**Correction** Several astute viewers have pointed out that on the Zoom F series you can create custom meter views which allow you to see the dB markers and the isolated meters on the same screen. This is great news and another plus for Zoom!
Do you think a triton fet head would improve the audio for zoom f8. It already has 75 db of gain right? I've tried it on the tascam dr70 and so far only the rode ntg4+ works.
How exactly does one customize the meter views to add the dB markers to each view option? I can't find it in the manual and I can't figure it out in the menu. Thanks. Also, Curtis, I think your videos are some of the best that I have seen for gear reviews and conveying information in an understandable way. You really seem to be in tune with the way people use gear in the real world. And your easy going manner is refreshing. Thanks.
OK. I was able to answer my own question after a more tinkering in the menu. For others who may be trying to figure this out, here's how to set up the meter views to show the dBFS levels on the Zoom F4. You need to go into Menu and set up the Level Meter View (pages 133-135 in the manual). Press Menu > System > Level Meter > Level Meter View. Then select the view you want to display the dBFS numbers. Let's choose View 1 as an example. Go into View 1 and select any three tracks (or fewer). Deselect all other tracks. Exit the set up menu by pressing Menu until you return to the Home screen. You should now see the Tracks you selected along with the dBFS numbers at the bottom of the meter. Note that there is an important limitation to this. Due to size limitations of the screen, you can only display a maximum or four tracks. The dBFS numbers count as one of these tracks which means that you can only display up to three tracks and still have enough room to display the dB numbers along the bottom of the meter. A work-around is to set up each of the four Meter Views to display different combinations of tracks to suit your needs. You then scroll through these from the Home screen to see what you need. For example, I have View 1 on my F4 currently set up to display Track 1/2, Track 3/4, and Track L/R. View 2 displays Track 1/2, Track 3/4, and Main. And so on...
Thing is with Curtis, there doesn't seem to be a fanboy bone in his body. Purely objective and always pleasant and careful when he describes his preferences. Makes everyone feel welcome to the conversation. That is an art. Thanks Curtis!
Hi Curtis! You say at around 12:15 that you can add two ADDITIONAL XLR/TRS inputs via accessory input while showing and discussing Zoom F8. However, that is only true for F4. With F8 plugging in any capsule to accessory input disables channels 1-2, so in fact thesee are not additional.
even worse: when you plug in one of the H5 modules, you can't control the input gain anymore: it's overridden and you have to play with the knob on the module itself, which is a pain in the ass if, like me, you bought the ECM-3 extension cable and the mic module is at the end of your boom doing rear surrounds! really silly. Of course if I have to choose one or the other, I'd want to control the gain from the recorder. :(
mark morgenstern When you use exh-6 it's probably not a big deal as you can simply use a cable that is long enough without ECM-3/6. But if you use microphone capsule it can be a problem. But it is true for all Zoom H series. Simply these capsules are not meant to be used in places where it is hard to reach them.
Really liking your channel and reviews as I am about to buy either the Zoom F4 or the F8 (still trying to decide.) Just FYI: Hirose is a Japanese company, so it is pronounced "Hero-Say" with no accent on either of the syllables. Hope that helps!
Thanks Curtis. I used your link to pick up the battery and cable from Amazon for my Zoom F8, which has treated me very well. Having an all day battery solution will be a big help.
I love watching Judd's videos! Better to see someone who is an audio guy in video rather than some random person who barely knows what he/she is talking about.
Brilliant insight into both recorders Curtis. But I'm wondering, where did you get that back brace for your recorder in the picture at 2:32? After a week or two on a shoot with a sound bag full of batteries and a hefty recorder, my neck and mid-back complained for a good month before properly recovering.
Hi DJ Shuffle, that's the Orca harness which is designed to work with their sound bags, in this case the OR-30 bag. Orca Harness: bhpho.to/2i8eXmU OR-30 Sound Bag: bhpho.to/2BfQ3Wh
I shamefully must confess that although I'm always thrilled when a new Judd video is up, I do watch them first. And then very often I click "like", but not always. (Sorry, Curtis). It does make life a little more complicated, I guess, but that's just who I am.
Lau, no shame in that. I prefer for people to be honest in cases where they really do not find a video helpful and I can always count on you to be honest.
My OP was just a meme and mostly did it for the lulz, however- it was particularly true. I already know when I see a new Curtis Judd video that I'm going to learn something, which deserves all the likes. Top notch work here, and we appreciate it. Just don't yell in your analog clipping videos anymore, thank you. lol jk
Fantastic and detailed comparison video, thanks! For a while I worried that I may have gone with the wrong choice but watching your video made me feel a lot better about my MixPre-6 purchase...and you're right. There are pros and cons to both. I can see myself owning both the MP6 and F8 one day.
Excellent comparison. Very clear and highly informative. I especially appreciated the part about the limiters. One question though about the limiters on the MixPre: I noticed in the spec sheet of the MixPre6 that it said, "Limiter at all gain stages, range > 40dB. First stage analog, subsequent stages digital. " So I did a follow-up about this and asked the guys at Sound Devices about it, and the answer was: "Whilst we cannot divulge too deep in our circuitry and design, our analog limiters sit before the AD converter, Digital limiters are used for signals after the AD converter such as LR Mix or Outputs. The input limiters are dual stage; first stage analog, second stage digital, Output limiters are digital. The threshold is approx -3 dBFS" (Perhaps that is the reason why I've read some people reported that the limiters on the MixPre's are a bit too harsh?) Anyway, the answer was not really very clear to me. Maybe you can explain it: Why is a second limiter stage needed after the AD converter if an analog limiter already sits before the AD converter?
Hello Professor, The second stage or output limiters are to protection against the potential overloading the outputs when multiple channels of sound are mixed together. The input limiters work on each input channel/microphone, in isolation from the others. If you are recording with two microphones and neither of them overload their individual input channels, they can still overload the outputs when they are combined/mixed for output because they are additive in terms of overall amplitude. Does that make sense? Thanks for the question!
Yes, that makes sense, thanks for clarifying and the swift response. I suppose my confusion after reading the specs was in thinking that the input would pass through the following: Analog Limiter->AD-Converter->Digital Limiter, and that the output would have another, separate, Digital Limiter.
Just watched this as I debate over options when I hopefully get the chance to move up a bit in equipment (if I get enough sound work to justify it) and this was a great comparison video for someone like me. I need to watch the regular review of the F series ones because I've been leaning Zoom F4, but very helpful info in this! Thanks for the great video.
Hi Curtis, congratulations for your amazing work, best objective and professional reviews webwide! Huge fan of your channel btw! I'm a young ethnomusicologist progressively making more and more field recordings (audio & video) for research purposes. As you can imagine, the challenges for the kind of work that I do are very specific to fieldwork/run-and-gun sonorous and dance situations : size & weight, portability, power sources and -obviously- sound quality. So far, I've been working my audio recordings with a Zoom H6 using the 2 pluggable Zoom mics, and a third NTG2. Very basic gear, practical and nice but amateur quality sound for consumer needs. So I actually want to upgrade my fieldwork gear (audio recorder and mics 1rst!) and I'm struggling to make the best choice for my needs assuming that my budget allows me to pretend pro-sumer products : for the Zoom F4, I absolutely love all its features (mostly price) EXCEPT for the 2 XLR dual channel limitation, the not-so-good headphone amp, and the fact that it can't be powered via USB, both things are considerable for all-day-long field recordings in rural areas. Moving on to my $1000 limit, the MixPre-6 seems fantastic, mostly the mic preamps that have an undoubted reputation! sole cons for me, single SD card slot so no real-time back-up unless connected to a computer. And finally the Zoom F8... well, it's also a fantastic device, more tracks than the F4, a bluetooth iOS app for comfy mixing and metadata entry, even buying the FRC-8 can improve the lack of maneuverability because of the little fader pots... BUT all the cons that you have signaled in your F8 reviews makes me think that I should really wait 3 or 4 months for the new F8n (lot of these cons will be improved as I know). So, that being said... I rarely record a session with more than 4 mics at the same time, so the F4 seems OK, but its cons bothers me a little. So if I had to go for a recorder that can handle harsh conditions on the field (lots of wind and background noises), best run-and-gun power possibilities and friendly interface, which of these 3 options would you choose? My microphone gear will progressively be updated to : Rode VideoMic Pro+ (on camera, mostly R&G situations), Audio-Technica AT4053b (indoor use), Sennheiser MKH-8040 (main mics) and in the future a Sanken CSS-5 for versatile stereo-mono recordings. Your help will be much appreciated, thanks a lot! Regards.
Hi Vincent, your projects sound very interesting! If you’re not into much of a hurry, I’d wait for the F8n early reviews. That might be the best option. I’m in the queue to get a copy and review it as soon as it starts shipping.
Reading through the manuals, seems the Mix-Pre 6 does do external controllers now. The manual lists the compatible ones. That size and weight looks nice in comparison with the Zoom. Twice the cost of an F4 though (and the F8 is now becoming cheaper as it's now older technology).
Yes! Several things added since this comparison. USB MIDI controllers: ruclips.net/video/nRNykAonevw/видео.html Remix: ruclips.net/video/_9RlX7YqiDo/видео.html Music plugin- multitrack/overdub: ruclips.net/video/xdcKjASBAZ4/видео.html
Thanks for the thorough review - I very much appreciate the amount of time and effort you put into your videos. I would like to point out, though, that having an analog limiter isn't a get out of jail free card: Limiters affect the sound significantly, depending on how much they are pushed, and can also add very unnatural characteristics in the attack and/or decay as they release. These are likely pretty gentle and designed to deal with modestly too-hot signals, but it's not going to save your butt the way a safety track can if the volume gets crazy. While you won't have distortion, you'll have massively compressed audio.
Very good point, even an analogue limiter doesn't save recordings where the gain is set too high. I should have been more clear on that. Good topic for a future episode. Thanks!
Urgh.. CHOICES!.. I love Sound Devices and I have worked with a Sound Devices 664 for quite some time and loved pretty much everything about it. I'm a filmmaker but I will also do sound on a couple of (no/low-budget) short films next year and need a Recorder. Budget-wise the MixPre-3 would be good and after reading about it and watching your vids I absolutely love it except for one personal uncertainty. Are 3 channels enough? I own a MKH416, a Sennheiser Wireless Mic Kit and soon an Oktava MK 012. Sure, renting would be an option, if 3 channels will not be enough in the future, but I want to actually use my own gear. The MixPre-3 is already a lot of money for me and the MixPre-6 would be too expensive, sadly. But going Zoom? Well, I still have about a good month left to decide...
Hi steadikek, I find 3 channels to almost always be enough for my work. Usually I shoot with a boom plus one or two wireless lavs. Of course if you get more than two actors/talent, then you'll need more. But I find that for most corporate and commercial pieces, 3 XLR inputs is enough.
Thanx Curtis, this comparison was very informative and helped me to finally decide. I've been reading through the comments and was amazed by the fact that you have been responding to everyone with such a great passion and dedication! Big UP man. My question is about the quality of preamps on MP3/6 comparing to some of the Sound Device high end products, are they actually the same preamps with 32bit A/D converter?
Hi h, the MixPre has a new preamp design. They sound somewhat similar but not identical and most can only hear the difference on good speakers or headphones (not on earbuds or phone or laptop speakers). Here's an episode with samples from each: ruclips.net/video/Hnvq-6M1adE/видео.html
Was hoping you'd make this exact video! Thank you, Curtis! The F8 is an incredible piece of gear. But I love the size of the Mix Pre 3. I think I'll keep my F8 at the office for in-house production and pick up a mix pre 3 for indie film field recording. And because it looks kinda cool.
Hey Curtis, really informative video, I currently have the F4 but I've been super interested in the Mixpre3/6 due to the headphone output and the analog limiters (that sound better than the F series to my ears), plus USB-C powering solutions sounds like it would be a lot more feasible than hirose/AC options (at least for a newbie). That said, would you say the F4's features are a better choice than the Mixpre series for a starting production sound mixer/sound designer?
+Morad Enayet I think they both have their place and can both make great recordings and budding production mixers would be well served by either. It also depends on what types of jobs you plan to take. Will you need to feed balanced outputs to camera? If you go with the MixPre, you’ll need to keep a DI box or two on hand to do that. With F4 or F8, you can do that natively. Are you going to be adjusting faders to make a stereo mix while recording? That is harder on the F series unless you add the $350 F-control. So it really depends on the types of work you plan to do. I hope that helps!
I haven't run into issues. Can still airplane mode and just turn bluetooth on. That at least eliminates the cellular and Wifi radios. By the way, loved your "Pro Batteries" piece from a few weeks back. It seems that most serious filmmakers at some point realize that it is not sustainable to run around with 40 batteries for a full day shoot. I sat on the fence with internal arguments for and against spending around $1000 on AB batteries and charger but in retrospect, it was one of the best decisions I've made in terms of gear purchases. So thanks for explaining that in words that everyone can understand!
Ah! That's great! How many times have I heard the dreaded cell phone/wifi crap in post, then wanting to commit murder on someone who can't read signs. LOL! And thanks for the thanks of the Pro Batteries episode. Been meaning for a very long time to try and explain this to beginners, and just couldn't figure it out. Spent a week or two with IndiPro Tools, and they hooked me up so I could explain it. Thanks again!
Hey Curtis, good production quality here. I have to ask your commentary seems to match what is in the video so well that I must assume that all your commentary is live with the video and not VO in post? If so are these mostly single take or multi take and then spliced together in post? As you have a lot of good straight forward commentary that doesn't feel strictly scripted but also not too much wandering like I tend to do with no script at all. These days I tend to just record footage and to VO in post (also for better quality/control of the voice itself using a VO microphone)
Thanks Vicious Computers. I usually make pretty extensive notes up front and then sit and do the entire talking head take in one shot. That is then edited in post where 1/4 to 1/3 is usually cut. Sometimes, where it makes sense, the jump cuts are covered with a b-roll shot. Thanks!
Thanks again Curtis. Building on my budget system, I've picked up a used MixPre-3 for a good price. I'll have to rely on my F2 for any 32bit float. Not sure I would need it when a mixer is in the mix. Saves $400-500. Confirmed all the important info here before pulling the trigger. youdaman.
Not anywhere close. :) the iRig Pro is a neat and convenient device but is missing many, many of the features of these more pro-sumer level recorders. If you don't need a prosumer, full featured recorder an iRig can be a fine device, but they're not really interchangeable with these.
Great stuff again. My one question is based around using mixpre as an audio interface, with speakers connected. The zoom sound a pain in the respect (AC power, turn on, menu diving etc). Am I right in thinking the mixpre is more a case of 'connect USB-3, connect speakers, turn on (no menu diving)? Also I've seen in another video you recommend going out of the stereo output for speakers - would it be a good idea to come out of the headphone jack instead so you have instant access to an overall volume for speakers (headphone vol at the side)?
Hi Jim, I see both of these as good mobile audio interfaces for post work using headphones when you need to edit on the go, but not as convenient as dedicated audio interfaces for the edit studio. I found that I needed to use a DI box with the MixPre, even for short cable runs or end up with a fair bit of noise. Not sure whether that was my particular setup. And with that, there were a lot of cables and clutter to make that work. Headphone jack might address the volume control issue to some small extent--make it easier to access--but still, not an ideal solution for someone who does a significant amount of editing with proper near-field monitors. That being said, I really like the MixPre as a mobile interface with headphones. Simple and straight-forward in that situation.
Hello! Thanks for your video again! It's help me a lot! May I ask if I use the TalentCell Rechargeable for the zoom F8, can it handle with a 9 hours above shooting(P.s I ask this question because I search that the TalentCell Rechargeable unit is count with "mAh" )? Not only but also its just sale on amazon, but it not ship to HongKong, how can I buy it? Sorry about too many questions, Thanks so much!
Hi Hochi, I have not formally tested the TalentCell but I do NOT believe it would last 9 hours. I suspect it would be closer to 4 or 5 hours depending on how many microphones you record and how many of them are using phantom power.
Thanks for doing these videos on the MixPre recorders. I had a long look at the F4 and the Mix Pre 3. I bought the Mix Pre. I have had a lot of audio recorders over the years. I hope I don't have to buy another one. This looks promising.
Thanks for the review/s Curtis. Just wondering if the 1/8" jack stereo output on the MixPre6 is sufficient level etc to send to your average camera on shoot, given some cable conversions can be made etc. Is this a practical output for this purpose? Would you mind elaborating a little on this? Also how important is it to have timecode generation on a shoot, that is, how often would camera be required to get timecode from the audio recorder above other sources..? I just really like the sound, the headrom, and operation of the MixPre6 and of course Sound Devices in general, but question the audio output capability to camera's as this is often requested, and my need to be the sync source on a future shoot. Thanks. I generally do independent films as sound mixer/recordist.
Hi Paul, that depends on the type of camera input. For mic level inputs, yes, definitely. For XLR line level inputs, it is not quite as hot as the 600 series from Sound Devices but still workable in the cases I’ve tried so far.
Hi Curtis. Thank you for your excellent explanations. :-) But I'm a newbie in sound recording and need to ask you a question. I'm using Zoom F4 and and can't get the difference between setting the Trim in PFL (for example 55dB) and achieving the same effect using the knob rotating it between 10-75dB. What is the difference? What is the setting Fader (dB) in PFL for? Looking forward to hearing from you. PS I'm sorry, maybe these questions are stupid but I would appreciate if you could help me. THX.
You might find my F4 course over at school.learnlightandsound.com helpful. There is a difference between trim (gain) and fader. The trim/gain defines how much amplification is applied to the weak sound signal coming in from the mic. A fader is something you use for mixing to quickly adjust the differences in loudness between several different microphones. I hope that helps a little!
@@curtisjudd Sure, it was helpful. You know ... sometimes only few words may be enough to explain something very difficult. One said that everybody can make life complicated, but to make something easier there must be a genius. :-) So thank you once again from Poland and thanks for your invitation to F4 course.
Excellent video! I really enjoy the analysis, findings and justifications for everything. I think your channel is the best I have ever seen for comprehensive reviews. You also reply to every question and I think that's amazing. Here is a question: If you were to redo this comparison today, but instead of reviewing a Zoom F8, you used an updated Zoom F8n instead, would any of your preferences change? Preferences for films, acoustic audio recording, or 'talking heads' interviews? I saw your video of the differences a Zoom F8n has over the F8, and it seems Zoom have done a lot to improve an otherwise brilliant system, but I'm curious how the refined F8n stacks up against a PreMix 6, or even a PreMix 10T now that Zoom have hit back with these improvements? Thank you so much for your time! Gus
Hi Gus, thanks! Several things have changed since I shot this on both the Zoom and Sound Devices sides. My perspective is still generally the same - they’re both still great recorder lines. I still personally prefer the MixPre for my work and working style, but the Zoom F series are very capable mixer/recorders in their own right. SD have added remix and control surface support which puts them closer to the Zoom feature set. Zoom made all the improvements in the F8n and also ported the software features back to the original F8 which is great. Overall, all of them are great but I would keep my MixPre10T if I could only keep one.
About the Stereo Output from the MixPre to a cinema or broadcast camera to an xlr input: Thats exactly what i had in mind. Im working with little sony cameras as well, but also with bigger ones like the FS-7 (sometimes Red and Arri, but than the audio is always camera free, so lets keep the FS-7 in mind). Is there no other way to get an XLR output? I thought you could use/link/change one of the 4 inputs as an XLR output? If the MixPre-6 doesnt have it, does the 10 have it? Since im more a "camera guy" than a "sound guy" im a bit lost at the moment^^. I would be realy glad if you could answer it. :)
Hi Ciel, the MixPre-10 has balanced mini XLR outputs you could use to get audio into cameras with XLR inputs like the FS-7. The MixPre-6 and 3 only have a 3.5mm unbalanced output. You can adapt those and they should work fine as long as you keep the cable short so you avoid picking up any interference.
Outstanding review! One thing I hate on the F8 is the AA battery sled and access door; it is a pain to access from the bottom of a sound bag and the locking screw for the battery door is really small and poorly secured to the door. The MixPre definitely has a better AA battery arrangement.
Hi Curtis, Thank You for another comprehensive review! I have been a F8 user for the past two years, but since I am doing mostly documentaries, I am gravitating towards lightweight setups (even such as a H4n mounted on a bottom of a boom pole - but that was years ago). I am now looking for a lightweight universal (H4n) replacement, and the MixPre-3 seems like a great option, that would put all the Zoom and Tascam models out of the competition. Are the preamps and limiters as good as the other SoundDevices and better than Tascams and Zooms? Would it make a difference with a Sennheiser MKH-60 and the Sennheiser microports?
Hi Radovan, I prefer the sound of the MixPre Kashmir preamps over the Zoom F4/F8 but the difference is very small: ruclips.net/video/Hnvq-6M1adE/видео.html I will also say that I prefer the sound of the SD 633 over the MixPre, but that is also a very small difference (also included in the comparison linked above). Yes, the MixPre will work very well with the Sennheiser MKH series and microports.
Hey Curtis, On your recommendation I got the Mix-Pre3 and couldnt be happier! Except for 1 thing. I mounted my Sony A7 camera on the Mix-Pre3 and was having some EMF noise coming through every time I hit record on the camera. When the camera is not mounted I do not get any noise. Do you have any idea why this might be happening? Thank you from Brooklyn, NY!
Hi Didge Project, glad its mostly working well! I haven’t experienced this but I would recommend contacting SD support. They’re quite good at solving issues like this. Best wishes!
Ok I figured it out. I checked the same set up on a Sony A7sii and there was no issue. So then I went back to the A7 and I found that as soon as the 1/4 20 pin makes contact with the camera’s mounting hole on the bottom, the emf noise comes in. So its probably a flaw in the A7 design which they corrected in later models. I hope this helps anyone who needs it. Love the MixPre-3 and thanks again Curtis, I’ve learned a lot from you about sound and lighting for video! -AJ
Did you try to use all 6 inputs of the MixPre-6 with say, wireless lavaliers? Basically would inputs 5 and 6 work if you send sound from 2 wireless lavaliers through an adapter (e.g. 2 XLR female to a balanced male 3.5mm)?
+Mark Hodgkin yes, have definitely fed wireless into the MixPre but have never tapped out all 6 inputs. I've fed one unbalanced wireless feed into 5/6. You could get two unbalanced in with a splitter but not something I'd recommend on a regular basis.
Thank you for your answer! I imagine it would be fine with just 1 wireless mic on input 5/6, but was curious to know how it would sound with 2 unbalanced wireless mics there. Yes, wouldn't use on a regular basis, but would it actually work? If you ever do that let me know! Cheers
+John Blystone hi John. The main differences are the number of XLR inputs, the fact that the inputs on the 6 also take 1/4 inch TRS plugs, and the 6 can record at 192kHz while the 3 tops out at 96kHz. The three is also a fair bit smaller physically. Otherwise they're the same.
Hey Crutis! Greetings from Argentina! I have a question for you (sorry for my awfull english). Can I conect this three devices to my computer, record, and in the same time be able to hear the recordings through my near fields monitors? I don't know if i'm expresing correctly. In other words, can i conect my near field monitors to this devices? I think you specified that about de zoom f8, with the mini xlr balanced outputs, but what about the f4 and the MixPre? There is almost no information about it on the internet. Great, great video! Thanks!
Hi Conra, yes, you can use all of these as audio interfaces to your computer and connect near-field monitors to them. You will need to potentially use adapter cables or a DI (direct input) box with the MixPre if your monitors take a balanced input only. With the F4, the line level outputs are full size XLR so this makes it easy if your monitors take a balanced signal via XLR or 1/4" TRS plug. I hope that helps!
Hi Curtis i had a quick question if you don't mind. I have an sd442 and I was wondering if you felt that by using that as a front end to an F4 might get around many of the issues that the f4 has in a pro setting (pro line out from 442, input analogue limiters, etc) or if you could see pitfalls? I know one is that using the 4 iso outs on the 442 is all pre fader so monitoring on the 442 is not really an option. I was also looking closely at the MP6 but lack of timecode and hirose power puts me off. I work mainly in post but I want to upgrade my production rig for when needed without paying a fortune. Great videos and thanks!
Thanks! Yes, the 442 would certainly solve those particular problems. It'll be a bit heavy to carry both in a bag, but no problem when working form a cart. The great thing about the 442 is that they're so affordable used these days. Good luck!
Curtis Judd thanks Curtis yeah I've had the 442 for a couple of years and it's great but it is quite big. Maybe splashing out on a mixpre 10t would do me better in the long run. Thanks again
What a fantastic and comprehensive comparison. Yet again an superb example of how this sort of video tutorial should be done. Regarding the lack of safety track feature on the MixPre series. A while ago I heard the suggestion that because the preamps are so quiet you can afford to record at a lower level (in a sense, the equivalent of a safety track) and boost in post without any problems. Would you agree with this. Thanks again.
Good point John, Paul Isaacs from Sound Devices suggested that to me when we first talked back at NAB earlier this year. That's definitely another strategy that works given the quality of the preamps.
Thanks for the reply. I certainly watched that interview with Paul Isaacs (never miss any of your videos) so that must be where I remember hearing the suggestion.
Hi, this is really a great and very informative video, it's very much appreciated. I have one question: you are saying that the mini-xlr-output isn't "professional", and I don't understand whether you are talking about the form factor (the mini) or the electrical output (perhaps to low ...?), or maybe I'm missing something completely. And: wouldn't either of these two possibilities easily curable with additional "things" ...?
The line level output is -10dBV which is considered "consumer line level". It is just slightly less powerful that the typical +4dBu "pro line level". The mini XLR connectors just need an adapter.
@@curtisjudd Hi Chris, I am totally blown away by your commitment to your channel and us, the audience. An answer to a 4 year old video after one day - unbelievable. Thank you so much for your videos, I already learned a lot. You convinced me (with another video) to step up my gear to a MixPre II (coming from a humble TASCAM DR40X), and now I will subscribe to my very first paid online course in my life to learn more ... Again: what you do here on RUclips is very special!
Hi Curtis! Thanks for the amazing comparison. With regard to the Zoom F4 - would paring it with a Sound Devices MM-1, give that top level Sound Devices pre-amp timbre and also allow for clean headphone monitoring? (I already own the F4, so considering picking up the MM-1 second hand) Thanks!! Ant
I would thinks so though I haven’t specifically used the MM1. SD gear usually has a bit more low end without being overwhelming while the Zoom F series sounds a bit more clinical. And I’d bet the headphone amp on the MM1 is better than the F4.
Hi Curtis, thank you for your amazing video! just a silly question, is it possible to solo the audio in the headphones of just one mic during the recordings? I mean, if you are recording for example 3 radio mics and 1 boom mic, would it be possible to hear just one mic in the headphones?
Just another amazing comparison Curtis! Thank you! I wonder if the sampling rate matters in such comparison, you know Zooms can sample audio up to 192kHz and MixPre3 can do at 96kHz. Does this matter in terms of audio quality for indoor dialogues?
Hi Husain Ali, for dialogue, I don't think sample rates higher than 48kHz make much of a difference. The main time I would consider using 96kHz is when recording sound effects which I wanted to process and especially in cases where I want to slow the sounds for slow motion shots. In most of the tests I've seen, even the most experienced mix engineers cannot reliably identify 96 or 192kHz sampled music from 44.1 sampled music in blind listening tests. I think using a lossless format like wav vs lossy formats like AAC and mp3 is much more important than using high sample rates.
As usual, thanks Curtis! I'm looking hard at the Sound Devices premix-10M as I almost solely do portable music shoots. Overdubbing is a huge plus, and lack of a F-control a big minus. For now I'm using the Zoom F8. Any takes on the premix 10-m? Thanks!!
Hi Joe, here are my thoughts on the 10T: ruclips.net/video/LgRdT8gsfIs/видео.html Unless you will never use it for filming and only for overdubbing, you should go with the 10T and NOT the 10M.
Hi, sort of. The Match loudness panel allows you to normalize using R-128 parameters. Technically, the Loudness Meter (Effects->Special->Loudness Radar Meter) offers metering for BS.1770-3 but if you set up the parameters to match EBU R-128, it will give you a good idea.
Hi Curtis, one question: The XLR cable for the MixPre-3 I find on the internet is only 30cm long. Do you have an idea where I can find a longer cable, so I could use it on a boom?
Hi Curtis and thank you for all your educational videos, i have learned so much from you. I have a question. I have made my first serious sound recording for a documentary film with Zoom F8 ( before that I was using Zoom h6, but there are some disadvantages in order to work them in the field) . Because of voice was so unstable with dialogs and music etc.. I recorded it on stereo mode and adjusted each channel on different levels. So, the question is, when I edit the sound with Adobe software , is it a good idea to replace the high peaking points with the other channel sound ( which was optimized specially for high peaks ). I would like to hear your opinion if you have time to answer it. Thank you again.
Great review as always! Question re Zoom F-Control device. Please comment on comparing it to using an iPad via bluetooth, ignoring the obvious that it has better control with sliders. Does it help with (USB) keyboard input and creating sound reports? In fact, can you/do you, have a video on how to use the F8 to create professional Sound Reports for use in a movie shoot environment? Thanks, Paul
Hi Paul, You can connect a USB keyboard to the F-Control to enter metadata so that definitely helps with creating sound reports. I don't have a specific video where we demonstrate sound report generation but that's a good one I'll add to the list. Thanks!
I need to be able to name inputs. My Zoom H6 creates a new folder per each take but the inputs are not named. Would be helpful. Instead of each file labeled ZOOM0001Tr1.wav. I would like each track nameable before we start recording my production. What recorder can do this? The analog limiter vs digital is important for my productions.Price is a huge contender, $2K wold be my limit. The MixPre-10T does not seem to dowhat I want. thoughts. I am the AD for Falcon Entertainment for Mafia War Chronicles. Thank you for your input. the H6 i use for my YT channel. I used it for my shoot this past weekend and the 4AAs lasted 8 hours using 6 channels.
Thanks for a great video. I would buy the mix pre 6 if I could clarify one thing. Normally on shoot I sync the timecode with the camera (for instance on the SD633) in the jam menu and then leave the timecode running. Is this not possible on the mix pre 6 ? Would I have to stay connected to camera in order to write timecode data to my files ?
Hi Emmett, if I understand correctly, you are using the timecode generator in the 633 to feed timecode continuously to camera. The MixPre-3 and 6 can receive HDMI timecode via HDMI feed from the camera effectively with the same results - if the camera sends timecode via HDMI. Or you can use external timecode generators like Tentacle Sync E. But no, the MixPre-3 and 6 do not have an in-built timecode generator like the 633.
Hey Curtis, I appreciate this review as I've been looking at the Zoom F4. I understand your bias and have taken it into consideration but I would really appreciate your device as I am truly a novice compared to the knowledge you have. I am a filmmaker and I work on projects that range from Short Films, Corporate Vidz, Promo Marketing Vidz, Government Vidz...and conferences (I also use the H6 as an audio interface)! I currently have 3 H4n's and 1 H6 because most of the conferences we do have breakout rooms that don't usually go beyond four. I am looking to replace my h4n's, they need to be upgraded. I don't use the microphone on the H6 AT ALL nor the H4n's and based on what I do and your review, I was thinking of purchasing three F4's. Based on the info that I've given you, would you recommend three H6's or F4's? (F4 = $550 & H6n = $400)
Hi Ethan, the F4s have some features that may be worthwhile for your work; Dual SD cards and the ability to power via very large external batteries. The preamplifiers are in a very different league - much cleaner. Build-wise they're also a bit more robust. I'd go for the F4s if you've got the budget. Good luck!
Mhm. Am on the look out to connect the battery you recommend to the F4. Interestingly enough I can get that battery pack here in Germany fairly easy. Finding a fitting DC 9 to Hirose cabel is far harder. 'tis possible to order the cable you recommend from the US - but that feels a bit silly / pricey to do :).
Hi curtis, going to do my first wedding video next month, what recorder would you recommend for recording dj board audio? I know very little about audio so please recommend a dummy proof one :) max budget is around 200-250. Also one that can be charged via a powerbank would big plus for me! Thx for your time!
Thx for the link, you have me convinced on going for the dr-60d2! Do you have any videos on how to connect these recorders to dj mixers etc? I am really a newbie when it comes to recorders, xlr, -12db and other chinese sounding terms :)
Hi Curtis, very nice video! Greetings from Ecuador. I just bought my zoom f8 and I'm looking for a good power bank. So I was wondering, so far how does that "Tallentcell" performed to you, I mean in terms of time? I work making documentaries and I need a power bank that at least can handle an entire day of production without recharging. Again, congratulations for the video and I hope to see more of your videos!
+Daniel Dosa hi Daniel, it definitely does not last a day, closer to 4 hours. I think you may need to move up to the more expensive batteries to get enough capacity for all day use. My Anton Bauer 90kW can power it all day.
Love your reviews - exhaustive and very objective. You make is clear when something is your personal preference and why. I love my Zoom H6, but I find myself longing for more gain! (I record nature outdoors). The F4 has a decent price point, but I really wish it was a color display - makes peaking adjustment easier.
Hi Fox X, I don't remember the exact date of release for the original MixPre 3 and 6 but they announced them at NAB 2017 (April) and I received mine in June 2017 as I recall. I pre-ordered so my MixPre-6 was the first batch to ship.
Thank you for this video. It’s very useful for me. I want to buy a new sound recorder in a few weeks; maybe a Zoom F4, maybe a Sound Device MixPre-3. Just a little precision if you know. What about iXML? Do you use iXML in FCPX ? Do you think it’s something important ? You can get iXML in the F4 but not with the MixPre series. I’m right ? And a last question, do you think Sound Device can add iXML in the MixPre series with firmware upgrade ? Or do you think Sound Device get this feature for their high range products? Sorry for my bad english.
Hi Bruno, The MixPre's metadata transfers through to FCPX nicely in my tests. The track names you setup are carried through as role assignments and all of the other metadata are carried through. I'm not sure whether it is using iXML or just the standard BWF metadata but the MixPre seems to work quite nicely with FCPX.
I'd be interested to see how the pre-amps on these records compare to the Roland R44, which is much older, but still being sold at a similar price point to the MixPre3 and a bit higher than the Zoom F4?
I am not sure about the "consumer output" quality you were talking about...!! If that is the case, could one remove the SD card after recording and run it from a computer with a good external sound card when mixing down audio ? Great Review...!! Thx.
Hi Mus Ele, no, I was not talking about transferring the audio to a computer via USB, that is fine. I was talking about the line outputs - XLR on the F4, TA3M on the F8. This is to send audio to a camera via an audio cable. It is not bad quality, it is just not as strong a signal as professional line level. It still works fine, you may just need to amplify it a bit more on the camera side.
Balance consumer line level is a less powerful signal than pro line level. In practical terms this means that when feeding audio from your recorder to a camera, the output will not be as strong with consumer line level.
+Curtis Judd I find it interesting how you say that the mixpre don't have a safety track feature but I am wondering whether it's possible to record to a second track without any safety features? So since the analogue limiters will do their job, that's great but if I do a recording where certain settings onset are preferential and then later decide certain parts would be better in a raw unajusted recording then I would love to have that possibility. Do you know about this?
Very Nice! And I assume the cable splitter won't affect the audio input as long as it has the same quality components as the balanced cable from the mic.
I haven’t done it before so I’m not positive on that, but worth a try. I’ve heard other engineers claim they’ve had good results with quality split cables.
Excellent video!!!! I’m looking for something to record a band (live). I was once using the H6 for this purpose but would like to upgrade. Would you recommend one of these devices shown in order to do this as an upgrade?
@@curtisjudd live band (like a rehearsal). Just needing something to get better audio from in post to sync with cameras. There will be no mixing board.
@@StuartJrBarrett These could work, of course, and do a very good job. If you'd prefer something with linear faders which are a little easier to operate, you might have a look at the ZOOM LiveTrak series. Here's a look at the L8 from a podcast perspective, but the LiveTraks are made for band rehearsal recordings as primary use case: ruclips.net/video/HYIJsOg9TPw/видео.html
I have a Canon EOS 5D Mark 4 that I want to use for a documentary film. What would you advise me to do as far as sound recording is concerned if I have a MixPre: connect it them together, or record the sound separately?
Used the F8 on a production a few months ago. Was planning to use it in mixer mode but had to abandon the idea since the F8 does not allow for gain trim in the channels PFL menus... I think you had to change back to trim mode to be able to change gain at all. I don't understand why they've done it this way but i'd be way more temped to buy one if they'd iron out those little things.
Hi Simon, yes, it works a little differently where you use the main encoder to change between fader and trim modes. I actually prefer that so that I don't have to jump into the PFL menu for each individual channel but it is definitely different than most other mixer/recorders.
Hi Curtis! I have a question and it might be rather silly, but I'll ask it anyway. What does it mean that main output in consumer-level? How it affects performance?
Hi Pawel, Consumer line level is a less "powerful" level of the audio signal. Most professional equipment (cameras, audio gear, etc.) uses line level. The impact is that the recorded level may be lower than optimal. You can read about line level here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_level
I'd recommend the MixPre-3 as a very high quality recorder for a lot of situations. But it depends on how you plan to use it. Will it be connect to the DJ's sound board? Connected to the camera? Some other config?
Hej Curtis ! Great Video, Thanks. one Q: I have a problem trying to figur out how to power up the F8 with a rode smartlav+ with the rode SC3 converter cable . I have tried to plug it in without phantom power , and it doesn´t work. Do you have any solution ?
Hi J. the smartLav+ requires plugin power. I'm not sure whether that'll work but you might try turning on the plugin power option in the F8's menu to see if that does the job. Best wishes!
Dear Curtis, is it possible to use XLR y-splitter to achieve a safety track in Zoom h4n Pro? This model does not offer any inbuilt safety track option. (Cable from boom microphone would be splitted to the other XLR-input and that would be recorded with lower gain.) Best regards!
@@harrij.9542 I don't believe this is a problem, there are many engineers that use splitters to record live shows and many mixing boards can only apply phantom to all of the mic inputs. You might watch this interview we did some time ago with Mike Stranks who does a lot of live show recording. He uses isolators on the inputs with splitters and gets good results: ruclips.net/video/KPXcjmDl-Eo/видео.html
Do you recommend recording Lavalier Mics on a R16 Zoom Recorder? It fits our film budget and it’s the only 8 track recorder we can rent at Long&Mcquade.
Thanks for video. In the meantime the Mixpre 3 II and Zoom F6 is available. 3 channels are sufficient for me. Should I go for the Mixpre 3 II or is F6 good enough? Mixpre 3 II with extra L mount adapter is 250€ more....
@@curtisjudd many thanks for you opinion, Curtis. Can you point out what the 250€ more is worth it? My mean usage scenario is to get better sound while filming with my Fujifilm Camera and my Sennheiser MKE600. Mostly the camera I’m using on a gimbal. Therefor the recorder must go into a (sound) bag. For the moment I’m using a Tascam DR100 II which is really not comparable. For this I’m a bit afraid of the SD with L mount battery gets a bit too bulky? Second scenario is to use it as a usb sound Interface (have a very Bad and old usb interface here without a brand) to connect my Rode Procaster to the computer for streaming like Zoom meeting. Maybe later I’m planning with a second mic to connect like a wireless one but that’s not my task on the moment...
@@pag5210 I find the MixPre easier to operate with its touchscreen and larger channel knobs which are more spaced apart. I prefer the sound of the MixPre's preamps, I find its analogue limiters to be superior to the digital hybrid limiters in the F6 and if I ever need to run audio out of the recorder to a camera, the F6 has a major flaw where the output produces an obvious, unacceptable amount of self-noise. The MixPre can be controlled via app on iOS or Android while the F6 is iOS only. The timecode implementation makes more sense to me on the MixPre than on the F6 (that's a longer story than I can cover in a YT comment). If you prefer the form factor of the F6, that is a consideration, certainly. As far as use as an audio interface, I find the MixPre superior there as well. I do not have to dive 3 deep into the menus to put it into audio interface mode. Also, the line out becomes a problem again on the F6 if you plan to drive speakers from the recorder - same noise issue unless your speakers can take a line level signal and have their own volume control.
@@curtisjudd Many thanks. I think I go for the Mixpre 3 II. Think the better userinterface is worth it. And three channels will be enough for my scenarios. Even if I will record a podcast, Interview or something like that this three channels should be enough. Now I must see where to get a matching Orca bag. These are everywhere sold out in Germany. Is the Automix plugin or Noisefilter plugin a recommendation? Maybe you can make a video in future about this, or does I haven’t found an existing one?
@@pag5210 Here's one on the MixAssist plugin: ruclips.net/video/oTLfgQ3qSek/видео.html And here is one on NoiseAssist (I did this on then 888 but it works the same on MixPre but for only one channel or mix): ruclips.net/video/nUVmHCYYlj8/видео.html
Ruined a few minutes of a take by starting accidentally on the 4AA powering option of MixPre-6, I thought the USB-C battery was powered up. So the Sony NP-L sled you showed, I am interested in getting it. nice experiences of it?
Yes, it works well in a bag, but not quite so well if you're planning to set the unity on a table as one of the batteries protrudes from the bottom of the sled. Much longer power times.
Curtis Judd but it seems stable/reliable? I would primarily use it on a tripod where the physical dimensions work. My NP batteries are the huge variants though, somewhat heavy. It just looks like it loads a lot of weight in a really odd fashion, but I guess they must have done the math and decided it is safe.
About 3 hours, possibly 3.5 depending on how many mics you're recording and phantom powering. They also have a larger capacity model (on the same page @ Amazon).
Can you operate on wall AC power with either of these recorders, such as in an interview situation? I am planning a multi-mic (with decrete audio channels for back-up) interview situation so that I can preserve the original audio for future use.
@@curtisjudd Great sounding videos!!!! :) I had wished I had access to this gear when I was recording remote recording for the NPR afilliate here in Portland, Oregon instead of an Ampex 601 tape machine years ago.
Newbie question. I am looking at a field recorder for recording Bird song. I also have a Sony NEX FS700. It would be nice on occasion to improve the sound on the camera with an external mic / input possibly from the recorder? I also use the camera for gigs & would like to improve the sound too. I have been looking at the Zoom F8 or even the F4 - Do you think these would be suitable and what do I need to look for to save buying the wrong unit. My work is mainly for fun but I would like the audio to be as good as possible for the bands and my own pleasure. I can probably only buy once there a little concerned I might miss something and regret the choice later. I know it is not easy to say buy this but hopefully you can warn of missing something. Thanks for the info on RUclips.Cheers
Hi DrPhotoOnTour, yes, I think the F4 or F8n can serve this purpose very well. I believe the FS700 has XLR inputs? If so, the F4 might be a good option as you could run standard XLR mic/patch cables from the recorder to camera. The preamplifiers on the Zoom recorders are very clean and powerful. I think it would be a good option. Best wishes!
Thank you for you quick response Chris - It's a nightmare. I have even looked at the SD744T complete with a TW mixer but it is then getting rather expensive and not sure if it would be worth the extra outlay. Lots of thinking to do. Cheers
If you wouldn't mind listing out your requirements in priority order, I'm happy to take a look at them and give my opinion on which might be the best fit.
Just curious (and this probably isn't done in any practical shooting scenarios, but): is there a way to feed the output from an XLR microphone onto two different recording destinations? Say, an external recorder, AND a preamp that's feeding into the camera - at the same time? I understand that signal loss would be an issue, and therefore I'd need probably need to use a higher gain settings on both recording platforms - but is this still doable?
Yes, there are options out there. Here's one from Rolls: bhpho.to/2xqWaZU You want to ensure that you use a isolator so that things don't get muddled in the process.
Totally agree to the no backlit buttons, whenever I happen to shoot in a indoor location theater, which is usually dark, it is a problem for pretty much every button. For the limiters, I believe what zoom did is actually a trick and it does actually work in the analog domain to avoid overshooting the ADC. If I'm not mistaken it works like this: let's say you set the limiter at -6 dB, the F8 then lowers the analog gain by 6 dB and raises the digital signal by 6 dBb, total overall gain is thus the same as without the limiter. Whenever the signal goes above the threshold (on the digital side), the digital limiter can now kick that back, but the analog part still has 6dB of overhead to work with. It will raise your noise floor by those 6dBs (or whetever you set), but then again, every compressor and/or limiter will diminish noise to signal ratio. So this is how I understood it works.
Great content. I have h6 and the floor noise is way too much for great interviews. So I am looking to upgrade. I have Sennheisers AVX mics but floor noise needs too much cleaning. So which of the two F4 vs MixPre-3 has lower noise?
Thanks. Mix Pr6 is over $1100, F4 is around $449 and Mix Pre 3 is over $649 so I really want to invest into something that is justified. I made good investment and have GH5S, GH5 and Sony A7iii, but you are right without great and clean audio all is wasted. So debating which one gives lower noise and is justified at the price point.
Here's the thing: Technically the MixPre's preamps are quieter by about 2dB on the test I saw. I have serious doubts that anyone can hear that difference. The more important thing will be to go with the Zoom F4 or MixPre-3, whichever makes sense for your budget, and ensure that you get a microphone with a low self-noise specification. The microphone will make more of a difference than the recorder. Best wishes and happy recording! 🎤
I have already invested in 3 AVX mics and they are expensive $800 each + I have EV RE 320 and Shure SM58. So I am not going to buy new set of mics. That's why I am kinda confused.
@@curtisjudd i am recording car exhaust sound and can’t find right recorder , i am not professional sound recording but trying to learn something from you too , i hope 🤞 i will receive on August 19th and let you know 😅
I have the MixPre 3, and I also have the Zoom H4n. With my Zoom I can set my peak levels to -6db during recording and I get very healthy wave forms in FCPX. With the MixPre if my recording peak levels travel much above -20db on the recording level meter then the recording sounds super hot and I get clipping and red peaks in FCPX. What gives?
**Correction** Several astute viewers have pointed out that on the Zoom F series you can create custom meter views which allow you to see the dB markers and the isolated meters on the same screen. This is great news and another plus for Zoom!
Do you think a triton fet head would improve the audio for zoom f8. It already has 75 db of gain right? I've tried it on the tascam dr70 and so far only the rode ntg4+ works.
Good to see this corrected :-)
& btw it has always been like this for me with my F4, since the first v1.0 firmware.
How exactly does one customize the meter views to add the dB markers to each view option? I can't find it in the manual and I can't figure it out in the menu. Thanks.
Also, Curtis, I think your videos are some of the best that I have seen for gear reviews and conveying information in an understandable way. You really seem to be in tune with the way people use gear in the real world. And your easy going manner is refreshing. Thanks.
I should clarify that I am using a Zoom F4. Thanks.
OK. I was able to answer my own question after a more tinkering in the menu. For others who may be trying to figure this out, here's how to set up the meter views to show the dBFS levels on the Zoom F4.
You need to go into Menu and set up the Level Meter View (pages 133-135 in the manual). Press Menu > System > Level Meter > Level Meter View. Then select the view you want to display the dBFS numbers. Let's choose View 1 as an example. Go into View 1 and select any three tracks (or fewer). Deselect all other tracks. Exit the set up menu by pressing Menu until you return to the Home screen. You should now see the Tracks you selected along with the dBFS numbers at the bottom of the meter.
Note that there is an important limitation to this. Due to size limitations of the screen, you can only display a maximum or four tracks. The dBFS numbers count as one of these tracks which means that you can only display up to three tracks and still have enough room to display the dB numbers along the bottom of the meter. A work-around is to set up each of the four Meter Views to display different combinations of tracks to suit your needs. You then scroll through these from the Home screen to see what you need. For example, I have View 1 on my F4 currently set up to display Track 1/2, Track 3/4, and Track L/R. View 2 displays Track 1/2, Track 3/4, and Main. And so on...
Thing is with Curtis, there doesn't seem to be a fanboy bone in his body. Purely objective and always pleasant and careful when he describes his preferences. Makes everyone feel welcome to the conversation. That is an art. Thanks Curtis!
Thanks Gerry, much appreciated!
Very well said.
😂 “Fanboy bone”
Always an informed, lucid video. I have never switched off half way through, this guy speaks sense all the time!
Thanks John, appreciate the feedback.
Yesss this is exactly the video I was waiting for
👍
Seriously... Who gives you grief!? You are one of the sources I refer to when giving a complete, non BS review, for information about audio and video.
Thanks dh2006dh.
I ended up getting the the mix pre 3.
Thanks Curtis. I'm loving the results!!
👍🎤
You can set up custom metering views on the F4 that include the number values.
By the way, I bought an F4. I'm quite pleased with it.
Thanks! Had no idea there was a way to customize the meter views, that's really good to know! I'm a fan of the F4 as well!
Hi Curtis! You say at around 12:15 that you can add two ADDITIONAL XLR/TRS inputs via accessory input while showing and discussing Zoom F8. However, that is only true for F4. With F8 plugging in any capsule to accessory input disables channels 1-2, so in fact thesee are not additional.
Thank you for the correction Pawel, much appreciated!
even worse: when you plug in one of the H5 modules, you can't control the input gain anymore: it's overridden and you have to play with the knob on the module itself, which is a pain in the ass if, like me, you bought the ECM-3 extension cable and the mic module is at the end of your boom doing rear surrounds! really silly. Of course if I have to choose one or the other, I'd want to control the gain from the recorder. :(
mark morgenstern
When you use exh-6 it's probably not a big deal as you can simply use a cable that is long enough without ECM-3/6. But if you use microphone capsule it can be a problem. But it is true for all Zoom H series. Simply these capsules are not meant to be used in places where it is hard to reach them.
Can't wait for your review on Sound Devices MixPre-10t!
+Mark Hodgkin I can’t wait either! Should be here within a week!
Really liking your channel and reviews as I am about to buy either the Zoom F4 or the F8 (still trying to decide.) Just FYI: Hirose is a Japanese company, so it is pronounced "Hero-Say" with no accent on either of the syllables. Hope that helps!
+Genshi Media Group thanks and best wishes!
Just ran across this video. Very helpful. Thanks for the sensitively detailed, honest objective (noting personal bias) review and comparison.
Thank you Eric, I appreciate the feedback.
Thanks Curtis. I used your link to pick up the battery and cable from Amazon for my Zoom F8, which has treated me very well. Having an all day battery solution will be a big help.
Thanks! I haven't used it all day yet but it's looking promising!
Even if it takes two to get through a full day that would be very much worth it and much better than replacing AA batteries.
I love watching Judd's videos! Better to see someone who is an audio guy in video rather than some random person who barely knows what he/she is talking about.
Thanks!
Brilliant insight into both recorders Curtis. But I'm wondering, where did you get that back brace for your recorder in the picture at 2:32? After a week or two on a shoot with a sound bag full of batteries and a hefty recorder, my neck and mid-back complained for a good month before properly recovering.
Hi DJ Shuffle, that's the Orca harness which is designed to work with their sound bags, in this case the OR-30 bag.
Orca Harness: bhpho.to/2i8eXmU
OR-30 Sound Bag: bhpho.to/2BfQ3Wh
I'm a simple man. I see a new Curtis Judd video I press like then I watch
Thanks muncherelli!
That makes two of us. But I'm sure there are many others out there taht do the same ;-)
I shamefully must confess that although I'm always thrilled when a new Judd video is up, I do watch them first. And then very often I click "like", but not always. (Sorry, Curtis). It does make life a little more complicated, I guess, but that's just who I am.
Lau, no shame in that. I prefer for people to be honest in cases where they really do not find a video helpful and I can always count on you to be honest.
My OP was just a meme and mostly did it for the lulz, however- it was particularly true. I already know when I see a new Curtis Judd video that I'm going to learn something, which deserves all the likes. Top notch work here, and we appreciate it. Just don't yell in your analog clipping videos anymore, thank you.
lol jk
first video I've ever watched from this channel, but THANK YOU for starting with the summary! (still gonna watch the whole thing though lol)
👍
Fantastic and detailed comparison video, thanks! For a while I worried that I may have gone with the wrong choice but watching your video made me feel a lot better about my MixPre-6 purchase...and you're right. There are pros and cons to both. I can see myself owning both the MP6 and F8 one day.
Thanks Bridget, happy recording!
Excellent comparison. Very clear and highly informative. I especially appreciated the part about the limiters.
One question though about the limiters on the MixPre: I noticed in the spec sheet of the MixPre6 that it said, "Limiter at all gain stages, range > 40dB. First stage analog, subsequent stages digital. "
So I did a follow-up about this and asked the guys at Sound Devices about it, and the answer was: "Whilst we cannot divulge too deep in our circuitry and design, our analog limiters sit before the AD converter, Digital limiters are used for signals after the AD converter such as LR Mix or Outputs. The input limiters are dual stage; first stage analog, second stage digital, Output limiters are digital. The threshold is approx -3 dBFS"
(Perhaps that is the reason why I've read some people reported that the limiters on the MixPre's are a bit too harsh?)
Anyway, the answer was not really very clear to me. Maybe you can explain it: Why is a second limiter stage needed after the AD converter if an analog limiter already sits before the AD converter?
Hello Professor, The second stage or output limiters are to protection against the potential overloading the outputs when multiple channels of sound are mixed together. The input limiters work on each input channel/microphone, in isolation from the others. If you are recording with two microphones and neither of them overload their individual input channels, they can still overload the outputs when they are combined/mixed for output because they are additive in terms of overall amplitude. Does that make sense? Thanks for the question!
Yes, that makes sense, thanks for clarifying and the swift response.
I suppose my confusion after reading the specs was in thinking that the input would pass through the following: Analog Limiter->AD-Converter->Digital Limiter, and that the output would have another, separate, Digital Limiter.
Great video thanks, seems MixPre-3 is the way to go for me - Android + limiter + good headphone output + back-light.
Thanks Gregor!
Really the best review I've seen on these mixers! Thanks so much!
Thank you Keith.
Thanks Curtis for another great video! I also tested Mixpre-3 vs. Zoom F4 vs Tascam DR-70D. All three great devices.
Thanks! Yes, all good options!
Just watched this as I debate over options when I hopefully get the chance to move up a bit in equipment (if I get enough sound work to justify it) and this was a great comparison video for someone like me. I need to watch the regular review of the F series ones because I've been leaning Zoom F4, but very helpful info in this! Thanks for the great video.
You're welcome and thanks for the feedback!
Hi Curtis, congratulations for your amazing work, best objective and professional reviews webwide! Huge fan of your channel btw! I'm a young ethnomusicologist progressively making more and more field recordings (audio & video) for research purposes. As you can imagine, the challenges for the kind of work that I do are very specific to fieldwork/run-and-gun sonorous and dance situations : size & weight, portability, power sources and -obviously- sound quality. So far, I've been working my audio recordings with a Zoom H6 using the 2 pluggable Zoom mics, and a third NTG2. Very basic gear, practical and nice but amateur quality sound for consumer needs. So I actually want to upgrade my fieldwork gear (audio recorder and mics 1rst!) and I'm struggling to make the best choice for my needs assuming that my budget allows me to pretend pro-sumer products : for the Zoom F4, I absolutely love all its features (mostly price) EXCEPT for the 2 XLR dual channel limitation, the not-so-good headphone amp, and the fact that it can't be powered via USB, both things are considerable for all-day-long field recordings in rural areas. Moving on to my $1000 limit, the MixPre-6 seems fantastic, mostly the mic preamps that have an undoubted reputation! sole cons for me, single SD card slot so no real-time back-up unless connected to a computer. And finally the Zoom F8... well, it's also a fantastic device, more tracks than the F4, a bluetooth iOS app for comfy mixing and metadata entry, even buying the FRC-8 can improve the lack of maneuverability because of the little fader pots... BUT all the cons that you have signaled in your F8 reviews makes me think that I should really wait 3 or 4 months for the new F8n (lot of these cons will be improved as I know).
So, that being said... I rarely record a session with more than 4 mics at the same time, so the F4 seems OK, but its cons bothers me a little. So if I had to go for a recorder that can handle harsh conditions on the field (lots of wind and background noises), best run-and-gun power possibilities and friendly interface, which of these 3 options would you choose?
My microphone gear will progressively be updated to : Rode VideoMic Pro+ (on camera, mostly R&G situations), Audio-Technica AT4053b (indoor use), Sennheiser MKH-8040 (main mics) and in the future a Sanken CSS-5 for versatile stereo-mono recordings.
Your help will be much appreciated, thanks a lot!
Regards.
Hi Vincent, your projects sound very interesting! If you’re not into much of a hurry, I’d wait for the F8n early reviews. That might be the best option. I’m in the queue to get a copy and review it as soon as it starts shipping.
Reading through the manuals, seems the Mix-Pre 6 does do external controllers now. The manual lists the compatible ones.
That size and weight looks nice in comparison with the Zoom. Twice the cost of an F4 though (and the F8 is now becoming cheaper as it's now older technology).
Yes! Several things added since this comparison.
USB MIDI controllers: ruclips.net/video/nRNykAonevw/видео.html
Remix: ruclips.net/video/_9RlX7YqiDo/видео.html
Music plugin- multitrack/overdub: ruclips.net/video/xdcKjASBAZ4/видео.html
Thanks for the thorough review - I very much appreciate the amount of time and effort you put into your videos. I would like to point out, though, that having an analog limiter isn't a get out of jail free card: Limiters affect the sound significantly, depending on how much they are pushed, and can also add very unnatural characteristics in the attack and/or decay as they release. These are likely pretty gentle and designed to deal with modestly too-hot signals, but it's not going to save your butt the way a safety track can if the volume gets crazy. While you won't have distortion, you'll have massively compressed audio.
Very good point, even an analogue limiter doesn't save recordings where the gain is set too high. I should have been more clear on that. Good topic for a future episode. Thanks!
Urgh.. CHOICES!..
I love Sound Devices and I have worked with a Sound Devices 664 for quite some time and loved pretty much everything about it.
I'm a filmmaker but I will also do sound on a couple of (no/low-budget) short films next year and need a Recorder.
Budget-wise the MixPre-3 would be good and after reading about it and watching your vids I absolutely love it except for one personal uncertainty.
Are 3 channels enough? I own a MKH416, a Sennheiser Wireless Mic Kit and soon an Oktava MK 012.
Sure, renting would be an option, if 3 channels will not be enough in the future, but I want to actually use my own gear.
The MixPre-3 is already a lot of money for me and the MixPre-6 would be too expensive, sadly.
But going Zoom? Well, I still have about a good month left to decide...
Hi steadikek, I find 3 channels to almost always be enough for my work. Usually I shoot with a boom plus one or two wireless lavs. Of course if you get more than two actors/talent, then you'll need more. But I find that for most corporate and commercial pieces, 3 XLR inputs is enough.
Thanx Curtis, this comparison was very informative and helped me to finally decide. I've been reading through the comments and was amazed by the fact that you have been responding to everyone with such a great passion and dedication! Big UP man. My question is about the quality of preamps on MP3/6 comparing to some of the Sound Device high end products, are they actually the same preamps with 32bit A/D converter?
Hi h, the MixPre has a new preamp design. They sound somewhat similar but not identical and most can only hear the difference on good speakers or headphones (not on earbuds or phone or laptop speakers). Here's an episode with samples from each: ruclips.net/video/Hnvq-6M1adE/видео.html
Was hoping you'd make this exact video! Thank you, Curtis! The F8 is an incredible piece of gear. But I love the size of the Mix Pre 3. I think I'll keep my F8 at the office for in-house production and pick up a mix pre 3 for indie film field recording. And because it looks kinda cool.
Thanks! Good call! If you can't decide on one, go for both! ;-)
If you think you'll ever need more than two wireless then don't get the MixPre3. Go for the Zoom F4 instead, or F8
Hey Curtis, really informative video, I currently have the F4 but I've been super interested in the Mixpre3/6 due to the headphone output and the analog limiters (that sound better than the F series to my ears), plus USB-C powering solutions sounds like it would be a lot more feasible than hirose/AC options (at least for a newbie). That said, would you say the F4's features are a better choice than the Mixpre series for a starting production sound mixer/sound designer?
+Morad Enayet I think they both have their place and can both make great recordings and budding production mixers would be well served by either. It also depends on what types of jobs you plan to take. Will you need to feed balanced outputs to camera? If you go with the MixPre, you’ll need to keep a DI box or two on hand to do that. With F4 or F8, you can do that natively. Are you going to be adjusting faders to make a stereo mix while recording? That is harder on the F series unless you add the $350 F-control. So it really depends on the types of work you plan to do. I hope that helps!
The F4 is great!! :-D Stick with that.
And rather than selling and buying something else, then save your pennies to buy a Maxx/633/SX-R4+
Thank you for yet another great review. This conundrum of choice faces me too. Your videos will help me towards this end.
Thanks and good luck!
On the IOS app, have you found any subtle (or not so much) interference? It seems to me you can't airplane mode using the app (unless I am incorrect).
I haven't run into issues. Can still airplane mode and just turn bluetooth on. That at least eliminates the cellular and Wifi radios.
By the way, loved your "Pro Batteries" piece from a few weeks back. It seems that most serious filmmakers at some point realize that it is not sustainable to run around with 40 batteries for a full day shoot. I sat on the fence with internal arguments for and against spending around $1000 on AB batteries and charger but in retrospect, it was one of the best decisions I've made in terms of gear purchases. So thanks for explaining that in words that everyone can understand!
Ah! That's great! How many times have I heard the dreaded cell phone/wifi crap in post, then wanting to commit murder on someone who can't read signs. LOL! And thanks for the thanks of the Pro Batteries episode. Been meaning for a very long time to try and explain this to beginners, and just couldn't figure it out. Spent a week or two with IndiPro Tools, and they hooked me up so I could explain it. Thanks again!
Hey Curtis, good production quality here. I have to ask your commentary seems to match what is in the video so well that I must assume that all your commentary is live with the video and not VO in post? If so are these mostly single take or multi take and then spliced together in post? As you have a lot of good straight forward commentary that doesn't feel strictly scripted but also not too much wandering like I tend to do with no script at all.
These days I tend to just record footage and to VO in post (also for better quality/control of the voice itself using a VO microphone)
Thanks Vicious Computers. I usually make pretty extensive notes up front and then sit and do the entire talking head take in one shot. That is then edited in post where 1/4 to 1/3 is usually cut. Sometimes, where it makes sense, the jump cuts are covered with a b-roll shot. Thanks!
Hey Curtis , great video. You are the final source I go to when look to make decision on audio. Great stuff.
Thanks!
Thanks again Curtis. Building on my budget system, I've picked up a used MixPre-3 for a good price. I'll have to rely on my F2 for any 32bit float. Not sure I would need it when a mixer is in the mix. Saves $400-500. Confirmed all the important info here before pulling the trigger. youdaman.
Congrats, good choice, and happy recording.
Very, very helpfull! I am also interested in where Irig pro fits into the "ranking" of these devices in terms of sound quality.
Not anywhere close. :) the iRig Pro is a neat and convenient device but is missing many, many of the features of these more pro-sumer level recorders. If you don't need a prosumer, full featured recorder an iRig can be a fine device, but they're not really interchangeable with these.
Great stuff again. My one question is based around using mixpre as an audio interface, with speakers connected. The zoom sound a pain in the respect (AC power, turn on, menu diving etc). Am I right in thinking the mixpre is more a case of 'connect USB-3, connect speakers, turn on (no menu diving)? Also I've seen in another video you recommend going out of the stereo output for speakers - would it be a good idea to come out of the headphone jack instead so you have instant access to an overall volume for speakers (headphone vol at the side)?
Hi Jim, I see both of these as good mobile audio interfaces for post work using headphones when you need to edit on the go, but not as convenient as dedicated audio interfaces for the edit studio. I found that I needed to use a DI box with the MixPre, even for short cable runs or end up with a fair bit of noise. Not sure whether that was my particular setup. And with that, there were a lot of cables and clutter to make that work. Headphone jack might address the volume control issue to some small extent--make it easier to access--but still, not an ideal solution for someone who does a significant amount of editing with proper near-field monitors.
That being said, I really like the MixPre as a mobile interface with headphones. Simple and straight-forward in that situation.
Hello! Thanks for your video again! It's help me a lot!
May I ask if I use the TalentCell Rechargeable for the zoom F8, can it handle with a 9 hours above shooting(P.s I ask this question because I search that the TalentCell Rechargeable unit is count with "mAh" )?
Not only but also its just sale on amazon, but it not ship to HongKong, how can I buy it?
Sorry about too many questions, Thanks so much!
Hi Hochi, I have not formally tested the TalentCell but I do NOT believe it would last 9 hours. I suspect it would be closer to 4 or 5 hours depending on how many microphones you record and how many of them are using phantom power.
Thanks for doing these videos on the MixPre recorders. I had a long look at the F4 and the Mix Pre 3. I bought the Mix Pre. I have had a lot of audio recorders over the years. I hope I don't have to buy another one. This looks promising.
Glad its working out so far. Best wishes!
Thanks for the review/s Curtis. Just wondering if the 1/8" jack stereo output on the MixPre6 is sufficient level etc to send to your average camera on shoot, given some cable conversions can be made etc. Is this a practical output for this purpose? Would you mind elaborating a little on this? Also how important is it to have timecode generation on a shoot, that is, how often would camera be required to get timecode from the audio recorder above other sources..? I just really like the sound, the headrom, and operation of the MixPre6 and of course Sound Devices in general, but question the audio output capability to camera's as this is often requested, and my need to be the sync source on a future shoot. Thanks. I generally do independent films as sound mixer/recordist.
Hi Paul, that depends on the type of camera input. For mic level inputs, yes, definitely. For XLR line level inputs, it is not quite as hot as the 600 series from Sound Devices but still workable in the cases I’ve tried so far.
Hi Curtis. Thank you for your excellent explanations. :-) But I'm a newbie in sound recording and need to ask you a question. I'm using Zoom F4 and and can't get the difference between setting the Trim in PFL (for example 55dB) and achieving the same effect using the knob rotating it between 10-75dB. What is the difference? What is the setting Fader (dB) in PFL for? Looking forward to hearing from you. PS I'm sorry, maybe these questions are stupid but I would appreciate if you could help me. THX.
You might find my F4 course over at school.learnlightandsound.com helpful.
There is a difference between trim (gain) and fader. The trim/gain defines how much amplification is applied to the weak sound signal coming in from the mic. A fader is something you use for mixing to quickly adjust the differences in loudness between several different microphones. I hope that helps a little!
@@curtisjudd Sure, it was helpful. You know ... sometimes only few words may be enough to explain something very difficult. One said that everybody can make life complicated, but to make something easier there must be a genius. :-) So thank you once again from Poland and thanks for your invitation to F4 course.
Excellent video! I really enjoy the analysis, findings and justifications for everything. I think your channel is the best I have ever seen for comprehensive reviews. You also reply to every question and I think that's amazing.
Here is a question: If you were to redo this comparison today, but instead of reviewing a Zoom F8, you used an updated Zoom F8n instead, would any of your preferences change? Preferences for films, acoustic audio recording, or 'talking heads' interviews?
I saw your video of the differences a Zoom F8n has over the F8, and it seems Zoom have done a lot to improve an otherwise brilliant system, but I'm curious how the refined F8n stacks up against a PreMix 6, or even a PreMix 10T now that Zoom have hit back with these improvements?
Thank you so much for your time! Gus
Hi Gus, thanks! Several things have changed since I shot this on both the Zoom and Sound Devices sides. My perspective is still generally the same - they’re both still great recorder lines. I still personally prefer the MixPre for my work and working style, but the Zoom F series are very capable mixer/recorders in their own right. SD have added remix and control surface support which puts them closer to the Zoom feature set. Zoom
made all the improvements in the F8n and also ported the software features back to the original F8 which is great. Overall, all of them are great but I would keep my MixPre10T if I could only keep one.
About the Stereo Output from the MixPre to a cinema or broadcast camera to an xlr input: Thats exactly what i had in mind. Im working with little sony cameras as well, but also with bigger ones like the FS-7 (sometimes Red and Arri, but than the audio is always camera free, so lets keep the FS-7 in mind). Is there no other way to get an XLR output? I thought you could use/link/change one of the 4 inputs as an XLR output? If the MixPre-6 doesnt have it, does the 10 have it? Since im more a "camera guy" than a "sound guy" im a bit lost at the moment^^. I would be realy glad if you could answer it. :)
Hi Ciel, the MixPre-10 has balanced mini XLR outputs you could use to get audio into cameras with XLR inputs like the FS-7. The MixPre-6 and 3 only have a 3.5mm unbalanced output. You can adapt those and they should work fine as long as you keep the cable short so you avoid picking up any interference.
Outstanding review! One thing I hate on the F8 is the AA battery sled and access door; it is a pain to access from the bottom of a sound bag and the locking screw for the battery door is really small and poorly secured to the door. The MixPre definitely has a better AA battery arrangement.
Hi Gregg. Yes, I agree. I have to admit, I really just see the AA batteries as a backup to sustain the mixer while I change out other batteries.
Hi Curtis. Can I use the mixpre iii both as an audio interface and a standalone recorder without being connected to the computer?
It is primarily a stand-alone field recorder but can also be an audio interface when connected to your computer via USB.
@@curtisjudd thank you so much 🙏
Great stuff Curtis, I found that really helpful. Many thanks.
👍
Hi Curtis, Thank You for another comprehensive review! I have been a F8 user for the past two years, but since I am doing mostly documentaries, I am gravitating towards lightweight setups (even such as a H4n mounted on a bottom of a boom pole - but that was years ago). I am now looking for a lightweight universal (H4n) replacement, and the MixPre-3 seems like a great option, that would put all the Zoom and Tascam models out of the competition. Are the preamps and limiters as good as the other SoundDevices and better than Tascams and Zooms? Would it make a difference with a Sennheiser MKH-60 and the Sennheiser microports?
Hi Radovan, I prefer the sound of the MixPre Kashmir preamps over the Zoom F4/F8 but the difference is very small: ruclips.net/video/Hnvq-6M1adE/видео.html
I will also say that I prefer the sound of the SD 633 over the MixPre, but that is also a very small difference (also included in the comparison linked above).
Yes, the MixPre will work very well with the Sennheiser MKH series and microports.
Hey Curtis, On your recommendation I got the Mix-Pre3 and couldnt be happier! Except for 1 thing. I mounted my Sony A7 camera on the Mix-Pre3 and was having some EMF noise coming through every time I hit record on the camera. When the camera is not mounted I do not get any noise. Do you have any idea why this might be happening? Thank you from Brooklyn, NY!
Hi Didge Project, glad its mostly working well! I haven’t experienced this but I would recommend contacting SD support. They’re quite good at solving issues like this. Best wishes!
Thanks for the reply. This is AJ btw. All the best you Curtis!
Ok I figured it out. I checked the same set up on a Sony A7sii and there was no issue. So then I went back to the A7 and I found that as soon as the 1/4 20 pin makes contact with the camera’s mounting hole on the bottom, the emf noise comes in. So its probably a flaw in the A7 design which they corrected in later models. I hope this helps anyone who needs it. Love the MixPre-3 and thanks again Curtis, I’ve learned a lot from you about sound and lighting for video! -AJ
Nice find, thanks for sharing!
Did you try to use all 6 inputs of the MixPre-6 with say, wireless lavaliers?
Basically would inputs 5 and 6 work if you send sound from 2 wireless lavaliers through an adapter (e.g. 2 XLR female to a balanced male 3.5mm)?
+Mark Hodgkin yes, have definitely fed wireless into the MixPre but have never tapped out all 6 inputs. I've fed one unbalanced wireless feed into 5/6. You could get two unbalanced in with a splitter but not something I'd recommend on a regular basis.
Thank you for your answer! I imagine it would be fine with just 1 wireless mic on input 5/6, but was curious to know how it would sound with 2 unbalanced wireless mics there. Yes, wouldn't use on a regular basis, but would it actually work? If you ever do that let me know! Cheers
Will do!
Remember you lose 5/6 if you using TC in your bag.
If you're doing lots of wireless then you really should go for a Zoom F4 or F8
Definitely agree if using loads of wireless a Zoom F8 is better.
Just wondering if, treated as an exception, one could use 6 wireless on the MixPre-6.
Hi thanks for this I wonder what differences you feel between mixpre 3 and 6? Thank you for your great always helpful work. Best John
+John Blystone hi John. The main differences are the number of XLR inputs, the fact that the inputs on the 6 also take 1/4 inch TRS plugs, and the 6 can record at 192kHz while the 3 tops out at 96kHz. The three is also a fair bit smaller physically. Otherwise they're the same.
Hey Crutis! Greetings from Argentina! I have a question for you (sorry for my awfull english). Can I conect this three devices to my computer, record, and in the same time be able to hear the recordings through my near fields monitors? I don't know if i'm expresing correctly. In other words, can i conect my near field monitors to this devices? I think you specified that about de zoom f8, with the mini xlr balanced outputs, but what about the f4 and the MixPre? There is almost no information about it on the internet. Great, great video! Thanks!
Hi Conra, yes, you can use all of these as audio interfaces to your computer and connect near-field monitors to them. You will need to potentially use adapter cables or a DI (direct input) box with the MixPre if your monitors take a balanced input only. With the F4, the line level outputs are full size XLR so this makes it easy if your monitors take a balanced signal via XLR or 1/4" TRS plug. I hope that helps!
Hi Curtis i had a quick question if you don't mind. I have an sd442 and I was wondering if you felt that by using that as a front end to an F4 might get around many of the issues that the f4 has in a pro setting (pro line out from 442, input analogue limiters, etc) or if you could see pitfalls? I know one is that using the 4 iso outs on the 442 is all pre fader so monitoring on the 442 is not really an option. I was also looking closely at the MP6 but lack of timecode and hirose power puts me off. I work mainly in post but I want to upgrade my production rig for when needed without paying a fortune.
Great videos and thanks!
Thanks! Yes, the 442 would certainly solve those particular problems. It'll be a bit heavy to carry both in a bag, but no problem when working form a cart. The great thing about the 442 is that they're so affordable used these days. Good luck!
Curtis Judd thanks Curtis yeah I've had the 442 for a couple of years and it's great but it is quite big. Maybe splashing out on a mixpre 10t would do me better in the long run. Thanks again
What a fantastic and comprehensive comparison. Yet again an superb example of how this sort of video tutorial should be done.
Regarding the lack of safety track feature on the MixPre series. A while ago I heard the suggestion that because the preamps are so quiet you can afford to record at a lower level (in a sense, the equivalent of a safety track) and boost in post without any problems. Would you agree with this.
Thanks again.
Good point John, Paul Isaacs from Sound Devices suggested that to me when we first talked back at NAB earlier this year. That's definitely another strategy that works given the quality of the preamps.
Thanks for the reply. I certainly watched that interview with Paul Isaacs (never miss any of your videos) so that must be where I remember hearing the suggestion.
I liked the idea of recording the right side at -10db versus the left.
I’m looking for a step by step video to show how to adjust output levels on multiple channels on the Zoom F4.
Need a bit more info and maybe context - what you're trying to accomplish?
Whoa! Thank you for such a thorough comparison!
👍
Hi, this is really a great and very informative video, it's very much appreciated. I have one question: you are saying that the mini-xlr-output isn't "professional", and I don't understand whether you are talking about the form factor (the mini) or the electrical output (perhaps to low ...?), or maybe I'm missing something completely. And: wouldn't either of these two possibilities easily curable with additional "things" ...?
The line level output is -10dBV which is considered "consumer line level". It is just slightly less powerful that the typical +4dBu "pro line level". The mini XLR connectors just need an adapter.
@@curtisjudd Hi Chris, I am totally blown away by your commitment to your channel and us, the audience. An answer to a 4 year old video after one day - unbelievable. Thank you so much for your videos, I already learned a lot. You convinced me (with another video) to step up my gear to a MixPre II (coming from a humble TASCAM DR40X), and now I will subscribe to my very first paid online course in my life to learn more ... Again: what you do here on RUclips is very special!
@@MrJPG1000 Thanks! Happy recording!
Hi Curtis! Thanks for the amazing comparison. With regard to the Zoom F4 - would paring it with a Sound Devices MM-1, give that top level Sound Devices pre-amp timbre and also allow for clean headphone monitoring? (I already own the F4, so considering picking up the MM-1 second hand) Thanks!!
Ant
I would thinks so though I haven’t specifically used the MM1. SD gear usually has a bit more low end without being overwhelming while the Zoom F series sounds a bit more clinical. And I’d bet the headphone amp on the MM1 is better than the F4.
Hi Curtis, thank you for your amazing video! just a silly question, is it possible to solo the audio in the headphones of just one mic during the recordings? I mean, if you are recording for example 3 radio mics and 1 boom mic, would it be possible to hear just one mic in the headphones?
Yes, that is possible with all of this recorders.
@@curtisjudd great! thanks Curtis!
Just another amazing comparison Curtis! Thank you! I wonder if the sampling rate matters in such comparison, you know Zooms can sample audio up to 192kHz and MixPre3 can do at 96kHz. Does this matter in terms of audio quality for indoor dialogues?
Hi Husain Ali, for dialogue, I don't think sample rates higher than 48kHz make much of a difference. The main time I would consider using 96kHz is when recording sound effects which I wanted to process and especially in cases where I want to slow the sounds for slow motion shots.
In most of the tests I've seen, even the most experienced mix engineers cannot reliably identify 96 or 192kHz sampled music from 44.1 sampled music in blind listening tests.
I think using a lossless format like wav vs lossy formats like AAC and mp3 is much more important than using high sample rates.
As usual, thanks Curtis!
I'm looking hard at the Sound Devices premix-10M as I almost solely do portable music shoots. Overdubbing is a huge plus, and lack of a F-control a big minus. For now I'm using the Zoom F8. Any takes on the premix 10-m? Thanks!!
Hi Joe, here are my thoughts on the 10T: ruclips.net/video/LgRdT8gsfIs/видео.html
Unless you will never use it for filming and only for overdubbing, you should go with the 10T and NOT the 10M.
Curtis, totally unrelated, but is there a way of analyzing audio to tell if it's EBU R-128 compliant in Adobe Audition?
Hi, sort of. The Match loudness panel allows you to normalize using R-128 parameters. Technically, the Loudness Meter (Effects->Special->Loudness Radar Meter) offers metering for BS.1770-3 but if you set up the parameters to match EBU R-128, it will give you a good idea.
Curtis Judd thank you so much Curtis!
Great review Curtis, thanks a lot. My choice as a videographer is the MixPre-3.
Thanks! Good choice!
Hi Curtis, one question: The XLR cable for the MixPre-3 I find on the internet is only 30cm long. Do you have an idea where I can find a longer cable, so I could use it on a boom?
Oh, this seems to me a rather silly question thinking about it now. I could just use an XLR extension.
Yes, any quality XLR cable should do that job.
Hi Curtis and thank you for all your educational videos, i have learned so much from you. I have a question. I have made my first serious sound recording for a documentary film with Zoom F8 ( before that I was using Zoom h6, but there are some disadvantages in order to work them in the field) . Because of voice was so unstable with dialogs and music etc.. I recorded it on stereo mode and adjusted each channel on different levels. So, the question is, when I edit the sound with Adobe software , is it a good idea to replace the high peaking points with the other channel sound ( which was optimized specially for high peaks ). I would like to hear your opinion if you have time to answer it. Thank you again.
Hi 1 nevi, yes, if the main channels has clipped/distorted, I would cut to the backup channel in post. Good luck on your film!
Wow, that was very quick answer!! Thank you.
SoundDevices now offers a sled that powers via Hirose. I bought it immediately. Excellent review, but the way. I ordered a MixPre-3.
That's a nice addition.
Great review as always!
Question re Zoom F-Control device. Please comment on comparing it to using an iPad via bluetooth, ignoring the obvious that it has better control with sliders. Does it help with (USB) keyboard input and creating sound reports?
In fact, can you/do you, have a video on how to use the F8 to create professional Sound Reports for use in a movie shoot environment? Thanks,
Paul
Hi Paul, You can connect a USB keyboard to the F-Control to enter metadata so that definitely helps with creating sound reports. I don't have a specific video where we demonstrate sound report generation but that's a good one I'll add to the list. Thanks!
I need to be able to name inputs. My Zoom H6 creates a new folder per each take but the inputs are not named. Would be helpful. Instead of each file labeled ZOOM0001Tr1.wav. I would like each track nameable before we start recording my production.
What recorder can do this? The analog limiter vs digital is important for my productions.Price is a huge contender, $2K wold be my limit. The MixPre-10T does not seem to dowhat I want. thoughts. I am the AD for Falcon Entertainment for Mafia War Chronicles.
Thank you for your input. the H6 i use for my YT channel. I used it for my shoot this past weekend and the 4AAs lasted 8 hours using 6 channels.
What seems to be missing on the MixPre-10T for you?
Thanks for a great video. I would buy the mix pre 6 if I could clarify one thing. Normally on shoot I sync the timecode with the camera (for instance on the SD633) in the jam menu and then leave the timecode running. Is this not possible on the mix pre 6 ? Would I have to stay connected to camera in order to write timecode data to my files ?
Hi Emmett, if I understand correctly, you are using the timecode generator in the 633 to feed timecode continuously to camera. The MixPre-3 and 6 can receive HDMI timecode via HDMI feed from the camera effectively with the same results - if the camera sends timecode via HDMI. Or you can use external timecode generators like Tentacle Sync E.
But no, the MixPre-3 and 6 do not have an in-built timecode generator like the 633.
Hey Curtis, I appreciate this review as I've been looking at the Zoom F4. I understand your bias and have taken it into consideration but I would really appreciate your device as I am truly a novice compared to the knowledge you have. I am a filmmaker and I work on projects that range from Short Films, Corporate Vidz, Promo Marketing Vidz, Government Vidz...and conferences (I also use the H6 as an audio interface)! I currently have 3 H4n's and 1 H6 because most of the conferences we do have breakout rooms that don't usually go beyond four. I am looking to replace my h4n's, they need to be upgraded. I don't use the microphone on the H6 AT ALL nor the H4n's and based on what I do and your review, I was thinking of purchasing three F4's. Based on the info that I've given you, would you recommend three H6's or F4's? (F4 = $550 & H6n = $400)
Hi Ethan, the F4s have some features that may be worthwhile for your work; Dual SD cards and the ability to power via very large external batteries. The preamplifiers are in a very different league - much cleaner. Build-wise they're also a bit more robust. I'd go for the F4s if you've got the budget. Good luck!
Mhm. Am on the look out to connect the battery you recommend to the F4. Interestingly enough I can get that battery pack here in Germany fairly easy. Finding a fitting DC 9 to Hirose cabel is far harder. 'tis possible to order the cable you recommend from the US - but that feels a bit silly / pricey to do :).
Yeah, perhaps Thoman Sound has something?
Hi curtis, going to do my first wedding video next month, what recorder would you recommend for recording dj board audio? I know very little about audio so please recommend a dummy proof one :) max budget is around 200-250. Also one that can be charged via a powerbank would big plus for me! Thx for your time!
Hi Bart, I'd have a look at the Tascam DR-60DmkII: ruclips.net/video/TRoIMPHS91U/видео.html Good luck!
Thx for the link, you have me convinced on going for the dr-60d2! Do you have any videos on how to connect these recorders to dj mixers etc? I am really a newbie when it comes to recorders, xlr, -12db and other chinese sounding terms :)
Hi Curtis, very nice video! Greetings from Ecuador. I just bought my zoom f8 and I'm looking for a good power bank. So I was wondering, so far how does that "Tallentcell" performed to you, I mean in terms of time? I work making documentaries and I need a power bank that at least can handle an entire day of production without recharging. Again, congratulations for the video and I hope to see more of your videos!
+Daniel Dosa hi Daniel, it definitely does not last a day, closer to 4 hours. I think you may need to move up to the more expensive batteries to get enough capacity for all day use. My Anton Bauer 90kW can power it all day.
You sir are pure gold. btw a6500 has tc out setting via hdmi. I wonder if it works with mix pre.
Thanks! Good question. I've been thinking about trying out an a6500. Will test and let you know if that works out!
www.sounddevices.com/products/recorders/mixpre-6/supported-cameras Says yes.
Thanks neoshazam! I thought I had seen that page previously but couldn't find it.
Thanks!
Unless you need your hdmi output for streaming via a Teredek Vidiu Pro... then what?
Love your reviews - exhaustive and very objective. You make is clear when something is your personal preference and why. I love my Zoom H6, but I find myself longing for more gain! (I record nature outdoors). The F4 has a decent price point, but I really wish it was a color display - makes peaking adjustment easier.
Agreed. The MixPre has the advantage there.
Very informative video. Thank you. I d like to know the manufacturer's (Sound Device) release dates of the MixPre 3 and 6
Hi Fox X, I don't remember the exact date of release for the original MixPre 3 and 6 but they announced them at NAB 2017 (April) and I received mine in June 2017 as I recall. I pre-ordered so my MixPre-6 was the first batch to ship.
@@curtisjudd Thank you.
Thank you for this video. It’s very useful for me. I want to buy a new sound recorder in a few weeks; maybe a Zoom F4, maybe a Sound Device MixPre-3. Just a little precision if you know. What about iXML? Do you use iXML in FCPX ? Do you think it’s something important ? You can get iXML in the F4 but not with the MixPre series. I’m right ?
And a last question, do you think Sound Device can add iXML in the MixPre series with firmware upgrade ? Or do you think Sound Device get this feature for their high range products?
Sorry for my bad english.
Hi Bruno, The MixPre's metadata transfers through to FCPX nicely in my tests. The track names you setup are carried through as role assignments and all of the other metadata are carried through. I'm not sure whether it is using iXML or just the standard BWF metadata but the MixPre seems to work quite nicely with FCPX.
Thanks Curtis. I think I'll buy the MixPre-3. But I'll take another few weeks to think.
I'd be interested to see how the pre-amps on these records compare to the Roland R44, which is much older, but still being sold at a similar price point to the MixPre3 and a bit higher than the Zoom F4?
Hi James, good question. I'll endeavor to borrow one for testing when the opportunity arises. Thanks!
I am not sure about the "consumer output" quality you were talking about...!!
If that is the case, could one remove the SD card after recording and run it from a computer with a good external sound card when mixing down audio ?
Great Review...!! Thx.
Hi Mus Ele, no, I was not talking about transferring the audio to a computer via USB, that is fine. I was talking about the line outputs - XLR on the F4, TA3M on the F8. This is to send audio to a camera via an audio cable. It is not bad quality, it is just not as strong a signal as professional line level. It still works fine, you may just need to amplify it a bit more on the camera side.
Thank you for prompt response...!! Best to you.
Excellent detailed comparison. One question: could you expand on the difference on consumer versus pro level outputs?. Thanks.
Balance consumer line level is a less powerful signal than pro line level. In practical terms this means that when feeding audio from your recorder to a camera, the output will not be as strong with consumer line level.
Thank you very much for the response. I wanted to confirm this. Have a great week !
+Curtis Judd I find it interesting how you say that the mixpre don't have a safety track feature but I am wondering whether it's possible to record to a second track without any safety features? So since the analogue limiters will do their job, that's great but if I do a recording where certain settings onset are preferential and then later decide certain parts would be better in a raw unajusted recording then I would love to have that possibility. Do you know about this?
Hi Nice, one could us a cable splitter to feed the audio from on mic to two separate inputs on the MixPre.
Very Nice! And I assume the cable splitter won't affect the audio input as long as it has the same quality components as the balanced cable from the mic.
I haven’t done it before so I’m not positive on that, but worth a try. I’ve heard other engineers claim they’ve had good results with quality split cables.
Excellent video!!!! I’m looking for something to record a band (live). I was once using the H6 for this purpose but would like to upgrade. Would you recommend one of these devices shown in order to do this as an upgrade?
Live band or studio? Will there be a mixing board and you'll be recording the mix off of that?
@@curtisjudd live band (like a rehearsal). Just needing something to get better audio from in post to sync with cameras. There will be no mixing board.
@@StuartJrBarrett These could work, of course, and do a very good job. If you'd prefer something with linear faders which are a little easier to operate, you might have a look at the ZOOM LiveTrak series. Here's a look at the L8 from a podcast perspective, but the LiveTraks are made for band rehearsal recordings as primary use case: ruclips.net/video/HYIJsOg9TPw/видео.html
@@curtisjudd Awesome! Thank you!!
I have a Canon EOS 5D Mark 4 that I want to use for a documentary film. What would you advise me to do as far as sound recording is concerned if I have a MixPre: connect it them together, or record the sound separately?
I'd record the separately, or if you do feed audio from the MixPre to camera, I'd still record on the MixPre and use that audio in post.
Used the F8 on a production a few months ago. Was planning to use it in mixer mode but had to abandon the idea since the F8 does not allow for gain trim in the channels PFL menus... I think you had to change back to trim mode to be able to change gain at all. I don't understand why they've done it this way but i'd be way more temped to buy one if they'd iron out those little things.
Also, to get dBU metering instead of dBV metering you have to change metering mode to "PEAK + VU".
Hi Simon, yes, it works a little differently where you use the main encoder to change between fader and trim modes. I actually prefer that so that I don't have to jump into the PFL menu for each individual channel but it is definitely different than most other mixer/recorders.
Good info, thanks!
Hi Curtis.
will you teach a course on Zoom F4 someday? y see that you have done one about F8n.
Hi Uno Castillo, yes, I hope to. It is just a matter of carving out enough time to do it. Thanks!
Hi Curtis! I have a question and it might be rather silly, but I'll ask it anyway. What does it mean that main output in consumer-level? How it affects performance?
Hi Pawel, Consumer line level is a less "powerful" level of the audio signal. Most professional equipment (cameras, audio gear, etc.) uses line level. The impact is that the recorded level may be lower than optimal. You can read about line level here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_level
Curtis would you recommend the mixpre3 for wedding flims.
I'd recommend the MixPre-3 as a very high quality recorder for a lot of situations. But it depends on how you plan to use it. Will it be connect to the DJ's sound board? Connected to the camera? Some other config?
Will you review the new Samson Go Mic Mobile wireless system? I wonder how's the sound quality going to be
That looks pretty cool, will have to check it out!
Hej Curtis ! Great Video, Thanks. one Q: I have a problem trying to figur out how to power up the F8 with a rode smartlav+ with the rode SC3 converter cable . I have tried to plug it in without phantom power , and it doesn´t work. Do you have any solution ?
Hi J. the smartLav+ requires plugin power. I'm not sure whether that'll work but you might try turning on the plugin power option in the F8's menu to see if that does the job. Best wishes!
Dear Curtis, is it possible to use XLR y-splitter to achieve a safety track in Zoom h4n Pro? This model does not offer any inbuilt safety track option. (Cable from boom microphone would be splitted to the other XLR-input and that would be recorded with lower gain.) Best regards!
Hi Harri, yes, technically possible.
Too bad both h4n Pro XLR-inputs give out phantom power. I dont know how the mic would handle this double phantom power...
@@harrij.9542 I don't believe this is a problem, there are many engineers that use splitters to record live shows and many mixing boards can only apply phantom to all of the mic inputs. You might watch this interview we did some time ago with Mike Stranks who does a lot of live show recording. He uses isolators on the inputs with splitters and gets good results: ruclips.net/video/KPXcjmDl-Eo/видео.html
Thank you, very helpful video
Do you recommend recording Lavalier Mics on a R16 Zoom Recorder? It fits our film budget and it’s the only 8 track recorder we can rent at Long&Mcquade.
Hi LaRana Nation, I haven't personally used the R16, but it should do the job. Be sure to test before you jump into a job. Best wishes!
Thanks for video. In the meantime the Mixpre 3 II and Zoom F6 is available. 3 channels are sufficient for me.
Should I go for the Mixpre 3 II or is F6 good enough? Mixpre 3 II with extra L mount adapter is 250€ more....
I can't tell you what you should do, but to me, the $250 more is worth it. 😀
@@curtisjudd many thanks for you opinion, Curtis. Can you point out what the 250€ more is worth it?
My mean usage scenario is to get better sound while filming with my Fujifilm Camera and my Sennheiser MKE600. Mostly the camera I’m using on a gimbal. Therefor the recorder must go into a (sound) bag. For the moment I’m using a Tascam DR100 II which is really not comparable. For this I’m a bit afraid of the SD with L mount battery gets a bit too bulky?
Second scenario is to use it as a usb sound Interface (have a very Bad and old usb interface here without a brand) to connect my Rode Procaster to the computer for streaming like Zoom meeting.
Maybe later I’m planning with a second mic to connect like a wireless one but that’s not my task on the moment...
@@pag5210 I find the MixPre easier to operate with its touchscreen and larger channel knobs which are more spaced apart. I prefer the sound of the MixPre's preamps, I find its analogue limiters to be superior to the digital hybrid limiters in the F6 and if I ever need to run audio out of the recorder to a camera, the F6 has a major flaw where the output produces an obvious, unacceptable amount of self-noise. The MixPre can be controlled via app on iOS or Android while the F6 is iOS only. The timecode implementation makes more sense to me on the MixPre than on the F6 (that's a longer story than I can cover in a YT comment). If you prefer the form factor of the F6, that is a consideration, certainly.
As far as use as an audio interface, I find the MixPre superior there as well. I do not have to dive 3 deep into the menus to put it into audio interface mode. Also, the line out becomes a problem again on the F6 if you plan to drive speakers from the recorder - same noise issue unless your speakers can take a line level signal and have their own volume control.
@@curtisjudd Many thanks. I think I go for the Mixpre 3 II. Think the better userinterface is worth it. And three channels will be enough for my scenarios. Even if I will record a podcast, Interview or something like that this three channels should be enough. Now I must see where to get a matching Orca bag. These are everywhere sold out in Germany.
Is the Automix plugin or Noisefilter plugin a recommendation? Maybe you can make a video in future about this, or does I haven’t found an existing one?
@@pag5210 Here's one on the MixAssist plugin: ruclips.net/video/oTLfgQ3qSek/видео.html
And here is one on NoiseAssist (I did this on then 888 but it works the same on MixPre but for only one channel or mix): ruclips.net/video/nUVmHCYYlj8/видео.html
F8 is the best option price / quality. In my opinion. Cheers.
Thanks Byron.
F4 is the best option price / quality. In my opinion. Cheers. ;-)
Ruined a few minutes of a take by starting accidentally on the 4AA powering option of MixPre-6, I thought the USB-C battery was powered up. So the Sony NP-L sled you showed, I am interested in getting it. nice experiences of it?
Yes, it works well in a bag, but not quite so well if you're planning to set the unity on a table as one of the batteries protrudes from the bottom of the sled. Much longer power times.
Curtis Judd but it seems stable/reliable? I would primarily use it on a tripod where the physical dimensions work. My NP batteries are the huge variants though, somewhat heavy. It just looks like it loads a lot of weight in a really odd fashion, but I guess they must have done the math and decided it is safe.
How many hours does that external USB battery you listed in the description last for the Zoom F8, in your experience?
About 3 hours, possibly 3.5 depending on how many mics you're recording and phantom powering. They also have a larger capacity model (on the same page @ Amazon).
Can you operate on wall AC power with either of these recorders, such as in an interview situation?
I am planning a multi-mic (with decrete audio channels for back-up) interview situation so that I can preserve the original audio for future use.
Yes, both the Zoom F4 and F8/F8n come with AC adapters. You can buy an AC adapter for the MixPre series.
@@curtisjudd Great sounding videos!!!! :)
I had wished I had access to this gear when I was recording remote recording for the NPR afilliate here in Portland, Oregon instead of an Ampex 601 tape machine years ago.
@@KurtRWarner Thanks! I agree, so nice that we have access to more affordable options with amazing quality!
Newbie question. I am looking at a field recorder for recording Bird song. I also have a Sony NEX FS700. It would be nice on occasion to improve the sound on the camera with an external mic / input possibly from the recorder? I also use the camera for gigs & would like to improve the sound too. I have been looking at the Zoom F8 or even the F4 - Do you think these would be suitable and what do I need to look for to save buying the wrong unit. My work is mainly for fun but I would like the audio to be as good as possible for the bands and my own pleasure. I can probably only buy once there a little concerned I might miss something and regret the choice later. I know it is not easy to say buy this but hopefully you can warn of missing something. Thanks for the info on RUclips.Cheers
Hi DrPhotoOnTour, yes, I think the F4 or F8n can serve this purpose very well. I believe the FS700 has XLR inputs? If so, the F4 might be a good option as you could run standard XLR mic/patch cables from the recorder to camera. The preamplifiers on the Zoom recorders are very clean and powerful. I think it would be a good option. Best wishes!
Thank you for you quick response Chris - It's a nightmare. I have even looked at the SD744T complete with a TW mixer but it is then getting rather expensive and not sure if it would be worth the extra outlay. Lots of thinking to do. Cheers
If you wouldn't mind listing out your requirements in priority order, I'm happy to take a look at them and give my opinion on which might be the best fit.
Thank you Curtis - I have bitten the bullet and bought a Sound Devices 744T Recorder with TW-LP44 Mixer - Fingers crossed.
@@DrPhotoOnTour Plenty of pros have made great recordings with the 744T so I think you're in a good place. Happy recording!
Just curious (and this probably isn't done in any practical shooting scenarios, but): is there a way to feed the output from an XLR microphone onto two different recording destinations? Say, an external recorder, AND a preamp that's feeding into the camera - at the same time? I understand that signal loss would be an issue, and therefore I'd need probably need to use a higher gain settings on both recording platforms - but is this still doable?
Yes, there are options out there. Here's one from Rolls: bhpho.to/2xqWaZU You want to ensure that you use a isolator so that things don't get muddled in the process.
The only thing I miss from the Zoom is no analogue limiters and no backlit stop button. Other than that, it's a beast of a device. I love it.
Good point on the lack of backlighting for the stop button. I ran into that on a shoot in a dark studio just the other day.
Totally agree to the no backlit buttons, whenever I happen to shoot in a indoor location theater, which is usually dark, it is a problem for pretty much every button.
For the limiters, I believe what zoom did is actually a trick and it does actually work in the analog domain to avoid overshooting the ADC. If I'm not mistaken it works like this: let's say you set the limiter at -6 dB, the F8 then lowers the analog gain by 6 dB and raises the digital signal by 6 dBb, total overall gain is thus the same as without the limiter. Whenever the signal goes above the threshold (on the digital side), the digital limiter can now kick that back, but the analog part still has 6dB of overhead to work with. It will raise your noise floor by those 6dBs (or whetever you set), but then again, every compressor and/or limiter will diminish noise to signal ratio. So this is how I understood it works.
Great content. I have h6 and the floor noise is way too much for great interviews. So I am looking to upgrade. I have Sennheisers AVX mics but floor noise needs too much cleaning. So which of the two F4 vs MixPre-3 has lower noise?
Both have very low self-noise, a teeny tiny bit less in the MixPre.
Thanks.
Mix Pr6 is over $1100, F4 is around $449 and Mix Pre 3 is over $649 so I really want to invest into something that is justified. I made good investment and have GH5S, GH5 and Sony A7iii, but you are right without great and clean audio all is wasted. So debating which one gives lower noise and is justified at the price point.
Here's the thing: Technically the MixPre's preamps are quieter by about 2dB on the test I saw. I have serious doubts that anyone can hear that difference. The more important thing will be to go with the Zoom F4 or MixPre-3, whichever makes sense for your budget, and ensure that you get a microphone with a low self-noise specification. The microphone will make more of a difference than the recorder.
Best wishes and happy recording! 🎤
Awesome. Thanks. I really appreciate your assistance.
I have already invested in 3 AVX mics and they are expensive $800 each + I have EV RE 320 and Shure SM58. So I am not going to buy new set of mics. That's why I am kinda confused.
i bought F6 after using it i return back and bought a MixPre-3 .
I hope the MixPre works better for you.
@@curtisjudd i am recording car exhaust sound and can’t find right recorder , i am not professional sound recording but trying to learn something from you too , i hope 🤞 i will receive on August 19th and let you know 😅
@@curtisjudd and I bought the course for MixPre
@@TheProVideo I hope you find it helpful. Happy recording!
Hello Curtis, what do you think about Nagra recorders? Like Nagra VI or Nagra 7
I'd love to try one but haven't had the opportunity. Thanks for coming to the livestream!
I have the MixPre 3, and I also have the Zoom H4n. With my Zoom I can set my peak levels to -6db during recording and I get very healthy wave forms in FCPX. With the MixPre if my recording peak levels travel much above -20db on the recording level meter then the recording sounds super hot and I get clipping and red peaks in FCPX. What gives?
Hmm. Do you have samples of each online somewhere?
Did you figure this out? Are you recording in 32-bit float?