Are Systrays Pointless (I Went Years Without Using Them)
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
- Most desktop environments and window managers have a system tray (systray) where certain applications choose to minimize to...but are systrays necessary? Should devs stop designing their apps to sit in the systray?
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your OBS argument only holds if the user has multiple monitors/desktops.
if i record on my single monitor, i do not want the OBS window showing in the recording, but i surely want to know that it is recording...
I use the OBS systray icon incredibly frequently, I start recording using a hotkey and it gives me a visual indicator that I'm recording, also it can be disabled if you find it annoying. General -> System Tray -> Uncheck Enable
Don't tell me you still use Xorg a bit, do you? Am I correct in believing that OBS doesn't work in Wayland yet?
@@terrydaktyllus1320 he does use xorg but afaik obs works alright on Wayland now
@@terrydaktyllus1320OBS works on Wayland since almost a year I think
@@terrydaktyllus1320 It's worked in Wayland for 2+ years
@@terrydaktyllus1320 Of course OBS Studio works great with Wayland, I use Fedora 38 wwith Wayland and it works as well as under Xorg.
One reason I hated Gnome because it didn't have systray. Like I want to know with a glance if Dropbox is backed up. Systray should be there because regular users and developers expect it.
Also, if an application is running in the background, then I want to know that by seeing it in the systray and be able to shut it off. Without systray things will still run in the background, you just won't be able to access them.
I think it's needed for Chat and Email applications. And any system monitoring applications. That's about it.
It should be for at a glance info, like the instrument cluster in your car. If a system tray icon is static all of the time then it serves no purpose being there.
It does if you can interact with it.
They have one good purpose. Apps like Discord, or email that can sit there all the time and only notify you when you have new messages/activity.
Without Systray, How do you interact with apps that dont have a window like Redshift, nm-applet, Udiskie... ??
Well, I personally never run udiskie 24/7.
I only run it when I need to, and in that case I just pop open a CLI & type "udiskie" and use it, do what I need, unplug, kill udiskie & the CLI.
I can see a case for the OBS icon: to let you know that the program is still recording even if the window were to be minimized. Personally the one icon I do like to have there is the kill window icon. But I agree that in general, it's not meant as a holder for shortcuts. Linux is about having options, so I'm happy so long as I can choose on or off for myself.
Why i still use the systray, even on vanilla Gnome installation. Remmina applet give me a drop-down menu for quick accessing remote desktops. And Skype and Teams are showing their current status on the tray as well. And those are the 3 apps i use for work.
What made you chose the LTS kernel over the standard one? I always wondered.
How would nextcloud work without a systray?
I literally have like 5 messengers sitting in my system tray to see when there are new messages. I have popup notifications disabled because they are way too distracting, I don't want to forget what I've been doing every time a new message pops up. I just look at the system tray every now and then to check if somebody messaged me, even instant messages can wait for 5-15 minutes until I'm comfortable answering them. I've been living like that for a long time now and can't even imagine how people can focus with all these messages popping up on their screen.
It actually really depends what you’re working with, I feel. When using a floating wm its incredibly useful to be able to minimize things and not have them clutter up your taskbar. But I’m a tiling wm I don’t do that, and as a result I don’t use a system tray. Then again half the time I don’t even use a bar at all because it’s a waste of space so maybe I’m not the best person to ask.
Many of the systray icons have quick menus for a lot of their functionalities. For example all the major game launchers like Steam and BattleNet. I use them all the time. It is very easy and fast to right click the icon and click on the game I want to play. I do not need to open the full application and wait for it load then find the game.
A good use of the Systrays Icon is the quick menu to stetting, quit or other options, without crowding the task bar. The Steam systray icon is a good example, it let me choose to open a game from the last 5 games opened without the need to really open steam. Now no all apps need a systray.
Many proprietary software uses a systray, just to let you know if you license is up. Others are just to be reopen.
The OBS systemtray and in that extend the recording and rendering software are more useful only for knowing the state of your render with only a mouse move while you do other stuff.
GNOME 44 have systemtray by the default, but they are not yet there. It only shows certain programs and it's only for closing background apps.
The "Background Apps" menu in GNOME 44 is NOT a systray. It was never meant to fulfill that role, but just to show the apps that are running in the background and to be able to close them.
@@lucas7061 is not a systemtray that shows apps that use systemtrays got it
@@lucas7061 And only flatpak ones.
If I’m not mistaken, you have emacs server running in the background, and are fine with emacs “not closing” when you close it.
Also, your bar is essentially a systray.
There are plenty of things to rail about, this seems of little consequence.
Apps, ESPECIALLY chat apps, shouldn't have a systray icon by default. Default settings matter, and most people have their systems flooded with icons and nagging notifications, distracting them.
Funny that you mention Discord, Spotify and Slack though as these are 100% usable in your browser, and that stops the apps from snooping on your system. I have fewer windows open, less ram usage, and things are more conveniently grouped with webapps. Btw, the only limitation of browser Discord is push-to-talk.
I want to know how to configure the qtile keybinding desktop widget ?
you back on ubuntu? what do you think of ubuntu and the slow snaps?
The app going to systray is way different to "secretly running in the background". It is on a visible place, it is not getting screen space when I'm not using it, I get notifications and most of the icons show some useful "app state information", like If I got a notification while I wasn't on my computer or if I ignored it at the time because I was concentrating in something else, the icon will show that there is some update that I should check later.
I prefer the systray instead of system info like, kernel version, keyboard layout, cpu and ram utilization (if those two get too high, it probably is from something that I'm running at the moment, I don't remember the last time I got any high usage without being my fault hehe)
I think for me, the systray is good for reminding me if an app is running in the background, but yes, a lot of it is pointless. Besides, not everyone remembers what's open, and some apps don't completely shut down when the window is closed. They stay accessible because they're doing something in the background and go to the systray for quick access.
I have seen some systray icons that are pointless. But I find it to be more of an exception than the rule.
I find clipboard managers in the system tray particularly useful because of the quick access to multiple copied items. I don't always want to go into a menu to open the app. Sometimes it's faster to have the systray icon, just click, and select the copied item and paste.
My solution is a hidden trayer that I can bring up with a keybind. Means that it's there when I need it and only when I need it, otherwise it's totally invisible.
I removed the whole bar from my QTile setup, not just the systray. All useful info that people usually put on the bar (like clock or audio volume) I put into conky, and I open conky from a keyboard shortcut. This way I bring that info only when I need.
OBS makes sense for single monitor recording where the OBS window will either be minimized or covered by the window/desktop being recorded. Sometimes things happen such as hitting the wrong shortcut combination and an indicator isn't such a bad thing.
However I completely agree about software that instead of closing when you press the close button they hide in the systray instead. This should never be the default behavior as it is misleading. If anything they should either add a button for this function or use the minimize button as that would make more sense at least. When you use the minimize button you are aware that said program is still running.
GNOME solves this by having a "recording" icon in the top left color, but it is a generic screencapture indicator, as it should be. It ain't an application icon like in the systray, because it makes no sense.
Couldn't live without systray and wouldn't want to.
I just want to be able to control whether the program goes to the systray I don't have or not. As long as there's a setting for it, I don't care, because that means that the application has been designed in a way where you don't need it, but can use it if you prefer to work that way. At this point basically any desktop is designed in such a way where the systray is basically just the dock/taskbar/panel you already have, just with smaller icons. Goes for Windows, Mac OS, GNOME, KDE and probably more DE's (but I don't remember how they look). Even if you want to argue that the icons in the dock/taskbar/panel are too big, you can resize them.
Right now, in my Windows systray, I have Signal (Which is pointless, because it's on my taskbar), Slack (Which is pointless, because it's on my taskbar), Wireguard (which is semi-useful, only because the network thing doesn't show its status), Steam (pointless, taskbar), NVidia Control Panel (just open the control panel from the launcher/start menu?), Logitech G Hub (It's a G that sits in the corner and does nothing). They don't need to be in the tray to run in the background. They can just close the window and stay running, so when you run it from the start menu or launcher, it'll open the already running one (as most things do when in the tray).
Apart from Wireguard, none of them serve any purpose. If being able to move active programs to a fold out menu is something you want, then you should just be able to move them off the taskbar yourself, instead of delegating that responsibility to the application, similar to what you can do with GNOME and KDE's very customizable panels.
Quick actions in context menus have also been a feature in Windows since Windows 7 (or was it Vista?) with jump lists, I honestly don't remember if any Linux DE's have them and I think I've seen them on Mac, but don't own one, and applications are free to change their task bar icon to indicate status changes. So really, what's the difference between a task bar item and a system tray item, apart from the ability to pin programs that aren't running on the taskbar?
Hey dt, you're a one stop shop. Consider an environment of a medium sized media company. There might be several people simultaneously working on the same project. It might be useful to have a bird's-eye view of things.
On the whole, adding something to the sys tray should be a setting that can be on our off.
System tray items should have some menu of common items for that app. If not, it is kind of useless.
without knowing where to find it it just took me around 20 seconds and 4 clicks to disable the OBS system tray....
In the case of discord the systray tells you that it is still running. Discord and similar applications doesn’t actually close unless set so, some of them don’t eve have that settings
OBS Icon is incredibly useful for those of us who don't have more than one monitor, or choose not to use our alternate monitors all the time.
At last, he was able to jebait me to comment.
Choice is good, design is personal preference.
Also I wanted to write an essay about people who do not use tiling wms but something like kde, with a lot of shortcuts on toolbar and a lot of opened windows, which sit on toolbar and how systray helps to save space by opening up possibility to not hoard toolbar and desktop, while adding fast access to frequently used features without spawning main window OR spawning main window by clicking on it, but i won't be doing this (oops).
Should they be toggle-able? Choice is good.
Should they not exist? No choice is bad.
Should they be enabled by default in apps? It's dev choice, choice is good.
Also Linux is about freedom I heard.
> Also Linux is about freedom I heard.
People say this a lot but they don't mean it, you either use their preferred Distro and DE or if not, there is something wrong with you. I like GNOME because i am a minimalist, and somehow using that DE is a sin to them, even though they dont even use 80% of KDEs settings. And I see it those things clutter that i cant remove (Im a bit of a clean freak too). XFCE is fine tho, because of its modularity. In GNOME? something is missing, find some extension and then add it, simple.
@@xsael8501 who are "they", why "their" opinion should matter what you prefer and overall what is your comment about? Do not think I am rude, maybe it's just language barrier (not a native speaker here) and I do not understand what this all is all about :D
@@gor. i was just venting myself, just nevermind it. Good day
@@xsael8501 u2 o7
7:29 @DT: Discord tries to pull authentication information from your browser session, so your Desktop client will be logged in without you having to do anything additional.
I remembered my days on Windows, my system tray was full of icons. I've only used about three of them.
Modern systems have these quick launchers. They could display various information, and there is instant access to any application. Therefore, the system tray is not really needed.
I use the window manager i3. I still need the system tray to use the music player and Clipboard Manager. And I find out when updates arrive.
i was using wayfire for a while when it didnt have a sys tray plugin and it drove me nuts. network status, volume icon and bluetooth is usually all i need. now wayfire has a sys tray plugin so all is good now
Disagree with almost all your points, DT. I'm actually surprised you're so against the systray, considering you are a window manager user. As a WM user myself, I don't want workspaces cluttered with things like a music player, Steam, a chat app, OBS, etc. I could make some of those things a scratchpad, but a simple systray icon makes far more sense in the case of something like a music player.
Also, just looking at your panel, you basically have system tray icons there. Why have a volume icon when you can just bind it to a key with a notification? Why have a keyboard layout icon? Are you typing in a different language (Emacs Lisp doesn't count)?
Finally, your take on OBS is so bad... Imagine you didn't have that visual indicator and thought you were recording. Woops! Time to redo the video!
System tray icons are not ment to replace the regular quick launch icons you have in the panels. If a app have a systray icon it suggests that the app is running in the background and it was not completely closed(quit) when you clicked window close button. The problem is gnome decided to not support it cause it make very little sense in a mobile shell(gnome shell if you will notice is in the back targeting to become a mobile shell which works also on desktop). For the apps like discord who you probably want to stay open and keep running in the background so you receive notification of new chats, cannot be replaced with a regular panel icon cause in that case the app will be closed(quit) and clicking the app icon will launch a new instance of application.
"I don' t like systrays, therefore they are a bad design."
A good compromise that could be toggled in a control panel setting is throwing a dialog so that the user has control over what happens to these apps. Minimize wouldn't throw a dialog but closing the window would throw a heads up with two options ... Exit / Minimize to Systray. With a check box ... Remember my decision for this app. Then in the settings control panel for Systray the behavior of these apps on exit can be modified centrally.
system tray icons such as cloud syncs or messaging apps should always be hidden away in a sub menu, otherwise they just clutter up the panel with static icons that provide no useful info
A system tray let's me know an application is still running. Yes, I *should* know an application is still running if I choose to launch it on my system, but what if it freezes? What if I want to close it without opening a system monitor to show me background tasks? What if I want to open an application window by clicking the icon in a system tray instead of having to search for the application in a run launcher or UI menu? What if I am coming from Windows or MacOS, two desktop operating systems that have system trays, and therefore I would like to have one in my Linux distribution? I mean you yourself said people using your WM configurations wanted a system tray. Maybe there was a fair reason they wanted that, and maybe for a majority of users, a system tray isn't confusing.
DT, you can configure and use your system however you want. If you think system trays are confusing due to your workflow, then by all means continue to not use one. But I can't help and think you're out of touch with how most people use a desktop operating system, whether it's Linux or something else.
I love direct access in Systrays when needed, i.e. alerts, warnings, popups so apps can run, I can forget about them until something needs my attention
I am old enough to remember when MS windows first added the system tray. "Tray, tray bien, Bill," I thought at the time. It seems to me that system tray clutter in 2023 could be addressed with additional UI innovation -- i.e. adding a way to stack trays like in a cafeteria line.
System trays aren't my favorite part of a desktop environment or a window manager, but I still find some use cases where they matter, like email. I've tried living without one, and just ran into instances where I had to search for a setting to disable the tray. If there isn't an option, it becomes a matter of me killing it from the command line. I don't want to have to run a separate command after closing a window to kill the program. It's just a concession for convenience, I put the network status and audio volume in my status bar with i3 without needing the tray, because I personally prefer their command-line equivalents. It sees very little use in my day-to-day workflow, but doesn't upset me and quite frankly shouldn't affect *you* so much.
As for this video, I dunno man, halfway through it sounds like your usual boilerplate filler when you have absolutely nothing to talk about. This was maybe something worth discussing in a thread and through text in a singular post, not a video. Maybe stick to actually teaching since you have the vocal cadence for it?
gnome leans heavy on the notification system approach. Quite a bold assumption that people want to go this route. When I focus on a particular task as the notifications are mostly irrelevant but disruptive right then and there. I find an indicator icon more subtle. Some apps simply need to stay open (example: some VPN vendors), their windows pollute the task switcher - and you can't always replace them.
I go through my workflow and have the UI to help me with that, it shouldn't be the other way around like the UI changing what my workflow is. People install extensions to change DE behavior, this puts some design choices into questioning.
I agree, some apps use sys tray and become so annoying. It drives me potty😱
Still furious at Gnome for removing the system tray. I still use old Windows programs via Wine and certain Linux ones that just plain don't close unless you exit it via the tray but in Gnome they just keep running. Yeah, they're annoying, but should really be a toggle to enable it. Doesn't do me any good if it's the "Gnome workflow" when old apps still require it. It just makes it a PITA to use Gnome. Yes, it would be ideal if apps didn't freaking close to the tray, but everyone still does it and it's not going to change old apps.
I genuinely think that last part you made note of is the core of this entire thing. Systray, completely agree.
Take Adobe for example. If I open Adobe for work, or let's say I just START my computer, there are so many services and things that start even if I go into the config to stop it. They burrow into your RegEx to start and if you edit that they don't work. Just it is such a shady practice of gathering data. Which is going to be super charged now with AI integrated into your systems... Can you imagine an Adobe AI just running in the background on your system 24/7 for uh, security reasons...
Companies that do this should be heavily fined for every single day, escalating till these intrusive applications actually close.
OS be damned, that should not be allowed.
I dont even have a working systray, and certainly don't have any need for it
My bar shows only time and workspace
I don't even understand the purpose of showing application title in a bar, I know which program I have open
In my tmux I also show active vpn but thats it
Any program I wish to run on command, I trigger a rofi menu. Even Firefox tabs using the awesome TabFS which lets me "mount" my browser as a filesystem so I can do thing like grep for tabs and navigate using rofi/dmenu
I use dwm so I dont have a systray. I haven't missed them. The only time I need to see the systray is to close bad applications that secretly run in the background but I have now stopped using such applications.
I use dwm so I dont have a systray.? one neednt follow the other. u can haz systray in dwm.
Pointless? I dunno, I'm basically lazy so I like a visual notification of something rather than having to use keybindings or the mouse. While I agree that most of the icons are not required, I don't find it that big of a deal because of the minimal space the systray takes up. Much more minimal when compared to the rather large amount of space your desktop is taking up to show the time and your keybindings. I prefer my desktop to be unencumbered by anything other than the half inch at the bottom with my quick launch icons & systray.
I do like systrays, also the ones for chat and obs. But some of the suff could be hidden in a folder like it is on windows. I am really sad that the linux community is not after it in popular statusbar applications like xmobar or polybar. The support for systrays is really awful there and therefore awful on most tiling window managers. KDE and Gnome did a really good job to integrate the systray into its bars, I hope better bars are comming soon. In my opinion it's not the problem of applications using the systray, its the problem of poor bars not giving you the option to display or customize them well enough.
i dont know, i like my sys tray, but again i am GenX and born in 1968 could be why i like it. grew up with them from windows 1.0 and on, now ia m linux only since 2014, but i sure like linux mint sys tray.
I certainly agree that not everything needs to be in the systray however it should be very much stressed that developers put an option in the preference settings. I 100% use systray for some apps like VPN that doesn't have an icon when active unless you open the app. I do not want to be without a VPN pretty much ever. And some notifications for messaging, etc, are fine. But agree that using the notification mechanism is preferred. I need to implement the feature that stores the recent notifications for review that a previous DistroTube video covered.
ruclips.net/video/ulunAkEW9XU/видео.htmlsi=t25OHzMYLrWsF079
Just remove them?
It amazes me that he isn't a literal neckbeard. He doesn't seem to really use linux for work as hes constantly bringing up stuff like this. Someone that actually gets work done has no time to do this kind of tomfoolery. If anything they might try to contact the tools' team to report a bug or request a feature.
Not get triggered over a traybar icon as they might actually find the tray icon useful.
Case in point: literally any comment in this video.
No system tray, no installation of the DE or System. It's that simple.
I would stop using gnome if i could not use the extension readd it again.
An email client, or a chat or something that always runs should be in systray otherwise it's very badly designed.
love it or hate it you cant disregard how clean ubuntu ships gnome
I don't care if you want to use systrays or not, at least always provide an easy way (GUI !!!) to enable/disable features.
That the Linux community still has to infight about such simple things tells a lot about them... A big reason why Linux desktop will never reach the masses.
...Maybe going years without using them is... the reason you don't understand why they're useful?
I'd like the choice to have them.
Systrays are not necessary, but can sometimes come in useful depending on your use case.
I dont use a systray. My debian minimal install+i3 is nice, clean and usable! Thanks for ur true words! Greets from Germany.
I do believe that system trays are very useful for people who can't be bothered to properly configure and manage their systems. It's just a quick little utility. People just need to be able to disable it quickly.
I use systray for quick launch all the time. I strongly disagree with your opinion, DT :)
I’ll be blunt. I unsubscribed not because I'm not interested in many of your topics, but because of your attitude/personality and a tendency that emerges over time to want to impose your point of view.
I hope it's not to get clicks?
I personally don't use a systray However, I think systray is a "comfortable" place for new users, that don't know much about Linux. And it helps to adapt.
i like the system tray. I hate the gnome desktop. It is illogical for a pc. If you instapp crap then you will have crap in the systray.
For you might be pointless, for many others it isn't.
Ahh... so that's what it is... I was vaguely aware that the area next to the clock in Windows 95 and later was called the sys tray, but I associated it mostly with the volume indicator and all those useless bloatware apps that like to clutter up that space. But when I was experimenting with Qtile I found a systray widget (which I think was part of the default config if I remembered correctly) but since there was already separate widgets for stuff like volume and battery status etc. I assumed it must have some different meaning; and system-anything sounds important, so I just left it there. But theres never anything in it, so I assumed it might be some notification thing and I simply hadn't gotten any notifications yet.
But now that I know it's just the completely useless parts of the Windows systray, I can just remove it from my config I guess.
On my work MacBook the systray is pretty much useless too, except for some of the default system ones and the accessibility one (which more or less mirrors the quick settings) and the clock and the keyboard layout indicator (so that I quickly can see why everything is weird when I have accidentally changed from my custom Norwegian layout to US layout).
Of the third party stuff there it's only really two I actually use: a timer widget to log time on whatver project I'm working on; and the second one is pretty useless but it's the only place I can access the settings for the third party "somewhat tiling window manager" extension I have. Plus when it disappears I know the app has crashed or failed to restart after a reboot.
All the other icons are crapware that the IT department have installed that is completely useless besides reminding me that I'm wasting CPU on some mandatory apps I don't need and cannot uninstall.
Having a list of indicators of running background apps, could in theory be useful, but the systray is not. Since it's entirely voluntary if the apps or daemons put something there anyway, so if I really want to se what's really running I would have to use top or some other system monitor anyway. And even if every daemon were listed, it should not be visible all the time, it would be sufficient to have a widget showing the number of background processes (if you're paranoid and want to constantly monitor that..) and a way to se the full list when needed.
Or maybe I should keep the empty systray widget, so if something ever appears there I know that's some crappy software I should replace with a less clingy one. 😆
developers don't stop using systray launchers please. I usong them every days. Every person is different.
Don't worry, they're not going anywhere on Windows and MacOS, GNOME missing one just makes it buggy to the user
@@BrodieRobertson I using LinuxMint with Cinnamon and primary BirdTray ...
This is a really stupid gripe. The gripe is stupid not the people with the attitude they are not needed. The GRIPE is why Linux doesn't get much traction with normies. Having the gripe about this stuff is what gives the Linux users an elitist perception. Don't get me wrong I like this channel but sometimes it just seems condescending.
Now what about desktop icons
I use them but everyone mocks me as a windows user lol
Who gives a toss whether or not Linux has "traction with normies"? It works for me to the point where I rid myself of my Microsoft abuser finally when support for Windows 7 ended, I am perfectly fine with Linux.
2% or 92% desktop penetration for Linux would make no difference on how I use it.
If you only use something because it's popular, then that isn't the right mindset to use Linux anyway.
@@terrydaktyllus1320you need traction with normies to increase market share so that hardware would be supported with Linux, services would be supported with Linux, etc.
@@dermondof course you use desktop icons. You want to put things in a place that's visible and where you would be reminded of later. I save files on the desktop too. It's like leaving things on top of your desk too deal with later instead of filling them in a cabinet every time.
@@hamobu I need nothing. Linux works perfectly fine for me as it is, it also pays me a good salary.
And what hardware still needs to be supported? And please witter on about games or GPUs...
And services? What services need to be supported?
I think you're pushing a stupid idea think of syatems without multiple monitors you need to know what is happening in the background, especially when your recording. That is the most stupid idea, not to show it, just wait for a hacker to switch it on for you
Hello Derek,
I just want to thank you for the work you do with this channel and with patreon! I've gone down a real rabbit hole in your video library, and they're absolutely excellent. You're clear, and precise, and you're very good at getting to the point of what people need to know, presenting it in a digestible and inspiring way.
We appreciate it! Thank you! :D
It must be an evolutional transfer to a clean environment. The longer one uses GNU/Linux the more one understands, that all these desktops are bloated. Gnome, KDE, Qtile or whatever. Systrays take space, they distract user from actual tasks and consume resources (even if it is some small amount). I know that on Super+1 hotkey is my terminal, and on Super+2 Firefox, messenger. Do I need any indicators to find out where I am at the moment? No. But for now there is one little icon that I have to use systray for - it is bluetooth button. Sometimes it is handy to connect to a speaker. Otherwise there would be a route through settings. Well, that is why systray still lives on my desktop, but in very minimal version and in a hidden mode 🙂
Hard disagree to all of this
Gnome systrays are ugly. Even uglier than xfce systrays. Systrays have their use, but only if you can completely customize them (which apps show what icon at what size in which order etc.). Yet another example of UI that M$ does better. Smdh.
20secs ago lol
4min.
11 for me =)
😄 👍👌...
You"re bad.
i use i3, only day, date and time in my i3status bar. i don't need systray also
If you are using a single monitor, things like OBS systray icons are invaluable! I run the entire program from that icon!
you can still use multiple workspaces on a single monitor
@@N0zer0 but you still don't have easy eyes on it, as you'd need to switch to said workspace to check. It's great for just periodically glancing to ensure you are still in fact recording without needing to switch workspaces quickly - thus disrupting the flow of your recording.
It depends on the app and the user. I have certain apps that I use the system tray for frequently, maybe just at-a-glance information or quickly looking at some stats without opening the app. It should be configurable but not removed.
Exactly true, freedom of choice. Easy as that 👍
Agreed. i wouldn't be on the side of removal but configurable. I like my systray and apps that reside there. I however dislike the "apps" that DT has for example in his bar... I also use WMs and i tend to avoid using those as much as I can.
As a system administrator I believe that system trays can be useful for desktops because they aknowledge the user about running applications. This can be (and often is) abused but, in my opinion, knowing what is going on on your computer is very important. System tray is one of the popular forms of easy access to this information (which, again, is often abused)
Old Net/Sys Admin here... I totally agree! System Trays are very important for displaying system environment statuses. This info placed anywhere else would be covered over by any opened window.
Thanks! So, system trays are often important, but in practice a lot of them aren’t and are indeed superfluous.
@@maxsiem8572 I don't think so... Scooter!!! Any avenue of "Status" is always important when dealing with Servers!!! In my many years of computing.... Information is KING!!!! I don't need that INFO hidden!!!!
I think it's excellent how chat programs DON'T kill themselves. Often I want to quickly pull up a chat client but don't want it taking up space when I'm not actually using it. When the client is fully closed I am not going to get any notifications.
That feature is called minimize. Unless you use a tiling WM, in which case why not just put it on a different workspace/tag it with an IM tag?
@quitting to the systray would allow the app to daemonize, saving ssyten resources instead of having a window up.
it can send background notifications without having a useless tray icon
@@raidev_That "useless" tray icon informs you that it's running and taking up system resources.
This is by far the most incoherent topic ever talked on this channel.
Systray is necessary. Apps are either open or closed. If they have a GUI, they either sit on the task bar with a bigger icon or just the Systray. Otherwise, they are closed.
I don't need slack or any other app that I don't actively use taking space from my task bar.
Gnome make things worse, you have this horrible, useless panel on the side and also a bar on top. It's like a crappy combo of Mac and Windows.
I guess you as user have options to change this but you are certainly far from knowing what UX means, especially when 99% of the users see the value on this feature.
So, this isn't a Linux problem -- my TTY never has crap in any systray -- it's a DE prob ... and Windows/Mac have at least as much crap in their systrays.
Having the OBS icon with the red dot is actually helpful to some people.
If I see it, I know it is recording. I'd rather minimize the OBS window and rely on the systray icon.
Everybody has a different taste in such things, but calling it useless is just plain wrong.
the problem is that it stays even when not recording, sitting there doing nothing
Systrays are useless. Except when they aren't useless. Got it.
Not your strongest video.
I look at the systray as a general settings and quick info kind of section of the UI. If an app infiltrates that area against my wishes I'd view that app as malicious and delete it. Otherwise, I'd say it works as intended for me. Volume controls, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, network indicator, clipboard, printers, keyboard indicator since my keyboard doesn't indicate NumLock, notifications and media player status are what I've got and I feel those are all necessary and have finagled the clipboard that way on more than a few occasions to reorder stuff I want to paste.
I use systray every single day, and I use it a lot. I need it for my email, my signal desktop, steam, OBS and many many other applications. No systray means not using that DE. End of story
Systrays are absolutely necessarry to my workflow, anything that needs to stay running in the background needs to have a tray icon. What is annoying is that there isn't standard behaviour that every app follows, its just a mess. Discord is number one here, with their stupidly glitchy right click menu.
Systray is necessary and I totally need. I'm using systray. I want there notifications from applications like email client, instant messaging, proxy programs, sound, network and so on and so on... Don't want to see this programs on my quick launcher. No Gnome is not going the right directions. It becomes more and more useless to me. Fancy animated but useless. This is why I left that crappy desktop environment. What you say it would be poor design. If I close slack it should be on systray and stay background. Show me if I got message but don't should be anywhere else until I use it. Like steam. It is right there. Right click on it. Launch the game from there. Don't necessary to open up the whole window. Etc...
I hope you are not designer and developer in any of my favorite DE project. Would be pissed of if they are removing this feature.
One of the worst thing in Linux community are people telling other people to stop doing things because it do not match their opinion.
I want to use system in my way, not your way. I don't want tilling managers but I'm not telling others to stop using them.
Systray works well for intended purposes, and that is my decision what I want to put there. Argument: 'I never need to see OBS systray indicator therefore is not needed' is same as 'I had a breakfast today therefore there is no world hunger'.
Those academicals and ideological approach kept me from Linux for quite a bit of time, because everyone had an opinion instead helping people to do things the way they want. Or constantly nagging that someone shouldn't say 'Linux' but the only correct way GNU/Linux, ffs.
An old bald man rants at a system tray..
I mean with your logic, why even have a desktop environment just do everything for the TTY
Some are pointless, yes... But some are useful, like volume, WIFI, clipboard, USB mounter and maybe an updater. But I typically only update once a week or so. But I can also hide them or disable them altogether. I'm not a window manager user either, all those keybinds I have to remember. Just isn't for me.
many apps provide useful information through sys tray just by being there
wifi/network (you mentioned it)
onedrive/dropbox etc being syncing properly.
sound/mic
vpn
battery for laptops
date or time
and then there are the ones that someone likes to have
cpu/ram/disk info
song playing
weather/temp
Having said that, should the apps include an option on whether or not you want to have it on sys tray, yes
Bruh... you're using a systray right now, then doing a video about the systray not being necessary. Windows and MacOS have system trays so... which users are you calling "confused" by the existence/use of them?
Where's the wallpaper from the thumbnail from?
Wow, I did not expect that people would react so negatively to the idea of no systray :D
I'm new to linux and am still exploring all the desktop environments but in general I prefer non-redundant and minimalist setups so I agree with you. To be honest I can't think of a single thing that I would like to have on my screen 100% of the time (not even the clock). I'd like to try to use my keyboard with hotkeys almost exclusively and switch to things only when I need to so that any single app can take 100% of the screen. A tiling window manager will probably be good for me but I have yet to try one.
Anyway, it's a matter of taste though so people need to chill.
Just add a second monitor and you can utilize that 100% of your screen. I'm at the age where I seldom use hotkeys, so that's not an option for me. Having a different opinion isn't reacting negatively, it's just people voicing their preferences, just like you did.
@rgavel Maybe you don't see the like to dislike ratio like I do because I use the extension for it. It definitely shows a negative reaction. Why did all those people have to dislike this video where he "just voiced his preference"?
I'm not gonna spend money on a second monitor, waste electricity and blast my eyes with even more blue light to fix a small and customizable software issue. That's like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut!
Anyway, what does age have to do with hotkeys? Are your hands diseased with arthritis? I can give you some health advice if so.
My apologies, I thought you were addressing the comments being made, not something that may not even apply to the topic of the video. I used to run that extension, but found it kind of pointless. That's just me, you do you.
Some of us like having a second monitor for the flexibility that it provides. I prefer having things that are useful, instead of installing apps I'm not going to need. No sledgehammers required.
Don't assume it's my hands, it's my memory. I'm not into memorization, when a simple glance or mouse click will do. No health advice needed, I can DO things you're talking about, I just choose not to. I'm basically lazy.
I'm going to make an assumption as well, though it's more of a prediction. I'm going to assume/predict I started using mainframe and desktop computers before you were even born.