How To Check Timing Chain Slack -EricTheCarGuy
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- If you have some strange performance problems like hesitation, misfires, or perhaps even a check engine light for a cam or crank sensor, you might want to check for timing chain slack. If the cam and crank don't move smoothly, engine performance will be effected. This test can only be performed on certain engines but it can be an invaluable tool when doing performance diagnosis. It's an easy test and all you need is a way to turn the crank and the ability to observe the distributor. No fancy tools required.
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![Top 5 Symptoms of a BAD TIMING CHAIN [What to Look Out For]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/7beQX8cE-18/mqdefault.jpg)
![Top 5 Symptoms of a BAD TIMING CHAIN [What to Look Out For]](/img/tr.png)
I used to have to type out this procedure a lot. Now I have a video! How To Check Timing Chain Slack -EricTheCarGuy
julchrist mbadinga Wadafuq?
Walter Black He said ''Mecanic is a job I'd enjoy'' It's french ;P
hey erick please activate the CC function, soy de mexico y sin subtitulos no le entiendo XD
Maybe do this with a Chevy Cobalt timing chain ? :) So I can see if mine is slack :P
Hey Eric, I have a 91 honda civic, I installed a new engine in it. So normally when you depress on the throttle pedal you could hear the sound match at the exact press time. And my car sounds milli seconds after the depressed of the pedal. What is the cause of this and what can I do to adjust that????
I thanks you for a great way to test for timing chain slack
I like the new pov video style, I don't know who your cameraperson is buy much easier to see things. Plus, I'm sure you're sick of playing with tripods by now.
What would happen if you turned the engine in the opposite direction? So say you turned it counter-clockwise instead of clockwise?
Do you know any method of checking if the chain timing is off on a Ford 4.6L V8?
Why does a timing chain skip?
Can missfire cause this
Car type
Audi A6 4.2 Quattro V8 S-Line
Dude it was so dark we couldn’t see squat
This video is so incredibly helpful! I've used it twice now and diagnosed two timing chains that were seriously slacking. Thanks Eric the Car Guy, you rule!!!
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I was dumb lost the login password. I would love any assistance you can offer me!
@Anders Paxton instablaster :)
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Takes quite some time so I will get back to you later with my results.
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@Anders Paxton you are welcome :)
Many mechanics I know have argued with me that this process of checking a timing chain is ridiculous or does not work, I say this is the best process to check the slack in your timing chain, it is common sense to see that this is the correct process. Most times I could tell you if a mechanic is worthless or decent just by seeing him apply a wrench to a bolt or by his ridiculously stupid comments, thank you for your post and explaining the proper process for checking a timing chain. When mechanics tell me that this is not the right way and then they tell me that they have been doing it for 30 years, all I have to say to them is you have been doing it wrong and that is a long time to be doing something wrong and not have figured it out yet, good job Eric.
Eric, the test was useless. Any engine could pass by your 7 degree test because the slack in a timing chain is on the non drive side. You would rotate your crankshaft in the direction the engine turns when running and THEN watch your rotor as you turned your crank the opposite direction. Get my point? The side that is pulled down by the grab of the turn will always be flexed tigt even if you has 4 inches side play on the non grab turning side.
This could also be indicative of a worn distributor gear. I had a friend that did this on a 302 and changed the chain. That didn't fix it, changed the distributor gear and it fixed it. Might be a freak problem for the dizzy gear to go bad but I just know it's possible
That is actually a very good comment..yes this test can indicate both chain wear and distributor gear wear. Gear wear is not as common, but still worth noting! Some engines are much more prone to distributor gear issues than others so its good to know some history on the system you are testing for sure!
Good to know, I wasn't sure how common it was. If only Eric would have said it in the video haha.
I hear ya..I have been pretty hard on Eric a few times with comments lol. Then I realized that if he covered every possible variable in every video, they would all be too long to watch lol. This test he gives is a valid method of checking slack on a chain with this type of system..yes there are variables, and in this goofy trade there always will be, but this vid only claims to show a method of testing for chain slack, and thats what it does :) Thats why comments are so critical on youtube channels..you get to learn lots from the vids, and you can learn lots from the comments as well :)
Yeah, true. I would think the best way to test the chain would be to pull the valve covers and watch the valves move. Wouldn't that be a valid way of doing it?
Anytime you can test something without having to remove anything else is the way to go in my books :)
Hi Eric heres a good one for you. I have a 99 astro van 4.3 vortec.
I suspect timing chain slack and or possibly jumped a tooth.
I noticed a little more noise like clicking and rattling but very quite though.
I can't seem to get the distributor on TDC mark 6 on the dist. housing.
Distributor went bad replaced it had no issue. recently had p0300 random misfire checked ignition timing and noticed the rotor on the dist. was firing after TDC.
I tried to adjust to back on TDC but could never do it.
The thing that me me concerned and of all convinced and is when I turn the engine over by socket and wrench its smooth than it gets hard and a lot resistance and for a second it pushes back (like the timing chain is too tight and pulling back).
Once I put some muscle into it and get past the hard part when rotating the engine it becomes smooth and loose.
Is this due to a stretched chain causing it to be very tight and loose? And why im experiencing hell trying to install a simple distributor.
very nice and clear demonstration Eric! we give you a nice applause from every technicians out there.. i deal with old classic TR6 MG vehicles sometimes at work and this will come in handy when it comes to diagnosing them for performance issues.. Anyways for anyone asking how to diagnose modern engines timing chain slacks.. you can use a live scanner like one of the bluetooth scanner that Eric reviewed one time.. i have an Elm327 scanner and i use Torque apps on my android.. it shows on Graphing> under timing advance.. you can only read by running the engine on idle but better on normal temperature after 5 mins.. you should see a about 6 degrees to 8 fluctuation and when you rev it should jump to 14 to 16.. it should be normal but again..its depending on what car you are looking at.. better check manufactures recommendations.. if you see erratic fluctuation on idle and the engines runs rough.. then you got timing issues.. better check these 4 things.. timing chain, crankshaft gear teeth and crank and cam sensors and gears... better start with the easy ones which are the sensors and the gears that it reads signals.. check them for everything before you jump to the chain since its a big job... :)
Or worn distributor there will be slack there no sure how much is too much.
Also, I have seen on GM vehicles that the distributor drive gear can be worn significantly causing additional slop. Can be one, the other or both. It's a good idea to pull the distributor and inspect it's drive gear. Happy wrenching!
This procedure seems overly complicated. Just put a socket on the crank and turn it back and forth and feel for when the chain tightens up and starts turning the camshaft. Camshafts have a good amount of resistance and it can be easily felt - no distributor needed. Very quick. If it seems like a lot of play then measure the angle to see if the slack is excessive. This is also useful on some vehicles with tensioners where the chain can get so much slack due to stretch and guide wear that the tensioner at full travel cannot keep the chain tight.
Hi .Eric Nice to see you do this vid , just after your drag strip run ..lol . oh well spos your gonna junk the engine eventually so it don't really matter... camera man needs to cut down on the booze ,,swayin a bit there on the dissy part..lol...
Two thoughts, to make the timing marks more visible, paint on some "white out" and wipe off the excess, really improves view.
Put a piece of blue painters tape on the lip of the distributor and mare the position of the rotor on the tape, makes it far easier to judge movement on the rotor.
Tony
Nice work Eric. Can this same method be used for a diesel engine if say I pulled out number 1 fuel injector after no 1 is at TDC and used a probe to watch for movement of the cylinder on a diesel common rail, twin cam type of engine instaed of the distributor? And is the degrees literally 7 degrees out of 360 degrees from the axis?
I'm about to do my first timing chain...I think I can do this your videos I've watched has helped gain confidence... thanks man 👍
Eric is your Camera Guy a "Car Guy" too?
cant wait till you pull out the engine.
me too. turning that fairmont into a race car is something i have to see. it'll be like a flying boat.
Eric, I can't wait for more Fairmont videos! Thanks for all you do. The value you bring to RUclips is absolutely not appreciated as much as it should be. As long as you keep posting videos, I'll be watching/sharing them.
Elvis clock?
Great old school tip
a worn timing chain can also affect oil pressure
nick carson hi mate can u help me out? i went in a garage and the guy said my timing chain has been stretched but the car drives normally without any problems but sometimes it doesnt start first time but always second time. also no engine management lights have come on? should i still replace it or just drive it as much as i can
Nick, thank you for saying that , cause I have poor oil pressure and now I know what to do. I know my timing chain has to be replaced. Again THANKS for mentioning that.
I'm not really super mechanical, but if you were to just measure the diameter of the pulley and use that to calculate the circumference, wouldn't that be a sufficient way to calculate degrees with fix mark of your choosing around the belt?
Also, is there any reason doing this on a compression stroke TDC is the best? Slack is slack is it not, or do you need the resistance of the compression to aid in the test?
Thanks for your videos. You're super helpful!
No dislikes
Thank you!!! This is time saving stuff. I actually didn't know that there was a way to test the timing chain. Working at the farm and my ole Chev. didn't start when I was ready to go home. Sounds like timing chain. going to test it now. Ole Chev only has 397,000 miles on it.
I did replace the chain and stuff, about...twenty years ago???? LOL.
Awesome diagnostic of the timing chain you got me on that one.
Would have helped with the observation of seeing the cap rotor move if the camera was stationary rather then have Brian moving around. None the less great video and appreciate you sharing how to check timing chain slack...
I have code P0016 in my 14 Malibu. Car drives fine and light comes on intermittently. Was off for a week then came back on 🤷♀️ Was told it child be dirty vvt solenoids or the chain hoping it’s the first one.
My 1996 chevy 1500 is fouling the terminals on the inside of my distributor like every other day could slack in my timing chain be the reason for this? Truck has 270xxx+ miles
Hello Eric , could you please help me out on a question I have about mypost 79 Chevy Elco , 350 motor , I just got it it's running ruff at idle, but seems to run good when driving , exhilarated , I did a full tune up and nothing changed ? it doesn't smoke or any thing like that ?? Anything you could tell me would be very appreciated , thanks for your time , and great video's
I have a 1998 Chevy Silverado 1500 5.7 Liter engine. My truck started making a noise that is coming from the front of the engine towards that bottom of it when idling and accelerating. I changed my water pump thinking it was that but it still makes that noise. With the belt off I started the truck and the noise is still there. Would the timing chain cause the engine to make a noise that sounds like it is releasing pressure? Before I bring it in to a mechanic I was wondering if anyone knew what it could be.
How many degrees of slack does a new timing chain have?, 350 Chevy.
Eric, your videos are SO helpful! Thanks for making them!
Wonder how many seconds you'd wipe off your time at the track if the tension was 100% correct.
Can you please look at my video on my engine tick in my 350z it uses a chain as well but its way different than this. It might not even be my timing chain it could be something else. Just want your opinions.
My one of my vehicles well actually I'm just stuck I bought a thing about a year ago my friend told me I needed a camshaft sensor he give me one cuz he on the truck but I messed around and misplaced it drivable I mean it had a little skip to it took my kids to school the other day when I drop some of them off at one school and went to go to the hood I couldn't hardly go in it it didn't backfire I didn't nothing put it on my machine it said it needed a crankshaft positioner or crankshaft positioner/camshaft positioner sensor I put both of those on there still no results plugs wires no reason I can advance the distributor a little bit cuz it didn't sit in there straight it was in a angle light it's a 5.72 k1500 96 model so then I put a distributor in it I timed everything got number one up on the right stroke put the distributor in time set it down and fell in place like it was supposed to be cannot get it to crank any way I moved at distributor so I put a coil on it cuz it was firing but it was yellow fire put a coil on it tonight still nothing what else can I do to crank it to fix it it was running before I put the other distributor shaft in it the old distributor shaft the gears on it man they were like knives that was that sharp but it was running do you got any advice what it could be and I can live video you and show you what it sounds like it wants to crank it tries to crank but it's like it's no gas
A note to your camera man/woman can you learn how to be even a little bit more steady? When you were talking about the movement of the distributor I couldn't see it because it looked like your camera guy just downed a bottle of tequila.
I guess you could watch valve movement from oil filler cap on a car without a distributor.
Can anyone figure out what's going on with this temporary intermittent chain slack ruclips.net/video/O0QXGwLt_q0/видео.html
I reinstall the main timing chain on my 95 Maxima. As I rotate the crankshaft, some sections of the main chain get very tight, and some sections have slack. Is that normal?
i have a question now this car is using distributor is easy to check timing chain slack, but how some vehicle is using plug coil no using distributor, so my question is how to do the checking without distributor. Thank you
You really need some wireless microphones. The echo and shitty one channel/crappy stereo audio is getting on my nerves.Get a wireless mic set please.
My car gives rattle sound on engine start and idle goes away in high gears. But I hear it again while travelling uphil. Secondly engine has a delay from ignition to start. Is it the timing belt issue?
There is a much easier way to check.
Just put a timing light on and look at the timing marks.
If the timing mark keeps bouncing around and will not be consistent the timing chain is stretched. Easy.
+Lucky Dog timing lights are kinda expensive
So are engine rebuilds.
$30 is expensive?
Lucky Dog that's easier said than done when you have excessive chain slack allowing the vehicle to only crank and not start. This method is the easiest because then you yourself can feel the slack and also hear any noise the chain makes when it tightens back up...
find a timing light in craigs list like I did or ebay, as last resort get a harbor freight one, not the brightest but adequate : )
I have a 403 Pontiac engine do the rotor button should be pointed at the number 1 spark plug on the number 1 on the distributor
is this motor chain driven? i know that the ford 240 and 300 straight 6 engines are geared drive, the crank gear runs the cam gear.
I can't believe it has been ten years now. This was pre engine swap too. Dang.
I love the clock on the wall at the end of the video hahaha
Would that 7 degrees also be applicable to a 99 chev 4.3 vortec ?
I don't like how much the camera sways in these more recent videos :/
Great! Thanks again. I love this stuff.
couldn't keep my eyes of Elvis 1:50
I have a 90 240sx and they are doomed with the timing chain, although this videos about a totally different car this was helpful. thanks Eric!
Does this 7 degree magic number fits on all "old school" engines?
I had an issue like that and I was unable to fix it , but it was on 4 inline cylinders european engine.
Anyway thanks for this good lecture.
is there a method for cop or non distributer cars thats fast like this?
I just did this to my 79 ford truck and it moves 10 degrees before i see the rotor start moving again. Yikes
Eric, did the Fairmont have a sort of weird vibration as if two cylinders were fighting each other, or a maybe more accurately described as a pulsating of the exhaust note? Because I have changed my distributor, new cap and rotor, ignition coil, plugs and wires, and Duraspark box. No change at all. It only does it from 1800 - 2200 ~ RPMS. From one mechanic to another this has me stumped. Edit: Same 200ci engine in my car.
When I push on it and it wiggles it’s loose
Oh wow love this info thanks Eric!
Very cool, thank you. Great info
This reminds me of something. I used to have a mid 90s (don't remember the exact year anymore) Buick. Had a bizarro problem where when the engine got hot after about a mile it would just die. Then if you let it sit and cool for an hour or so, it would run fine again for about another mile. At first I thought it was an overheat issue, then maybe a sensor, then I was thinking that maybe it was an electrical problem with the fuel pump. Basically I went through a huge list of things that it could be with no success. Eventually I found out that when the timing chain got hot, the metal would expand and it would screw up the timing enough that the engine would just die.
Thanks Eric, had a misfire at @5200 with a big block chrysler. determined that the crankshaft would rotate 10-12* before the distributor starts rotating, yikes! Thanks again for the informational video!
I had taken my A6 to the audi dealership. After getting my car back, it waa less than 12 hours in the morning driving to work around 6AM. During. The drive toward work which is about 10 min or less my engine light starts to flash and my car begins to shake like crazy.... I turn off the car and call Audi and tell them.... This was 2 days before i needed to go to the hospital for my first born. The female audi service lady said it was there fault and gave me a loaner car. 1 days before my first born i get a call from audi telling me prices..... I then had to rush back to audi leaving work insanely early tp get my car to go to the hospital!
Now im forced to report the dealership and more action will be done, because they broke my car and didnt report any service needed for this outcome they said they dont see how it is their fault and tried to tell me ita becuae the year of the car being 2006.... They said my car is missfiring and the timing jumped so they want mw to pay $8,500 to fix their poor service to my car.......
Carbon cleaning is needed they never told me that plus ingition coils look bad they didnt care to tell me that aswell. Oh yea my engine oil is black, they denied me service to change my oil......
your 0 is above 5 on the timing tag...
White paint or nailpolish + toothpick = make a mark on the pulley and timing position indicator = win! (when using inductive timing light)
Eric I'm not too positive about this but the 300ci has timing gears i'm not too sure if the engine in your Fairmont is the same? Also you could have play between the cam gear and the distributor gear right?
No, the Fairmont has a chain. Actually it's probably the nylon gears that have worn down that are causing the slack. As for the distributor, not as much as the chain. Any slack there would likely be negligible.
I have a 1979 ford 460 that stops working all of a sudden once it reaches normal temp. Compression is +/-6 psi on all cylinders, I can see fuel dump into carb and spark at coil and at #1 Plug. Vacuum at idle in park is 17 and bounces rapidly. I did this test and my chain is about 7 degrees like yours. My question is could this be the culprit to my issue?
I have a 2001 volkswagen jetta.
It staryed havimg engine knock
Then the check engine light came on.
Now it wont start. The noise sounds stuck and it wont crank.
How can I determine if the engine is dead?
Or timing chain.
Any advice appreciated till I save up for mechanic diagnosis.
Would it be easier to align the harmonic balance mark at ----- 0* and cylinder at #1 at TDC. The Ignition rotor pointing at #1 on the disturber cap. Then remove the Disturber cap and rotor. Check pickup coil is align to reluctor wheel, if not you have timing slack to Gear/Chain. Reluctor wheel and coil > < have to align for spark if I am correct.
will this cause hard starting when hot
I have a 2011 Mazda 6 I Sp and just put in shop due to this noise coming from bottom of engine, a weird rattle that can be heard when revving in N. When driving was barely heard. If you have any info or vids related to timing chain and or tensioner on my Mazda please leave me a comment thank you.
I prefer chains over belts any day. Of coarse with these modern engine having cops/coil pack/s this method does nothing but just happy to know that my current vehicle has a chain.
Good test for timing chain slack, not an easy task for a DIY'er if you have never done one. Just changed the chain and gears on my Dodge 5.9 gas had about an inch slack in the chain at 192,000 miles....Fun Stuff
My car is being a piece of shit anymore and I'm about to just drive it off of a cliff. I've been doing nothing but electrical diagnostics for weeks now, and have just gotten to the point of just throwing parts at it.
I have a 91 f150 with a 300 straight 6 and I don't think it's has enough power has a should I changed my plugs and wires and I took my pugs out the other day and it's burning hot could this be the problem
Good old school tip..practical and still very useful. I recently picked up a 1975 Dodge B200 Tradesman van with a 360 in it. The guy I bought it off told me the timing chain was just replaced. The engine was nice and clean so I couldn't really tell one way or the other if he was telling the truth lol. I do trust he was telling the truth, but this video reminded me that it would only take me like 5 minutes to see if he was BS'n me or not.
OK first off love your videos they've gotten me out of a jam on more than one occasion. I've got an 07 ford escape 4 cylinder 140k miles and the battery is four months old. Its my wife's aunts car. she took it to a store left it running went in, came out went to pull out heard a pop from under the hood stayed on for awhile then died. I've got a crank/ no start. Got fuel checked pressure, fuel pump, and inertia switch also witness fuel mixture come out of spark plug hole when spark plug was removed just to be sure. I got spark, replaced spark plugs, tested coils and visually witness sparking, again just to be sure but still no goey. Removed valve cover, timing chain in-tacked and cam and chain all rotate accordingly. Tested ignition relay, tested continuity of position sensor connector to ground and the CPS itself is reading 470 ohms which I think is normal haven't done a voltage test. I suspect a timing issue but I've hit a wall on what to troubleshoot next. Any advice because I'm pulling my hair out and about to gouge my eyes out so I can't help people anymore.
What are some of the best company's to buy timing chain kits for a 2001 Dodge Dakota 4.7?
good vid Eric ,,, i have a question,,,, 67 pontiac 400 how does the timing chain get its lubrication ?,,,does it just get sloshed ? if so then how about the eccentric lubrication?
I used to own a p71 with the 4.6. And it had tendency when I would go to crank it, the engine would not crank but the there was something that sounded like the timing chains whirring away like mad and it was so loud I was actually embarrassed. What do you think this is?
If the chain has slack, get #1 on TDC on comp. stroke. on 0. Then mark the #1 plug wire on the cap on the Dist. with chalk. Lift up the Dist. and turn the rotor to #1 terminal on the Dist. body. Now turn the distributor body way back against normal rotation. Set the Dist. down and turn the distributor to normal position. Tighten the bolt some. Now set the timing. You are compensating for timing chain slack.
So how about if you turn the crankshaft a whole 360 and the distributor rotor doesn't move, but the engine does start?
tbh, im not quite sure if i like these new videos when there's another person using the camera. idea is great and it should be better but for some reason it's not. the picture moves around too much and it's sometimes frustrating to try to watch these. another problem is the sound. first it's too loud and then it's too quiet. guess it takes time to get these right with the new shooting arrangements and all that. certainly hope it gets better. other than that - thanks for the info. very useful, as always. :)
erice when are you going to work on new ford fiesta ????
Great video... I've always had problems with Ford timing chains from the 1970's and 1980's. Ford used a nylon cam sprocket on their timing chain sets. These start to wear out around 70K miles, and fail around 100K miles. With this much slack, I would replace the timing chain set "immediately" with a steel timing chain set.
Also ive worked on cars since I was a little boy. Ive never had a issue like this and its the only explanation I can logically think k of is the timing chain being stretched or jumped a tooth after TDC
Hello, great video. I have a 3800 series 2 from GM. I don't have a standard distributor. How would you check for slack in my situation.
hey Eric, I had this grinding sound coming from the front end. I thought it was my brake pads on the rotor. I replace my pads, rotors, calipers and likes(it needed it) but I still had the sound. finally I located it and it's coming from the crankshaft pulley location. while the jeep was running I could hear it a little like sand rubbing on metal. I used a stethoscope and I can her some grinding. from the inside I only hear it when moving. rpm change doesn't cause it, only while in motion. does this sound like a timing chain problem?
excellent eric ...i'll check this on my MR2 tomorrow...maybe that why she want start after sitiing for 8 years.-your the best.
Thanks Eric, your videos are a great help! Best wishes to you and your channel.
I pulled the timing cover off a 2000 Dodge Caravan to fix a leaking o-ring. Replaced timing chain since it had a lot of slack. Engine now runs better and mileage has improved too.
My car bounces at certain rpms like it's missing a bit. I found the upper chain tensioner plastic had a half inch of plastic worn away and it was rubbing on metal. Bought a new tensioner which is in the mail. Can't wait to see if it fixes it.
Would the same seven degrees be "useable" on a chevy 305 c.i., or is it only with your type of engine?
Great video keep it up. But soon can you get portable curtains to deaden the echo in The shop. A shower curtain hanging from an engine hoist would help. Two in a "v" shape with the camera in the middle would be great. Keep them just off camera. Maybe hang a tarp or sheet flat from the ceiling. Stay dirty.
excellent video sir!...i actually think my timing chain skipped a tooth,, barely runs at all now..was running bad with poor power... also when i removed cap and put on top dead center rotor was off by approx 30degrees
hey etcg, thanks for these information rich videos man i really appreciate ur work. what i wanted to bug u with was my 2001 gmc jimmy. I've replaced all of the emission related components trying to chase down this random multiple cylinder misfire. to no avale. however i can hear a almost tick tick tick noise coming from timing cover area. now this is causing the truck to have noticeable "wobble" at highway speeds. i can see my hand on the wheel kinda going side to side again at highway speeds. already replaced tires ,alignment etc.i have recently replaced balancer hoping that was the culprit but i notice while pressing the new balancer on i could actually move the crank shaft that the balancer screws into in an up down motion ever so slightly which leads me to believe theres a bad bearing somewhere behind that timing chain cover on that crankshaft. what do u think? i know without actually having hands on its kinda like asking to diagnose cancer over the phone, but worth a shot i guess.might be worth mentioning that there is no other code except the ever present random mis. truck has the 4.3 ltr 4x4 engine just hit 110k miles again its a 2001 gmc jimmy slt. thanks in advance if u get around to this comment or anyone else for that matter. whom ever may have some insight could feel free to gimma a text 443 796 8828 again i do appreciate any insight seeing as how i am not a mechanic by trade but i do most of my own repairs what with the inner webs & all.