I was really surprised when they did that. It killed it for me too. I wanted to really enjoy it as the setting is amazing but I just couldn’t get to grips with it.
Necromunda just announced a 2 book compendium that will have one book with all the updated rules in it and the other with the 6 main factions and all their rules in it. This was much needed and I hope will bring in/back many who we're turned off by the lack luster launch, rule book only available in the starter box, and piecemeal release schedule. Though as an early adopter myself I feel a tad punished financially by what they did. Makes me a tad leary about buying more expansion books for the next wave of factions in hopes that a compendium will release in another year or so with all the new factions in it.
Yeah I know what you mean. I bought in early then got turned off by the drip feed rules. The compendium wasn’t announced when I made this video but glad it’s in its way.
Coming up to two years soon since this video came out, and gw are still drip-feeding rules for necromunda... Luckily I just keep playing the necromunda that came in the cool box back in the 90's! 8)
UPDATE: the RULE book is Now selling Separate from Box set, but box set is still a Better deal, also ALL 6 of the Basic Gangs are out, as well White Dwarf had Rules for Hire Gun Venerator Gang & Cultists Gangs. (there is also a Combined Gangs of the Underhive for the original 6 gangs in one book)
all the comments talking about rule books for Necromunda. YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY THESE! There is a free online pdf of all rules and printable tactic cards etc.
I agree with what you’re saying however there shouldn’t need to be a community made version of bringing the rules together. The GW drip feed put a lot of people off.
@@BlackJackLegacy I think GW in the beginning actually did it to please the audience that for decades have complained that they had to purchase great tome like books (for a lot of money) with ALL the rules, rules they didn't actually need. They based on this then decided to split up the rules, but alas, GW-fans never change and now we sit and complain about having to buy everything separately. Now that they have finally responded to this as well (all in one book), I wonder what else we can complain about...
It’s really interesting you say that. I read something today that said the only thing wargamers hate more than change is things staying the same. Never been more apt than here.
I found this trying to decide between the New 2019 Necromunda box and the Kill Team one with Space Wolves and Tau. I like the setting of Necromunda and that new box comes with tons of terrain you can use for 40K also. Combine it with some of the mechanicum pieces and its perfect for 40k also. Think I'll start (actually return to)the hobby with Necromunda Dark Uprising. Good video.
Kill Team for me. I was already on board with Shadow War: Armageddon. Just have to switch over to the new rules and add some more mini's to the forces since they balanced them out with more options.
I struggled with SWA in the same way I struggle with Necromunda. They’re great games but just that little bit rules heavy for how often I play them. Thanks for watching Cesar.
Necromunda every time we play 2nd edition living rule book with original models absolutely live it! But I really wana try this one the more I look at it the more I wana play it and will buy the starter set soon but I'm put off by the hole needing multiple books to play it
To be honest, you only really need The Rulebook and the Gangs of the Underhive book to play Necromunda if you plan on playing one of the 6 core gangs. This video is now rather dated tbh. The Book of Perils The Book of Judgement And The Book of Ruin are not essential unless you plan on playing GSC, CGC, Chaos Cultists or Enforcers but do add new facets to the game.
Great video. I have both and find I play both but with different circles of friends. You are right though. Kill team definitely appeals to a wider audience.
Thanks John. I think there's some crossover (of which you're a great example) but the fact you play with different friends shows it has different audiences for each game. Thanks for watching and commenting :)
Great vid. I’ve gotten quite into Kill Team since it’s release but I’ve also just started collecting Necromunda as well. I haven’t done anything with it yet but looking forward to. I have the core box and GW1. Looks like fun.
Hey there! Thanks. I have Necromunda too and a lot of the guys in my gaming group play it but it’s just not clicked for me. I think I like my rulesets that little bit simpler and easier on my brain power. Thanks for watching.
Yeah that’s true but then Gang War 2,3 and 4 add extra rules that while are optional are still part of the overall game. The Terrain rules should really have been in the main book and the main book should be available without having to buy the boxes set in my opinion. That doesn’t make it a bad game - just an interesting way to release the rules. 👍🏼
wondering how you would compare deadzone to necromunda or something similar? I don't have any experience in necromunda or kill team but have quite a load of time and money put into deadzone
i really adore your videos. i get the idea of being informed instead of being convinced to buy something. please keep up the good work and don't bother about your 'low' count of subscriptions. most people can't handle quality ':) (your english sounds so much nicer than the american version
Thanks so much Peter - really nice of you to say so! I’m not in this to be a salesman so I’m just trying to share info and my opinions through my own hobby experience so I’m glad that comes across. Hopefully the subs will grow but I’m having fun so what happens next is all good. My English is very northern so I’m sure there’s many don’t prefer it but kind of you to say 👍🏼
Great summary for both games there. I love the Necromunda minis, but the game seems too complicated for me. I bought it on impulse when it launched, but lost interest pretty quickly with GW taking too long to release models & expansions that caught my attention. Their support for Kill Team has been superb so far, obviously they had the advantage of the minis already existing, so it was more about the kill zones & expansions, but with the savings you make on some of the bundles, it's no wonder the game hit the ground running. I'm half tempted to build my Escher & Goliath models as proxies for Kill Team, and simply cash in on the Necromunda rule book, but that's a decision for another day. Great vid
Its like you read my mind Dan. I feel exactly the same about Necromunda. Bought it as I got caught in the hype and then was overwhelmed by the rules. Thanks for the kind words and thanks for watching and commenting mate.
I feel a tad punished financially by what they did. Makes me a tad leary about buying more expansion books for the next wave of factions in hopes that a compendium will release in another year or so with all the new factions in it.
Sadly I think that’s exactly what will happen. It’s one of the reasons I liked Kill Team from the off as everything was in one book. Now, however it seems Kill Team May go the same way with drip frees rules like Commanders. I don’t mind expansions over time but this one felt a little too soon after the launch.
@@BlackJackLegacy I thought the same thing. Happened so fast that I'm sure it was in the original rule set then they just removed it just to squeeze fans financially for a few extra bucks.
They are very different and I like that. Kill Team has speed of play and killer combo. Necromunda the tense tactics and 3D feel. I have enjoyed playing both.
Tnx, good comparision even if I am biased for Necromunda. :) Necromunda was pretty cheap...Starter box at half price at sell-out. Full-color-scan PDFs of all the extra supplement rule books just to download. Really like the gangs/models in Necromunda and the idea of hired guns...Forge Worlds units.
Great comparison. I have both games buy not played kill team yet. Necromunda plays in under 2 hours normaly. I got the first 2 gangwars books and the 3rd gang but it adds up fast if you get the book, the dice, figures and tactics cards so decided to stop at the 3 gangs. Kill team will have more options for me with the kids getting into 40k we will end up with 4 army's to pick out of.
Thanks Steve, I think maybe as you get to grips with the Necromunda rules it may well speed up but my experience is guys just staring into books for hours trying to find a certain rule or trying to understand how a certain rule works. For me thats just too much like hard work hence why Kill Team is my personal preference.
@@BlackJackLegacy I have the proper rule books and a pdf created by the community of the rules and gang wars 1 the pdf is so much easier to reference as in order and the fluff cut out.
Thanks alot for this explanation. I have a good bit of content for Kill Team now and have really been looking forward to playing some games and beginning a collection for full on 40k eventually but I am very much a theme/narrative person that loves combat crunchiness in my rules and have been eyeballing Necromunda for awhile. Time to take out a loan I guess lol.
I like Kill Team and the fast pace is great but the depth of Necromunda makes it a far better game for me. The rules are complex and having them spread over aaaaall those books is annoying but it's worth it. I love the hive setting and how attached to your gang you become.
hey mafoota, I love the Hive setting too but the deeper complex rules are a barrier to me as I prefer something a little more straight forward. That doesn't mean Necromunda isn't an amazing game however.
It is sort of odd that GW brought out two competing skirmish games so closer to each other, both set in the same universe and both sharing a similar rule set
Kind of gave up on Kill Team after Harlequins charged my Necrons from behind cover (so no overwatch) repeatedly, then murderalted my shooters. If I'd stuck with it, I was definitely considering a 10x Flayed One list...
Yeah I never liked that rule but they have changed it in Kill Team Arena. You now get to Overwatch once you see the model like a reaction. Much better.
Bases on Gdubs prices & not counting terrain. I would say KT is more expensive as the Kommandos are the most expensive at £36.50 whereas the gangs are £26 as of Feb 2022. You could, of course go cheaper with both games using cultists or even proxies. I personally like Necromunda, just look at the different gang styles 😁 PS I use One page Rules/ Firefight/ Gang Wars.
For me its tryhammer vs skirmish roll play. Where Im at Kill Team is no more a entry for new players, as it is a playground for veterans that wants to "try out" new teams, Necromunda is a hobby in its own right.
Interesting video and great comparison. Necromunda 1st Edition was where it was at! I had an enforcer gang and still have my Escher and Redemptionists, some of the coolest Middlehammer Models. Mordheim is by far GWs best skirmish game but I had left the hobby when it came out but snagged a copy of it in 2005, I think it was still in production. I would love to try modern necromunda and I know 2 of my regular opponents have it. The entry to the game does sound daunting and is a massive turn off. I have watched a couple of lets plays and have been meh about it. Kill Team has failed to impress me so far, however I wont give up on it yet, I have a friend very keen for it and I really want to get into it. I played Kill Team twice and went Meh... where as I played Frostgrave and Walking Dead once and got hooked! I play far too many non GW Games and I really dont think GW games are the be all end all. They are good games but I dont think they are great. I think I am just stuck in the past when it comes to GW especially the 1990s and I will never get that feeling again from GW that I got as a pubescent teen.
Thanks for the reply mate. I’ve never played Mordheim and completely missed this Blood Bowl, Mordheim, Necromunda, Mon O War age of GW the first time around so there’s no nostalgia pull for me. I’ve found Kill Team really really fun but maybe that’s the guys I’m playing with rather than the game. My gameing has been very much non GW until this last year or so and I love discovering new games and rules. Most of my gaming has been Wyrd, Privateer Press and Mantic until I started this channel. I didn’t play much as a kid so I don’t have that memories much (only of Fighting Fantasy and Hero Quest) as I didn’t get in to minis in a big way until my 30’s. I guess that’s one reason why I’m less addicted to GW than some. 👍🏼
We have now a full rule book for necromunda. The gang war thing was garbage. You can also purchase gang specifics books to extend their customisation and fluff (lore). Also Necromunda campaigns, gangs, models and rpg progression are excellent. N.B : it has been said before, tons of content is given for free on the internet (like on the "The Trove : archive" with few rule books and other content). As an exemple dont buy cards for necromunda, you have smaller version for card sleeves made by fans and with all the existing necromunda cards).
I have both games and here are my thoughts for what they're worth. Kill team: Pros: It had a much better launch with everything available both separatly or in value boxes from the beginning. Necromunda would have been wise to have done the same. Plays a bit faster and is a bit more simple. More balanced and competitive. A great way to scratch a 40k itch with minimal miniatures. Uses 40k minis and supports nearly all factions with a decent selection of troops. Cons: Campaign system, troop specialization, and troop upgrades aren't quite as robust as I'd personally like and don't make quite as big of an impact on the overall game as I'd personally like. Troop load out and selection while decent aren't quite a large as many other skirmish games. Necromunda Pros: Very rich thematic game play with easily customizable characters and scenarios. Unique setting with a huge variety of equipment and play styles. Terrain is a key feature of the game with lots of interaction with the environment. Campaign system and troop upgrades are super deep, custimazable, and rewarding making each gang, its individual members, and scenarios feel robust and personal with a fun in-between game that matters. Its community is very laid back and more concerned with having a good time than winning at all costs. The "Rule of Cool" meaning if it looks fun use it. Don't worry if it's the perfect optimization or not. Cons: Longer game time with a lot to keep track of. The rules, while not super difficult, are moderately complicated with a lot going on and a lot of steps at each point of the game. Not as balanced in terms of competition and run away winners can happen in it's longer campaign system. Its drip feed release schedule is frustrating making you have to wait a long time for everything you want/need to play your faction. It financially punishes early adopters with piece meal expensive expansion books that later release as much needed updated compendiums making you either wait a year or more for a better book with all the rules or pay a premium for completing the rules or factions as you go. My final thoughts: Both games have fun systems and gorgeous minis. The factions of kill team appeal to me a bit more and it's better at quick one off games and had a way better launch but at the end of the day Necromunda is my personal favorite. The deep campaign system, laid back community, massively customizable characters, fun integration of terrain, and extremely thematic game play of Necromunda win me over every time and keep me wanting to come back to it again and again. Anyways those are my thoughts. What are yours?
Hey Wayner396, I pretty much agree with everything you’ve said. As I said in the video I don’t think one game is better than the other as they scratch different itches. Kill Team is by far the easier entry point and a lower investment but Necromunda is a deeper richer game if you can invest time into it and are willing to accept the rules spread around the books. I know there’s a compendium coming soon which will certainly help. Kill Team plays great at that small 22” x 30” size and the terrain sets work great. Necromunda needs a LOT of terrain to play well but once you have it it’s a really immersive game. It’s horses for courses but as a new player trying understand what the difference between the games is Kill Team is by far the easier gateway. Thanks for watching and for your awesome reply too 👍🏼
@@BlackJackLegacy I lenjoyed and appreciated your video. I think you did a great job of comparing the two. I agree with you. They are two different animals in their approach to skirmish games with one focused on theme and the other with easy-of-play but that there's room for both as they appeal to different audiences. Anyways. Keep up the awesome work and thanks for the response.
Interesting video. Necromunda is just great. Sure, getting into it is more difficult, but it gives so much variety. I prefer the campaign, but it's also fun to play one-off skirmish games. I'm already having several 40K armies and enjoy it a lot to play something different in that universe I love. Sometimes it's a bit sad, as I don't even get to play 40K anymore as I feel Necromunda keeps me better entertained. On facebook.com/Elite40K you can see me doing some serious hobbying… :-) I find 8th edition of 40K is already a bit simple, so I wish Kill Team could be more complex...
You raise a great point Elite 40K and thats the reason I think these games have different audiences. Necromunda is more complex but some people love that and Kill Team is more simple and others love that. It doesnt make one game better than the other - they just cater to different gamers. I'll check out your facebook page too thanks :)
Necromunda is fun but I hate the way the rules for Necromunda are being handled. Too many rulebooks. If they are going to release a book with every gang then make it a codex for that gang with information only specific to that gang. Don't put core rules in there. Besides the cost it is annoying to have to go through all these books trying to find that one rule you saw that one time.
Hey inttruders - yeah the multiple books with rules and ifo split across them is a real pain. I understand theres a compendium book planned but then that feels like just another book to buy to make what should have been available from day 1. Thanks for watching and commenting. :)
In Killteam the models are available, but all the tactic cards are not. You have to buy other sets just to get the cards or download them. Some teams have more options than other's. I bought into it, but now I hate it. Where I live it is hard to get into an open play. League play has ruined it for me. During the league no one wants to up there teams status cards, but instead use tactic cards. I served and a Killteam is not designed that way, a Killteam is design to get the objective, and leave combat as soon as possible. The competitive nature of this game has ruined it for open play players. Gamesworkshop has done this to make more money, I can understand that. But what happened to getting everything you need in one box? I play other games and have just enough fun with them without spending a lot money. What happen to simple? I feel that it has been purchased, and made complex, make it more about who has the bigger stick. I love painting the models, but GW has let me down again and will most likely do so in the future.
Kill Team is probably the best comparison. Infinity has some easy to get started Introductory boxes such as Operation Coldfront (I have a review on my channel) and they include 2 starter forces and everything you need to learn the bulk of the rules step by step. After that point however the game becomes a little more rules heavy and is more like Necromunda from a board size (4’x4’) along with some quite crunchy rules. Games can take a few hours too even with less than 10 minis per side. Does that help?
I play Underhive with 2 gangs using Space Hulk 1st Edition rules lol. Works fine if you want a quick game. Space Hulk... sigh... wish GW would rerelease the jewel in their crown. It's the only GW game I've ever enjoyed playing, even with expansions you could learn the rules in about 20 minutes
I do both! Both are enjoyable but with those + Adeptus titanicus I am now struggling to find to play all of them! I do hate the supplements though... Btw - what happened with the give-away?
I wonder how many play both ? I struggle to play Necromunda as I play so infrequently I feel like theres too many rules to hold in my head alongside everything else I play.The giveaway happened on Monday 3rd September on the Monday Night Live Stream as mentioned in the original Giveaway Video.
I have both Necromunda and Kill Team, and enjoy both. However, I don't see myself playing Necromunda in the future which is both frustrating and disheartening - I first played Necromunda back in the 90s and it helped lead me to my love of tabletop/miniature gaming. Today, the issue I have revolves around GW's marketing. Instead of releasing a single rules book like they did with Kill Team, they decided to divide the Necromunda rules book into multiple parts, tie them to the release of specific gangs and then release them over the course of a year or two - it's a simple money-grab and, frankly, counterproductive to promoting their products. While I'm happy to support GW and buy their stuff, I don't like being disrespected and cheated. I like to think that Necromunda (and Shadow War: Armageddon to name another short-lived GW product) will someday be folded into Kill Team. Hopefully, the upcoming Rogue Trader release is a step in that direction. Thanks for the video and keep up the good work!
Thanks Randal! Yeah the rules split is a really strange choice. I didn’t like how they did that with Blood Bowl either. I’m not sure how long Kill Team will stay just one book but I’m enjoying it while it lasts 👍🏼
This is coming from someone outside the hobby who used to play a bit of 40k like 15 years ago in high school. I think GW would do well to lower their prices substantially if they ever want to expand and become more popular. They have so many cool games and concepts, but then you realize that to really dig in and play even a smaller game like these, you are looking at like 250$+ investment. And that is just for you. You then need to find other people who own a bunch of stuff for the same game or you get to spend even more money so that you have enough stuff for at least one other person to play. Their prices are absolutely insane. I am interested in picking some 40k stuff up as I just reconnected with a buddy from my high school days who still plays, but I really can't justify the cost of an army just to play a few casual games a month. Not to mention if I wanted to paint them then I have to spend 5-6$ per little thing of paint and whatever brushes and whatnot cost. Shit is out of control. It's damn near 1k just to get everything you need to play a full 2000 pt game. I honestly don't know how the company is still around. I mean, for christ's sake, it has to cost almost nothing to make the models at this point with the kind of 3d printing tech that exists. Bunch of crooks
I think you need to look a little closer. Sales have never been so good for Games Workshop. They have never been as profitable as they are now and that’s down to 2 things. The price they can sell for and the amount of people willing to pay that price. Many may feel they’re expensive but it seems there’s more than enough people willing to pay these prices to the point where there production facilities are full to capacity and they’re looking to expand with a new production building. From a purely business perspective it would seem they’re doing a great job. If they dropped the prices they’d have to sell more to make the same profits and at the minute they can’t make anymore. If people will pay it - why lower the price?
I wanna get into mini war gaming with GW being on top of the list just cause its the easiest to find peeps to play with but their costs for what u get seem so unreasonable that I'd have to give up a dozen of my other hobbies just to start this one. Are they justified for charging so much in terms of running costs and such or are they stingy sons of b****es trying to squeeze their fans for every penny?
I think it is by definition of low model count however there are a lot of really detailed rules that make game play a lot longer than a traditional skirmish game in my experience.
The splitting and staggering of rules across multiple books and releases really kills my interest in any game.
I was really surprised when they did that. It killed it for me too. I wanted to really enjoy it as the setting is amazing but I just couldn’t get to grips with it.
google 'Necromunda Comprehensive Rulebook'
I know this is a thing but it shouldn’t have to be a community driven thing. I fear Kill Team is going the same way sadly.
Necromunda just announced a 2 book compendium that will have one book with all the updated rules in it and the other with the 6 main factions and all their rules in it.
This was much needed and I hope will bring in/back many who we're turned off by the lack luster launch, rule book only available in the starter box, and piecemeal release schedule.
Though as an early adopter myself I feel a tad punished financially by what they did. Makes me a tad leary about buying more expansion books for the next wave of factions in hopes that a compendium will release in another year or so with all the new factions in it.
Yeah I know what you mean. I bought in early then got turned off by the drip feed rules. The compendium wasn’t announced when I made this video but glad it’s in its way.
Coming up to two years soon since this video came out, and gw are still drip-feeding rules for necromunda... Luckily I just keep playing the necromunda that came in the cool box back in the 90's! 8)
Necromunda is like a Cyberpunk 2077 themed killteam and Killteam is like Team Death Match from Call of Duty?
UPDATE: the RULE book is Now selling Separate from Box set, but box set is still a Better deal, also ALL 6 of the Basic Gangs are out, as well White Dwarf had Rules for Hire Gun Venerator Gang & Cultists Gangs. (there is also a Combined Gangs of the Underhive for the original 6 gangs in one book)
all the comments talking about rule books for Necromunda. YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY THESE! There is a free online pdf of all rules and printable tactic cards etc.
I agree with what you’re saying however there shouldn’t need to be a community made version of bringing the rules together. The GW drip feed put a lot of people off.
@@BlackJackLegacy I think GW in the beginning actually did it to please the audience that for decades have complained that they had to purchase great tome like books (for a lot of money) with ALL the rules, rules they didn't actually need. They based on this then decided to split up the rules, but alas, GW-fans never change and now we sit and complain about having to buy everything separately. Now that they have finally responded to this as well (all in one book), I wonder what else we can complain about...
It’s really interesting you say that. I read something today that said the only thing wargamers hate more than change is things staying the same. Never been more apt than here.
I found this trying to decide between the New 2019 Necromunda box and the Kill Team one with Space Wolves and Tau. I like the setting of Necromunda and that new box comes with tons of terrain you can use for 40K also. Combine it with some of the mechanicum pieces and its perfect for 40k also. Think I'll start (actually return to)the hobby with Necromunda Dark Uprising. Good video.
I grew up with & love Necromunda and the gangs evolve and Grow, it feels like you are really you in the game.
Kill Team for me. I was already on board with Shadow War: Armageddon. Just have to switch over to the new rules and add some more mini's to the forces since they balanced them out with more options.
I struggled with SWA in the same way I struggle with Necromunda. They’re great games but just that little bit rules heavy for how often I play them. Thanks for watching Cesar.
necromunda all the way constant new content
I agree on the new content but I don't like the way its spread out all over the place through many books.
Kill team is a total gateway drug to 40K, the boxed are super priced regarding content/price and i bought some for my N17 game
Yeah I think so too although I think Kill Team is a great game on its own. Thanks for watching and commenting Lars.
Thanks for this, I’ve played a bit of Kill Team but am a complete stranger to Necromunda so was wondering how they differed. Well explained.
Thanks Mister! I've heard this a few times, even from 40K players so glad you found the video helpful :)
Necromunda every time we play 2nd edition living rule book with original models absolutely live it! But I really wana try this one the more I look at it the more I wana play it and will buy the starter set soon but I'm put off by the hole needing multiple books to play it
To be honest, you only really need The Rulebook and the Gangs of the Underhive book to play Necromunda if you plan on playing one of the 6 core gangs.
This video is now rather dated tbh.
The Book of Perils
The Book of Judgement
And The Book of Ruin are not essential unless you plan on playing GSC, CGC, Chaos Cultists or Enforcers but do add new facets to the game.
Great video. I have both and find I play both but with different circles of friends. You are right though. Kill team definitely appeals to a wider audience.
Thanks John. I think there's some crossover (of which you're a great example) but the fact you play with different friends shows it has different audiences for each game. Thanks for watching and commenting :)
Great vid. I’ve gotten quite into Kill Team since it’s release but I’ve also just started collecting Necromunda as well. I haven’t done anything with it yet but looking forward to. I have the core box and GW1. Looks like fun.
Hey there! Thanks. I have Necromunda too and a lot of the guys in my gaming group play it but it’s just not clicked for me. I think I like my rulesets that little bit simpler and easier on my brain power. Thanks for watching.
Esher and Goliath gangs rules are in the main rules and Gang wars one is mainly for the use of terrain in games of Necromunda
Yeah that’s true but then Gang War 2,3 and 4 add extra rules that while are optional are still part of the overall game. The Terrain rules should really have been in the main book and the main book should be available without having to buy the boxes set in my opinion. That doesn’t make it a bad game - just an interesting way to release the rules. 👍🏼
the answer is... Warcry ;)
Maxime M.Ste-Marie if only Warcry was a thing when I made this!
@@BlackJackLegacy : clearly, didn't look at the date lol
Maxime M.Ste-Marie - I even did an update to this video about 3-4 months ago. At some point I’ll compare all 3 games 👍🏼
Necromunda, my true love.
I'm playing both 😊😊😊
The might and excellence of the Kill Team and the grunge and desperation of Necromunda.
And don't forget Deadzone from Mantic 😊😊😊
wondering how you would compare deadzone to necromunda or something similar? I don't have any experience in necromunda or kill team but have quite a load of time and money put into deadzone
The new rulebook came out, and the complete Gangs.
Yeah I saw that. The video is about 4-5 months old now so I didn’t know that then :)
i really adore your videos. i get the idea of being informed instead of being convinced to buy something.
please keep up the good work and don't bother about your 'low' count of subscriptions. most people can't handle quality ':)
(your english sounds so much nicer than the american version
Thanks so much Peter - really nice of you to say so! I’m not in this to be a salesman so I’m just trying to share info and my opinions through my own hobby experience so I’m glad that comes across. Hopefully the subs will grow but I’m having fun so what happens next is all good. My English is very northern so I’m sure there’s many don’t prefer it but kind of you to say 👍🏼
You got the mail on the head, the fragmented necromunda rules are a huge issue for that game. Great video fella!
I am a little worried Kill Team May be going the same way sadly.
@@BlackJackLegacy it's a slower pace, so that's an improvement.
You mean "hit the nail" on the head?
Great summary for both games there. I love the Necromunda minis, but the game seems too complicated for me. I bought it on impulse when it launched, but lost interest pretty quickly with GW taking too long to release models & expansions that caught my attention. Their support for Kill Team has been superb so far, obviously they had the advantage of the minis already existing, so it was more about the kill zones & expansions, but with the savings you make on some of the bundles, it's no wonder the game hit the ground running. I'm half tempted to build my Escher & Goliath models as proxies for Kill Team, and simply cash in on the Necromunda rule book, but that's a decision for another day.
Great vid
Its like you read my mind Dan. I feel exactly the same about Necromunda. Bought it as I got caught in the hype and then was overwhelmed by the rules.
Thanks for the kind words and thanks for watching and commenting mate.
I feel a tad punished financially by what they did. Makes me a tad leary about buying more expansion books for the next wave of factions in hopes that a compendium will release in another year or so with all the new factions in it.
Sadly I think that’s exactly what will happen. It’s one of the reasons I liked Kill Team from the off as everything was in one book. Now, however it seems Kill Team May go the same way with drip frees rules like Commanders. I don’t mind expansions over time but this one felt a little too soon after the launch.
@@BlackJackLegacy I thought the same thing. Happened so fast that I'm sure it was in the original rule set then they just removed it just to squeeze fans financially for a few extra bucks.
They are very different and I like that. Kill Team has speed of play and killer combo. Necromunda the tense tactics and 3D feel. I have enjoyed playing both.
They definitely scratch different itches and each deserve their place.
@@BlackJackLegacyNicely put 😊
Tnx, good comparision even if I am biased for Necromunda. :)
Necromunda was pretty cheap...Starter box at half price at sell-out. Full-color-scan PDFs of all the extra supplement rule books just to download.
Really like the gangs/models in Necromunda and the idea of hired guns...Forge Worlds units.
Thanks. There’s a lot changed since I made this so will be doing an update video soon.
@@BlackJackLegacy ah, looking forward to that! :)
Great comparison. I have both games buy not played kill team yet. Necromunda plays in under 2 hours normaly. I got the first 2 gangwars books and the 3rd gang but it adds up fast if you get the book, the dice, figures and tactics cards so decided to stop at the 3 gangs. Kill team will have more options for me with the kids getting into 40k we will end up with 4 army's to pick out of.
Thanks Steve, I think maybe as you get to grips with the Necromunda rules it may well speed up but my experience is guys just staring into books for hours trying to find a certain rule or trying to understand how a certain rule works. For me thats just too much like hard work hence why Kill Team is my personal preference.
@@BlackJackLegacy I have the proper rule books and a pdf created by the community of the rules and gang wars 1 the pdf is so much easier to reference as in order and the fluff cut out.
Thanks for your comprehensive yet easy to understand explanation on the similarities and differences. :>)
You’re welcome Peter - thanks for watching 👍🏼
Thanks alot for this explanation. I have a good bit of content for Kill Team now and have really been looking forward to playing some games and beginning a collection for full on 40k eventually but I am very much a theme/narrative person that loves combat crunchiness in my rules and have been eyeballing Necromunda for awhile. Time to take out a loan I guess lol.
Thanks for watching and commenting :) Hope you enjoy your time in the Underhive!
I like Kill Team and the fast pace is great but the depth of Necromunda makes it a far better game for me. The rules are complex and having them spread over aaaaall those books is annoying but it's worth it. I love the hive setting and how attached to your gang you become.
hey mafoota, I love the Hive setting too but the deeper complex rules are a barrier to me as I prefer something a little more straight forward. That doesn't mean Necromunda isn't an amazing game however.
@@BlackJackLegacy chop the two together dude, necromunda models and progression but with kill team game mechanics?
Could be interesting to do actually as I do have the Necromunda core box. Thanks for the idea :)
It is sort of odd that GW brought out two competing skirmish games so closer to each other, both set in the same universe and both sharing a similar rule set
I think a lot of people ask the same question however they are very different games. Thanks for watching and commenting moochieman7
Te rules aren't that similar whe you get into it.
Kind of gave up on Kill Team after Harlequins charged my Necrons from behind cover (so no overwatch) repeatedly, then murderalted my shooters. If I'd stuck with it, I was definitely considering a 10x Flayed One list...
Yeah I never liked that rule but they have changed it in Kill Team Arena. You now get to Overwatch once you see the model like a reaction. Much better.
@@BlackJackLegacy I'll have to try that out. ;)
Necromunda costs about 1000$ if you wanna get all content for it (Books, Minis and Base Game). That's just ridiculously expensive 0.o
Necromunda has squats, nuff said.
Has /a/ squat
Bases on Gdubs prices & not counting terrain. I would say KT is more expensive as the Kommandos are the most expensive at £36.50 whereas the gangs are £26 as of Feb 2022. You could, of course go cheaper with both games using cultists or even proxies. I personally like Necromunda, just look at the different gang styles 😁
PS
I use One page Rules/
Firefight/
Gang Wars.
For me its tryhammer vs skirmish roll play. Where Im at Kill Team is no more a entry for new players, as it is a playground for veterans that wants to "try out" new teams, Necromunda is a hobby in its own right.
Yeah Necromunda is definitely a hobby product where Kill Team feels a little more casual “drop in and out”.
Very nice content, have subscribed, all the best Garry
Hey Garry, thanks so much for watching and subscribing too. Its much appreciated.
Interesting video and great comparison. Necromunda 1st Edition was where it was at! I had an enforcer gang and still have my Escher and Redemptionists, some of the coolest Middlehammer Models. Mordheim is by far GWs best skirmish game but I had left the hobby when it came out but snagged a copy of it in 2005, I think it was still in production. I would love to try modern necromunda and I know 2 of my regular opponents have it. The entry to the game does sound daunting and is a massive turn off. I have watched a couple of lets plays and have been meh about it. Kill Team has failed to impress me so far, however I wont give up on it yet, I have a friend very keen for it and I really want to get into it. I played Kill Team twice and went Meh... where as I played Frostgrave and Walking Dead once and got hooked! I play far too many non GW Games and I really dont think GW games are the be all end all. They are good games but I dont think they are great. I think I am just stuck in the past when it comes to GW especially the 1990s and I will never get that feeling again from GW that I got as a pubescent teen.
Thanks for the reply mate.
I’ve never played Mordheim and completely missed this Blood Bowl, Mordheim, Necromunda, Mon O War age of GW the first time around so there’s no nostalgia pull for me. I’ve found Kill Team really really fun but maybe that’s the guys I’m playing with rather than the game. My gameing has been very much non GW until this last year or so and I love discovering new games and rules. Most of my gaming has been Wyrd, Privateer Press and Mantic until I started this channel.
I didn’t play much as a kid so I don’t have that memories much (only of Fighting Fantasy and Hero Quest) as I didn’t get in to minis in a big way until my 30’s. I guess that’s one reason why I’m less addicted to GW than some. 👍🏼
Another good video man
Cheers me old mucker!
Warhammer Fantasy...
We have now a full rule book for necromunda. The gang war thing was garbage. You can also purchase gang specifics books to extend their customisation and fluff (lore). Also Necromunda campaigns, gangs, models and rpg progression are excellent. N.B : it has been said before, tons of content is given for free on the internet (like on the "The Trove : archive" with few rule books and other content). As an exemple dont buy cards for necromunda, you have smaller version for card sleeves made by fans and with all the existing necromunda cards).
Great video very informative thank you 👍
Thanks for watching Howard. Much appreciated
Yes! This is an awesome video. Totally helps me decide how to spend my $$ Thanks for creating this.
Really glad to help give the info buddy.
Would it be possible to play kill team if the only minis I have are the little first strike starter set?
Putting core rules in each expansion that you may or not want to buy has just about killed Necromunda.
I agree but I do worry that since making this video Kill Team May be going the same way!
really helpful. thanks!
Spryers, Redemptionist, scavvies and Ratskin brave when? ☺️
Another cool video mate
Thanks mate 👍🏼
I choose both ❤️❤️❤️
Good choice Andrea!
I have both games and here are my thoughts for what they're worth.
Kill team:
Pros:
It had a much better launch with everything available both separatly or in value boxes from the beginning. Necromunda would have been wise to have done the same.
Plays a bit faster and is a bit more simple.
More balanced and competitive.
A great way to scratch a 40k itch with minimal miniatures.
Uses 40k minis and supports nearly all factions with a decent selection of troops.
Cons:
Campaign system, troop specialization, and troop upgrades aren't quite as robust as I'd personally like and don't make quite as big of an impact on the overall game as I'd personally like.
Troop load out and selection while decent aren't quite a large as many other skirmish games.
Necromunda
Pros:
Very rich thematic game play with easily customizable characters and scenarios.
Unique setting with a huge variety of equipment and play styles.
Terrain is a key feature of the game with lots of interaction with the environment.
Campaign system and troop upgrades are super deep, custimazable, and rewarding making each gang, its individual members, and scenarios feel robust and personal with a fun in-between game that matters.
Its community is very laid back and more concerned with having a good time than winning at all costs.
The "Rule of Cool" meaning if it looks fun use it. Don't worry if it's the perfect optimization or not.
Cons:
Longer game time with a lot to keep track of.
The rules, while not super difficult, are moderately complicated with a lot going on and a lot of steps at each point of the game.
Not as balanced in terms of competition and run away winners can happen in it's longer campaign system.
Its drip feed release schedule is frustrating making you have to wait a long time for everything you want/need to play your faction.
It financially punishes early adopters with piece meal expensive expansion books that later release as much needed updated compendiums making you either wait a year or more for a better book with all the rules or pay a premium for completing the rules or factions as you go.
My final thoughts:
Both games have fun systems and gorgeous minis. The factions of kill team appeal to me a bit more and it's better at quick one off games and had a way better launch but at the end of the day Necromunda is my personal favorite.
The deep campaign system, laid back community, massively customizable characters, fun integration of terrain, and extremely thematic game play of Necromunda win me over every time and keep me wanting to come back to it again and again.
Anyways those are my thoughts. What are yours?
Hey Wayner396, I pretty much agree with everything you’ve said. As I said in the video I don’t think one game is better than the other as they scratch different itches.
Kill Team is by far the easier entry point and a lower investment but Necromunda is a deeper richer game if you can invest time into it and are willing to accept the rules spread around the books.
I know there’s a compendium coming soon which will certainly help.
Kill Team plays great at that small 22” x 30” size and the terrain sets work great. Necromunda needs a LOT of terrain to play well but once you have it it’s a really immersive game.
It’s horses for courses but as a new player trying understand what the difference between the games is Kill Team is by far the easier gateway.
Thanks for watching and for your awesome reply too 👍🏼
@@BlackJackLegacy I lenjoyed and appreciated your video. I think you did a great job of comparing the two. I agree with you. They are two different animals in their approach to skirmish games with one focused on theme and the other with easy-of-play but that there's room for both as they appeal to different audiences.
Anyways. Keep up the awesome work and thanks for the response.
wayner396 thanks 👍🏼. Always good to have a discussion in the comments too as it helps clarify stuff sometimes too.
Interesting video. Necromunda is just great. Sure, getting into it is more difficult, but it gives so much variety. I prefer the campaign, but it's also fun to play one-off skirmish games. I'm already having several 40K armies and enjoy it a lot to play something different in that universe I love. Sometimes it's a bit sad, as I don't even get to play 40K anymore as I feel Necromunda keeps me better entertained. On facebook.com/Elite40K you can see me doing some serious hobbying… :-) I find 8th edition of 40K is already a bit simple, so I wish Kill Team could be more complex...
You raise a great point Elite 40K and thats the reason I think these games have different audiences. Necromunda is more complex but some people love that and Kill Team is more simple and others love that. It doesnt make one game better than the other - they just cater to different gamers. I'll check out your facebook page too thanks :)
Bro a true good skirmish game is just a 40k match with 550pts
Necromunda is fun but I hate the way the rules for Necromunda are being handled. Too many rulebooks. If they are going to release a book with every gang then make it a codex for that gang with information only specific to that gang. Don't put core rules in there. Besides the cost it is annoying to have to go through all these books trying to find that one rule you saw that one time.
you can find a compiled PDF with all the rules in it..or so i heard (heretic mumble)
Hey inttruders - yeah the multiple books with rules and ifo split across them is a real pain. I understand theres a compendium book planned but then that feels like just another book to buy to make what should have been available from day 1. Thanks for watching and commenting. :)
Thats true but its a shame that a community gamer has had to do what GW should have done from day 1.
In Killteam the models are available, but all the tactic cards are not. You have to buy other sets just to get the cards or download them. Some teams have more options than other's. I bought into it, but now I hate it. Where I live it is hard to get into an open play. League play has ruined it for me. During the league no one wants to up there teams status cards, but instead use tactic cards. I served and a Killteam is not designed that way, a Killteam is design to get the objective, and leave combat as soon as possible. The competitive nature of this game has ruined it for open play players. Gamesworkshop has done this to make more money, I can understand that. But what happened to getting everything you need in one box? I play other games and have just enough fun with them without spending a lot money. What happen to simple? I feel that it has been purchased, and made complex, make it more about who has the bigger stick. I love painting the models, but GW has let me down again and will most likely do so in the future.
Check out my video about Whats Next For Kill Team - I feel the same
Wow, that was perfect. Thank you for the explanation. Def going kill team even though I love the necro lore
Hey Dylan. Glad you found it helpful 👍🏼
If you aren't judging them on what is better, it's not versus, it's a "everybody gets a trophy" system. -_-
Play both!
Thats the perfect answer ... of you have the time :)
How do GW skirmish games compare to Infinity?
Kill Team is probably the best comparison. Infinity has some easy to get started Introductory boxes such as Operation Coldfront (I have a review on my channel) and they include 2 starter forces and everything you need to learn the bulk of the rules step by step. After that point however the game becomes a little more rules heavy and is more like Necromunda from a board size (4’x4’) along with some quite crunchy rules. Games can take a few hours too even with less than 10 minis per side. Does that help?
It does! Thank you sir!@@BlackJackLegacy
Just pirate rules, i mean, i didnt, but this guy i know...
Far be it from me to condone this kind of behaviour 😏
I play Underhive with 2 gangs using Space Hulk 1st Edition rules lol. Works fine if you want a quick game. Space Hulk... sigh... wish GW would rerelease the jewel in their crown. It's the only GW game I've ever enjoyed playing, even with expansions you could learn the rules in about 20 minutes
I do both! Both are enjoyable but with those + Adeptus titanicus I am now struggling to find to play all of them! I do hate the supplements though...
Btw - what happened with the give-away?
I wonder how many play both ? I struggle to play Necromunda as I play so infrequently I feel like theres too many rules to hold in my head alongside everything else I play.The giveaway happened on Monday 3rd September on the Monday Night Live Stream as mentioned in the original Giveaway Video.
You need a update 😊
Oh I definitely do. Theres a lot changed since I made this video.
BlackJack Legacy please do it, Both games changed a bit and Necromunda now is really "worth it".
madluper - I definitely will. I plan to record it in the next week or so. Make sure you’re subbed to see it 👍🏼
It's about the muscularity!
Most muscular! 😏
Broadsword!
I play both :D
I have both Necromunda and Kill Team, and enjoy both. However, I don't see myself playing Necromunda in the future which is both frustrating and disheartening - I first played Necromunda back in the 90s and it helped lead me to my love of tabletop/miniature gaming.
Today, the issue I have revolves around GW's marketing. Instead of releasing a single rules book like they did with Kill Team, they decided to divide the Necromunda rules book into multiple parts, tie them to the release of specific gangs and then release them over the course of a year or two - it's a simple money-grab and, frankly, counterproductive to promoting their products. While I'm happy to support GW and buy their stuff, I don't like being disrespected and cheated.
I like to think that Necromunda (and Shadow War: Armageddon to name another short-lived GW product) will someday be folded into Kill Team. Hopefully, the upcoming Rogue Trader release is a step in that direction.
Thanks for the video and keep up the good work!
Thanks Randal! Yeah the rules split is a really strange choice. I didn’t like how they did that with Blood Bowl either. I’m not sure how long Kill Team will stay just one book but I’m enjoying it while it lasts 👍🏼
I just dislike the models of necromunda. The game is pretty fun though. Digging the video though brother. Good luck!
Thanks Tyler! They are a very different taste to 40K. What do you think of the new Rogue Trader models coming out soon? Thanks for watching.
@@BlackJackLegacy they are interesting. Not my favorites either but they have such a range on them it's very interesting to say the least.
This is coming from someone outside the hobby who used to play a bit of 40k like 15 years ago in high school. I think GW would do well to lower their prices substantially if they ever want to expand and become more popular. They have so many cool games and concepts, but then you realize that to really dig in and play even a smaller game like these, you are looking at like 250$+ investment. And that is just for you. You then need to find other people who own a bunch of stuff for the same game or you get to spend even more money so that you have enough stuff for at least one other person to play. Their prices are absolutely insane. I am interested in picking some 40k stuff up as I just reconnected with a buddy from my high school days who still plays, but I really can't justify the cost of an army just to play a few casual games a month. Not to mention if I wanted to paint them then I have to spend 5-6$ per little thing of paint and whatever brushes and whatnot cost. Shit is out of control. It's damn near 1k just to get everything you need to play a full 2000 pt game. I honestly don't know how the company is still around. I mean, for christ's sake, it has to cost almost nothing to make the models at this point with the kind of 3d printing tech that exists. Bunch of crooks
I think you need to look a little closer. Sales have never been so good for Games Workshop. They have never been as profitable as they are now and that’s down to 2 things. The price they can sell for and the amount of people willing to pay that price.
Many may feel they’re expensive but it seems there’s more than enough people willing to pay these prices to the point where there production facilities are full to capacity and they’re looking to expand with a new production building. From a purely business perspective it would seem they’re doing a great job.
If they dropped the prices they’d have to sell more to make the same profits and at the minute they can’t make anymore. If people will pay it - why lower the price?
3D printing isn't really that cheap
I wanna get into mini war gaming with GW being on top of the list just cause its the easiest to find peeps to play with but their costs for what u get seem so unreasonable that I'd have to give up a dozen of my other hobbies just to start this one. Are they justified for charging so much in terms of running costs and such or are they stingy sons of b****es trying to squeeze their fans for every penny?
Sounds like Necromunda isn't really a skirmish game
I think it is by definition of low model count however there are a lot of really detailed rules that make game play a lot longer than a traditional skirmish game in my experience.
The original Necromunda was THE skirmish game in my opinion.