Also, Merry Christmas to everyone celebrating it! This is my last video of the year, and what a year has it been. Some of my favorite videos were shot, edited and published this year. And this is one of them actually. But then again, if your last video isn't better than your last, are you really improving as a film maker? Anyway, I'm jibber jabbering... Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, and see you soon with more, bigger and better videos! Cheers!
Great stuff. By the way did you know that the fortune cookie is NOT from China? It was invented by local Japanese Americans for a world fair held on Treasure Island in San Francisco Bay in 1939 and 1940, called the Golden Gate International Exhibition, and was such a hit the local restaurants started putting them out at the end of meals, with Confucius sayings being quite popular. CFMoto, or originally Zhejiang Chun Feng (the CF in CFMoto). Zhejiang is the name of the province (just west of Shanghai) and ChunFeng (Spring Wind) is located in Hangzhou, the capital of Zhejiang. I lived and worked there for several years just after they started their company I think in 1989. Beautiful place to visit ( I recommend fall for better weather).
I am 55 years old (don't know how that happened). My riding is the adventure, I try to escape civilization as much as I can, so I do lots of side roads, off road and such riding. For this type of riding, there are so few bikes out there, my current bike is the Honda Rally 300, it took about $3000 usd to get it to competent bike status. Still the occasional highway run is marginal. Kove is awesome, the 450 too off road oriented, the 800 stunning but I don't want 100 HP. The new CFmoto 450 MT is it right now. Wish it was 15 kg lighter...... But looking at the whole package, no one makes a bike like that. Nice vid.
I am so happy for Kove and really wish them all the best . For decades customers were begging big name bike manufacturers to create lite dual sport / adventure bike - but got nothing in return. When Tenere came out heavy like elephant , and not only heavy - but top heavy - I got enough. Big name bike manufacturers selling a badge and robbing us with the price of spare parts for decades.... Oh yeah you could buy factory rally replicas costing 35 000 euros..... I used to be loyal to Yamaha - but no more. She is still in the garage, but I am definitely placing order for Kove 450 . Thanks for posting ...
Another great video...with interesting insights. Another Chinese off road/enduro company, GPX , are also now producing some decent bikes at a good price. We have a good dealer and spares network in the UK. The factory listen and fix issues quickly. Their 250 2 stroke even comes with 6 months warranty... faith in your own product is a good place to start.
@@Kennon959 wrong ..they manufacture...and surprisingly close to older KTM...I wouldn't be surprised if KTM have a stake..most of their stuff is made in china anyway.
Hello sir. What about the logistics and parts availability? The main reason I never wanted a Chinese bike is the headache of never finding odd parts and being stuck with an unfixable motorcycle
I've rode a CF Moto MT 800 across china 7500 kilometers great bike no probs kept chain lubed and adjustments, but like with any brand if they dont have workshops local they dont come into consideration to buy
This is quite an interesting video. More than a decade ago when my kids were small, I picked a couple of Chinese bikes and they were indeed crude. Basic maintenance kept them working for several years but yes they were replaced with Japanese bikes as the kids grew. Fast forward to last spring and I was looking for a small dualsport to keep on the back of my RV as a runabout and light dualsport for exploring. I tried to purchase a Honda CRF300L at my local dealer as the price of $5,300 seemed reasonable, unfortunately the dealer was still adding their "covid pricing" and the out the door price was close to 9 grand after markups and taxes. This frustration led to me clicking "buy it now" on a small chinese dualsport for a ridiculous price. Well that bike has turned out to be far better than anticipated and has actually been used on a few "real" off road rides with my usual group and it has done quite well (yes you must still realize what you are working with, a simple inexpensive machine). Thank you for the informative video.
@@KRANKiT I always explaine to others that motorcycles should be first an utlitary vehicle and second as a hobby, that if you call yourself a motorcyclist.
Well done! I grew up with the "made in Japan" is junk mentality all around me. But the goofy little bikes made in Japan didn't leak oil, didn't require constant work to keep them running, and were so cheap to buy. That made it possible for almost all of us kids to be able to save up our lawn mowing money and actually buy a motorbike. And learn to ride and love riding as we lusted for the big but very expensive British bikes that were always out of our reach.
Guess we’ll never know. That being said, it’s been some time since I last saw Honda try to pioneer a segment, to be so bold. Would I have liked to see a 450 Rally honda? Sure. But realistically I don’t think I had too much hope.
@@KRANKiT I'd say Kove will take 3 years to prove it's reliability reputation one way or the other. The Japanese could steal the press's attention back in that time with a similar release.
I've ridden all sorts of bikes in the past 14 years. Several of those have been Chinese motorcycles. They have come a long ways. Back about 14 years ago you were lucky to get one thousand miles out of a Chinese bike before you started having serious issues. Jump to 2016 or so and I got a Vader and it was a great bike. Now I have a hawk 250 as a fun around town and trail bike and I never worry about it breaking down and leaving me stranded.
Beside the subject, great quality video remind me the Fortnine style of shots and edits, ofcourse is a compliment New sub and thanks for this awsome one!
after last years Dakar I got excited about the Kove450... its almost the unicorn bike we've been wanting from the big 4.. and then came the cfmoto 450... seemed to push ktm, royal enfeild and bmw to step up the small cc dual sport game...
I live near Bydgoszcz, which used to be one of the biggest producers of small displacement bikes in the Warsaw Pact with the Romet factory. Now the factory is no more, but thanks to the Chinese, you can still buy brand new Romet bikes. My hometown is close to Minsk. Much like Bydgoszcz, Minsk motorcykles gave freedom to countless masses. The factory is no more, but there are brand new Minsk bikes out there. To quote a certain US president, "I make good buisiness with the Chinese, am I supposed to hate them?". Granted, the new bikes arent perfect, but... they do work, and when they stop working, they're not that hard to fix. True, the 'authorised' spare parts may be hard to get, alas the bikes themselves are not designed to only need 'authorised' spare parts. In case you use the new calendar in your place, happy Nativity!
Most of them are copies. That the truth, that no body said. The moto morini is just a versys copy. The multiple kopies of the cb 500x. Kove 800x is just a cb500x with ktm 790 engine, with good suspensions. This is the main different between china and japan. All of that copies are just stolen. kawasaki paid bsa. I think that we need to be more vocal about the way they are making business...
I've had 5 bikes so far, 3 benellis, one yamaha and one suzuki. Believe or not, the most thrashed around were the benellis, specially my current leoncino trail offroad, 20k kms and the only problem was a leaking water pump gasket, waited 2 days for that part, on the 3rd day the dealer was installing it! In portugal (at least at my dealer), everything is almost as quick as my yamaha. Also benelli was the best seller in europe last year and despite the fact that their owners are chinese, the original engineers and designers still remain, the production, however was moved to china. If you visit Pesaro or are able to talk to some benelli personnel, they'll tell you so. As will QJ motor, benelli's owners. Great to see china fighting top brands, maybe now they'll get down their high horse 😁
Chinese bikes will have to become BETTER then other manufacturers for a majority of people to overlook the downsides. Chinese bikes might have reached a competitive level, but i cant comprehend a reason youd choose a chinese bike over other manufacturers. They have lower resale value, a bad image, and still unproven longterm reliability. Not to mention one day, if we are at war with china which is very possible, parts may become impossible to get.
In the city where I come from motorcycles are banned in total which is un-constitutional if Chinese constitution matters. I need to immigrate to Europe to ride one of the 'made in China' assuming if I still want one. Chinese problems are never anything other than political. But still I appreciate your recognition of Chinese manufacture.
In Nigeria there are a lot of chinese motorcycles of different kinds. Qlink, Denstar, jingcheng, solink, lingfan. These bikes can run in terrains u have never imagined and they can carry nearly 200kg of material across long distances In Kenya you have dual sports with good reviews like Tekken and vogue 200 and 250cc. The ones in Nigeria are Naked bikes, bikes that look like cruisers and scramblers in one. 200cc brand new less than $1000 Dollars. The dual sport in Kenya are about $3000. Fitted wit everything u need on a modern Enduro bike. No need for aftermarket upgrade
Not to long ago, in the USA, Japanese were the cheap option. That said, I can tell the casting difference just by looking at the engine. Not willing to spend my money on them....yet.
Great video! I have a Hawk 250 with almost 16,000 miles on it. It’s been virtually bulletproof, but I did do quite a bit to make it super reliable. I also have 4 other Chinese machines, and only one of them has given me quite a bit of problems (an early 2000s ATV). The rest…bulletproof so far.
Fun fact is that Zhang Xue had already left the Kove company for unknown reasons(overly putting resources on development without assessing the market might be the one), and he is starting his new business, Zhang Xue Motorcycle now. Who knows.
Nowadays almost every big store in western Europe beside selling "european" or japanase brands , is selling also some chinese brands in disguise. Be that Benelli, Zontes , CFMoto etc. And they also sell a lot of chinese scooters aswell. If you look at the quality of CFMoto there is actually no point in buying other brands for certain type of bikes. And I m a KTM owner. More so, the chinese companies attacked this year already the small adv market with bikes around 450cc capacity. Lots of ppl want less expensive, smaller, less powerfull adv bikes and the big names never listened to them. Your videos are very nice, the storyteller style suits this industry perfect as there is so much to tell. Salutari din Bruxelles si Craciun fericit! 🥳
Wanna make a video talking about the lack of quality on ktm bikes? exc 300 deciding that don't want to be we us anymore after 5 hours? cylinders made by kymco failing in 20 hours or less? Beta bearing fisco with the skf china?
There are many obstacles to the development of motorcycles in China, not only the technical catch-up, but the compulsory scrapping you mentioned does have a great impact, but more importantly, there are 800+cities in China, of which 250+cities prohibit any motorcycle driving, and the number is increasing gradually. One of them is called "Shenzhen", and I hope motorcyclists all over the world will remember that as long as you drive a motorcycle in this place, you will be fined 2,000 yuan, about 300 dollars, and your motorcycle will be detained. Of course, don't take any chances. There are many cameras in China, as you should know. And "Shanghai" is a place where motorcycles want to drive legally on the road, they have to pay 600,000 yuan to buy a license plate first. Yes, a license plate costs 600,000 yuan, about 9 w $ In this regard, China's cyclists and motorcycle manufacturers can't do anything about it. We can only confront the government in court again and again, but how can we win? The government has suppressed its manufacturing industry, which I think is ridiculous. Therefore, the motorcycle industry in China can develop gradually, which has nothing to do with the government. At the darkest moment, the motorcycle manufacturers in China didn't fall down because of the support of cyclists in China. Therefore, there is absolutely no need to be biased because of political factors. The government is the government and the manufacturer is the manufacturer. Motorcycle drivers and motorcycle manufacturers in China do not like the government and do not support their ideas.
In Thailand, Honda rules capturing more than 70% market share. However, for cheap tricycles which used to sport old Honda engines are now equipped with Lifan engine from China. Lifan engine is indestructible as it is a clone of Honda engine from the 80s, simple maintenace just needing oil change periodically and it would run forever, similar to Honda original.
Nice video! And you do have a point, I myself believe that CF Moto is on the rise as japanese brands were back then. As a German, I love that there will be more affordable motorcycles innthe future, BUT there is just one problem, that might not apply to everyone. The politics. As many already pointed out lol. I myself.....I can't stand it. The new CF Moto 450 MT is a awesome bike, but I will probably not buy it. I gave my money to the Indians instead and bought myself a Royal Enfield Himalayan.
Yep, I agree, that’s why I acknowledged it. I don’t want to go deep into it since this channel is about bikes, not about politics, but it will be a factor for many people.
@@KRANKiT Absolutely legitimate. Opening up a discussion about politics is like opening the gate to hell these days. Stick to your awesome bike content. Keep it up, your videos are awesome!
Its sad the media has slagged off China. The history, culgure and expertise in China is great as is the culture. I grew interested studying Wing Chun kung Fu, thdir food and history, mentality and culture is vefy much misunderstood. They deserve 5:25 equality and respect
Nice one! The only one point I disagree is that at the beginning of Japanese motorcycle making, these machines where unreliable. I don´t think so. At least not more un-/relieable than the others. Reason: When a Japanese mechanic/company plans something, they undergo very thorough studies and the outcome may not be sexier but certainly the same or even more reliable from the start onwards. Another reason is, that the mechanical level in Japan was quite high, not only "recently". Whatever materials the Japanese are working on, be it wood, metal, glas, name it - the outcome usually is stunning. Think of ancient katana swords, think of silk kimonos, think about ancient wooden constuctions and how these things where all made. Quality at its very best. Regarding China, I agree, they are NOT dumb and they have a huge army of intelligent engineers who learn fast. And they are still HUNGRY for success. And yes, KOVE really sticks out, because the main guy (sorry, don´t recall his name) is a real bike/race enthusiast! The driving force behind all this and authentic one, too. He is one of us! Not European or American or Westerner - he is a rider and nationality doesn´t count in this case. Sad enough, that he "disappeared". Apparently was too successful, too Western for the taste of the Chinese government. Hope, he´s still alive and I hope he´ll pop up somehwere, where he can pursue his dreams.
Id rather see more chinese bikes or any other brands rather then seeing the bike content of the usual brands. They're so boring. I wanna see new stuff and at the moment Chinese brands seems exciting 🔥 We do need more proper supermotos though. Wish Zontes/CFmoto would make one soon..
I have a zontes too, the GK350 is 🔥 I just wish in the near future that zontes or CFmoto makes a supermoto that looks like the DRZ / Sherco / KTMs / Husqvarna.
The fact that all the videos about Chinese motorcycles refuse to speak about the political side of the story is almost frightening. You just cannot speak about a topic like this without acknowledging the politics.
Bro I’m American and I hate my own government right now. Would you not buy a Harley because you don’t agree with the president? You gotta separate the people from the government.
@@channel-q2m nah man, that's different. The Chinese government regularily owns parts of these big companies and also subsidizes them to be able to undercut the market. That way one does directly fund the Chinese government by buying chinese bikes. A government that is the Chinese Communist Party, that is a dictatorship and is basically friends with russia. A government that is widely known to disregard human and civil rights. On top of all that, China doesn't care about intellectual property. This leads to brands like Kove illegally copying motors from KTM (in case of their 800 models), Honda (for the 500 models) and Yamaha (300 models). Other Chinese manufacturers do the same to varying degrees.
In short, and I can only speak for myself, the politics aspect of it is really big and complex. I know a lot of facts about motorcycles, but I don't know as much about politics. And I try not to talk publicly about things I am not sure of. And to be fair, addressing that would take ages. And even at that point, it would be subjective. Why would it be frightening? It's different topics. This politics aspect that you mention can genuinely be applied to anything that comes from China. From any phone we've ever used, any computer, almost anything. Heck, Honda has some parts built in China. Should I start every Honda video from now on with a 30 minute monologue about politics? I don't think so. At the end of the day, conspiracy theory aside, I'm not addressing China or the CCP because this is not the place for it. This channel is about motorcycles. About the products. About where they are sold, who invented them, and so on. That's it. Not everything has to be about politics. And this isn't. And it will never be.
Also, one more thing I do want to add, I did mention in the video that there will be questions about ethics, about trust, and all those things... And as I said, those questions are not black and white. As much as we want to say it is, it's not. It never is.
@@KRANKiT Hey man, I appreciate the detailed answer. I do absolutely understand your reasoning for not bringing it up in your video, however, with parts of it I respectfully disagree. Yes, politics are very complex and not many people know a lot about it. But politics are just part of our daily life and very important to our society. Politics is just inherently connected to most topics, some more, some less. But I think people being unaware is exactly the issue. I see part of the responsibility here with content creators. It doesn't need to be a 30 minute perfectly researched documentary about the CCP and its inner workings. But in my opinion, in a video explicitly about chinese motorcycles, people should be made aware that they are, when buying those motorcycles, directly supporting a government that abuses human rights and funds a war aggressor. That's something that can be said in one sentence and without any subjectivity. If people then decide to not care about that, that's fine, but I think it's better then them not even knowing about it and just being hyped. You mention that the politics aspect can be applied to anything that comes from China. I agree and I actually think it should. I personally always consider where something comes from. However, I do also realise, that it's not possible to not by anything from there. Like you mention, even established european and japanese manufacturers get parts from China. But at least most of the customers money doesn't end up there in that case. On another note, (btw, I'm unsure, why you mention conspiracy theories haha) I think an interesting topic to explore is that of the Chinese motors. That's something very much about motorcycles and who invented them. Let's take the motor of the Kove 800X for example. Obviously KTM developed that motor, it's their 790 motor. But did Kove also develop it because they changed some stuff about it? Also they seem to have done it without KTMs approval?! But will it have the same quality as the original KTM unit? As an engineer I say: probably not, because they don't have the KTM quality control. But how can they do that? Probably because non-existant IP laws in China. Will they get sued when they try to sell it outside of China? All that is basically politics, even tho it's directly about a motor. Also now I'm kinda motivated to do some research and stuff. Maybe call the guys in Mattighofen and ask them about what they think of people stealing their motor designs. Or maybe they aren't actually stolen, but licensed. Maybe you'd like to co-write a script with me for your channel, that goes a bit deeper into the politics of the chinese bikes and how these motors come to exist. If not, that's fine too, it's your channel after all and if you don't want to do anything political than that's absolutely fine. I'm sorry, this got into quite the rant towards the end. Regards.
Look at TVS, Rajdoot, Enfield, Hero Honda, jawa and Bajaj all made in india and some 165cc single cylinder motos cost Rs 50000 or £600 new in India but exported the price is more than double so a £3000 enfield bullet in the uk costs less than £2k or 1.5 lakh or 150000Indian rupees in India new. We are so ripped off by the importers and id import my own bike for £600 to £750 for a bike under 200cc and build it up and register and pay transport dufy etc for cheap reliable simple bikes. I did 120 miles on a TVS single of 165cc in Rajastan with high mileage and it was well used but was very economical, did 50mph top whack and was amazing on fuel economy and simple. Thats great economical wheels in my opinion. Thats how it should be so the poorest, vulnerable, old etc have cheap easy to service cheap transport. And r people will be on that small cc bike! Well done TVS.
looks almost like after years and years of european and japanese brands producing middle and high end motorcycles in china with local companies, those same local companies set up "parallel models" loaded with extra and with lower price. voge are honda copycat, cf moto are ktm copycat, but for kmt that's not even a copy, it's the same motorcycle coming out of the production line with a different brand
Sanctioning Chinese brands that copy Harley-Davidson in America for making better quality than the original is the best way to save Harley-Davidson from bankruptcy. Anyway it is a solution.
Today's motorcycles are a collection of government regulations on 2 wheels. Vintage motorcycles are rebuidable forever. Parts availability is excellent. Modern motorcycles are built with planned obsoletion in mind. Modern motorcycles are not owner serviceable.
It's weird that there's not an overall view instead some American, N.American slant. Mexico has more motorcycles in use than America has had in last 5 years. Many of them Chinese. And Mexican manufacturers have done 2 things, copy what works and use formulas that say sometimes quality and reliability are not the only factors in the market. CF Moto is pushing really really hard, building a multi million dollar facility in Monterrey Mexico, Nuevo Leon, why? Because they make motorcycles using Austrian KTM motor copies w permission. Previous Mexican motorcycles were either straight Chinese or used Honda copy motors. So Chinese push to American market will come by backdoor loopholes in Mexico - US trading relationship. There is almost nothing new or good coming from China, just great copies of proven designs by someone else.. very very little innovation. And what is going to sink or swim Chinese motorcycles is dealer support, parts and stable supply chain, better warranty and resale and aftermarket. Building KTM knockoffs is smart because you can add a little to the aftermarket, but popularity of KTM and established parts supply chain may not doom Chinese motorcycles because they are actually not full Chinese pedigree, Chinese by way of Austria or Japan. Chinese bikes in Mexico and elsewhere are garbage, that said, you can buy a brand new motorcycle for less than $1300-2000 dollars and you work constantly repairing it into the overall cost and ownership experience. In the US nobody is buying a $7-15,000 dollar motorcycle that needs a day or two of maintenance and repair per month.
Chinese motorcycles are built for many years but sold especially in the Chinese market, quality is what you see in 20 or 30 year old motorcycles working 100%. If they were so poor quality why do we buy American and European Japanese motorcycles of which more than 50% are produced in China? Maybe because the quality exists but people prefer to pay more but have the same quality. When honda yamaha and toyota arrived on western markets they were japanese junk today they are war machines. The world champion engines in various FIM disciplines are 100% Chinese, but for the average human being, what comes from China is no good.
I have Kove 510x and im very very happy..the quality is no different from the Japanese, just like the workmanship. World-class components such as the Kayaba suspension (adjustable both front and rear), Nissin brakes, ABS and injection Bosh, a battle-tested engine, licensed by Honda... what more could you want? And the price is really decent
Man, you sound like the Canadian blogger " Fornine " , with an Eastern European accent. Please, chinese quality control in manufacturing plus the quality of their materials in engine components will never be like japanese bikes. They simply build in bulk end products and they dont use the " zen" mentality to achive excelence in what they build. Chinese are champions in reverse ingenering, they copy everything and never produce original well made products especially in mechanical vehicles and so forth
While the "zen" mentality was actually copied from China hundreds years ago haha. Japanese learned the whole culture, architecture, religion and art from China and now you're telling me Chinese never produce original🤪Then maybe stop using paper because it was invented by Chinese.
@axios9182 yes zen state of mind comes from buddism religion which in china they used to follow. In the past chinese did imvent lots of things but now they just copy everything, industrial espionage its the norm from chinese manufacturing and still they do bad job in the final products. Dont get me wrong I like chinese culture, specially food but I would never buy a chinese product with many mechanical parts.In The western world we assume for a real reason that chinese products are of low quality and japanese are of excelent quality which is reflected on the motorcycle industry
@@santiavila2005 I understand your feeling, it comes from your true experience about Chinese products. But I believe things will change and I'm positive about that. 🤝
My friend also have 1 chinese bike I don't know the nam of that bike but the company name is zondes something that's a 350 cc bike i think, that' bike looks great but it's built quality is poor but engine is good.
Also, Merry Christmas to everyone celebrating it! This is my last video of the year, and what a year has it been. Some of my favorite videos were shot, edited and published this year. And this is one of them actually. But then again, if your last video isn't better than your last, are you really improving as a film maker? Anyway, I'm jibber jabbering... Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, and see you soon with more, bigger and better videos! Cheers!
good insights, yet again our subjects cross paths, I have just sent you an email, have a great holiday
Bro please keep making videos. Unique takes, quality editing, and reliable information. You got the formula to be an incredible content creator
Thank you very much!
Great stuff. By the way did you know that the fortune cookie is NOT from China? It was invented by local Japanese Americans for a world fair held on Treasure Island in San Francisco Bay in 1939 and 1940, called the Golden Gate International Exhibition, and was such a hit the local restaurants started putting them out at the end of meals, with Confucius sayings being quite popular. CFMoto, or originally Zhejiang Chun Feng (the CF in CFMoto). Zhejiang is the name of the province (just west of Shanghai) and ChunFeng (Spring Wind) is located in Hangzhou, the capital of Zhejiang. I lived and worked there for several years just after they started their company I think in 1989. Beautiful place to visit ( I recommend fall for better weather).
I am 55 years old (don't know how that happened). My riding is the adventure, I try to escape civilization as much as I can, so I do lots of side roads, off road and such riding. For this type of riding, there are so few bikes out there, my current bike is the Honda Rally 300, it took about $3000 usd to get it to competent bike status. Still the occasional highway run is marginal.
Kove is awesome, the 450 too off road oriented, the 800 stunning but I don't want 100 HP.
The new CFmoto 450 MT is it right now. Wish it was 15 kg lighter...... But looking at the whole package, no one makes a bike like that.
Nice vid.
thank you!
I am so happy for Kove and really wish them all the best .
For decades customers were begging big name bike manufacturers to create lite dual sport / adventure bike - but got nothing in return. When Tenere came out heavy like elephant , and not only heavy - but top heavy - I got enough. Big name bike manufacturers selling a badge and robbing us with the price of spare parts for decades.... Oh yeah you could buy factory rally replicas costing 35 000 euros.....
I used to be loyal to Yamaha - but no more. She is still in the garage, but I am definitely placing order for Kove 450 .
Thanks for posting ...
You have been a fresh spirit into the motorcycle world. Very entertaining, very encouraging, very inspiring. Happy new year. Merry Christmas.
thank you! Happy new year!
Another great video...with interesting insights. Another Chinese off road/enduro company, GPX , are also now producing some decent bikes at a good price. We have a good dealer and spares network in the UK. The factory listen and fix issues quickly. Their 250 2 stroke even comes with 6 months warranty... faith in your own product is a good place to start.
That’s true, I’ve started seeing a couple of them here and there
GPX aren't a maker they're a rebrander of Koshine, Kove and so on ......... Think Lexmoto but more obnoxious
@@Kennon959 wrong ..they manufacture...and surprisingly close to older KTM...I wouldn't be surprised if KTM have a stake..most of their stuff is made in china anyway.
You have great knack for making informative videos, great camera, editing and storytelling. Keep it up.
Thank you!
"The destiny of glass is always to break".... Great vid, agreed. Merry Christmas Mr Krankit and co. :D
Happy holidays!
So far i am extremely impressed with my 2022 CFMOTO ZFORCE 800EX, Sport utility side by side. I will be purchasing a motorbike from CFMOTO next!
Hello sir. What about the logistics and parts availability? The main reason I never wanted a Chinese bike is the headache of never finding odd parts and being stuck with an unfixable motorcycle
I've rode a CF Moto MT 800 across china 7500 kilometers great bike no probs kept chain lubed and adjustments, but like with any brand if they dont have workshops local they dont come into consideration to buy
This is quite an interesting video. More than a decade ago when my kids were small, I picked a couple of Chinese bikes and they were indeed crude. Basic maintenance kept them working for several years but yes they were replaced with Japanese bikes as the kids grew. Fast forward to last spring and I was looking for a small dualsport to keep on the back of my RV as a runabout and light dualsport for exploring. I tried to purchase a Honda CRF300L at my local dealer as the price of $5,300 seemed reasonable, unfortunately the dealer was still adding their "covid pricing" and the out the door price was close to 9 grand after markups and taxes. This frustration led to me clicking "buy it now" on a small chinese dualsport for a ridiculous price. Well that bike has turned out to be far better than anticipated and has actually been used on a few "real" off road rides with my usual group and it has done quite well (yes you must still realize what you are working with, a simple inexpensive machine).
Thank you for the informative video.
I'm glad you enjoyed it!
They have also been pushing their bikes out to influencers who will gladly review (and promote) them. It's been a pretty aggressive marketing effort.
In China, bikes are a mode of transportation. In the West, it's a statis symbol.
I wouldn't call it a status symbol... But more of a hobby. A non-essential.
@@KRANKiT I always explaine to others that motorcycles should be first an utlitary vehicle and second as a hobby, that if you call yourself a motorcyclist.
Well done!
I grew up with the "made in Japan" is junk mentality all around me.
But the goofy little bikes made in Japan didn't leak oil, didn't require constant work to keep them running, and were so cheap to buy. That made it possible for almost all of us kids to be able to save up our lawn mowing money and actually buy a motorbike. And learn to ride and love riding as we lusted for the big but very expensive British bikes that were always out of our reach.
Bravo, frumoasă poveste și cinematografie. Din ce în ce mai bun, ține-o tot așa! Crăciun fericit!
Craciun Fericit!
Excellent video! You deserve more coverage!
Thank you!
Great vid, keep up the good work! Amazing content👍
Thank you!
Just a thought, I wonder if kove would be getting all this press had Honda released their 450 Rally concept?
Guess we’ll never know. That being said, it’s been some time since I last saw Honda try to pioneer a segment, to be so bold. Would I have liked to see a 450 Rally honda? Sure. But realistically I don’t think I had too much hope.
@@KRANKiT I'd say Kove will take 3 years to prove it's reliability reputation one way or the other. The Japanese could steal the press's attention back in that time with a similar release.
I've ridden all sorts of bikes in the past 14 years. Several of those have been Chinese motorcycles. They have come a long ways. Back about 14 years ago you were lucky to get one thousand miles out of a Chinese bike before you started having serious issues. Jump to 2016 or so and I got a Vader and it was a great bike. Now I have a hawk 250 as a fun around town and trail bike and I never worry about it breaking down and leaving me stranded.
Beside the subject, great quality video remind me the Fortnine style of shots and edits, ofcourse is a compliment
New sub and thanks for this awsome one!
subbed. production quality is really impressive.
after last years Dakar I got excited about the Kove450... its almost the unicorn bike we've been wanting from the big 4.. and then came the cfmoto 450... seemed to push ktm, royal enfeild and bmw to step up the small cc dual sport game...
You make good videos and speak very good sense
Nice year, go forward ! Happy holidays !!!
Happy holidays!
Nice one ! Can you please tell me what is the model of that yamaha in the beginning of the video? Thanks
Sure, it’s an SR250. There’s a video on the channel about it!
I love cfmoto quads. We have an 850xc and a 1000 driven for 7k kilometers and no problems
I live near Bydgoszcz, which used to be one of the biggest producers of small displacement bikes in the Warsaw Pact with the Romet factory. Now the factory is no more, but thanks to the Chinese, you can still buy brand new Romet bikes. My hometown is close to Minsk. Much like Bydgoszcz, Minsk motorcykles gave freedom to countless masses. The factory is no more, but there are brand new Minsk bikes out there. To quote a certain US president, "I make good buisiness with the Chinese, am I supposed to hate them?". Granted, the new bikes arent perfect, but... they do work, and when they stop working, they're not that hard to fix. True, the 'authorised' spare parts may be hard to get, alas the bikes themselves are not designed to only need 'authorised' spare parts.
In case you use the new calendar in your place, happy Nativity!
Most of them are copies. That the truth, that no body said.
The moto morini is just a versys copy.
The multiple kopies of the cb 500x.
Kove 800x is just a cb500x with ktm 790 engine, with good suspensions.
This is the main different between china and japan.
All of that copies are just stolen.
kawasaki paid bsa.
I think that we need to be more vocal about the way they are making business...
I've had 5 bikes so far, 3 benellis, one yamaha and one suzuki. Believe or not, the most thrashed around were the benellis, specially my current leoncino trail offroad, 20k kms and the only problem was a leaking water pump gasket, waited 2 days for that part, on the 3rd day the dealer was installing it! In portugal (at least at my dealer), everything is almost as quick as my yamaha. Also benelli was the best seller in europe last year and despite the fact that their owners are chinese, the original engineers and designers still remain, the production, however was moved to china. If you visit Pesaro or are able to talk to some benelli personnel, they'll tell you so. As will QJ motor, benelli's owners.
Great to see china fighting top brands, maybe now they'll get down their high horse 😁
Very nive vid, love the fog sceens. Very creative and informative.
Chinese bikes will have to become BETTER then other manufacturers for a majority of people to overlook the downsides.
Chinese bikes might have reached a competitive level, but i cant comprehend a reason youd choose a chinese bike over other manufacturers.
They have lower resale value, a bad image, and still unproven longterm reliability. Not to mention one day, if we are at war with china which is very possible, parts may become impossible to get.
ive had a zontes 310r new since 2019......... bikes brilliant......... infrastructure......... months to get parts!
That’s rough
In the city where I come from motorcycles are banned in total which is un-constitutional if Chinese constitution matters. I need to immigrate to Europe to ride one of the 'made in China' assuming if I still want one. Chinese problems are never anything other than political. But still I appreciate your recognition of Chinese manufacture.
In Nigeria there are a lot of chinese motorcycles of different kinds. Qlink, Denstar, jingcheng, solink, lingfan.
These bikes can run in terrains u have never imagined and they can carry nearly 200kg of material across long distances
In Kenya you have dual sports with good reviews like Tekken and vogue 200 and 250cc. The ones in Nigeria are Naked bikes, bikes that look like cruisers and scramblers in one. 200cc brand new less than $1000 Dollars. The dual sport in Kenya are about $3000. Fitted wit everything u need on a modern Enduro bike. No need for aftermarket upgrade
Not to long ago, in the USA, Japanese were the cheap option. That said, I can tell the casting difference just by looking at the engine. Not willing to spend my money on them....yet.
This RUclips channel is great. 👌
Thank you!
very well written script, great editing. Keep it up.
Great video! I have a Hawk 250 with almost 16,000 miles on it. It’s been virtually bulletproof, but I did do quite a bit to make it super reliable. I also have 4 other Chinese machines, and only one of them has given me quite a bit of problems (an early 2000s ATV). The rest…bulletproof so far.
Excellent video! I didn't know about the 13 year law. Cheers from the Philippines
Cheers!
Fun fact is that Zhang Xue had already left the Kove company for unknown reasons(overly putting resources on development without assessing the market might be the one), and he is starting his new business, Zhang Xue Motorcycle now. Who knows.
I got to your videos and found them very interesting.but I don’t know why this particular video has less views?
I’d say it’s not bad for the size of my channel. Who knows
Nowadays almost every big store in western Europe beside selling "european" or japanase brands , is selling also some chinese brands in disguise. Be that Benelli, Zontes , CFMoto etc. And they also sell a lot of chinese scooters aswell. If you look at the quality of CFMoto there is actually no point in buying other brands for certain type of bikes. And I m a KTM owner. More so, the chinese companies attacked this year already the small adv market with bikes around 450cc capacity. Lots of ppl want less expensive, smaller, less powerfull adv bikes and the big names never listened to them. Your videos are very nice, the storyteller style suits this industry perfect as there is so much to tell. Salutari din Bruxelles si Craciun fericit! 🥳
Thanks! Crăciun fericit :)
Wanna make a video talking about the lack of quality on ktm bikes? exc 300 deciding that don't want to be we us anymore after 5 hours? cylinders made by kymco failing in 20 hours or less?
Beta bearing fisco with the skf china?
KTM is turning into most unreliable bike on the market.
13年强制报废，大部分城市禁摩，大部分高速不允许摩托上路。还有像北京这种，如果想骑摩托进城里面，一块车牌大几十万人民币，否则你只能在市郊骑行。
There are many obstacles to the development of motorcycles in China, not only the technical catch-up, but the compulsory scrapping you mentioned does have a great impact, but more importantly, there are 800+cities in China, of which 250+cities prohibit any motorcycle driving, and the number is increasing gradually. One of them is called "Shenzhen", and I hope motorcyclists all over the world will remember that as long as you drive a motorcycle in this place, you will be fined 2,000 yuan, about 300 dollars, and your motorcycle will be detained. Of course, don't take any chances. There are many cameras in China, as you should know. And "Shanghai" is a place where motorcycles want to drive legally on the road, they have to pay 600,000 yuan to buy a license plate first. Yes, a license plate costs 600,000 yuan, about 9 w $
In this regard, China's cyclists and motorcycle manufacturers can't do anything about it. We can only confront the government in court again and again, but how can we win? The government has suppressed its manufacturing industry, which I think is ridiculous.
Therefore, the motorcycle industry in China can develop gradually, which has nothing to do with the government. At the darkest moment, the motorcycle manufacturers in China didn't fall down because of the support of cyclists in China. Therefore, there is absolutely no need to be biased because of political factors. The government is the government and the manufacturer is the manufacturer. Motorcycle drivers and motorcycle manufacturers in China do not like the government and do not support their ideas.
brilliant video!
Thank you!
In Thailand, Honda rules capturing more than 70% market share. However, for cheap tricycles which used to sport old Honda engines are now equipped with Lifan engine from China. Lifan engine is indestructible as it is a clone of Honda engine from the 80s, simple maintenace just needing oil change periodically and it would run forever, similar to Honda original.
Cool new program, cool new presenter. 👍🏻
Now you just have to try one :D Voge or Kove :)
Wouldn’t mind it :)
Exactly
I don't give a F#$k nobody should buy from our enemy !!!
Voge DS900X is a fully specced BMW F900 gs for just 9500€!
Hi. Just came across your videos. Wow very interesting and top quality too. i am hooked.
Thanks!
Excellent video
Thanks!
Nice video! And you do have a point, I myself believe that CF Moto is on the rise as japanese brands were back then. As a German, I love that there will be more affordable motorcycles innthe future, BUT there is just one problem, that might not apply to everyone. The politics. As many already pointed out lol. I myself.....I can't stand it. The new CF Moto 450 MT is a awesome bike, but I will probably not buy it. I gave my money to the Indians instead and bought myself a Royal Enfield Himalayan.
Yep, I agree, that’s why I acknowledged it. I don’t want to go deep into it since this channel is about bikes, not about politics, but it will be a factor for many people.
@@KRANKiT Absolutely legitimate. Opening up a discussion about politics is like opening the gate to hell these days. Stick to your awesome bike content. Keep it up, your videos are awesome!
F9 vibes in your presentation style and editing. 😌
Its sad the media has slagged off China. The history, culgure and expertise in China is great as is the culture. I grew interested studying Wing Chun kung Fu, thdir food and history, mentality and culture is vefy much misunderstood. They deserve 5:25 equality and respect
HONDA the best
Good quality video. Reminds me of fortnine
That's a huge compliment! Thank you!
Nice one! The only one point I disagree is that at the beginning of Japanese motorcycle making, these machines where unreliable. I don´t think so. At least not more un-/relieable than the others. Reason: When a Japanese mechanic/company plans something, they undergo very thorough studies and the outcome may not be sexier but certainly the same or even more reliable from the start onwards. Another reason is, that the mechanical level in Japan was quite high, not only "recently". Whatever materials the Japanese are working on, be it wood, metal, glas, name it - the outcome usually is stunning. Think of ancient katana swords, think of silk kimonos, think about ancient wooden constuctions and how these things where all made. Quality at its very best. Regarding China, I agree, they are NOT dumb and they have a huge army of intelligent engineers who learn fast. And they are still HUNGRY for success. And yes, KOVE really sticks out, because the main guy (sorry, don´t recall his name) is a real bike/race enthusiast! The driving force behind all this and authentic one, too. He is one of us! Not European or American or Westerner - he is a rider and nationality doesn´t count in this case. Sad enough, that he "disappeared". Apparently was too successful, too Western for the taste of the Chinese government. Hope, he´s still alive and I hope he´ll pop up somehwere, where he can pursue his dreams.
Id rather see more chinese bikes or any other brands rather then seeing the bike content of the usual brands. They're so boring. I wanna see new stuff and at the moment Chinese brands seems exciting 🔥 We do need more proper supermotos though. Wish Zontes/CFmoto would make one soon..
The only way they will sway me.
I have a Zontes
I have a zontes too, the GK350 is 🔥 I just wish in the near future that zontes or CFmoto makes a supermoto that looks like the DRZ / Sherco / KTMs / Husqvarna.
Good video. Most of what you say is very true 👍 🇬🇧
Thanks!
Ktm gave it to them instead of making it themselves 😅
The fact that all the videos about Chinese motorcycles refuse to speak about the political side of the story is almost frightening. You just cannot speak about a topic like this without acknowledging the politics.
Bro I’m American and I hate my own government right now. Would you not buy a Harley because you don’t agree with the president? You gotta separate the people from the government.
@@channel-q2m nah man, that's different. The Chinese government regularily owns parts of these big companies and also subsidizes them to be able to undercut the market. That way one does directly fund the Chinese government by buying chinese bikes. A government that is the Chinese Communist Party, that is a dictatorship and is basically friends with russia. A government that is widely known to disregard human and civil rights.
On top of all that, China doesn't care about intellectual property. This leads to brands like Kove illegally copying motors from KTM (in case of their 800 models), Honda (for the 500 models) and Yamaha (300 models). Other Chinese manufacturers do the same to varying degrees.
In short, and I can only speak for myself, the politics aspect of it is really big and complex. I know a lot of facts about motorcycles, but I don't know as much about politics. And I try not to talk publicly about things I am not sure of. And to be fair, addressing that would take ages. And even at that point, it would be subjective.
Why would it be frightening? It's different topics. This politics aspect that you mention can genuinely be applied to anything that comes from China. From any phone we've ever used, any computer, almost anything. Heck, Honda has some parts built in China. Should I start every Honda video from now on with a 30 minute monologue about politics? I don't think so.
At the end of the day, conspiracy theory aside, I'm not addressing China or the CCP because this is not the place for it. This channel is about motorcycles. About the products. About where they are sold, who invented them, and so on. That's it. Not everything has to be about politics. And this isn't. And it will never be.
Also, one more thing I do want to add, I did mention in the video that there will be questions about ethics, about trust, and all those things... And as I said, those questions are not black and white. As much as we want to say it is, it's not. It never is.
@@KRANKiT Hey man, I appreciate the detailed answer. I do absolutely understand your reasoning for not bringing it up in your video, however, with parts of it I respectfully disagree. Yes, politics are very complex and not many people know a lot about it. But politics are just part of our daily life and very important to our society. Politics is just inherently connected to most topics, some more, some less. But I think people being unaware is exactly the issue. I see part of the responsibility here with content creators. It doesn't need to be a 30 minute perfectly researched documentary about the CCP and its inner workings. But in my opinion, in a video explicitly about chinese motorcycles, people should be made aware that they are, when buying those motorcycles, directly supporting a government that abuses human rights and funds a war aggressor. That's something that can be said in one sentence and without any subjectivity. If people then decide to not care about that, that's fine, but I think it's better then them not even knowing about it and just being hyped.
You mention that the politics aspect can be applied to anything that comes from China. I agree and I actually think it should. I personally always consider where something comes from. However, I do also realise, that it's not possible to not by anything from there. Like you mention, even established european and japanese manufacturers get parts from China. But at least most of the customers money doesn't end up there in that case.
On another note, (btw, I'm unsure, why you mention conspiracy theories haha) I think an interesting topic to explore is that of the Chinese motors. That's something very much about motorcycles and who invented them. Let's take the motor of the Kove 800X for example. Obviously KTM developed that motor, it's their 790 motor. But did Kove also develop it because they changed some stuff about it? Also they seem to have done it without KTMs approval?! But will it have the same quality as the original KTM unit? As an engineer I say: probably not, because they don't have the KTM quality control. But how can they do that? Probably because non-existant IP laws in China. Will they get sued when they try to sell it outside of China?
All that is basically politics, even tho it's directly about a motor.
Also now I'm kinda motivated to do some research and stuff. Maybe call the guys in Mattighofen and ask them about what they think of people stealing their motor designs. Or maybe they aren't actually stolen, but licensed.
Maybe you'd like to co-write a script with me for your channel, that goes a bit deeper into the politics of the chinese bikes and how these motors come to exist.
If not, that's fine too, it's your channel after all and if you don't want to do anything political than that's absolutely fine.
I'm sorry, this got into quite the rant towards the end. Regards.
The Kove La CF de Voge they are real indeinnoCre of C.N and Globle 🎉🎉🎉❤❤❤👍
I love my CLX 700
Fortune cookies are an American invention btw.
Look at TVS, Rajdoot, Enfield, Hero Honda, jawa and Bajaj all made in india and some 165cc single cylinder motos cost Rs 50000 or £600 new in India but exported the price is more than double so a £3000 enfield bullet in the uk costs less than £2k or 1.5 lakh or 150000Indian rupees in India new. We are so ripped off by the importers and id import my own bike for £600 to £750 for a bike under 200cc and build it up and register and pay transport dufy etc for cheap reliable simple bikes. I did 120 miles on a TVS single of 165cc in Rajastan with high mileage and it was well used but was very economical, did 50mph top whack and was amazing on fuel economy and simple. Thats great economical wheels in my opinion. Thats how it should be so the poorest, vulnerable, old etc have cheap easy to service cheap transport. And r people will be on that small cc bike! Well done TVS.
❤
looks almost like after years and years of european and japanese brands producing middle and high end motorcycles in china with local companies, those same local companies set up "parallel models" loaded with extra and with lower price.
voge are honda copycat, cf moto are ktm copycat, but for kmt that's not even a copy, it's the same motorcycle coming out of the production line with a different brand
Fortune cookies are an American invention. 😂
I know, but nobody thinks of "Hell Yeah Texas" when they hear fortune cookies :))
Sanctioning Chinese brands that copy Harley-Davidson in America for making better quality than the original is the best way to save Harley-Davidson from bankruptcy.
Anyway it is a solution.
excellent!
sad but true, people are getting poor, bikes,cars got expensive. cheaper bikes will dominate. And indeed they get better
Today's motorcycles are a collection of government regulations on 2 wheels. Vintage motorcycles are rebuidable forever. Parts availability is excellent. Modern motorcycles are built with planned obsoletion in mind. Modern motorcycles are not owner serviceable.
That was a waste of 11 min. of my life. How about putting some effort and facts in your video?
any way to get some of those millions of bikes for next to nothing, before they get obliterated ? they might be "stolen" the day before
It's weird that there's not an overall view instead some American, N.American slant. Mexico has more motorcycles in use than America has had in last 5 years. Many of them Chinese. And Mexican manufacturers have done 2 things, copy what works and use formulas that say sometimes quality and reliability are not the only factors in the market. CF Moto is pushing really really hard, building a multi million dollar facility in Monterrey Mexico, Nuevo Leon, why? Because they make motorcycles using Austrian KTM motor copies w permission. Previous Mexican motorcycles were either straight Chinese or used Honda copy motors. So Chinese push to American market will come by backdoor loopholes in Mexico - US trading relationship. There is almost nothing new or good coming from China, just great copies of proven designs by someone else.. very very little innovation. And what is going to sink or swim Chinese motorcycles is dealer support, parts and stable supply chain, better warranty and resale and aftermarket. Building KTM knockoffs is smart because you can add a little to the aftermarket, but popularity of KTM and established parts supply chain may not doom Chinese motorcycles because they are actually not full Chinese pedigree, Chinese by way of Austria or Japan. Chinese bikes in Mexico and elsewhere are garbage, that said, you can buy a brand new motorcycle for less than $1300-2000 dollars and you work constantly repairing it into the overall cost and ownership experience. In the US nobody is buying a $7-15,000 dollar motorcycle that needs a day or two of maintenance and repair per month.
Chinese motorcycles are built for many years but sold especially in the Chinese market, quality is what you see in 20 or 30 year old motorcycles working 100%. If they were so poor quality why do we buy American and European Japanese motorcycles of which more than 50% are produced in China? Maybe because the quality exists but people prefer to pay more but have the same quality.
When honda yamaha and toyota arrived on western markets they were japanese junk today they are war machines.
The world champion engines in various FIM disciplines are 100% Chinese, but for the average human being, what comes from China is no good.
I have Kove 510x and im very very happy..the quality is no different from the Japanese, just like the workmanship. World-class components such as the Kayaba suspension (adjustable both front and rear), Nissin brakes, ABS and injection Bosh, a battle-tested engine, licensed by Honda... what more could you want? And the price is really decent
It’s Asia’s era again tbh
Ironically, fortune cookies aren’t Chinese.
Stay awake from Chinese automotive products. They aren't worth the time.
Try motor bikes made in India
More BS than info
They still suck. I wouldn't buy them.
Chinese cotarga, still cotargă
Some cotarga is better than other cotarga :))
I will never buy a chi na ese brand bike.
world is really broke that one has to go for cheaply made Chinese moto
If you love motorcycles……..and you hate Chinese motorcycles…….look in the mirror……..and you will see a hypocrite.
Man, you sound like the Canadian blogger " Fornine " , with an Eastern European accent.
Please, chinese quality control in manufacturing plus the quality of their materials in engine components will never be like japanese bikes. They simply build in bulk end products and they dont use the " zen" mentality to achive excelence in what they build. Chinese are champions in reverse ingenering, they copy everything and never produce original well made products especially in mechanical vehicles and so forth
While the "zen" mentality was actually copied from China hundreds years ago haha. Japanese learned the whole culture, architecture, religion and art from China and now you're telling me Chinese never produce original🤪Then maybe stop using paper because it was invented by Chinese.
@axios9182 yes zen state of mind comes from buddism religion which in china they used to follow. In the past chinese did imvent lots of things but now they just copy everything, industrial espionage its the norm from chinese manufacturing and still they do bad job in the final products. Dont get me wrong I like chinese culture, specially food but I would never buy a chinese product with many mechanical parts.In The western world we assume for a real reason that chinese products are of low quality and japanese are of excelent quality which is reflected on the motorcycle industry
@@santiavila2005 I understand your feeling, it comes from your true experience about Chinese products. But I believe things will change and I'm positive about that. 🤝
lol
My friend also have 1 chinese bike I don't know the nam of that bike but the company name is zondes something that's a 350 cc bike i think, that' bike looks great but it's built quality is poor but engine is good.
Dude ur a hater in a political way don lie we can read u the Chinese are goin up accept the facts