1968: Should Women Get EQUAL PAY? | 24 Hours | Voice of the People | BBC Archive
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 22 авг 2022
- Fyfe Robertson visits a cigarette factory, to report on the movement to get equal pay for women. What does 'equal pay for equal work' mean in those instances where jobs are done exclusively by either men or women? Wouldn't a fairer system be 'equal pay for work of equal value'? Wouldn't true equality mean equal opportunity for women to do jobs that are currently the preserve of men - and equal access to the training and education necessary to compete for those jobs?
How do factory workers, shop stewards and employers feel about equal pay?
This clip is from 24 Hours, originally broadcast 5 September, 1968.
You have now entered the BBC Archive, a time machine that will transport you back to the golden age of TV to educate, entertain and enlighten you with classic clips from the BBC vaults.
Make sure you subscribe so that you never miss a single stop on our amazing journey through the BBC Archive - ruclips.net/user/BBCArchive?... 
Развлечения
Equal pay for equal work.
Imagine how smoky the canteen is in that cigarette factory
Dear old Fyffe Robinson - his voice was quite unmistakeable
A rather tense relationship in that lab. That guy was just making up his arguments as he went along and failing. Glad they put him on the spot as it highlighted how none of it made much sense. I wonder whether he ever changed his mind.
I wish the BBC would still do that to people talking total bollocks on TV
@@Fredric_Cedrich there would go most Labour Party shadow front bench if that happened then
@@xr6lad right after the whole slate of Tory benches!
So experience shouldn't be rewarded?
Don’t know…. I liked his way of thinking. Makes perfect sense to me !!!
I am joking
Amusing to hear the mental gymnastics involved in denying something so simple and fundamental in retrospect.
“By paying women less than men, we are doing our part to preserve our way of life.”
How very noble of industry to increase their profits for the benefit of society.
Yup. House prices out of control now. Two need to work to make ends meet. Rarely pay a mortgage on one salary. Most manufacturing industry dead in the water. It’s progressed no end.
Industry has only benefited from the increase in the labour force. Yet now things are almost reversing where men are dropping out of the workforce and women dominate in education and society is not better for it. Just look at the fertility rates and marriage-it's a societal disaster!
The case has always been for employers, and always will be… Divide and Conquer. Be it based on our age, gender, class, colour or creed. The more complex society is the more it can be ruled by those who seek to profit and remain at the top of the pyramid. Women did eventually get better pay and provision for maternity leave, so the next way of division was to separate aspirational from less aspirational people. It started by selling council houses, offering easily obtainable finance on cars and holidays etc thereby pitting regular people against each other. Our NHS will be the next major societal shift, where those in work will be tied to mortgages and health insurance premiums whilst the vulnerable, needy and lower paid will rely on a most basic NHS with extremely long waiting times and substandard treatment. Read this comment in 5-10 years to see how accurate I am!
I couldn't agree more!
Who are these people you speak of when you say "those who seek to profit and remain at the top of the pyramid"?
How does getting finance put people in competition with one another?
How does selling council houses seperate the aspirational from those who are apathetic? Surely buying your council home keeps you in the same place as those who can't buy their council homes.. no?
I still have faith that if the Tories lose the next election there is hope for the health service.
@@danmorley6517 Don't be so naive, as if Labour would do anything different. The NHS is always in trouble but not for a lack of funding but for pathetic profligacy and too much middle management.
And use contract lawyers to do their dirty work !
Got my popcorn and watching comment section 🍿
This channel is fantastic, thanks BBC people!
Glad to see these kinds of issues are being publicly archived even though modern reception / discourse on this topic is much more aggressive.
I'm from Blackburn and we have a statue of Barbara Castle MP in our town :)
She was an MP in Blackburn
I’m live in Barbara Castle and we have a statue of Tony Blackburn DJ in our town.
They should have Aurthur Scargill, Enoch Powell and shame the grooming gangs which the BBC tried to cover up!
Pure insanity to treat someone differently because of gender, color or creed...
Well gender does matter. Equal pay is BS
Yes we should get equal pay
Most of the woman working in my factory need help lifting a 10 kilo box up onto the bench so why should you get equal pay?
U have equal pay
@@wodens-hitman1552 Because they are humans. You however are subhuman.
weird stance but ok
Then stay in the job for the same amount of time and have the same experience . And you’ll get it.
Equal pay for equal work and responsibility, regardless of gender.
the guy at 6:20 is struggling so hard to justify going against equal pay xD
Ha, it’s the same paper thin arguments that now are given for why CEO pay is up nearly 40% and make 351x the wage of their workforce. Plus ça change.
They get paid more because they take on the responsibility. Who gets blamed for mcdonalds mass selling poisoned food? The chef, or the CEO who let it happen across the planet.
Lol imagine being so inept as to not realise why CEOs get paid more than the cleaner. CEOs are paid as much as a company is willing to pay them, so I really don't see what you're angry about.
and this is how the uk enforced the class system
Wow; the men really can’t wrap their heads around it. I can see know why there’s still a struggle.
What struggle these days? There is no pay gap at all, the only difference is men tend to work longer hours thats why a man can make more then a woman, if women were paid less a company would hire 99 women to 1 man.
@vikingjohn9813
The gender pay gap in the UK is measured only on fulltime worker (without overtime ) and stands at 7%. Thankfully, it's been slowly declining over the past 25 years. I think because the men we see in this video, will have been retiring ( along with their crappy attitudes). It's almost closed for lower paid earners.
The problem is that women are still struggling to get into higher paid management like jobs and when they do, they are still paid a lot less than then then men.
The struggle is that the men shown in this video, will only have retired in the last 10 years. The attitude that "women should only load the cigarette machine, but not run it" is still about.
@GemmaMiss like I said the gender pay gap aint real and that's another thing men retire much later then women! Ya gripping at the past to try and validate a non existing issue! Like I said if women were paid less there would be more women employed then men the cold hard truth is men work longer hours in jobs that if they are mostly men doing the job it's because it's jobs women don't want to do or physically can't do. You may be mistaken job experience as a wage gap but it's not I'm a professional in my line of work that means I earn the money that my level of expertise gives and if an apprentice decides to join either male or female they will not get the same rate of pay as me until they are fully qualified
@@vikingjohn9813 Hun, I’m talking about the figures for the pay gap provided by the UK for 2023. Nothing historical there.
But it’s okay, I knew from your first comment that you were very good at maths. 99:1 ratios and all that.
I also understand that you are just like the guys in the video, clueless.
@GemmaMiss have you took in to consideration time? I'm 42 I work 2 days a week and my co worker is 49 he works 3 days a week I earn more then him then we have an apprentice so to say works 5 days a week on less then both of us because of different levels of experience, the fact that men work longer hours are less likely to be off work then women are more then likely to stay at a job longer thus gaining more practical experience is why they may be a difference, its got nothing to do with gender I know women who earn more then some blokes that they work with because of time and experience. They want you to think there is a gender pay gap to sow distrust and frustration like the way they want black and white people to fight because a society thats ruled by fear and distrust is easy to manipulate and rule over.
Aah, the good old days! 😂
Rare footage here of young Andrew Tate the 1st. Who’s grandson would go on to continue his legacy in the same gentlemanly manner some 60 odd years later
Good those men were exactly like Andrew tate and so am I. Hes from my hometown. Ur grandfather's are laughing at u for destroying England. Its become a joke
These people are all either dead or retired, now robots and machines do many of those jobs. Weird
Even in that tied they did
Fyfe Robertson was so brilliant at this sort of thing: never overtly taking a side and getting the bludgers to expose the nonsense of their own position.
Ah, yes - back when the men just said what is now the quiet part out loud.
They were correct and I'm confident things will either reverse themselves and return to normal or end in disaster.
The men refer to the women workers as “girls” in the most patronising way.
This footage reminds me of a skit Harry Enfield did called 'Women know your place', check it out. Looking down the comment section here, not surprised to see some of the comments from the males who seem to be stuck in the 1960's even though we're in the 21st century.
No
I think the idea of unequal pay was born from the notion that women would almost always explore the other life/children/homemaker options whereas, men were expected to go out and work every day until retiring, leaving child raising, housekeeping etc to the partner or spouse. What's changed, is that women no longer want to be assumed as 'I will have children' , 'I want to be a homemaker' . Equally, men now have the right to say 'I do want to help in raising my children' 'I would like to assist in housekeeping etc'. Very divisive because on the one hand it rightly gives both genders equal access to each others traditional roles, rightly (in most cases) gives women equal pay but, it has lead to some real problems with the wrong people getting jobs BECAUSE they were female or of any other minority you care to think of that was discriminated against. Careful what you wish for.
Of course men shouldn't pack cigarettes! Nor should women control the machines! No one should be doing either.
well they all been replaced by robots now lol
I love that the guy says that you should get paid less under the age of 25. Yet with all of the things that has changed since it is still perfectly legal to pay people under 25,21 and 18.
13:17 YOU LITERALLY LIVE IN A MATRIARCHAL SOCIETY!!
amazing how divided opinion was back in the day.
Of course people should get equal pay. I should get paid the same at basketball as a 7ft NBA superstar 😮👈
Essential femininity - how the world has changed!
It seems insane to me that there are only 30 years between this clip airing and my birth. A man born the day these interviews was recorded would only be in his mid-50s now. The immense difference in working culture and gender equality is crazy considering the short time.
I can only hope that we look back at stuff happening today in the same way 50 years from now as we look back at this video. Women’s liberation has moved so quickly in the last lifetime, and I can only hope that the it, and the liberation of other groups, continues just as quickly.
How many smoking related deaths did all those cigarettes contribute to?
You are so right, those women should be put on trial for mass murder.
You're right, they were complicit to the whole thing! 😂
Imagine the yakking and gossip that went on in that factory 🏭 😆
Patriarchy and toxic masculinity at its finest. This should never of even been a debate in the first place. Who first decided that women should be paid less than men, its ridiculous!
No, they should get paid more, to make up for the crap men have put them through
🥴
Yeh right, we spend most of the night shift putting right the crap woman couldn't manage
Yes exactly! Fight sexism with sexism! Then we are equal! Please name examples of what women has a whole have been put through by men as a whole
@@aaroncousins4750 really, your asking that...
@@privatechannel8462 yes. Yes i am. Now stop trying to stall
It's still a man's world in 2022.
When anyone from the older generation complains about todays young people just point them straight to this video
Don't ever give us the woke version bbc. This is history and you can't modify it for modern gen z snowflakes.
Glory days
Equal pay for equal work.
Why are women tennis players payed the same as men when they play a maximum of 3 sets compared to men’s 5?
I’m all for women getting payed the same as Male tennis players but make them play best of 5
There's that, but also it's the men who sell 75% of the tickets, sponsorship money and garner the lion's share of commercial partners. Even if they play 5 sets, they should get paid what they generate, and not a penny more. Fair's fair
We had a professional female Aussie rules football team competition start in Australia. When it did all the female players and many of the woke complained it was unfair as their basic salary was not the same as the professional male players.
Of course ignoring that the male completion had something like an average 50,000 to a game, tv rights in the hundreds of millions, viewing figures of a few million, sponsorships in the billions. Whereas they needed to hand out free tickets or piggy back off big matches, viewing figures were low, sponsors were few and paid less.
But they thought because they both kicked a ball round the ground they were entitled to equally pay.
And that’s the problem with so called ‘equal pay’ in sport. If you bring in the same as your competing group then yes you should get it, if not then it’s not our problem.
That's only in grand slams.
These days we accept the moral argument for equal pay for equally valuable labour, but we also understand the economic consequences of equality between the sexes, in terms of falling wages, falling birthrates, and unaffordable housing. For women, work has gone from being an option and has become an obligation.
Oh yes, if women just knew their place none of these issues would be around
@@GemmaMiss You say that sarcastically but the continued denigration of gender roles has proved catastrophic. Go ahead and try to explain how women divorcing their husbands and waiting til 30 to have children will contribute to a stable and healthy society.
The right price is what the individuals involved in the transaction agree upon.
Government has no right to coercively interfere with voluntary transactions.
Divide and Rule.
It’s about the kids. Wom8n want a capable m4n to head the family so, all m8n need to be capable to build all that we see around us.
Uh, why did you censor women and men...?
We need some of that honesty of the first 70 seconds today. Women don't earn as much as men in 2022 because they choose easier jobs. They have had free access to high management and highly technical jobs for decades, and still don't apply. You can mandate equal pay for equal work, but not equal pay for different output, not equal pay for different choices.
it is a man's world because men built it. we formed a legislature, and through policy we commissioned the work; the work was then undertaken by builders, who are all men.
tf are you talking about?
are you feeling okay?
Yeah but it wouldn’t mean nothing, nothing, without a woman or a girl.
@@kingmuffin...5876 Did yr Mrs make you write that?
Their not very good at manual labour in the construction industry, but Their great in the site canteen knocking up sandwiches and tea.
Of course women should not get the same pay as men.
Interesting that you have made a presumption ('of course') but not even attempted to provide a single reason.
what a strange thing to say
Troll Hard 2: Troll Harder
Women burned an average of 213 calories during 30 minutes of light running, while men burned 276
So women should get 22.82percent less salary than men!
😺👍
Now both parents have to work to survive
"A woman's work is never done."
That's why you don't get paid like we do.
Equal pay for equal work is a ridiculous idea. How much an employer values you is not just about what job you have, its about how well you can do your job. It's not the governments job to come in and decide how much someones labour is worth. Salaries should be left to the negotiations of the employer and employees, the government should have stayed out of it in the 60s and they should stay out of it now.
True in perhaps higher paying jobs but where more manual labor is involved with more menial tasks which must be done correctly throughout the day in multiples, a basic wage floor must be in place. If an employer wants to provide incentives above the basic wage for individuals(of any gender), who perform above and beyond and visibly increase productivity, then that's the best way to do it. But having two workers on the same line and one is payed 20-40% more for only yielding 5-15% increased productivity, or is somehow more at the favor of bosses/supervisors which is the basis for the higher wage compared to other workers, is a formula for worker discontent and labor instability. And I'm hardly some Gene Debs style Leftist workers rights person. I'm a true believer in the free market system to a fault. But what's right is right. And noticeable wage disparities between workers with little to no discernible difference between their outputs and general worth to the firm, are wrong.
@@mattwuxx3888 In theory I agree with you in the circumstances you laid out, however i don't think that government regulation is the answer, especially when they have a blanket rule that doesn't work for all situations. I think if a woman is genuinely being paid less than a man for the exact same job, its more likely to be that the woman didn't negotiate hard enough than some overarching discrimination towards women.
And 50 years later, something that by purely analytical equality sounded not only right (philosophically and ideologically), but reasonable (as per economic terms), has provoked a population decline that haunts EACH and EVERY industrialized country who adopted the "women in the workplace" policy. We put the "rights" tree over the "population birth rate" forest, because there was NO WAY that we could've thought that was ever going to be a problem. NO country, no matter what measures and incentives has tried (and they tried them all) has achieved, once the birth rate fell below the replacement rate of 2,1, a reversal.
China, Japan, Korea, Germany, Finland, Russia (and the list goes on and on) are now facing a de facto workforce collapse that will cascade o the 2020's. The retiring population (those who began the women's liberation and equality revolution of the 60's) is the one who had fewer children (nowadays most have one, or two at most and at a later age) and therefore changing the shape of the population pyramid for worse.
In the beginning that was seen with fascination: "Wow, we solved the dreadful prospective of an overpopulated world" and "Wow, wealthier countries have less children" and "Wow, fewer children, more free time, longer adolescence, just live like a teenager until the 30's" etc.
Then the economic (and human) factors began to enter. Robots didn't evolve on such a manner to replace the needed work force (yes, they do wonders, but yet still you need many, many skilled young workers). The whole economic structure is based on the premise that the (many) working young sustain the (fewer) old ones, and this has reversed (many times you have one grandchild for four grandparents.
The type of technological world we currently live in, is dependent on sheer numbers: globalization and vast populations of consumers make that technological things that by themselves would never make economic sense on a "smaller" world, were profitable (and possible). And this will likely end.
Climate change (another "we didn't see it coming" cautionary tale) add to the problems. By the way both population and climate sounded the alarm decades ago, but these problems seemed too distant to care plus it was anathema to "go against feminism" or "go against economic wealth"; both are really, really complex problems (as the solution was never to keep living like medieval brutes who denied technology or women's rights).