A Starship Civilian's Life
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- Опубликовано: 28 авг 2024
- Star Trek the next generation introduced the concept of having entire families on board a vessel alongside a large presence of non Starfleet personnel, so what exactly do they do on board a Starship? The Enterprise D had plenty of room and activities aboard it from teachers, to labs, recreational areas, Ten Forwards and so on. Even barbers, so what was life like for your average citizen of the UFP on such a vessel?
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This Video is for critical purposes with commentary.
Don’t forget the importance of having a tailor aboard
A plain, simple tailor.
Who definitely doesn't have links with a shadowy order.
A cobbler, if you as the Tal'Shiar.
;)
Cardassians are great tailors.
And also a Barber 😂
Imagine poor Doug attempting a subspace board meeting and then having to leave bc “sorry, another Red Alert. It’s been the third one this week…” 😅
I gather that's how a lot of people felt during air raids. Annoyed at the interruption rather than afraid.
"This meeting so useless! This could've been an email! I wonder if I can fake a Red Alert to get out of this..."
Ugh...I HATE when that happens!
Oh my god 😂
"Let's all just take lunch now, we'll reconvene in an hour. Good luck Doug."
Imagine the multiple time-loops they went through in TNG and how that would mess things up. "Doug! Where have you been? You just stopped reporting in to work for a week."
I've been rewatching TNG and I've noticed that during the Ten-Forward scenes there are certain civilians that you see again and again, but you never see these people anywhere else on the ship. It's like they just in the bar all day, every day.
I think you've just uncovered the main job of civilians aboard: background extras. They help make the ship look more like a city and less like a fragile bottle of air drifting in the void. That's a necessary feature to keep the crew from going mad.
Well, any large enough community will have its share of barflys.
So just regulars like real life?
Where everybody knows your name
To be fair, given the storylines are normally focused on the Starfleet crew, you only see civilians on rare occasions. Like when visiting the barbers etc.
I'd imagine there's whole areas of the Enterprise-D devoted to mainly civilian activities.
Ten Forward being the melting pot where there's free mixing.
It's also possible that some of them are off-duty Starfleet personnel choosing to wear civvies in their downtime.
Of course, it could also be that some of the apparent civilians in Ten Forward were actually limited holograms to provide background ambience to the venue... 😁
Being a military brat growing up, I essentially viewed life on a Galaxy Class (and more accurately DS9) to that of living on a base, whether state side or overseas; the only difference is that we weren't facing world ending dangers on a weekly basis.
Same.
oh man that "world ending dangers" caught me XDDD
In watching this video, it just occurred to me that civilian life on a Star Fleet vessel is similar in some forms to civilian life now in an overseas military base.
Very much so.
They did a good job of showing it. Especially with the O’Brien family, and with Jake.
Yeah but the base won't storm the beach on D-Day.
Hmm. I do wonder who runs the similar positions on a modern aircraft carrier? Civilians, or military?
@@kevinramsey417 Going by Encounter at Farpoint, I think the original idea was that the saucer would separate if the crew had to go something particularly dangerous. However they ended up rarely actually doing it, probably because of behind-the-scenes production reasons.
I know it's hip to poo-poo the idea of the interior aesthetic of the Big D as well as the idea of "civilians" aboard but can I just say two big things:
1. It speaks to the very philosophy of the society of the Federation and post scarcity Earth culture that "family" and our culture, all of the cultures that make the fabric of the Federation are taken with us as we chart the greater unknown and meet new sapient life. It also shows an evolution of Starfleet culture as long distance missions will be better for the psyche of Starfleet personnel if not only the facilities at hand are spacious and comfortable with amenities for the body but also the soul. Loved ones and partners coming with make for better balanced officers. And the jobs civilian members do not only free up Starfleet for mission priority work there would inevitably be the creation of community which in turn would break down into sub-communities. It's why we see all this group events aboard, all the music, plays, the sporting activities. And logically there would be more. We see poker night is a big deal with the command staff. I'm sure there's book clubs and people getting martial arts certification, botanical enthusiasts, probably D&D and philosophy studies, and all that is because you have barbers, teachers, athletic coaches, artists, dancers, food service, from all over Federation member worlds in a bustling city in space setting. It allows crew to remain grounded to where they come from and it presents the Federation in the best light by having well adjusted people working under well adjusted commanders and we have a ready made example to showcase our culture and the individuals it produces.
2. Also... Because WE CAN do this in the 24th Century. I know it works dramatically to always highlight the dangers of space travel and whatever particular threatening forces from the franchise in modern storytelling. And it tracks that even Trek has absorbed some of the general pessimism of the culture, sometimes for good, but it can eject some elements that are part of Trek that aren't about "rationality" or "realism". It's the 24th Century and while mankind is nowhere near to Godhood we have enormous resources and have come up with efficient methods to create systems that WORK to provide for all. The technologies available are staggering in implications compared to even our most cutting edge ideas in the real world of today. Not gods, no, but we have been able to truly harness some of the fundamental forces of the universe to our liking. Medical technology is at its peak. I think the Galaxy class was outrageous because it imagined something from a time and place ALIEN to our understanding and that aspect is lost these days to just making Starfleet a defacto military force when judging from the conception of the D in TNG it really would be so much stranger to us if it were real. It literally is the expression of a culture that put self good and self exploration at the front equally alongside actual real world exploration of the universe. I don't think it's supposed to feel "practical" to our world as it is now, that's the point.
The DoD calls this Total Force. Each service comprises active-duty members, reserve members, National Guard members, civilian personnel, and contractor personnel. While the civilian personnel and contractor personnel may not wear the uniform, they still support the mission. This is the same concept in Star Fleet. The dependents or families of the uniform members get to move with them to their duty station but do not get to go on the ships with them.
The civilians on the ships also remind me of the camp followers of the armies of a few hundred years ago. Each army needed barbers, laundry services, merchants, and some family members would follow as well.
I was thinking of civilian base personnel, but perhaps it's more like an Aircraft Carrier.
Yes, While I was in the Navy and serving on board Carriers, there were always Civilian tech reps on board from Raytheon, Lockheed, and other companies to support maintenance of the systems that the Navy bought from those companies. The shop I worked in generally had a couple different tech reps at any given time, they were very capable, technical, knowledgeable and helpful on their systems they were there to help with. I learned how to play guitar by taking lessons from one of the tech reps during one of the cruises I was on, on the USS Forrestal. They were good people.
@@deanlawson6880 My wife keeps seeing jobs for the carriers to run the SAPR program on ship as a civy.
I liked The Orville’s explanation of a post scarcity society encouraging people to do things to improve their reputation. I imagine being on a ship where you can go in the magic room and learn how to cook from best chefs on any Federation world would be a hell of a way to spend your spouse’s deep space assignment.
Iv never bought this explanation, in this scenario how do you get a home and its location , in the second last episode the crew are at a gathering at Kelly’s fathers that she inherited so that means in some way there is ownership so how can a waiter that is the best waiter ever get an opportunity to get a house overlooking the beach with an ocean view , in our world you get it by having more money than the other bidder on the day .
post scarcity does not mean no property. Quarks makes it clear commerce still exists it just that the necessities are considered a given, heathcare, food, housing, communication. But as pucard vineyard shows you can strive for. More
When you have a machine that can do it for you
@splashpit I always thought of it as how he said in the Orville; Your wealth is determined by your determination. Kelly's father likely did some work that contributed more than someone who decided to lounge around all day simply being entertained. Everyone has the basics, but if you go above and beyond you get more.
I had come to mention this very concept, and quite like it as an explanation for work ethic in a post-scarcity society.
I was in the military for a while, and when transferring to basis officers will often find themselves moving their families with them. Often times the military would take in their skills and would find jobs for them and give them preference while on the base. And if there was nothing they had the option to do their own thing, often work in some sort of support service or get training and work for the military as a civilian. I would assume it works the same in Starfleet.
but to take the familys to the unknown as in star trek is unlogic and irresponsible. You surely would not have moved your family to a FOB in Iraq or afganistan.
In star trek they do not even bother to evacuate the civilians from the ships before knowingly going into battle… for example put them on an nearby M class planet for the time of battle.
For example the background story of Sisko seen in DS9 first episode is a total brainfart. They KNEW they would encounter a borg qube and were aware that it would basically be a suicide mission for majority of the fleet, but still they thought „hey, bring your families with you… what could go wrong?!?“ 😂
@@pt3800 No, in the real world you wouldn't, but there is an irony in Star Trek which is actually brought up best in DS9 Episode the Maquis. There, Sisko gets pissed off when Admiral Nechayev basically told him to bring back the Maqui settlers and Sisko goes off on how Earth is a paradise, so much so that leadership is disconnected from the realities of their frontier regions. So the show is aware of the situation, even Starfleet to a point. But we the viewers are looking at this with the Borg and the Dominion in mind (not to mention the random disaster of the week the Enterprise faced). On average, and this has been mentioned, most ships had a pretty boring existence. They went about their lifetimes barely even using their shields. The Federation at the time was so massive, it took years to cross. Its reasonable to assume that, even the second Borg invasion was barely news on the Federation's outer rim. This is why Federation membership was so desirable. Sure, they had enemies, but overall, it was a peaceful existence. The post-movie era moving into the beginning of the TNG era, and up to the Dominion war was literally a golden age. Also, many Federation ship's doubled as colony transports, so it made since. The risk was taken because it wasn't seen as a risk...until it was.
I suppose it makes more sense than a random Bolian deciding he wants to wait tables in a restaurant sucked by black holes every other Wednesday. Maybe it is folks who were in for a 4ide anyway.
They probably offer a lot of trainings to interested civilians. Want to learn to be a shuttle pilot? Sign up for the ships training program with the chance to be offered contractor work for the ship when needed.
This is one of those videos that you didn't know you wanted, but is absolutely satisfying when you see it. 👍
I seem to remember in the episode "Up The Long Ladder" there's a line of dialogue where Riker says the ship mainly "cleans itself".
Whether that's reference to a combination of air filtration and specialist materials and coatings that help keep things clean or there's a small army of robotic Henrys vacuuming isn't made clear. 😁
I always figured that it's the same thing as whatever the sonic shower does, just on a bigger scale and run section-by-section on a regular schedule.
Star Trek predicted the Roomba.
I always assumed it used transporter tech to dematerialise dirt and contaminants. But I don’t have a problem with Discovery’s saying they just have super-Roombas.
Riker also claimed not to understand how the "foot washing" was going to work. I don't always take Riker at his word. The guy is a bit shifty.
4:30 To further illustrate Guinan's benefit, look at Voyager were Neelix transform the Captain's private dining area for honor guest to everyday mess hall for the crew to improve moral for the long journey back home
*improve morale
@@PatGunn I stand corrected, thanks ^_^
I’m pretty sure that the mess hall was already there, and the captain’s private dining area was turned into a kitchen. As much as I may not want to defend Neelix in any way, to be fair, with replicator use rationed, that actually was kind of necessary. He still should have asked first, though.
Neelix is a vastly over-villified and underrated character, and Ethan Phillips was phenomenal in the role. He's a natural peacemaker who regularly turns himself into the butt monkey to give the crew an outlet for their frustration. They even gave him a backstory to justify his personality (being the object of abuse being _penance_ for his cowardice during the war and _befitting_ of an ex-con taken in by the Voyager crew).
A lot of depth below the surface, is what I'm saying.
@@GSBarlev I think the biggest issue with Neelix is how inconsistently written he was... that and him being a total albatross and bringer of misfortune, lol.
Holodeck, Holodeck, and more Holodeck
But then won't you end up like Reg Barkley (in the early years)?
One thing I considered is that in general Federation education is quite advanced, so most any Federation citizen might already have the basic skills to do lots of jobs on a Starship. Not direct operations, but the sciences, computers, horticulture, and many other skills that could find or even create a niche among the crew.
Also, I was thinking that as a Captain or XO on a Starship I'd start a kind of "Apprenticeship program" for anyone inspired to look into Starfleet as a career. Much like it was done for Wesley Crusher, but open it to anyone in the civilian compliment who is motivated to try.
@@orklovenThere was something similar done unofficially for Nog in "Deep Space Nine". He needed a recommendation from a high-rank Starfleet Officer, but later you see Chief O'Brien training him.
I can imagine various maintenance people doing things like repairing or maintaining the walls along the halls, plumbing, non-essential turbolifts, replicator repairs for civilian sectors etc. With 1000+ people onboard, there might even be general practitioner-type doctors onboard. No need to for sickbay. Just a regular clinic for regular illnesses, like the common cold or to dispense diarrhea pills.
with 1000 people be ery would be easily swamped with the day to day. Just walk into any clinic on any day and theirs at least a dozen people there at any time. Beverly woukd absolutely need basic doctors for rank and file illness
@@CuppaLLX yeah with a thousand people they needed a small hospital onboard really. I always figured there were additional sick bays but we just only saw the main one where her office was or at least additional rooms attached to it.
After thinking about this a bit, I could see some starships being operated like a cruise ship. There are three populations aboard: crew, passengers, and staff. Crew are Starfleet personnel who operate and maintain the ship and conduct missions. Passengers are live-aboard family members and civilian specialists assisting in missions and research. Staff are the equivalent of the hospitality staff on a cruise ship - they provide the services required by the passengers.
I've thought about this for years, like the Bolian barber from Schisms. It's not the worst life in the world but spending your life being a hairdresser in a society where money doesn't exist.
The man loves hair, simple as. We all want most what we can't have.
Yep, that's Mott. He's been in a lot of episodes, in fact in "Starship Mine" when Picard got caught by pirates trying to steal stuff from the ship while it was under maintenance, and they asked him his name, he quickly answered "Mott" and then launched into a nonstop gab fest to keep with that choice of cover story. xD
Mr. Mott's calling to be a hairdresser and barber may just be akin to Voyager's Doctor's sentiment, when he spoke of stimulating Seven of Nine's hair follicles in order to produce a less Borg-looking person, which was, as he said, "a vicarious thrill for me, as you can well imagine." 😀
Surely in the doctors case he COULD of simply asked paris or b'elanna to tweak his physical appearance. If he really wanted.
Mott was Bolian but he came from country Hoople
I feel like the Federation would be great for artists, artisans, writers, and creators in general. Without the need to spend time for necessities like real life, you can spend most of your time on your personal passion project and improve your skills without much worry about “surviving” (unless your ship goes red alert against a Borg cube)
Federation society also takes away the stigma of being the "starving artist" we have; where saying you are an artist creates an impression that you are not responsible or reliable, can't get a job and are a leech on "productive" members of society. It allows and even encourages you to follow your passions to your fullest.
@orkloven there is still pressure to do something productive for society, and most artistic people are not really that good, so it would just be seen as a form of selfish idling away. Not to mention, Beyond Simple materials, they would still need access to material which is rationed through the replicator. So I guess you could be like a singer-songwriter or painter, but rare materials would still be limited.
Wow, this got me to thinking and imagining things a lot more than your videos normally do!
There's snark, like with professional counselors available like Deanna Troi, I'm sure there are plenty aboard who are thankful for services like Guinan's.
It also reminded me of post-scarcity voluntary maintenance co-ops who would pop up and self-organize. Even if no one was officially in charge of something that wasn't official to begin with, someone's going to assert influence and back it up with followers who agree. I'm reminded of the novel Down And Out In The Magic Kingdom, where the protagonist joins a crew that maintains and repairs attractions in the now defunct Disneyland, in a post-scarcity world. I vaguely recall some of the conflict was between traditionalists who wanted to keep the Hall Of Presidents operating exactly as it had been, and some modernists who wanted to accent the existing displays with some background holographic displays. Hey, in the absence of wars and starvation, humans have to disagree over something, right?
Anyway I can just imagine the kind of background civilian conflicts that could happen on a Galaxy starship about what to do in one of the local community use gardens. A bed of tulips near the starboard area has been maintained by one crew member, but she hasn't been able to work on it much for the past week since half her working section was killed in a Borg attack and she's been working double shifts, and someone else has been eyeing the area hoping to grow some organic spinach and being a little pushy about how much longer the self organized Deck 37 Section 8 Garden Council will continue to reserve the spot for tulips and ask volunteers to maintain it. That sort of thing.
...Oh dear, HOAs In Spaaace! Make the Borg look pedestrian my comparison.
The thing about the Enterprise D that doesn't get talked about much is the obscene amount of inhabitable space the ship has. The ship famously crewed just over a thousand, but even subtracting the labs, dolphin tanks, and other facilities the ship could comfortably house far, far more.
One of her in-universe missions was colony support. The ship would have been packed with colonists and gear heading out to new sites pretty much all the time. All the spatial anomolies and stuff was all side quests. But that's not exciting so it doesn't make it into the historic record for the holotapes.
@@MichaelRainey Emergency evacuations as well. Which seems odd that the one time they had to do it everyone ended up apparently crammed into a cargo bay.
@@Vipre- and I distantly remember something like an Incredible Cross-Sections that showed how whole suites of lab space and ambassadorial ballroom could be pulled out of the subframe and replaced with piles of shield emitters and proton torpedo bays and phaser arrays. The luxuries and grandeur on a Galaxy Class were a subtle "aren't you glad we're orbiting your planet with this pleasure cruiser and not the other options?" implication.
Being a reporter/journalist would be a fun job on the ship. You could report on new discoveries and events to the general public while stationed on the ship.
Jake Sisko core
Some time ago I began exploring a hinted at BUT unexplored area of Star Trek, the Civilian Starship. I would imagine just like on Earth, civilian owned and operated vessels out number Star Fleet vessels 10 to one!
Imagine the life aboard a Federation Pleasure Cruise vessel!
You mean the ships that are found drifting vacant and powerless in an uncharted sector of space, so the hero ship's crew has a mystery to solve this week?
@@daveh7720 i thought that was more an old Schoolbus that Hippies left on the Roadside
Imagine going on a cruise around the Caribbean sea on a luxury liner only to discover that your liner has fore and aft 16" triple turrets, torpedo launchers and anti-aircraft guns. And while the main purpose of the cruise is to visit tropical islands and have carefree adventures, the secondary purpose of the cruise is to fight bloodthirsty pirates ☠️.
@@donaldscholand4617 “Let history never forget the name… Harmony of the Seas.”
Honestly, I'd pay to cruise on a ship like that as long as I get to shoot the big guns.
Oh my god, i hadn't realised the barber was from a species without hair either. That is amazing. I wonder if its some alien fascination to him or if he just saw an opportunity to provide a service to aliens visiting his homeworld and he enjoyed the work enough to take it onto a spaceship?
Bolians are not entirely without hair, the canon has been inconsistent but we've seen a female with hair on TNG and a male with hair in one of the other series.
Your idea about D&D made me think. Imagine what the other species would be like if made to play, like a Vulcan being convinced to give it a try, even if out of academic curiosity. Would be quite the session haha.
Vulcan min maxing half-Orc wizard confirmed.
Probably be quite popular with them. They are usually trained to maintain constant restraint over their emotions, but playing a character would let them indulge in some emotional pleasures by proxy. Though I imagine every one of them would make up a min-maxed munchkin for their first character, playing the game purely with logical optimisation, until they get the hang of roleplay.
@@vylbird8014Nah the romulan would be playing the high elf. Vulcans throughout the shows have been known to cheat so they'd pick half-orc and then go wizard.
@@vonshroom2068 There's no rule says a half-orc can't be a wizard. It'd be very unusual, and the stats mean they wouldn't be very good at it, but it's allowed. All you need is a little character background to explain how it came about. Perhaps they found he had a talent for the mysticism of orcish magic, and realised that if they were to grow their abilities to their fullest they would need to travel away from orc territory and seek the knowledge found only in human cities. So when opportunity comes, they join a band of adventurers - hoping to prove their worth and earn some gold, and so gain access to greater knowledge which they can one day return to empower their tribe.
@@vylbird8014 I see you've never min maxed before. half-orcs auto revive if killed. As for initlligence points well you can -2 +1 from a dump stat like charisma or wisdom.
This is why i say a vulcan would pull that crap as they would also be the rules lawyer of the party.
I sitll want my own Oberth class starship. A little refitting to make it a dedicated cargo/liner and I'll be happy. Maybe set aside some space for a holodeck if not a holosuite, a small hydroponics bay for fresh veggies and a diner/bar area for passengers to congregate on trips. It's the life but the only thing I want to do with mine is refit the secondary hull to mate it to the saucer like an Excelsior class starship without the neck. Man I wish I had the skills and program to draw that and plan it out.
ETA: If you want to know what the ship would look like, look up an Arkley class starship but I want to keep the nacelles over the saucer for a slimmer profile and to allow direct docking with starbases.
What you're describing is how I always thought the Oberth would look better as, just look at the top-down view and imagine the secondary hull directly mated with no pylons.
I've had talks about civilian life in Star trek for years with my family and friends. I can picture myself being a Cultural Event's Coordinator between friendly federation worlds, a novelist, a diplomat, a designer for ships or other products that might appeal to multiple species and get so popular it becomes well traded outside the federation to foster first contact like in Galaxy Quest. New worlds would want to trade with us just to get ahold of stuff i made.
I'm guessing it's similar to military families having opportunities to be on military bases irl. You always hear about 'military brats' moving from base to base as their parents served.
So, I always wondered who corralled the civilians during some ship emergency which happened regularly on the Enterprise. Obviously, Starfleet is trained how to behave and handle themselves during emergencies. For the civilians, what keeps them from panicking all the time when they can’t see what’s causing the turbulence, etc.
I'd assume there'd be a briefing, like when you get on a plane and the flight attendants let you know what to do in an emergency.
I take it you have never heard of air raid drills, fire drills, active shooter drills, duck & cover nuclear drills, etc...
@@arbjbornk yeah, but those have scarcely ever been put in to real practice in the real world. The Enterprise is getting pounded by something at LEAST every other week. I can’t imagine civilians would be able to handle that without extra training.
Plus, no need to be condescending to me. We’re all friends and fans here, right?
In any number of episodes where the Enterprise was evacuated you can see members of the crew acting as "traffic directors" in the ships corridors keeping the civilians moving in the right directions. So most likely it's Lower Deck personnel assigned to guide them to safety and make sure everyone is accounted for. Crew who don't have more vital stations during emergencies other than damage control or being the Back-up's back-up.
@@jime6688 I think you're answering part of your own question. Those drills would be put into real practice on the Enterprise because incidents happen often enough to keep people in practice. Remember that there are places in the real world right now where civilians have been living under frequent threat for months or years.
As for the other part of your question, if your family members are developing anxiety disorders or PTSD symptoms, I imagine you'd be encouraged to reconsider having them aboard ship. We don't hear about it, but I'd expect that to happen pretty often, especially with new arrivals.
YES. D&D HOLODECK. I think I'd be there to gather samples and examples of fibres and fibrecraft everywhere they went. Even though they have replicators I think there would be an amazing amount of variation and familiarity in different worlds knitting/crochet/material production.
I tend to look at a Galaxy class as a mobile starbase; somewhere between a US Carrier and one of the US's overseas military bases. You need hairdressers, teachers, bartenders, chefs, cashiers, gardeners, etc. The big difference between a base and a starship is that you don't have people commuting to work, they've got to live on the starship. I would guess priority for these jobs goes to any family members who are aboard, to give them a normalized lifestyle. After that would be people who typically do this stuff repeatedly, like anyone who is already working at or nearby a Starfleet or Federation facility for these kinds of jobs. And I'm sure that everyone has to undergo a basic "are you a Romulan spy/shape shifter" security checks.
He said teachers, I imagine most of the serious learning on a star cruiser is done through an online program ie your math science etc. With civilians acting guest teachers. Something akin to homeschooling. If you have a business man on board, he can teach business, an accountant can cover accounting etc.
There's a DS9 scene where Jake is on the promenade watching passengers disembark from a runabout, and one of the passengers he makes a note of is a Bolian with a bad toupée. I think this plus Mr Mot's chosen career represents a bit of a thread of Bolians having a fixation on, (or even envy for), hair.
We've also seen at least one Bolian female with hair but maybe it was a wig.
Two words: Holodeck Harem.
Mott being the ships barber is fabulous, he can be an artist with other's long hair.
Since the Federation is post-scarcity I always liked the idea that although you had to fill out the right paperwork and go through the right channels anybody could just *ask* to be transported by or assisted by Starfleet and they basically could not say no, because they serve the Federation, you just get added to a list and they get around to you based on priority and capacity. It would add a lot to the purpose of Starfleet as it's clearly not just a defence and exploration organisation, it seems to fulfil a full on service role
In keeping with the "civilians that are people maintainers" theme like guinan, on US aircraft carriers there are 2 civilians exclusively dedicated to this role, the Fun Boss and Fit Boss. The Fit Boss is in charge of the ship's gyms and is responsible for setting up various workout sessions (sometimes coordinating with a sailor to instruct it) as well as giving personal trainer type advice to crewmembers who ask for it. The Fun Boss is responsible for morale, maintains a gaming and video library for crew to check out, and coordinates things like movie ticket sales, discounted trips, morale building events onboard like bingo and karaoke nights, and during deployments coordinates discounted hotels, tours, trips, and other benefits during port calls for the entire strike group (which is usually several ships and thousands of sailors.)
Both of these individuals are college graduates with degrees in their respective fields, and have several sailors assigned to them to assist them.
I suspect that by the early 25th century time of Picard, this practice had been discontinued. At the beginning of TNG the Federation had mostly been at peace for decades and it seemed like a good idea to include families given the length of some missions, so we get a ship like the Enterprise D. But after the Borg, the Dominion, and other random losses due to dangerous space phenomena/hostile entities it was probably deemed too risky. Losing officers who signed up for potential danger is one thing, but spouses and children being lost as well is something else entirely
On top of that, Galaxy class ships didn't actually seem to do a lot of deep-space exploration like they were designed for, so the main justification for the program doesn't seem to hold much water.
Meh, civilians historically have been in horrific disasters before (sieges, wars, disasters, ammunition explosions, etc.) and we still tend to mingle with military personal all the time. It is the risk you take if you want to spend prolonged time with your loved once. Sure, you evacuate them in time of conflict, just like how countries evacuate large amounts (but usually not everyone) from population centers near conflicts. You do your best, but some stuff is unavoidable.
And if the shit really hits the fan: how many colonies or planets have you seen wiped out over the different series? If you can't stand the heat, you really should not be out there! Stick to blissful unawareness of the core systems, just like civilians are usually not aware to what dangers military and police services need to face to keep communities safe.
Thanks for the video. The idea of certain civilians bringing certain jobs with them helps make every ship unique in a way I never thought of. Imagine if your husband is the best DJ in the quadrant and you're on a Rave ship. Or the best fashionista and you have the best dressed crew when civilian dressed. The USS Steroid with Hulk Hogan running fitness programs. I heard that the USS Lollipop has the best holo-DM in the sector.
“Subspace communications enable talk with your family back home.”
I mean that’s just space Skype. Have we ever seen a, I dunno, “tele-presence holodeck”? Like both parties go into holodecks and interact with live holograms broadcast from the other end. You could all “get together for Sunday dinner with the family, enjoying Mom’s roast chicken” every week from completely different quadrants, just with holograms and replicated food.
Human or alien shields for that matter will not discourage the Borg.
Defiant for the win!
In our Star Trek improv show we had a character who was the husband of a nurse and he was a civilian on the McGinley (a galaxy class ship). it was fun to use him as a way to poke at some of the tropes of Star Trek. A full year and a half before Lower Decks! 😊
It would be interesting to see episodes of Star Trek which follow the "Civi" life on a starship. John Smith is a shepherd from idk, Scottland Academy of Sheep and Cattle, and he's come along as a civilian to try raising animals on board the ship as part of a research project, though nothing incredibly fancy. He's given a holo-lab to simulate raising all sorts of creatures, but when he's not doing that, he's just a guy on the ship doing civi stuff. Seeing him stamping around 10 Forward with a staff and tunic would be a nice change from the usual bridge affairs. There's no... "Boring" episodes, and having some tossed in would be quite refreshing, even if not as awe-inspiring.
Scotland academy of sheep and cattle haha. If you threw some romance and drama in I'd watch this show.
"Sorry to interrupt if you're busy..."
"Not at all. What can I do for you, Commander?"
"Well, while we don't like to pry, we do like to keep an eye on the physical and mental health of our civilian residents. It's been noted that you haven't left your quarters in some time. Is everything all right? Have you been struggling at all to keep your mind or body occupied?"
"Oh, thank you so much for checking up on me, but I'm doing great. I'm just getting really involved in this new business I've started."
"Ah, that's great. What are you selling, if I can ask?"
"Well, I program Holodeck characters that resemble real people my customers know personally or through reputation."
"... for research? Or sentiment?"
"Those are both valid innuendos."
"I can't help but feel like that is a gross violation of ethics, even if not technically illegal."
"That's what La Forge from engineering said. Would you like to take advantage of my buy-one-get-one-half-off special, like he did?"
"...sigh... what are your rates?"
I'm glad you touched on civilians with no specialized skills living on a starship.
An interesting topic i don't see discussed is what the general populace does with themselves in the Federation and on Earth. There are 9 billion people on Earth during TNG and the level of automation and post-scarcity eliminates a lot of service jobs, and not everyone is motivated to become a specialist.
Long story short, I'd like to know how a 24th Century Midwit lives his life.
Count me in for the DnD nights on the Holodeck! The rest of the time... I'd probably be a researcher. Already have a degree in Astrophysics, and there's no better way to build on that than to see the stars up close...
I would work the bar and some time in the gardens. Oh, also spend off time with Lt. Paddles in Cetaecean Observatory because my Commander Wife and I knew Paddles from back in our time in Frisco. 😂😂😂
It was totally unreasonable in every way to bring your CHILDREN along a potentially dangerous journey across the galaxy. I mean look how often the Enterprise D nearly got destroyed or was in serious danger. What happened to the children during an emergency or space fight? they would have been permanently scared for LIFE. At least they realised this because of the dominion war and only manned the newer starfleet ships with starfleed crew. great video as always!
Steve Shives recently uploaded a really good video about this very topic
It depends on the ship, mission, and peace/wartime. Many vessels would see none, to little danger.
It rather depends on your definition of "unreasonable danger".
For example, there's several countries where the unreasonable danger is in sending the kids to school.
You also have to remember that at the time the Galaxy Class was conceived, the Federation had been at comparative peace with it's neighbours for a good while. And the Galaxt Class was able to separate the saucer section, in theory allowing the families to escape battles.
However, it turned out that in practise there was rarely opportunity to do this. And as subsequent encounters with the Romulans, Borg etc proved, there were still big threats in the galaxy.
Of course in the real world, families on board was part of Gene Roddenberry's vision of an optimistic future.
It would have been interesting to see how TNG would have progressed had he lived longer.
Although I do love a good battle as much as the next Trekkie.
Doing absolutely nothing all the time... living the life.
I wanna see a TNG episode about a guy who watches Ferenghi daytime television all day.
Hahahahahahaha! So basically Boimler? That was such a great bit of world building. OF COURSE the Ferengi have the trashest trash TV.
ferengi television could be dreadful. could you imagine how much product placement and other advertisements there'd be? it'd be worse than a transformers movie! id rather be looking through the media of the newly encountered civilizations. imagine being able to become the first aficionado or even expert on alien cultures by just binging their shows and movies.
@@cosmosyn2514 No need to image, there's a Lower Decks episode about just that. There's an entire Ferengi show that is just one long product placement.
@@cosmosyn2514i feel reminded of the german term "Dauerwerbesendung", though that more refers to infomercials. ngl, though, those infomercials were they just try to sell odd products which claim to solve problems that you either don't have, or if you did and those things worked, they'd actually be commonplace already, can be something of a guilty pleasure to watch, just to laugh at it.
@@Vipre-Would that be A Lego Movie, but forced and no fun?
The idea of a Bolean(sp?) barber makes me think of a human doing something like carapace modification on an insectoid species. Like carving, engraving, setting jewels and inlay, painting, that sort of thing. If your species has no hair, even the most mundane haircut would be an artistic expression.
Edit in response to the outro question: Hoo boy, what WOULDN'T I do?? I'm a nerd who'd rather read a textbook than a novel, but I'm also and avid outdoorsman and have been a craftsman - which I'm trying to get back into. The learning and exploration opportunities would be EPIC! Even as a young kid, I was an adventurous nerd and would have enjoyed even the hostile, dangerous incidents. I'd be a less capable version of Wesley. But, then again, he was something special, it turns out.
A town/colony on the frontier is also rather dangerous, yet civvies volunteer for that all the time too.
Plus we only see the 10% where life on the ship is interesting, not the 90% that's just boring surveys or traveling.
Honestly if my wife was an officer in Starfleet and I had followed her aboard ship I would talk to the Captain and senior officers and find out where I could be put to good use. That way I wouldn't be lounging around all day doing nothing. I would want to do stuff aboard ship to help not only support my wife and her career but also fellow ship mates as well.
The trouble with the "longterm missions away from" rationale for having civilians and families aboard is that TNG showed us that the Enterpeise spent an awful lot of time in Federation space and running errands between Federation planets, not really all that much time on any "frontier" far away.
On the note about random civilian visitors not being permitted to annoy the crew or accessing restricted areas, Berlinghoff Rasmussen would beg to differ.
Notably, the bridge seems quite accessible to children and freshly thawed 20th-century businessmen, even during an alert.
I've lived in a hotel for six months that had a restaurant bar, gym and pool, it was boring and the restaurant got old. I concluded that was what it was like to live on the Enterprise. I couldn't be a civilian much less a low level officer on board for year's. If anyone wants to experience life on a starship, I suggest living in a moderately size hotel for a year
Even slightly comparing a hotel to a galaxy class starship with holodeks and replicators is a bit of a stretch...
They get in the way. All hail the Terran Empire.
ALL HAIL TERRA FIRMA
I’m not sure what the Navy version would be, but in the Army we had a Family Readiness Group (FRG), which essentially was an army wife club. I’d assume starships would have something similar where spouses would organize events for the families that serve aboard as well as operate as a support system for each other, to deal the struggles of starship living that you pointed out.
It’s interesting watching this when you understand just how massive the Enterprise-D is in comparison to how much space the crew occupies. All 4,000-6,000 crew members grouped together would cover a tiny patch on the saucer hull. It’d be like if Manhattan only had 200,000 people total but all those huge buildings for millions of people. 😂✌️
Hosting D&D parties about a starship? That's the ultimate fantasy life, there!
If I would, Ship repair and possibly Replicator repair. Or if need be in entertainment; something of a barkeep for a classy design.
I've wanted a civilian Trek show for a long time. Here are shows I’d like to see:
* following people traveling in space in a profession other than Starfleet: artists, actors, musicians, journalists, politicians, doctors, etc.
* a show similar to TNG’s “First Contact,” in which a planet learns about the existence of aliens and that the UFP exists.
* a show that takes place in the 2160s, as the UFP is just being formed, the people forming the government hire historian(s) to consult on the project, which allows that story to parallel with the unification of Earth after First Contact, in both timelines, we see the effects of the decisions made by the new government on the general public. ENT or First Contact characters could be in it.
* an Earth-based series at any point in Trek history.
* a show set on a colony.
* West Wing: Rom
I’d also be interested in spinoffs such as:
* Wesley and Kore as Travelers
* Rios, Teresa, and Ricardo fighting for medical equality in the 2020s.
* Jurati’s adventures over the course of the 400 years where she crafts her own version of the Borg collective while staying out of history’s way, waiting to emerge and reintegrate with the rest of the galaxy.
* Literally anyone on La Sirena, working for the Fenris Rangers, similar to the fanfilm series Star Trek: Aurora. I suppose Worf and Elnor are free agents and have familiarity with the ship. If it's the two of them, it could be a way for Worf to come to terms with his previous hate for Romulans, through training Elnor. I would have originally preferred Seven and Raffi, but they appear to be occupied with the Enterprise.
* a show about Book’s relief efforts after the DMA attacks.
* a show or miniseries that ties up the loose ends from “Calypso.” My theory is that the Discovery’s jump duplicated the ship, and that copy has been dormant and adrift up until the time when our Discovery emerged.
This was far more interesting than I thought it would be. Thanks for doing it.
My theory is that the waiters and barbers are actually the spouses of officers. Boredom is a powerful motivator for getting a job.
I wish they did a series detailing a group of civilians, we too often get the lives of Starfleet officers.
I would argue that while not Starfleet herself, Guinan as a bartender would have at least nominal connection to Deanna and/or Bev's departments.
Especially considering that Guinan and Mott were both better at Deanna's job than she was
I'd probably be spending all my time learning about various topics. Not even important stuff like military strategy or complex physics, just the most random things.
"there he goes again, he just started reading about fruit-bearing trees on Cestus III and it's all he's been able to talk about."
"Give him a week, he'll switch to something else. We're starting a betting pool on what the next niche interest will be."
Starfleet is a military, no matter how many times they try to convince themselves or others lol
Non-Starfleet occupations on a ship (like a barber or bartender) are just like when the same occupations are available on a military base.
I think the biggest issue is that people seem to think that military must always be about fighting and weapons. Modern military supports scientific research, diplomacy, transporting VIPs, rescue missions, aid relief, and much more.
Starfleet is 100% a military organization. They should have kept MACOs as part of the crew too.
I think most in universe and outside see Star Fleet as the Coast Guard. Until they need an Army.
FYI - the bigger naval ships have civilians on board for activities and the like. They may also allow some family members on board for a few days when coming into port.
6:27 made me laugh
Doug can live a cat's life
So interesting info you may be unaware of, in the US Navy on board an aircraft carrier there are civilians offering rolls such as, moral officer, fitness instructor, college professors, civilian maintenance experts, and a few other rolls. They'll be on board from the beginning of deployment until the end. So as odd as it seems that the Enterprise D had civilians it really isn't as far off as you might think.
I'd like to wonder whether or not the Federation started allowing more civilian presence again around the Star Trek Picard era especially in the 2400s when they started going back to their more exploration roots with the Constitution III and Excelsior II. The presence probably diminished from the Borg and Dominion threats, but did that norm stay after those situations as part of Starfleet's more guarded stance from the 2370s to 2390s?
Something I wish they'd have done is implement a 'Families For Federation' movement where Husbands and Wives who are prepared to face the same risks as their spouses insist on joining them on their travels, similar to how wives marched with regiments and took care of cooking, cleaning etc. You'd get a small unofficial non com army who could look after the officers.
9:05 That makes me wonder how things are cleaned in the 24th century in general. Like, we don't see people vacuum or dust off their quarters or dry the shower or clean the toilet in the bathroom. Do tiny drones do this kind of work? Clothes and dishes can be recycled in the replicator as can trash (empty shampoo bottles and the like).
I presume a fair proportion of facilities like say, bathroom appliances are actually self-cleaning or otherwise don't get dirty just from smart materials or little force fields or whatever. They'd think no more of it than we think of not emptying chamber pots today.
@@OllamhDrab I would agree with that. Damn, would I be in awe if I experienced that for the first time! (The first of countless instances I'd be in awe actually 🤭)
By the 24th century at least, you would think transporters could be used for some of these duties. How many transporters are there on a Galaxy class? Like 20? Part of say the overnight shift could be "vacuuming" the ship's carpeting by targeting dust particles and beaming them into some sort of matter storage.
@@adamlytle2615 There are doubtless less energy-intensive ways to do that. Subtle force fields or charges or carpet that passes dirt along to some collection duct or something.
@@OllamhDrab oh yes very possible!
Having civilians on board was Roddenberry's craziest idea. Starfleet is best when it's run like the military. For the Next generation, see First Contact or Nemesis.
Since I am somewhat of a free spirit, I would probably work on holographic imagery, and robotics or would try to design my own starship. I would think that there is still a need for Trading, Logistics and long range social-transport (for lack of a better word).
Not all can be solved by "more Power" dumped into a Replicator and I also think that civilians probably are not so keen about beaming to another star system for a family visit.
These will probably be the regions I would "work" on if I weren't in Starfleet.
If Doug is on a Galaxy class, give him a vacuum. Those carpets don't clean themselves.
According to Riker the ship does clean itself.
@@danielyeshe shhhhh. Don't tell Doug.
Tell me what
Tell me what
@@user-nh7fe6mb3i ummm.... There's a spill on aisle 3. Think you can help out? 🖖
Imagine being an Animal Daycare personel onboard a Nebula \o/ All the doggos and cattos and lizards calling you " _Jerk.._ "
I'd appreciate at some point Trek mentions an explicit protocol for evacuating civilians off of vessels before dangerous situations, in the aftermath of Wolf 359. Even if they didn't expect to get spanked as badly as they did, the fact that they brought that many ships to bear for the battle means they knew they were in for a hell of a fight, and yet at least the Melbourne still had civilians and children on board during the battle. It would be nice if after that there was a protocol put into place, for dumping them on a class M world or launching a shielded yacht a lightyear away from expected hostilities, if time allowed. (And, I just looked it up, the Enterprise fired it's deflector weapon on Stardate 43998.5, after which Hansen said the fleet was assembling at Wolf 359, and the battle at Wolf 359 was on Stardate 44002.3)
Is this why the Enterprise split off the Saucer Section a few times? That goes off to fight, while the rest keeps the civilians safe? I wonder why they didn't do that for Wolf 359.
@@AndyKauffman-ml3og I think it was introduced for this idea, the star drive section had a "battle bridge", so that it could go into battle while the saucer was left behind somewhere safe. The enterprise did split off the saucer in Best of Both Worlds, but not to protect the families, just to try to distract the borg so Data could slip onto the cube. As for why the folks at the battle of wolf 359 didn't, I think this event was supposed to (or has in retrospect) highlight the hubris of the federation - they sent in Miranda class ships against the cube, picket line formation, chock full of non-combatants, because they thought they were too big to fail
Bolians have an advanced sense of symmetry. This is why they make very good tailors and barbers,...even though they don't have hair.
Having lived and worked on one of the world's biggest cruise ships, I can confidently say I wouldnt want to be a civilian living onboard the Enterprise. Its bad enough when you work on a ship, let alone if you don't.
I can see a lot of opportunities for group activities on a Galaxy just because there are so many more people, but I wonder what the options are for families aboard smaller ships, like Mirandas.
The ones I feel bad for are the kids who are taken on civilian science missions and are stuck for months on a ship with nobody else but busy adults.
Thats does remind me that it would be awesome if after the incident that happened to Voyager, if any of the spouses were encouraged to pick up training and see some of these part-time appearances of spouses learning become field commissioned crew members. Maybe even have one come up in the ranks to where they are tested by starfleet once they have communication again and then once they get back they are offered high ranks in the fleet or even their own ships.
I would make it my life's work to keep the Spooge Tanks on the holodecks filled. 💦
Huh. I must have accidentially hit the subscribe button. Interesting.
Now it all makes sense. I've always wondered, with a ship the size of the Enterprise, why just the bridge crew goes on away missions. I always thought the reason was seeing your favorite characters do stuff. But, the real answer is, everyone else on the ship is civilians.
Mentioning journalism, while not necessary for the franchise, there was still a near total lack of news media. The game Starfleet Academy did a decent job with the one scene where the cadets watched a breaking story about a skirmish with the klingons. You'd think they would regularly be coming and going to report on everything from astronomical events to alien cultures. Though this might open the door to the tired "combative reporter" trope in DS9, it would give Jake Sisko direct exposure to that side of reporting.
That said, the shows did fine without them and even Voyager made an attempt at writing about civilians on the ship.
I love the idea of someone running Holodeck D&D!
Now I want to hear the story of Doug as he tries to find his place in a Star Ship while supporting his wife as a star fleet officer.
Chin up, Doug, you'll find your niche on board!
Never put much thought into this. But, wow thanks for the detailed look!
If i wasn't part of the crew. I'd probably be a sort of mercenary. Free travel to whever the ship is going, with the offer to fight should the need arise.
I am not sure how easy becoming a mercenary would be in Star Trek. It entirely depends how common or uncommon FTL vessels are to the average person or company, what the federation's laws are, and the conflicts involved.
It seems to me, the federation has control of all star ships under its banners control.
Not exactly like Star Wars where anyone could get a ship. Or Warhammer 40,000 where elites with a ton of power could hire guns for their own agendas.
I'd create a virtual D&D Holonovel Series, complete with everything we know, and throw in some new stuff. The Dungeon Master would be a hologram (so no arguing over who is the DM) and everyone sits at a table, only instead of cheap little figures, a 3D holographic figure moves around, and you can have a larger copy of the "field" on the floor nearby so you can see more details, zoom in and out.
Imagine a horde of Orcs fighting a horde of Klingons, both of which want to face an army of cavernous Tribbles.
the xbox huge interior geometry of STO ships' crew spaces will never not be jarring.
Thanks Ric. I needed this.
We know there are a lot of extracurricular activities on the Enterprise that seem to be organised by volunteers. Sometimes those are crew members, like Dr Crusher's amateur dramatics. Others are likely organised by civilians. We don't see a teacher in Picard's art class, but they could well be a family member making themselves useful (as could be the nude model). We hear about chess tournaments. Various activities for the children on board that are likely organised by the parents. There are cultural events. It seems there are plenty of things for family members to volunteer for if they want to do something useful.
Even in a starship you need a guy that fixes the plumbing.
This was hilarious just for seeing Mr. Man-Skirt show up in the stills. 🤣
Power aboard a Starfleet vessel is immense, but not infinite. I wonder if crew members are limited to the amount of replicator usage/holodeck times, like in Voyager during the year of hell where they were in energy conservation mode and Janeway was pissed that Chakotay replicated her a watch. If there was no limit, imagine a regular ass human being trying to create their own shuttlecraft in their downtime.
Voyager went on replicator rationing pretty much immediately after blowing up the Caretaker when they knew they weren't getting home that way and it was now a 75 year ride home. Ships in routine contact with star bases and member worlds can keep the tanks topped off.
My headcanon was that the D had other counseling staff with Troi as the dept head, including a possible civilian counselor on staff to deal with the civilian population.
Yeah, this is why there are enlisted personnel. These would not just be "out of boot" but also people with various skills normally not trained for, like a tailor, or barber, that want to travel space, have some kind of space career, and such serving aboard ship. It is galling that virtually every Starfleet crew member, officers and crew, are essentially only officers. No, I am aware of Ch. Miles O'Brien (Who is not?), but he is the ONLY Enlisted and NCO ever shown on in a show or movie. And when enlisted crew are represented they are not much different from the officers, over-trained, hyper-competent, and their ranks might as well be same as well.
If by some timey-whimy chance I ended up in the 24th Century, it would be fun to serve as a shipboard librarian. I'm too old for Starfleet Academy now, and I doubt they're in need of an office assistant, but I have some librarian experience, and it was a job I enjoyed. It would be cool to research an additional 400 years worth of literature just from Earth, never mind all the alien books out there!
"I'd like to learn about this book. It's from a great man in your history..."
"Ok, whats the name?"
"Mein kampf"
Starfleet is one of the military arms of the UFP. It's no coincidence that the ranks mirror current navel ones. There are JAG and Court Marshalls which only pertain to military service personnel.
Would love to see a video about civilian access to phaser's and shields. Weird topic, but I thought it would be interesting.
I was thinking something similar. I assume you could get training on phasers, personal shields, etc as a civilian. Would such things be handed out in something like an enemy boarding?
Shields are probably everywhere, as a safety measure. Required by building codes, like sprinkers. If the building is damaged and collapses, or fire breaks out, anyone who can't escape gets shield-bubbled. For about thirty seconds, while the city transporter-center gets a lock and beams them to safety.