A wise man once said hindsight is 20/20. EJ's experience is growing, even his commentary has grown, it's fun to watch and listen. Good call jumping out, no need to keep pushing through when you are feeling sketched out.
Jeff hit the nail on the head with keeping the momentum on a course like this. I am also a bigger rider and with more weight comes more momentum. The extra momentum actually gives a small advantage into the start of a short hill if you hit it at speed and you can even recover some on the down hill sections. There are ways to take a corner and keep your momentum as well even if you are not at the front by letting a little space open up leading into it and then closing it as you come through. Keep at it EJ and eventually you could be winning races like this.
The crit itself is hosted by the UC-Berkeley Cycling Club. The weekend is the last collegiate race weekend of the calendar. Low-level collegiate is its own category but ever since COVID the As and Bs are too small to have their own fields so we combine 'em with the opens, placed separately.
Too bad collegiate fields are so small these days. Back when I did California collegiate racing the fields had heaps of dudes, all categories; ABCD. Times have changed. -grandpa
I’m a collegiate racer for Stanford, though I wasn’t racing for Stanford here. This is the last road race on the collegiate calendar, and you need 3 collegiate A races to be eligible for nationals, though your result in those races doesn’t matter. A lot of collegiate A riders are cat 1 or 2, including our rider in this race, which might explain why they’re racing this course harder.
Kudos for keeping up the fight as long as you did. All you can do is keep trying and learning. If we were born perfect there'd be no such thing as "learning". So many people seem to either be perfect (right) or they simply don't remember what it was like to learn how to race and how different watching a well-produced RUclips product it from actually being in the heat of a race.
Hey EJ and Jeff, I don't want to seem like I'm dispensing any shit, but have you guys practiced some bumping/cornering drills on a big grassy field? I remember that being one of the things that really turned around my anxious mind as a new racer - practicing shoulder bumps, bar bumps, hip bumps, touching wheels/recovering from an overlapped wheel. Heck, I've even gone so far as to practice pedal striking - that might help with some of the reluctance to pedal through corners...
Maybe you could try going back to include races/rides that do not involve EJ? Just for a change? How about rounding out the coverage with some master’s?
But on the bright side, you gotz to meet me(Dallas), hope to see you at Tulsa tough. oh you thought that hill was tough at 170....I am sitting at a lean 190+....that equal lots o Ouch on that course. Great meeting you EJ. NSDQ!
Crash Anaysis Tip - pause video, press "?" on keyboard. See how to step fwd/back a single frame at a time. (works in chrome -- not in youtube app on ipad/iphone. other devices - unknown.)
He really needs to look and work on his cornering. The poor cornering @5:58 results in a dump of 1000w a few seconds later, but the real problem is that by @6:14 he's still going downhill and everyone is approaching another turn. How an efficient rider would do this is leave more space, let those riders power hard to the next turn and you can even give up a few spots. Then you're not jamming it into the next corner and you're keeping more speed than everyone else, emerging in the draft with minimal watts used. This isn't about feeling fresh, coming back with fitness, it's simply not having enough experience yet to know how to manage this course efficiently.
EJ definitely has the power but needs to work on cornering and technical skills. Would love to see EJ learning some MTB skills from Ryan and applying it to his racing.
I wish this had been intentionally brought up in this video. This is the message that beginner roadies need to hear, particularly strong, young roadies who cat up to elite races easily.
100% this. MTBing teaches you that the bike is so much more capable than the rider. Sometimes the safest way through a corner (or over an obstacle) is to relax the body and trust the bike. Sometimes it's okay to be a passenger. After the obstacle you'll have a chance to recover control a little more...or find you truly over-cooked it and say hello to a tree.
Berkeley & Cherry Pie crits - both very technical courses, one EJ does well & one he doesn't - the difference shows that EJ is not comfortable with his bike handling skills at speed rubbing elbows with others
!! Look at the Jakroo rider's front brake lever @4:11 is FULLLY MAXd out (the black/green Bianchi). Bad safety crutch? Worn out? Forgot to close the quick release?
If you are bigger you go faster downhill. Watts per kilo is everything, second bike handling, third follow wheels closely if you want that 30% less effort, and lastly as a big guy, you would if possible pick a bigger guy to draft off.
Fitness with low riding technical skills is a dangerous combination for all…a negative off Zwift and other indoor cycling platforms…do 50 days of aggressive group rides before you do your first race
If this was not an A race for you just ride the front as long as you can working on your fitness and Cornering and towards the end of the race if you are still there try your luck
EJJJJJJJJJAY, First: Never quit, but take it as a learning oportunity. Second: Work on cornering both technical and confidence. As Pete Morris said: You know you are on the limit when your tires sounds like velcro opening through the corners;-)
You can do some quick math here. It sounds like EJ is an 80Kg rider and we'll say there's about 10Kg more for bike and other equiptment. That would mean the lighter rider would need to do 70/90 = 78% the power to have the same W/Kg. So in the worst case, say a standing start on a hill, there is a 222W difference between EJ and a 60Kg rider when EJ is doing 1000W. EJ would have to be doing 1800W for there to be a 400W difference.
@@willgd6666 That is correct on flat ground, the basic f=ma equation. Also need to apply gravity since they are going uphill. Physics was too long ago for me to remember that equation plus I don’t know the gradient of the hill. Need horizontal and vertical acceleration.
@@SnappyWasHere The better way to think about this one is with energy. For acceleration, you look at kinetic energy (1/2 mv^2) and for climbing rate, potential energy (mgh). Both of them inclue the "m" for mass once, so to end with the same velocity and change in altitude everyone would have to do work (power * time) proportional to their mass. This is why W/Kg is a useful metric.
Jeff confuses climblers thinking all are light riders,. you know Pinot? or caleb evans, or cavendish? seriously dude don't ever compare yourself to Latern /rouge
Man, you are so analog, your power is either on and over 700w, or 0w. You should be more digital and learn to control and stay around your threshold if possible. That is such an important factor to save energy for bigger riders like you for the last sprint. You are a power house, save the juice for the final..
A wise man once said hindsight is 20/20. EJ's experience is growing, even his commentary has grown, it's fun to watch and listen. Good call jumping out, no need to keep pushing through when you are feeling sketched out.
No shame in stopping. Better to be safe than to take that risk. 👊👏
Jeff hit the nail on the head with keeping the momentum on a course like this. I am also a bigger rider and with more weight comes more momentum. The extra momentum actually gives a small advantage into the start of a short hill if you hit it at speed and you can even recover some on the down hill sections. There are ways to take a corner and keep your momentum as well even if you are not at the front by letting a little space open up leading into it and then closing it as you come through. Keep at it EJ and eventually you could be winning races like this.
The crit itself is hosted by the UC-Berkeley Cycling Club. The weekend is the last collegiate race weekend of the calendar. Low-level collegiate is its own category but ever since COVID the As and Bs are too small to have their own fields so we combine 'em with the opens, placed separately.
Too bad collegiate fields are so small these days. Back when I did California collegiate racing the fields had heaps of dudes, all categories; ABCD. Times have changed. -grandpa
I’m a collegiate racer for Stanford, though I wasn’t racing for Stanford here. This is the last road race on the collegiate calendar, and you need 3 collegiate A races to be eligible for nationals, though your result in those races doesn’t matter. A lot of collegiate A riders are cat 1 or 2, including our rider in this race, which might explain why they’re racing this course harder.
Kudos for keeping up the fight as long as you did. All you can do is keep trying and learning. If we were born perfect there'd be no such thing as "learning". So many people seem to either be perfect (right) or they simply don't remember what it was like to learn how to race and how different watching a well-produced RUclips product it from actually being in the heat of a race.
Hey EJ and Jeff, I don't want to seem like I'm dispensing any shit, but have you guys practiced some bumping/cornering drills on a big grassy field?
I remember that being one of the things that really turned around my anxious mind as a new racer - practicing shoulder bumps, bar bumps, hip bumps, touching wheels/recovering from an overlapped wheel. Heck, I've even gone so far as to practice pedal striking - that might help with some of the reluctance to pedal through corners...
Maybe you could try going back to include races/rides that do not involve EJ? Just for a change? How about rounding out the coverage with some master’s?
But on the bright side, you gotz to meet me(Dallas), hope to see you at Tulsa tough. oh you thought that hill was tough at 170....I am sitting at a lean 190+....that equal lots o Ouch on that course. Great meeting you EJ. NSDQ!
Awwww yeah, it wouldn't be a good movie without the low arc!! Looking forward to the fightback arc! Go EJ!
Thanks for the tips guys! Us heavier guys have to stay near the front to have every opportunity to carry speed through corners.
Crash Anaysis Tip - pause video, press "?" on keyboard. See how to step fwd/back a single frame at a time. (works in chrome -- not in youtube app on ipad/iphone. other devices - unknown.)
Love'd the intro Music! Hype hype hype! Preserving speed is everything.
Can never expect race performance to be great every time, it’s just one of those days, you’ll do better next time
He really needs to look and work on his cornering. The poor cornering @5:58 results in a dump of 1000w a few seconds later, but the real problem is that by @6:14 he's still going downhill and everyone is approaching another turn. How an efficient rider would do this is leave more space, let those riders power hard to the next turn and you can even give up a few spots. Then you're not jamming it into the next corner and you're keeping more speed than everyone else, emerging in the draft with minimal watts used. This isn't about feeling fresh, coming back with fitness, it's simply not having enough experience yet to know how to manage this course efficiently.
EJ definitely has the power but needs to work on cornering and technical skills. Would love to see EJ learning some MTB skills from Ryan and applying it to his racing.
He should probably learn road bike handling skills specifically... Keep working EJ you'll get it
I wish this had been intentionally brought up in this video. This is the message that beginner roadies need to hear, particularly strong, young roadies who cat up to elite races easily.
100% this. MTBing teaches you that the bike is so much more capable than the rider. Sometimes the safest way through a corner (or over an obstacle) is to relax the body and trust the bike. Sometimes it's okay to be a passenger. After the obstacle you'll have a chance to recover control a little more...or find you truly over-cooked it and say hello to a tree.
Berkeley & Cherry Pie crits - both very technical courses, one EJ does well & one he doesn't - the difference shows that EJ is not comfortable with his bike handling skills at speed rubbing elbows with others
Good too see a San Jose State rider in the mix. Miss those collegiate races in the bay area. My favorite was old Fort. or is it old ford.
Yeah it's a collegiate race, along with Berkeley RR, hosted by CalCycling.
It's open to other categories for extra $ to the club.
get ej a fixie will stop his coasting
1:15 What’s questionable about this? Holding an outside line and preserving speed to overtake seems totally reasonable.
not that guy, look further up the road, there's a near crash
@@NorCalCycling Ahhh yes...white helmet in the center. Thanks for clarification!
!! Look at the Jakroo rider's front brake lever @4:11 is FULLLY MAXd out (the black/green Bianchi). Bad safety crutch? Worn out? Forgot to close the quick release?
Naysayers saying never quit-Ya crazy. Do what you want-have fun be safe lmao.
If you are bigger you go faster downhill. Watts per kilo is everything, second bike handling, third follow wheels closely if you want that 30% less effort, and lastly as a big guy, you would if possible pick a bigger guy to draft off.
Fitness with low riding technical skills is a dangerous combination for all…a negative off Zwift and other indoor cycling platforms…do 50 days of aggressive group rides before you do your first race
I think the feeling of pulling the plug and quitting is worse than most crashes. Having done both
I think EJ should try in a hard race like this to get tunnel vision to one good rider. Follow that wheel and don’t give it up.
That second channel can’t be put up on “the channel link”? Because I’ve looked for it there but didn’t know y’all were still running that one.
If this was not an A race for you just ride the front as long as you can working on your fitness and Cornering and towards the end of the race if you are still there try your luck
EJJJJJJJJJAY, First: Never quit, but take it as a learning oportunity. Second: Work on cornering both technical and confidence. As Pete Morris said: You know you are on the limit when your tires sounds like velcro opening through the corners;-)
Always listen when Thor speaks
3:07 Is there a massive hole in his shirt?
Yes
Would tail gunning be another strategy on this course for EJ?
it would be easier, but it's way too big a risk to get caught behind splits on a tough course like this.
@@NorCalCycling that makes sense. Cheers!
I bet 20kg up that hill is closer to 400w difference because of gravity plus acceleration. Weight is a massive advantage.
You can do some quick math here. It sounds like EJ is an 80Kg rider and we'll say there's about 10Kg more for bike and other equiptment. That would mean the lighter rider would need to do 70/90 = 78% the power to have the same W/Kg. So in the worst case, say a standing start on a hill, there is a 222W difference between EJ and a 60Kg rider when EJ is doing 1000W. EJ would have to be doing 1800W for there to be a 400W difference.
@@willgd6666 That is correct on flat ground, the basic f=ma equation. Also need to apply gravity since they are going uphill. Physics was too long ago for me to remember that equation plus I don’t know the gradient of the hill. Need horizontal and vertical acceleration.
@@SnappyWasHere The better way to think about this one is with energy. For acceleration, you look at kinetic energy (1/2 mv^2) and for climbing rate, potential energy (mgh). Both of them inclue the "m" for mass once, so to end with the same velocity and change in altitude everyone would have to do work (power * time) proportional to their mass. This is why W/Kg is a useful metric.
Yet the winner from Red Peloton is not a small rider & had no issues at his height/weight
@@willgd6666 Correct. So add the acceleration and climbing together would be more than your 222w stated. I’m closer to right than you think.
EJ is still the goat
So weird going to text the homie Antonio but opening RUclips instead and the first thing I see is him in the video lol
Just take a pre race shot of whiskey for the nerves 🫡
The bad pavement in that corner is what makes this a legendary course ngl
170 lbs is a big rider? bruh. EJ how tall are you?
Jeff saying ligher riders go faster dowhill is not only cycling ignorance is basic physics ignorance. Stop making the ridicule man
“Elite 3’s” lol
EJ, please stop saying 'its the beginning of the end' at the start of the video. Makes the content less exciting
"elite 3s" lol
Jeff confuses climblers thinking all are light riders,. you know Pinot? or caleb evans, or cavendish? seriously dude don't ever compare yourself to Latern /rouge
Man, you are so analog, your power is either on and over 700w, or 0w. You should be more digital and learn to control and stay around your threshold if possible. That is such an important factor to save energy for bigger riders like you for the last sprint. You are a power house, save the juice for the final..
EJ "What would've been a good strategy for me to execute in order to maximize my strength on this course"....Who cares you don't listen 😆🤣
He quitted??????? REALLY?????????????? Quiteeeeeeeeeerrrrr! This is a looser mentality!!!!!!