5 Biggest DIY Mistakes Wiring a Socket
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- Опубликовано: 31 май 2024
- 5 common DIY mistakes wiring a socket, and how to address these issues.
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#electrical
#diy
#sockets 
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I love the fact that this is about mistakes allegedly made by DIYers. I have seen all these mistakes and more made by professional electricians in every house I have lived in.
You’re absolutely right, but I thought it made a better title haha, thanks for watching!
I have a degree in electrical engineering and electronic engineering and I have worked as an installation engineer in hospitals for 30 years - but I am not a qualified electrician. Consequently, due to part P regulations, I can no longer wire my own house, so when we had a new conservatory and on another occasion had an electric fire fitted, we had a professional in. Neither if them worked to the same standard as I would have done myself, the conservatory guy in particular fitted the boxes out of parallel to the floor and so close together that it was difficult to get the sockets on and cosmetically, nothing lined up neatly. The fire guy didn’t earth the back box… I found it very frustrating, no longer being able to do this myself (you can, but then you have to get it certified by a qualified guy and you have building regs issues…)
3:33 I am still disturbed by what I saw a week ago on a very similar American YT channel.
Unbelievable fact no. 1:
They've only just switched to sockets with a tamper proof mechanism roughly similar to our one which has been a legal requirement since 1947!
Second horror:
Their way of being "to code" is to strip (too much) extra insulation off the "hot and neutral" so that there's bare copper sticking out of the connection points. So that it's quicker for the inspector apparently! Also they don't have to and therefore don't sleeve the "ground" earth coppers, and whatismore sometimes join the earth and the neutral wire in its connection point on the back of the socket fitting.
Third and final:
There's no L, N or E markings just different coloured screws. You're just meant to know.
Thank God I'm a Limey.
yip that's 100% correct
@HalfTheWorldAway-mf5cf The faceplate was brass - I personally would have earthed the backbox - but I never said anything was dangerous, I said they didn't work to the same standard as I would have done myself...
5:57 Heartfelt thanks for freely admitting to being a screwaholic.
I do vertical for odd numbered years and horizontal for even ones.
I know, I know, there's no hope!
Thanks for watching!
(sigh) No, you sound like a perfectly normal human animal that obscures PARTS of your life in a total sess pit of details and; correct me if I'm wrong, completely ignores the details of numerous other parts of your life.
In my experience it's not just DIYers who make some of these mistakes.
Absolutely!
Absolutely! Thanks for watching!
Correct lol
Part P 6-week wonders spring to mind!
@@stevegray5263 I see a stat that other week that nearly 3/4 of all NIC approved contractors don't actually carry an industry recognised qualification.
Possibly the most educational, technically informative and beneficial 6 minutes of RUclips that I have watched! I now have a far better understanding of where I have gone wrong over the years but better still how to do it right in the future! Thank you!
I’m glad to hear it, thank you for watching and commenting!
If you do not know what you are doing then STOP playing silly buggers !
The only thing I would disagree on is aligning the screw heads, while it is visually nice I feel it is is important to firstly concentrate on tightening them enough, but not overtightening them. If you are focused on lining them both up you could end up either not tightening them quite enough, or overtightening them a bit. A lot of sockets (and switches) come with caps to cover the screw heads anyway.
Thanks for watching!
I once spent two weeks on a building site aligning all the screws on light switches and sockets to a forty five degree angle because that’s what the architect wanted
@@malcolmgullam8348 That's crazy! why 45' ??? if you are that OCD I would have expected vertical or horizontal, but 45'. Who ever notices anyway!
@@colinfaed5910 That’s what they wanted I was getting paid or
@@malcolmgullam8348 I just had a quick look round my house, most light switch screws aligned vertically, the socket screws are all over the place and in many cases hidden by plugs, also most too low to see without bending down anyway. I hope this doesn't make start looking at them in other people's homes!
I'm a sparky and the number of sparkies I know that are to lazy to put on grommets and who do not earth the back box or use an earth sleeve if they do never ceases to amaze me , furthermore I have seen many a sparky cut the cable so short that it's a real struggle to wire in the back of the socket at all . Truthfully this upload applies equally to DIYers and so called professional electricians who do not take pride in their work .
Absolutely, thanks for watching!
No requirement to earth the back box provided there is one metal fixed lug on the box. You earth the accessory and the fixing screw picks up the death from the fixed lug.
@@andyjones1433 you are right but its good practice , there are a million cheap sockets out there not all come with earthing via the backplate on the socket so why not take the extra minute and connect the alreadt available earth wire to the terminal ?.
Never said it wasn't good practice also, never said I didn't do it.@@shadow-Sun
Great video George. Awesome channel. Glad I’ve found it it’s already helped me out on my home renovation. Cheers.
Thank you, very appreciated! And thank you for watching!
Thank you for your delightfully organised presentation.
You’re very welcome, thanks for watching!
Many thanks, great information. I definitely learned something
Thanks for watching!
Thank you for the tip about not twisting the two earth wires together. I never thought about the reason for that.
Thanks for watching!
Very helpful video so many thanks. I'm a hobby woodworker and it's regarded as a good finishing touch when all exposed screw heads are aligned.
Thank you! Yes I think it shows good attention to detail!
But you also get plastic lugs to pop over them so not really an issue
Love this video! Much needed ❤
Thanks for watching!
Nice tips, thanks for sharing 👍🏿
Thanks for watching!
Sparky's take: very good video, couple of points though. Dont need to earth a back box so long as it has at least one fixed lug(like your box) boxes with all adjustable lugs must be earthed, however, it will do absolutely no harm to earth all boxes, it will just take longer for no real gain. Dont bother aligning your screw heads, nobody is EVER going to look at it and say "oh your screw heads are all inline".
Grommets 👍
Dont twist the cpc 👍
Double back cores when you have a single core in the terminal(dont bother with two or more) 👍
Leave spare length 👍
Wish every DIY socket I came across was like yours 😆
The screw heads is just obsessive OCD on my part haha. Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 surely correct tightness is more important?
I was alway taught to align heads, but at 45deg.
@@pauldarlington9157 yeah, I really cant knock it, fantastic practice 👍 this is honestly an example of me choosing to not go the extra mile in the interest of keeping pace
Another point of best practice, again something that I dont actually bother with unless spec'd(high integrity earth spec); If you put one cpc in each earth terminal, any problems with the earthing integrity within the socket itself will show up when it is next tested.
Nice. With the cost of living going the way it is, a lot of people can't afford to pay an electrician to change a faceplate or replace the integrated led downlight, so videos like these are very useful for the DIYer who wants to tackle these simple jobs themselves and make considerable savings in the process. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the support and thanks for watching!
Your not supposed to refit or install sockets or wire any electrics anymore ,unless you are qualified & have the proper certification . They don’t even want you fitting a plug anymore ,hence all new appliances being supplied with sealed plug & external fuse access . This is to stop idiots from fitting dangerous electrical fittings & poor wiring leading to possible electrocution ,fires ,injury or death .
@@maskedavenger2578 Not true.
@@garyredmond1890 It is true ,if you are unqualified these days ,you can be prosecuted for wiring ,installing electrical sockets ,without the proper legal certification to carry out the work involved . This is to stop DIYers & chancers causing injury & death caused by their meddling & botchery . Also gas piping & appliances has to also be fitted by proper certificated & trained fitters & plumbers for the same reasons . If you fit any gas or electric ,it has to be connected up to the main supply, tested & commissioned for use by a qualified technician in that field
@@johnmoore2026
Whether you see no problem the Masked Avenger is correct
Really nice. When I was still in the trade, I always aligned by screw heads so I could see instantly, if anyone had played about with my work.
Yes good point! Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 And thanks to you too. Been retired so long now. It's good to see one of 'Our Boys' practising the craft!
Great idea 👍
Diligent indeed thanks for the tips
Thanks for watching!
So glad I aren’t the only one who aligns the screws
Seems to have caused a stir in the comments haha, so glad to have someone on by side! Thanks for watching!
Yes having the screws vertical helps the power come down the wire!
@@samball6019 😂😂
Great video, thanks
Glad you liked it! Thanks for watching
Great channel 👍
Thank you! Very appreciated!
Good tips 👍
Thanks for watching!
I agree with everything you said and while it is a good idea to always run the cpc to a metallic backbox - as far as the regs are concerned it is only mandatory when the socket you are installing does NOT have an earthed screw hole at the FIXED backbox lug. Most brands of sockets these days strap both holes (or are fully metallic anyway) so it is usually unnecessary.
Agreed, belt and braces though. Thanks for watching!
The only problem with that is, when you remove a socket it is possible for the live to be bare if there was no grommet installed and for it to touch the metal box once you have removed the socket allowing it to shock you. Far better to take the earth to the box first then to the socket if there is an earth point fitted, although if there wasn't we were known to put a crimp onto one of the fixing screws, I know, rough but effective. Who you going to call.....rough bast.....
Sorry could you explain what sockets don't have an earth terminal.. In the UK we have three pin sockets which always have an earth pin even if its not used, in fact its always used even if its not as a functional earth, we use it as the earth pin on a plug is longer to open the gates to the live and neutral pins.
You are totally wrong about the regulations, what it has nothing to do with the socket, on back boxes for sockets then its about the lugs, if there are no "fixed lugs" then an earth to the back box is required, if there is one "fixed lug", which is most back boxes that go into a wall like the ones shown then it is recommended but not required, if there are two fixed lugs then it is not needed.
Generally most back boxes like the ones shown you will have two lugs either side, one will be fixed, one will move about, so it has one fixed lug so it is recommended but not required, however lets say that fixed lug is broke off and you use one of those lug replacement fixings, then you have no fixed lug so an earth would be required.
If in doubt put a fly lead...
@@steve11211 What do you mean i'm wrong about the regs? - you just reaffirmed my point! Also who said anything about sockets not having an earth terminal!?!
@@mastergx1 You said "it is only mandatory when the socket you are installing does NOT have an earthed screw hole at the FIXED backbox lug" Its not clear what exactly you mean by that, the socket is an accessory and not part of the backbox, apologies if I have misunderstood your point..
But you go on to say " Most brands of sockets these days strap both holes (or are fully metallic anyway) so it is usually unnecessary." I am guessing you mean double sockets, all sockets will have a common earth and if it has two terminals for the earth they will always be connected together, but this has nothing to do if a fly lead is actually required, its all to do with the back box if the connection points ie where the screw to fix the socket to the back box is a fixed lug or floating lug, most back boxes have one of each, so its recommended not required.
Hi there, nice basic and useful tips. thanks for posting the video.
Thanks for watching!
I remember once I was untwisting wire from old sockets to tidy up someone started shouting at me. In the end I said you wire it soon was apologetic. Twisted wires is so annoying. Also the same person though I was doing something else wrong when I was wiring a switch as I was putting a piece of sleeving on the black wire to show its live. I soon went through regulations with him until he got bored
Thanks for watching!
Thanks, great vid, I have a question: why must the 2 screws of the socket be lined either horizontally or vertically?
Purely aesthetic reasons haha, for anyone with OCD
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 oh I see :D
Strangely, I use the blanks supplied with the socket to hide the screws.
Why is everyone taking electrical advice off a DIYer?
Because he’s absolutely right in everything he said, that’s why 👏🏼 good video dude
Thank you!
Excellent video. 2.5 sq mm single strand T&E is horrible: nowadays one can get stranded, far better. My instructor was in the trade when 7/0.29 sq inch was still in use. He said that when 2.5 T&E came in, they called it stair rods - quite right: it's horrible. In the premetric days, most lighting circuits were done in 3/029 sq in, far better than 1.5 sq mm solid core. Stranded conductors give better connections.
Thanks for watching!!
It's single core for a good reason, if you just think about it.
My early 70s council house is stranded definitely copper it's horrible stuff and all cut quite short so can't really do a fresh cut not terminate.
I qualified in old cables pre solid. I was taught to coil slack in rear of sockets. So if took socket off it sprung out like a spring. Twist 2.5 together so actual connection. Side by side relies on screw continuity.
Thanks for watching!
clear video not sure I'm with you on the OCD screw alignment.
Thanks for watching!
I ALWAYS use a booted ferrule when terminating cables, I'll also use heat shrink. Not standard, but looks VERY tidy.
Yes does look very neat with the ferrules. Thanks for watching!
Ferrules are for stranded wire, not solid.
Oddly, most of my recent wiring has involved stranded wire. Did quite a bit with multistrand flexs and made the move to "bootlacing". I don't think I will ever look back now. It just makes dealing with fine high strand count wire so much easier and the connections so much more solid. Even just low voltage, DC screw terminals, pop a couple of ferrules on the ends and 90% of the hassle disappears.
Yep absolutely, ferrules are great. Thanks for watching
Class 5/6 (fine strands) stranded cable should always be crimped with ferrules.
Class 2 (thicker, less strands, often found in cables like 4 or 6mm twin and earth) crimping isn't required... Arguably shouldn't be crimped.
Regards
Tom
A little learning is a dangerous thing.
i always earh the back box ive seen a a mounting scre touch a live wire and cause a wall to go live after a plasterer was wetting a wall down
Exactly, always best practice to earth a metal box
Serious problem with cpc/earthing if that screw through the live didn't show up on testing or allowed the circuit to be energised. The mounting screws conect the backbox to earth via the faceplate.
The one problem I frequently have is trying to get the right length - too much and it's difficult to squash it into the back box. Any tips on getting it right and how to position the cable to make it easy to screw the socket on without straining the connections?
I like to do an inch or two past the edge of the box. Then dress the cables neatly into the back. Thanks for watching!
This video is very good. Just like i was trained way back in 1969. Differences were the black and red cables and plain green sleeving and the use of 7.029 wire. Awkward apprenticeship when the metric cables came in about 1971 and all the sizes and ratings of cables changed. For those not used to Imperial cables. 1.044, 3.029, 7.029,7.036,7.044. Tails were 7.064. Never forget those cable sizes.
Thank you for sharing! Thanks for watching!
What multimeters did you use then for testing?
@@zippymo672 We used a Clare instruments earth loop impedance tester and a wind up Megger. No multimeters in use on house wiring back in 1969. To test a current operated elcb, the normal test was a 100watt lamp across live to earth. If it tripped, that was good enough. Earth bonding was 2.5mm single. Rewireable wylex fuses on most things. Back in 1969, electric showers had not been introduced, rooms often got just 2 single sockets and kitchens had 4 sockets plus one on the cooker outlet. Looking back now, at what we installed, people would now call it unsafe. It was 14th edition regulations at that time. Water main for the main earth was still allowed until they were replaced with plastic then the 1 amp elcb came out by Chiltern. Back then, i was rewiring lead cased house wiring and joint boxes were made of plated brass. Often, the house would have switchgear with live and neutral fusing in the box. Times changed a lot during my worklife. I went back to college many times for new regulation courses. I finished with the 17th edition and retired aged 59 from full time work doing 58 hours on my last week. Good living and i bought a house aged 20, i now have 4 motorcycles and 2 high value cars. I have 3 Nephews working as Electricians now but not my business.
Don't underestimate all so called "DIYers" there's a lot of good people out here without letters after their names who've been doing their own electrics long before alot of the
"Experts" were born & are still are. Bits of kids can get carried away with their own self importance none more so in. this particular industry.
Agreed! Thanks for watching!
Earthing the metal box. The front plates that I've used have always had bonding strips attached to the screw mounting holes so this is done automatically when you put them on.
If you have one fixed lug, you don’t have to, but it is best practice to. Thanks for watching!
what's the advantage of aligning your screw head direction on the socket?
Purely aesthetics, I appreciate it is very minor to most people though haha
I always get my wife to test out any electrical work I’ve done. She’s had a few close calls but she’s still alive.
Hahaha safety first. Thanks for watching!
I agree with all your points, except the last one. For me, it's far more important to have the screw properly tight and let the slot point where it may.
Thanks for watching!
I see the esthetic of aligning the screws, but it’s just not something that I’ve ever done for myself, nor had anyone else comment about in real life. I guess it’s a simple enough thing to form as a habit 😊
Yeah just personal preference really. Thanks for watching!
Can I just say that there is no correct or incorrect way to terminate a cable into the socket. While I agree with you that doubling over a single cable
is probably benificial. There are many Electricians out there that don't do this, Including me and I have'nt as yet had a problem with any install I have
done. Also there is no Regulation in BS 7671 that states you should terminate single cables into sockets this way. So while your saying this is the correct way
to do it, it is largely a matter of choice for each individual Sparky. In this respect you are niether correct or in correct. Thanks for a very informative video.
Thank you for watching!
Go back to old installations (talking of before the 1980s) and it is common to find neither earth sleeving used or grommets. It's good practice to remedy both when replacing sockets and light switches. It can be a bit tricky in a masonry wall with traditional plaster as it often runs into the wall. As for earthing backbones, that's a controversial one as all sockets have earthed inserts in the screw holes. From what I read, if the metal fixing lugs are the sliding ones, then you are meant to earth the back box, but if there's at least one fixed lug, then it is not required. Of course the screws have to be done up properly, and it's good practice to check earth continuity on both the screws and any metal fascia plate anyway.
Again, many, and possibly most existing installations will not have earthed back boxes. There is also the problem that those 25mm deep back boxes have little spare space for yet more wires, especially if there is a spur and/or has a USB power outlet. Personally, I much prefer 35mm back boxes, or even 45mm in stud walls.
As for lining up the slots on the retaining screws, that is purely aesthetics, not a mistake and pointless if the screw heads are concealed by a fascia plate or have those little plastic insert plugs.
Nb. I was watching ith some amusement some American guidance where many recommend that insulation tape is wrapped round their sockets to avoid the danger of live terminals touching the earth (ground) wire as they are not sleeved. Seems a bit strange that sleeving isn't mandated in the USA. However, the US has quite a nice rule that the continuity of the ground circuit must not be interrupted if a socket is removed, which means that a pigtail is used for that purpose. That way if there's a poor ground connection on a replacement socket, it won't affect the integrity of the ground circuit on downstream sockets. It would fit quite neatly with a terminal on the backplate, although those on UK ones are too small to be used that way. Also, on a ring, but not a radial, the are two routes to earth.
Thanks for the info! Thank you for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 John Ward covers backbox earthing and the regs in his video on the subject. Of course there's nothing wrong with earthing the back box, and some consider it best practice but I don't find it's that common.
It is covered in the IET guidance rules which John goes through, and that explicitly states that a back box with at least one fixed lug is considered to be earthed provided, that is, the accessory in question (socket, switch etc.) has a terminating earth connector which will connect to conductors on the screw holes.
often wondered about the earthing arrangements that seem to exist on plastic boxes
@@theotherside8258- if you mean a single earth terminal in a plastic back box, that’s for earth continuity if the accessory does not have an earth terminal (e.g. light switch).
As DIYer I have to agree about backbox depth. Our house has mostly metal conduit set in the plaster apart from new instals which have just the cover strips. Plastic fitted by professionals or metal if I did the job. All sockets and switches were surface mounted plastic so no earth continuity. Earth/CPCs were taken direct to the face plates. Over the first 2 or 3 years we were here I gradually chopped out and installed metal back boxes. All at least 35mm as the original face plates were straight back entry and I soon found that trying to push the plate in squashed the wires flat against the back of the box. Older face plates often had a much heavier lump on the back leaving very little room for the wires, bent at right angles and tight to the backbox. I gradually replaced all the face plates with more modern ones with angled top entry for the wires. All earth wires were sleeved and taken to the backbox terminal plus an extra sleeved length from the faceplate to box. We have now replaced them all again with brushed steel face plates which are all earthed via the fixing screws. Although the sockets also have a wire to the backbox as well. I am also lucky in that my neighbour, until last year, was an electrician and would always come round and check everything for me.
Great video. Funny I thought I was a rank amateur for bending back the ends of single core (professionals often don't seem to bother). P.S. Do a bit of voice coaching - at about 4min50sec you relax and the voice becomes natural and flowing. Many thanks again.
Thank you, I do appreciate the honest feedback, talking to a camera on your own doesn’t come easily to me haha!
Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 Don't worry about it. The high quality of the content far outweighs any verbal "stiffness"
Is the metal box not connected to the switch plate earth bar via the faceplate screws?
It is, but still best practice. Thanks for watching!
Shouldn't be removing the faceplate live so no need to earth the back box as it's done through the 3.5 mil screws
Is it okay if the conductor touches the back of the plastic faceplate? Should I insert the conductors as far as they will go?
Conductors shouldn’t be touching the face plate, but you’re fine to be pushing them fully into the terminals
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 thanks for getting back, if I push them fully in I can hear thermal tapping on the back of the plastic front part, is this normal?
Do you still have to align the the screw heads when they are covered by those little white plastic covers?
Depends how severe your ocd is haha. Thanks for watching!
there's always a plastic cover short, but I'd add to test the socket before you put them on.
I think they should make transparent covers so you can check that the slots are aligned without having to take them off
Very informative video, many thanks. I will add that the screw alignment for internal sockets must be aesthetical. If however it was an outdoor project the alignment of the screws is of importance. Old school carpentry in particular would have the slots vertical to allow water to pass. If the screw slot was horizontal it would allow water to gather and possibly rust. atb Mally
Thank you and thanks for watching!
you missed out depth of back box
i originally tried to just sink in a few 25mm ones and they were far too shallow so they all came out again and 35mm ones were dropped in, slightly below the surface too so when the skim was done they were just a tad bit deeper again, which was an added bonus
got the fancy wago type sockets so no need for screws in the back or doubling over the cable, but the rest of the points you make are well worthy of making
Yep good point, although most of the sockets I’ve used fit in a 25mm back box fine. I think it is the usb and flat plate stuff that usually needs 35mm. Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 35mm should be standard. You talk a lot about removing the sockets in the future, a deeper box allows for future changes with no damage
@@elliotwilliams7421 well I agree that would be better in terms of future proofing, but what you are talking about there is chopping in every socket where as 25mm sits within the limits of the dab and board so you dont need to chop the box back. I think that really depends on what the customer wants. That should impact your price if it was a job for example
@@benjamincompton9767 quote 35mm as standard and give reasons, up to the customer to question it.
Obviously there are times when it isn't applicable, but I just prefer a 35mm box, more space especially if you have 3 cables. Leaves space for a join if more sockets are added in the future.
Dot dab, depends on the person doing it....... I just take a twin blade chaser to the wall during the 1st fix.
Another one is back boxes that are too shallow. Trying to fit a faceplate on when there are too many wires in the way. I'm restoring an old house at the moment. When it comes to first fix I plan to fit 32mm, or more, deep boxes in all the stud walls (they are thick enough).
Yes absolutely, thanks for watching!
In my sockets I have a blue neutral, brown live and green earth. The earth is connected to the back box to be ‘earthed’.
I’ve been told that I would require a full rewire if I intend to use any conductive faceplate like brushed metal. Can I not connect the earth wire to the new face plate?
That doesn’t sound right to me, but probably best to get advice from a professional or a few different professionals. Thanks for watching!
Twisting the cables together was a thing done in the 60s and 70s ( as a spark from that time). It was said it made a better mech connection ..as when screwing down more copper to grip on .. times have changed , better equipment , testing etc and tools ..
Thanks for watching!
Still the same old crappy screw wire clamping as found in switches and sockets. Roll on the day when the same wire clamp styles found in rcd's and mcb's become the norm. No wonder the screws have a tendency to slacken over time, it's amazing the connections last as long as they do.
I always twist and sleeve the cpc on ring final socket outlets, my thinking is, it is more important to the long term integrity of the cpc circuit than to help out if a fault may develop in 20 or more years, how many have tested a ring final and found no cpc continuity, if the break happens at two points some outlets wouldn't be earthed, and it's mostly due to a loose screw and one cable has dropped out.
Thanks for watching!
I was under the impression that it was not necessary to earth the back box if at least one of the lugs was fixed. Is this a new reg or is this just best practice? Its very rare to see it done
The regs say desirable, so not required, but i think certainly considered best practice. Thanks for watching!
I was wondering what situation you would have 4 wires in a socket terminal . ? I can understand 1,2, and 3 wires but not 4 4?
Two spurs off a socket, not sure if that is allowed or not actually?
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 I didn’t think that would be acceptable ? I have seen sockets with 4 wires and the holes look a bit overcrowded.
In my own home I always rub a bit of silicone oil on the rear edge of switches and sockets, so they come off without chipping the paint. They are often installed when paint hasn't had time to cure.
That is a great tip, I’ve never thought of that and it is definitely a problem. Thank you for sharing!
At the end of your video where you’re aligning screws - Here’s some advice from a DIYer on most wall sockets you will find small, white plastic inserts that will cover the screws and leave a smooth face on the back face of the socket.
Thanks for watching!
Do you have to earth the back box because on 17th edition I’m pretty sure it wasn’t compulsory.😊
You’re right, it isn’t compulsory, but I think still best practice. Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 we always did
As an ex sparky I totally agree with all your comments apart from the final one. There is absolutely no electromechanical advantage/ reason for aligning the fixing plate screw heads . Yes you often find this detail on fine cabinet making and boat building but only for decorative or aesthetic purposes. I think you need to point that fact out in your video
I do say it is just an attention to detail thing, but agreed I could have said explicitly that it isn’t part of the regs. Thanks for watching!
Just watched your video and was surprised you never mentioned not to have a washing machine next to electrical box, especially with the water outlet right next to it?
It’s not something I’ve heard of being a big issue, I guess where the water is contained within the machine, rather than free to spray like a tap or shower, it perhaps isn’t a big risk? Thanks for watching!
As a competant builder/plumber and sparky albeit DIY my issue is 25mm socket boxes.I actually thought they had to be 35mm thesedays on the ring?Three cables running through never mind needing crimps and they are too shallow.25mm for the lighting circuit fine but not for ring or cooker boxes.
As far as I’m aware, back box depth is personal preference. I’ve personally never had an issue fitting 2 cables and a regular socket in a 25mm box, but appreciate it becomes very difficult with 3 cables, flat plate or usb sockets. So i do tend to use 35mm boxes or sink the 25mm boxes a little deeper
Regarding earthing the box, why isn't the socket earth connected to the mounting brackets?
Technically it is, but the regs say it is desirable to have an Earth fly lead. Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 Thanks.
Very good guide, just be clear, the Neutral and Line are both Live.
Thanks for watching!
Neutral is earthed at substation. But, neutral could be live in an installation if there was a fault - so, yes, I'd treat N as if it were L to be sure.
My view on the facing plate screws is when they’re tight, they’re tight. Not gonna over or under tighten for aesthetic reasons.
I’m a DIYer, and have never made any of these mistakes. Mind you, it’s hard to get metal back plates these days.
I’ll be honest, I wish we could use 15mm or 22mm copper piping (soldered joints) as conduit, thus containing any fires, and also providing an additional earth on circuits. But then, when I made a male DIN to female vehicle power adapter, I used 30A cable despite the DIN socket being only 15A on the truck. I like a bit of redundancy, it’s safer.
Thanks for watching!
Here in the US, home inspections are done by people with little training (I'm not talking about the professionals who inspect the original electrical installation). Those 'certified' inspectors look for screws which are lined up.
It's just one of those things on learns to do to minimize problems down the road for home-owners.
@@ethelryan257, so to utilise an old phrase & make it new, someone’s oily rag checks another engineer’s work?. Dang that’s whack. I’m looking at a light switch I fitted myself, secure against the wall, both screws tightened equally, one’s at about 340 degrees, the other 250
@@ethelryan257 Do you get an electrician to replace the faceplates after the tiling is done in the US ?
The copper pipe bit reminds me of the anecdote about the man having a suite made for himself. He had two jackets made in case he got a cigarette burn in one; then burnt a hole in the trousers.
I really enjoyed this. From the perspective of an electrician working in the USA, were I to double over a wire like that, the inspector would not only fail that connection but certainly want the entire installation yanked and checked with a fine tooth comb.
Not saying it's wrong, so the arm-chair experts can stand down, but there is a very strong move away from anything which would weaken a connection through copper annealing here in North America.
Interesting to hear! Thanks for watching!
How would this cause copper annealing? If anything the bend would slightly work harden the copper. Provided the screw clamps the wires on both sides of the bend (as shown in this video) you have a better electrical connection, if you somehow only manage to clamp one side (pretty much impossible) then it's as good as a single wire without the bend.
I've started using those fire retardant membrane grommets these days over those open ones. You just make a small slit in it (I find it neater if you do this vs shoving the cable in), bash it into the hole, and insert your cable and pull it back a little. I imagine the regs will probably mandate these if they haven't already, since they're intended to choke out any fires that begin in a box before they can escape.
Sounds like a good idea, thanks for watching!
I thought that I was a bit compulsive about symmetry - but leaving screws oriented the same way! That's positively OCD :)
Hahaha attention to detail! Thanks for watching!
Got me at the end with having the screws at 90 degrees and identical? Is that a personal OCD thing because no-one notices that, and you screw them in until they're tight, shouldn't overtighten or back off just to get the slots identical.
Just a personal one really, thanks for watching!
Another big one that you see a lot is terminal screws tightening down onto insulation instead of copper.
Yep that’s a good one
What about putting the cables into conduit? Ever drill into the wall and nick a cable, if it is in conduit it can be pulled out and replaced, if the cable has been plastered over, you ruin the wall. Irrespective of the regs, I'd always earth the metal back box, I take a dim view of those that dont.
Yeah cables in conduit would be useful, but generally means more chasing at install, so more time and money. A DIYer might want to spare the time, but i think a professional would charge a lot extra at first fix.
Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 Very minimal extra cost I would think! I suspect just taking the easiest minimalist way out; the same way plasterers don't plaster right down to the floor, (It makes the job of attaching skirting board to "fresh air" very interesting).
In my house, UK 1978, most of the screws holding the sockets and switches to the boxes have had their threads mangled. One handyman said this is caused by inappropriate use of power screwdrivers.
Crossing the thread on every box is probably someone using an electric screwdriver carelessly. Thanks for watching
Yeah tell me about it, I've a friend who does everything up by an electric that's set to max, to make sure there's zero risk of it ever undo ever again not only that every screw with a cross-head he somehow mangles
Also:
One has recently become aware, due to experience, of an inherent problem where metal boxes are fixed in place with screws that have countersunk screw heads.
The screw head can present a really sharp eadge, that, because the box holes aren't countersunk, remains very slightly proud of the metal surface.
Should a wire become hooked up on or resting against the eadge of the head, it can very quickly wear through the cable insulation. 👍.
Cheese head or rounded screw heads are my preference now.
Yes good point on the screws. Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 There's a simple way to avoid this: use of acoustic putty (or countersunk finishing washers). The putty is great though as it provides a fire barrier as well as some acoustic properties.
People in the comments saying the screw head orientation is not important and is not a safety issue… you’re wrong!
From a safety standpoint it’s imperative that the screw heads are oriented correctly as incorrectly oriented screws could pose a danger to anyone in the vicinity (within 10ft).
For those who don’t understand the danger, allow me to explain.
I am a little OCD and fitted all of my sockets and switches with the screws all oriented vertically. A friend came and tightened the screws a little further leaving them randomly oriented. I had no choice but to hit him over the head with my spirit level and stabbed him through the left foot with my screwdriver.
It took weeks for him to recover from his injuries and it took me months to recover from my PTSD associated with the entire debacle. My friend and I no longer speak.
I hope you now understand the danger associated with incorrectly oriented screws? Have a safe day!
Hahaha! Thanks for watching!
could be remedied by putting socket on sideways as a compromise
@@theotherside8258 You sir are a genius!
The other reason for a grommet is in some cases the cable will vibrate and wear the insulation from the cable eventually shorting out onto the metal box. I'm a retired sparky and when I first started as an apprentice I had a desk my dad built in my room, so I wired it up and I had a particular corner where it was difficult to get fixings. Everything appeared fine except when things got very quiet, I could hear a vibrating hum, it took me forever to trace it back to the corner, I eventually had to make a tight bend to get close fixings on the cable and stop it vibrating.
How long does it take two electricians to change a lightbulb?
How about 5 hours!
Why?
When you go to a building to fix a light fitting and you get there, to be escorted to a huge door. When they open it you find a huge freezer, and the light, a 5ft fluorescent encased in 300mm of ice.
The problem was they couldn't switch off the freezer unit, that was a matter of inches from the fitting, so, even with arctic jackets on it was our fingers and feet that got cold quickest. We had to use a hot air stripper to warm the fixings that were frozen solid once they started to move we took it away and the fixing instantly froze again. From that we estimated the temperature we were working in was -50°C! The estimate was taken from a survival book, if you are at either Pole and don't know the temperature, spit, if it hits the ground and freezes instantly it is -50, if you spit and it immediately freezes it is -70, so removing the heat gun it had to be at least -50 for it to freeze immediately.
Have you seen the new MK Smart sockets, £250 each, thank god I'm retired.
That’s very interesting on the vibrations, not something I’ve heard of before, thanks for sharing!
Fortunately as a diyer I doubt I’ll ever be thawing a light fitting out in negative 50 haha, but certainly a good story!
£250 is crazy money, they’re not going to sell any at that price!
Don't blame amateurs or DIYers. All my sockets installed with the house have short cables making it very difficult to change socket covers. not seen any grommits used. Problem is intrinsic to the socket design. There's always a danger that a cable that seems tightly fastened comes loose or free without being noticed as the socket cover is placed on the box twisting or moving the cable. If the boxes were designed so that cables were wired into them directly , ie all the structure of the socket cover built into the box instead and then a cover can just plug into that and be screwed on. You would have no need for excess cable being folded away as the cover is put on
Thanks for watching!
Done a lot of decorating in our home recently and noticed that very few of our back boxes are earthed. Not sure if that’s down to the previous owner or the builders 🤔🙄
Could be either! Thanks for watching!
I would suggest that taking a fly lead from the cpc terminal to the ko box is unnecessary. Were the box to somehow become live the plate screws would result in a very low impedance earth fault resulting in instantaneous disconnection. Even if this were not to happen ( an unlikely scenario) the heads of the 3.5 mm screws recessed into the plate would hardly present a shock risk.
The purpose of these lugs was when it was customary to run an earthed conduit to an accessory and not have a cpc cable, but usung the containment as the fault path. This is still permitted but seldom encountered. The lug provided means to bring the earth potential on the accessory's box onto the accessory be it a socket, switch, fused connection etc.via a fly lead into the earth terminal or lug.
Agreed, but belt and braces. Thanks for watching
I'd have wires twice width of box if fed from above or below; 1½ times if fed from sides. I regret going shorter in past
Thanks for watching!
Number 4, earthing the back box is not required on a socket if the circuit is protected by a 30ma residual current device. No harm in still doing it though
Thanks for watching!
Although it is not a bad idea, earthing a metal back box to the socket is no longer required as long as long as you have at least one fixed lug which is used to secure the socket front to the back box via the machine screws.
Yes true, I think the regs state desirable rather than required. Thanks for watching!
With regards to the earth wires a better you can always; As you have keep them separate, strip more back on one conductor, measure the earth sleeve from the cable entry to the box earth point slide the sleeve onto the conductor, double the conductor and connect it to the box earth terminal. The remaining conductor is cut and doubled over to fit into the socket earth point, and an earth sleeve is fitted before connection.
I like that. Incorporating all the parts in the earth ring means they're included in any integrity test anywhere on the ring.
Great idea! Thanks for watching!
Thanks for commenting!
What is the reasoning for the screws being vertical or horizontal?
Purely aesthetic, but appreciate few people would notice or care!
My father always did the same. Purely pride in neatness.
Horizontal just collects dust & muck - vertical every time!
Mmm
In the Netherlands we do not use metal ins instalation boxes, but made of rigid plastic.
Much safer!
I guess we use metal for longevity. Thanks for watching!
One observation that I believe is missed is to have a box where an exposed knock out is not covered. Another thing I disagree about UK code is not earthing this type of cabling (we call cable Romex) with the earths first bonded to the metallic box and with all earths first bonded inside the box. If you open that live box and the box isn't earthed and The Live (or Neutral with current flowing) makes contact with the metallic box, you will feel it.
Interesting, thanks for sharing and thanks for watching
I like the way you present the info with no messing about. However, the first example of needing a grommet is incorrect. If the cable(s) are hard plastered in there is no need for a grommet, and left a vacant hole in the first box.? Also, you fitted the boxes upside down with relation to the earth lug, It's at the bottom for a reason, it's real easy to see it in that position especially for lower down sockets. Lastly, you seem to leave a fair bit too much outer grey on the cables in the boxes after you have stripped them. My examiner would have a field day with all of this !! But, good info for a DIY audience, cheers !!
Thank you. I prefer to fit boxes upside down so the earth lug doesn’t get full of plaster, I don’t think there is a requirement to have it oriented a certain direction. Thanks for watching!
Glad to see someone saying to double over the core before inserting it into the terminal. I said this to a professional electrician and he said oh no you musn't do that because the cable could fracture at the bend. Another point to the benefit of doubling over the cable is that when using just a single cable, the copper can migrate under the screw pressure and the terminal becomes loose. This is also a hazard.
Absolutely! Thanks for watching!
The problem for most people isn't the doubling over it's the over tightening of the screw terminal. It's so easy to over tighten without a torque screwdriver.
@@paulw6183 what torque do you tighten to?
@@AmirKhan-qx2lr
Depends on the size of the screw in the terminal
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 I understand why you do it. It is one of those immediate fails here in the US during and inspection. Except for low voltage, we tend to avoid more than one wire under a screw connector and size the connectors appropriately. You have to contend with a different system.
Again, arm-chair idiots, I'm not criticizing him, just mentioning that different places do things differently.
Earthing the backbox is generally more of a best practice (unless both lugs are adjustable then it's required), as for the screw alignment, meh, I've used LAP sockets and switches for years and they come with plastic caps :)
Thanks for watching!
Did I miss you mentioning to sleeve the bare earth conductors
Yes i think i missed it, but definitely a mistake people make!
The metal box is earthed via the outlet mounting earth screw, fly lead not required?
True, but only in the case of fixed lugs. The regs state no earthing of the back box required when it has two fixed lugs. For two adjustable lugs the box must be earthed as the adjustable lugs can’t be relied on for a good connection. For one fixed and one adjustable, which in my experience is most common, the regs state it is desirable. A bit subjective, but I’d say it is certainly best practice in that case.
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759I have seen some electricians argue both ways, as an electrician from another country I would earth the box. I can't understand why the regs state it is desirable. Its required or not, make a rule. It should not have to be best practice.
Yes agreed!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 I am a fully qualified sparky in uk and I dont earth the back box with a flylead on sockets (presuming there is at least one fixed lug), regs state that if there is at least one fixed lug it is not required.... My reasoning for this is in a few arguments, firstly and easily the back box is earthed so if it for whatever reason line comes into contact with it then the over current protection device will trip. Next the back box is not actually touchable anyway, its in the wall how is anyone going to touch it? I do put a fly lead if I fit surface metal clad boxes, the only time it could be touched is when removing the socket and anyone doing that should be competent...
But why not just do it anyway I hear you ask, well a lot of back boxes are only 25mm deep, and often you will not just have one cable you will have two or even three, so trying to put in another cable and filling the box even more is not needed especially when the cables are a bit older and less flexible, also the biggest problem I see with DIY is not tightening the connections enough, you should always tighten, push the socket to the plate, pull it back out and then tighten again as when cables move they can become lose in the terminal, having potentially 4 cpc cables in a terminal increases the likely hood I find of a loose cable or one of the cables having a poor connection because its biting into the sleeving. (Honestly try it in a kitchen with a counter top socket with a unit above so its difficult to see anything, easy when there is just one cable but that is rare)
A lot of the old boys when they did MICC cable use the outer core for the cpc so just used two core MICC and just earthed to the back box so when you take off a socket there is no earth cable in the socket (Not my preference I have to say but been fine for years).
You could argue and I always use pan head screws instead of countersunk screws as the cable can get caught, also put a washer on so it spreads the stress of the fixing, might be overkill but I think just as important as a flylead...
@@steve11211 Very well put, and 100% correct about the regs.
My augment for still having the cpc fly even when there are fixed lugs, is what if the socket is latter changes for one that isn't? Example I have seen is where the nice MK one has been changed for a cheep chinese one, because is has USB charging. I know this wouldn't be be the original installers problem typically. But they could deny they changed it, especially on a rental property. By having the fly lead in "just in chase", you are stopping a possible argument down the road.
I would be very interested in the counter argument.
My brother make learning safe electric which colour original box.
Thanks for watching!
I wired a double socket with 6mm outdoor 3 core flex to help my spark out. Thankfully his only comment was, "Could have been slightly tighter". Which was because I used too small a screw driver without enough power. I also laughed that I'd not left it open for him to check, I'd left it open for him so he had to do the ackward bit of getting the 6mm cables to fit behind the plug!
Thanks for watching!
I am a plumber but was told by a great spark to fit the screws vertically so no water or debris would stay in them long enough to seep into the fitting, makes sense to me but like I say I am a plumber ( but I do know how water/ fluids get into things )😳
Thanks for watching!
Why do you earth the back boxes? The faceplate screws do that anyway.
If you’ve not got any fixed lugs, you have to. Thanks for watching!
Every socket and switch in my newish build house has the cpc twisted together.
It’s not wrong, just wouldn’t be considered best practice
I did the same in our 4 floor home. We separated the 4 floors into 2 plus 2 and fitted a second meter. When the inspector came to check the work he thought his tester was faulty because the earth bonding was so good. When he left, he even turned round and came back to check the readings. Terminal screws come loose over time and twisting the wires together ensures the ring stays intact.
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 but you had WRONG in big letters on the video title! Good practise 🤣
Twisting CPCs together is utter dogshit! 😊
Gutted! 😂
If you know about testing you will know why it’s sh*t!
why do the boxes not come with grommets?
I guess they don’t know how many you would need per box, so makes more sense to sell separately
So, why are back boxes supplied without grommets and why can I not find grommets in packs of 10s
Because you might need one grommet or 6 for a single back box. They’re sold in bigger boxes as they’re aimed at professionals fitting lots, not DIYers. Thanks for watching!
Sorry I didn´t explain my situation more graphically. I will take photos and publish them here. Thanx
Please do!
The only thing I would add to this is do not twist any tails together in the terminal, it is a devil of a job to untwist the ends if opening the circuit to add further sockets and continue the ring!
Thanks for watching!
The regulations state that a fly lead to the back box isn't required, as long as at least one of the boxes lugs are fixed, not movable. Its earthed through the faceplate screws and faceplate earth strap.
Agreed, although i think the regs say it is desirable but not essential. I still think best practice to do so, but definitely up for debate. Thanks for watching!
@@TheDiligentDIYer1759 I've not found anywhere in the regs where it says "desirable". Can you point me to it?
2:38 "and do the screw-up". Was that an intentional pun?
It was not haha, but if the shoe fits….
I think the screw direction is a personal preference (mild ocd) not a requirement.
Yep haha. Thanks for watching!