When I bought my s-works SL7 from an LBS, they also threw in a bike fit, which led to us swapping out saddle post (with no set back) and longer stem at no cost to me. Also upgraded to their fancy 3d-printed saddle, and then credited me back the default saddle that came with the bike. Not sure how common this practice is, but gave me the feeling of full choice, with the added benefit of being able to touch and feel and experiment with the options before deciding. Not to mention my fav part about the LBS - the community. And if you buy a bike thru them, you’re one of theirs, and they take care of you. Really happy I went this route, and would 100% opt to buy via LBS again for next purchase.
+1. I went through my LBS for a 2024 Ostro VAM for the same reasons. They do bike fits too, and that was actually the reason for me buying one. The spec (barstem, cranks) was perfect and it’s the most comfortable position of all my bikes (Cervelo R5, Caledonia 5, Canyon Grizl). My LBS offered swapping of components after the fact (if needed) for no additional cost. The long-term relationship of my LBS servicing the bike, the community, and supporting local small business all fall within the “value” category for me.
I am looking at the Factor and an S5. My hesitation for the S5 is getting a bar and stem combo that works. I would be pleasantly surprised if the Cervelo shop can get the 38/130 I want. I can’t find any of these in stock here in the US. Dealing with that headache vs checking the boxes for exactly what I want is very appealing.
I was in contact with a specialized dealer this week who said he could do the same as you describe here, but even swap cranks (175 -> 170), stem and bar width at no increased cost.
That's common for specialized dealers in the US, because of the 30 day return policy specialized has. Anything that was specialized / roval / praxis should fall under that policy.
On the subject of the $9000 BMC frame: in the early 2000s, when I was like 10 years old, I played some silly online game where you have a fish tank and you try and breed and sell fancy fish. At one point I discovered that if I just made my fish some absurd price like $3000, someone silly NPC in my fish store would still buy it eventually. Later I realized that is completely true in real life as well XD
@@debasishnayak8610 Also I do not get people that say things like 'turned off at 50k to go, because it was wrapped' like he never got more than 1:30 gap on Remco and Mathieu, its a 274k race at the end of the season, even though It's Pogi, he could collapse and he kinda half-did on the last lap, so there was tension all the way
@@debasishnayak8610Well yes, but this wasn’t total domination. He didn’t ride away and keep growing the gap. It was always within reach of the chasers. 34 seconds margin at the end is pretty close given he was away for so long!
1:12:36 VAM is something a lot of pros are using to compare. You don’t know the watts but VAM is a directly comparable metric. It isn’t gradient dependent. Just because you aren’t using it for Centennial Park doesn’t mean it isn’t being used. Even LRCP has talked about it when I validating riders/performances.
Own ostro V1 and now sl8. Both incredible bikes. Factor QC is better on the finish, stiffer bb. Sl8 weight, fit, and most of all, comfort and dampening is better than the factor carbon fiber. Sl8 frame is a lot lighter frame. Factor BI wheels make the ostro v2 light. Sl8 seems to jump under you as you slam the pedals. No one is better than the other, just a different vibe and riding feel.
I got the new Ostro Vam recently. Factor sent the bike directly to me from Taiwan. I won't go into all the reason I got it directly, but it was mainly down to them making it easier to purchase than the local bike shops, particularly when you get the custom painted frame. The only real role of Factor Australia was that it have me someone to talk to around frame size and assembly. The reason it is the same price or higher than local bike shops is because they want local bike shops to support the product, so undercutting them on price is nota great idea..
@@ChrisMillerCyclingMost Factor bikes I see here in New Jersey/New York were purchased online, despite there being one or two dealers. Anecdotally, of course.
I went through local dealer in nyc for ostro vam v1. Custom paint was only $500. I have been happy with the bike. I find the ride to be quite comfortable for a race bike but I am not using factor wheels.
But the mental side is just trudging along at sub-zone2 pace and getting bored out of one's mind. It's just overcoming monotony, especially on those straight roads with just field around.
@@pl4free Although some people get into cycling to compete with other white collar dudes on a street circuit, some get into it because of the adventure. The bike is the best human powered means to experience the world, if you enjoy seeing the world then it wouldn't be boring to you. The Lachlan situation is unique because he is a world class cyclist who decided that he enjoys the adventure.
@@maturtlelaza I know. I do both, but I still wouldn't call exploring riding for 10 hours on a straight road with the same type of landscape. If he wanted to explore, he would have taken some back roads, would have taken the time to do some detours etc. etc. It was still a pure how fast do I go from A to B with a support team
The boys don't wanna talk about Lachy or World Champs but will dedicate another half an hour to discussing a 50g weight difference between two bikes, ahaha
The boys are all over Lachy and the WC - the 2 most newsworthy cycling points of interest in the last 10 days and they both - in unison dismiss both of them. If they both backslapped TP and LM along with the rest of the cycling fraternity it would be band wagon jumping. Far more clicks or controversy in going the opposing view which they do. They are being controversial for a reason - you just don't know it yet.
Was building up my SL8 pro frame around the time this Factor was coming out. Built out with Sub50 Limitless wheels (1360g) and managed to get a 38cm Rapide cockpit. For the Factor, I do think the pricing is pretty good at the Ultegra level and probably around where I spent building out the SL8. I'm on my 4th racing bike and first Tarmac, but this thing blows away any other bike I've ridden, esp the acceleration and handling. This is giving me a little bit of remorse of wishing I had been able to test the Factor (tho I'm not sure you really can). I also think the Factor looks a touch better in the right colorway, I love that you can customize. And I would have gotten 165mm cranks straight away too. Lot to like about this bike for sure. Far from dissatisfied from the SL8 b/c it's head and shoulders a better riding experience than anything else I've ridden, but def interested in the factor.
The take on Factor is pretty reasonable but I think the credibility the brand has earned from Israel Premier-tech is being massively understated. Stevie williams is a respected rider who’s had a great season, Joseph Blackmore is probably the highest touted junior in the world, Derek Gee is a super talent who podiumed the Dauphine, they win grand tour stages every season… it goes on. Certainly not a joke performance wise and objectively better than many World Tour teams. I would encourage riders to sign for them over Ineos these days.
This. They've had a better season than a decent chunk of other established teams. I agree the Froome signing was probably a waste of money and not sure what hype it's really generated.
I have a VAM v2 with Red. I love everything about it and it's way more unique than the big brands. Everyone has an SL8 and to pay too dollar with no choices in color, or other components is a no go for me. With Factor, you're able to choose everything you need included in the price. There's real value in that.
From Canada, I ride a BMC Teammachine. Cannot say I see a whole lot of them riding around. Most common bikes, anecdotally, are SL7/8s, Emondas and Madones. 🤷
… maybe discuss how good Tratnik was or how did he so quickly find out Tadej was solo behind so he knew to pull over? Discuss the key moments where the gap was close to 30s but why it went back out… or Ben’s finally getting the timing and move right…. Or how strong some lesser known rides went like Tom’s? Plenty to talk about.
Brands set a recommended retail price (RRP) and that’s the price. Whether it’s sold online, in the brand’s own stores (assuming they exist) or an independent store won’t change the RRP. Of course the margin each channel generates will vary. That’s what happens when you have an Omni-channel selling model.
I ride BMC in the US. They are largely sold through independent bike shops here, and they are not super common (not like a Trek or Specialized). Sort of a cult following. If I had money to throw away, I would totally get the mpc. It is beautiful.
@@Sign_HeroAmerican here, I actively dislike Specialized, don’t mind Trek, and wouldn’t buy a Cannondale. I have zero regard for country of origin as I recognize that the whole industry is so global that it means nothing.
If you’re not in a large metropolitan area the nearest Specialzed or Factor dealer may be three hours away. I can order off the website and have any local bike shop work on it with out driving six hours round trip
Some people enjoy the adventure of ultracycling. There is a track of people who's first love was the outdoors, then they realized that biking was an amazing way to explore, then they got interested in doing it quickly. Personally, there is nothing that excites me about going to a street circuit and racing a bunch of chippy, soft handed, type A middle aged men. I get immense satisfaction from being able to bike through amazing areas while also challenging my limits. I enjoy overcoming the fears of being alone, being self-sufficient and managing logistics. I get a much more intense emotional response from this than I do from road racing. People are stoked about Lachlan's ride because he is a world class cyclist who also enjoys the adventure aspect. He's doing some insane shit and its awesome to see.
I cross shopped the SL8 and Ostro V2 for a couple months before settling on the Ostro in August. I am sure the SL8 would have been just as nice (if not better) but for the same price as an SL8 Pro (not S-Works) I could customize everything on the Factor (group-set, crank-length, wheel-set, bar width, paint, etc.). The other huge selling point on the Factor is that I could test ride one on a trip to LA from the Rapha bike shop. Riding that Ostro through the Santa Monica Mountain Canyons sold me on it more than anything else! Regarding the downtube flexing, my Cervelo TT does the same (and it is not even light), I had never noticed it before, so I don't consider it an issue.
25:22 I reckon the reason the price is no different is because they want you to go to a store and buy it. There would also likely be a commercial agreement in place that prevents them from being cheaper online
There's a place for FACTOR, they're like the Supreme of the bike world right now. The only person I know with a FACTOR is Sam at CCACHE, he's arguably one of the best dressed mechanics on the planet (the guy used to be a tailor so he knows a thing or 2 about fashion!). An S-WORKS SL8 frameset costs $9,500 AUD. I can afford one, but can't justify the price. The fact that I see at least 1 person riding one at Centennial Park EVERY SINGLE TIME I ride there (3 times a week) makes me somehow want one less and less.
"...An S-WORKS SL8 frameset costs $9,500 AUD..." I certainly didn't believe you, so I went and checked. You are right. I cannot believe it. Insanity at this point.
Funny. I’m probably a target audience for these ridiculously priced bikes (big law firm partner) but I bought a Giant Propel Advanced Pro (with Ultegra) because I just can’t justify more than $8k for a bike to be ridden by a MAMIL about 200-250 Kms a week. It’s great: better than any other bike I’ve ridden if I’m honest.
Bought a factor ostro V1 frameset at a reduced price as the new version came out. Spect it with ultegra di2 and dura ace crank since I wanted to ride larger chainrings. Put on some lighter chinese wheels in 60mm - I would never pay 3k for the black inc wheels. Its around 7.2kg now with pedals and everything. Could go lighter but I don’t care. Great bike I have to say! Only it was a quite harsh ride when I rode with the old wheelset and 25mm tires - I ride now 28mm tubeless, which opt for 30mm on the 32mm rims 👌🏻 total build still was around usd 8k. Also one thing to add since I swapp bikes every 2 to 3 years - in europe it‘s quite hard to sell a chinese frame. Better having a brand frame with some chinese parts, people care less or they don‘t have a clew anyways.
I personally own an s-works venge 2020 frameset and the carbon there flexes like crazy (if you squeeze it). I'd even risk to say that you could brake a tube with your hand just with a firm squeeze.
@@xVertOxit is expected to be that way if you want to save weight but it’s how stiff the frame that matters. You must understand how physics goes when it comes to the design of layering the carbon. If you don’t want any squeeze then titanium or aluminum frame is the way to go. My sl8 is stiff even if the frame flex.
I would agree generally on O'connor but his great attack with paret-peintre earlier this year on some climb in the desert is a good exception. Great attack
Factor absolutely support pro cycling. With respect, your argument not buying a Factor due to pro sponsorship is not watertight. The co-founder of Factor has come out sand said his prices would probably be lower if he did not sponsor pro teams such as IPT or Human Powered Health. However, he does believe that Factor customers want to support these pro-team endeavours. It's not Canyon's level of sponsorship with Belgium superstars, but Factor do their part.
The possibility of choosing handlebars, saddle setback and all this stuff when it comes to Factor is definetely a big + when compared to other brands, but honestly it should be a standard if not more when buying a top of the range bike. Even with Factor you cannot change chainrings or cassette and SL8 looks appaling when it comes to customization given the price. I don't say it should be a rule for every bike, it should a right that you have to pay for, but buying an almost 20k bike and then having to replace that many components is a farse
Additional costs: increased margin to compensate for risk and need for ROIC on investment into direct channel, local distributors and retailers extracting a pound of flesh in the form of likely service contracts for warranty and other work, or potentially local logistics, etc
Food for thought. I’d like to watch a Nero Show segment on the kind of “stealthy” Italian brands. Sarto, Basso etc. Not the industry standard Pinarello, Colonago, Bianchi etc. Look,Time and Wilier’ ~ What are they offering. what are the challenges to stay current and possibly surpass Pinarello? To me, Sarto has the looks of an SL7 Tarmac~ & Even from purely a bike perspective, what has the bike brand Cipollini done right? Derosa too. Thanks!
Yes please! Quite a few Basso bikes riding around recently…that would a great chat. Just not sure if you guys at Nero see the brands mentioned in your area…?
I bought a Factor Ostro V1 from the Australian distributor. I picked the spec via their website then they contacted me and arranged a time for a bike fit to make sure the frame size, seat post offset and stem length were right before I could actually order it. I’m Melbourne based.
Suggestion for next weeks chat -- cycling news just did a big tyre test (rolling resistance) and the results are super interesting, but not surprising. At least I found it interesting and thought they did the test fairly well from an experiment integrity point of view. Re: Factor- I think Ed Laverack is still riding one. Climbing beast that guy
Just checked both my Ostro and Defy and both deflect very slightly on the downtube. So I’m calling it normal. And yes my Ostro was fully customised to me. To do the same on an s works I’d either be buying frame only or paying a fortune to change bar and stem. Yes I could sell the bar that comes with it but I doubt there is much of a market for a 42cm bar in 2024
My wife loves her arm strap for the HR, she always hated the chest strap types that were part of her sports bra and really hated the chest strap by itself, but once she tried the arm strap, she was very happy. My chest strap died on me and I was waiting for my replacement to ship, so I used it..... I canceled my order and bought arm strap. It is fantastic. You can even wear them on your thigh if you want, its very accurate
I do believe that the continued pricing levels on high end bike for the consumer buyers, the direct Chinese bikes will start to take serious market share. Great conversation, thanks for sharing.
Once I went with an optical hr strap, hubbard strap apparently, I never went back to chest straps. No irritated skin anymore and yes, it is a bit cleaner as well. Accuracy is good too.
I bought a an SL8 Sworks frameset and built it up. It's sub 15lbs with Time pedals. I put Ultegra components and Farsports EVO S wheels. I got a discount on the frame as the team is sponsored by a local shop, but I'm 8400 USD all in. Not bad for an SL8 Sworks.
Bit disrespectful to the Israel Premier Tech team imo! As for pricing on Factor vs the rest, it all depends what country you're from. In the UK for instance, you'll pay £2.5k more for an equivalent build SWORKS SL8, and the top tier Canyon Aeroad CFR is only around £500 cheaper, and you can't spec your own bar/stem, crank length, chainring sizes, cassette etc... If you want a bike that everyone owns, buy one of the bigger brands. I'm happy riding a Factor, a brand I hardly see when out riding. Unfortunately that will change though!
Felt and Scott TT frames were squeezable. Carbon fibre springs are a thing so I wouldn’t be that concerned about flex in the walls. Loved the Attia interview review. Put it in perspective. The problem with the hubbard strap is if it doesn’t do hrv then the garmin doesn’t give you ftp. And you have to remember to charge it.
N.B: Factor online orders are fulfilled by your local distributor- who have to have the bike shipped to them and then build it up. You cant get one "shipped to your door"- i can be collected from the distributor or they will find a way to deliver it. At a cost.
FYI - Israel Premier Tech is in its best season yet with 26 wins, including Tour Down Under and Tour of Britain (6 WT wins). They're actually quite a formidable team this year.
@@ambulowan the bottom bracket on the Ostro is phenomenal. I smile every time I get out of the saddle on a climb. Not a single pedal stroke goes to waste. Stiff and immediate power transfer. That “feeling” makes it nicer to ride up climbs vs. my Cervelo R5 (which is a lovely bike).
It would have been nice to have a more extended discussion on possible safety measured in the wake of Muriel Furrer's passing. It's wild that people on club runs might have more safety here than pros. E.g. the Specialized helmet crash detection system, my phone does the same, my wife can see my live GPS on my Hammerhead. A simple rule change to make this mandatory for all riders would keep a level playing field as everyone would have the same weight disadvantage.
Direct to consumer going forward should be letting each buyer spec their components Pointless selling complete bikes when you have to buy new bar, stem, cranks and even saddle size
Love the show guys, but a. technical correction for you Jesse, there is no customs duty on whole bikes imported into Australia. Also if a business is importing bikes into Australia as trading stock, they'll get a full credit for the import GST, so that's not a cost either. Happy to point you to the law if you like.
Thanks for the clarification. So are you saying there will be no duty on both the bikes imported by the distributor and when you buy directly from the web?
A friend of mine just bought a 2024 Ostro VAM and the front fork started to delaminate! It was replaced under warranty as you would expect, but somewhat concerning QC!
I've been guessing wages are increasing at corporate levels and manufacturing. The developing world has become somewhat middle class. Agree - little change at retail level other than fewer outlets.
@@discbrakefan Because Canyon started as a “cheap” alternative to name brands and if they now increase their prices then people will just go buy name brands.
Spot on summary of sooky Remco. With the legs he had, if he and MvDP followed Pog, all that happens is the three of them ride together for another lap or two while their teams sit in the peloton doing nothing, then pog drops them and goes solo anyway.
factor australia will probably still have to pay import duties (at least we have to when we sell product manufactured in Asia in European markets), don't forget cost product packaging that is suitable for shipping a bike around the globe in (bulk packaging is way cheaper), factor will also have to provide call center capacity for any support calls, there are more costs we're forgetting. the D2C price is justified but unfortunately does not offer any benefit for the buyer. quite the contrary if you buy your bike in the shop it actually is easier to get support.
I think you’re overstating it. Cardboard and foam aren’t that expensive. It won’t add up to the markup a distributor and a retailer add on top. Canyons are mostly cheaper than other brands in Australia for similar specs.
@@discbrakefan R&D for the design of the box will also have to be factored in. granted the box itself will be rather cheap... still we're talking 50 bucks rather than cents. I engineer products for D2B, we manufacture in Asia, the costs add up extreeeeeeemly quickly. Any change in your supply chain any "duplicate" SKUs will cost you an arm and a leg. Heck, alone compliance will be so different when you start selling to private customers instead of businesses... plan on spending 20k on the lawyer just to find out WHAT product laws you have to comply with worldwide
My theory on the BMC is they wanted to make a hyper bike for Tudor cycling team. The cost to do that won’t be commercially successful, but they need to make it available to the public to satisfy TdF rules
I really rate armband heart rate monitors. Like Chris says, they are rechargeable and I have had one for two years now without having it fail. Previously, my chest straps would last around eight months before I got weird readings
I think the DTC thing could be for people who either don't live near a Factor dealer. And yea I think it's crazy that a $20K bike isn't completely customizable. That is part of why I don't bother with big name brands.
I own two Factors (VAM + Gravel) and bought both with end-of-year discounts direct from Factor for under $9k (Dura-Ace/SRAM Force). I was looking for custom and vs. the Melee at $15k, Factor was a no-brainer. I was out a couple hundred dollars at the LBS to complete the build but these are the two best bikes I've ever had.
On the direct-to-consumer being cheaper...I agree that from a consumers perspective this makes sense, however, since the manufacturer is already cutting away at the incentive for the customer to go to the retailer, if the manufacturer would then also start undercutting the retailer on price there would be even less of a reason for the retailer to remain in that relationship. By having the direct-to-consumer option, the manufacturer is probably already stretching the vendor/retailer relationship as far as they can up to the point where totally eliminating the retailer might become disadvantageous.
My Argon 18 Nitrogen you could squeeze the down tube and feel the flex. But a down tube works in tension like spokes and you can flex spokes. Probably not great for durability banging it around the garage but fine for the wide and flat side of a tube.
You would get interesting intel off Ben O. because he ran close to Pog for the Worlds. Ben would obviously know what he did, so working out Pog would be easy from there
Why isn';t there more outage about the tim that Swiss rider was laying on the side of the road ( somewhere) before her crash was noticed, and she was found and attended to and medi-vaced. I have readit was something like 90 minutes or more?
Israel premier tech have had a great year for performance, particularly early. Surpassed teams like EF, Jayco and Movistar on the UCI rankings. Don't know how you can call them a 'joke'.
Interestingly, I was speaking with a Northern Hemisphere dealer about getting a Seka Spear. He told me they use the same factory to paint their frames as Factor. Seka being a Chinese brand, why would they send there frames to Taiwan to be painted? Mentioned that there’s a 3 month wait for the colour-way I wanted due to this! On bike customisation, people need to look at Cabal bikes from South Africa. They fit you to the bike first, then you customise your frame etc, and build your bike for around 8k aud.
A few thoughts on the direct to consumer discussion: as someone who is over 1.5 hours away from any relevant store, which until recently were out of stock anyway, im not buying anything else but dtc. And if they undercut the retailers the Internet will riot against them. Your own podcast had made that point before And pricing has increased further because cycling is the new golf and wealthy people want to feel exclusive. That's why they find buyers for the premium bikes
@Jesse, I think the stores that do not offer any additional service will lose their meaning, but the passionate stores that gives you real and honest support in customization and choose of components will remain the reference for who is keen to pay 5k+ on a bike.
Ostro vam is a very good bike on tests. would still take a cervelo S5 ahead due to its incredible wheel drafting bonus it has over others, testing not completed by most apart from brands inhouse and some rollsroyce workers using rr test centre. the last sworks venge with the new aero bars still one of the fastest options in a straight line.
Factor is a proprietary layup and design made by them. I’m willing to guess the SL8 has some Specialized design language but has a helluva lot more Chinese off the shelf to it. And then a ton of marketing. Factor supplies Ceramic Speed BB and headset as standard.
It would be interesting if the Factor Rep was using the correct terminology and taking various taxes into account, (it's amazing how many don't) also remember the GOVT takes $1820 in GST before the bike shop makes any money The distinction between Margin and Markup is important @ 30% Margin of the retail price (ex GST) the bike shop is making $4971. But at 30% markup only $3800 Distributor $3500 vs $2950. These differences mean a landed cost difference of $9800 vs $8100 for Factor to take their costs out of. Its a significant difference
Arm hr defo better for indoor cycling as less cold/damp when you initially put it on. Polar verity sense works on forearm and bicep so I guess that one will also.
The international margins are quite high and the savings would not be as massive as you think. Just look at canyon bikes. I would suggest it’s a mere 10-15%. Marketing & sales teams ramp up costs tremendously. I googled them and did everyone forget: “Sounds like there will be a bunch of protests around the Israel Premier Tech in Australia, about Gaza, even though most of the team aren't from Israel.” This was from Reddit. A number of clubs I know are not willing to touch the bike due to this issue. Love your comment: “the Israel premier team is still a bit of a joke.” 100%! It is truly was an influencer bike but no longer on the right path, if they continue on this road I could see them failing in addition to the political folly. The better alternatives that we have in our club: Canyon Aeroad Scott Foil Ultimate SL7 or SL8
I had a guy show up on our ride last week here in southeast Michigan…he has a new ostro van. Loves it..but. Was disappointed with the weight 8kg. Has new seam red and zipps.
That's just disc brakes sadly. Back then you could get a dura-ace rim brake cervelo for 7.2kg for 8k. No integrated bar/stem, no crazy light carbon wheels etc. Good luck getting anywhere near that weight for under 10k.
He did use the prized custom paint job option…he calls it his “water melon”😂..it’s light green with a pink stripe down the middle. Maybe there was some extra weight from that. I worked at a bike shop for 20 years and I’ll always talking to an Orbea rep back then. He told me (back then, early 2000s) the frames were made in Asia but painted in Spain. The place in Spain ran very humid and the paint jobs on some frame would have to be done a few times to get them to look good…said in some cases it added hundreds of frames to a frame.
Aero testing would be everything on the BMC-R. If that is top 2-3 lightest climbing bike and the fastest aero bike and you got Gucci money. And you have some sort of relative Ftp to your club ride. Then yes you have to have
Jesse was very close with his numbers direct buy from manufacturer. August I got a Canyon Ultimate CFR - with Sram Red for just on 12k. Ordered it on Monday and it arrived from Cologne the next Tuesday. You could get same bike with Durace for maybe 13.5k - LBS wanted 17k for an older model Factor with ultegra. No decision really . Hard trying to persuade your wife to go for a 18 - 20k bike over a new kitchen....
I think Factor do encourage you to buy from your bike shop. You can’t get a discount from the website - you can from your bike shop …and they will build it.
The bike industry’s supply chain feels really inefficient, especially now when production costs are rising and brands are under pressure to make huge profits every quarter. I’m worried that this could push out honest, independent bike shops, as too much of the process is dominated by middlemen. Is this a blockbuster moment for bike shops?
When I bought my s-works SL7 from an LBS, they also threw in a bike fit, which led to us swapping out saddle post (with no set back) and longer stem at no cost to me. Also upgraded to their fancy 3d-printed saddle, and then credited me back the default saddle that came with the bike. Not sure how common this practice is, but gave me the feeling of full choice, with the added benefit of being able to touch and feel and experiment with the options before deciding. Not to mention my fav part about the LBS - the community. And if you buy a bike thru them, you’re one of theirs, and they take care of you. Really happy I went this route, and would 100% opt to buy via LBS again for next purchase.
Cheers for that comment man. I must admit I hear stories like this all the time, so I would like to think it is more common then we give credit for.
+1. I went through my LBS for a 2024 Ostro VAM for the same reasons. They do bike fits too, and that was actually the reason for me buying one. The spec (barstem, cranks) was perfect and it’s the most comfortable position of all my bikes (Cervelo R5, Caledonia 5, Canyon Grizl). My LBS offered swapping of components after the fact (if needed) for no additional cost. The long-term relationship of my LBS servicing the bike, the community, and supporting local small business all fall within the “value” category for me.
I am looking at the Factor and an S5. My hesitation for the S5 is getting a bar and stem combo that works. I would be pleasantly surprised if the Cervelo shop can get the 38/130 I want. I can’t find any of these in stock here in the US. Dealing with that headache vs checking the boxes for exactly what I want is very appealing.
I was in contact with a specialized dealer this week who said he could do the same as you describe here, but even swap cranks (175 -> 170), stem and bar width at no increased cost.
That's common for specialized dealers in the US, because of the 30 day return policy specialized has. Anything that was specialized / roval / praxis should fall under that policy.
On the subject of the $9000 BMC frame: in the early 2000s, when I was like 10 years old, I played some silly online game where you have a fish tank and you try and breed and sell fancy fish. At one point I discovered that if I just made my fish some absurd price like $3000, someone silly NPC in my fish store would still buy it eventually. Later I realized that is completely true in real life as well XD
Sorry, World Champs was amazing. It's not a boring chat, it was phenomenal race.
I second this, it is rare i get excited to watch 100km
@@mihpop9733 and it's fun to watch. If we can enjoy the best of the best dominate, people should start watching lower categories of sports.
@@debasishnayak8610 Also I do not get people that say things like 'turned off at 50k to go, because it was wrapped' like he never got more than 1:30 gap on Remco and Mathieu, its a 274k race at the end of the season, even though It's Pogi, he could collapse and he kinda half-did on the last lap, so there was tension all the way
@@debasishnayak8610Well yes, but this wasn’t total domination. He didn’t ride away and keep growing the gap. It was always within reach of the chasers. 34 seconds margin at the end is pretty close given he was away for so long!
@@discbrakefan agreed
1:12:36 VAM is something a lot of pros are using to compare. You don’t know the watts but VAM is a directly comparable metric. It isn’t gradient dependent. Just because you aren’t using it for Centennial Park doesn’t mean it isn’t being used. Even LRCP has talked about it when I validating riders/performances.
Own ostro V1 and now sl8. Both incredible bikes. Factor QC is better on the finish, stiffer bb. Sl8 weight, fit, and most of all, comfort and dampening is better than the factor carbon fiber. Sl8 frame is a lot lighter frame. Factor BI wheels make the ostro v2 light. Sl8 seems to jump under you as you slam the pedals. No one is better than the other, just a different vibe and riding feel.
Can you tell me about the difference in the BB's T47 on the Factor vs BSA on the SL8?
Also what do you mean by SL8 seems to jump?
The BB style is not as important as the size of the BB area.. factor is 3x size. But thr sl8 is no slouch. Plenty stiff for the size.
Also the sl8 being so light it jumps under up when your slamming onnthe pedals . Its light
Super interesting comment man. Fascinated by your thoughts on the Factor quality ... very interesting.
ruclips.net/video/0rADJz-oebw/видео.html
I got the new Ostro Vam recently. Factor sent the bike directly to me from Taiwan. I won't go into all the reason I got it directly, but it was mainly down to them making it easier to purchase than the local bike shops, particularly when you get the custom painted frame. The only real role of Factor Australia was that it have me someone to talk to around frame size and assembly. The reason it is the same price or higher than local bike shops is because they want local bike shops to support the product, so undercutting them on price is nota great idea..
Interesting you went straight from the web. Too be honest, I think I would do the same, especially given the potential of the custom paint option.
@@ChrisMillerCyclingMost Factor bikes I see here in New Jersey/New York were purchased online, despite there being one or two dealers. Anecdotally, of course.
I went through local dealer in nyc for ostro vam v1. Custom paint was only $500.
I have been happy with the bike. I find the ride to be quite comfortable for a race bike but I am not using factor wheels.
I think Lachlan’s ride is physically and even more mentally amazing, even coming from a racing background.
But the mental side is just trudging along at sub-zone2 pace and getting bored out of one's mind. It's just overcoming monotony, especially on those straight roads with just field around.
@@pl4free Although some people get into cycling to compete with other white collar dudes on a street circuit, some get into it because of the adventure. The bike is the best human powered means to experience the world, if you enjoy seeing the world then it wouldn't be boring to you.
The Lachlan situation is unique because he is a world class cyclist who decided that he enjoys the adventure.
@@maturtlelaza I know. I do both, but I still wouldn't call exploring riding for 10 hours on a straight road with the same type of landscape. If he wanted to explore, he would have taken some back roads, would have taken the time to do some detours etc. etc. It was still a pure how fast do I go from A to B with a support team
No one is paying $1200 to ship one bike. Jesse has no idea.
The boys don't wanna talk about Lachy or World Champs but will dedicate another half an hour to discussing a 50g weight difference between two bikes, ahaha
The boys are all over Lachy and the WC - the 2 most newsworthy cycling points of interest in the last 10 days and they both - in unison dismiss both of them. If they both backslapped TP and LM along with the rest of the cycling fraternity it would be band wagon jumping. Far more clicks or controversy in going the opposing view which they do. They are being controversial for a reason - you just don't know it yet.
The profit margins are so huge that Factor don't care if it's a shop or online purchase.
The bike industry is super hard. If you want to make money don’t get into the bike industry. So not really sure where you are coming from.
Lfg a nero show podcast for my wednesday coffee
Remco would be great to have on the show.
Was building up my SL8 pro frame around the time this Factor was coming out. Built out with Sub50 Limitless wheels (1360g) and managed to get a 38cm Rapide cockpit.
For the Factor, I do think the pricing is pretty good at the Ultegra level and probably around where I spent building out the SL8. I'm on my 4th racing bike and first Tarmac, but this thing blows away any other bike I've ridden, esp the acceleration and handling.
This is giving me a little bit of remorse of wishing I had been able to test the Factor (tho I'm not sure you really can). I also think the Factor looks a touch better in the right colorway, I love that you can customize. And I would have gotten 165mm cranks straight away too. Lot to like about this bike for sure.
Far from dissatisfied from the SL8 b/c it's head and shoulders a better riding experience than anything else I've ridden, but def interested in the factor.
You must try Giant TCT - better carbon frame and ride efficiency
Love the content guys, an absolute breath of fresh air! Keep it up! Love from Ireland.
Thanks so much!
The take on Factor is pretty reasonable but I think the credibility the brand has earned from Israel Premier-tech is being massively understated. Stevie williams is a respected rider who’s had a great season, Joseph Blackmore is probably the highest touted junior in the world, Derek Gee is a super talent who podiumed the Dauphine, they win grand tour stages every season… it goes on. Certainly not a joke performance wise and objectively better than many World Tour teams. I would encourage riders to sign for them over Ineos these days.
This. They've had a better season than a decent chunk of other established teams. I agree the Froome signing was probably a waste of money and not sure what hype it's really generated.
I think Mads Pedersen would be a great guest. Speaks his mind.
I have a VAM v2 with Red. I love everything about it and it's way more unique than the big brands. Everyone has an SL8 and to pay too dollar with no choices in color, or other components is a no go for me. With Factor, you're able to choose everything you need included in the price. There's real value in that.
From Canada, I ride a BMC Teammachine. Cannot say I see a whole lot of them riding around.
Most common bikes, anecdotally, are SL7/8s, Emondas and Madones. 🤷
Hey JC. Bit of love for IPT mate... Derek Gee wasn't too bad in the Tour this year...
Ps. The new Ostro is amazing! Not surprising it tests so well! 👍
Michael Woods has had some good results as well!
Komoot does same thing. When ride synced you are notified and then can add photos, titles, description and all the stuff.
57:28
… maybe discuss how good Tratnik was or how did he so quickly find out Tadej was solo behind so he knew to pull over? Discuss the key moments where the gap was close to 30s but why it went back out… or Ben’s finally getting the timing and move right…. Or how strong some lesser known rides went like Tom’s? Plenty to talk about.
Lachlan is supported in his ride around Australia. He has a motorhome with him. He's not sleeping in tents. He has a team helping him.
magic of marketing LOL
Pog was saying his heart is his engine, and he's tuned into it. Makes sense.
Brands set a recommended retail price (RRP) and that’s the price. Whether it’s sold online, in the brand’s own stores (assuming they exist) or an independent store won’t change the RRP. Of course the margin each channel generates will vary. That’s what happens when you have an Omni-channel selling model.
I ride BMC in the US. They are largely sold through independent bike shops here, and they are not super common (not like a Trek or Specialized). Sort of a cult following. If I had money to throw away, I would totally get the mpc. It is beautiful.
Americans like riding a American brand bikes Specialized, Trek and Cannondale 🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲
@@Sign_HeroAmerican here, I actively dislike Specialized, don’t mind Trek, and wouldn’t buy a Cannondale.
I have zero regard for country of origin as I recognize that the whole industry is so global that it means nothing.
If you’re not in a large metropolitan area the nearest Specialzed or Factor dealer may be three hours away.
I can order off the website and have any local bike shop work on it with out driving six hours round trip
Some people enjoy the adventure of ultracycling. There is a track of people who's first love was the outdoors, then they realized that biking was an amazing way to explore, then they got interested in doing it quickly. Personally, there is nothing that excites me about going to a street circuit and racing a bunch of chippy, soft handed, type A middle aged men.
I get immense satisfaction from being able to bike through amazing areas while also challenging my limits. I enjoy overcoming the fears of being alone, being self-sufficient and managing logistics. I get a much more intense emotional response from this than I do from road racing.
People are stoked about Lachlan's ride because he is a world class cyclist who also enjoys the adventure aspect. He's doing some insane shit and its awesome to see.
I cross shopped the SL8 and Ostro V2 for a couple months before settling on the Ostro in August. I am sure the SL8 would have been just as nice (if not better) but for the same price as an SL8 Pro (not S-Works) I could customize everything on the Factor (group-set, crank-length, wheel-set, bar width, paint, etc.). The other huge selling point on the Factor is that I could test ride one on a trip to LA from the Rapha bike shop. Riding that Ostro through the Santa Monica Mountain Canyons sold me on it more than anything else!
Regarding the downtube flexing, my Cervelo TT does the same (and it is not even light), I had never noticed it before, so I don't consider it an issue.
25:22 I reckon the reason the price is no different is because they want you to go to a store and buy it. There would also likely be a commercial agreement in place that prevents them from being cheaper online
There's a place for FACTOR, they're like the Supreme of the bike world right now. The only person I know with a FACTOR is Sam at CCACHE, he's arguably one of the best dressed mechanics on the planet (the guy used to be a tailor so he knows a thing or 2 about fashion!). An S-WORKS SL8 frameset costs $9,500 AUD. I can afford one, but can't justify the price. The fact that I see at least 1 person riding one at Centennial Park EVERY SINGLE TIME I ride there (3 times a week) makes me somehow want one less and less.
Supreme of the bike industry. I love this analogy. Surely this has to be a show topic ... "what fashion/clothing label is each bike brand?"
"...An S-WORKS SL8 frameset costs $9,500 AUD..." I certainly didn't believe you, so I went and checked. You are right. I cannot believe it. Insanity at this point.
@@ChrisMillerCycling Van Rysel is... Van Rysel! LOL.
@@ChrisMillerCycling
Giant - Levis Jeans
Canyon - Uniqlo
Pinarello - Balenciaga
Specialised - RM Williams
Funny. I’m probably a target audience for these ridiculously priced bikes (big law firm partner) but I bought a Giant Propel Advanced Pro (with Ultegra) because I just can’t justify more than $8k for a bike to be ridden by a MAMIL about 200-250 Kms a week. It’s great: better than any other bike I’ve ridden if I’m honest.
Bought a factor ostro V1 frameset at a reduced price as the new version came out. Spect it with ultegra di2 and dura ace crank since I wanted to ride larger chainrings. Put on some lighter chinese wheels in 60mm - I would never pay 3k for the black inc wheels. Its around 7.2kg now with pedals and everything. Could go lighter but I don’t care. Great bike I have to say! Only it was a quite harsh ride when I rode with the old wheelset and 25mm tires - I ride now 28mm tubeless, which opt for 30mm on the 32mm rims 👌🏻 total build still was around usd 8k. Also one thing to add since I swapp bikes every 2 to 3 years - in europe it‘s quite hard to sell a chinese frame. Better having a brand frame with some chinese parts, people care less or they don‘t have a clew anyways.
52 ostro v1, old red grouppo, evo5 wheels - 7.29 kg all in with heavy smp saddle
Remember the Durianrider sl7 squeeze test 😂
I personally own an s-works venge 2020 frameset and the carbon there flexes like crazy (if you squeeze it). I'd even risk to say that you could brake a tube with your hand just with a firm squeeze.
Mine sworks tarmac SL5 Rim brake has no flex on the squeeze whatsoever
No. Who watches his rubbish?
@@discbrakefanrim for road, disc for dirt. Disc brakes are for people who don’t know how to ride a road bike lol
@@xVertOxit is expected to be that way if you want to save weight but it’s how stiff the frame that matters. You must understand how physics goes when it comes to the design of layering the carbon. If you don’t want any squeeze then titanium or aluminum frame is the way to go. My sl8 is stiff even if the frame flex.
I would agree generally on O'connor but his great attack with paret-peintre earlier this year on some climb in the desert is a good exception. Great attack
Factor absolutely support pro cycling. With respect, your argument not buying a Factor due to pro sponsorship is not watertight. The co-founder of Factor has come out sand said his prices would probably be lower if he did not sponsor pro teams such as IPT or Human Powered Health. However, he does believe that Factor customers want to support these pro-team endeavours. It's not Canyon's level of sponsorship with Belgium superstars, but Factor do their part.
Enjoyable chat lads.
The Lachlan Mortan thing, I've seen two RUclips Shorts about it, and nothing else.
Reckon there will be a longer (high production values) doco after completion
@@paulw677his brother is filming the journey so I’d say so.
The possibility of choosing handlebars, saddle setback and all this stuff when it comes to Factor is definetely a big + when compared to other brands, but honestly it should be a standard if not more when buying a top of the range bike. Even with Factor you cannot change chainrings or cassette and SL8 looks appaling when it comes to customization given the price. I don't say it should be a rule for every bike, it should a right that you have to pay for, but buying an almost 20k bike and then having to replace that many components is a farse
Additional costs: increased margin to compensate for risk and need for ROIC on investment into direct channel, local distributors and retailers extracting a pound of flesh in the form of likely service contracts for warranty and other work, or potentially local logistics, etc
Food for thought. I’d like to watch a Nero Show segment on the kind of “stealthy” Italian brands. Sarto, Basso etc. Not the industry standard Pinarello, Colonago, Bianchi etc.
Look,Time and Wilier’ ~ What are they offering. what are the challenges to stay current and possibly surpass Pinarello? To me, Sarto has the looks of an SL7 Tarmac~
&
Even from purely a bike perspective, what has the bike brand Cipollini done right?
Derosa too.
Thanks!
I like this idea. Leave it with me.
Yes please! Quite a few Basso bikes riding around recently…that would a great chat. Just not sure if you guys at Nero see the brands mentioned in your area…?
@@ChrisMillerCycling Great segment~today10-9-24.
Thank you.
Awesome job guys, love the show
I bought a Factor Ostro V1 from the Australian distributor. I picked the spec via their website then they contacted me and arranged a time for a bike fit to make sure the frame size, seat post offset and stem length were right before I could actually order it. I’m Melbourne based.
Interesting. Thanks for that info.
Suggestion for next weeks chat -- cycling news just did a big tyre test (rolling resistance) and the results are super interesting, but not surprising. At least I found it interesting and thought they did the test fairly well from an experiment integrity point of view.
Re: Factor- I think Ed Laverack is still riding one. Climbing beast that guy
Marc Hirschi and Julian Alaphilippe will be on them DT Swiss wheels next year so well can't be THAT bad.
Would love to hear fellow RUclipsr Remco Evenepoel weigh in on the Worlds race tactical failures.
Just checked both my Ostro and Defy and both deflect very slightly on the downtube. So I’m calling it normal.
And yes my Ostro was fully customised to me. To do the same on an s works I’d either be buying frame only or paying a fortune to change bar and stem. Yes I could sell the bar that comes with it but I doubt there is much of a market for a 42cm bar in 2024
My wife loves her arm strap for the HR, she always hated the chest strap types that were part of her sports bra and really hated the chest strap by itself, but once she tried the arm strap, she was very happy. My chest strap died on me and I was waiting for my replacement to ship, so I used it..... I canceled my order and bought arm strap. It is fantastic. You can even wear them on your thigh if you want, its very accurate
ostro 2024 is a masterpiece. looks can be discussed but it rides like a dream
I do believe that the continued pricing levels on high end bike for the consumer buyers, the direct Chinese bikes will start to take serious market share. Great conversation, thanks for sharing.
we waiting for x-lab rs9 in EU :)
Once I went with an optical hr strap, hubbard strap apparently, I never went back to chest straps. No irritated skin anymore and yes, it is a bit cleaner as well. Accuracy is good too.
I bought a an SL8 Sworks frameset and built it up. It's sub 15lbs with Time pedals. I put Ultegra components and Farsports EVO S wheels. I got a discount on the frame as the team is sponsored by a local shop, but I'm 8400 USD all in. Not bad for an SL8 Sworks.
Bit disrespectful to the Israel Premier Tech team imo! As for pricing on Factor vs the rest, it all depends what country you're from. In the UK for instance, you'll pay £2.5k more for an equivalent build SWORKS SL8, and the top tier Canyon Aeroad CFR is only around £500 cheaper, and you can't spec your own bar/stem, crank length, chainring sizes, cassette etc...
If you want a bike that everyone owns, buy one of the bigger brands. I'm happy riding a Factor, a brand I hardly see when out riding. Unfortunately that will change though!
Felt and Scott TT frames were squeezable. Carbon fibre springs are a thing so I wouldn’t be that concerned about flex in the walls.
Loved the Attia interview review. Put it in perspective.
The problem with the hubbard strap is if it doesn’t do hrv then the garmin doesn’t give you ftp. And you have to remember to charge it.
N.B: Factor online orders are fulfilled by your local distributor- who have to have the bike shipped to them and then build it up. You cant get one "shipped to your door"- i can be collected from the distributor or they will find a way to deliver it. At a cost.
The point of having a halo priced model bike is to make your other bikes look like better value.
FYI - Israel Premier Tech is in its best season yet with 26 wins, including Tour Down Under and Tour of Britain (6 WT wins). They're actually quite a formidable team this year.
What do you guys think about Factor using T47 Bottom Bracket vs BSA on the SL7 and 8?
@@ambulowan the bottom bracket on the Ostro is phenomenal. I smile every time I get out of the saddle on a climb. Not a single pedal stroke goes to waste. Stiff and immediate power transfer. That “feeling” makes it nicer to ride up climbs vs. my Cervelo R5 (which is a lovely bike).
Im playing a drinking game, every time they say the word factor and it's not as the bike brand.... You drink!
Remco bit made me LOOOOOLLLLLL 🤣🤣
It would have been nice to have a more extended discussion on possible safety measured in the wake of Muriel Furrer's passing. It's wild that people on club runs might have more safety here than pros. E.g. the Specialized helmet crash detection system, my phone does the same, my wife can see my live GPS on my Hammerhead. A simple rule change to make this mandatory for all riders would keep a level playing field as everyone would have the same weight disadvantage.
I would love that new BMC Teammachine R Mpc🤤
in a size 54 … if anyone from BMC is reading this 😂
@ChrisMillerCycling thats my size too with 110mm long onepiece cockpit.. hahah
Direct to consumer going forward should be letting each buyer spec their components
Pointless selling complete bikes when you have to buy new bar, stem, cranks and even saddle size
Love the show guys, but a. technical correction for you Jesse, there is no customs duty on whole bikes imported into Australia. Also if a business is importing bikes into Australia as trading stock, they'll get a full credit for the import GST, so that's not a cost either. Happy to point you to the law if you like.
Thanks for the clarification. So are you saying there will be no duty on both the bikes imported by the distributor and when you buy directly from the web?
A friend of mine just bought a 2024 Ostro VAM and the front fork started to delaminate! It was replaced under warranty as you would expect, but somewhat concerning QC!
The front fork delaminated! WOW ... I have never heard of that.
If manufacturers go direct to consumers they price wouldn’t change! Why? Because the reason they went direct was and is to keep all profits ;)
Exactly!!
Exactly, the mark-up is somewhere else, not in the retailer XD
I've been guessing wages are increasing at corporate levels and manufacturing. The developing world has become somewhat middle class.
Agree - little change at retail level other than fewer outlets.
Yeah I guess that’s why Canyons are mostly cheaper than other mainstream brands…
@@discbrakefan Because Canyon started as a “cheap” alternative to name brands and if they now increase their prices then people will just go buy name brands.
New regular segment: Bubble Chat
Spot on summary of sooky Remco. With the legs he had, if he and MvDP followed Pog, all that happens is the three of them ride together for another lap or two while their teams sit in the peloton doing nothing, then pog drops them and goes solo anyway.
The U23 Race was amazing
factor australia will probably still have to pay import duties (at least we have to when we sell product manufactured in Asia in European markets), don't forget cost product packaging that is suitable for shipping a bike around the globe in (bulk packaging is way cheaper), factor will also have to provide call center capacity for any support calls, there are more costs we're forgetting.
the D2C price is justified but unfortunately does not offer any benefit for the buyer.
quite the contrary if you buy your bike in the shop it actually is easier to get support.
I think you’re overstating it. Cardboard and foam aren’t that expensive. It won’t add up to the markup a distributor and a retailer add on top.
Canyons are mostly cheaper than other brands in Australia for similar specs.
@@discbrakefan R&D for the design of the box will also have to be factored in. granted the box itself will be rather cheap... still we're talking 50 bucks rather than cents.
I engineer products for D2B, we manufacture in Asia, the costs add up extreeeeeeemly quickly. Any change in your supply chain any "duplicate" SKUs will cost you an arm and a leg.
Heck, alone compliance will be so different when you start selling to private customers instead of businesses... plan on spending 20k on the lawyer just to find out WHAT product laws you have to comply with worldwide
My theory on the BMC is they wanted to make a hyper bike for Tudor cycling team. The cost to do that won’t be commercially successful, but they need to make it available to the public to satisfy TdF rules
I really rate armband heart rate monitors. Like Chris says, they are rechargeable and I have had one for two years now without having it fail. Previously, my chest straps would last around eight months before I got weird readings
I think the DTC thing could be for people who either don't live near a Factor dealer. And yea I think it's crazy that a $20K bike isn't completely customizable. That is part of why I don't bother with big name brands.
Lachlan is most likely doing this in prep for an Around the World record attempt. 1:28:47
would be interesting to see if he can beat Mark, but it will be hard, unless he takes the risk and rides through Russia... difficult with the route!
59:00 the Strava update has also screwed up achievement labels and segment recognition. Hopefully they sort it.
I own two Factors (VAM + Gravel) and bought both with end-of-year discounts direct from Factor for under $9k (Dura-Ace/SRAM Force). I was looking for custom and vs. the Melee at $15k, Factor was a no-brainer. I was out a couple hundred dollars at the LBS to complete the build but these are the two best bikes I've ever had.
Factors are regarded as low grade in the Chinese market.
On the direct-to-consumer being cheaper...I agree that from a consumers perspective this makes sense, however, since the manufacturer is already cutting away at the incentive for the customer to go to the retailer, if the manufacturer would then also start undercutting the retailer on price there would be even less of a reason for the retailer to remain in that relationship. By having the direct-to-consumer option, the manufacturer is probably already stretching the vendor/retailer relationship as far as they can up to the point where totally eliminating the retailer might become disadvantageous.
Strava Stalking for a route is not weird.. but that sentence is 😂
Reminded me that I need to undertake the Coyle Calc on my bike
My Argon 18 Nitrogen you could squeeze the down tube and feel the flex. But a down tube works in tension like spokes and you can flex spokes. Probably not great for durability banging it around the garage but fine for the wide and flat side of a tube.
You would get interesting intel off Ben O. because he ran close to Pog for the Worlds. Ben would obviously know what he did, so working out Pog would be easy from there
I definitely think we need to see Chirs ride across Australia in a youtube series called "Welcome to Hell"
HAHAHA!!
Why isn';t there more outage about the tim that Swiss rider was laying on the side of the road ( somewhere) before her crash was noticed, and she was found and attended to and medi-vaced. I have readit was something like 90 minutes or more?
Israel premier tech have had a great year for performance, particularly early. Surpassed teams like EF, Jayco and Movistar on the UCI rankings. Don't know how you can call them a 'joke'.
IPT are a meme … sorry, they are not moving product for any brand. Ps. Yes, I have been very critical of Jayco
Interestingly, I was speaking with a Northern Hemisphere dealer about getting a Seka Spear. He told me they use the same factory to paint their frames as Factor. Seka being a Chinese brand, why would they send there frames to Taiwan to be painted? Mentioned that there’s a 3 month wait for the colour-way I wanted due to this!
On bike customisation, people need to look at Cabal bikes from South Africa. They fit you to the bike first, then you customise your frame etc, and build your bike for around 8k aud.
Pros can tell you a lot of interesting things, but not on camera =)
A few thoughts on the direct to consumer discussion: as someone who is over 1.5 hours away from any relevant store, which until recently were out of stock anyway, im not buying anything else but dtc.
And if they undercut the retailers the Internet will riot against them. Your own podcast had made that point before
And pricing has increased further because cycling is the new golf and wealthy people want to feel exclusive. That's why they find buyers for the premium bikes
@Jesse, I think the stores that do not offer any additional service will lose their meaning, but the passionate stores that gives you real and honest support in customization and choose of components will remain the reference for who is keen to pay 5k+ on a bike.
Ostro vam is a very good bike on tests. would still take a cervelo S5 ahead due to its incredible wheel drafting bonus it has over others, testing not completed by most apart from brands inhouse and some rollsroyce workers using rr test centre. the last sworks venge with the new aero bars still one of the fastest options in a straight line.
What is wheel drafting bonus?
@@ppawlows2000 has better aero gains holding the wheel over its rivals, previous Madone was the same.
Factor is a proprietary layup and design made by them. I’m willing to guess the SL8 has some Specialized design language but has a helluva lot more Chinese off the shelf to it. And then a ton of marketing. Factor supplies Ceramic Speed BB and headset as standard.
It would be interesting if the Factor Rep was using the correct terminology and taking various taxes into account, (it's amazing how many don't) also remember the GOVT takes $1820 in GST before the bike shop makes any money
The distinction between Margin and Markup is important @ 30% Margin of the retail price (ex GST) the bike shop is making $4971. But at 30% markup only $3800
Distributor $3500 vs $2950. These differences mean a landed cost difference of $9800 vs $8100 for Factor to take their costs out of. Its a significant difference
What HRM is that Chris?
Arm hr defo better for indoor cycling as less cold/damp when you initially put it on. Polar verity sense works on forearm and bicep so I guess that one will also.
Personally I love the Campy. And I’ve actually used it.
The new Super Record wireless?
The international margins are quite high and the savings would not be as massive as you think. Just look at canyon bikes. I would suggest it’s a mere 10-15%. Marketing & sales teams ramp up costs tremendously.
I googled them and did everyone forget:
“Sounds like there will be a bunch of protests around the Israel Premier Tech in Australia, about Gaza, even though most of the team aren't from Israel.”
This was from Reddit. A number of clubs I know are not willing to touch the bike due to this issue.
Love your comment: “the Israel premier team is still a bit of a joke.” 100%!
It is truly was an influencer bike but no longer on the right path, if they continue on this road I could see them failing in addition to the political folly.
The better alternatives that we have in our club:
Canyon Aeroad
Scott Foil Ultimate
SL7 or SL8
I had a guy show up on our ride last week here in southeast Michigan…he has a new ostro van. Loves it..but. Was disappointed with the weight 8kg. Has new seam red and zipps.
That's just disc brakes sadly. Back then you could get a dura-ace rim brake cervelo for 7.2kg for 8k. No integrated bar/stem, no crazy light carbon wheels etc. Good luck getting anywhere near that weight for under 10k.
That’s the weight of these new bikes. The scales the reviewers use are absolute BS: definitely calibrated with a kilo weight on them!
@@youtubesafename123 I got 6.8 kg for 500 bucks. Tons of rim brake bikes for firesale all over
8kg? What is causing the weight? It won't be the groupset and it's definitely not the frame unless it is 1.5kg!
He did use the prized custom paint job option…he calls it his “water melon”😂..it’s light green with a pink stripe down the middle. Maybe there was some extra weight from that. I worked at a bike shop for 20 years and I’ll always talking to an Orbea rep back then. He told me (back then, early 2000s) the frames were made in Asia but painted in Spain. The place in Spain ran very humid and the paint jobs on some frame would have to be done a few times to get them to look good…said in some cases it added hundreds of frames to a frame.
Aero testing would be everything on the BMC-R. If that is top 2-3 lightest climbing bike and the fastest aero bike and you got Gucci money. And you have some sort of relative Ftp to your club ride. Then yes you have to have
Jesse was very close with his numbers direct buy from manufacturer. August I got a Canyon Ultimate CFR - with Sram Red for just on 12k. Ordered it on Monday and it arrived from Cologne the next Tuesday. You could get same bike with Durace for maybe 13.5k - LBS wanted 17k for an older model Factor with ultegra. No decision really . Hard trying to persuade your wife to go for a 18 - 20k bike over a new kitchen....
I think Factor do encourage you to buy from your bike shop. You can’t get a discount from the website - you can from your bike shop …and they will build it.
I have the TMR and I want the MPC version.. no tire clearance for your 32's though. I wish I waited to be honest (agree with Jesse) it's a good deal
The bike industry’s supply chain feels really inefficient, especially now when production costs are rising and brands are under pressure to make huge profits every quarter. I’m worried that this could push out honest, independent bike shops, as too much of the process is dominated by middlemen. Is this a blockbuster moment for bike shops?
Yeah, but that's how all the money is made......Middlemen/ distributors taking a decent wedge for doing very little.
Factor don't have the O2 VAM anymore?
I think you guys should interview an ex pro other wise you’re just gonna get the media trained responses