I have a 25r from 98 with a steel grate front, and use the drive channel all the time. Sounds as good as the day I bought it. I also use a preamp with it for all the other effects.
I have loved my 25r as a practice amp for several years. My main amp is an old drip edge twin reverb but I get lazy to lug it around. Just tried a Princeton 65 solid state amp which I think is essentially the old version 65r, 65watt 1x12 amp with the same intense presence. I was hoping it would be just a louder 25r but like you mentioned, they really are different amps. Would you say the deluxe 90dsp would be more similar in quality to the 25r ie, without the intense brightness of the 65r?
Jesse - The short answer to your question is yes - I believe you will have more control over the sound with the Deluxe 90, with or without the DSP primarily due to the super sensitive volume control of the Frontman 65R. I also have an older Fender Twin and used it many years ago as my primary amp, so my comments will be based against the FT sound. For me, there are two scenarios to discuss: A) bedroom practicing, and B) on-stage performance. Bedroom practicing - As the amp is right in front of you and there is very little other noise, our ears are more sensitive to small changes in tone. It is in this case that the intense presence of the Frontman 65R is apparent. Typically, bedroom practicing is done at very low volume levels, which also affect how our ears perceive the sound. In my opinion, it's difficult to set the Frontman 65R to achieve a good low level sound. The 25R, on the other hand, was made for such an environment and works well at low levels. Because the volume control on my Deluxe 90 can be finely adjusted, it is easier to adjust the tone, once the volume is set. On-stage - Lots of musicians have challenges getting the same tone on-stage as they achieve in the bedroom (especially with effects). For me, I would roll off the treble a bit and boost the mids and lows. There is LOTS of other noise around you (read drummer) that reduces the question to: 1) am I loud enough/too loud, 2) is the tone representative of my instrument (I play a telecaster). All this is presuming you are in a small/mid sized venue and not going through the PA system. So, while I believe the 65R would be fine for smallish on-stage venues, I would prefer the 25R (or something that has good low level tone and volume control) for bedroom use. Hope that helps. Ben Price - San Antonio
@@ve3cda thank you for your considerate reply! it is nice to know that the deluxe 90 doesn't have as much of that super sensitive volume issue as the 65r. And most, the 25r is definitely more convenient for home use, but sometimes for band practice it's just not getting to the volumes i need it to. thanks again for the reply. I was also looking at the deluxe 112 as an option but i think i'll forgo the 65r and think about the deluxe 112 and the deluxe 90
Mr Serious - I have never owned a Princeton 65 so I don't have an "official" comment. Perhaps someone out there can provide input (after watching this video and seeing the controls of the Frontman 65).
Thanks for this video. With regards to the drive, I don't personally like it and use a light drive pedal in front. It was reassuring to hear the info and also kmow that my amp's quirks are standard. Good video 👍🏽
I have that exact 25R I play in my church band. It has a very nice clean sound and the reverb works well. It gets plenty loud to keep up with the house sound system. I stay clean 99% of the time. It also can get dirty too which is nice. I also like to play stone temple pilots/ black keys.. etc. It can handle the distortion fine. It does have a little hum when you crank the gain up.
Hankman3 - Thanks for taking the time to provide real world church experience with the 25R. There was a poster below (Raul Lopes) who was asking questions that you have now answered. Happy New Year. Ben Price - San Antonio
Ed - The Peavey Classic 30 is a very nice amp, as is the 65R. I'm sure you will find they are different in many ways, especially the brightness of the 65R. I play in a classic country band here in South Texas and use a Tele as my main instrument. I don't use any pedals for compression as I find the Tele has a natural bite to it. My recommendation is to play around with the 65R and, if possible, try it out in a live/bar/church setting to dial in the tone you're looking for. Ben Price - San Antonio
Just as a matter of information I have played pedal steel guitar through a Frontman 25R for several years and have been pretty satisfied with the results. I replaced the factory speaker with an Eninance "rajin cajun" which did a lot to improving the audio BUT . . . . I have never been all that fond of the lack of response to the lower frequencies from the amp. Recently I ran across a good deal on a Frontman 65R WITH THE UNDERSTANDING the there was a problem with the volume control (on the clean channel). Since the 65R has a 12 inch speaker (versus the 10 inch in the 25R) I figured that the larger speaker would come closer to bringing out the low frequencies I'm looking for. I have some electronic experience so I figured it would be a matter of replacing the volume potentiometer which is usually a pretty simple thing to do. WRONG!! To start with it is a major disassembly to get to and remove the main circuit board. Beyond that the offending potentiometer (according to some Fender replacement parts suppliers I have contacted) that part is no longer available AND there are no substitutes. So I am now in the process of coming up with some sort of work around to salvage this amp.
brdman3 - Thank for sharing your story. Sorry to hear the repair of the 65R has turned out to be more complicated than anticipated. It might be a long shot, but maybe you could swap the volume pot from the other channel. Anyway, I hope that all works out for you. The 65R certainly has a lot of power and the 12 inch speaker should give reasonable low end for your pedal-steel. Best regards - Ben Price - San Antonio
@@ve3cda That's not an option due to the fact that the clean channel's potentiometer is a 50K (ohms) and the other channel's potentiometer is 100K (ohms). The other problem is finding those with a splined 3/4 inch shaft. I'll come up with something down the road.
@@brdman3 I'm just curious to know if you made any good progress with the volume control problem? I've often thought of soldering 3 wires to the circuit board and using a hard-wired potentiometer to the 3 wired tails, just really to give more choice in potentiometers that could be used as the originals are hard to track down. I would possibly go for an 'Audio' taper pot too, to tame the rapid increase in volume between 1 and 2. Best wishes.
@@alanknott363 What I ended up doing was to replace the offending volume potentiometer (i.e. "pot") with another type. To make this work (and fit), the connectors on the replacement had to be turned UPWARDS. The original's connectors were DOWNWARDS and soldered directly onto the circuit board. It should be noted that with the replacement being turned upwards it is necessary to reverse the wiring from the pot's 2 outside terminals back to the circuit board. If this isn't done correctly your volume would be off when the control is at the fully clockwise position and wide open in the counter-clockwise position. This worked very well and I did use a linear taper pot as opposed to the original audio taper. This corrected the problem. A word of caution here, the factory pots (all of them in the 65R) are carbon FILM pots. If at all possible when replacing them try to find the regular carbon type since the FILM type are more prone to failure especially if they are sprayed with electronic contact cleaners which people sometimes tend to use to clear up 'scratchy' or 'dead spots' . Hope this helps and thanks for the reply.
I have a 65r and I tend to use the gain a lot since I play more classic rock and metal. I find it to be very nice sounding once you find the a sweet spot in the controls. I usually only have my amp set to about 1.5 for the volume and I never really need to have a higher volume on my guitar, usually around 4. The only issue I can really say tone wise is that using a humbucker in the bridge position make the and sound to dirty on the B and high E. Aside from my amp have some age to it and needing a couple repairs it’s a good amp to have as long as you understand it’s controls.
Brain G - Sorry for the late response - Yes, either amp at $70 is very reasonable (I presume you mean the 25R as the 65R is a little harder to find). Good luck
Had a 25r and sold it now have a champion 20 with all of the cool effects but the 25r sounded killer with my squier tele. Might pick up the 65r for $100 tomorrow
Tania - there are a lot of factors to consider when responding to your question. First, I presume we're talking about the Frontman 65R. The only effect this amp has is overdrive - which is passable if you tweak it a bit. To get sounds like the bands mentioned in your question, you will need external foot pedals or effects. While the 65R is pretty loud, a lot of the answer to your question depends on where you're playing. If you're a beginning garage band, then the amp will be fine. If you're in a venue with any more than 100 people (larger than a smallish bar), you will need to mic the amp, or use a direct box. If you haven't yet purchased an amp, and your intention is hard rock, I would recommend you look for a used Peavey Bandit (silver or red stripe). These are perhaps $200 on Craigslist and are adequate for most situations. If possible, seek out someone local that you know and trust to help you gather information and make decisions. Unless you are an experienced musician, a lot of this stuff can be quite confusing. I hope this helps - Ben Price - San Antonio
GMoneyDon - I have seen blue Fender amps from time to time, and that has got me wondering if there were other colors available (such as white, etc). Would you have any insight into this? Being a sort of collector, I thought you might know.
Floyd Crammer's Last Date? I have a 25R Frontman with a Eminence LEGEND 1058 10" 75watt Speaker, and I also have a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, 50watts single 12"...
Mutt69m - Yes, the song is Floyd Cramer's Last Date - a very nice instrumental and instantly recognizable by the audience. My 25R is stock but I've seen folks who have changed out the speaker. Did you have the stock speaker and then changed it for the Eminence, or was the Eminence in the 25R when you bought it? What do you think - is it worth the cost to make the switch? Do you use the 25R for gigs or just for practice? Ben Price - San Antonio
Raul - Yes, you could. It sounds really good with an acoustic-electric guitar. If you need more volume because of the size of the church, I would recommend using a microphone and putting it thought the PA board.
@@raulgrangeiro Raul - Perhaps the most common mic would be a Shure SM57. They are about $100 and you will have it for the rest of your life. You can purchase a gadget called a cabgrabber which will let you mount the microphone in front of the cabinet without using a microphone stand. They are about $50. For higher-end microphones, the really fancy folks use a Sennheiser 906. Also, I have used the Frontman 25R with both acoustic/electrics and straight electrics and it works well with both. It certainly does have that sparkly Fender sound.
I prefer the 25 over the 65 . . . in real life and in this demonstration.
Good demo 👍
I have a 25r from 98 with a steel grate front, and use the drive channel all the time. Sounds as good as the day I bought it. I also use a preamp with it for all the other effects.
I have loved my 25r as a practice amp for several years. My main amp is an old drip edge twin reverb but I get lazy to lug it around. Just tried a Princeton 65 solid state amp which I think is essentially the old version 65r, 65watt 1x12 amp with the same intense presence. I was hoping it would be just a louder 25r but like you mentioned, they really are different amps. Would you say the deluxe 90dsp would be more similar in quality to the 25r ie, without the intense brightness of the 65r?
Jesse - The short answer to your question is yes - I believe you will have more control over the sound with the Deluxe 90, with or without the DSP primarily due to the super sensitive volume control of the Frontman 65R. I also have an older Fender Twin and used it many years ago as my primary amp, so my comments will be based against the FT sound. For me, there are two scenarios to discuss: A) bedroom practicing, and B) on-stage performance.
Bedroom practicing - As the amp is right in front of you and there is very little other noise, our ears are more sensitive to small changes in tone. It is in this case that the intense presence of the Frontman 65R is apparent. Typically, bedroom practicing is done at very low volume levels, which also affect how our ears perceive the sound. In my opinion, it's difficult to set the Frontman 65R to achieve a good low level sound. The 25R, on the other hand, was made for such an environment and works well at low levels. Because the volume control on my Deluxe 90 can be finely adjusted, it is easier to adjust the tone, once the volume is set.
On-stage - Lots of musicians have challenges getting the same tone on-stage as they achieve in the bedroom (especially with effects). For me, I would roll off the treble a bit and boost the mids and lows. There is LOTS of other noise around you (read drummer) that reduces the question to: 1) am I loud enough/too loud, 2) is the tone representative of my instrument (I play a telecaster). All this is presuming you are in a small/mid sized venue and not going through the PA system.
So, while I believe the 65R would be fine for smallish on-stage venues, I would prefer the 25R (or something that has good low level tone and volume control) for bedroom use. Hope that helps. Ben Price - San Antonio
@@ve3cda thank you for your considerate reply! it is nice to know that the deluxe 90 doesn't have as much of that super sensitive volume issue as the 65r. And most, the 25r is definitely more convenient for home use, but sometimes for band practice it's just not getting to the volumes i need it to. thanks again for the reply. I was also looking at the deluxe 112 as an option but i think i'll forgo the 65r and think about the deluxe 112 and the deluxe 90
Princeton 65/Frontman 65 basically the same ??? good blues amps
Mr Serious - I have never owned a Princeton 65 so I don't have an "official" comment. Perhaps someone out there can provide input (after watching this video and seeing the controls of the Frontman 65).
Thanks for this video.
With regards to the drive, I don't personally like it and use a light drive pedal in front.
It was reassuring to hear the info and also kmow that my amp's quirks are standard. Good video
👍🏽
I have that exact 25R I play in my church band. It has a very nice clean sound and the reverb works well. It gets plenty loud to keep up with the house sound system. I stay clean 99% of the time. It also can get dirty too which is nice. I also like to play stone temple pilots/ black keys.. etc. It can handle the distortion fine. It does have a little hum when you crank the gain up.
Hankman3 - Thanks for taking the time to provide real world church experience with the 25R. There was a poster below (Raul Lopes) who was asking questions that you have now answered. Happy New Year. Ben Price - San Antonio
Nice one, very informative and helpful
Nice info, just bought a used 65R..Hopefully it will do the trick..! Struggling with tele and a Peavey Classic 30..Thanks for sharing..Ed..uk..😀
Ed - The Peavey Classic 30 is a very nice amp, as is the 65R. I'm sure you will find they are different in many ways, especially the brightness of the 65R. I play in a classic country band here in South Texas and use a Tele as my main instrument. I don't use any pedals for compression as I find the Tele has a natural bite to it. My recommendation is to play around with the 65R and, if possible, try it out in a live/bar/church setting to dial in the tone you're looking for. Ben Price - San Antonio
Just as a matter of information I have played pedal steel guitar through a Frontman 25R for several years and have been pretty satisfied with the results. I replaced the factory speaker with an Eninance "rajin cajun" which did a lot to improving the audio BUT . . . . I have never been all that fond of the lack of response to the lower frequencies from the amp. Recently I ran across a good deal on a Frontman 65R WITH THE UNDERSTANDING the there was a problem with the volume control (on the clean channel). Since the 65R has a 12 inch speaker (versus the 10 inch in the 25R) I figured that the larger speaker would come closer to bringing out the low frequencies I'm looking for. I have some electronic experience so I figured it would be a matter of replacing the volume potentiometer which is usually a pretty simple thing to do. WRONG!! To start with it is a major disassembly to get to and remove the main circuit board. Beyond that the offending potentiometer (according to some Fender replacement parts suppliers I have contacted) that part is no longer available AND there are no substitutes. So I am now in the process of coming up with some sort of work around to salvage this amp.
brdman3 - Thank for sharing your story. Sorry to hear the repair of the 65R has turned out to be more complicated than anticipated. It might be a long shot, but maybe you could swap the volume pot from the other channel. Anyway, I hope that all works out for you. The 65R certainly has a lot of power and the 12 inch speaker should give reasonable low end for your pedal-steel. Best regards - Ben Price - San Antonio
@@ve3cda That's not an option due to the fact that the clean channel's potentiometer is a 50K (ohms) and the other channel's potentiometer is 100K (ohms). The other problem is finding those with a splined 3/4 inch shaft. I'll come up with something down the road.
@@brdman3 I'm just curious to know if you made any good progress with the volume control problem? I've often thought of soldering 3 wires to the circuit board and using a hard-wired potentiometer to the 3 wired tails, just really to give more choice in potentiometers that could be used as the originals are hard to track down. I would possibly go for an 'Audio' taper pot too, to tame the rapid increase in volume between 1 and 2. Best wishes.
@@alanknott363 What I ended up doing was to replace the offending volume potentiometer (i.e. "pot") with another type. To make this work (and fit), the connectors on the replacement had to be turned UPWARDS. The original's connectors were DOWNWARDS and soldered directly onto the circuit board. It should be noted that with the replacement being turned upwards it is necessary to reverse the wiring from the pot's 2 outside terminals back to the circuit board. If this isn't done correctly your volume would be off when the control is at the fully clockwise position and wide open in the counter-clockwise position. This worked very well and I did use a linear taper pot as opposed to the original audio taper. This corrected the problem. A word of caution here, the factory pots (all of them in the 65R) are carbon FILM pots. If at all possible when replacing them try to find the regular carbon type since the FILM type are more prone to failure especially if they are sprayed with electronic contact cleaners which people sometimes tend to use to clear up 'scratchy' or 'dead spots' . Hope this helps and thanks for the reply.
@@DBlack-zn6gw Glad you got a good result..
8:43 10:44
I have a 65r and I tend to use the gain a lot since I play more classic rock and metal. I find it to be very nice sounding once you find the a sweet spot in the controls. I usually only have my amp set to about 1.5 for the volume and I never really need to have a higher volume on my guitar, usually around 4. The only issue I can really say tone wise is that using a humbucker in the bridge position make the and sound to dirty on the B and high E. Aside from my amp have some age to it and needing a couple repairs it’s a good amp to have as long as you understand it’s controls.
One around locally for sale @ $70. Probably a good deal.?
Brain G - Sorry for the late response - Yes, either amp at $70 is very reasonable (I presume you mean the 25R as the 65R is a little harder to find). Good luck
Had a 25r and sold it now have a champion 20 with all of the cool effects but the 25r sounded killer with my squier tele. Might pick up the 65r for $100 tomorrow
Diesel - I believe you will like the 65R, but it is a different amp than the 25R. Let us know how that works out.
@@ve3cda the only issue I have is no mid control for the clean channel. Thats why I love the 25r.
Is this amp good for hard rock? Like scorpions, acdc, kiss, bon jovi, quiet riot, twisted sister.. etc
Tania - there are a lot of factors to consider when responding to your question. First, I presume we're talking about the Frontman 65R. The only effect this amp has is overdrive - which is passable if you tweak it a bit. To get sounds like the bands mentioned in your question, you will need external foot pedals or effects. While the 65R is pretty loud, a lot of the answer to your question depends on where you're playing. If you're a beginning garage band, then the amp will be fine. If you're in a venue with any more than 100 people (larger than a smallish bar), you will need to mic the amp, or use a direct box. If you haven't yet purchased an amp, and your intention is hard rock, I would recommend you look for a used Peavey Bandit (silver or red stripe). These are perhaps $200 on Craigslist and are adequate for most situations. If possible, seek out someone local that you know and trust to help you gather information and make decisions. Unless you are an experienced musician, a lot of this stuff can be quite confusing. I hope this helps - Ben Price - San Antonio
@@ve3cda Thank you very much this helped a lot!
I have 2 red 25R's,,a 65R & a Blue 212R 100 watt,,,Iam looking for a blue 25R
GMoneyDon - I have seen blue Fender amps from time to time, and that has got me wondering if there were other colors available (such as white, etc). Would you have any insight into this? Being a sort of collector, I thought you might know.
@@benprice8175 ,,,fender put out 500 each of the red and blue 25R and 500 each of the 212R 100 watt amps these are great amps
Floyd Crammer's Last Date? I have a 25R Frontman with a Eminence LEGEND 1058 10" 75watt Speaker, and I also have a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, 50watts single 12"...
Mutt69m - Yes, the song is Floyd Cramer's Last Date - a very nice instrumental and instantly recognizable by the audience. My 25R is stock but I've seen folks who have changed out the speaker. Did you have the stock speaker and then changed it for the Eminence, or was the Eminence in the 25R when you bought it? What do you think - is it worth the cost to make the switch? Do you use the 25R for gigs or just for practice? Ben Price - San Antonio
Your dog photobombed the video.
Love it
li possiedo entrambi come pure il 15r e li adoro ❤
Great video
A very nice video. Is it possible to use the 25r on a church?
Raul - Yes, you could. It sounds really good with an acoustic-electric guitar. If you need more volume because of the size of the church, I would recommend using a microphone and putting it thought the PA board.
@@ve3cda have you used it with accoustic guitar? But probably I'll use with an electric one.
@@ve3cda what mic do you recommend to use with it?
@@raulgrangeiro Raul - Perhaps the most common mic would be a Shure SM57. They are about $100 and you will have it for the rest of your life. You can purchase a gadget called a cabgrabber which will let you mount the microphone in front of the cabinet without using a microphone stand. They are about $50. For higher-end microphones, the really fancy folks use a Sennheiser 906. Also, I have used the Frontman 25R with both acoustic/electrics and straight electrics and it works well with both. It certainly does have that sparkly Fender sound.
@@ve3cda thanks for the answers. I'll look for that mic!
Yeccch 😢 tone