale CNC Router) would be neat too!
Does it have enough “ooomph” to do Die Sinker EDM?
Great idea and execution, yet another leap towards truly democratizing manufacturing! Kudos
Do you really need the resistor?
You could use a capacitor and series inductance to limit the dI/dt, and then switch the mosfet to act like a software current limiter. You just traded a few hours of writing code in return for halving the size and price of your device.
You'll also reduce your power supply requirements dramatically - as long as you're willing to cut slowly, you can now have a super small cheap power supply costing just a dollar or two. And even if you want to cut fast, you'll be able to use a cheaper supply because all the energy will be going into the workpiece not into a power resistor.
Give me a shout if you want me to send over a circuit and code.
hello. I'm trying to make a similar machine. I like this idea but I don't know how to implement it. Could you help me with that?
Simply incredible. Been following you for a bit, glad it worked out. I will be purchasing one when I set up my workshop.
Impressive amount of determination clearly met with incredible results!
Well done
Thank you Josh
been subscribed to your channel for a while now and I wish you'd upload more frequently. Watching your content is like watching a mad scientist, I don't know if there's another channel doing more with less rn.
Why did you need the large power resistors or the PCB resistor? Is it to limit the current to the electrode? If so would a current controlled power supply be a better solution? You could maybe make one that is relatively high efficiency by using a buck or boost converter that has a constant current mode.
You are spot on
This the most badass Ender Mod i’ve ever seen.
That is extremely impressive, if it shipped outside of the US I would 100% buy it, would there be a possibility of making the plans for sale?
EDM is awesome, I have been waiting for a video like that for a long time.
You've got something really great going here. It's good stuff. You'll be a multimillionaire sooner or later, this development is what people dream of.
for a cheap DIY power resistor, I suggest what I call a "washboard", it's basically 2 threaded rods wrapped in kapton tape (or not depending on the resistance), between which you string nichrome wire, it's basically how cheap heater fans are made, and you also can simply use wire from a broken heater.
manufacturing this at scale is probably more costly though than pcb+aluminium extrusion.
another option you can use is air dry clay around the threaded rod as an insulator. you can also use mika as they do in heaters
you can make a 120x120 grid and suspend it in front of a regular pc fan, and it will work really well. (I tested up to 2kw on 240V) heat elongation at higher power may be a problem, so you may want to mount the bars on springs if it droops too much.
in a pinch you can also use regular steel wire.
probably the easiest option would be to use a 2kw 240V heater and add 3 taps, connecting the 4 sections in parallel for a ~7 ohm resistor
if 7.8 ohm is good, you could also use a regular 110V 1550W radiator with no modifications.
I came for the EDM banger, still this managed to entertain me even better!
This one is more like Heavy Metal ..
Being as the Kickstarter is already sold out, I'll be looking forward to any future production runs or versions
Oh wow, I was actually thinking about this sort of thing not too long ago.
It would be an incredible gift to small scale fabricators if this takes off like 3D printing has!!
Also, to assist with fundraising, you might want to look into taking orders for custom injection molds/small parts?
That way various real world use cases can be tested for improvements, and reliability can be measured too.
Honestly, the price of 3D prints is really competitive. We have enormous design freedom. There is a lot less work and lead time associated with running our print farm, compared to contacting injection molders.
@@MorlockEngineering i think OP meant that it would be a good demonstration, similar to your stamping and compliant mechanism demos
I've used an 10m long trace on a PCB as a power resistor, because I needed to keep the temperature of that device above 10°C. What I've found is that there can be pretty huge difference in the copper height deppending on the manufacturing process. Most boards were within +-10% range, but there were some with more than 20% difference from the nominal value.
Good point. For consistency's sake one could make the trace 10% longer than optimal then add multiple junctions, measure the resistance of them with a Kelvin probe so that you could wire each board appropriately.
@@ExtantFrodo2 Yeah, that is what I've done. There are three junctons that you can connect with solder and they make the whole thing shorter by -10 and -20%.
I thought about doing something similar some time ago. I know how to make boards, that's my actual job, but I didn't have the money to invest. What you did is very impressive, specially considering none of you had experience designing PCBs!
I felt like there was something familiar when I started watching the video. I realized you're channeling Applied Science. I subscribed.
This is amazing... I am absolutely dumbfounded by the limits people are pushing in the at home manufacturing technology. If you would have told me 10 years ago the things we can do from home at the price point we are able to do it at.... I don't know if I would believe it.
smart machines > dumb machines
Microcontrollers, sensors, and automatic calibration can compensate for almost anything on a machine tool. Vibration resonance tuning is an excellent example from the world of additive manufacturing.
Open Source EDM! Open Source Hardware! Open Source LibreOffice Calc number crunchin' You're my new favorite channel :) Awesome stuff! Keep It Up!!
Just some thoughts thought, While this is cool I think you may have gotten some of your information a little incorrect or not quite explained how it necessarily is
Firstly when you talk about compliant mechanisms, While they can benefit from being EDM machined they are not necessarily an exclusively EDM manufactured part. Not really even close. Methods like conventional CNC and Laser cutting along with Sintered metal 3D printing are all methods being used to complaint mechanisms, Though I'm not familiar with designs at the microscopic scale I believe it's going to use a different method than EDM machining.
That being said we also don't necessarily have a bottle neck on the EDM side for complaint mechanisms. A lot of work in the industry is moving towards Microscopic scale, or 3 dimensional objects like NASA's multi directional thruster which can't be made using an EDM machine either just from how the routing of tubes work.
Next to address your statement on injection molds. Well In industry yes we Can and will sometimes use EDM to manufacture molds, but we certainly don't have to. In fact entire careers are built around getting those parts to final mirror polish but also designing the molds because there is a lot of engineering and precision involved with making them. EDM is also slow and can't take of nearly enough material as CNC can so for this application you would need to use a CNC machine anyways to start it off and then hire someone to do the EDM work to get it to a mirror polish. There is of course the alternative of making a separate copper electrode to machine the part without needing CNC machines to make the cavity, but someone still needs to make that custom electrode to EDM into the stock material.
There's a lot of work involved with making injection molds at an industrial level so it's not really a bottle neck of EDM machines that make things expensive. It's the labour behind all of that work that makes EDM machined parts so expensive.
Overall I commend your efforts and love that you're bringing an EDM machine to the hobby market but they way you're presenting these problems really isn't the full story and a little misleading to those who might not know as much about the industry. If you really want to fix this so called "EDM" bottle neck which I would personally disagree we even have you would need to focus making machines with incredibly high level of precision far more affordable and cost efficient than what's currently available while still maintaining the same high degree of compatibility with industrial software and industry flexibility.
Amazing work ! I signed up for notifications on the next release.
Thank you for the informative video
Thank you!
I don't think I've ever gone from watching a video to spending over $500 so fast. Actually, paused at 58 secs to go to your kickstarter.
Never do that - always do research first on stuff like this. I don't doubt this is a genuine project but a little prudence goes a long way
A lot of that electronics went over my head but it is amazing that you have created this. I can`t wait until a few generations forward. Amazing .
A great first step. But we need more info on its limitations.
that is SOOOO freaking bad ass!!!! i work in a machine shop and have a row of 5 edm's in the shop, this is so freaking cool how small yyou shrunk it down too! if i had one of these and brought it to my shop and showeed the edm guys i guaruntee they would get a massive kick out of it and love it. i bet if i showed my boss/owner of machine shop he would be interested in buying! we have tons of jobs that are perfectly sized for this edm
You are going to love what comes next.
Side note - an incandecent or halogen lightbulb is a high wattage, cheap power resistor
How do you deal with erosion/deformation of the electrode?
Why is the resistor necessary? Can't you control discharge time and current through more sophisticated means? Do you have (or want) a proper electronics guy who can help?
This is really impressive, thanks for moving things along!
This is the most amazing thing I've seen all week -well done guys and good luck with the Kickstarter! +Please consider shipping to Europe (inc. London, we are still in Europe just... ;o)
Absolutely brilliant work!
Love the thinking behind the inspired design of the power resistor.
Can't wait for this to be available in Aus!
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! I was considering doing this and knowing you accomplished it makes me more confident moving forward in my project! I'll be sure to review all of your public information on your project before moving forward. Thank you again!
Hell yea, Seen this on printables and i was skeptical because there was no video but here we are lol
What does the resistors do? Current limit? I am pretty sure that can be done in another way with ready IC:s.
It prevents instantaneous increases in current, which can damage the power supply. In 5 years there will probably be smarter solutions on the market. But right now this works and is really cheap to manufacture in bulk.
Seriously, GREAT JOB !
How did you get the water inlet to be the same flow as the outlet so yhe tank doesn't run dry or overflow?
I never ordered anything from Kickstarter, but this had me intrigued. Only to find out it's US only. Such a bummer. Do you have the BOM and PCB designs available for purchase or download?
Whoa. This is awesome. Video is packed with information and clever, inexpensive solutions! You're definitely onto something great here. Mahalo for sharing! : )
This is awesome! Apologies if you mentioned this in the video: What's the maximum part thickness possible?
Very impressive, but no information on the thickness or type of metal limitations. .6mm aluminum (used in the video) is VERY thin (.024").
This is some incredible stuff. I learned so many things watching your video I have no count. Thank you once again for sharing.
This is freaking awesome! Thank you for sharing. 😁
Thank you!
I know almost nothing about electronics but i enjoyed your adventure and was captivated by your enthusiasm and commitment. I did industrial design many years ago and it's fascinating to see how accessible these sophisticated manufacturing processes have become.
I've wanted to mess around with EDM for a while now. I look forward to seeing more of your progress.
5:43 what are "html soldering instructions"? or HTML bomb?
Glad I stumbled on your channel. Thank you.
Hmm, very nice. I have been wanting to learn how EDM works. What max thickness this will it cut and at what kind of tolerance?
Well Played...!!! Excellent implementation concept..!!! There is deff a place for this.
The nice bit is that the motherboard is so spacious, allowing for easy repairs and troubleshooting!
This is the most incredible mod I've ever seen. Like, this is huge. My mind is exploding right now.
Absolutely amazing that these types of devices can be made by a small team instead of large corporations. twofold that by enabling small fabricators the ability to make metal parts in house. great job with this.
fascinating! would this be able to drill into larger blocks? i only see sheet metal being worked here, and i dont expect any sort of 3d application work, but can this do long holes through solid pieces?
Fantastic stuff!
this is incredible. I can't wait to see where this takes hobby machining.
What is the thickest metal you can cut with this?
Wonderful job. Wish you more publicity because it need it.
Very interested to see the progress, don't need one, but it is really cool.
How do you do spark gap control? Is there feedback for the 3d printer to control the distance?
What do you do if the electrode contacts the work piece?
We do not yet have any custom firmware for closed loop control. Right now we just avoid shorts by machining slowly (12 mm / min). Any sort of closed loop control would be a game changer, especially with Klipper firmware.
I'm not familiar with the circuit of an EDM. Can someone tell me what the purpose of the huge power resistor? It seems so much energy is wasted as heat, is it necessary?
A good source for cheap pure water in bulk is reef aquarium shops. All day every day they are making their own reverse osmosis distilled (RO/DI) water and selling it in 5 gallon reusable jugs.
Holy crap, you're actually doing it. I will 100% make one of these for my shop, even if its just for burning out taps.
I wonder, if it would be possible to use an off the shelf hair dryer as the power resistor. I'm sadly not from the US, so I can not participate in the kickstarter and I'm also broke, but I wish you the best luck with your project!
This is something the 3dp/reprap/fabbing community NEEDS. Thank-you for pushing the space forward. Price is in some ways, the most important part.
People under estimate the importance of price. "Price" just means resources. Making something with less resources is good for everyone. In five years, we want to see an affordable EDM machine in every fab shop and laboratory. The world will be a more interesting place is everyone can make hardened steel or aluminum parts same-day.