Totally agree. He was treated appallingly. As were so many others who did not conform to the required stereotype. Turing was just brilliant, in so many fields. Just imagine what he might have gone on to achieve, had he been allowed to. In this respect, at least, we live in far more enlightened times.
I am an 83 y. Old gay man and have had a great life , but it was a very different life when I was a young in the closet teenager .I am proud to be British but ashamed of the ignorance of this time in Britain. This was so moving it brought me to tears .
Sad to say, I don't think it was ignorance. The state knew what it was doing. The majority either believed the state was right or did not care enough to do very much about it.
Mentioning the times old feller, We used to send people to Australia for stealing a loaf of bread, we sent children up chimneys as sweeps, but no longer, we learn as we live. I'm 82.
Are you joking? You’re ashamed of this time of ignorance in Britain!? Brah!? What do you want!? There’s a gay pride parade every 5 minutes, gay pride police cars and last time I went to hospital there were LGBTQAA7+++ banners EVERYWHERE. There are no rights gay people don’t have, they can even get married. In a church. Ignorance? I don’t see it at all. If you go so ott with any message you’ll get push back. What can you expect? Growing up it would have been worse than now to be gay. I wasn’t around then but I’m 100% sure. You live in probably the best time and place in all of human history to be gay today. And you’re ashamed of your country? Tell ya what, move just about anywhere else and see how they treat gay people. Read a book. Go on holiday. You’ll find if you actually pay attention that people in the Uk are generally fine with gay people. It’s the politics that surround it that people don’t like. For bloody good reason. That being said, if you want to be in anyway political you WILL get opposition. You could say the earth is flat and get political pushback. You see what you want to see. If somebody cuts you off in traffic it’s homophobic. 🙄
Alan Turing was voted The Greatest Person Of The 20th Century in a BBC poll, and is also honoured by having his picture on the £50 banknote. I suspect, however, he would be infinitely more proud to learn that the computer science's equivalent of the Nobel prize, the Turing Award, was named in his honour long before his wartime exploits became known.
He solved an (outside the mathematical world) obscure mathematical problem ... which utterly dismantled the whole of mathematics ... ..and incidentally invented every single digital computer ever ... before they were invented ..... ...he then went on to invent the digital computer ... several times, as he couldn't speak about it
When the British public were asked to nominate an individual’s likeness to be placed on the recently released £50 note, Alan Turing was the overall winner ....... taking note that this selection wasn't from a short list just simply a question “who would you like on the back of the fifty pound note”, I think that is incredible when you consider how badly he was let down by the establishment!
When the secrets of Turing’s work were declassified to the public, the then British Government issued a posthumous apology to Alan Turing. It is one of the saddest and shameful episodes in British history. 😢
I live in Bletchley where Alan Turing is remembered in our everyday lives. My daughter was in Turing house at school, a local pub is named the Turing key and has a large silhouette of his face across the exterior wall. He has been entwined in our society so much that he and what he accomplished will never be forgotten. It was to our disgrace we as a nation treated him so badly and that he never lived to see how grateful we are now. RIP Alan and thank you
I agree with your sentiments, however it was a different time. Thank goodness we have progressed and become more tolerant and understanding. Remember Women were not allowed to vote because they were somehow believed to be unable to understand politics. Just like the poor or servant classes at one time could not vote. We have progressed but just look at what is happening to women and girls in Afghanistan. We are supposed to be a fair country yet we cannot have a King who is a Catholic because of religious prejudice (basically because the Catholic Church would not allow Henry VIII to Divorce. So rather in the manner of Donald Trump nowadays, he just made up his own Church so he got his own way). There are still many country's in the world that treat Homosexuality as a crime.
@@grimreaper-qh2zn sorry but I find “look how far we’ve progressed ‘ and ‘it was a different time ‘ very weak defences and a way of trying to say it doesn’t really matter as we’re better. They said that when I was a kid as well, I was gay. Going through puberty and needing advice, when all kids mocked gay people as freaks, but thanks to section 28 I was being protected from gay culture. Almost committed suicide, but hey I was protected, same is happening to trans children today, two steps back and one step forward is not progression. And it’s the same time not different it’s just got a different coat of paint, in my opinion.
Iv always knew about Alan Turing we were taught in school in Manchester about him, there's a Turing building and sculpture. Sadly school's theses days don't teach about people who have been part of our past.. and like everyone in the comments have said how he was treated was Totally inhumane. God bless him ❤
While holidaying in Britain, my husband & I called at Bletchley Park for what we thought would be an hour or so. It was so interesting we spent the whole day there. On another matter, we were both annoyed & disappointed at the movie U-571 that portrayed the capture of the Enigma machine by Americans. The Enigma machine was captured by the British before the US had even entered the war. Surely the US has had sufficient proud historical events without needing to hi-jack feats done by other nations.
The Enigma machine was out there already, as stated in this excellent video. I read that at one point they thought it might be useful in banking but it didn’t catch on. Poland were KEY in the enigmas story, and the British were educated by Polish intelligence. They needed an ACTUAL machine to take apart but none existed.Until someone remembered an old dusty machine in a bank cupboard!
That’s not exactly accurate. The German banking did use Enigma extensively during the 1930’s. The Enigma machine wasn’t found in a cupboard. I believe one was obtained by Polish Intelligence Services who purchased of a German citizen. As the war hit Poland I believe the Poles handed the machine over to French Intelligence and then it made its way to Bletchley. When the Poles had the machine, through brilliant mathematics discovered a flaw in the Enigma machines wiring system that enabled them to read Enigma encoded messages. By the end of 1939 this flaw had unfortunately been remedied and Enigma messages could not be read until Turing devised a mathematical model that with the aid of the Bombe was able to once again decrypt encoded German messages.
Yes indeed it is very true that the Enigma machine was recovered from a captured U boat by a ship of the Royal Navy and brought back to Bletchley Park to find its secrets and break the codes and shorten the war because of the work of Alan Turing and his team.
My mother worked with Alan Turing at Bletchley park. She always said that he had the most wonderful sense of humour and was convinced throughout her life that he was murdered.
There is an interpretation of events which make Turing's death by murder plausible. At the inquest only one person claimed Turing had been depressed, his student Robin Gandy, who also inherited Turing's papers. Gandy was homosexual but not out, he attended the same club/society as did members of the traitorous spies, the Cambridge 5 all of whom were convinced Communists as was Gandy himself. Since the Soviets knew of Turing it would have been oddly remiss for them not attempt to recruit Gandy who could supply details of what Turing was working on. In his last months Turing was working on, I suspect, a Universal Turing Maker. A theoretical "device" which could make anything - a natural extension of the idea of a Universal Turing Machine envisioned as a device which could produce any blueprint or execute any program. I believe this is why he became interested in both monotheism and quantum mechanics as well as non-linear chemistry. The common theme was a scientific model of god. One can also go a long way to explaining things like spirit or spooky action at a distance if one permits both positive mass and negative mass into physics. For example if the vacuum is an ether of net zero mass in bulk but of tiny opposite sign masses at smallest scale light has to be a particle but with associated waves in the "massless" ether. If Gandy reported to his atheist spymasters Turing was working toward a scientific model of god might they not think it prudent to snuff out this mischief maker? Gandy would be recruited, perhaps not to kill, but definitely to give plausible excuse for suicide to hide events and to dispose of "unwanted" documents. If you read Hodges biography carefully it is evident an aged Gandy was the instigator of its conception and main shaper of its outline.
One of us has seen the "Imitation Game" the other hasn't. Yet neither of us had any idea of the real life story of British genius and WWll hero, Alan Turing. The beginning of the man and the unexpected, unfathomable tragic end of the man. This was highly informative and yet incredibly heartbreaking to hear and learn. Our anger had to be held down and we had a cry after the camera was off... We thank him for his genius and applaud him for who he was and certainly will NOT forget him. We are more than happy that we learned this story of Alan Turing's life. Let us know if you learned anything from this too. We always love to hear from you. Thank you SO much for watching! If you enjoy our content, please consider subscribing to our channel, it is the BEST way to support our channel and it's FREE! Also, please click the Like button. Thank you for your support!
Growing up in the 60s and 70s it was hard to feel "different". I've lived a "straight" life. Although I never have been. I knew it from a very early age. But it was unacceptable. I am still in a "straight" relationship, and have no problems with it at all. I feel that maybe I have more insight into women than a completely hetero man would have. I've been married twice. Betrayed the first time, windowed the second. I have children and step children and grandchildren. I am who I am. I make concessions and compromises for a rewarding life. I wouldn't have been able to be as brave as Turing. A sad end to a great man. X
I was born in the 50's but didn't understand what being gay was until the 70's when my mother phoned , " your brother is in hospital." I knew he was gay and everyone around us was fine with that. But some men had followed him and almost beat him to death. It was then I understood how hard his life was and would be thanks to some people who could let people just lead their own life in peace. My brother was just a normal lad who loved another normal lad all his life. are improving with acceptance of other people, but we still have away to go.
It was not only Turing who had to keep everything secret after the war. Tommy Flowers, the man who actually built the computer, Colossus, had to enrol at night school in 1993, to get a minor qualification in computer studies.
Flowers spent his own money building Colossus, and only got part of it back from the government. Both did receive awards indicating that they had done work the the government considered significant during the war - an MBE for Flowers in 1943, and an OBE for Turing in 1946.
Used to work with a close member of his family. Totally in awe of him and what he did. The apple symbol is a tribute to him. Of course he was not alone in this and the way he was treated was horrendous.
I'm not so sure about 'had to' enrol at night school: he was in his late 80s, so probably did it for personal satisfaction (he had a degree and received an honorary doctorate in 1973).
The truth is a hard pill to swallow. As an Englishman who knows much of my country's history I'd like to point out that we have as much to be ashamed of as we have to be proud of. Natasha's comment of "too little, too late" regarding the governments apology in 2013 is absolutely on the mark. If you want to truly atone for the mistakes of the past then lay the foundations for a better future for all.
Yet we're called unpatriotic when we do say that. The same people who don't want it mentioned will say they're no nonsense and want to be able to say it as it is. Yet, when the truth slaps them round the face, they cry foul and accuse people of twisting things and applying modern values to past times. Rant over. That was a long winded way of saying well said, lol.
We have to remember our past; otherwise we're doomed to repeat it... Everyone does the best they can... but we must always learn if we want to be better... failure to accept and learn means we cannot improve our socety
@@supertuscans9512 It has to be done, or the only thing that happens is deterioration. I mean, a war hero was treated badly because of who he was. That alone is a warning of what was happening. Such things will destroy generations of Turings had the pardon not happened. I should know. I am a direct descendant of another figure far older, going back to Elizabeth the 1st and King Charles the 1st.
No he was treated badly by the authorities because he was deemed a very high security risk. Without doubt Turing was a genius but he was some way away from being the greatest genius at Bletchley. That crown (arguably) probably belongs to Bill Tutte and Gordon Welchman with Flowers deserving a shout out as well.
My Nan was based at Bletchley after leaving Oxford university. She worked with Alan and always remembered him very fondly. When she spoke about him it always made her cry.
Bill Tutte was without doubt the greatest genius at Bletchley park. What I mean by that he was the greatest genius in the field that Bletchley was set up for, namely Cryptography. The second greatest genius in this field, 2nd only to Tutte, was Gordon Welchman. Next would come Turin and the other unmentioned genius was Tommy Flowers but it’s hard to include him in this paricular lists of geniuses because he wasn’t actually ever employed at Bletchley, he was employed by the Post Office. Without doubt, all three of them had intellectual ability way beyond the ability of ordinary mortals. I hope that answers your question.
It needs to be remembered that the people who worked for Station X (Bletchley Park) were told to NEVER disclose their work and many never spoke about it. This was partly due to the work being carried on through the Cold War. That's why a lot of people never got the credit for their vital wartime work.
It's ridiculous how many people weren't given their due recognition at Station X. Enigma was a commercially available device prior to WW2 and the Poles cracked it first. Tommy Flowers built Colossus, the first programmable computer, which deciphered Enigma at a rate the Bombe never could. And it was a woman from Station X who worked out that Enigma would never output the same letter that was input, therefore reducing the number of permutations they needed to manually calculate.
A hero in every sense of the word, yet let down by his own country at that time, it's disgraceful, he was a pioneer and genius, thank you for highlighting this man.
There has been attempts to highlight and celebrate his life and contribution. I walk down Alan Turing Way every week (thankyou manchester city council). However there is nothing that can be done to make up for the way he was treated
What worries me is that there are still people in my country and yours who think the way they did back in the 1950s and would persecute people like Turing today. Thanks for posting this. I already knew about him but this video hit the nail on the head clearly and succinctly.
There are always people who will use the most sadistic, violent means to destroy others whom they are so sure are 'wrong' - physically, mentally, morally, politically. It's utterly sickening that we have to share a world with these specimens.
I'm straight but Alan Turing is one of my heroes. It's absolutely appalling what they did to him. I really think this story needs to be told more often because I'm sure it could make people more accepting. Btw I'm not usually a fan of Simon's work, but this video is outstanding.
The fact that Alan Turing was pardoned adds insult to injury. Pardoned for what? Being “pardoned” indicates original guilt. I know this was all of its time, but the man murdered no one, attacked no one, did not assault children and caused no harm in any way to anyone at all. His private life was just that, private and between consenting adults - whether we accept it or not. It was no one else’s business. Pardoning means forgiving. Forgiving his “offence” is meaningless. It makes the pardon look benevolent when in fact we should be contrite and thankful. What they should have said as well as their apology is “We were wrong and we are grateful for your life and your service to the world. You died a lonely and painful death which is deeply regrettable. You will never be forgotten, thank you Sir, thank you”.
Disgraceful what they did to him. Alan is a hero and will never be forgotten. 🙏 There's now an Alan Turing memorial garden with a statue of him in Manchester City centre and whenever I see his statue I always feel saddened for what happened to him but also immensely proud of him. There's always people taking photos stood next to his statue which would also make him proud ❤
Absolutely heartbreaking and tragic. This is the sort of thing kids should be learning about in school, not only to learn about Alan Turing's contributions to the world but also so that this sort of injustice never happens again.
It was no injustice to prosecute him for sexual deviancy. The man was a promiscuous pervert, a pedaphile, and serial sex offended. No injustice to prosecute such a man
This man was a hero to all of us, his tragic life may have been cut short, but it will always remain a symbol of hope to everyone. My son finally felt comfortable enough to come out to me out after learning his story, and I've never been so proud as a parent. I can't think of a better role model for my boy than Alan.
Alan Turing was the reason I studied computer science at Manchester University. My final year dissertation was in artificial intelligence again in honour of this true pioneer. I was able to walk in the huge shadow cast by a this great man, a giant in his field. His treatment by the state was a shameful episode in the history of the UK.
It’s a heartbreaking story, I named a construction development ‘Turing Drive’ in Wilmslow in his memory, near to where he sadly took his life. RIP Alan. 🙏🏻
I was born in 1952, how come I never knew any of this? thank you Ladies that was fascinating. I watched the film about the life of Quentin Crisp, I think John Hurt played the part, that was the first time I had ever heard of the struggles that went on back then, I did have a passing knowledge of the Pardon for Alan Turing, but I had no real knowledge of his 'crime', so sort of dismissed it 🥺.. from my teens onwards people were openly gay, and were for the most part just accepted... you have to be taught hatred, you are not born with it. I grew up in an accepting family, so have never considered being gay as weird or a crime.
Don't be surprised you hadn't heard of it. At that time his work was considered ULTRA. That is, above Top Secret. (Which is why none of it, sadly, could be used to defend him during the trial.) I only learnt about the depth of his work while studying for a computer science degree - after it was starting to become declassified. We had all heard of Turing, mostly in regards to his work in Manchester and his test for human level A.I. To then discover he's quite literally the father of the modern world was jaw dropping...
I had a Great Uncle who was as open as was possible back in the 50's, an open secret in the family (confirmed bachelor was the term at the time) and had been since the 20's when he and my Grandmother bought a new house together in 1920 upon the death of my Grandfather (he was only 40, TB). My Uncle, his partner (also his business partner) and my Grandmother all lived happily together. It was a fun house to stay as a kid. Sadly she passed in 1965 aged 70. I'm bi-sexual (genetic?).
lesbianism has never been illegal here! It infuriates me to know the way Turing was treated! My son is gay, I’m so happy that he was born in 1974, he’s married now, and so very happy, it makes ME happy !
In an episode of the BBC panel show QI Stephen Fry related a conversation with Steve Jobs in which he asked Mr Jobs if the Apple logo was a reference to Alan Turing. He replied “No… …but I wish it was”
Again girlies you pulled it out of the hat with this one. We need people like Alan to be remembered for years to come, sadly our children never learn these story's in school and it is up to us to keep our history alive. I could keep going but I end up waffling. Well done 👏👏👏❤
I learnt about Turing in school in Australia so would b surprised kids in the UK don't have that opportunity. Pretty sad if that's the case but I expect the US 2 b lacking which is sad in itself
I went watching the "Imitation Game" at the cinema when it came out, I felt so legit angry with how his life ended after making such a HUGE contribution to not only the UK, but world. Such a tragic waste of his brilliance, just made me think how much more he could have tributed to the world had he been celebrated
@@richardjames3022 The film managed to malign both Turing's real character, reducing him to a mere caricature, and the huge contribution of many other brilliant minds working at Bletchley in cracking Enigma. An awful movie.
@@richardjames3022 there are lots of true elements to it and it doesn't change the fact he was a brilliant mind who essentially only had the tragic end he did because of the unfortunate antigay laws. How can learning of an injustice and disservice like that happening to someone not make someone else angry
My Grandmother worked at Bletchley Park during the war, nobody in the family knew until a couple of years before her death. I regret never having had the opportunity to discuss it.
Where I used to live in Manchester England, we had a road named after him. It was (and still is) called Alan Turing Way. It was so named in 1994, a full 20 years before he was pardoned. Well done Manchester
@@jamesbones6632 I was going to mention this too. It's in the Gay Village in Manchester, and during Pride weekend at the end of August a candleit vigil is held in that park for the poeple that died from HIV and Aids. It's beautiful, almost as if Alan is watching over them.
Loved it. People need to hear this story. What a genius. Cut the war by two years and possibly saved 14 million lives, only to be treated as he was. So sad an ending to a brilliant man. Thankyou both for bringing this to light. Hopefully more people will see it now. Now for Bombshell. ❤to you both.
Turing didn't do this single handed, there were many others who played equally important roles in the Enigma. These others are largely unknown because they were never highlighted ad Turing was. Turin deserved better in his lifetime, but so did Wallace Barnes, Barnes didn't receive proper recognition for his work for over 25 years.
I worked in Manchester for a number of years in a building near Sackville St and the gay village and in Sackville gardens there is a statue of Alan Turing My husband is a WWII fanatic and we have visited Bletchley Park so I have known about Alan Turing for many years and always thought that it was shameful the treatment he suffered considering the debt of gratitude we all owe him and those he worked with It wasn’t actually the government but the police who hounded him BUT the government didn’t do anything to stop it I agree that the film is well worth another watch
As someone who has lived in Greater Manchester for nearly 20 years, it always amuses me that the statue of Turing looks out over Canal Street, the epicenter of Manchester's renowned Gay Village. Over the years the street signs have been regularly edited to "anal treet".
The government couldn't do much without revealing his role during the war and openly telling the world about what went on at Bletchley - which was still classified as ULTRA (above Top Secret) due to the Cold War. While I'm sure many of the political establishment couldn't have given a fig about him, those few in the know about his work must have felt horribly impotent.
This may have been mentioned but he was voted 'The Greatest Person of the 20th Century' in a UK public vote...... Quite the turnaround in public opinion compared to 70yrs prior. Great video as always ❤.
This reduced me to tears and made me so ashamed of our history. We owe and owed that man the most enormous debt that can never be repaid. Shakes my head in disgust.
Yeah Alan Turin built the first ever electronic computer not IBM but didn't take credit because it was top secret for more than 50years unil everyone involved had passed away
No, that's not correct. Turing had no involvement in the building of Colossus. Other minds were behind that and it was physically realised by the electrical engineer Tommy Flowers for the purpose of breaking a completely different set of codes used by the German high command. Sometimes this machine is claimed as tge first electronic computer. Turing, on the other hand, had already invented an electro-mechanical (not electronic) machine called the "bombe", used to decode Enigma messages.
It is a tragic story of a world we have come from. Younger people now do not seem to acknowledge that history is not to be shoved under the carpet, but remembered, and learned from. That is how society grows. Acknowledge and remember your past and let those mistakes and injustices inform and guide your future. A truly moving video again ladies. All the best from the UK.
To me history is a vital lesson, both my parents were born in 1919 and were 20 in1939, my Dad served in N.Africa, Italy and Austria but never really talked about this, but as his hair receded I noticed scars emerging on his scalp,I asked him about these and he explained they were caused by the heat of bullets just missing him, I never again asked why he said nothing.
It wasn’t just tragic the way that Alan Turing was treated - it was criminal and thoughtless to say the least. Can you just imagine what else he could have done if he had been allowed to go and fill his full potential. all the best to you and yours. Rab
Remembering how Alan Turing was treated breaks my heart. Makes me tear up every time. He deserved so much better and I wish he could see the world now and how much of a hero he was
Such an astounding man with so many gifts and we all owe him and others like him our lives. Your response is one we relate to.... Yes I concur with your call to salute him Hip Hip Hooray for Alan Turing and his contribution to us all. Love and appreciation to you both for such a heart warming channel & for who you both are.. inspiring others with your goodness, fun curiosity & love . ❤🤗 Keep it up please I so look forward to your videos- Thank you!
A person who Alan Turing credited with inspiring him to write his paper on computing is Ada Lovelace the daughter of Lord Bryon. If you get a chance take a look at Ada Lovelace, you will find another women whom maths skills matched those of Turing.
Very pertinent comment…but only discovered Ada Lovelace, fairly recently…Womens contributions to many things are not given equal prominence….wonder why that is?????….By the way eg…The Womens FA cup (UK football) final is played today to sell out crowd at Wembley Stadium!!!…the same FA organisation.. who banned them from playing on official football grounds for 50 years!!🤬…Hmmm?!
Just found the Hedy Lamar Docuentary......off to watch it now thanks ladies. Alan's work connot be understated, he instituted brand new fields of mathematics that others have followed and we are all today benefiting from.
The fact that we didn't lose to the Nazis, and that my dad didn't have to fight (joined the RM Commandos in 1946) is enough of a memorial for me. RIP, to a bloody hero!
There's little that could be done to make up for the way the government treated Turing, but one small recent thing is that his image is now on the £50 note. Even that is a very limited gesture because ATMs do not dispense £50 notes, so virtually no-one in the UK has actually seen a £50 note in real life with his image on it.
I've got one thankfully. Luckily my local Lloyds branch had some and I requested it on an in person withdrawal. Now I'm considering getting it framed, there's a spot in my hallway it would fit into nicely now I think about it. He's one of our best, I'm glad he's finally getting the recognition he deserves.
There were a number of heroes involved in breaking German codes and ciphers. Turing is the best known, and by far the worst treated, but others were also essential. Might be worth another show on the topic... And on the topic of Hedy Lamar, she also did work on aerodynamics for Howard Hughes!
Yes there was but it was Turing to come up with the idea for the machine and design of it. I'm not saying they weren't essential but he was the guy that did it.
What happened regarding Alan Turing was an absolute disgrace. Worse still, human beings persist in committing terrible atrocities upon each other. Where are we without our essential connections and compassion? The philosopher Daniel Dennett is an admirer of Alan and pays regular tribute to him in his talks. The Royal Institution Lecture that he gave on information, evolution and intelligent design contains such a tribute.
Alan should be always remembered for what he did, but also for what we did to him. Not to be chastised but a lesson, we cannot and should not judge the past on our current values because we will never ever learn, yes, what happened then to us is way out of our values but it was THEN not now. I love Turing's work and we indeed owe him so much. I think that his legacy should be that we know exactly what he both did and also suffered so we could be here now, and that we do not repeat mistakes.
Not taking anything away from Alan Turing but Enigma was first broken by Poland pre-war (1932). They actually aided in hacking the new version at Bletchley Park... The man most responsible for breaking the Enigma code was Marian Rejewski long before WWII. _With the second world war looming, Poles had to share their knowledge about the Enigma with British and French colleagues. During a meeting in Pyry, near Warsaw, in July 1939, Rejewski and his colleagues demonstrated how to crack the machine and gave each allied side a replica_ Again this takes nothing from the work at Bletchley Park it was a modified version that required considerable mathematical work, but it must be remembered that historically enigma was broken initially by the Poles. Bletchley Park was the code breaking section and did create the first real programmable computer, the plans for which were given to the American CIA after the war under Churchill's orders, Colossus became the scaled up American copy ENIAC. _Colossus was a set of computers developed by British codebreakers in the years 1943-1945 to help in the cryptanalysis of the Lorenz cipher. Colossus used thermionic valves to perform Boolean and counting operations_
The American film about an American submarine capturing an Enigma device actually happen before the Americans joined the war, and it was the British that did it. The Royal Navy captured German U-boat U-110 on May 9, 1941 in the North Atlantic, recovering an Enigma machine, its cipher keys, and code books that allowed codebreakers to read German signal traffic during World War II.
During the 80s i had an amazing computing school teacher his hero was Alan Turing and he did not just teach of his achievements but also his tragic end so when the imitation game came out me and my partner went to the cinema me alrealdy knowing what happens and the shock on her face said it all. She couldn't believe that is how we treated a hero. This mans story breaks my heart
Thank you for this video today, I did know all this information having read it and also visited Bletchley but hearing it today I couldn’t find the right words to express how I felt about his treatment. A man who literally saved millions of people, words fail me. I was so emotional and in tears. It was so tragic what happened to him and an apology is too little too late in my opinion. We owe him and his team a debt we can never ever repay
This has been a real insight to what happened to him. Thank you for bringing it to the light and making us more understanding of what happened to guy. He has been recognised on one of our banknotes Thank goodness for what this man did. And once again thank you to you too for bringing this to our attention❤
I think I could feel what you were going to say but didn’t and I feel the same. So many thoughts and feelings brought up by this tragedy. Thanks for another great video lassies! ❤
A Brilliant man with a sad ending, that explains why they called a road in Manchester “Alan Turing Way (I’m from Manchester, I now live in New Zealand). I think there’s a statue/memorial in Manchester too.
@@susansmiles2242 I’ll check it out when I come back for a holiday to see my family, and hopefully try and get a ticket to see United for the last time too!
I think the "Status" should not make any difference. The "Crime" was the Law itself that make homosexuals offenders and Turing wasn't the only one who has the choose: Criminal Record for doing a "sex crime" or chemical castration.
@@DSP16569 true - but the video was making a specific comment on treatment of a war hero, but at the time that wasn’t public knowledge. I’m not suggesting that it makes this any less of a tragedy
Bletchley Park was so secret, people met after the war, married and only in their 80s when it was declassified, they found out they had worked together in separate buildings. They had been married for 50 years and never knew what each other did during the war. There is a statue to Turing in Sackville Park in Manchester's gay village. My father was an engineering student at Manchester in the early 60s and worked on the computers that were developed from Turing's.
The worlds not perfect but thank god many can now live as they wish, with who they wish heartbreaking how everything he and others did was nothing against þhier ctime of loving someone. Im genuinely happy you two are free to love and be loved by each other xxx
He really does and makes it possible to remember it. Too many videos go over things to quickly or the narrator speaks too fast , I lose it and stop watching.
Tommy Flowers is another man who needs recognition for his GIGANTIC PART in the war effort, especially on the enigma codes. He spent his last days in America teaching students complex mathematics.
Dammit girls - you keep doing that to me! I knew about Alan Turing (and Hedy Lamarr) and listened to his sad story but when you gave him 3 cheers the tears started to flow. Your respect and admiration and plain old caring is so unusual these days. I thank you for it.
The apology and posthumous pardon are symbolic gestures of a society that acknowledges the appalling treatment of Alan Turing and other members of the LGB+ Community back in the dark days when we were closed minded. Today, whilst we are not perfect, we are a far more enlightened people and we recognise Alan Turing as a national hero. The three Polish men involved - Marian Rejewski, Jerzy Różycki and Henryk Zygalski. Their work was instrumental in breaking the Enigma Code.
Yes, agree. The Polish men were incredibly brave and instrumental in breaking the Enigma code.I think the word PARDONED is misleading. the man hadn’t done anything wrong. Gordon Brown and The Queen apologised for the way this national hero , this man, this human being was treated. Highlighted the appalling treatment, and bigotry bestowed on Alan Turing.
The Enigma Code was no more difficult than The Times Crossword, compared to Lorenze. The poles made a fantastic contribution to crypto analysis by providing the allies with an Enigma machine. They also made a significant contribution in the less up to Sep 1939 in helping break Enigma. However this wasn’t done on crypto analysis of the code, but rather by a piece of mathematical genius that uncovered a flaw in the machine itself. Unfortunately by the start of 1940 this defect in the machine had been rectified and no further encrypted Enigma messages could be broken again until Turing found a way to break the code .
The polish scientists are honoured at Bletchley Park .. without them nobody could have had a chance ... that they gave at great cost their knowledge should be honoured
Even though I knew of the tragic end, it still brings me to tears. Alan Turing did not end his own life, the system killed him just as sure as if they had put a gun to his head. This poor, poor man. It's unspeakably sad.
I am lucky As a ypung man i became a Paramedic in London, and it changed the trojectory of my life. I am now a Disabled Mentaly ill Person, who has an X Wife who is a friend and two wonderful Children. Mr Turing et all. Thank you for your service. HIP HIP HORAY. PEACE
You two lady's are brilliant.The fact Alan Turing was gay should never ever have mattered.I think it is highly probable that the world would be in a much Darker place today if it was not for this man. RIP Alan.
If you ever come to England, you can visit Bletchley Park and see the machine he was working on and have a tour around the site including where he did his work.
I am British and fiercely proud of my country and its achievements for such a small nation. But the way Alan Turing was treated by my country makes me sick to my stomach. The man should be lauded as one of this country's greatest heroes. And he was. I have nothing but admiration, gratitude and deep sympathy for him.
There is an 'urban myth' that the Apple logo of an apple with a chunk missing is an homage to Alan Turing, and his death. Stephen Fry tells the story of meeting Apple co-founder Steve Jobs, and tackling him on it. The reply was that is was NOT true " ...but by God we wish it were "
Just because you are not a mathematical genius does not mean you are worthless or have nothing to contribute. Just through your reviews, you are contributing to people's knowledge and understanding. Plus, the knowledge of your lives together is an active demonstration that sexual preference does not enhance or diminish your value as human beings. I love your videos, and much love to both of you.
Gee we humans can be real **';;!#! Can't we. There is a saying both my Mother and Father used. " There but by the grace of God go I" most apt in this case. Such a sad,sad story. But if the only thing that history teaches us, let us please learn by our mistakes. Have a nice rest of your weekend. Jane in New Zealand 🇬🇧🇳🇿😢
My mum worked at Bletchley Park during WW2, obviously she signed the official secrets act, so proud. Turin suffered so much, when he should have been held in high esteem. Thank god weve come a long way since then. Natasha, your reaction is how i feel whenever i think about this great man. Hedy was amazing
Having been to Bletchley Park many times I can say it is such an interesting museum. At around £30 per person with free year long repeat admission it is well worth it
I haven't seen The Imitation Game but I have seen "Breaking the Code" starring Derek Jacobi as Alan. To me this was a pretty accurate telling of Alan Turing's life, I watched it back in the late 1990's on tv. Worth a look I think :) Take care and have fun. Thanks.
Sorry for the abrupt ending, the anger was too much to hold in and had to edit out a lot of profanities and other stuff... Also, sorry to tell everyone but the Apple logo was a nod to Isaac Newton not Turing.
I like how your reaction video is respectful for the presentation and information. You don't stop and talk loads... just react and listen to the history. I love this guys delivery as he is to the point with an interesting way of doing it. I love how you both respect that and are genuinely interested. Nice reference to Hedy Lamarr too. Also the apple logo is a respectful nod to Mr Turing
Thank you, we appreciate your kind words. Contrary to popular belief though, the Apple logo is myth in regards to Turing. Is what created as a nod to Newton.
*IM BRITISH* our treatment of this man, a national hero, was utterly inexcusable.
This is why history needs to be taught and not sanitised
Agree.
It was disgraceful.
@@chrisjones2149 - It was - deeply shameful part of our history.
Not my treatment. The government's.
Totally agree. He was treated appallingly. As were so many others who did not conform to the required stereotype. Turing was just brilliant, in so many fields. Just imagine what he might have gone on to achieve, had he been allowed to. In this respect, at least, we live in far more enlightened times.
I am an 83 y. Old gay man and have had a great life , but it was a very different life when I was a young in the closet teenager .I am proud to be British but ashamed of the ignorance of this time in Britain. This was so moving it brought me to tears .
Sad to say, I don't think it was ignorance.
The state knew what it was doing.
The majority either believed the state was right or did not care enough to do very much about it.
Mentioning the times old feller, We used to send people to Australia for stealing a loaf of bread, we sent children up chimneys as sweeps, but no longer, we learn as we live. I'm 82.
I'm a 63 year old gay guy and remain scared to death to be openly gay in the UK...!
Are you joking? You’re ashamed of this time of ignorance in Britain!? Brah!? What do you want!? There’s a gay pride parade every 5 minutes, gay pride police cars and last time I went to hospital there were LGBTQAA7+++ banners EVERYWHERE. There are no rights gay people don’t have, they can even get married. In a church. Ignorance? I don’t see it at all. If you go so ott with any message you’ll get push back. What can you expect? Growing up it would have been worse than now to be gay. I wasn’t around then but I’m 100% sure.
You live in probably the best time and place in all of human history to be gay today. And you’re ashamed of your country? Tell ya what, move just about anywhere else and see how they treat gay people. Read a book. Go on holiday.
You’ll find if you actually pay attention that people in the Uk are generally fine with gay people. It’s the politics that surround it that people don’t like. For bloody good reason. That being said, if you want to be in anyway political you WILL get opposition. You could say the earth is flat and get political pushback.
You see what you want to see. If somebody cuts you off in traffic it’s homophobic. 🙄
@@bobm198 What are you scared of exactly and where’s a better place?
Alan Turing was voted The Greatest Person Of The 20th Century in a BBC poll, and is also honoured by having his picture on the £50 banknote. I suspect, however, he would be infinitely more proud to learn that the computer science's equivalent of the Nobel prize, the Turing Award, was named in his honour long before his wartime exploits became known.
Yes he was, Chris Packham gave a brilliant speech why he should be called The Greatest Person Of The 20th Century, there was only one winner
He solved an (outside the mathematical world) obscure mathematical problem ... which utterly dismantled the whole of mathematics ...
..and incidentally invented every single digital computer ever ... before they were invented .....
...he then went on to invent the digital computer ... several times, as he couldn't speak about it
@@melclo3641Churchill said of Turing. “This man won the war.” Then he was driven to suicide. The wonderful British irony never takes a day off.
When the British public were asked to nominate an individual’s likeness to be placed on the recently released £50 note, Alan Turing was the overall winner ....... taking note that this selection wasn't from a short list just simply a question “who would you like on the back of the fifty pound note”, I think that is incredible when you consider how badly he was let down by the establishment!
It really is so wonderful that he was eventually chosen. He 100% deserves at least this honour as well.
He was a worthy winner...personally I voted for Mr Bean
@@billdoor3140 - That would be interesting!
@@billdoor3140 similar… I voted for Mr Blobby
Yep. Very sad. But at least the Queen pardoned him
When the secrets of Turing’s work were declassified to the public, the then British Government issued a posthumous apology to Alan Turing. It is one of the saddest and shameful episodes in British history. 😢
Agreed.
I’ll second that, he was a hero and was treated disgracefully
I’m so glad that he’s finally getting the recognition he deserved.
@@2503debora He was convicted under the laws of the land at that time.
@@clivenewman4810 ABSOLUTELY now read above.
I live in Bletchley where Alan Turing is remembered in our everyday lives. My daughter was in Turing house at school, a local pub is named the Turing key and has a large silhouette of his face across the exterior wall. He has been entwined in our society so much that he and what he accomplished will never be forgotten. It was to our disgrace we as a nation treated him so badly and that he never lived to see how grateful we are now.
RIP Alan and thank you
Well said!
I agree with your sentiments, however it was a different time. Thank goodness we have progressed and become more tolerant and understanding. Remember Women were not allowed to vote because they were somehow believed to be unable to understand politics. Just like the poor or servant classes at one time could not vote. We have progressed but just look at what is happening to women and girls in Afghanistan. We are supposed to be a fair country yet we cannot have a King who is a Catholic because of religious prejudice (basically because the Catholic Church would not allow Henry VIII to Divorce. So rather in the manner of Donald Trump nowadays, he just made up his own Church so he got his own way). There are still many country's in the world that treat Homosexuality as a crime.
@@grimreaper-qh2zn sorry but I find “look how far we’ve progressed ‘ and ‘it was a different time ‘ very weak defences and a way of trying to say it doesn’t really matter as we’re better. They said that when I was a kid as well, I was gay. Going through puberty and needing advice, when all kids mocked gay people as freaks, but thanks to section 28 I was being protected from gay culture. Almost committed suicide, but hey I was protected, same is happening to trans children today, two steps back and one step forward is not progression. And it’s the same time not different it’s just got a different coat of paint, in my opinion.
'we' as a nation, no, just a few law makers and politicians.
Iv always knew about Alan Turing we were taught in school in Manchester about him, there's a Turing building and sculpture. Sadly school's theses days don't teach about people who have been part of our past.. and like everyone in the comments have said how he was treated was Totally inhumane. God bless him ❤
While holidaying in Britain, my husband & I called at Bletchley Park for what we thought would be an hour or so. It was so interesting we spent the whole day there. On another matter, we were both annoyed & disappointed at the movie U-571 that portrayed the capture of the Enigma machine by Americans. The Enigma machine was captured by the British before the US had even entered the war. Surely the US has had sufficient proud historical events without needing to hi-jack feats done by other nations.
The Enigma machine was out there already, as stated in this excellent video. I read that at one point they thought it might be useful in banking but it didn’t catch on. Poland were KEY in the enigmas story, and the British were educated by Polish intelligence. They needed an ACTUAL machine to take apart but none existed.Until someone remembered an old dusty machine in a bank cupboard!
That’s not exactly accurate. The German banking did use Enigma extensively during the 1930’s.
The Enigma machine wasn’t found in a cupboard. I believe one was obtained by Polish Intelligence Services who purchased of a German citizen.
As the war hit Poland I believe the Poles handed the machine over to French Intelligence and then it made its way to Bletchley.
When the Poles had the machine, through brilliant mathematics discovered a flaw in the Enigma machines wiring system that enabled them to read Enigma encoded messages.
By the end of 1939 this flaw had unfortunately been remedied and Enigma messages could not be read until Turing devised a mathematical model that with the aid of the Bombe was able to once again decrypt encoded German messages.
@@supertuscans9512 thank you for your information
Yes indeed it is very true that the Enigma machine was recovered from a captured U boat by a ship of the Royal Navy and brought back to Bletchley Park to find its secrets and break the codes and shorten the war because of the work of Alan Turing and his team.
Also the film we bought a zoo. I wouldn't go to see it as it's not the true story the zoo is on Dartmoor
My mother worked with Alan Turing at Bletchley park. She always said that he had the most wonderful sense of humour and was convinced throughout her life that he was murdered.
That is incredible. Thank you for sharing this with us.
Suzie, fascinating. Yes, I watched an interesting documentary on this not so long ago. I think it might have been the BBC
There is an interpretation of events which make Turing's death by murder plausible. At the inquest only one person claimed Turing had been depressed, his student Robin Gandy, who also inherited Turing's papers. Gandy was homosexual but not out, he attended the same club/society as did members of the traitorous spies, the Cambridge 5 all of whom were convinced Communists as was Gandy himself. Since the Soviets knew of Turing it would have been oddly remiss for them not attempt to recruit Gandy who could supply details of what Turing was working on. In his last months Turing was working on, I suspect, a Universal Turing Maker. A theoretical "device" which could make anything - a natural extension of the idea of a Universal Turing Machine envisioned as a device which could produce any blueprint or execute any program. I believe this is why he became interested in both monotheism and quantum mechanics as well as non-linear chemistry. The common theme was a scientific model of god. One can also go a long way to explaining things like spirit or spooky action at a distance if one permits both positive mass and negative mass into physics. For example if the vacuum is an ether of net zero mass in bulk but of tiny opposite sign masses at smallest scale light has to be a particle but with associated waves in the "massless" ether. If Gandy reported to his atheist spymasters Turing was working toward a scientific model of god might they not think it prudent to snuff out this mischief maker? Gandy would be recruited, perhaps not to kill, but definitely to give plausible excuse for suicide to hide events and to dispose of "unwanted" documents. If you read Hodges biography carefully it is evident an aged Gandy was the instigator of its conception and main shaper of its outline.
@@charlesstewart4436 fasinating
They’d have killed Darwin long before they troubled with Turing.
One of us has seen the "Imitation Game" the other hasn't. Yet neither of us had any idea of the real life story of British genius and WWll hero, Alan Turing. The beginning of the man and the unexpected, unfathomable tragic end of the man. This was highly informative and yet incredibly heartbreaking to hear and learn. Our anger had to be held down and we had a cry after the camera was off... We thank him for his genius and applaud him for who he was and certainly will NOT forget him. We are more than happy that we learned this story of Alan Turing's life. Let us know if you learned anything from this too. We always love to hear from you. Thank you SO much for watching! If you enjoy our content, please consider subscribing to our channel, it is the BEST way to support our channel and it's FREE! Also, please click the Like button. Thank you for your support!
My granddaughter is gay I will defend & love her to end of my life I could anyone treat another human being like that love from 🇬🇧x
He ended up on the £50 note.
Growing up in the 60s and 70s it was hard to feel "different". I've lived a "straight" life. Although I never have been. I knew it from a very early age. But it was unacceptable. I am still in a "straight" relationship, and have no problems with it at all. I feel that maybe I have more insight into women than a completely hetero man would have. I've been married twice. Betrayed the first time, windowed the second. I have children and step children and grandchildren. I am who I am. I make concessions and compromises for a rewarding life. I wouldn't have been able to be as brave as Turing. A sad end to a great man. X
The movie is entertaining that is all. Historically it is nowhere near the truth.
I was born in the 50's but didn't understand what being gay was until the 70's when my mother phoned , " your brother is in hospital." I knew he was gay and everyone around us was fine with that. But some men had followed him and almost beat him to death. It was then I understood how hard his life was and would be thanks to some people who could let people just lead their own life in peace. My brother was just a normal lad who loved another normal lad all his life. are improving with acceptance of other people, but we still have away to go.
It was not only Turing who had to keep everything secret after the war. Tommy Flowers, the man who actually built the computer, Colossus, had to enrol at night school in 1993, to get a minor qualification in computer studies.
It's criminal how Tommy Flowers is always overlooked, and also Gordon Welchman who went on to have a massive influence on American intelligence.
Flowers spent his own money building Colossus, and only got part of it back from the government.
Both did receive awards indicating that they had done work the the government considered significant during the war - an MBE for Flowers in 1943, and an OBE for Turing in 1946.
Tommy Flowers remortgaged his house to build it, hardly got any thanks and had to wait a very long time just to get his costs back.
Used to work with a close member of his family. Totally in awe of him and what he did. The apple symbol is a tribute to him. Of course he was not alone in this and the way he was treated was horrendous.
I'm not so sure about 'had to' enrol at night school: he was in his late 80s, so probably did it for personal satisfaction (he had a degree and received an honorary doctorate in 1973).
The truth is a hard pill to swallow. As an Englishman who knows much of my country's history I'd like to point out that we have as much to be ashamed of as we have to be proud of. Natasha's comment of "too little, too late" regarding the governments apology in 2013 is absolutely on the mark. If you want to truly atone for the mistakes of the past then lay the foundations for a better future for all.
Yet we're called unpatriotic when we do say that. The same people who don't want it mentioned will say they're no nonsense and want to be able to say it as it is. Yet, when the truth slaps them round the face, they cry foul and accuse people of twisting things and applying modern values to past times.
Rant over. That was a long winded way of saying well said, lol.
We have to remember our past; otherwise we're doomed to repeat it...
Everyone does the best they can... but we must always learn if we want to be better... failure to accept and learn means we cannot improve our socety
It’s absurd to cast judgement from one era on the events and actions from another.
@@supertuscans9512 It has to be done, or the only thing that happens is deterioration.
I mean, a war hero was treated badly because of who he was. That alone is a warning of what was happening. Such things will destroy generations of Turings had the pardon not happened. I should know. I am a direct descendant of another figure far older, going back to Elizabeth the 1st and King Charles the 1st.
No he was treated badly by the authorities because he was deemed a very high security risk.
Without doubt Turing was a genius but he was some way away from being the greatest genius at Bletchley.
That crown (arguably) probably belongs to Bill Tutte and Gordon Welchman with Flowers deserving a shout out as well.
My Nan was based at Bletchley after leaving Oxford university. She worked with Alan and always remembered him very fondly. When she spoke about him it always made her cry.
How wonderful that your Nan worked at Bletchley and worked with Alan Turing.
Turing whilst without doubt a genius, was far from being the greatest genius at Bletchley Park.
@@supertuscans9512 who was then ? Please name them .
Bill Tutte was without doubt the greatest genius at Bletchley park. What I mean by that he was the greatest genius in the field that Bletchley was set up for, namely Cryptography.
The second greatest genius in this field, 2nd only to Tutte, was Gordon Welchman.
Next would come Turin and the other unmentioned genius was Tommy Flowers but it’s hard to include him in this paricular lists of geniuses because he wasn’t actually ever employed at Bletchley, he was employed by the Post Office.
Without doubt, all three of them had intellectual ability way beyond the ability of ordinary mortals.
I hope that answers your question.
Does matter how "genius" you are, what matters is how you apply it. @@supertuscans9512
It needs to be remembered that the people who worked for Station X (Bletchley Park) were told to NEVER disclose their work and many never spoke about it. This was partly due to the work being carried on through the Cold War. That's why a lot of people never got the credit for their vital wartime work.
Many took the secrets to their deaths and their families never ever found out.
It's ridiculous how many people weren't given their due recognition at Station X. Enigma was a commercially available device prior to WW2 and the Poles cracked it first. Tommy Flowers built Colossus, the first programmable computer, which deciphered Enigma at a rate the Bombe never could. And it was a woman from Station X who worked out that Enigma would never output the same letter that was input, therefore reducing the number of permutations they needed to manually calculate.
@@chaipup7045 Tommy Flowers contribution was huge. As was Gordon Welchman and Bill Tutte.
A hero in every sense of the word, yet let down by his own country at that time, it's disgraceful, he was a pioneer and genius, thank you for highlighting this man.
There has been attempts to highlight and celebrate his life and contribution. I walk down Alan Turing Way every week (thankyou manchester city council).
However there is nothing that can be done to make up for the way he was treated
@@alistairwalker7947 Or the way they treated imprisoned Suffragettes, children in Factories, etc etc etc . over to you
@@MrDaiseymay why over to me? i agree with you that the way the suffragettes were treated was appalling, as was employment of children in factories
He was not "let down" by anyone. He offended against the mores and laws of his day, and paid the price
He's not unsung here in Manchester.
There again, he was one of many people in Manchester who significantly impacted the world.
What worries me is that there are still people in my country and yours who think the way they did back in the 1950s and would persecute people like Turing today. Thanks for posting this. I already knew about him but this video hit the nail on the head clearly and succinctly.
Actually, that sort of thinking is the norm in the world sadly.
There are always people who will use the most sadistic, violent means to destroy others whom they are so sure are 'wrong' - physically, mentally, morally, politically. It's utterly sickening that we have to share a world with these specimens.
I'm straight but Alan Turing is one of my heroes. It's absolutely appalling what they did to him. I really think this story needs to be told more often because I'm sure it could make people more accepting.
Btw I'm not usually a fan of Simon's work, but this video is outstanding.
I am a UK funeral worker, regularly attend Woking crematorium, where he was cremated. He is remembered there.
The fact that Alan Turing was pardoned adds insult to injury. Pardoned for what? Being “pardoned” indicates original guilt. I know this was all of its time, but the man murdered no one, attacked no one, did not assault children and caused no harm in any way to anyone at all. His private life was just that, private and between consenting adults - whether we accept it or not. It was no one else’s business. Pardoning means forgiving. Forgiving his “offence” is meaningless. It makes the pardon look benevolent when in fact we should be contrite and thankful. What they should have said as well as their apology is “We were wrong and we are grateful for your life and your service to the world. You died a lonely and painful death which is deeply regrettable. You will never be forgotten, thank you Sir, thank you”.
Very well said! Thank you.
In the UK, a Pardon is a legal act, squashing convictions. It does not indicate any "original guilt" in UK custom
Disgraceful what they did to him.
Alan is a hero and will never be forgotten. 🙏
There's now an Alan Turing memorial garden with a statue of him in Manchester City centre and whenever I see his statue I always feel saddened for what happened to him but also immensely proud of him.
There's always people taking photos stood next to his statue which would also make him proud ❤
Absolutely heartbreaking and tragic. This is the sort of thing kids should be learning about in school, not only to learn about Alan Turing's contributions to the world but also so that this sort of injustice never happens again.
It still does just a slightly different minority.
It was no injustice to prosecute him for sexual deviancy. The man was a promiscuous pervert, a pedaphile, and serial sex offended. No injustice to prosecute such a man
This man was a hero to all of us, his tragic life may have been cut short, but it will always remain a symbol of hope to everyone. My son finally felt comfortable enough to come out to me out after learning his story, and I've never been so proud as a parent. I can't think of a better role model for my boy than Alan.
Alan Turing was the reason I studied computer science at Manchester University. My final year dissertation was in artificial intelligence again in honour of this true pioneer. I was able to walk in the huge shadow cast by a this great man, a giant in his field.
His treatment by the state was a shameful episode in the history of the UK.
It’s a heartbreaking story, I named a construction development ‘Turing Drive’ in Wilmslow in his memory, near to where he sadly took his life. RIP Alan. 🙏🏻
Nice tribute
I was born in 1952, how come I never knew any of this? thank you Ladies that was fascinating. I watched the film about the life of Quentin Crisp, I think John Hurt played the part, that was the first time I had ever heard of the struggles that went on back then, I did have a passing knowledge of the Pardon for Alan Turing, but I had no real knowledge of his 'crime', so sort of dismissed it 🥺.. from my teens onwards people were openly gay, and were for the most part just accepted... you have to be taught hatred, you are not born with it. I grew up in an accepting family, so have never considered being gay as weird or a crime.
Don't be surprised you hadn't heard of it.
At that time his work was considered ULTRA. That is, above Top Secret. (Which is why none of it, sadly, could be used to defend him during the trial.)
I only learnt about the depth of his work while studying for a computer science degree - after it was starting to become declassified. We had all heard of Turing, mostly in regards to his work in Manchester and his test for human level A.I. To then discover he's quite literally the father of the modern world was jaw dropping...
I was born in 1955 in Australia and I knew all about it.I get the feeling Brits are kept in the dark in regard to what Britain does.
I was born in 1957 and was aware of this. But history has always been my thing.
I had a Great Uncle who was as open as was possible back in the 50's, an open secret in the family (confirmed bachelor was the term at the time) and had been since the 20's when he and my Grandmother bought a new house together in 1920 upon the death of my Grandfather (he was only 40, TB). My Uncle, his partner (also his business partner) and my Grandmother all lived happily together. It was a fun house to stay as a kid. Sadly she passed in 1965 aged 70. I'm bi-sexual (genetic?).
You never knew, cause you were too young to know such things. The Hlloywood gayfest was ok for you.
lesbianism has never been illegal here! It infuriates me to know the way Turing was treated! My son is gay, I’m so happy that he was born in 1974, he’s married now, and so very happy, it makes ME happy !
In an episode of the BBC panel show QI Stephen Fry related a conversation with Steve Jobs in which he asked Mr Jobs if the Apple logo was a reference to Alan Turing. He replied “No… …but I wish it was”
You did something for Alan Turing by showing this. He is not forgotten. Thank you!.
Again girlies you pulled it out of the hat with this one. We need people like Alan to be remembered for years to come, sadly our children never learn these story's in school and it is up to us to keep our history alive. I could keep going but I end up waffling. Well done 👏👏👏❤
But he needs to be remembered for his genius and his personal part in the outcome of the War.
That's what I'm talking about.
I learnt about Turing in school in Australia so would b surprised kids in the UK don't have that opportunity. Pretty sad if that's the case but I expect the US 2 b lacking which is sad in itself
I went watching the "Imitation Game" at the cinema when it came out, I felt so legit angry with how his life ended after making such a HUGE contribution to not only the UK, but world. Such a tragic waste of his brilliance, just made me think how much more he could have tributed to the world had he been celebrated
The film in NOT fact it's fantasy
Makes me angry when people watch films and think just coz it's based on a true story means everything in said film is true.
@@richardjames3022 The film managed to malign both Turing's real character, reducing him to a mere caricature, and the huge contribution of many other brilliant minds working at Bletchley in cracking Enigma. An awful movie.
@@richardjames3022 there are lots of true elements to it and it doesn't change the fact he was a brilliant mind who essentially only had the tragic end he did because of the unfortunate antigay laws. How can learning of an injustice and disservice like that happening to someone not make someone else angry
Only Britain could throw away a brilliant mind I cried in the cinema when film finished.
My Grandmother worked at Bletchley Park during the war, nobody in the family knew until a couple of years before her death. I regret never having had the opportunity to discuss it.
What a conversation that would have been.
Where I used to live in Manchester England, we had a road named after him. It was (and still is) called Alan Turing Way. It was so named in 1994, a full 20 years before he was pardoned. Well done Manchester
There's a statute of Alan Turing in a park in Manchester as well
@@jamesbones6632 I was going to mention this too. It's in the Gay Village in Manchester, and during Pride weekend at the end of August a candleit vigil is held in that park for the poeple that died from HIV and Aids. It's beautiful, almost as if Alan is watching over them.
Loved it. People need to hear this story. What a genius. Cut the war by two years and possibly saved 14 million lives, only to be treated as he was. So sad an ending to a brilliant man. Thankyou both for bringing this to light. Hopefully more people will see it now. Now for Bombshell. ❤to you both.
Let us know what you think of Bombshell...it's an incredible true story!
@@TheNatashaDebbieShow will do, going to watch it whike i hsve my breakfast
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@@TheNatashaDebbieShow hi can you do video about your family ancestry app
Turing didn't do this single handed, there were many others who played equally important roles in the Enigma. These others are largely unknown because they were never highlighted ad Turing was. Turin deserved better in his lifetime, but so did Wallace Barnes, Barnes didn't receive proper recognition for his work for over 25 years.
I worked in Manchester for a number of years in a building near Sackville St and the gay village and in Sackville gardens there is a statue of Alan Turing
My husband is a WWII fanatic and we have visited Bletchley Park so I have known about Alan Turing for many years and always thought that it was shameful the treatment he suffered considering the debt of gratitude we all owe him and those he worked with
It wasn’t actually the government but the police who hounded him BUT the government didn’t do anything to stop it
I agree that the film is well worth another watch
As someone who has lived in Greater Manchester for nearly 20 years, it always amuses me that the statue of Turing looks out over Canal Street, the epicenter of Manchester's renowned Gay Village. Over the years the street signs have been regularly edited to "anal treet".
The government couldn't do much without revealing his role during the war and openly telling the world about what went on at Bletchley - which was still classified as ULTRA (above Top Secret) due to the Cold War.
While I'm sure many of the political establishment couldn't have given a fig about him, those few in the know about his work must have felt horribly impotent.
I love that statue. Sat on a bench, holding an apple.
And there’s Alan Turing Way of course
Turing's statue in Sackville Park always gets flowers on his birthday.
As a Brit, I’m utterly ashamed how our country treated Mr Turing. There are no words.
This may have been mentioned but he was voted 'The Greatest Person of the 20th Century' in a UK public vote...... Quite the turnaround in public opinion compared to 70yrs prior. Great video as always ❤.
Wow what a sad ending to the life of a man who did so much for our country x that was really educational thank you ladies x
This reduced me to tears and made me so ashamed of our history. We owe and owed that man the most enormous debt that can never be repaid. Shakes my head in disgust.
Two more heroes who remain unsung who also worked at Bletchley Park during WW2. Bill Tutte and Tommy Flowers.
Just reading about them.
correct, these 2 stand out as unsung heroes.
Yeah Alan Turin built the first ever electronic computer not IBM but didn't take credit because it was top secret for more than 50years unil everyone involved had passed away
No, that's not correct.
Turing had no involvement in the building of Colossus. Other minds were behind that and it was physically realised by the electrical engineer Tommy Flowers for the purpose of breaking a completely different set of codes used by the German high command. Sometimes this machine is claimed as tge first electronic computer.
Turing, on the other hand, had already invented an electro-mechanical (not electronic) machine called the "bombe", used to decode Enigma messages.
Alan deserved so much better.
It is a tragic story of a world we have come from. Younger people now do not seem to acknowledge that history is not to be shoved under the carpet, but remembered, and learned from. That is how society grows. Acknowledge and remember your past and let those mistakes and injustices inform and guide your future.
A truly moving video again ladies. All the best from the UK.
To me history is a vital lesson, both my parents were born in 1919 and were 20 in1939, my Dad served in N.Africa, Italy and Austria but never really talked about this, but as his hair receded I noticed scars emerging on his scalp,I asked him about these and he explained they were caused by the heat of bullets just missing him, I never again asked why he said nothing.
It wasn’t just tragic the way that Alan Turing was treated - it was criminal and thoughtless to say the least. Can you just imagine what else he could have done if he had been allowed to go and fill his full potential. all the best to you and yours. Rab
It was criminal at the time.
Remembering how Alan Turing was treated breaks my heart. Makes me tear up every time. He deserved so much better and I wish he could see the world now and how much of a hero he was
Such an astounding man with so many gifts and we all owe him and others like him our lives. Your response is one we relate to....
Yes I concur with your call to salute him Hip Hip Hooray for Alan Turing and his contribution to us all.
Love and appreciation to you both for such a heart warming channel & for who you both are.. inspiring others with your goodness, fun curiosity & love . ❤🤗
Keep it up please I so look forward to your videos- Thank you!
Appreciate you Paul
@@TheNatashaDebbieShow Love you both sooo much- appreciate you just as much😘🤗😊 Thank you for a nice comment xx
A person who Alan Turing credited with inspiring him to write his paper on computing is Ada Lovelace the daughter of Lord Bryon. If you get a chance take a look at Ada Lovelace, you will find another women whom maths skills matched those of Turing.
Very pertinent comment…but only discovered Ada Lovelace, fairly recently…Womens contributions to many things are not given equal prominence….wonder why that is?????….By the way eg…The Womens FA cup (UK football) final is played today to sell out crowd at Wembley Stadium!!!…the same FA organisation.. who banned them from playing on official football grounds for 50 years!!🤬…Hmmm?!
Will do, thank you fascinating stuff
It’s hard to believe that we have come from demonising a man who probably saved this country to the freak show we have now
Turing did not crack Enigma. It was the Polish mathematicians.
I dont know if this has been mentioned but, Turing was not well known in the UK until a fifty year embargo was lifted on his secret documents.
Correct.
Just found the Hedy Lamar Docuentary......off to watch it now thanks ladies. Alan's work connot be understated, he instituted brand new fields of mathematics that others have followed and we are all today benefiting from.
Captcha is basically the Turing test.
It’s brill, without her, no mobile phones.The woman was way ahead of her time,
The fact that we didn't lose to the Nazis, and that my dad didn't have to fight (joined the RM Commandos in 1946) is enough of a memorial for me. RIP, to a bloody hero!
There's little that could be done to make up for the way the government treated Turing, but one small recent thing is that his image is now on the £50 note. Even that is a very limited gesture because ATMs do not dispense £50 notes, so virtually no-one in the UK has actually seen a £50 note in real life with his image on it.
Hmmm… still hidden then…. and will be invisible if the ‘B**t**ds’ do away with physical cash, like they are planning 🤬🤬
I've got one thankfully. Luckily my local Lloyds branch had some and I requested it on an in person withdrawal. Now I'm considering getting it framed, there's a spot in my hallway it would fit into nicely now I think about it. He's one of our best, I'm glad he's finally getting the recognition he deserves.
There were a number of heroes involved in breaking German codes and ciphers. Turing is the best known, and by far the worst treated, but others were also essential. Might be worth another show on the topic... And on the topic of Hedy Lamar, she also did work on aerodynamics for Howard Hughes!
I think it’s because of the terrible way he was treated!
Yes there was but it was Turing to come up with the idea for the machine and design of it. I'm not saying they weren't essential but he was the guy that did it.
What happened regarding Alan Turing was an absolute disgrace. Worse still, human beings persist in committing terrible atrocities upon each other. Where are we without our essential connections and compassion? The philosopher Daniel Dennett is an admirer of Alan and pays regular tribute to him in his talks. The Royal Institution Lecture that he gave on information, evolution and intelligent design contains such a tribute.
Thank you for talking about Hedy Lamarr. She was amazing and I've loved finding out about her for years. She deserves to be more widely known.
Alan should be always remembered for what he did, but also for what we did to him. Not to be chastised but a lesson, we cannot and should not judge the past on our current values because we will never ever learn, yes, what happened then to us is way out of our values but it was THEN not now. I love Turing's work and we indeed owe him so much. I think that his legacy should be that we know exactly what he both did and also suffered so we could be here now, and that we do not repeat mistakes.
I cried my heart out at the end of the film, Alan did so much for his country and he was treated so badly ending his own life, just tragic
Natasha. You are 100% right. You can’t apologise to someone who has died.
I agree but the admission of fault at govt level has significance for gay people now
True.
Your correct, you can not, but it can mean something to the family, that he left behind.
Not taking anything away from Alan Turing but Enigma was first broken by Poland pre-war (1932). They actually aided in hacking the new version at Bletchley Park... The man most responsible for breaking the Enigma code was Marian Rejewski long before WWII.
_With the second world war looming, Poles had to share their knowledge about the Enigma with British and French colleagues. During a meeting in Pyry, near Warsaw, in July 1939, Rejewski and his colleagues demonstrated how to crack the machine and gave each allied side a replica_
Again this takes nothing from the work at Bletchley Park it was a modified version that required considerable mathematical work, but it must be remembered that historically enigma was broken initially by the Poles.
Bletchley Park was the code breaking section and did create the first real programmable computer, the plans for which were given to the American CIA after the war under Churchill's orders, Colossus became the scaled up American copy ENIAC.
_Colossus was a set of computers developed by British codebreakers in the years 1943-1945 to help in the cryptanalysis of the Lorenz cipher. Colossus used thermionic valves to perform Boolean and counting operations_
Absolutely true.. thanks for underlining those facts 👍…
The American film about an American submarine capturing an Enigma device actually happen before the Americans joined the war, and it was the British that did it.
The Royal Navy captured German U-boat U-110 on May 9, 1941 in the North Atlantic, recovering an Enigma machine, its cipher keys, and code books that allowed codebreakers to read German signal traffic during World War II.
During the 80s i had an amazing computing school teacher his hero was Alan Turing and he did not just teach of his achievements but also his tragic end so when the imitation game came out me and my partner went to the cinema me alrealdy knowing what happens and the shock on her face said it all. She couldn't believe that is how we treated a hero. This mans story breaks my heart
Neither the police nor the courts were allowed to know about his work at Bletchley Park. It was still highly sensitive and top secret.
Thank you for this video today, I did know all this information having read it and also visited Bletchley but hearing it today I couldn’t find the right words to express how I felt about his treatment. A man who literally saved millions of people, words fail me. I was so emotional and in tears. It was so tragic what happened to him and an apology is too little too late in my opinion. We owe him and his team a debt we can never ever repay
We struggled with words too Roz...😢
100% agree. It has saddened me ( once I read his story) how cruelly he was treated. It makes me feel ashamed. God bless him.
Correct.
Yes yes yes one of my hero's ❤❤
This has been a real insight to what happened to him. Thank you for bringing it to the light and making us more understanding of what happened to guy. He has been recognised on one of our banknotes
Thank goodness for what this man did. And once again thank you to you too for bringing this to our attention❤
Very interesting history episode today thanks again ladies
I think I could feel what you were going to say but didn’t and I feel the same. So many thoughts and feelings brought up by this tragedy. Thanks for another great video lassies! ❤
This is a fascinating story Alan Turing as a British Citizen I salute you Sir
Nice heartfelt video , thank you for understanding how the world (not just Britain) used to be and sadly still is in some places.
A Brilliant man with a sad ending, that explains why they called a road in Manchester “Alan Turing Way (I’m from Manchester, I now live in New Zealand). I think there’s a statue/memorial in Manchester too.
I drive up that road to and from work an yes, there is a memorial to him on Sackville Street. It is of him sitting on a bench holding an 🍎.
The statue is in Sackville Gardens which is in the gay village just off Piccadilly Gardens
@@susansmiles2242 I’ll check it out when I come back for a holiday to see my family, and hopefully try and get a ticket to see United for the last time too!
@@MjII7 hope you have deep pockets tickets not cheap these days
Turings ‘war hero’ status wasn’t known to the court because his work was so highly classified that almost nobody knew about it.
I think the "Status" should not make any difference. The "Crime" was the Law itself that make homosexuals offenders and Turing wasn't the only one who has the choose: Criminal Record for doing a "sex crime" or chemical castration.
@@DSP16569 true - but the video was making a specific comment on treatment of a war hero, but at the time that wasn’t public knowledge. I’m not suggesting that it makes this any less of a tragedy
Bletchley Park was so secret, people met after the war, married and only in their 80s when it was declassified, they found out they had worked together in separate buildings. They had been married for 50 years and never knew what each other did during the war.
There is a statue to Turing in Sackville Park in Manchester's gay village.
My father was an engineering student at Manchester in the early 60s and worked on the computers that were developed from Turing's.
Turing is genuinely loved in Great Britain as a national hero, but the treatment of this decent soul, will never be forgotten.
The worlds not perfect but thank god many can now live as they wish, with who they wish heartbreaking how everything he and others did was nothing against þhier ctime of loving someone. Im genuinely happy you two are free to love and be loved by each other xxx
That was a interesting video, so sad people could treat him like that god bless alan turing 😢😢😢😢
Very interesting , I love Simons videos, he explains everything so well
He really does and makes it possible to remember it. Too many videos go over things to quickly or the narrator speaks too fast , I lose it and stop watching.
Omg how this started out. 😮 He was happy just to be near him. That was enough. That’s beautiful. Who doesn’t want to be loved like that? Then…😢
Tommy Flowers is another man who needs recognition for his GIGANTIC PART in the war effort, especially on the enigma codes. He spent his last days in America teaching students complex mathematics.
Really appreciate your work girls you highlighted injustice that Turing went through another great video
So sad and disgusting
Dammit girls - you keep doing that to me! I knew about Alan Turing (and Hedy Lamarr) and listened to his sad story but when you gave him 3 cheers the tears started to flow. Your respect and admiration and plain old caring is so unusual these days. I thank you for it.
The apology and posthumous pardon are symbolic gestures of a society that acknowledges the appalling treatment of Alan Turing and other members of the LGB+ Community back in the dark days when we were closed minded. Today, whilst we are not perfect, we are a far more enlightened people and we recognise Alan Turing as a national hero. The three Polish men involved - Marian Rejewski, Jerzy Różycki and Henryk Zygalski. Their work was instrumental in breaking the Enigma Code.
Yes, agree. The Polish men were incredibly brave and instrumental in breaking the Enigma code.I think the word PARDONED is misleading. the man hadn’t done anything wrong. Gordon Brown and The Queen apologised for the way this national hero , this man, this human being was treated. Highlighted the appalling treatment, and bigotry bestowed on Alan Turing.
The Enigma Code was no more difficult than The Times Crossword, compared to Lorenze.
The poles made a fantastic contribution to crypto analysis by providing the allies with an Enigma machine. They also made a significant contribution in the less up to Sep 1939 in helping break Enigma. However this wasn’t done on crypto analysis of the code, but rather by a piece of mathematical genius that uncovered a flaw in the machine itself.
Unfortunately by the start of 1940 this defect in the machine had been rectified and no further encrypted Enigma messages could be broken again until Turing found a way to break the code .
The polish scientists are honoured at Bletchley Park .. without them nobody could have had a chance ... that they gave at great cost their knowledge should be honoured
Even though I knew of the tragic end, it still brings me to tears. Alan Turing did not end his own life, the system killed him just as sure as if they had put a gun to his head. This poor, poor man. It's unspeakably sad.
I want this man to be remembered as a hero. I wanted him on our new money.
Words cannot express how I feel about what Alan Turing gave to the world and what the world gave back to Alan Turing.
I knew about this before the clip, and it is one of the only times I have been truly ashamed of my country
I am lucky As a ypung man i became a Paramedic in London, and it changed the trojectory of my life. I am now a Disabled Mentaly ill Person, who has an X Wife who is a friend and two wonderful Children. Mr Turing et all. Thank you for your service. HIP HIP HORAY. PEACE
I shall be adding "Bombshell" to my watch list, thank you ladies ❤❤
You will LOVE it!! We watched it 3 times!
@TheNatashaDebbieShow
Thank you & thank you for the top rate content. Sorry this one hurt you both.
Sending love from Manchester ❤❤❤
Me too
This story always makes me so mad. The awful way he was treated.
You two lady's are brilliant.The fact Alan Turing was gay should never ever have mattered.I think it is highly probable that the world would be in a much Darker place today if it was not for this man. RIP Alan.
You seem to be unaware of pre 1967 (pre- Wolfenden) gay circumstances.
Fantastic movie about a genius of a man
If you ever come to England, you can visit Bletchley Park and see the machine he was working on and have a tour around the site including where he did his work.
I hope they do come over.
I am British and fiercely proud of my country and its achievements for such a small nation. But the way Alan Turing was treated by my country makes me sick to my stomach. The man should be lauded as one of this country's greatest heroes. And he was. I have nothing but admiration, gratitude and deep sympathy for him.
There is an 'urban myth' that the Apple logo of an apple with a chunk missing is an homage to Alan Turing, and his death.
Stephen Fry tells the story of meeting Apple co-founder Steve Jobs, and tackling him on it. The reply was that is was NOT true " ...but by God we wish it were "
Just because you are not a mathematical genius does not mean you are worthless or have nothing to contribute. Just through your reviews, you are contributing to people's knowledge and understanding. Plus, the knowledge of your lives together is an active demonstration that sexual preference does not enhance or diminish your value as human beings. I love your videos, and much love to both of you.
Gee we humans can be real **';;!#! Can't we. There is a saying both my Mother and Father used. " There but by the grace of God go I" most apt in this case. Such a sad,sad story. But if the only thing that history teaches us, let us please learn by our mistakes. Have a nice rest of your weekend. Jane in New Zealand 🇬🇧🇳🇿😢
My mum worked at Bletchley Park during WW2, obviously she signed the official secrets act, so proud. Turin suffered so much, when he should have been held in high esteem. Thank god weve come a long way since then. Natasha, your reaction is how i feel whenever i think about this great man. Hedy was amazing
Turing was a great man who deserved so much better.
Why does no one mention Tommy Flowers who built the Colossus computer he is the real unsung hero of it all.
Because his work was even more secret than Turing's.
Having been to Bletchley Park many times I can say it is such an interesting museum. At around £30 per person with free year long repeat admission it is well worth it
I knew you girls would be choked up. Thank goodness for our freedom today
R.I.P Alan Turing, we will not forget!
I haven't seen The Imitation Game but I have seen "Breaking the Code" starring Derek Jacobi as Alan. To me this was a pretty accurate telling of Alan Turing's life, I watched it back in the late 1990's on tv. Worth a look I think :)
Take care and have fun. Thanks.
Sorry for the abrupt ending, the anger was too much to hold in and had to edit out a lot of profanities and other stuff... Also, sorry to tell everyone but the Apple logo was a nod to Isaac Newton not Turing.
I like how your reaction video is respectful for the presentation and information. You don't stop and talk loads... just react and listen to the history. I love this guys delivery as he is to the point with an interesting way of doing it. I love how you both respect that and are genuinely interested. Nice reference to Hedy Lamarr too. Also the apple logo is a respectful nod to Mr Turing
Thank you, we appreciate your kind words. Contrary to popular belief though, the Apple logo is myth in regards to Turing. Is what created as a nod to Newton.