Also the character development in "Can you hear me?". Overall though, Ryan and Graham got pretty much all the character development in Season 11. I'm perfectly happy for Season 12 to focus more on The Doctor and Yaz...
So uh... how did Clara not see the doctors past when she JUMPED into his TIMESTREAM. there would have been a awkward conversation like Clara: so how come you didn’t tell me about your hundreds of forms? Doctor: im sorry what? Clara? Don’t pretend Doctor: what did I look like Clara: a black woman... Doctor: what the fu...
To be fair, Clara jumping into the Doctor's timeline was a really dumb idea in the first place and I'm glad the show forgot about it like a couple episodes later.
I couldn't stop laughing, they were ridiculous! Granted, yes, a Gallifreyan Cyberman should look like that, but those collars and the cap! And when I stopped laughing for the outfit, I noticed they're even grumpy like they're saying "look how they dressed me!" and started again
To return to the quote that Harry said back in his review of "The Woman Who Fell To Earth" "We can now breathe fresh air, reassured by what we just witnessed and all is well in the world of Who" Well, that certainly didn't age well.
Also that episode was total shit (the entire conflict was literally solved at the start of the episode off screen with the sonic, WITHOUT telling the audience), so I really don’t know where Harry was coming from back then...
@@El_Descarriado That's not how Plutronic energy works. That only toasts sandwiches. Matt Smith used it all the time, remember. It's not very useful stuff.
@@TheSmart-CasualGamer It works, how I say it works you little worm. Who do you think you're talking to!? I AM CHRIS CHINBALLS. I OWN WHO. I OWN EVERYTHING.
How are we supposed to believe The Master singlehandedly destroyed Gallifrey and wiped out all the Timelords? *Thanks Chibs* for the explanation! And Graham telling Yaz she's the best human he knows was so unearned and cringe - these two have barely had an on-screen relationship up until this point… *thanks Chibs* for the excellent writing!
The writing was poor and full of holes and Red Herrings. Chibs the idiot could not even convincingly retcon the show! Having the same cliff used in three scenes made it just visions created by the Master. Clearly the canon is maintained and Hartnell is still the first, the original Doctor and the Jo Dr is an illusion.
Ever since The Master claimed responsibility for the destruction of Gallifrey, I have been waiting for the episode that proves this to be a lie! Sadly, Chibnall has neither the skill nor the ability to provide a decent script that would truly explain Gallifrey's downfall!
You've gotta love how The Doctor was originally every ethnicity (and gender) under the sun for however many years before being *thirteen white males in a row* ... doesn't feel forced at all.
There is no logic behind it. I may be thinking to much into this. But the reason we (as humans) have races in the first place is because of evolution. Perhaps if there were environmental factors which determined the race of a regeneration in which that race had an advantage over another race, then fine... go for it. But for them to just be sat in a chair being killed on repeat just so the Woke Identitarians can sit there and pleasure theirselves over the "diversity" of the scene is plain retarded.
@@frogradar plus also contradicts and fucks up the classic series as it's made very clear there is no gender swapping (the toxic NuWho trait) as in classic Who it's clearly defined roles - TimeLords and TimeLadies - so yeah.....Im not adding the Fan fiction Virgin books as I never read them as a child. lol
@The Crimson Queen Think you didn't quite catch what I was trying to say... let us hope the woke-agenda that Chibs enforces upon this show gets stamped out quickly.
So ever since the War Doctor he thought he destroyed Gallifrey only to learn it’s been lost so he goes looking for it and after all that the endgame is it got destroyed Wow that sucks
@Lady Wanderer An entire planet, with the most advanced civilisation in the universe... and all chibbs can think of is destroying it again, after it's already been destroyed and undestroyed once before.
I would've loved to see a flourishing time lord civilization with giant sprawling cities greater than the Citidel, new time travelling technology etc, etc. But all we got was: It gOt dEStRoYeD AgAiN IsN'T thAT cooL gUyS?!.
Why can't we just get a series where the doctor has to go up against the time lords who are desperate to reclaim their former standing/glory, whatever the cost. Introduce a new time lord leader now that Rassilon has been exiled. You could even bring back Rassilon in an interesting way, maybe have the Doctor and a newly regenerated/weaker Rassilon pair together. There's so much the show could do, but won't.
The timelords were supposed to be the most advanced race who ever lived, second only to eternals and actual Gods. They should have been left as a mysterious race we rarely saw, because they can never live up to the hype. Once only the daleks could take them on, and it destroyed galaxies in order to do it. Now they've been turned into a joke that can be defeated by anyone.
*Issues unlikely to be explained:* - If the Doctor isn't Gallifreyan, what are the chances of her having two hearts?...or the same biology at all? *- Why didn't Clara see these Doctors when she entered his time stream?* - Russell has confirmed that the woman in The End of Time - a Time Lord, but not Rassalon - was the Doctor's mother. *- How can Ruth have a Police Box TARDIS?* - If the Doctor chose her name prior to her memory being wiped (prior to Hartnell), how does she remember it? Did she never question her ignorance? *- If the Judoon identified that the Doctor had previous bodies, why does no one else? Ever?* - Why would the Time Lords reset the Doctor after seemingly letting Ruth go?
Everyone will try to answer these questions, but the fact is - I don't want these questions answered. *The show's called Doctor Who for God's sake!* My issue is that Chris is trying to answer questions about the Doctor's past that were never meant to be answered in the first place. That's bad enough - but he's done such a shit job of it that there's even more (uninteresting) questions! He couldn't have done a worse job. And, for context, I was until recently luke-warm on Chibnill's Doctor Who.
@Kri Sulvara how is that a question? She literally says in this episode that they appear to have somehow forced her back into childhood because she remembers all those academy years you're talking about
There are other two-hearted humanoids - remember The Girl Who Waited? But everyone seems to be assumed that the Timeless Child can't be Gallifreyan just because they found her near a portal. Maybe that's not the direction they'll go, but they certainly COULD still have her be from Gallifrey in the future - it would explain why Gallifrey needs complex paradox shields - the Timelords are descended from... themselves.
Kri Sulvara it was stated that when the timeless child regenerated into the 1st Doctor, the timeless child regenerated into a baby that grew up to be the first doctor. everything about the doctor and the master being friends still works out. remember what the master said in the timeless children? “Doctor, as a child you always acted like you were special”.
I like how this episode, that has perhaps the largest scale and consequence of all new who and comes off as far more laughable and pathetic than basically every small scale episode in the RTD and Moffat runs
Master on Episode 2: I found out this terrible thing, but why should I tell you? It wasnt easy for me Episode 10: Sit down, i prepared a Power Point to explain the whole thing
@@MutantProductions Its another instance of the "tell, dont show from this era". It couldnt have been hamdled a lot better than the see-through "youre gonna have to wait for 10 to find out". Just like the Doctor and Doctor Ruth never talking at the end of 5 about what they remember or where they fit
@@TheJaviferrol Not a first time doctor who has done this, nor is it last, and also, tell don't show? You yourself said it was Power Point presentation.
@@MutantProductions The mental image of the Master sitting around watching the Doctor *not* working it out until he gets up and goes "ugh, fine, I'll just tell you myself. Teach you to ignore me" does make me smile
It's so refreshing to see a negative Doctor Who review that's actually a review that could make me grin and laugh, and not just a string of unbridled rage aimed at whoever. Thanks for existing and doing what you do.
Love Harry's reviews, even though on this one I disagreed with him on his acceptance of the canon busting storyline. As I wont be watching the show until JW & Chibbers leave the show, I wont be too bothered with Harry not reviewing them and look forward to him getting round to all the classic years.
Both you and Harry are the only reviewers who point out the actual flaws in the series, instead of a bunch of bigots moaning about diversity and wokeness, despite the fact that these are good things, if written properly. The fact they AREN'T written properly is the problem.
So basically chibnall created a story arc that he then completely forgot hat he had to finish it and explain it. He also managed to have a genius idea of cyber men being able to regenerate. And then killed them instantly Oh yeah can someone tell chibs what continuity is
We can't be sure that the Cyberlords are dead. When the old guy detonated the particle, Master was shouting something like "Everyone, go here!" I'd say that Master and at least few Cyberlords survived.
The plot holes don’t stop there. The Doctor said in a good man goes to war, that the time lords received their regenerations bu looking into the time vortex, which is proven by the fact that we saw the master do it in the sound of drums, and that river gained hers from the vortex as well.
JustSomeRandomGuy Online Oh how I miss RTD before Moffatt destroyed the show. At least Chibnall is making the show entertaining unlike the Moffat bore fest which make you want to slit your wrists (aka heaven sent)
IlikeTrainsguy100 are you referring to hellbent by accident because honestly I think heaven sent is one of the best episodes of the show and certainly one of my favorites I prefer Davies over moffat aswell but heaven sent is an amazon allegory for grief with a great twist
Remember what happened when 10 was faced with something similar? Old Wilf told the Doctor to just forget about him since he's already old, but the Doctor still sacrificed himself.
The Timeless Child’s origin is identical to that of Doomsday from The Death of Superman (1992). I only picked up on that now. Can we call Chibs a hack now?
Actually, this is more notably similar to an idea that the writer of the Seventh Doctor had going for the time. You know? The Doctor era that was so bad that the show got cancelled for a decade? Chibnell thought that taking heavy inspiration from that era was a good idea.
10:06 is there a reason why both bodies at the bottom of the cliffs are rotated 180 degrees the wrong way? They both fall of backwards but somehow end up with feet towards the sea.
Ok, am I the only one who noticed every time a character fell off a cliff they ended up facing the complete opposite direction to what they we're facing when they fell?
When you started playing Tektayoon's name over and over again it started to sound like the first 3 notes to the opening theme, but Chibs ain't that clever
Chibs actually *is* pretty clever. The "invasion of the tiny cubes" that did nothing so the Doctor's boredom became his own worst enemy was a *great* idea for a story, for example. He's just not *consistently* clever, unfortunately. And he has a few recurring weaknesses as a writer.
I don't think I've come across a single person who's alright with how they've rewritten The Doctors history. Or the fact that they've answered the question of Doctor Who...the question that should never be answered...but who cares?? Whittaker hasn't even watched the previous Doctors and I doubt Chibby has either.
@Bilbous Bagoda The show is called "Doctor Who" which can, as far as I know, be interpreted primarily as a question about Doctor's name. And they didn't reveal Doctor's name, they just (possibly) changed his/her origin.
This Doctor wouldn't really care if one of her companions die. Did you see how she reacted to Graham when he mentioned that he was worried he might get his cancer back? This Doctor isn't Eccleston, Tennent, Smith, or Capaldi lol
Companions are always safe and ultimately only disposed of in the most humane way possible. None of them do something as simple as "die." That is kind of a Doctor Who constant, isn't it?
Why can't they just fire Chibnall? It should have been obvious from the start, especially since he royally f*cked up series 11. Moffatt must be banging his head on the wall every time he sees this crap. I would feel much better if they just canceled the show and said the last two seasons weren't canon because of how bad and poorly received they were by the fandom. Then just redo both series 11 & 12, using the same main cast, but with a better showrunner and proper writing staff. Oh, poor Sydney Newman. The man must be rolling over in his grave, cursing the incompetent idiot who is Chris f*cking Chinball.
I'm not a fan of Moffat's showrunning era but I can at least say Matt Smith and Capaldi were written consistently well enough I enjoyed their take, I honestly feel sorry for Jodie half the time because she's not getting the direction or material any of the other Doctors got at all.
@@aperson6505 well, moffat wasn't the best, but he wasn't bad in my opinion, ofc I prefer Davies writing cuz I rly enjoyed doctor being dark (especially the ending of family of blood oh my God), moffat made doctor be more funny and childish, which is not a bad thing for broader audience, but still. And about Jodie. If I'm not mistaken, she likes this preaching stuff and is all for this agenda BBC is putting into who, which makes me hate this series even more now, but if I'm wrong, sry
@@vitluk The show isn't being ruined by having political themes, it's had them since day 1, what you're disliking is the lack of subtlety and nuance it may have had previously. Regardless, that has nothing to do with what I was saying, because Jodie and her companions have had some truly abysmal dialogue that tanks any performances they could have (even Ewan McGregor and Ian Mcdiarmid couldn't save the Star Wars prequels for example); I liked Fugitive of the Judoon because it gave her some room to breath and actually perform as it was a half decent episode for once.
@@aperson6505 yeah it had political shite but it was clever and subtle not WHITE MAN BAD, DONALD TRUMP PERSON BAD, RACISM BAD. i could probably write better than that retard chibnal
" People are ignorant, they just don't like a female being the doctor! " " People are ignorant, they don't like diversity! " No. Just Jodie, and her two cardboard companions. Jo Martin looks like shes interested in the role, and isn't bad at acting.
@@rkah6187 Agreed. I think that's why she was so much stronger in Season 12 when they started producing more polished scripts with some depth. If Season 13 is as big an improvement over last season, as Season 12 was compared to Season 11? I think we have some fun times to look forward to...
The problem is there are people blaming the bad writing on the "wokeness" and diversity of Chibnall's era. Look at comment sections of the Ruth!Doctor reveal and you'll find dozens of people with "blah blah evil sjws ruining my white male content", or people complaining that the Doctor/the Timeless Child started out as *gasp* a black girl! I agree the writing was shoddy and not giving the actors enough to chew on, but let's not pretend people are not being narrow-minded bigots about this era.
so are about 50% of all doctor who vilens. The difference was, the writing behind the shambling limp of plastic and cling film with ping pong balls for eyes was actually pretty good and or fun. This... is sloppy at best. this series's up, would be a down in any other series or season.
They could've been interesting had they been implemented differently. Imagine that the heads would split open like the cyberman in the pandorica episode and captured people wiring itself into the human brain with cables. They converted humans could be treated as weaker, disposable cybermen which would add weight to the death of characters who would be former allies converted into villains.
@@chefboiarby304 at first I really thought that they would do that. Imagine how fun it would be if they had more humans and it was actually a semirobotic headcrab zombie like episode.
I did a presentation on Doctor Who. I had to tell my class, "Don't watch from series 11 on because the current showrunner is an incompetent moron, whose writing should have been burned."
@@TheJaviferrol presuming the rest of who is still canon and this cyberwar is the same one that was mentioned in revenge of the cybermen then some humans survived but both cybermen and humans are nearly extinct and human life slowly recovers. Tho that's with context of other who media not within the episode bar one line which is shitm
I mean the fact that the doctor left two unlocked TADISs lying randomly around, one of which could easily be snatched up by any remaining Cybermen is the bigger issue.
What happened to the Doctor's age old rule of despising weapons, yet she seems to be totally giddy using weapons now. Oh wait, I forgot this was the Chibnail era, where there is no continuity whatsoever. Never mind me. Edit: Also severely disappointed that Jack Harkness didn't show up in the finale. Why have him back in the first place, if you're just going to use him for a short cameo? The character deserves more than that.
i thought that the fact that the doctor was the first timelord was really dumb. not only was it a huge retcon, but also it completely ruins the idea that the doctor was just some random timelord that managed to survive the war
I have 3 issues with this episode: 1. it's clearly stated, even in the last episode that the Time Lords are different from the regular population who can't regenerate, yet the entire population got wiped out? All of them? Even the non-Time Lords? 2. The Doctor appears to have no qualms about killing an entire planet - what if there were survivors outside the city? She didn't even check. What about all the native creatures? Who care. 3. When the cyberman discussed that little glowing light inside his chest, it thought it was designed to destroy all life, everywhere in the universe. Yet when the humans discuss it, based on what they'd heard, it would only destroy all life on a single planet. If that were true, how would it acheive the cyberman's goal to destroy all life everywhere, and if it's not true, then all life everywhere would be destroyed... and the Doctor didn't bother to check?... As far as we know, the universe died at that point in time now.
Lady Wanderer yep. Total disregard for life. In the Time War, he agonised over the decision to destroy the world so much two other Doctors came to help him out. Here without even knowing the extend of the destruction this will cause, she’s fine with obliterating her planet (yes even if it’s not her planet, she was raised there and live there for a very long time). The doctor hates using weapons (so when Capaldi did, it was a bit of a shock). The Doctor did not destroy Gallifrey and saved all the innocent people and children once. Now, as you say, “kaboom! Wheee!” 😡
@@MutantProductions "How many children were on Galifrey", a question that both 10 and 11 argonize over, if in different ways, yet barely seems to phase Jodie.
Sam Blades - I used to think she (Jodie Whittaker) had good potential myself, but she’s just never filled the Doctors shoes! Whittaker does a Doctor impersonation and it shows because actress Jo Martin only played the Doctor for about 15 minutes onscreen this last season and yet nailed a believable Doctor in her own right! That’s my opinion anyways...
@@PaulusAlone I agree with that statement. She hasn't had that moment where you say to yourself "that's the doctor". I went back to season 11 and the whole time it feels like a poor impersonation of Smith and Tennant combined.
People will argue your claim and debate she's a fantastic doctor the show is great and amazing and doesn't need fixing and the show seems to care less about the writing and more about reviving done to death characters THE DALEKS AT CHRISTMAS UGGhGGGhHGHGUGGGH talk about original!???
I do feel the doctor is more a victime tbh. The term "god" qualify a superior mind who dominate everything and create everything. The doctor was a little girl, mysterious, a paria. She had this mysterious ability of regenerate and was treated like a lab rat. The doctor is not the leader of Gallifrey cuz he represents the big secret of timelord's origins. Just imagine : if the doctor was the leader, he could have more possibilities to discover the truth. So the doctor was, again, a paria in Gallifrey, so it could be easy for the timelords to hide this secret. And the timeless child plot could be a clue about why did he call himself the doctor. In the timeless children, we learned that the Doctor worked for the Division. If the doctor was like an oppresor or tyrant when he worked in the Division, so in his second life, maybe his subconscious wanted to be a better person so he called himself the doctor, to fix the mess he did. What about Tecteun, this explorer could totally be the mysterious woman in the End of Time. The woman cried, perhaps because she knew all that is her fault, or she knew what she did to the doctor. For the time of the doctor "plot hole" : its really simple and here's why : -the doctor was originally a child (timeless child) -when he looked like a teenager, he began to work for the Division -then, when he was old, he stopped working for the Division and this top secret "police" decide to erase ALL doctor's memory -the master confirmed in the finale, that the time when him and the doctor were in the academie truly happened : so the Doctor was turn back into a child (hartnell incarnation). You could asked me : Why ? Well, to keep the secret. We also know that it was Tecteun who suggest the whole idea of only 13 regenerations possible (a cycle) : After the timelords erased doctor's memory, they could totally limited his regenerations like all other timelords. Some people say that 12 said that when he was hartnell, it was his first regeneration : I repeat : for the doctor, his life began with Hartnell, when he was a child/or a baby. So when 1 regenerated, it was the first time for hil cuz he had no memories of the others (and still don't have). Last point about river song. The doctor was called the timeless chils ok ? Words are important right ? She was timeless. BUT perhaps she went trough the vortex and this travel was the origin of the regenerations, so no plot hole for river song or any other things. Timeless child plot add and do not destroy
Been waiting for this one. The Timeless Child, for me, will be the definitive episode where I decided that the Chibnall Era is no longer canon for me and it would seem that I’m not alone... what a biblical fuck up of an episode. Just cancel it now.
What a lot of people seem to miss is that The Timeless Children is set up to make the Doctor a more mysterious figure again and open up story possibilities for Season 13. Whether or not it's a biblical fuckup depends entirely on what comes out of that setup next season...
@@irrevenant3 eh. It still ruins the doctor imo. The doctor isnt supposed to be anyone special, just a time lord who ran away, and just managed to be the last of his species.
@@mrknowhere6457 Now she's been revealed to be just a Timeless Child who ran away and just managed to be the last of her species. Doesn't seem a significant difference, honestly.
@@irrevenant8724 now shes the first of her species. In my opinion, that makes the doctor to special. I liked it more when they were just an average time lord who managed to be the last.
@@mrknowhere6457 She's unlikely to be the first of her species, we just don't know anything about the rest of her species yet. My current headcanon is that she's an orphan and/or runaway from the Timeless Children, but we don't know yet. Personally I think Chibnall did a pretty good job of having his cake and eating it too with this reveal. The Doctor still grew up on Gallifrey as a child as a Time Lord so nothing significant changes there. The "Chosen one" trope comes up a lot, but that doesn't fit. The Chosen one is like King Arthur - the only person who can save the day because of *what* they are rather than who they are. It has never being the Timeless Child that made the Doctor a hero. The opposite really - the Timeless Child was a convenient lab experiment, and later pawn of the Division. The Doctor is a hero for wanting to help people, ignoring what they were *supposed* to do with their life, and going out there to change the universe anyway. I think Chibnall has carefully done this reveal in a way that retains that.
@@nimander5483 I don't believe that there is a problem with any of the cast. Like Colin Baker and Sylvester McCoy, they can't make a purse out of a sow's ear of a script.
@@nimander5483 Yeah but a sort of similar thing with Chibnall. He's a decent writer but he can't write good Doctor Who and I don't think Whittaker can act good Doctor Who either tbh
After The Doctor Falls, they should have let go of the Master and Cybermen for at least 4 seasons, I tell you. You are not going to top that finale, so don't spoil it by bringing them back so soon. Especially, if you are planning to spoil a lot more of the series.
I loved the guy who played the Master. I just loved how much fun he's having as the villain but he can quickly change to having depth. At least he gave that impression to me. Also loved Jodie at the beginning being really rude. She's stressed. It gives off this impression that there really is a danger of her losing (even though that's about all that gave me this feeling). She's so stressed because she's realised how fucking stupid her mistake was in the last episode. I just enjoyed watching the Doctor's children show presenter demeanour she's had in the last two seasons just fall apart. It gives her depth, as if it is just a front for some darkness beneath her. It's what I loved about her sending the Master to the death camps. She actually has something dark underneath her, unlike 12 for example who they kept saying had dark stuff beneath him but nothing ever actually showed or implied it. Although, I have to say I didn't like the two for the most part. Those were the two things I actually liked. The twist I hated because I've never - not in the Moffat era, not in the Davies era, not during the classic show - liked the Doctor being the centre of the universe. It's pointless. It ruins the premise of this random person travelling around the universe for no purpose. Sure, gallifreyans already don't have regeneration as built into their biology. Time Lords are genetically altered gallifreyans, which is said in some classic stories. Normal Gallifreyans are shown in Invasion of Time, that's not a twist. But I hate that the Doctor is the centre of the universe now. It ruins the show. The Doctor is not a God. There is so much that is bigger than the Doctor, but they can't seem to admit that. It's just lazy
Sorry, but Jodie's dark doctor just came out of no where and it's totally jarring.Oh, and it wasn't convincingly acted either.Unlike Peter Capaldi (12) when threatning Ashidr ; now that was bloody dark and far more convincing than the pathetic shove that Jodie did.
the fact that this doctor has lasted longer than Christopher Eccleston is just sad also i think that everything that happens from series 11 till dr who gets cancelled should be non cannon
the brendon story is explained as being a cover for the timeless child so that if the doctor remembered it she would just see a story about some irish kid instead of her origins. Thats why brendon has the same events happen; being discovered as a child, falling to what should of been his death but surviving and having his menory wipped at the end of his life. Brendon was the cover for the first 12 regenerations of the doctor
It was totally out of character for the Doctor to let Ko detonate the Master and the cybermen. This is supposedly the same Doctor under Tennant, that sacrificed his life as the Doctor to save Wilfried from the radiation, knowing that he would have to regenerate. So, to leave Ko to take the fall based on a totally weak and unexplained backstory, was ridiculous.
@@justsomerandomguyonline1144 Moffat was nowhere near as bad as this. Regardless of what you think of Moffat's writing, at the end of his era everything was still intact. Chibnall on the other hand has basically butchered everything that made the Doctor as a character special and pumped out the dullest seasons of NuWho.
River could regenerate because it was explained that it was because she was conceived in the time vortex but now with this finale that can't be the case. This breaks an established character as well as just be a poor season all over. I truly hate Chibbs being anywhere near this show. I've given up caring.
No, I watched the episode. Personally I tend to agree with The Council of Geeks' review of it: The Timeless Child twist is clearly very divisive, and there's a little too much "telling" but other than that the story itself is pretty well done and entertaining.
The whole Brenden stuff was pointless consider it was a “filter” over the real story (that the doctor was apparently seeing) I’d rather flesh out the Tc flashbacks instead of a good interesting pointless story and a underdeveloped cannon breaking one
This season had so many great ideas, that were just wraped up in a couple of minutes and wasted. I belive the island stuff is a dream the doctor has, based on her deleted memories. I realy liked that part, but they could have expanded it over the whole season. The doctor having weird dreams of humans she doesn't know. A short story each episode, that gives a clue to what realy happened. This could have been also woven in with the story of the gods feeding on nigtmares. Or the cybermasters could have been born by a council of timelords that wanted to expand their life over the 12 regenerations they have. Or at least there could have been a few timelords for the doctor to confront about her backstory. There was so much wasted time this season that could have been filled with build up or backstory or relationship building between the characters.
Am I under a gross misapprehension, or do you not have to pass through "shaft deep" to get to "balls deep"? Surely the scale goes "Head deep" < "Shaft Deep" < "Balls Deep".
I find myself wondering how the final episode still got 2/10. Kill the moon can be considered a masterpiece in comparison - it didn't make any sense, however at least the dialogue was mostly decent back then. Neither did it have any serious overarching implications. The ludicrous backstory "developments" in this episode turn this train wreck of a series into a tsunami of idiocy. The finale wasn't just moronic, it was disrespectful to any decent writer, actor and crew member ever to have been involved with the show in it's 50+ year run. I still hark back to when canon was an integral part to the show and ambitious storylines contributed their bit in every series rather than just being some shoddy and frankly childish agenda driven concept. The result being nothing short of destructive, degrading years of partly excellent storytelling to one cataclysmic plothole.
"The ludicrous backstory "developments" in this episode turn this train wreck of a series into a tsunami of idiocy." - I know you posted this long ago, but I must have missed it. Damn - it was funny!
Eccleston and Tennant have been the best Doctors since the reboot because their characters had DEPTH. We saw both Nine and Ten as de rigeur Doctors, swaggering about with confidence, trying to interact with humans without going over the top (like Twelve's note cards ... oh my actual god), but then something in the story would flip a switch and we'd see their dark sides: Nine when he meets the Dalek in the dungeon, Ten particularly during the ending to The Waters of Mars and when he dealt with the Family of Blood. Then Eleven was played too much on the strength of the legacy without actually contributing to it, and Twelve was played too much for laughs - remember him driving a Dalek shell around while mocking his supposedly most dangerous enemy? Thirteen has no darkness to her, which means she has no depth. It is almost as though the writers have said, well, the Doctor is a woman now, that's enough to set her apart from her predecessors. No. No, no, no, no, no. You still need to develop a character. You still need to make Thirteen into something. The War Doctor had more characterisation than this and he was in, what, two episodes? Three? Chibnall sucks and Whittaker's immense talent is being wasted. Bin both of them and start afresh. And I am NOT saying Fourteen can't also be female. Just make her interesting.
Lady Wanderer I can explain trenzalore easy. So the doctor reached his regen limit or so he thought he did. The time lords realised the Doctor was going to find out there secret so they quickly pretended to give him more regenerations.
17:15 - This was explained in the episode. Brendon's story was a disguised representation of the story of the Timeless Child, stored in the Matrix by someone unknown who wanted to preserve the truth, but also to keep it from being obvious to the wrong people. Effectively it was a metaphor for the Doctor's origins and the time she spent working for The Division (the 'ex-employers' from 'Fugitive of the Judoon' who were after Ruth). One bit I really love about that is when "Brendan's Father" is encouraging "Brendan" to join the Division, he gives his reason as "He wants to serve" but Brendan corrects it to "I want to make a difference". You can see both the Doctor's quintessential character and the seeds of The Doctor's eventual break with the Division in that 5 second snippet...
I was hoping that Ruth would be an alternate timeline or something that referenced one of the classic series episodes, or at least a future Doctor. I mean that would have been a very cool way to introduce the next Doctor. The Timeless Child was just an absolute mess.
Hopefully, they get a new showrunner, honestly, DW would do great with a soft-reboot, heck maybe the show could adapt concepts from the Time Lord Victorious thingy in Big Finish.etc to act as an event to trigger said soft-reboot.
Wait until next season when The Doctor's little sister Dawn starts to play a major role rather than just hanging around in the background of the Tardis.
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![Thoughts on Torchwood [SERIES 1 REVIEW]](/img/tr.png)
![DID IT SUCK? Doctor Who [LEGEND OF THE SEA DEVILS REVIEW]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/8wDmZZEfnUU/mqdefault.jpg)
Ryan character development in s12 was throwing a basketball
So true
It's funny that's pretty much all of he will get, considering he is not coming back after December Special.
Its like the writers just ignored him
It's more than Yaz ever got
Also the character development in "Can you hear me?". Overall though, Ryan and Graham got pretty much all the character development in Season 11. I'm perfectly happy for Season 12 to focus more on The Doctor and Yaz...
So uh... how did Clara not see the doctors past when she JUMPED into his TIMESTREAM. there would have been a awkward conversation like
Clara: so how come you didn’t tell me about your hundreds of forms?
Doctor: im sorry what?
Clara? Don’t pretend
Doctor: what did I look like
Clara: a black woman...
Doctor: what the fu...
Right? Great point.
Also if the doctor has unlimited regenerations then why did he need to be granted more regenerations as Matt Smith
Don't mention her, she isnt worth caring about.
To be fair, Clara jumping into the Doctor's timeline was a really dumb idea in the first place and I'm glad the show forgot about it like a couple episodes later.
I don't think she actually remembered all those faces she saw after coming out of the timestream. At least not consciously.
I feel sorry for the people who designed and made the time lord cyber man suits. They look really cool yet we’ll probably never see them again.
Yeah, I’d say they were the highlight of the episode.
Are you kidding, they look cheap af
I don’t think they look cool, but it is a shame to see such wasted effort
When exactly did time lord dna become compatible for conversion? I don't think that was clarified.
I couldn't stop laughing, they were ridiculous! Granted, yes, a Gallifreyan Cyberman should look like that, but those collars and the cap! And when I stopped laughing for the outfit, I noticed they're even grumpy like they're saying "look how they dressed me!" and started again
To return to the quote that Harry said back in his review of "The Woman Who Fell To Earth"
"We can now breathe fresh air, reassured by what we just witnessed and all is well in the world of Who"
Well, that certainly didn't age well.
Who said that?
JD Di Go back to the beginning of his video reviewing "The Woman Who Fell To Earth"
Also that episode was total shit (the entire conflict was literally solved at the start of the episode off screen with the sonic, WITHOUT telling the audience), so I really don’t know where Harry was coming from back then...
WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO CAPTAIN JACK
Disinety he evaporated😏
He's gone to some bar to be awesome, as usual.
God, I love him so much.
Was pretty obvious they brought him back because people weren't watching the show
Well, it worked.
That's what I want to know. I hope we see more Captain Jack Harkness in series 13.
Glad to see Ryan cured of his incurable dyspraxia....
"Well we kinda forgot about his dyspraxia."
Clearly enough time exposed to the Tardis' plutronic energy has affected his Fingilius glands and fixed all of that.
TheGrouchyGamer why not? Now all bets are off in this post-Kim-Jong-Retcon Chibs era.
@@El_Descarriado That's not how Plutronic energy works. That only toasts sandwiches. Matt Smith used it all the time, remember.
It's not very useful stuff.
@@TheSmart-CasualGamer It works, how I say it works you little worm.
Who do you think you're talking to!?
I AM CHRIS CHINBALLS.
I OWN WHO.
I OWN EVERYTHING.
How are we supposed to believe The Master singlehandedly destroyed Gallifrey and wiped out all the Timelords? *Thanks Chibs* for the explanation!
And Graham telling Yaz she's the best human he knows was so unearned and cringe - these two have barely had an on-screen relationship up until this point… *thanks Chibs* for the excellent writing!
@Geiz Lots of planets have an India!
Geiz no no dont give the writers any idea
The writing was poor and full of holes and Red Herrings. Chibs the idiot could not even convincingly retcon the show! Having the same cliff used in three scenes made it just visions created by the Master. Clearly the canon is maintained and Hartnell is still the first, the original Doctor and the Jo Dr is an illusion.
Ever since The Master claimed responsibility for the destruction of Gallifrey, I have been waiting for the episode that proves this to be a lie! Sadly, Chibnall has neither the skill nor the ability to provide a decent script that would truly explain Gallifrey's downfall!
He hasn't started yet
This is just the beginning
You've gotta love how The Doctor was originally every ethnicity (and gender) under the sun for however many years before being *thirteen white males in a row* ... doesn't feel forced at all.
Also amazing how he was every ethnicity and child under the sun except A GINGER.
@@frogradar That's racist and sexist to gingers tbh
There is no logic behind it. I may be thinking to much into this. But the reason we (as humans) have races in the first place is because of evolution. Perhaps if there were environmental factors which determined the race of a regeneration in which that race had an advantage over another race, then fine... go for it. But for them to just be sat in a chair being killed on repeat just so the Woke Identitarians can sit there and pleasure theirselves over the "diversity" of the scene is plain retarded.
@@frogradar plus also contradicts and fucks up the classic series as it's made very clear there is no gender swapping (the toxic NuWho trait) as in classic Who it's clearly defined roles - TimeLords and TimeLadies - so yeah.....Im not adding the Fan fiction Virgin books as I never read them as a child. lol
@The Crimson Queen Think you didn't quite catch what I was trying to say... let us hope the woke-agenda that Chibs enforces upon this show gets stamped out quickly.
So ever since the War Doctor he thought he destroyed Gallifrey only to learn it’s been lost so he goes looking for it and after all that the endgame is it got destroyed
Wow that sucks
remember NuWho has a massive Gallifrey fetish lol and oh gender/diversity politics.
@Lady Wanderer An entire planet, with the most advanced civilisation in the universe... and all chibbs can think of is destroying it again, after it's already been destroyed and undestroyed once before.
I would've loved to see a flourishing time lord civilization with giant sprawling cities greater than the Citidel, new time travelling technology etc, etc. But all we got was: It gOt dEStRoYeD AgAiN IsN'T thAT cooL gUyS?!.
Why can't we just get a series where the doctor has to go up against the time lords who are desperate to reclaim their former standing/glory, whatever the cost. Introduce a new time lord leader now that Rassilon has been exiled. You could even bring back Rassilon in an interesting way, maybe have the Doctor and a newly regenerated/weaker Rassilon pair together.
There's so much the show could do, but won't.
The timelords were supposed to be the most advanced race who ever lived, second only to eternals and actual Gods. They should have been left as a mysterious race we rarely saw, because they can never live up to the hype.
Once only the daleks could take them on, and it destroyed galaxies in order to do it. Now they've been turned into a joke that can be defeated by anyone.
*Issues unlikely to be explained:*
- If the Doctor isn't Gallifreyan, what are the chances of her having two hearts?...or the same biology at all?
*- Why didn't Clara see these Doctors when she entered his time stream?*
- Russell has confirmed that the woman in The End of Time - a Time Lord, but not Rassalon - was the Doctor's mother.
*- How can Ruth have a Police Box TARDIS?*
- If the Doctor chose her name prior to her memory being wiped (prior to Hartnell), how does she remember it? Did she never question her ignorance?
*- If the Judoon identified that the Doctor had previous bodies, why does no one else? Ever?*
- Why would the Time Lords reset the Doctor after seemingly letting Ruth go?
Everyone will try to answer these questions, but the fact is - I don't want these questions answered. *The show's called Doctor Who for God's sake!*
My issue is that Chris is trying to answer questions about the Doctor's past that were never meant to be answered in the first place. That's bad enough - but he's done such a shit job of it that there's even more (uninteresting) questions! He couldn't have done a worse job. And, for context, I was until recently luke-warm on Chibnill's Doctor Who.
it's NuWho.........that's the answer lol......god how i've grown to dispise NuWho :)
@Kri Sulvara how is that a question? She literally says in this episode that they appear to have somehow forced her back into childhood because she remembers all those academy years you're talking about
There are other two-hearted humanoids - remember The Girl Who Waited? But everyone seems to be assumed that the Timeless Child can't be Gallifreyan just because they found her near a portal. Maybe that's not the direction they'll go, but they certainly COULD still have her be from Gallifrey in the future - it would explain why Gallifrey needs complex paradox shields - the Timelords are descended from... themselves.
Kri Sulvara it was stated that when the timeless child regenerated into the 1st Doctor, the timeless child regenerated into a baby that grew up to be the first doctor. everything about the doctor and the master being friends still works out. remember what the master said in the timeless children? “Doctor, as a child you always acted like you were special”.
I like how this episode, that has perhaps the largest scale and consequence of all new who and comes off as far more laughable and pathetic than basically every small scale episode in the RTD and Moffat runs
Master on Episode 2: I found out this terrible thing, but why should I tell you? It wasnt easy for me
Episode 10: Sit down, i prepared a Power Point to explain the whole thing
maybe he got tired of waiting? She clearly wasn't looking into it and was just going on separate and totally unrelated adventures...
@@MutantProductions Its another instance of the "tell, dont show from this era". It couldnt have been hamdled a lot better than the see-through "youre gonna have to wait for 10 to find out". Just like the Doctor and Doctor Ruth never talking at the end of 5 about what they remember or where they fit
@@MutantProductions Or what happened to Daniel Barton for that matter
@@TheJaviferrol
Not a first time doctor who has done this, nor is it last, and also, tell don't show? You yourself said it was Power Point presentation.
@@MutantProductions The mental image of the Master sitting around watching the Doctor *not* working it out until he gets up and goes "ugh, fine, I'll just tell you myself. Teach you to ignore me" does make me smile
It's so refreshing to see a negative Doctor Who review that's actually a review that could make me grin and laugh, and not just a string of unbridled rage aimed at whoever. Thanks for existing and doing what you do.
Agreed, harry always actually points out issues and problems and doesn't come off as angry af like certain other channels.
Agreed. Gonna miss these reviews actually :(
Love Harry's reviews, even though on this one I disagreed with him on his acceptance of the canon busting storyline. As I wont be watching the show until JW & Chibbers leave the show, I wont be too bothered with Harry not reviewing them and look forward to him getting round to all the classic years.
Both you and Harry are the only reviewers who point out the actual flaws in the series, instead of a bunch of bigots moaning about diversity and wokeness, despite the fact that these are good things, if written properly.
The fact they AREN'T written properly is the problem.
There is nothing wrong with being angry
So basically chibnall created a story arc that he then completely forgot hat he had to finish it and explain it. He also managed to have a genius idea of cyber men being able to regenerate. And then killed them instantly Oh yeah can someone tell chibs what continuity is
The unexplained parts will, most likely, be the basis of the Season 13 story arc.
Best part about that? Cyber Timelords have been done before in the comics. Chinbal has brought nothing original to this series, at all.
We can't be sure that the Cyberlords are dead. When the old guy detonated the particle, Master was shouting something like "Everyone, go here!" I'd say that Master and at least few Cyberlords survived.
Dr Who is built on not explaining things.
With Chin balls it is spelt "cuntinuity"
If she is the "Timeless Child" then the Doctor shouldn't have "Time Lord" physiology [two hearts]...since not of the Galifreyan race.
“Purely Coincidental”....
It's a coincidence. Maybe the Time Lords didn't have two before they found the Doctor.
The plot holes don’t stop there.
The Doctor said in a good man goes to war, that the time lords received their regenerations bu looking into the time vortex, which is proven by the fact that we saw the master do it in the sound of drums, and that river gained hers from the vortex as well.
In my eyes everything past twice upon a time isn’t canon.
Edit: now that RTD is coming back hopefully he can fix this shitshow
Anything past the End Of Time part 2 isn’t canon
JustSomeRandomGuy Online Oh how I miss RTD before Moffatt destroyed the show. At least Chibnall is making the show entertaining unlike the Moffat bore fest which make you want to slit your wrists (aka heaven sent)
JustSomeRandomGuy Online That’s a little too far, how about anything after Christmas Carol.
Oh please, it hasn't been Doctor Who since they recast Hartnell...
IlikeTrainsguy100 are you referring to hellbent by accident because honestly I think heaven sent is one of the best episodes of the show and certainly one of my favorites I prefer Davies over moffat aswell but heaven sent is an amazon allegory for grief with a great twist
old cybermen: *Aims fairly good.*
New Cybermen: *shoots like a storm trooper*
God, I miss the "We haven't got guns. We just electrocute people with out fists".
Remember when the Doctor cared about people and went out of his way to save them? Yeah those were good times.
The last scene of the actual show: "Laugh hard. Run fast. Be kind. Doctor, I let you go,"
And goes straight to 14
Did anyone else think it was really unlike The Doctor to just accept that guy sacrificing himself immediately and just RUN AWAY?!
Remember what happened when 10 was faced with something similar? Old Wilf told the Doctor to just forget about him since he's already old, but the Doctor still sacrificed himself.
The Timeless Child’s origin is identical to that of Doomsday from The Death of Superman (1992). I only picked up on that now. Can we call Chibs a hack now?
Yes, he is a massive hack. All of the stories in this season are rip-offs from the previous Doctors.
I mean wasnt he a guy who wrote that awful 42 episode, you know that Satan's Pit rip-off but with sun and timer.
@MetaPlanet my bad on that one - still a massive rip-off of Satan's Pit and other earlier episodes.
@MetaPlanet he wrote a lot of terrible DW eps..and Torchwood gave the planet a uterus...
Actually, this is more notably similar to an idea that the writer of the Seventh Doctor had going for the time. You know? The Doctor era that was so bad that the show got cancelled for a decade? Chibnell thought that taking heavy inspiration from that era was a good idea.
Does anyone else listen to “Tecteun...Tecteun...Tecteun...Tecteun...” and suddenly have the Doctor Who theme music in their head?
I'd say it was intentional but Chibnall isn't that clever or subtle.
I just hear dum dum dum dum dum dum dum dum dum doo doo doo dum dum dum dum dum dum dum dum dum doo doo doo da daaaaaa da doo deeeeeee
10:06 is there a reason why both bodies at the bottom of the cliffs are rotated 180 degrees the wrong way? They both fall of backwards but somehow end up with feet towards the sea.
Both fell off the same cliff, in Ireland and Galifrey!
Rotated for better camera angle. Continuity be damned!
I was just about to ask that. Suck poor writing. When you notice some crap like that it really takes you out of the story.
Probably a Broadchurch reference (Jodie's son in Broadchurch is found dead at the bottom of a cliffside)
Because the Earth is uh flat..... and a Wizard did it
Continuity whats that
Ok, am I the only one who noticed every time a character fell off a cliff they ended up facing the complete opposite direction to what they we're facing when they fell?
Nope, it really annoyed me as well
I noticed it, it really confused me.
When you started playing Tektayoon's name over and over again it started to sound like the first 3 notes to the opening theme, but Chibs ain't that clever
Chibs actually *is* pretty clever. The "invasion of the tiny cubes" that did nothing so the Doctor's boredom became his own worst enemy was a *great* idea for a story, for example. He's just not *consistently* clever, unfortunately. And he has a few recurring weaknesses as a writer.
That bit with 10s voice.... don’t you think she looks tired got me
Almost 60 years worth of doctor who ruined in an hour
Please click this timestamp: 21:20
It is easier to destroy than to build something.
@Bilbous Bagoda to be fair the original comment didn't explain how
I’ve watched it for all 57 years, this was a bit of alright.
A big change to a successful system is more likely to make it worse than better.
So this show isn’t Doctor WHO anymore as we know the backstory. It is now basically just called Doctor
Yay :(
nah, it's doctor Woke.
abrr2000 yes it’s new name is Doctor Woke. A new stunning and brave TV show
It's Doctor diversity, yey
Doctor who cares
Doctor Nasty
I don't think I've come across a single person who's alright with how they've rewritten The Doctors history. Or the fact that they've answered the question of Doctor Who...the question that should never be answered...but who cares?? Whittaker hasn't even watched the previous Doctors and I doubt Chibby has either.
Which question? Doctor's name? They didn't answer it.
@@gelaos5753 That'll be next season clearly
Who care what his name is? What's his shoe size? Doesn't matter either.
@Bilbous Bagoda The show is called "Doctor Who" which can, as far as I know, be interpreted primarily as a question about Doctor's name. And they didn't reveal Doctor's name, they just (possibly) changed his/her origin.
I'm ok with it. I actually loved the episode.
I was really hoping at least one companion would have died to add some weight to the episode.
One of them should have blown up gallifrey
BRADDS FX the fact that some random old twat was the only loss this episode sits really badly with me
This Doctor wouldn't really care if one of her companions die. Did you see how she reacted to Graham when he mentioned that he was worried he might get his cancer back? This Doctor isn't Eccleston, Tennent, Smith, or Capaldi lol
Especially considering two are leaving.
Companions are always safe and ultimately only disposed of in the most humane way possible. None of them do something as simple as "die." That is kind of a Doctor Who constant, isn't it?
Why can't they just fire Chibnall? It should have been obvious from the start, especially since he royally f*cked up series 11. Moffatt must be banging his head on the wall every time he sees this crap. I would feel much better if they just canceled the show and said the last two seasons weren't canon because of how bad and poorly received they were by the fandom. Then just redo both series 11 & 12, using the same main cast, but with a better showrunner and proper writing staff.
Oh, poor Sydney Newman. The man must be rolling over in his grave, cursing the incompetent idiot who is Chris f*cking Chinball.
they don't care abt DW, they said it's a good show even with chibnall(even after Jodie and Chibnall basically said they don't care abt the fandom)
"Why can't they just fire Chinball?"
They don't WANT TO fire him. They want him to churn out more woke whitemanbad propaganda.
I identify is a straight cis white male with brown hair you mong.
@Erik The Existor I think you've misunderstood Andrevus.
Moffat must be banging his head on the wall every time he sees this crap? Sorry but Moffat was far worst
50th anniversary: "how many children died on galifrey?"
Series 12 finale: "ah dunt give ah fuck"
please bbc for the love of god replace Chibnall
Funny joke u wrote here...
I'm not a fan of Moffat's showrunning era but I can at least say Matt Smith and Capaldi were written consistently well enough I enjoyed their take, I honestly feel sorry for Jodie half the time because she's not getting the direction or material any of the other Doctors got at all.
@@aperson6505 well, moffat wasn't the best, but he wasn't bad in my opinion, ofc I prefer Davies writing cuz I rly enjoyed doctor being dark (especially the ending of family of blood oh my God), moffat made doctor be more funny and childish, which is not a bad thing for broader audience, but still. And about Jodie. If I'm not mistaken, she likes this preaching stuff and is all for this agenda BBC is putting into who, which makes me hate this series even more now, but if I'm wrong, sry
@@vitluk The show isn't being ruined by having political themes, it's had them since day 1, what you're disliking is the lack of subtlety and nuance it may have had previously. Regardless, that has nothing to do with what I was saying, because Jodie and her companions have had some truly abysmal dialogue that tanks any performances they could have (even Ewan McGregor and Ian Mcdiarmid couldn't save the Star Wars prequels for example); I liked Fugitive of the Judoon because it gave her some room to breath and actually perform as it was a half decent episode for once.
@@aperson6505 yeah it had political shite but it was clever and subtle not WHITE MAN BAD, DONALD TRUMP PERSON BAD, RACISM BAD. i could probably write better than that retard chibnal
13:29
when I tell you I just wHEEZED DURING THIS PART LMAOOOOO
I never thought did say this. But bring back Moffat
Unpopular opinion: Moffat was a fine show runner.
@@QuokkaCore Moffat was bloody terrible (towards the end of his tenure at least), but Oliver's right, I'd take him over Chibnall anyday.
Why? He is the main reason the show is in the shits now. It started with him
Tom Monty That’s a matter of opinion.
La Maci RTD was better yes but I feel Moffat gets a lot of undeserved hate, sure he had some bad episodes, but he also made some great ones.
" People are ignorant, they just don't like a female being the doctor! "
" People are ignorant, they don't like diversity! "
No. Just Jodie, and her two cardboard companions.
Jo Martin looks like shes interested in the role, and isn't bad at acting.
You're one of the few who liked her acting.
Compared to Jodie, I'll take her.
Nothing wrong with Jodie, I think she's a really good actress, but you can only do so much if they don't give you a good script.
@@rkah6187 Agreed. I think that's why she was so much stronger in Season 12 when they started producing more polished scripts with some depth. If Season 13 is as big an improvement over last season, as Season 12 was compared to Season 11? I think we have some fun times to look forward to...
The problem is there are people blaming the bad writing on the "wokeness" and diversity of Chibnall's era. Look at comment sections of the Ruth!Doctor reveal and you'll find dozens of people with "blah blah evil sjws ruining my white male content", or people complaining that the Doctor/the Timeless Child started out as *gasp* a black girl!
I agree the writing was shoddy and not giving the actors enough to chew on, but let's not pretend people are not being narrow-minded bigots about this era.
The flying Cybermen heads were a joke
I made a joke about it a few moments before they appeared Hahahahah saying how predictable could NuWho go lol
so are about 50% of all doctor who vilens. The difference was, the writing behind the shambling limp of plastic and cling film with ping pong balls for eyes was actually pretty good and or fun. This... is sloppy at best. this series's up, would be a down in any other series or season.
The saddest thing about them is that scene but with Cybermats would have been tense and scary.
They could've been interesting had they been implemented differently. Imagine that the heads would split open like the cyberman in the pandorica episode and captured people wiring itself into the human brain with cables. They converted humans could be treated as weaker, disposable cybermen which would add weight to the death of characters who would be former allies converted into villains.
@@chefboiarby304 at first I really thought that they would do that. Imagine how fun it would be if they had more humans and it was actually a semirobotic headcrab zombie like episode.
I did a presentation on Doctor Who. I had to tell my class, "Don't watch from series 11 on because the current showrunner is an incompetent moron, whose writing should have been burned."
Bravo sir
How did thay respond?
Tell them to watch fugitive of the judoon though
La Maci he atleast knew how to tell a competent story that isn’t just spewing out sjw propaganda
Warning them about Season 11 is fair (although it had a couple of decent episodes). Season 12 was overall pretty decent though.
By the way; doesnt leaving the last remaining humans from the future on present day Earth could lead to a giant clusterf*** of a Paradox?
I think it's implyed other humans survived and got to the boundary before the master hijacked it
@@jplegend98 And we never know what happened to them anyway...
@@TheJaviferrol presuming the rest of who is still canon and this cyberwar is the same one that was mentioned in revenge of the cybermen then some humans survived but both cybermen and humans are nearly extinct and human life slowly recovers. Tho that's with context of other who media not within the episode bar one line which is shitm
@@jplegend98 Yeeeeeah... thats the problem with a lot of this era "pressuming"
I mean the fact that the doctor left two unlocked TADISs lying randomly around, one of which could easily be snatched up by any remaining Cybermen is the bigger issue.
What happened to the Doctor's age old rule of despising weapons, yet she seems to be totally giddy using weapons now.
Oh wait, I forgot this was the Chibnail era, where there is no continuity whatsoever. Never mind me.
Edit: Also severely disappointed that Jack Harkness didn't show up in the finale. Why have him back in the first place, if you're just going to use him for a short cameo? The character deserves more than that.
The more you think about it, the less it makes sense.
It's The Last Jedi of Doctor Who.
Except the last jedi was better
Even TLJ and Picard have got nothing on this cavalcade of fuck-uppery.
Fuck that means the rise of Skywalker of doctor who is still to come...
Is it weird that I like the sequels and really don’t like S11 and S12
WackyWAA ! Nah I agree with you
i thought that the fact that the doctor was the first timelord was really dumb. not only was it a huge retcon, but also it completely ruins the idea that the doctor was just some random timelord that managed to survive the war
The Timeless Children should be a 10 since during the mind blown sequence you can see the Abzorbaloff
This man speaks the truth
Wait rly? I dont remember seeing that but if it's true, I am disappointed in this show even more now
@@vitluk What are you talking about. We all love the Abzorbaloff and it deserves to be in every episode of Doctor Who
@@Glac0 -_-
There is a great evil in this thread.
When you're rooting for the cybermen and hoping they'll kill the doctor, you know the writing has gone bad.
Hear hear.
I have 3 issues with this episode:
1. it's clearly stated, even in the last episode that the Time Lords are different from the regular population who can't regenerate, yet the entire population got wiped out? All of them? Even the non-Time Lords?
2. The Doctor appears to have no qualms about killing an entire planet - what if there were survivors outside the city? She didn't even check. What about all the native creatures? Who care.
3. When the cyberman discussed that little glowing light inside his chest, it thought it was designed to destroy all life, everywhere in the universe. Yet when the humans discuss it, based on what they'd heard, it would only destroy all life on a single planet. If that were true, how would it acheive the cyberman's goal to destroy all life everywhere, and if it's not true, then all life everywhere would be destroyed... and the Doctor didn't bother to check?... As far as we know, the universe died at that point in time now.
My that’s why she got arrested? Idk I’m done trying to figure this show out now...
@@sparkymist lol I didn't consider that! They should really have put her in a cell with River though ;)
Lady Wanderer yep. Total disregard for life. In the Time War, he agonised over the decision to destroy the world so much two other Doctors came to help him out.
Here without even knowing the extend of the destruction this will cause, she’s fine with obliterating her planet (yes even if it’s not her planet, she was raised there and live there for a very long time).
The doctor hates using weapons (so when Capaldi did, it was a bit of a shock). The Doctor did not destroy Gallifrey and saved all the innocent people and children once. Now, as you say, “kaboom! Wheee!” 😡
Sparkymist I think it's probably because of what the Ruth doctor did and her still being the same person
@@MutantProductions "How many children were on Galifrey", a question that both 10 and 11 argonize over, if in different ways, yet barely seems to phase Jodie.
Got a feeling this can either be retconed or explained as the master lying
You know... Moffat's time as showrunner may have been a tad insane and all over the place, but at least it was well written and entertaining.
I hated this episode for killing off the blonde girl in the beginning, she was the best of the group of humans rebelling against the Cyberman!
classic Bescot
Biscotti
It really is such a shame that all of Whitaker's run as the Doctor has been bad, or mediocre....she has good potential, wasted...
The Dalek episode was the only good episode of the entire Chibnall run.
@AManNamed2 there is only so much she can do with the shit writing around her
Sam Blades - I used to think she (Jodie Whittaker) had good potential myself, but she’s just never filled the Doctors shoes!
Whittaker does a Doctor impersonation and it shows because actress Jo Martin only played the Doctor for about 15 minutes onscreen this last season and yet nailed a believable Doctor in her own right!
That’s my opinion anyways...
@@PaulusAlone I agree with that statement. She hasn't had that moment where you say to yourself "that's the doctor". I went back to season 11 and the whole time it feels like a poor impersonation of Smith and Tennant combined.
People will argue your claim and debate she's a fantastic doctor the show is great and amazing and doesn't need fixing and the show seems to care less about the writing and more about reviving done to death characters
THE DALEKS AT CHRISTMAS UGGhGGGhHGHGUGGGH talk about original!???
And to think we have (at least) one more series with Jodie and Chibs... kill me now.
I wonder if Chibbs is gonna leave after the last Jodie season
I do feel the doctor is more a victime tbh. The term "god" qualify a superior mind who dominate everything and create everything. The doctor was a little girl, mysterious, a paria. She had this mysterious ability of regenerate and was treated like a lab rat. The doctor is not the leader of Gallifrey cuz he represents the big secret of timelord's origins. Just imagine : if the doctor was the leader, he could have more possibilities to discover the truth. So the doctor was, again, a paria in Gallifrey, so it could be easy for the timelords to hide this secret. And the timeless child plot could be a clue about why did he call himself the doctor. In the timeless children, we learned that the Doctor worked for the Division. If the doctor was like an oppresor or tyrant when he worked in the Division, so in his second life, maybe his subconscious wanted to be a better person so he called himself the doctor, to fix the mess he did. What about Tecteun, this explorer could totally be the mysterious woman in the End of Time. The woman cried, perhaps because she knew all that is her fault, or she knew what she did to the doctor. For the time of the doctor "plot hole" : its really simple and here's why :
-the doctor was originally a child (timeless child)
-when he looked like a teenager, he began to work for the Division
-then, when he was old, he stopped working for the Division and this top secret "police" decide to erase ALL doctor's memory
-the master confirmed in the finale, that the time when him and the doctor were in the academie truly happened : so the Doctor was turn back into a child (hartnell incarnation). You could asked me : Why ? Well, to keep the secret. We also know that it was Tecteun who suggest the whole idea of only 13 regenerations possible (a cycle) : After the timelords erased doctor's memory, they could totally limited his regenerations like all other timelords. Some people say that 12 said that when he was hartnell, it was his first regeneration : I repeat : for the doctor, his life began with Hartnell, when he was a child/or a baby. So when 1 regenerated, it was the first time for hil cuz he had no memories of the others (and still don't have). Last point about river song. The doctor was called the timeless chils ok ? Words are important right ? She was timeless. BUT perhaps she went trough the vortex and this travel was the origin of the regenerations, so no plot hole for river song or any other things. Timeless child plot add and do not destroy
Any chance of you doing children of Earth at some point? I just finished watching torchwood and loved that story.
Peter Capaldi is in it!
And great in it.
Capaldis still regenerating this is just a bad dream
Ate one too many pears and now he’s tripping balls
Benni not being in it makes it 0/10
Been waiting for this one. The Timeless Child, for me, will be the definitive episode where I decided that the Chibnall Era is no longer canon for me and it would seem that I’m not alone... what a biblical fuck up of an episode. Just cancel it now.
What a lot of people seem to miss is that The Timeless Children is set up to make the Doctor a more mysterious figure again and open up story possibilities for Season 13. Whether or not it's a biblical fuckup depends entirely on what comes out of that setup next season...
@@irrevenant3 eh. It still ruins the doctor imo. The doctor isnt supposed to be anyone special, just a time lord who ran away, and just managed to be the last of his species.
@@mrknowhere6457 Now she's been revealed to be just a Timeless Child who ran away and just managed to be the last of her species. Doesn't seem a significant difference, honestly.
@@irrevenant8724 now shes the first of her species. In my opinion, that makes the doctor to special. I liked it more when they were just an average time lord who managed to be the last.
@@mrknowhere6457 She's unlikely to be the first of her species, we just don't know anything about the rest of her species yet. My current headcanon is that she's an orphan and/or runaway from the Timeless Children, but we don't know yet.
Personally I think Chibnall did a pretty good job of having his cake and eating it too with this reveal. The Doctor still grew up on Gallifrey as a child as a Time Lord so nothing significant changes there.
The "Chosen one" trope comes up a lot, but that doesn't fit. The Chosen one is like King Arthur - the only person who can save the day because of *what* they are rather than who they are. It has never being the Timeless Child that made the Doctor a hero. The opposite really - the Timeless Child was a convenient lab experiment, and later pawn of the Division. The Doctor is a hero for wanting to help people, ignoring what they were *supposed* to do with their life, and going out there to change the universe anyway. I think Chibnall has carefully done this reveal in a way that retains that.
Drones? More like the return of the evil Handles
Bravo. It was awful. A fan since 1981 and I’m out till Chibs and Whittaker are gone.
Probably enough with Chibs. For all we know, Whittaker is instructed to act like that. She is a good actress.
@@nimander5483 I don't believe that there is a problem with any of the cast. Like Colin Baker and Sylvester McCoy, they can't make a purse out of a sow's ear of a script.
@@nimander5483 Yeah but a sort of similar thing with Chibnall. He's a decent writer but he can't write good Doctor Who and I don't think Whittaker can act good Doctor Who either tbh
Duncan Rose Don't come back, you're not welcome
@@IlikeTrainsguy100 please don’t tell me you actually liked any of this.
"They accidentally got a good shot in here" it hurts but its true 😆
They fly now!?
Without William hartnell there is no doctor who way to honor this man's legacy BBC
After The Doctor Falls, they should have let go of the Master and Cybermen for at least 4 seasons, I tell you. You are not going to top that finale, so don't spoil it by bringing them back so soon. Especially, if you are planning to spoil a lot more of the series.
I loved the guy who played the Master. I just loved how much fun he's having as the villain but he can quickly change to having depth. At least he gave that impression to me.
Also loved Jodie at the beginning being really rude. She's stressed. It gives off this impression that there really is a danger of her losing (even though that's about all that gave me this feeling). She's so stressed because she's realised how fucking stupid her mistake was in the last episode. I just enjoyed watching the Doctor's children show presenter demeanour she's had in the last two seasons just fall apart. It gives her depth, as if it is just a front for some darkness beneath her. It's what I loved about her sending the Master to the death camps. She actually has something dark underneath her, unlike 12 for example who they kept saying had dark stuff beneath him but nothing ever actually showed or implied it.
Although, I have to say I didn't like the two for the most part. Those were the two things I actually liked. The twist I hated because I've never - not in the Moffat era, not in the Davies era, not during the classic show - liked the Doctor being the centre of the universe. It's pointless. It ruins the premise of this random person travelling around the universe for no purpose. Sure, gallifreyans already don't have regeneration as built into their biology. Time Lords are genetically altered gallifreyans, which is said in some classic stories. Normal Gallifreyans are shown in Invasion of Time, that's not a twist. But I hate that the Doctor is the centre of the universe now. It ruins the show. The Doctor is not a God. There is so much that is bigger than the Doctor, but they can't seem to admit that. It's just lazy
Sorry, but Jodie's dark doctor just came out of no where and it's totally jarring.Oh, and it wasn't convincingly acted either.Unlike Peter Capaldi (12) when threatning Ashidr ; now that was bloody dark and far more convincing than the pathetic shove that Jodie did.
This episode literally a migraine talking about how this fu**ed up the continuity of the WHOLE SHOW
“I’ve just been diagnosed with cervical canc-” “DONT NEED YA LIFE STOREH”
I didn’t know the Doctor was able to use the secret Joestar Family technique!
Nigerundayo fam!
The doctor is just a regular human with an OP stand
the fact that this doctor has lasted longer than Christopher Eccleston is just sad also i think that everything that happens from series 11 till dr who gets cancelled should be non cannon
This was worth waiting two weeks for, thank you so much Harry for your hard work that goes into making these reviews 🥺🥺🙌🏻
The bit where it flashed over parts of past who just made me go, "Damn, I miss Capaldi."
I've missed Capaldi since the announcement he was leaving. He nailed it as the Doctor; it was the lackluster writing that hurt him.
I thought that the Irish flashbacks were to do with the lone cyberman
I assumed Brendan WAS the Lone Cyberman. They give him HANDLES during the torture scene!
I used to watch Doctor who for fun and ignore the reviews and critics.
Now, I get my fun from the reviews and critics
the brendon story is explained as being a cover for the timeless child so that if the doctor remembered it she would just see a story about some irish kid instead of her origins. Thats why brendon has the same events happen; being discovered as a child, falling to what should of been his death but surviving and having his menory wipped at the end of his life. Brendon was the cover for the first 12 regenerations of the doctor
Ah that makes sense. I mean it's still shit but at least it makes sense
Confuses me that people can be long term fans AND. STILL. LIKE. THIS.
Ahh yes, Cyberdrones, AKA Toclafane 2 Electric Boogaloo.
It was totally out of character for the Doctor to let Ko detonate the Master and the cybermen. This is supposedly the same Doctor under Tennant, that sacrificed his life as the Doctor to save Wilfried from the radiation, knowing that he would have to regenerate. So, to leave Ko to take the fall based on a totally weak and unexplained backstory, was ridiculous.
Just can't believe they've given Jodie and Chibs another season. Just rubbing salt into the wound now.
Im pretty sure they contracted them for three seasons upfront unfortunately... We can only wish that season 14 will bring something else.
Why shouldn’t they have? They have given Moffat 6 series and he was far worst
@@justsomerandomguyonline1144 Moffat was nowhere near as bad as this. Regardless of what you think of Moffat's writing, at the end of his era everything was still intact. Chibnall on the other hand has basically butchered everything that made the Doctor as a character special and pumped out the dullest seasons of NuWho.
River could regenerate because it was explained that it was because she was conceived in the time vortex but now with this finale that can't be the case. This breaks an established character as well as just be a poor season all over. I truly hate Chibbs being anywhere near this show. I've given up caring.
The cliff fall in the timeless children is so hillarious like from a low-budget, collage spoof parody of the Lion King...
Anyone else completely disengaged with the show and watching this without watching the episode?
Chuck eeeeeeyup. Anything after Capaldis regeneration into Jodi....I reject it.
No, I watched the episode. Personally I tend to agree with The Council of Geeks' review of it: The Timeless Child twist is clearly very divisive, and there's a little too much "telling" but other than that the story itself is pretty well done and entertaining.
Chuck i stopped after capaldi
The whole Brenden stuff was pointless consider it was a “filter” over the real story (that the doctor was apparently seeing) I’d rather flesh out the Tc flashbacks instead of a good interesting pointless story and a underdeveloped cannon breaking one
* Brendan * canon
The chibnall eara just makes me relise how much we took Russle T Davies and Moffat and their story's for granted
This season had so many great ideas, that were just wraped up in a couple of minutes and wasted. I belive the island stuff is a dream the doctor has, based on her deleted memories. I realy liked that part, but they could have expanded it over the whole season. The doctor having weird dreams of humans she doesn't know. A short story each episode, that gives a clue to what realy happened. This could have been also woven in with the story of the gods feeding on nigtmares.
Or the cybermasters could have been born by a council of timelords that wanted to expand their life over the 12 regenerations they have. Or at least there could have been a few timelords for the doctor to confront about her backstory.
There was so much wasted time this season that could have been filled with build up or backstory or relationship building between the characters.
"This season had so many great ideas." No it didn't. Literally almost everything in this series was a rip-off of previous seasons.
* wrapped * believe * really
judging by the massive poor reception I'd say the episode was worse than "balls deep", it was full on "shaft deep".
Why not judge by watching the episode?
@@heliotropezzz333 I did and it was shite!
@@heliotropezzz333 Helen Trope bahahaha bet you have a wacky hair dye wanker
Am I under a gross misapprehension, or do you not have to pass through "shaft deep" to get to "balls deep"? Surely the scale goes "Head deep" < "Shaft Deep" < "Balls Deep".
@@ParanoidBobby You lose your bet. How much were you betting?
Finally. Harry is free. Looking forward to seeing what’s to come.
Liked for the "nice knowing ya Chris" bit
The issue is... the cyber man have gone to the imperial marksmanship academy
I find myself wondering how the final episode still got 2/10. Kill the moon can be considered a masterpiece in comparison - it didn't make any sense, however at least the dialogue was mostly decent back then. Neither did it have any serious overarching implications. The ludicrous backstory "developments" in this episode turn this train wreck of a series into a tsunami of idiocy. The finale wasn't just moronic, it was disrespectful to any decent writer, actor and crew member ever to have been involved with the show in it's 50+ year run. I still hark back to when canon was an integral part to the show and ambitious storylines contributed their bit in every series rather than just being some shoddy and frankly childish agenda driven concept. The result being nothing short of destructive, degrading years of partly excellent storytelling to one cataclysmic plothole.
"The ludicrous backstory "developments" in this episode turn this train wreck of a series into a tsunami of idiocy." - I know you posted this long ago, but I must have missed it. Damn - it was funny!
@@jvblhc Thx mate! Reading the comment back again reminds me I must have had fun writing it... 😅
Eccleston and Tennant have been the best Doctors since the reboot because their characters had DEPTH. We saw both Nine and Ten as de rigeur Doctors, swaggering about with confidence, trying to interact with humans without going over the top (like Twelve's note cards ... oh my actual god), but then something in the story would flip a switch and we'd see their dark sides: Nine when he meets the Dalek in the dungeon, Ten particularly during the ending to The Waters of Mars and when he dealt with the Family of Blood. Then Eleven was played too much on the strength of the legacy without actually contributing to it, and Twelve was played too much for laughs - remember him driving a Dalek shell around while mocking his supposedly most dangerous enemy? Thirteen has no darkness to her, which means she has no depth. It is almost as though the writers have said, well, the Doctor is a woman now, that's enough to set her apart from her predecessors. No. No, no, no, no, no. You still need to develop a character. You still need to make Thirteen into something. The War Doctor had more characterisation than this and he was in, what, two episodes? Three?
Chibnall sucks and Whittaker's immense talent is being wasted. Bin both of them and start afresh. And I am NOT saying Fourteen can't also be female. Just make her interesting.
14:46 I needed a good laugh after that abysmal clusterfuck to Doctor Who’s legacy
Dude no, the timeless child has no limit to regenerations, that's the point. But it's saying that Tecteun restricted the other time lords to 12.
Lady Wanderer
I can explain trenzalore easy.
So the doctor reached his regen limit or so he thought he did. The time lords realised the Doctor was going to find out there secret so they quickly pretended to give him more regenerations.
I really want captain jack back. I got excited when he beamed them up to his spaceship but then I was disappointed.
Would've been better if the Master was the timeless child.
It was even better that nobody was the child.
Just an illusion created by the master.
@@fivish honestly yes but that would mean good writing and this is Chibnall so.....
17:15 - This was explained in the episode. Brendon's story was a disguised representation of the story of the Timeless Child, stored in the Matrix by someone unknown who wanted to preserve the truth, but also to keep it from being obvious to the wrong people. Effectively it was a metaphor for the Doctor's origins and the time she spent working for The Division (the 'ex-employers' from 'Fugitive of the Judoon' who were after Ruth).
One bit I really love about that is when "Brendan's Father" is encouraging "Brendan" to join the Division, he gives his reason as "He wants to serve" but Brendan corrects it to "I want to make a difference". You can see both the Doctor's quintessential character and the seeds of The Doctor's eventual break with the Division in that 5 second snippet...
The Timeless Children essentially boils down to the Master showing off a PowerPoint project he’s made to the Doctor
At least I still have the classic series on DVD! Chibby can't take that away no matter how much trash he writes for his version of DW!
Keep your DVDs in decent order, they'll be changing the original episodes to 'be more in line with contemporary society' soon.
I was hoping that Ruth would be an alternate timeline or something that referenced one of the classic series episodes, or at least a future Doctor. I mean that would have been a very cool way to introduce the next Doctor. The Timeless Child was just an absolute mess.
The timeless child should have looked like a young William Hartnell
So they basically retconned Rasalons greatest achievement in favour of making the Doctor even more special.
You know this show's gone tits up when there's a Filthy Frank reference in the review script.
Hopefully, they get a new showrunner, honestly, DW would do great with a soft-reboot, heck maybe the show could adapt concepts from the Time Lord Victorious thingy in Big Finish.etc to act as an event to trigger said soft-reboot.
Wait until next season when The Doctor's little sister Dawn starts to play a major role rather than just hanging around in the background of the Tardis.
I love how you can still find nice parts in a series that gives me ptsd from all the previous failures.