CLASSIC MTG Can't Beat a SINGLE YUGIOH Trap Card | Card Connection
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- Опубликовано: 13 июн 2024
- In one of my most MASSIVE undertakings thus far, (and unfortunately beaten to the punch by @TolarianCommunityCollege by like 2 weeks), I
see how well the quintesential YuGiOh retro deck, 2005's GOAT Control can not only be converted into Magic the Gathering, but also how well it can stand up to the 2005 MTG metagame! Gifts Ungiven, Tooth and Nail, Green Aggro; does our little sheep have the teeth to rip through the competition, or is it all bark and no bite? Joined by my friends Adam, Jonah (CapCrow) and Nate (Toxicutter), we play it out to find out! And the results will SHOCK YOU!
Check out the full list of converted cards: imgur.com/gallery/yugioh-goat...
Check out Jonah's stuff here: x.com/Cap_Crow
Check out Nate's stuff here: @ToxicutterMusic
Caleb once again came in on the assist for audio, check out his work here:
@kappamuse
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#mtg #yugioh #yugiohtcg #custom 
Игры
Thanks for inviting me to play I had a great time and would love to come back for another video
Only if you promise to not read the cards before we play again
So first thing I noticed: Bottomless trap hole shouldn't able to exile Darksteel Colossus, it should destroys then exile so something with indestructible is immune to it, a la how it works in Yugioh. (patron of the vein is literally the only example of this in MTG, believe me I tried to find another but exile and destroy at the same time just don't play well together in MTG)
there's combos that go cards sent to graveyard are exiled/destroy target
@@satibel Still doesn't work. Exiling the card from the graveyard (Rest in Peace, for example) is a replacement effect that happens while the card is going to the graveyard. Indestructible protects from "destroy" effects and lethal damage, so the card never leaves the board in the first place. What that combo DOES do though, is stop death effects from triggering, because the card never hits the graveyard before being sent to exile.
better ver: Bottomless trap Hole, Instant, when a creature with power 3 or more enters de battlefield deal damage equal to its toughness, if a creature dealt damage this way would die this turn, exile it instead.
This way indestructible minions survive
@@Dizek we can have Bottomless work without causing oddities about dealing damage to the creature. It would just read kinda weird.
After the cast condition, the effect would say:
"If those creatures would die this turn, exile them instead"
(that's the first effect, it hasn't actually done anything to the creatures yet)
and then there's a second line of text:
"Destroy those creatures"
I want this as a rom hack or something. This looks fun as fuck.
Great video! Somehow paying 5 mana for Snatch Steal doesn't feel as powerful as just activating it in Yu-Gi-Oh! regularly LMAO
Glad you liked it! But hey, at least magic snatch steal can technically yoink multiple things if you can get rid of whatever's currently attached LMAO
@@JMarGameDesign that's the same with regular Snatch Steal though right? It's just ygo players don't play equips or anything that attaches to monsters much since removal is so easy to come by
@@HazeEmrysome yugioh for you:
if I snatch steal an opponent's monster and return the snatch steal to my hand, the monster returns to my opponent; so you could steal again, but not double dip.
if I snatch steal an opponent's monster and return the monster to the hand or destroy it or whatever, the equip spell will go to the graveyard because it isn't equipped anymore. (btw, this is your "why don't they play equips" answer - you get two-for-one'd if they remove the monster)
but snatch steal basically only does the stealing when you cast it, so even if there was somehow a lingering face up snatch steal, you couldn't use it in any way.
@@HazeEmry equip spells in YGO work like Enchantments in Magic, they go to the Graveyard if whatever they're attached to leaves the field for any reason.
@@vampirecat6769 are we all talking about the same thing here? I'm not talking about equip spells leaving the field when the monster it's attached to leaves, I'm saying equip spells stay equipped to a monster when said monster changes ownership, and Ygo players don't play equip spells much because removal is so ubiquitous and removal of a monster equipped with stuff would also remove everything equipped to it. Like for example if Comic Hand, Relinquished Anima or Dragunity monsters swap owners they'd still be equipped but if the monster is destroyed, the equipped stuff are destroyed as well
I swear to god I click on a completely innocuous MTG video because I've been on an MTG swing lately, and get jump-scared by my own alt-format. I can't get away from it!
Glad I could give ya a spook
the extra deck cards could have been companions with partner, so that'd function as an extra deck.
In general yes, but this is 2005 mtg, Companions won't exist for 15 years
@@eugenideddisneither did some of the card effects though right? Like we made up a special kind of foretell.
They would still use up all the sideboard slots, companions used up a sideboard slot.
this man can single handedly make the best crossover in history if konami and wizards (especially wizards) werent being so damn stupid with monetization of the game
W...wow
I have never seen someone translate Yu-Gi-Oh cards into magic in such a great way!
Its so good, you made new natural interactions (like the metamorphosis a face down card) that just sound so right tho
Excellent work right here!
I really like the idea to somehow transfer Yugioh Fusion and ritual mechanics to magic. I think if done and thought properly, it could give Magic a new life and maybe a more interesting approach to card design and gameplay. Maybe even commander gameplay would be more fun to fusion summon your commander for a certain creatures for flavor.
When I tried to design a small homebrewed TCG I tried to implement Yugioh fusion summons and magic tempo and resources system and it was very flawed but incredibly fun and had potencial if reworked properly.
I had an "extra deck" with certain enchantments. For a "Endless Calamity" you needed Anger, Exasperation and Fear in your graveyard, which you banish, making a "contact fusion" of sorts.
My idea was that Endless Calamity had a certain effect, but then you attach banished cards used for its contact fusion cost to the summoned card, and the attached cards add to Endless Calamity effect. And its was hella cool. A little bit of Digimon influence here, but I just really like stacking cards on top of each other and attaching them so they can develop into something new.
I think a similar idea could work in Magic.
54:25 is really giving kaiba's "so what hope do you have against two?"
TRUUUUUEEE HONESTLY
dealt with the first one, NO feasible out for the 2nd lmaooo
It made me think of Madara's Tengai Shinsei
this dude just did 85% of the work for universes beyond Yu-Gi-Oh..
Shiet guess WOTC is gonna owe me some royalties then lmao
@@JMarGameDesign Could you imagine Blue-Eyes being printed as an MTG card 😅
@@Hurricayne92 I mean it'd just be a vanilla dragon
And then maybe some stuff like burst stream that checks if you control it or a dragon w/ similar stats
"I can't believe it. All of the meta defining decks lost to morph"
Oh I'm sorry I didn't know I was in the presence of greatness
As much as I want to stay humble I won't YES THIS CAME OUT GREAT RIGHT
For what I get, Relinquished turbo is stronger than any Magic deck from the era in exchange for being more inconsistent, but that doesn't really matter since the games are slow enough
Funnily enough, some EXCEPTIONALLY old cards in yugioh actually have Reach. During Duelist Kingdom in the anime, monsters can have states such as flying and a big part of Yugi's duel against Weevil
ADDENDUM : better example is Mai's Harpie Ladies
The Yugioh Cards in Magic style look great btw :)
I'd gladly have a real live version of this goat deck :o
lets be onest, Nate NOT reading the card is the most gi oh ho play
also reading what Pot of greed do is a RULE even if you use 3
I was confused for a bit going "how doesn't he die to poison from blocking colossus with his face?" and then I realized it was darksteel not blightsteel colossus
Yugioh fan here, your content is great. This is so incredibly high quality.
I liked how you incorporated Yu-Gi-Oh cards into magic cards
You're a great speaker, really interesting to listen to, thanks for the vid! Fun to see the two card games that take turns occupying my brain interract like this, really like your design ideas
As a yugioh player with limited magic knowledge, it is was a very entertaining way to get to know some of magic's old decks, I would love to see another video similar to this one, congratulations for the awesome idea
What decks/format would you like to see covered in this style?
This was awesome! I really hope you can do other erras
1:36 To be fair. Tribe-Infecting Virus wasn't even fair and balanced for 2005 _Yu-Gi-Oh._
Fair, but then again, the boards in yugioh never get big enough where you have to drop 4 - 5 cards to pop the board
Really interesting stuff!
I only have the ygo perspective and am more of an mtg observer, but it definitely seemed like some of the costs and stats could have used a bit more tuning.
The one that jumped out to me was wanghu hitting the 3 power threshold -- I'm curious how many cards in the format get hit by that compared to the goat deck itself.
As well, wanghu not destroying your own goats seems crazy (especially considering how many games devolved into TER control), but I'm not sure what the implications are of it hitting any creature that enters the field.
NGL I think I assumed that wanghu only pops if it's normal summoned, didn't realize it also pops on special summons
Tho tbh the implications would probably be matchup dependent - either you sit on wanghu til you win vs aggro or you remove it yourself to get creatures back on board
The ironic part of Metamorphosis getting haste: in the Manga and Anime, during the Battle City arc, fusion summoned monsters couldn't attack the turn they were summoned.
47:14 In Yugioh, Metamorphosis "tributes" the monster as part of the effect
Wait what? That doesn't sound right tbh, I'd always thought it tributed as cost to get the fusion monster.
@@JMarGameDesign nevermind me, Fusion spells work like this but Meta is an exception
I feel like Snatch Steal should be changed a little, to be that if the Equipped Creature is destroyed you also destroy Snatch Steal.
I know there were combos with Giant Trunade, but it felt weird it staying on the board after it died. Lol
After seeing the reaction of MTG players to some of these cards, now we need some pure tier 0 formats translated. I had to suffer through TeleDad, so do they.
I mean the real question would be comparing what's worse to play against, teledad or something like tier 0 eldrazi or combo winter
@JMarGameDesign Since you were doing decks from the same time, maybe see if Tier 0 formats ever lined up. TeleDad is what I'm most familiar with but if something in MTG lined up with full power Spyral or Zoo, that could be insane as well. Although I don't know how in the world you would translate Zoo to MTG.
I'd have to go back and see if my XYZ implementation in the six sam video would work the same way in MTG for zoo.
I think the tier 0's that would line up would potentially be like, CED/Yata Lock and Artifacts for Mirrodin, I don't think offhand there'd have been a tier 0 yugioh deck for Cawblade to fight against, and then like Gouki/Spyral Link Spam vs. MH1 Arcums Astrolabe stuff in 2017/2018. Though honestly none of those really sound that interesting to play out given the solitaire nature a lot of the decks boil down to at a certain point.
Maybe if it was vs. like some vintage/legacy high tier stuff to match the same general power level plus having Force of Will as countermagic?
Full power ishizu tearlaments for some real warcrimes
Oh god ishizu tear but on mtg stack instead of chain links
Actually that might be a little weaker since you can't chain block stuff
This and your six Samuri videos are the best conversion videos in the business.
Pot of greed is just black lotus
I would say that for the Trap Card they should be castable from Exile for either their CMC or half rounded up in order to balance out that aspect, otherwise they become way too good.
this was fun. gonna go up in years from now to see what happens in different eras?
amazing video!
happy to see dustshoot is toxic here also!
Next episode should be "Yugioh trap cards can't beat Chalice of the Void".
Now, what about hybrid decks using cards from both games?
Graceful charity reanimator going to go hard. I wonder what the best Metamorphosis deck would end up being though.
I'd have metamorphosis treat tokens as having a cmc of 1, because Thousand Eyes is level 1 for a reason (namely being a retrain of a ritual monster)
Conversions seem really cool though, nice job
Yeah, if I had done this conversion now with the new "tokens have mana costs" tech they implemented w/ MH3, I probably would have gone that route. Would definitely help the throughline for doing stuff like metamorphing sinister serpent like in actual GOAT format.
Thousand Eyes is more an evolution of Relinquished, given that it requires Relinquished
Btw my other comments criticized some of the design decisions, but that was done out of love. This video is spectacular and i thoroughly enjoyed it and recommended it to my friends. Id totally want to see more like this from formats like hat or Meadowlands. And edison i guess
Excuse me sir, you dropped this 👑
Great and entertaining video, earned a sub
That new taramgoyhf commander thing makes tokens with mana value 1G. When i made ygo mtg customs (including many goat staples and synchros from later formats) i just made the tokens have the ability that their mana value was treated as 1, etc.
Not even a full 30 seconds and there's already a Veldalkan Shackles learning experience. Poor fella, we've all been there
“You chose not to read”
He’s a yugioh player already ;)
It's cool, he plays MTG already so it's basically the same thing
Black luster soldier's first ability doesn't work out because you can just exile a creature after declaring attackers but before declaring blockers, making the drawback unexistent
That one needed tweaking on the actual text to say "do at sorcery speed" I played it in the game like you'd do in Yugioh but missed adding that fix on the actual image
39:07 pal already embraced the Yu-Gi-Oh core culture piece- not reading cards
Edit: 40:38 Ah so mtg players are as braindead as we are!
I'm an idiot, I asked on an older video why there were no other episodes of Card Connection, not realizing this was a Card Connection episode.
You're good lmao
I wanted to include the intro but wanted to try a different starting hook
@@JMarGameDesign
Nah, it's fine, I just didn't notice "Card Connection" in the title since it was at the end instead of at the beginning.
This is incredible!
just the fact that you have to pay mana, changes the dynamic of a lot of yugioh cards... you can no longer summon, play trap and spell for free, add quite a bit of tactical component into the game...
Feel like the Yu-Gi-Oh cards were a bit busted, thus explaining why it cleaned floor with every other deck lol BLS being just delve 2 8/8 double strike is what hogaak wish it could have been
Yeh any of the alternate cast cost for special summoning were gonna end up being iffy, probably should been exile a black and white creature from your discard and pay 5 mana.
Choas sorcer likely also needed a similar restriction.
This is awesome!
Fusions could just be stuck in the side deck, and poly can be: as an additional cost: discard cards or sacrifice creatures who's name are mentioned on a card you own outside the game: put that creature into play.
You mentioned the ultimate battle of ultimate destiny, I'm like a single voter issue, and you have my vote (like and sub)
Dustshoot is also OP in Yugioh XD
With Modern Horizons 3 now tokens can have a mana cost (Tarmogoyf token is a 1G for example), so you could have made the sheep tokens have a cost of 1 and TER a cost of 1, so the weird interaction with face down creatures is not present.
I had started working on this last September post MagicCon and didn't get games in til April
Which was all long before they implemented the new MH3 "tokens with cmc tech" unfortunately lol
@@JMarGameDesign _technically_ tokens have always been able to have mana values, usually if they were copied, but also Garth One-Eye lets you cast specific spells that enter the battlefield as tokens with mana costs (but also Garth is a weird card).
As of modern horizons 3 you actually can have a token have a mana cost if you use the original name of another card
i.e. you could have scapegoat make zodiac goat tokens that would be 1/1s with mountainwalk and a mana cost of R
obviously this is new tech that didn't exist at the time of card creation but its pretty neat new tech
Yeah, I started this entire thing like RIGHT after magiccon last year, and did all the games last month before any of the MH3 stuff was revealed/leaked
So I guess now I could have properly had the level 1 stuff work like in yugioh lol
Wait, im pretty sure thats not true. Making a token copy of a creature creates a token with a mana value, that was possible waaaaaay before MH3. Cards like clone legion have existed for almost 10 years and they made tokens with CMC
@@ich3730 yes but they require a physical card in the current game to copy off of
rule 111.11 is new and is the first thing to allow you to make tokens with mana value out of nothing
although the tech was not recently technically disallowed to say "this token has a mana cost" its just that nothing ever really used it i think since it is a lot of unnecessary text in most cases
It'd be fun to see how well the Goat deck handles full power Affinity or even decks from Onslaught/Mirroden Standard. The converted Yugioh cards are insane by 2005 Magic standards, so why not try a gauntlet of more powerful decks?
Also, do't forget the changes that happened with mulligans and mana burn since 2005. Mulligans were very painful back then and Pulse of the Forge was so good because you could burn yourself before throwing it at the opponent and getting it back.
I used this mirrodin/kamigawa gauntlet since it's what was legal in the same time period
I was debating using old school mulligan rules and mana burn, but I didn't want to have people relearn magic just to help me record this
Arguably giving the new mulligan rules helps both the yugioh and the old school decks not get insanely punished for having to take multiple mulls
@@JMarGameDesign It's just an idea since some of the cards were over-tuned, why not piy yhem against some of Magic's over-tuned cards?
I get ya, I wouldn't mind trying that if the games were going to be interesting though lol
Given the power level and the gameplans though, I doubt they would be
@@JMarGameDesign You're probably right. Ravager Affinity was like Slickshot Red, but faster.
There is a precedent for antimorph tech. We got karlov watchdog in mkm
I think MKM had just come out when I was working on the cards, good to know though for the future
I did something like this in Forge and it holds up very well...when it's not crashing the game that is because it's so hard to program it right sometimes XD
If you do this again, how would you do XYZ? (If possible)
I actually did XYZ in the Six Samurai card connection video! Worked it kind of like imprint, but in hindsight the implementation was a little skewed. I might go back to experimenting with the more complex yugioh summoning types down the road.
Thanks, I go check that video out now.
Someone get this video to MBT, I’m begging
BRO IVE BEEN TRYING
what is this platform called, ive never seen online mtg that looks as much like the paper magic experience
Tabletop Simulator on Steam!
Interesting concept. Who knew if you print undercosted spells and put them against cards from 2005 you win. Could definitely use more work to make the Yugioh cards more in line with magic but not a bad concept
A 3 mana instant speed board wipe is insane, as an example. "Destroy all creatures" is pretty solidly 4 mana for sorcery speed, usually, and the exceptions are MORE expensive, not less. To be honest, I'm not really sure how you'd go about costing Yugioh cards as a conversion to MtG fairly on the MtG side while still respecting that the primary difference between the two IS the lack of meaningful resource considerations in Yugioh. It's a fun idea though, I agree. It would be extremely interesting to see how this would look if it wasn't the costs of the cards that broke the game.
For the purposes of balancing this format, sure, the yugioh cards might be undercosted. But, if we're trying to be authentic to yugioh, you can't make them too expensive. Every card in the deck needs to be high tempo so you don't lose to aggro - a yugioh card you couldn't play until turn 5 would not see play, a spell that conflicted with you summoning a monster for the turn would have to essentially be a board wipe, monsters whose don't do anything the phase you summon them are almost always bad, etc. etc. Like you could try and balance the cards, but that's not the point - the yugioh player has no intention of playing a fair card.
@@jkid1134 Pretending that Yugioh cards can't lose to aggro is silly. Especially considering the specific Yugioh format being converted here is dominated by Chaos Turbo, the premier aggro deck of the format.
@@dontmisunderstand6041 Chaos Turbo is not an aggro deck lol, it's midrange. You play 1 for 1s and draw cards and set monsters. Aggro decks in goat format are like, Earth Aggro or Warriors or Reasoning Gate, decks that are actually trying to develop a threat on turn one, and they are all pretty grossly contorted to try to play through Gravekeeper's Spy (some players will tell you Warriors is a control deck because even though the goal is to put on early and constant pressure and crack your opponent, basically every card is chosen to disrupt the Chaos value engine because of how impossible it is to play aggro against Chaos if it does what it's built to).
@@jkid1134 So your argument is that Yugioh players are so devoid of intelligence and reading comprehension that they'd refer to a non-aggro deck with words specifically designed to evoke a sense of speed. In any other context, you'd be mocked for suggesting such a ridiculous thing, but given it's Yugioh it's plausible.
There's merit to the idea that a good aggro deck is a type of control deck that deprives the opponent of resources by necessitating bad trades in order to simply continue the game. The sentiment that an aggro deck plays more like control has solid basis in the reality of the strategy.
For the record. In Yugioh, how aggressive a strategy CAN be is determined by how many more summons it can perform compared to its competitors. Chaos Turbo literally plays more ways to get more monsters than the enemy, compared to Warriors. You're not exactly the beatdown if your monsters are the same size and you summon less of them.
With the way you designed MSLV2, it can become MSLV4 by killing a face down monster, which is specifically not how it works in its Yugioh equivalent. It’s hard to create a true equivalent with how his toughness is 1 (accurate for a 0 def monster). The best remedy I can think of is to make him a 2/1 first strike instead, and to make the face down effect read like Kaldra Compleat
It might be that was the case, but im pretty sure with how Mystic Swordsman l2 is worded, the end effect just checks if it's destroyed any monster in combat, NOT specifically a face down one.
@@JMarGameDesign in yugioh MSLV 2 destroys monsters by effect before ever reaching the end of the damage step. Face down monsters are not considered destroyed by battle for the sake of leveling up.
Ohhh I see what you mean now, gotcha
@@JMarGameDesign ye
Seeing the cards all over the damn place pisses me off to no end.
OK, I'll bite, how would you work it to visually display multiple cards at once that people are unfamiliar with (old 2005 stuff) or haven't heard of before (my YGO conversions)?
@@JMarGameDesign
No, it's nothing you did, just magic the gathering not having a field layout
OHHHH in tabletop sim, gotcha
Snatch steal should have just auto equip for free then had the clause to sacrifice it after it became unequip
Sorry, what program are you using to play?
Tabletop Simulator!
Wait till bro hears about chalice of the void
You couldn't chalice on 0 to stop the trap casts though if that's what you're thinking
Void mirror could work tho
@@JMarGameDesign why not both to be really funny
No matter the game, Book of Moon always overperforms
wow! this was cool!
magic has a trap effect you could have used that and give them no mana cost so there forced to use the secondary cast restriction
Technically they're already forced to used the secondary cast restriction
At least so far for this case - if you wanted to you could technically cast them from exile with a red impulse-type effect. Admittedly I wanted to have that interaction there since I thought it'd be cool, but also because I don't think it would really come up that often.
Hey what software is that for playing please ?
tabletop simulator i believe
@@Goblin_War_Buggy Thank you . I found in depth videos how to set it up. Have a good day. Gabos4ever
equating foretelling to setting cards face down when you have mechanics that synergize with the exile zone seems like a tremendous design mistake
equips should not be actual equips, they should be auras - especially snatch steal, which could have been equated to magic's staple 'control magic'
So what happens if you dropped peak Tearalaments Ishizu into modern MTG would it ruin the format or not do anything at all?
Depends on how the cards get converted to be honest, though you could probably jam it into like reaniamtor for some nonsense
Imagine if he made library FTK or reasongate in magic
Aw but I love combo
I think I'd be more concerned with reasoning gate since the quality of an average MTG creature probably does more than the average YuGiOh one in that context (i.e. monster gate hits griselbrand or somethin)
@@JMarGameDesign Library FTK would just straight suck lol because you cant just activate 50 spells in one turn for no cost
All mana values are funky
2 mana for snatch steal is too little, when all other steal cards are 4 mana
Ez ygo sweep
Why not make the traps and quick play Spells become facedown permanents that you turn face up like using morph or manifest. Have the cards not be creatures but coloress facedown enchantments that can flip themselves to activate effects and if it wasn't originally a continuous trap the enchantment would sacrifice itself after resolving. This way you can also simulate the yugioh backrow removal in mtg as well being able to more easily target and interact with them.
This is exactly what I was thinking too…a “trap” keyword ability that lets you cast the card as a face-down enchantment before you activate it. Bonus is you could apply that to a bunch of different card types for extra versatility (like giving it to a sorcery so it goes to the GY on resolution like you said, giving it to an aura enchantment to simulate continuous traps, or even creatures to simulate trap monsters).
I’m super new to MtG but it sounds like a good idea to my novice brain anyway, lol
I mentioned going the route of Spellmorph (the mechanic that was shown on one of the mystery booster cards that lets you have an instant/sorcery start as a 2/2 before being cast as a spell later on), but because I didn't want a repeat of the Six Samurai card connection of making a billion new mechanics, I wanted to see what I could work with using just what magic currently has (I know fusion summoning is technically a new mechanic made, but the games never used proper fusion summoning, more like birthing pod from the sideboard). But making them like enchantments was an idea I was considering, I just didn't feel like adding new mechanical complexity in that area. Obviously it didn't work in some areas, but that's what you find out through playtesting.
@@JMarGameDesign Yeah, I definitely get it, but I think since traps are essentially one of Yu-gi-oh’s most major defining mechanics (they are literally one of the three main card types alongside spells and monsters, after all), it probably wouldn’t hurt to create a keyword *just* for them even if literally nothing else, in my opinion.
lol pot of Greed is strictly worst ancestor's recall, cost twice as much and get less cards
Im not sure how the Fortell cost of 0 is supposed to make sense here since the traps cant be played in any other way, meaning their CMC only matters for tutoring effects and all effectively just cost two colorless mana no matter which it js. I think they need a real fortell cost to not all be equally costed for such varied utility and power (you could use Mirror Force with zero white mana in your deck etc).
Also if they want to play true to Yugioh then traps should suffer from summoning sickness somehow. I'd even suggest rather than exile them and cast from exile, they might function better as enchantments when facedown so Magic's equivalent to backrow removal (artifact/enchantment removal) can hit them. Other than that its a nice experiment.
So you made OP cards for MTG out iof Yugioh cards... Lol
One of the most consistent problems I see with Yugioh -> MTG conversions is never using mana for anything other than the baseline casting cost of a card. Of this entire "set", the only activated ability that isn't completely free in terms of mana is Snatch Steal, and that's all the more perplexing because it should be an Aura in terms of how the card actually plays, not even being able to put an actual "equip" ability on it because that wouldn't be compatible with equip spells being able to target opposing monsters in Yugioh (and not being able to re-equip afterwards). Like, you realize all these "Foretell 0" trap cards just completely ignore the color pie, right? Why would something like that ever get printed? Same for every special summon monster here, with the chaos monsters being the most egregious for not even asking you to pay mana to cast a fusion spell first.
So going in order:
1. I made the foretell costs free because the goal of this conversion was more to bring the YuGiOh playstyle over into MTG. Obviously not the extent of modern with extreme combo but more simple things like the way traps work of just setting and playing later on. Skipping a bit to your 2nd to last point there, It's something I recognize at the end of the video that I SEVERELY underestimated just how potent they'd be with my (lack of) understanding of the 2005 metagame and general speed, and designing cards under more modern card design sensibilties (and I even say that yeah they probably needed some additional mana costs post foretell payment).
2. Same vein of being a little strict on my rules, I made the equip card from yugioh an equipment in MTG. Snatch steal probably should have been a control magic-type aura but in development I noticed I could include an equipment into the card pool, so I did.
3. I mean same idea, I wanted to bring over the mechanics for how it works in yugioh and the chaos monsters don't use a fusion spell.
One of the best decks the game has ever seen VS mtg decks that happen to align because of the year they were played. Though, I get why there isn't any p9 shenanigans. You came to play magic, not spectate it.
I mean, I wouldnt really call it one of the best decks Yugioh has ever seen, hell with modern deck building knowledge we know now that Goat Control isnt even the best deck of Goat format.
@@wren5413 To be fair, that's not really due to deckbuilding sensibilities. It's more due to how math works. Aggro will basically always have a massive advantage whenever wins can come out of nowhere. Not even necessarily an OTK, if you can even get remotely close to an OTK then aggro is the best strategy. That's not a yugioh specific thing, it's a generic truth for pretty much every game.
p9 wasn't legal.
@@janehrahan5116 guys, we found Sherlock.
@@dontmisunderstand6041 thanks for saving me the time typing lol.
Why is snatch steal an equipment? Doesn't just straight up fit perfectly as an enchant aura, like control magic or something? I feel like it'd be a perfect fit as like a 3 mana control magic that just gives your opponent 2 life each upkeep. It should also give haste for yugioh flavor!
I do want to note that I love the idea of this video. The other day I turned my favorite yugioh archetype of all time, tearlament, into a magic "archetype". Obviously adding mana costs to the cards and all triggers, but I still think that it's a super cool idea for a playstyle, especially since nothing like it exists in magic. The closest thing is probably dredge, but dredge is so unbelievably far from a control deck that it's difficult to say they're similar other than the fact that they both like to mill themselves. I've been thinking about doing so with several archetypes over the history of the game and printing them out using a proxy website, then turning it into a cube.
Tho I have to ask - where/how did you make your cards? I noticed, especially with cards with higher text like saryuja skull dread, that you were able to fit a monumental amount of text on the card. I used MTG Cardsmith, which unfortunately has a pretty limiting text box.
I agree, Snatch Steal being an equipment was a huge miss.
I used Magic Set Editor to make the magic stuff, I like it ALOT more than cardsmith
The TLDR for snatch steal being equipment is because it's an equip in yugioh, and I wanted to try to keep everything as close to its original card as possible.
@@JMarGameDesign Equip in Yu-Gi-Oh is like auras in MTG.
Yeah, I can concede that snatch steal operates more like an Aura than an equipment
Just wanted to make it more of an equipment though, but then obviously it needs some increased costs to justify the effect
good movie
Can you try modern YGO vs modern magic next time?
Definitely thinking about it
Tho it might end up being more modern yugioh vs legacy/vintage magic to compete at the same general speed
@@JMarGameDesignthe next "important" Legacy format for yu-gi-oh is Edison format so it would be fun to see something like quickdraw, blackwing or vayu challenge the 2010 magic meta
1:01 get draw four card.
I am so happy this video exist. Because it shows how much broken yugioh already was at the start. And how much different was the power level in comparison with other card games
Magic has trap cards to my knowledge didn't they?
Yeah, they're a subtype for instants
I guess I couls have made them like that and skipped foretell entirely but then you're actually paying for effects like these for free lol
@@JMarGameDesign Not all of the MtG traps are free if their conditions are met. There’s a pretty wide range for how you could design MtG style traps. There’s an existing one that costs 8 mana normally, but costs 5 if its condition is met. Mirror Force could be 6 mana to destroy all attacking creatures that costs 3 if an opponent attacked with 4 or more creatures. That’s basically a better Arrow Volley Trap. Bottomless Trap Hole could be free if 2 or more creatures entered simultaneously.
snatch steal wouldnt be an artifact, and it wouldnt be green, and where does it say in ygo that you can reuse snatch steal? so why put that effect on the mtg card? it prob would be a red and or blue enchantment for 3 mana (maybe 4) with the effect of taking control of target creature and giving the opponent 3 life on upkeep
Fusion is literally just meld.
In early yugioh I could agree with that, but to keep it potentially future proofed where materials are much more fluid (1 dinosaur + 1 machine for example) or a monster can be a part of multiple different fusions (blue eyes can be a material for blue eyes ultimate, blue eyes twin burst).
The only reason it can't "win" is because the custom cards are overtuned lol?
Magic has so many removal options it makes yugioh a joke. Not to mention alternate win conditions.
31:46-32::00 Woah woah woah, hold your horses there buddy, I saw what you did. Trap Dustshoot literally states "Cast Trap Dustshoot ONLY from exile" This part is already a negative meaning it shouldn't be playable. Then you have "Target opponent with four or more cards in their hand reveals their hand. You may choose a CREATURE card from it."
OBJECTION! What you did was not only break rules as written, you also pulled a card that WASN'T a creature card! Therefore you are disqualified!
OK so hoping this is in jest and I just can't pick up sarcasm via text BUT:
1. At 31:34 you clearly see me put down the trap dustshoot facedown as I'm accidentally about to place tribe infecting face down
2. I announce its going into foretell into exile (which for the sake of the game I'm just putting those cards face down off to the side mimicking trap cards from yugioh, the card is never cast from my hand)
3. Jonah's hand is 2 islands, a condescend (instant) and a kaijin (a creature) that I send back with trap dustshoot as it's the only valid target (I apologize if the editing made it look different)
So yeah take that objection OUTTA HERE
@@JMarGameDesign we clearly see him putting back the condescend dude.
Yeah, there's a kaijin he has on board already
His hand at 31:55 is kaijin, condescend, 2 islands
So one kaijin goes from his hand back in
The hand he has left is condescend + 2 islands
@@JMarGameDesign I love that you made this, and would love to see Branded VS new MTG. I still have to say though, I saw Condescend leave his hand.
I gotcha, could just be the editing and cuts to fit it in (tho did find his hand of 3 is laid out at 32:15 if that's easier to see or if you can zoom in on mobile to better see)
Branded could be interesting but my concern with throwing new YGO vs MTG is that ygo is SO fast that you'd relatively need vintage/legacy level MTG to.have an even challenge, assuming you convert yugioh to stay in line with its speed/resource loops/etc.
Snatch and steal should have just been a 5 mana mind control enchantment having it be repeatable is silly. As it clearly only worked once in yugioh.
Dust tornado shouldnt be able to destroy artifact and enchantments while also being modal to move cards out of exile while also cost 1 mana, or 0 cause of foretell and being at instant speed.
Trap dust shoot should probably be at 7 not 4 since it desgined around starting hand size being 4 not 7.
Having seen the end of the video yeh being able to mana cheat with foretell was busted as was being able to heavily mana fix with them.
The creature balance was slightly skewed as you identified, but otherwise was a intresting watch.
I dont get why you made the life costs so high
Premat pays 800 lp which is 1/10 your starting life total in ygo. Why wouldnt it pay 2 life in mtg?
Duo is 1000lp cost, so why not pick between 2 or 3 for mtg?
The Magic conversions of trap cards shouldn't really be Trap type. The Trap type in Magic implies there's a cost reduction to be made if the conditions are met. Archive Trap is free because the opponent searched their library, for example. Mechanically I suppose it doesn't conflict, but is a huge flavor fail
The trap mechanic is really janky and exploitable. They should just be like morph but instead creatures they are artifacts. Single use ones get sacrificed and the continuous ones don’t.
Well yea, Yu-Gi-Oh is pretty much like Vintage Magic. It's broken as hell, lol.
Also since yuigoh doesn't have rotations at all your probably should have been matched up against a vintage deck not a standard deck.
Sure it's no rotations, though the goat deck only uses cards from the first 2.5 years of releases. Arguably this is yugioh standard of 2005 vs mtg standard of 2005
@@JMarGameDesign Ah okies, you could have tried matching up against decks using the first 2.5 years of magic cards. Although that might favour the magic deck due to how powerful the non creature spells. The creatures would have been alot weaker.
Yeah, tbh it'd probably boil down to "who had the better noncreatures" lmao
yeah i'm not exactly sure what's going on, the sudden jump cuts and the never actually showing what any of the cards to make this pretty unwatchable tbh
kindergarteners when the teacher starts using flash cards
power9 solos youll never get a turm