S4 E10. We find out if the AMR500 supercharged Kubota diesel engine is more fuel efficient.
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- Опубликовано: 9 мар 2024
- Season 4 Episode 10. Jimbo finds out if the recently installed AMR500 supercharger on the 719 cc kubota diesel engine has an effect on fuel efficiency. The answer may surprise you, tune in and find out.
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Jimbo
Robot Cantina
207 S. Sedgwick Ave
P.O. Box 28
Haven KS, 67543 
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This channel is like Sunday morning cartoons for adults. Just came to this realization as I've been watching for the past several months.
car tunes lol
@@fenreon i see what you did there. Lol!
I really like your analogy or metaphor or what ever it is ha ha. I'm not an English major.
@@fenreon hahaha that's perfect. Car tunes lol you win my version of the internet for today, that is great
@@user-ru3rq4jv3f I think it's an analogy as it uses the word "like"
If memory serves me correctly anyway, analogy is directly comparing. Metaphor is more when you imply/infer?
I could be wrong too. Wouldn't have pointed it out or said anything if you had picked one, I'm not 100% sure which is right either but I think it's analogy. Lol
My strong subject has always been things that go vroom lol
Jimbo, you drive that car off the sides of the road like a 16 year old, who is just learning to *text and drive* lol 🤣🤣🤣
It annoyed me as well that he was hugging the line all the time. Own the lane, just like when riding a motorcycle
It’s honestly amazing how bad he is at maintaining lane position.
A spring-loaded belt tensioner would certainly help with keeping that belt tight, and saving the need for roadside maintenance... :)
i wonder what a torque converter would do to the parasitic loads.
@@felderupmake it worse. There's a significant amount of slip in a cvt compared to a single speed belt drive. And it would only make the boost disparity worse at high rpm worse.
@@ShinyUmbreon765 yah, there's some with less slip but that shouldn't affect the making of a chart showing the effect.
Turbo+supercharger please
A flat belt is more efficient than a V-belt
Great video. I figured the fuel economy would go up if you drove it normally.
I had a Western Star truck with a 16 liter Detroit and 600hp from the factory. I worked with a tuner and we added a 20 % tune to go to 750hp and I gained .5 mpg.
The truck was run on a dyno to get real numbers. That saved me over 2000 gallons of Diesel per year and was well worth the investment.
Don't leave us hanging. What was the result in mpg? What kind of load?
This is a great example of a small difference multiplying into a huge one.
@@lightningdemolition1964
I was pulling a 53’ refer back and forth to Alaska. It was a six axle setup with Canadian axle spacing of 54” on center on the trailer. The average weight was about 45,000 to 48,000 pounds in the box. The truck averaged 5.5 mpg over 370,000 miles when it was replaced. There was hardly any idle time involved. I used a Carrier APU instead it had probably the same Kubota engine in it then the Honda.
@@cullenmiller8170 thanks, I thought my mileage was bad but I guess not. I'm getting a solid 5 mpg mostly short local under 20k miles a year on a Detroit d13. Hauling dump trailers and at landfills. I used to have a series 60 Detroit that got me 7 to 8 mpg in the same service. California air resources board shut it down because too old even though it worked fine. That's why we can't have nice things.
A lot of people are unimpressed with small mpg improvements, but over time, it really does add up (especially on any vehicle that drives a lot).
As you have not added more fuel it's possible that the extra torque that's now available is making the engine struggle less. Better economy on an engine with more torque but with no fuel rack adjustments🤔.
Always enjoy the videos👍
That's exactly what I was thinking. I'm willing to bet a couple more lbs of boost & it'll get better mpg.
Yeah I’ve noticed the same effect on most aftermarket small displacement engines I’ve supercharged. In normal everyday driving and especially during highway driving the extra torque will give you better mpg. It would be even more noticeable with hills since the rpm’s wouldn’t change much and gears wouldn’t need to change.
It'll be a bell curve. It can't go on like this forever. Also it's cruise performance being measured.
@@ThePaulv12 of course, but it'll be fun to see what kind of mpg this little engine can pump out as well as how much horsepower could potentially be achieved
@@TheTulerie Probably not, if it was a turbo yeah but more boost on this charger is going to just increase frictional losses for little gain
“Nobody would ever want to drive this thing that long”
You underestimate our love for jankiness, Jimbo! I dailied an 84 diesel rabbit for two years with a broken heat box.
On another note: you might benefit from tossing that turbo you had back onto this setup. Twincharging is sorta more common than pure supercharged diesels because it is very possible to lean out the motor at low load/idle and “blow out” the combustion once you get more air out of the supercharger. Food for thought!
This result was expected, I can try explain. With the added boost you are getting more torque from the engine, but you don't increase the amount of fuel that goes into it. Commercially available Diesel engine always run with excess air when possible to get maximum power while having complete combustion (reduces particle emissions).
What you have done is made the fuel burn more efficient and complete. Requiring less throttle input to maintain speed, which in turn squirts less fuel into the cylinder.
This is fascinating and I myself have been looking at AMR superchargers as a potential to increase power in motorcycle engines that compete in the UK Formula Student events.
The Engine was previously set up for a Turbo, including Fuel, and this wasn't changed back to NA running. So it is still running more fuel than NA.
TLDR - I dig all the videos on your channel related to this content. It shows you really know what you are talking about, vs just someone who needs someone, ANYONE to listen to them.
absolutely correct @@MyFabian94
Love the fact the Honda Insight can Coal Roll. Keep up the good work.
Hi from the uk if you are measuring the fuel by weight you don't need to be concerned about temperature, for any given weight the volume will change with temperature
Keep up the good work
This doesn’t factor the difference in density of the fuel in the car tank.
It wouldn't make a difference if they *fully* drained the tank each time to check the weight, but because they're leaving a known volume of fuel, there is a difference from temperature.
The temperature is a concern to get a similar volume out of the tank. Since Jimbo is using the level of the fuel return, he wants the fuel density to be as close as possible to ensure the volume extracted is as close in density to the volume added as possible.
@ThatMattWhite
Hi
Yes I see my mistake
You got me
I think after you swap the supercharger pulley you might be able to drive this thing on a highway.
It is a diesel, if his fueling stays the same so will his horsepower even if he doubles the boost. Actually in the end it would make less hp if he doubled the boost right now with no fueling changes because of the increased losses to the supercharger. Of course it would be fixed by adding more fuel to match. His motors already running lean as hell if it is not smoking just like any other diesel
@@DarkAttack14 Gale Banks would like to have a word with you
@@vandersnickmcduffle7333 wouldn't be much for him to say, if you're already running lean and smoke free adding boost has no positive effect on horsepower whatsoever that's factual. You can quadruple the boost on a diesel while keeping fueling the same and you will make ZERO extra power *unless you were running rich/smokey to begin with*. A properly running diesel at 20 pounds of boost with make the exact same amount of power if not slightly less at 40 pounds of boost up until you add fuel
@@DarkAttack14It is a bit over fueled right now. You've seen the smoke.
@@DarkAttack14it’s not running lean
That mpg is INSANE!!! I was saying I'd be impressed if it was over 55mpg. You're a wizard Jimbo!
At those speeds the stock car with its original gasoline engine and electric assist would be getting around 70 to 80mpg (while also being much more drivable and highway-worthy). Not downplaying Jimbo's mechanical wizardry, but I think most of the heavy lifting on the efficiency front is being done by the car's aerodynamic shape, low frontal area, and light weight.
I believe the reasoning for the better fuel economy is you just need to use the pedal as less. I have seen people who v8 swap 4runners get almost twice the MPGs over the small displacement V6's sure they work great at highway speeds but you need to damn near redline it to keep up with traffic if any stops/hills are involved. With the v8 you can just putt along staying under 3k rpm which saves fuel in the long run. Not to mention it make the engine last longer, but that's another topic all together and probably why they switched to small displacement engines...
Top Gear found a v8 mercedes gets better mpg around the track than the prius.
20 years ago I helped a buddy to swap an LT1 V8 into his daily driver Jeep Wrangler to replace the anemic 4 cylinder. The Jeep did not have a lift kit nor did it have big narley tires. The highway fuel economy went from 13 mpg on a good day to 17 mpg, plus it no longer struggled on mountain passes.
that sounds like a terrible v6 if I cant keep up with traffic, in europe that vehicle would have a 4 cylinder and work fine.
I upgraded from a 115hp v4 outboard to a 200hp v6 on a 17' mako and it got better economy almost anyway you ran it. Except idling/trolling. While the 115 ran hard to do its thing, the 200 doesn't even break a sweat.
@@krusher74 in Florida stop and go is 0-90kph.
The more I watch this series, the more I want to turbocharge my 1.8L EJ18e powered Legacy Outback! I mean... what could go wrong? 🤣
Orrrrr use an m90 supercharger off an old buick.
A perfect Sunday morning, coffee and Cantina.....Thanks for all the work, and keep them coming....
I'm still on my coffee so I am going to refer to this ritual as Coffee and Cantina henceforth. :D
I don't understand most of the science and math, but this is my favorite automotive channel that isn't actually an automotive channel.
If you are taking volunteers to drive that thing cross-country for the data, sign me up.
Thanks again ! This channel plus Sunday morning coffee and I’m as entertained as I was watching roadrunner as a kid.
Should have kept the original pulley sizes and run the extra pressure. Superchargers on small engines are cool.
Jimbo- "The king of cliff hangers".
Love this channel.
I have seen two different articles on your channel in two days and I’ve been watching since the insight had a 420cc I’m guessing your seeing a boost in views I’m so happy this means more projects !
Really enjoy your content. Regarding the fuel temp, I think that only effect the volume of the fuel, not its weight.
You are right, however that would slightly affect how much fuel they are able to draw out of the tank from the height the return hose is at.
@@chevyinlinesix Hey, you're right! After the fuel gets down to the return pipe level it stops getting pumped out. Then after the remainder cools the level would decrease to slightly below the return pipe. Never thought of that.
Imagine having *Jimbo* as a Father - Priceless
Thanks! your videos have become a Sunday morning ritual and I love it
Thank you so much!!!!!!!!!
Nice work my friend, I don't know why this little experiment of yours is so fun to watch but ya got me hooked.
Thank you for making the videos that you are passionate about and with relative relatability for the common man instead of being a sucker for sponsorships or completely changing your content from one video to the next!
one of the main reasons i love sundays! keep up the work jimbo!😊
Thank you for another video Jimbo, yet again you give us something nice to end off the week 😊
Great video, great fuel economy and I love the sound this diesel powered supercharged Insight is making.
I just love all of the mix-matching going on in these videos. It's a lot of fun.
This is probably my most looked forward to channel. But although you put an incredible amount of time into these projects, this video is less than 15 minutes. You probably invested dozens of hours in this segment and not even a tenth is represented here. Ill enjoy the heck out of anything you post as its incredibly interesting. But sure would appreciate longer videos. Cheers my friend!
I think this series is so much fun. I love the little diesel set up.
I love watching these every Sunday morning before I get outta bed
Loving what you do! Fantastic channel. Keep on keeping on doing what you're doing! :-)
An Intercooler or Heat Exchanger it's NEVER a bad investment on a turbo or supercharged engine.
I think of it as "future proofing" the build, regardless of what the instruments say.
The closer you can keep the compressed air before entering the cylinders to ambient temp, the better for performance and engine longevity. Be it Diesel or Gasoline.
Great work as usual, RC Team, looking forward to next episode. 👌😊👍
EDIT: I'm ALL for Twin - Charging this beast as others have suggested. Blower for low rpm response and the turbo to complement the blower and carry the steam to high rpm.
Still love the channel! And that you are thorough with the fuel tests even though you think its boring😊
Great video. Keep the great work.
Great video as always, Jimbo. I always look forward to watching the latest episode on Sunday morning. It's nice to see you're getting more comfortable on camera. I noticed you didn't blur out your face in this one. I hope you continue to make more appearances. It's nice to see the mastermind behind these crazy projects 👍🏻
Hey Jimbo. Awesome to see you’re a fan of our Australian fauna. I’m just heading out to check some local cows for a pouch. Great work 👍
Oh man I love how that thing sounds even when it looks like it's not accelerating we've though you floored it past the camera.
Love watching these vids your puttin out
Very educational.
Thanks for another great video another great Sunday evening
Good Morning Jimbo. Keep em coming.
I'd crank the boost to 12psi, do a WATER to air intercooler (less pressure drop and heat soak compared to air-to-air, also allowing it to not sit on top of the engine) heat wrap the exhaust, and gold wrap the intake and intercooler/piping. On a random note, i'd like to see if an anti reversion chamber off the downpipe makes a difference in power and fuel economy. If you are fealing extra, swap that pod filter with a K&N x-force pod of the equivalent size, the top cap on the filter is also an intake location (unlike the existing one), thus providing more surface area for air to come in.
Good content as always.
As always good stuff, thanks for sharing your videos. 👍
Another great episode Jimbo!
For what it's worth when I had the Blower engine in my tow car I used to see better fuel economy due to less throttle opening to maintain the same speeds.
I'm really enjoying the current series keep em coming!
This gave me a great idea for a new style of forced induction I have not seen produced yet!
Great video as always Jimbo!
The fluctuations in the values from your road test are to be expected. There are only so many variables you can control. Temperature, wind speed and direction, fluctuations in how you accelerate - some things aren't practical to control. That's why we use multiple tests: that allows us to see how much randomness there is in our measurements. When we make a change, we judge whether the change was beneficial by first assuming that it made no difference at all (the "null hypothesis"). Using the random distributions of our measurements, we can determine how likely it would be to measure a given difference by chance alone if the change had done nothing. Then, only if the change we observe is so large that it's unlikely to be a result of simple randomness, we reject this null hypothesis and are left with the only possible alternative that the change was made did in fact have an effect. Again, the size of that effect isn't known exactly either; its randomness is a result of the randomness of both measurements.
The difference between your two measurements was 0.6%. That's extremely consistent! Good job controlling it as much as you did.
Of course, that's only two measurements - the average variance could be much larger than that. The difference between your averages before and after was 3.0%. That's quite a bit larger. It's hard to say from the small sample size, but I think that's likely to be significant - the supercharger is likely improving the fuel economy.
Sometimes more power actually does improve mileage, and not even just in small vehicles. I have a 99 f350 with the 7.3 power stroke, in stock form I got 14-15mpg. After some bigger injectors and a t6 tuner bringing the stock 250 horsepower up close to 400ish I get 16-17 mpg.
You know its Sunday morning when quality Robot Cantina is on the tube.
My old golf 6 1.4 was twin charged. It had a magnetic clutch on the pully. When the came op boost the turbo took over and released the magnetic clutch one supercharger. It was a fun car to drive 😅
Robot Cantina and a cup of coffee. My Sunday morning is complete. Excellent video as always.
Another great Sunday with the 719 cc kubota diesel engine with an AMR500 installed, what a delight 🙂.
Thanks Jimbo 👍💪✌
One marsupial to another, great work Jimbo
Many thanks!
You have me excited to see the next episode.
So far so good. Keep chuggin.😊
Anything over 70 MPG is really awesome! Good Job!
No fuel rack adjustments were made so it makes sense available supply is the same so efficiency of combustion increased nice 👍
The drone footage is a nice touch. 👍
Started watching not long ago and just realized you're also from Kansas! I'm from Wichita and it's nice to see someone took am interest in these. I definitely want to buy one. And focus on improving the aerodynamics. But first I have to find one to buy
Absolutely the best automotive channel on YT that uses xylophone in its theme song.
Great video Jimbo. It's not a diesel till it has forced induction lol. Keep up the awesome work. Cheers from Canada 🍻
Interesting results. Looking forward to seeing the higher boost efficiency and speed.
I love my Sunday mornings because of these videos🎉
Best Sunday morning is a cup-o-Joe and Jimbo!
I keep coming back just to see what's next and that's a good thing. If someone told me I would be watching this content 6 months I would have laughed at them. Just goes to show you don't know what you like till you try it. Now never miss a Vid,
Good job guys. Keep it up.
Great video , love your little diesel project. I have 35 hp Kubota tractor and would love to have more power.
Great episode!!!!!!
“More work”……but it’s good work!!! Thanks.
Solid work Sir
Impressed that you brought up that there are upsides and downsides to Superchargers and Turbos, not a lot of automotive channels point out that superchargers are parasitic on horsepower but offset the power they take by the power they make so they don't typically give the potential power off boost because of the parasitic losses.
Also, Diesels like hot charge pipe temps, its exhaust temps you need to keep an eye on.
Better tell modern diesel manufacturers to stop intercooling then... Even in the 90s Isuzu added intercooling to the 4hk1 and gained 10hp
All ICE like relatively hot charge temps for efficiency. Doesn't help with power, but reduces pumping losses.
@@Low760 increasing charge temp increases efficiency, not power. The colder the charge temp the greater your pumping losses.
Slapping an intercooler on will increase HP but pull fuel economy down a little.
It's a tradeoff: hot is more efficient, cold is more powerful... You have choose your treat
@@Low760Ooooo 10hp, minimal gains for hundreds of pounds added, ooooooo
Lost more speed from the weight than you gained from the added mousefarts.
That shot at 2:07 is great, cinematic stuff
The motorized camera slider shot. Some people overdue slider shots, Me, well one or twice a year is good.
Great work! Adding the turbo ontop would be cool! Perhaps thinking about gapping the rings a bit first 😅
You don't "need" an intercooler so much as it just let's you make more power. It just increases air density by cooling the charge air after all, effectively allowing you to put more oxygen into the engine at any given boost pressure. Suppose it doesn't matter as much with a supercharger but it's still less parasitic loss on the engine to make the same power at lower boost with the supercharger, so more total power at any given boost pressure :).
Also get some sort of coolant pre-heater or block heater for it. Should make it run better on cold starts and gives you heat immediately when you start driving.
You're also getting dangerously close to Lupo 3L numbers on this thrown together not-meant-for-cars engine which is impressive considering VW sold the Lupo 3L at a massive loss because of the different chassis, aluminium + magnesium body and magnesium wheels and interior parts. Plus they had a bespoke engine with a weird automated manual with a start stop system.
Honda sold this car at a huge loss too!
They got here before the Prius and only Sold it 6 years .
@@stuntvist supposedly the 3l would do like 2.8l in testing
It may not be super fast but take none of my fascination away most enjoyable to watch
My wife says you have a soothing voice and cadence. I agree.
Got my coffee, got the Cantina going. Cant wait to see what you've been up to! Always a joy. Thanks, Jimbo!
Good job, Jimbo! Well, maybe put this project on the back burner for a bit. What exciting thing are you going to do next? Lolol!
Wow surprising results on the fuel economy test I thought for sure it would be down around maybe 65 miles per gallon 73 miles per gallon is pretty damn good I take that any day thanks for the video see you next Sunday
keep your eyes on the road jimbo, says future jimbo!
Well done Jimbo 😎
Great progress
You could make a crude Dyno for doing standardised economy runs by getting a used differential and an industrial fan and a couple of drive belt pulleys.
Mount the diff in a frame that sets it high enough to attach the fan to the pinion.
Lock one side or fit a pulley to each side and also attach pulleys to the vehicle hubs replacing the wheels.
Then just spin it up to whatever speed you want and go have a coffee.
That boost just blows people away!
Nice, just got a coffee and I'm ready to watch and enjoy.
Same, I woke up at about the right time for once today 😂
Same here, drink my coffee while I watch.
Nice work Jimbo, it's very satisfying when your labors are rewarded with positive results! 74 mpg is pretty good at 55 mph for a Frankenstein Honda Insight.
Have you considered a fuel flow sensor? I know you are after an average fuel economy figure but, having an instantaneous fuel consumption rate gives quick feedback for experimental tuning settings. Additionally, a Cal Factor can be computed between average and steady-state 55 mph to arrive at a reasonably accurate average fuel economy.
One interesting fact for whoever might be interested: The melody at the end of the video (from about 12:25) is from the song "Der Computer nr 3 " from the incredible cute singer France Gall and originally performed in 1968.
Stunning results. My guess is the next overdrive pulley setup will give better performance, with a slight decrease in MPG, but it could surprise us and get even better MPG. That would be EPIC! Either way a little more performance even with a small decrease in MPG would be an excellent outcome and I think is probably the better of the two scenarios. There's a guy right down road from me with the exact same vehicle, sitting there for a few years now. Time to get the welder out??
RUclips is great for showing me things I never knew I needed.
If that 'bota runs on DIY bio fuel of dubious quality, I have some work to do on a 2004 'yota Echo.
surely there's some kind of high tech bolt or gizmo that could electronically transmit effects of the weight of the fuel tank to convert to a measurement to save time pumping. 600 miles in that jalopy beats a good day at work ;) THANKS for sharing your content with us😊
Great video,thanks.
Lots of diesels seem to like a warm-up. In the Seabees we had to give our heavy equipment a 5 minute idle/warm-up before operating.
You can put header wrap on the down pipe and the charge pipes. Also a heat shield between the down pipe and the super charger will help.
You should finish buttoning this diesel back together. I would absolutely love an episode of you taking this on a genuine road trip across the state or states if you felt it could make it.
Add the tutbo back on, it'll work great with the increaed airflow, if you send me prints, i can turn a set of k4 pulleys for the supercharger setup
I appreciate the offer on fabricating the pulleys! I have never fabricated pulleys before, however I did watch a few youtube videos on how to. I think I'll give it a shot and if they don't come out good enough I'll give you a shout.
About fuel economy, it's probably the extra air burning the fuel more efficiently and higher dynamic compression ratio that may help you extract more energy from the same amount of fuel, despite some of the power going to the supercharger.
I built a couple 1 liter Zetec Rocam Supercharged engines with Eaton M24 blower, 9.8:1 and 11.8:1 compression and few different pulleys. I run them on ethanol (Brazilian hE100) instead of gasoline. I ran these engines at 1.6-1.8 pressure ratio.
From what I noticed, these 1 liter Zetec Rocam had a bit better fuel economy on the highway. In my last car, I reached 13.3km/l (31.2mpg or 7.5l/100km). Thats a big improvement, since cars with these engines often reached 10-12km/l on the highway.
The engine on that case was running at 1.8 pressure ratio and while the mixture at above 100kPa was lambda 0.85-0.87 (I do not use AFR due to variable multifuel projects), below 100kPa it was 1.00-1.05 to get a really good fuel efficiency whole cruising, just like factory cars.
I hope skme of this information helps you with some interesting ideas.
Have a good one Jimbo!
Another fun video!
That's pretty amazing.I'm in the UK and my Honda Civic with their fancy 1.6 turbo diesel can get about 80mpg (UK) with careful driving. That's measured from full tank to full refill. 80mpg UK is about 67mpg US so you're doing brilliantly
I love the insight build, but you should look into kei trucks. It would be fun to see what you could do with one.
Part of me is hoping to see aero mods and ram air. I thought of a heat deflecting plate between the intake and exhaust, set up in a way that the exhaust will still get air flow from the grille. Or maybe it’s more work than it’s worth, but either way I really enjoy this series.
Nice work Jimbo, eonder if theres a easy way yo get a digital read out of the boost that way you could see how consistent it is and when or if the belt is slipping.