This Tears of the Kingdom Dungeon is Awful
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
- Welcome to Bear Bites! It has taken me a bit, and I feel like it has been long enough to finally have this conversation. Today, I'm going to give my opinion on why a certain Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom temple is...well...not good...
Credits:
Writing & Voice Over: Nathan Murphy (Twitter: @theRealNRM)
Editing: Patrick Osborne ( @KamuiMiracle )
Artwork: The Sketch Fox (Twitter: @TheSketchFox), Starmax (@starmax1000) & Blast - Forever ( @BlastForever )
Gameplay Footage:
Special Thanks to the Following People/Channels for Gameplay Used in the Video...
BeardBeear - Tears of the Kingdom Playthrough
Gameplay Remastered - Tears of the Kingdom Playthrough
JeffsGameGallery - Breath of the Wild Playthrough
Kino Gaming - Tears of the Kingdom Weird Builds
Krow's Graveyard - Breath of the Wild Playthrough
NintendoMovies - Ocarina of Time Playthrough
Rubhen925 - Tears of the Kingdom Playthrough
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#videogames #tearsofthekingdom #legendofzelda #nintendo
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Playing the fire temple right, it’s pretty cool. As for using something other than mine carts, it’s no different than how you can break a shrine using runes mainly magnesis, it’s upgraded cousin ultra hand, stasis and recall.
Honestly I think it is a problem with the water temple too, but the fire Temple I really felt was so overcomplicated I actually felt "forced" to cheese it.
It pretty much reminds you about Ascend and flight on floor 1, and the tracks are much less obvious on the map so using them at all feels very... "Choose your own adventure storybook" where you eventually learn a dead end page number and just stop turning to it.
I went through it 3rd after Tulin/Mineru and honestly can't say I ever figured out some areas connections legitimately, Yunobo sucked so bad with ramps I had to make full bridges just to fire point blank and tracks that just derail you in the middle of nowhere mean you either reset losing progress or cheese a selected objective starting from somewhere you weren't expected to start from, which the other temples just have straight paths.
I think the only way to avoid this would have been to go top-down instead of bottom-up, much as the Spirit Temple did.
I’ve played 30 hours and only did 1 temple, I just like flying around and making monsters go boom 😁
In all honesty, that’s the truest Tears of the Kingdom experience right there
Which temple?
Yeah thinking about it, this is the dungeon I "cheesed" the most, I ended up climbing a fair bit to reach areas (I got confused by the minecart tracks, prob a flaw on my part), but great video overall!
Would be neat if you talked about what you think was the best/better dungeon in the game 👀
Perchance 👀
Yunobo imbalanced my minecart and threw me right into the lava, then he shot me in the chest with a rifle
HE TOOK THE KIDS!!! 🐻❤️
For me it was like when you open a “terms of service” and you see that giant wall of text and brain shuts off so you just click okay.
As soon as I saw that minecart maze I just didn’t feel like exerting the brain power to understand it and just climbed the whole temple.
I mean that’s what happens when the design is lazy: the players will naturally just take the path of least resistance and not learn anything lol.
why? like.... arent you playing the zelda game to interact with the dungeons?? why do yall play games and give in to lazyness instead of having fun? Fire temple was literally my fave in the game bc I .... actually played it? Am I really in the minority here?
This game is about freedom, I agree in the main dungeons they should restrict us more but like since they dont..... let's just be responsible with the freedom we're given? That seems pretty easy to figure out for me, I interact with the game I payed for like it's intended, I get to enjoy it, no big problems. Sometimes I get lazy too but its with small things, and I don't get to complain after, bc it's clearly a choice I made
@@suaviduds depends. I just really wanted to complete the main game and find out the story and everything. If a certain part of a game seems like a hassle or tedious, then people will want to skip it.
In regards to dungeons/temples… a lot of people don’t feel like these compared to how temples were in the main zelda games from 1998-2011, and I think for some, they just wanted to get the temple over with as fast as possible.
It doesn’t make the game bad overall, or the players bad. It’s just something that didn’t mesh right for a lot of people.
A similar thing is with the widespread popularity of people utilizing the duplication glitches. I hadn’t even heard of the glitches until I got to the gerudo section and I wanted to buy outfits but had almost no money, so in searching for methods to make money fast, I stumbled upon all the glitch methods people were using.
TOTK made it too hard to get money, and certain things take way too long, so some people would rather glitch and get the things they want faster, rather than adding an extra 50 hours of playtime to get something.
For the next game, the developers should contemplate on why so many decided to cheese the fire temple, or why so many people were looking for duplication glitches, and then fix those problems in the next game.
@suaviduds I want to preface that while I disagree, I think your play style and experience is valid. However, I don’t think throwing bad design and making it a fault of the player is the most constructive thing. Playing a game with one arm behind your back isn’t fun and (assuming this part) not intend by the designers. If the cards on the table, it’s fair game ya know? Purposely ignoring that kinda derails from the issue of it being there in the first place. 🐻❤️
I saw the fact that I didn't have to use the carts as a plus. Climbing isn't free, you still need to have done a significant number of shrines to get the stamina, or mixed enough stamina elixers/food, or found the climbing gear. Or you could just make a hoverbike from capsules in your inventory and bypassed it all. I saw those tracks with multiple paths and changing pathways and thought "Nope. Not fun. Skipping this." Giving players options is not bad design.
I think having options is great, don’t get me wrong. Like the other 3 dungeons do a perfect job at doing this. But with that said, it’s a balance. A good dungeon should have you interact with the rules while also allowing for critical thought. I just feel the fire temple tipped the scales too far on one side. 🐻❤️
Good job with the vid! I’m still on the Fire Temple lol that thing’s long as hell
Thank you 🐻❤️
This was the first temple I did and being that I'm not huge on building, I just used the carts and it was fine. Although for one of the bells I definitely just climbed and ascended until I got there (so I guess you made your point).
I didn't hate the fire temple that much. I found the carts confusing so I appreciated the option to find different alternative ways of getting through the temple.
I see the point that you're making and do agree to a point, but I also feel like this argument could also be used for the other dungeons as well. You don't NEED to use the bubbles in the water temple, just make a flying machine from zonai devices like you did in this video (and I'd also argue Sidon is used even less for his temple since splash fruit are easily available especially around the zora). You don't NEED to use the light beams in the lightning temple, just go for dazzle fruit instead, and making a flying machine takes a good chunk of difficulty away from the wind temple too. Still gonna subscribe bc this is a good video though, these are just some thoughts I had while watching
I think you make a valid point, but I feel that some of those aren’t as plain as day than the Fire Temple. For those temples, it seems like to “cheese em” you have to have some brain power. For the Fire Temple, it was really obvious. But I understand players experiences will be different.
@@BearBitesShow Fair point there, I will admit using the minecarts a bunch did feel more tedious compared to the other temples. No ill will meant on my end, and I hope your channel grows at the pace you want!
I also wasn't a fan of the fire temple, but mainly because the whole thing just felt like a giant maze to me, which is the last thing I want in a zelda dungeon
Baller video
Thanks for editing this one 🐻❤️
No idea how the fire temple is supposed to be solved. Those carts and tracks are a mess. I just used ultrahand+ascend and climbed.
Lol I personally loved the fire temple quite a lot! It was my second favorite dungeon behind the Lightning temple 😅
Lightning temple was my favorite too so at least we are on the same page there 🐻❤️
Really good and all around entertaining video first off. I havent reached the fire temple yet so my opinion isn’t the most grounded, but I kinda want to disagree. I feel like you can “cheat” in the other temples as well. The fact that there are multiple ways to go about things is part of what makes the game so good to me. But I’ll find it out for myself once I get there
Absolutely valid take. But what I’ve come to find that the amount of “cheesing” upfront in the fire temple vs the other temples is night and day. However, I always encourage to experience it yourself 🐻❤️
I feel like what you're viewing as a bug, I'm viewing as a feature.
Can you skip past some of the Fire Temple puzzles? Sure. You can also rocket jump some of the shrines. Others you can't. They force the solving of the puzzle.
The developers allowed it because it makes sense. Gorondia was originally a city. It wasn't built with link in mind. If it was real life you'd probably try walking across the mine cart track too. If you could warp into a room from the floor below, or paraglide in from above, why hunt for a random key?
I'm just saying that, to me, it doesn't feel like a flaw, it feels like an opportunity to showcase just how special link is and how exceptional his powers are.
I’m gonna be real here, that is such an interesting and unique outlook on this. I give you props for that, like truly 🐻❤️
To me, the water temple is by far the worst of the whole series by far!
I'm subbing, how do you have so little subs
Thank you for the sub 🐻❤️
Fire temple is my second fave. Water sucked!
I’m one of the few who didn’t like BotW at all. I think it was way over praised.
I agree the Fire Temple is the weakest one of the entire game but I don’t think it’s the worst thing ever.
Once I stopped trying to use the tracks to navigate, it was a bit better. It actually made it more tolerable and enjoyable to me
I feel like as a designer, the moment breaking a dungeon becomes more fun than the dungeon itself, you gotta ask yourself on what went wrong and adjust. But that’s a personal thing, and I’m glad you found it fun when doing that. Also not liking BotW is a take I gotta respect even with differing opinions since you don’t hear it often 🐻❤️
@@BearBitesShow that’s fair for sure! Although I was not a big fan at all of BotW I am loving Tears a million times more
I mean TotK is objectively a better game by all metrics lol 🐻❤️
"you can optionally ignore the entire dungeon, therefore the entire dungeon is bad!" stopped watching right there. I don't think you can really justify saying a dungeon is bad because you ignored the entire concept of the dungeon. The idea of applying a tool you gained outside of the dungeon inside of the dungeon is used within the fire temple more than any other dungeon in totk. Yunobo is usable in combat, rock breaking, minecart track switching, and a handful of his gong buttons are puzzles in of itself. I don't think it's fair to say this dungeon is bad for not gripping you by a leash and controlling your undisciplined gamer brain; you can cheese half of the dungeons in the entire zelda series, so by this video's standard all of those dungeons are actually atrocious because it didnt force me to think in the box.
Every play session experience is different (especially with different players), this is just what I experienced. I think that the fact you can even do that in the first place is bad design, especially when comparing it to the other 3 temples which are leagues better. 🐻❤️
I love the fire temple, its vast and dark, quite an intimidating feeling, but if you follow the minecarts it all clicks and theres some neat puzzles for switching tracks and problem solving with zonai devices. I bet skipping all that is a boring and confusing experience tho so I totally get it!
Honestly if we are judging the temple off of aesthetics I’d have to give it the A+ on that for sure 🐻❤️
To be fair, the minecarts are almost always going to be a faster means of traversal to point B than climbing a wall; even with a piece of climbing gear on, and/or with high stamina
Fair enough. But the fact that the carts are optional and nothing is really lost from not doing it really isn’t good design
165 hours into my playthrough and on my way to 100% here 🤚
When i played this dungeon there was something so off about it for me that i couldnt really put my finger on until watching this video, and now i understand my frustration.
Totk is full of different ways to cheese everything. The designers have even said they took alot of inspiration from cheating, because cheating is fun. However... everytime i have "cheated" in a shrine of while defeating a boss, it made me feel smart. I could see the way the game wanted me to do it, but the way i wanted to do it was so much cooler and more practical. Big emphasis on PRACTICAL. I felt like i was outsmarting the game and felt good doing it. But in this dungeon. There was no satisfaction in cheating. I didnt feel smart for figuring out a different way to do things, i felt frustrated trying to figure out the intended way and felt even more frustrated because the "cheating" wasnt satisfying or practical. Climbing everything and building zoni flying machines didnt make things quicker or easier or satisfying. It was just easier than solving the puzzles.
Every other time ive cheesed anything in this game it has felt like a clever little short cut. But in this dungeon is felt like the long way round for stupid people. It was the only time the game didnt reward you for cheating with practicallity or speed.
Lastly. I think the second thing that wasnt mentioned here that made a massive difference with this dungeon was the minecarts themselfs. When they are used at any other point in the game, they are full of excitment and mystery. You are racing at high speeds to an unknown location, you never know what you might find at the end of the track. And for me, thats what made the minecarts so fun, it was going head first into unknown territory.
When they are used in this dungeon however, i know exactly where im going to end up. At a platform... with some more tracks. There was no sense of wonder, i could see where i was trying to go. Making the carts just an annoying obstical rather than a tempting mystery ride.
Apologise for the length of this comment, but your video just made me realise i was alot more angry at this dungeon than i previously thought 😅
Absolutely fantastic comment. Couldn’t agree more 🐻❤️
@@BearBitesShow would love to hear your thoughts on the "I need to reach my friend" koroks. Thats the other part of the game I've found myself not really enjoying. In Botw I loved doing the koroks, they were fun little puzzles I could do on my way to something bigger. But now. I find myself pinning these backpack koroks and thinking "ugh... I have to go all the way over there? I'll do it later" and now that I'm on my way to 100% I'm thinking "might aswell get this out the way". I love the distraction element of totk where you start doing one quest and then find yourself half way across the map doing 6 other things, it feels super adventurous and immersive. But when the game is forcing me to go alllll the way up this hill, or alllll the way across this stream, i find myself not enjoying it as much. There's no curiosity thats encouraging me, no prize other than a seed. Its just "go all the way over here and then come back again to keep doing what you were doing"
Everyone else seems to love them, but I just don't see why?
On your second point I do have to agree: ___'s island, within a large cave system to the northwest of death mountain accomplishes the "minecart puzzle" idea a bit better than the majority of the Temple.
Rather than easily being able to shield surf (or walk, if you don't have stick drift and you're very careful), you cannot reach the majority of the rails if you lose your cart (too high up); they are also just more treacherous to traverse in general.
You can skip one of the final sections, but the area heavily punishes you for the attempt; archers, boulders, fire keese, etc.
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I personally enjoyed goofing around DK country style, but I agree the mechanics were very under utilized.
Just look at spirit tracks for good examples of how to use almost the exact setup 😅
Love and Peace folks.
When I did the fire temple, I legitimately had no idea how the hell I was supposed to get where I needed to be, on the mine carts. I was frustrated that I couldn't figure out how they wanted me to solve it, and I circumvented it all by climbing, gliding, ascending through floors, etc. I agree, it was a bad experience. But I had some bad experiences in other temples too - I got through a wall of flame just fine in the water temple, only to find that wasn't the challenge. The challenge was to get my fish buddy through a wall of flame, and for some dumb reason, he couldn't walk under the hoverstone just like me. And then I had no idea what I was supposed to do. For some reason, I tried pressing the button, and it didn't do what I thought it did, etc. It was frustrating. And there were similar problems with Riju. I would get past some challenge, only to discover she couldn't follow, for the stupidest reason.
the minecart maps was really annoying to keep track of. and even some of the map design itself confused the hell out of me, that i just ended up ascending wherever i could and gliding to chests and unexplored areas whenever i could. it's fun to solve something the unintended way, but the fire temple has too much freedom in comparison.
also yunobo's ability is helpful, just not very satisfying to use. i end up having to chase him, and i activate anyone elses' ability
I feel like this video belies a fundamental misunderstanding. All of the temples can be solved in broad ignorance of their mechanics either by using climbing/gliding, zonai devices, or ascend and ultrawinding. The other temples don't see as much of this though because they're better designed to both communicate with players what their next steps should be, and how to achieve those things. People climb and glide through the fire temple instead of engaging with its puzzles because the mine tracks in the fire temple don't always lead in easily discernable directions, and its puzzles involve more frustrating and time-consuming back-tracking. The combination of time and mental investment it would take to do the fire temple correctly means that as soon as people realize they don't have to, they choose not to. The other three temples aren't done 'correctly' because they can't be solved with other exploration and mobility methods, they're done 'correctly' because doing so is enjoyable.
I guess I could have been more clear, but this is kinda what I meant by saying that the dungeon isn’t conducive to the mechanics present. Of course exploration and testing is present in all 4 dungeons, but the fire temple has this tick that makes it hard to play by its rules. Probably could have went into more detail on this 🐻❤️
yeah that's why i prefer the fire temples to the rest, i found most of the temples too easy but at least i had to think harder on the spatial 3D of the fire temple. Plus they keep giving you the spot where to go on the map which makes everything a bit too easy i think. Overall i find all the puzzles (shrines + temples) from totk way easier than in botw
I still haven’t played TOTK but I do think it’s impressive that this is only a problem with one dungeon. A common challenge in game design is figuring out how much freedom you should give the player versus how much you want to give them a specific experience and play by certain rules. I can definitely see this being an exponentially difficult challenge in a game like TOTK and I think it’s commendable that this dungeon was one of very few major oversights in the game’s design.
I actually really liked this temple, but it was definitely because I chose to play it like a traditional dungeon and didn't allow myself to climb.
I did a paraglider-less run and I think because of that the fire temple was actually my favorite dungeon. It felt super traditional and I loved using all the tracks to get around. Plus I left in the middle of the dungeon to cross the lava sea and light up the lightroots so I could see everything. I think I get where you're coming from, but personally I loved it!
I’m glad you loved it! Always glad to hear when people can get good experiences out of stuff even when I can’t 🐻❤️
You say that you don't have to use the minecart tracks as intended because you can just walk, climb and glide. But I didn't find it simple like that at all. I had to backtrack a lot and redo the track alignments a lot to finally figure out where I needed to even go.
For me, I just followed the mini map and climb and ascend until you got to the right area. Gliding would cover so much ground that I could kinda guess correctly where the gongs were 🐻❤️
I tried to solve the dungeon as intended, but I got to a point where those Minekart tracks didnt make sense to me, so I climbed :) But still it was more fun than the water temple
Water temple from TotK or OOT? Regardless, I’m glad you found some fun in it 🐻❤️
I had to cheat most of the fire temple.
The thunder temple was my favorite though. Felt like a proper dungeon
Lightning temple FOR THE WIN! 🐻❤️