Thank you for the timing of this video. This is literally EXACTLY the situation I was looking to compare - I went looking for a compact dual channel preamp, found a good deal for a JuicedLink RM222, then went looking for reviews. I use a Shure FP23, but it's designed by Sound Devices so it's basically the same thing as the MP-1. I recently picked up a matched pair of mics to record a grand piano via the H5 and it was good, but I knew it could be better (Since I couldn't use the single channel amp on the FP23). The added extra benefit of having the backup track option for dialogue in a video production makes this a winning combo in my opinion. I should have the JuicedLink in my hands by the weekend. Thanks again!
Thanks for sharing Sir. Curious, what attenuator did you use on the SD MP-1 into H5 setup? And what input did you use on the H5? Since you attenuated the line out signal of SD MP-1 (and essentially have a mic out signal) you have the option of using the combo jacks at the bottom of the H5 or the ext mic on the XY capsules. 7:30 / 8:11 - did you have a limiter turned on somewhere? What are those meters on the left? Do I hear distortion? For both S/N ratio tests on H5 and SD the recording sounds limited and distorted. On the juiced link it's good.
I tried two different attenuators. First, I used my buddies expensive Shure locked at 50dB. I ordered the Hosa ATT448 with hopes that adjusting it to 20, 30 or 40 would give me more options. As far as input... For this video I used the XLR in on the h5. I spent 3-4 days testing the 1/4 jack line in and even going XLR to mini jack going straight into the stereo in on the H5. The combo jacks on the H5 ARE NOT line in. They are consumer line in and the MP-1 will still be too much. Additionally, they DO NOT bypass the preamp. There's no way to bypass the preamp on the H5...That's preciously why I ordered the HOSA attenuator to have the flexibility of testing different stages of attenuation rather than being locked in at 50dB. I did notice that I could lower the amp on the stereo in by much more than the XLR in on the h5 before the signal doesn't go through. For example, you can set the H5 stereo to like 1 and it will pass through, where the XLR or 1/4 jack in requires like a 2. In post, I normalised each section of audio and used a limiter in post to keep the peaks at -6dB. However, before each recording I played a test tone and calibrated it to -12dB before recording. That way each amp was amping the same volume to the same level if that makes sense. I just normalised and boosted everything in post so that you guys wouldn't be having to adjust your volume knobs every 5 seconds. I do think that the S/D amp is probably the best hands down. However, I have no way of testing it fairly. I see no reason to buy it over the JL/H5, and if you had a mixer that accepts line level XLR you probably have better preamps built into the mixer or field recorder (like the 633 or zoom f8). Show less
Cool comparison, though my understanding is simply unplugging the microphone from a mic input doesn't allow an accurate representation of the amplifier's noise level in many cases. It messes with the circuit by creating an open circuit, changing the impedance, which allows possible interference and other artifacts. Also some preamp/amp circuits I believe are designed to mute when there's an open circuit. "If you want to measure noise input on a microphone input, you should do so with "dummy" impedance. Almost universally a 150Ohm resistor is used for this. Some amplifier circuits will have increased noise output with no source connected and generally speaking the circuit is not "closed" so all kinds weird stuff can happen that would not happen with a mic connected."- Random Redditor on an interesting post I read a while back. I just mention this because at least with my H6 the noise level noticeably increases when a mic is disconnected and I believe the H5 has a similar circuit. That said the MP-1 is definitely superior, and the Juiced Link is also very cool!
dayummmmmmmmmmmmm. wish this video was out earlier. too bad for some people that already purchased their gear. h5 and juiced link were somethings on my shopping list. @tim kyle 1.) - for my set up, i was also looking at the Video Devices PIX-LR XLR Audio Interface for PIX-E Monitors . got any experience with this? 2.) For 1 man band situations, using Juicedlink out to camera for interviews /documentaries would be perfect. But for short film 1 man band shoots, would you say its not ideal to use juicedlink-out-to-camera since actors/camera may be moving? I was thinking about, recording audio on a separate audio recorder (h5), would there ever be a time where sound operator would have to move really far away from the camera? With the JuicedLink connected to camera, the xlr cable should be decent long enough to move around /behind the camera. what are some pros/reasons to have the audio recorded separately (h5) vs recording audio directly to the video (juicedlink).?We have to sync h5 audio to the video anyways. 3.) I am reading online for h5, it does have "back up recording" at -12. and you said that it can output straight to the camera. Arent both of these functions what the JuicedLInk have/can do? please help!
1. I'm not familiar with that device, sorry! 2. You can run xlr cables over longer distances with no issues because they are balanced cables. The issue you run into is the juiced link by itself outputs a 3.5 stereo jack which is not a balanced cable. You want the juiced link close to your recorder or end source (camera). You can still have a person on a boom far away but they can't monitor the sound as they are recording. I'd opt to record into a zoom type recorder and sync in post if that's the case.
Thank you for the timing of this video. This is literally EXACTLY the situation I was looking to compare - I went looking for a compact dual channel preamp, found a good deal for a JuicedLink RM222, then went looking for reviews. I use a Shure FP23, but it's designed by Sound Devices so it's basically the same thing as the MP-1.
I recently picked up a matched pair of mics to record a grand piano via the H5 and it was good, but I knew it could be better (Since I couldn't use the single channel amp on the FP23). The added extra benefit of having the backup track option for dialogue in a video production makes this a winning combo in my opinion.
I should have the JuicedLink in my hands by the weekend. Thanks again!
Glad this helped! The JL has a really solid preamp!
You should do this test with a Tascam DR-40.
Thanks for sharing Sir. Curious, what attenuator did you use on the SD MP-1 into H5 setup? And what input did you use on the H5? Since you attenuated the line out signal of SD MP-1 (and essentially have a mic out signal) you have the option of using the combo jacks at the bottom of the H5 or the ext mic on the XY capsules.
7:30 / 8:11 - did you have a limiter turned on somewhere? What are those meters on the left? Do I hear distortion? For both S/N ratio tests on H5 and SD the recording sounds limited and distorted. On the juiced link it's good.
I tried two different attenuators. First, I used my buddies expensive Shure locked at 50dB. I ordered the Hosa ATT448 with hopes that adjusting it to 20, 30 or 40 would give me more options.
As far as input... For this video I used the XLR in on the h5. I spent 3-4 days testing the 1/4 jack line in and even going XLR to mini jack going straight into the stereo in on the H5. The combo jacks on the H5 ARE NOT line in. They are consumer line in and the MP-1 will still be too much. Additionally, they DO NOT bypass the preamp. There's no way to bypass the preamp on the H5...That's preciously why I ordered the HOSA attenuator to have the flexibility of testing different stages of attenuation rather than being locked in at 50dB.
I did notice that I could lower the amp on the stereo in by much more than the XLR in on the h5 before the signal doesn't go through. For example, you can set the H5 stereo to like 1 and it will pass through, where the XLR or 1/4 jack in requires like a 2.
In post, I normalised each section of audio and used a limiter in post to keep the peaks at -6dB. However, before each recording I played a test tone and calibrated it to -12dB before recording. That way each amp was amping the same volume to the same level if that makes sense. I just normalised and boosted everything in post so that you guys wouldn't be having to adjust your volume knobs every 5 seconds.
I do think that the S/D amp is probably the best hands down. However, I have no way of testing it fairly. I see no reason to buy it over the JL/H5, and if you had a mixer that accepts line level XLR you probably have better preamps built into the mixer or field recorder (like the 633 or zoom f8).
Show less
Cool comparison, though my understanding is simply unplugging the microphone from a mic input doesn't allow an accurate representation of the amplifier's noise level in many cases. It messes with the circuit by creating an open circuit, changing the impedance, which allows possible interference and other artifacts. Also some preamp/amp circuits I believe are designed to mute when there's an open circuit.
"If you want to measure noise input on a microphone input, you should do so with "dummy" impedance. Almost universally a 150Ohm resistor is used for this.
Some amplifier circuits will have increased noise output with no source connected and generally speaking the circuit is not "closed" so all kinds weird stuff can happen that would not happen with a mic connected."- Random Redditor on an interesting post I read a while back.
I just mention this because at least with my H6 the noise level noticeably increases when a mic is disconnected and I believe the H5 has a similar circuit. That said the MP-1 is definitely superior, and the Juiced Link is also very cool!
While zooms are better than built in DSLR audio they have ALWAYS had annoying noise
So the Juiced Link doesn't have a limiter it's just a second channel at a lower level.
you should have increased the scale you only had it to 57 or 60, I tested my preamps noise floor and it went down to -67--67db
Great and helpful Thanks
dayummmmmmmmmmmmm. wish this video was out earlier. too bad for some people that already purchased their gear. h5 and juiced link were somethings on my shopping list.
@tim kyle
1.) - for my set up, i was also looking at the Video Devices PIX-LR XLR Audio Interface for PIX-E Monitors . got any experience with this?
2.) For 1 man band situations, using Juicedlink out to camera for interviews /documentaries would be perfect. But for short film 1 man band shoots, would you say its not ideal to use juicedlink-out-to-camera since actors/camera may be moving? I was thinking about, recording audio on a separate audio recorder (h5), would there ever be a time where sound operator would have to move really far away from the camera? With the JuicedLink connected to camera, the xlr cable should be decent long enough to move around /behind the camera. what are some pros/reasons to have the audio recorded separately (h5) vs recording audio directly to the video (juicedlink).?We have to sync h5 audio to the video anyways.
3.) I am reading online for h5, it does have "back up recording" at -12. and you said that it can output straight to the camera. Arent both of these functions what the JuicedLInk have/can do?
please help!
1. I'm not familiar with that device, sorry!
2. You can run xlr cables over longer distances with no issues because they are balanced cables. The issue you run into is the juiced link by itself outputs a 3.5 stereo jack which is not a balanced cable. You want the juiced link close to your recorder or end source (camera). You can still have a person on a boom far away but they can't monitor the sound as they are recording. I'd opt to record into a zoom type recorder and sync in post if that's the case.
3., the backup recording for the H5 only applies to the x/y mic. I should have covered this in the video. It won't help you for using external mics.
+Tim Kyle Photography the backup track for the jl is superior. From my tests there is no distortion!
thank you for your fast reply. I think, ultimately , i will get this exact setup. thanks to you !!
+zsoldier awesome, good luck!