Why Are Adult Stories Usually Dumb?
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
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It’s always hilariously and sadly ironic how well a lot of kid’s shows aged so well for their nuanced and subtle takes on irl and in-universe topics (Justice League and Unlimited come to mind) whereas for “adult cartoons,” we get shit like Velma
I can only hope that things like Velma serve as a nice negative example for anyone who tries it again.
Episode 1 of Justice League goes much harder than it has any right to and it's incredible.
Bro I was watching megas xlr with my friend like "oh you remember that one show we watched a yt clip yesterday of, wanna watch it?" And the comedy resonated so hard we sat multiple nights just laughing, Im not very adult yet, 23 yo but i guess things sometimes grow old better than how you think they would
Today adult woke adult story formula: kinkery and bad words.
@hermitcard4494 how is it woke
"I don't make movies for children. I make movies for the child in all of us." -- Walt Disney
That aged badly.
… and that is complete nonsense. Did you ever see adult man watching Mickey Mouse?
@@leonidfro8302 Yes. Not Mickey Mouse House or whatever but those older cartoons actually made in Walt's time are very funny even for adults.
Now they make movies for the adults in children.
@@leonidfro8302Absolutely. The original Mickey Mouse cartoons could be appreciated by all ages. Mickey could be a jerk and got his comeuppance a lot as well.
Modern Disney how lost sight of appealing to the child in us while also exploring themes adults can relate to.
That is how I feel about “adult” language. Yes, you’re so adult for using the vocabulary of every 12 year old playing Xbox Live. So mature of you.
I’m quite guilty of this, off camera. The truth is that it’s lazy. I could think of an interesting adjective or go with F. The latter usually wins out of habit, I’m afraid
If it's a war movie/series (I.E. Generation Kill, which is fantastic) I can look past it given that most infantry/combat arms types I know are pretty crass (and have a morbid/vulgar sense of humor to boot).
Haha I feel the same way! It was the only “adult” category that is often abused that was missing from Greg’s analysis
This is a issue I have with real-life, too. There have been studies done, and people who curse casually ARE seen as being immature and less intelligent. And, yeah, supposedly there are a couple studies that say that they're actually 'more' intelligent (maybe they're just more ticked off by all the idiots around them, lol,) but that's the image they are projecting. The rest of us ARE judging, people.
And more and more, the shows throw it in because 'that's what's done', even when it's ridiculously awkward. I tuned into Picard when it first aired, and, for the record, I LOVE Sir Patrick, he's an excellent actor, and I grew up on TNG, so I was really looking forward to the new series. Then, midway through the first episode, and here we suddenly have PICARD dropping the F-bomb? To be a bit of a hypocrite, WTF!!! Picard's a diplomat, he doesn't just go swearing at people, IF that's even a word that will still be used in our far-flung future. And the admiral doesn't sound any more natural when she starts swearing back at him, either. It completely threw me out of the scene. And apparently he was against it, too, but let himself be talked into it, because 'that's what's done'. Next time, please stick to your principles, good Sir.
Now, given, I'm not that impressed with the series anyway, it's really not good, but that is one of the things that sticks with me the most.
@@gregowen2022become the Brian Regan of RUclips though. Please.
“When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” ― C.S. Lewis
He took that from the Apostle Paul too
I saw some conservative writers dissing the Narnia books on twitter a few days ago, and was very disappointed to see that his wisdom has been lost here. THAT BEING SAID, a ton of YA is extremely childish and immature, and encourages kids and adults who read it to be immature, so I get the impulse. Just...be intelligent about it, and not lazily blanket!
@@millernumber1 Kids are dumb, but they're not stupid. People forget that.
@@silverheart4049 interesting idea! :D
Wow, that is an excellent phrase
"You've got to remember who your writing for. You're not merely writing for children. You're writing for the unfortunate people who've got to read the stories over, and over, and over again." Rev. Wilbert Awdry
Big reason why I appreciate his work more as an adult.
So.. I make indie comics, which are a medium that was once *mainly* meant to be for kids and is now almost completely saturated with fringe adult degeneracy. Meanwhile, the comics I grew up with- which really were meant for kids, retain essential elements of storytelling, mythology, and literacy that seem to be a lost art.
When you right or perform with a hinderance, like having to make it family friendly, you usually get a better product. I think it’s in our nature to take the easy way out, and visual pulp is just that.
What kind of stories do you make?
@@gregowen2022 I consider them to be “heroic adventure” - fantasy and science fiction with comedic elements.. the current thing I am doing is about an alien princess who ends up stranded on a hostile planet with her robotic butler. But I am pulling story ideas from Hamlet (a usurped throne) and King Lear (sisters vying for a throne) as well.
@@empyreanvole And where can we find this? 😁
C.S. Lewis also understood the most important thing of writing for children: that they so not need to be talked down to or have things hidden or oversimplified. Narnia deals with some heavy themes like treachery, death and sacrifice with no attempt to soften them.
I've thrown my screenplay of Greg Owen: The Movie in the bin. Replacing all the sex scenes with drinking tea was a disaster. That and replacing him with a strong female lead.
I completely shredded my script when the Segway to subscribe was interrupted by several ssx scenes and scenes of him snorting Coke.
Writing with constraint produces greatness! If can write an erotic scene, fully clothed, involving only tea and maybe dad jokes, that’s Oscar material right there!
@@gregowen2022 A fully clothed, erotic scene with tea and dad jokes sounds....amazing! (And possibly family friendly)
@@gregowen2022've seen that being done with tootbrush instead of tea before
Greg is so refreshing. I like all the critic guys but his is quickly becoming my favorite. The way he says everything like it's kinda funny really makes it easy not to feel negative when he's ripping a movie apart
He's great.
I refuse to care about his tea, though.
@@AbsoluteBumderor his rampant procreation
I appreciate that! Being angry all the time just isn’t fun.
You guys might be surprised how many people used to ask what was in the cup before I started mentioning it
That "I'm thirsty" cut with Patrick Rothfuss made me almost cry laughing. I don't even know who that guy is but it just caught me off guard😂
I’m glad someone else liked it too. I was chuckling at my desk while adding it!
My favourite kids movie is probably The Incredibles. The story, pacing and animation is perfect. If I recall correctly the theme is having the courage to be true to who you are and where you are. For Mrs Incredible its letting her family embrace their unique strengths and use them, and for Mr Incredible its finding the joy in the normality of family life and appreciating today rather than living in past glory. We don't need super powers to relate to all of that.
I've been watching Vikings lately and I'm getting close to dropping it because of how many gratuitous sex scenes it has.
It feels like they had a quota to include at least one, if not more, per episode.
Your mistaking that for Spartacus, and Shameless.
@@ThePrinceOfNigeriadespite it having too much sex I still thought the Spartacus show had fantastic writing and storytelling.
@@secondcoming9789 I agre
The one thing I really notice about adult shows is the fact that 'nobody' can seem to do anything social or have a meal without having alcohol involved. Dinner time? Break out the wine. Casual get-together with a friend or two, or whatever? We must have beer, or whiskey/rye/champagne/etc. I'll admit I'm not a very social person, quite the opposite, and I don't like alcohol, (I don't mean I'm against it, I just physically don't like the taste,) but it happens so often it seems to be a trope. 'Hey, we're adults, so we must drink the adult drink'. I would just love to see a show where the people sit down to dinner, and they have a glass of water or juice or milk with it, or, hey, maybe even tea, or have a visit and enjoy a couple cans of pop or something... Not everything requires alcohol.
I'm not sure when it started, but over the past several years, I've had more and more appreciation for stories/movies that use death and violence sparingly. That way, when it happens, it makes it so much more impactful. Somebody finding the strength to kill someone is infinitely more interesting than somebody killing 200 people on the way to kill the bad guy. Also, I'd even argue the scenes that "conveniently block your view" from the violence actually hit harder than seeing it directly. Maybe not every time, but a lot of times.
I agree. The use of blocking the violence forces you to imagine it and it’s so much more “real” in that way. Your idea on violence also applies to language, I’m finding. When used sparingly, it’s much more impactful
@@gregowen2022 Oh yeah, 100% on the language thing too. I understand that in "real life" people would be swearing constantly in stressful situations, but when telling a story, it seems like it's just for edge a lot of times. But when your character is "well spoken" in regards to swearing and finally drops the bomb because he gets pushed so far, you definitely feel it more.
Kind of like when your dad really tries to refrain from swearing when you're a child and you just annoy him so bad it finally slips and you instantly think "oh geez I'm gonna get it now. it's over".
You are rising through the ranks of all my favorite reviewers and film analysis youtubers. Keep up the good work!
Thank you so much!
I personally love doctor suess because he feels so optimistic in a world that isn't perfect. Its like he knows the world sucks but doesn't want adults to get caught in that part alone then weavrs in childlike wonder for all ages to enjoy, but its effect is different depending on the audience
I don't comment too often but thanks for this, I have struggled to articulate even to myself the thoughts you have expressed here. I have distanced myself from a lot of adult stories and media because of the overuse of the standard crutches and the lack of any kind of subtlety it feels like there is a competition to up the ante, so that the sex, violence and drug use gets more and more over the top which in my opinion distracts more then adds the story. I get annoyed with the distractions in stories. I very much appreciate subtlety I don't like things spelled out for me I enjoy a story best when I am allowed to think for myself without being drug into what amounts to me as side quests.... I like be able to run the story though the sieve of my own experience, thoughts and opinions too often the crutches slow and dumb the story down. Anyhow thanks again.
10:41 I would add characters to story and theme here because one of my pet peeves about characters in”adult content” is that they are often only defined by their desire for sex,drugs or violence - the first example I think of is Starfire from DC if she’s in a “kids” story she usually has depth, cares about her teammates and has her own motivations depending on the story, the current threat or mission but if you read or watch more “mature” stuff with her she is only motivated by a desire to sleep with any and all characters around her or some other superficial thing like in the “Red Hood” comic or the “I am not Starfire” comic both terrible stories with awful depictions of characters done much better in “kid” stories
That’s a good point. A character driven entirely by vice has basically no agency. The vice has more character than the character!
This is why the CW bugs me so much. Not only are they trying to write "adult shows" but their view of adult is what they believe that teenagers believe it means to be adult....
I've said this many times before, but an excellent series for this is Gravity Falls, a show for adults that appears to be a show for children. It does so much for both demographics and that's why it's still beloved so many years after the series came to an end.
I need to check it out, because I saw it on Cartoon Network and the animation looks so basic I figured it was just dumb
Thank you! I've tried to express this when reviewing stuff. Several movies and TV shows I have seen I wouldn't recommend for families not because there's violence, sex or disturbing images, but just because it entails complicated subjects and themes that a lot of younger kids just wouldn't understand or feel bored by it. (Vivy, Interstellar just off the top of my head)
Also have to post the quote:
“Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” -CS Lewis
I fully agree with you on the stoner gripe. When I was a teen I loved stoner movies but I was also an idiot (even more so than I am today) now that I'm older it's just annoying to watch. Kinda in the same sense of being the sober person at the Xmas party. Also the excessive sex is just cringe, I haven't seen Oppenheimer but majority of what I'm hearing is all about a 15 minute sexing with Florence Pugh. I sure hope the scene drives the movie a bit.
Haha, right? I haven’t watched Half Baked since I was a kid, but I fear that it won’t be nearly as funny as I thought it was back then.
Nolan shot the whole movie with IMAX cameras. If you see guys lining up at IMAX theaters, well it’s not to see the explosions
@@gregowen2022 I can't say that I wouldn't want to see florance pugh in I max lol
I took a writing workshop with one of the writers from Dawson’s Creek around 2008. Dude had worked in tv for decades and knew some stuff. One girl casually mentioned Zoey 101. Some snickered but I backed her up and said that show is really funny. Then this man in his early fifties said, “It is really funny. I think Nickelodeon is putting out some of the best comedy right now because they actually have to be clever, they can’t just go for the crude shock humor.”
SpongeBob has legitimately good comedy writing.
Honestly, I find it sad that all people think belong in an adult story is blood, gore, sex, drugs, swearing and causing so many disturbing moments that can turn a lesser man's stomach. It's INHERENTLY juvenile and pretty much misses what these things can really do: bring out a truly mature story that hits hetty themes mature people can only pick up on. My personal pick for this is a manga called Berserk, which has pretty much everything a bad adult program from the West has, but plays them properly to REALLY get the Nietzschean themes and philosophy of overcoming darkness and tragedy to reach true happiness. And yeah, it was Game of Thrones before A Song of Ice and Fire ever hit shelves.
Every death displays a permanent end, a Brutal death is used in either retribution or to show how EVIL some creature is. Sex is used in different ways: to assert power or control like with Donovan or Wyald (don't worry, they get exactly what they deserve), display a bonding of true romance and comfort like between Guts and Casca, or even used as a means to a greater end like with Griffith. The Gore and R@p3 are meant to show cruelty and evil. Scars are not only body decoration: they tell a story of the person, a memory made manifest as to what the character has experienced. I could go on, but I'd spoil a lot of it.
There's religious symbolism, political references to historical accounts; philosophical ponderings on cruelty, the nature of good and evil, the nature of Man, and our underlying darkness, the hope of faith and blindness of fanaticism, Fate and Destiny, and the strength of the human will.
Granted, it is a hard story to get through if you don't like things like brutal fight scenes, heavy subject matter, Cosmic Horror, Dark Fantasy, extremely depressing moments or slow storytelling. However, I proffer this: when things get the hardest to read is when the most rewarding parts of the story arrive and simply quitting can and will spoil a good thing. Basically, tough it out and you'll get something good.
Added bonus: you can piss off Twitter while reading the best manga ever written and getting a fun and gritty story about a man overcoming great evils, both without and within, to truly reach peace. I highly recommend it because the author and those who have taken up his place truly care for giving a great story by taking the things adult stories use as selling points in a vain attempt to seem "Mature" and use them as vehicles to achieve a truly mature story.
I would love to read it. Dark Souls father Hidetaka Miyazaki apparently references it in all the games. If he likes it, I’m willing to give it a go
@gregowen2022 I'd highly recommend it. The exploration of the themes and lighter moments combined with the terrifying Horrors are blended together perfectly to make the whole read so rewarding.
Velma is probably the epitome of pumping your media full of shock value, trying so hard to be "adult," and yet results in being so immature because they didn't have any deep characters or story due to all their efforts being focused on seeming "adult."
One movie that seems like it would succumb to these same pitfalls, but doesn't, is Dredd (2012). Very underrated action movie filled with violence, drugs, and brief nudity. However, the way that film uses these devices is very clever. It's essentially a raid movie, with 2 officers tasked with busting a drug operation in a dystopian future. There's tons of gore, but it's made explicitly clear that this world they inhabit is filled with crime and corruption, and the apartment building they're infiltrating is populated by innocent tenants being suppressed by said violence. The drugs are a fictional substance that has a slow-mo effect and is used for a very satisfying climax. And the nudity shown is utilized by the co-lead psychic to manipulate a villain shown to have a sexual desire for her. It's a movie that doesn't waste a single one of the things that give it that R Rating, and I highly recommend giving it a watch. (Plus Karl Urban from the Boys plays the titular Judge Dredd).
The movie where Dr. Bones decided he wanted to become the Harmacist instead.
I love this. I am not a husband or father yet, but I still have a great appreciation for animation and films/TV aimed towards kids. Some of your review videos on movies I liked were how I found the channel and now you are one of only 2-3 movie channels I have notifications for. I've had a lot of the same thoughts you shared in this video, I've just never coalesced them and shared them in such a thoughtful and well-discussed way. Keep up the fantastic work!
I really appreciate the kind words and I am so glad you are enjoying the videos! Thank you so much for watching
I loved how smart and thought through Adventure Time is.
Having been a Saw fan, I enjoyed the level of inventiveness and the BTS sections on the physical media were normally fun to watch. A couple of people walking around a store looking at things and thinking about ways to "utilize them" in the story sometimes ironically. I watched that franchise in a similar way to Final Destination, here let's find neat ways to off people. Actually, having just typed that last sentence fragment it matches up quite well with those other "adult" movies. As for a great "kids" movie, I have to go with the one that lead me to your channel, "Puss in Boots The Last Wish".
The first Saw and first FD I thought were really good. I still consider Saw to be one of the best movies ever considering it was filmed in like 2 days or something. But then I thought they both went downhill for the exact reasons you enjoyed them. Lol i quit after the 3rd of each series. They lost all substance.
Saw is also basically a soap opera, I want to see what nonsensical twist their gonna pull out next.
The real Jigsaw was the second cousin twice removed of police dude we saw for exactly three seconds and he’s been working with Kramer since he was eight so he’s the first first apprentice and also this entire movie took place in the 1800s.
One children's cartoon I'd like to bring up is Static Shock. It's a weekly cartoon that is very clearly for children, and its animation is just so old now, but some episodes were covering serious things. School shootings, homelessness, etc.
I noticed this with comedians awhile back. So many of them will jump to cussing, sex, and toilet humor because the only way they can keep an audience is to shock them.
This has been especially bad with female comics. They think the shock value of being a vulgar woman works, and for some it does for a bit, but it wears off quickly
"Seriously guys, rub one out before you start writing" so good... thank you
I came for the film reviews but stayed for the philosophical musings.
You need to get out of my head! I have been saying this for literally a decades. It began when I discovered some of my favorite comic writers had made some indie comics, only to discover that the first thing many of them did when freed from the constraints of the mainstream was to flaunt their ability to put boobs, drugs, f-bombs, and excessive violence in the comic in the place of where they would usually have put a story. Then I decided that as an adult I should read some novels outside of the YA genre, but discovered the same thing in the first few books I attempted. I have since found better adult examples in both mediums, but now I notice that juvenile definition of mature everywhere-books, movies, video games, tv shows, music, etc
It is unfortunate that you find that in so many places where creators are freed and suddenly need to push the boundaries and flaunt their ability to show whatever they want. As Dr. Malcom said, they were so obsessed with whether they could, they didn’t stop to consider if they should
Hey Arnold.
A kids show but deals with some very adult themes. As a kid most of it flew over my head but as a adult i rewatched it and was surprised how it tackles some things. One episode that stood out to me the most is pigeon man.
I found Over the Moon to be really impactful. It's a girl's quest to find the goddess of the Moon to ask her to bring back her dead mother. It deals with grief, anger at a parent finding love again, and finding your place in a new family. I highly recommend it
This is why I don't read fantasy anymore. Because after Harry Potter, every fantasy story has to tell you it's not for kids by mentioning sex in the first two pages and I just roll my eyes.
Like, I get why. It's just so cringe I can't take it seriously.
I'm 30. I refuse to watch any movie or show with sex scenes of any sort. I haven't picked up a romance novel since before I got married seven years ago. It's not honoring to my husband, my own body, or God to have sexual immorality of ANY kind before my eyes. I'll stick with How to Train Your Dragon, Hotel Transylvania, and other FAMILY FRIENDLY entertainment.
this is extra relevant with horror. I've always thought kids horror so much smarter and more entertaining that adult horror stories. kids horror can't just chop off heads and limbs. kids horror has to be smarter and more story and suspense.
I really enjoy watching Power Rangers and Super Sentai (Japanese Power Rangers, which all of our western versions are adapted from). I love the campy, insane, unapologetic FUN they're overflowing with, but I also like the strong themes of family and friendship that every series is inherently intertwined with.
I started comparing it to "adult" shows like Game of Thrones.
Why is it that murder and rape and horrors upon horrors with no hope for anyone whatsoever are considered "adult", but a show that tells you to look out for your friends, to always try to do the right thing even when it's difficult, even to try and care for your enemies whenever possible, is considered childish?
I've said many times IRL that most people never get past their "grade school" mentality, where kids are far more concerned about how they and their likes/dislikes will appear to others, sacrificing what they love and pretending to love something they hate just to fit in.
Then, once those kids grow up, those learned habits have become such an integral part of their very being that they actually BELIEVE that they love or hate certain things, because they've only trained themselves to go along with the consensus, but never to question it.
You could write entire academic papers on how our entire world is based on this one single foundation; everything is based on fitting in.
So people watch "mature" programming, not because they actually think it IS mature, but because of how watching said programming allows them to have their "hot takes" and fit in with everyone else watching the same show. It's learned behavior that has nothing at all to do with any deeper thought, because there IS no deeper thought.
And then those shows paint pictures of bleak, hopeless worlds, and then those people consume nothing but hopelessness, speak nothing but hopelessness, and then wonder why the world seems so hopeless, because a world without hope isn't simply all they understand, it's all they're willing to ALLOW TO EXIST.
So I'm very glad that Power Rangers/Super Sentai is not mainstream like the MCU or Game of Thrones or anything else, because people would just suck all the joy out of it and deconstruct it just like they do with everything else. Then once all that was left was an empty husk, they'd move on to the next thing to consume, leaving the original fans behind to pick up whatever pieces were left of what they once loved.
I watched Power Rangers as a kid and through that discovered Super Sentai and tokusatsu in general. (Sentai is by and large the superior show to PR). I wouldn't necessarily agree that toku is "campy" by definition, but I do agree with your overall point. I'd much rather watch tokus (especially from the 80s through the 2000s) than a lot of modern Western media over the past two decades. In fact, most of what I do watch anymore are tokus and old movies and shows made before the 90s.
I also finished an action-adventure book that I plan to self-publish, where the heroes' suits and fights, and the villains, are loosely inspired by the Garo and Metal Hero series. I'm just waiting on some artwork to be finished; but in the meantime, I've converted the book into a spec script and tried submitting it to some festivals on FilmFreeway and studios on InkTip.
I think your points apply to real life as well. People with active sex lives and those who engage in drug use are often dull, shallow and miserable.
It's always fun when someone articulates thoughts you've never said out loud yourself. You pretty much nail my feelings on sex scenes exactly. Sex scenes are almost always narrative brake slamming. A lot of filmmakers could learn a thing or two from RocknRolla's sex scene. It lasts 2 seconds. "Just like you," my wife says, but I don't know what she's talking about.
The Wise Man's Fear detour into magic fairy sex was doubly frustrating for me because the section before that was the first time I was truly engaged in Kvothe's story in either book. It felt like the plot was finally kicking in. The rest of the book lost me completely. I have sympathy for Rothfuss fans, but I'm not losing any sleep if the series remains unfinished.
I was able to go to the bookstore for the first time in a long time a couple days ago, and when I did I immediately went to the intermediate readers and young adult section.
Mom: "Why did you go to this section?"
Me: "So I can find a nice meaty book without being blindsided by sex and other garbage."
Nine times out of ten when I try reading a book marketed for adults it's got the stuff you listed that I don't care about in the slightest--I don't care about sex, and I don't really want to read about the drudgery of life. Gimme books like Guardians of Ga'Hoole or the Books of the Raksura or even the ones I'm reading right now, the Chaos Knight trilogy, where I can get into an entirely different world and care about these characters without being hit by "and then suddenly NSFW" stuff. X\
Drug trips scare me, and I'm 32 and on meds
As an adult, yes, adult stories are dumb and painfully boring!
Thank you so much for putting into clear and concise words what many of us are feeling but haven't been able to articulate.
I generally don't like most of what you have said either, but one thing I must admit is that I like when violence is shown to set the tone of a setting, like the Northman was a good example of this, you may have gotten away with thinking it was just going to have the heroic main character striking villains with his sword and axe, and you see a splash of blood but nothing else, but no, instead we get an insight into both how brutal the world is, and how brutal he has to be in response, literally tearing someone's throat out with his teeth after he's already knocked him to the floor, not just to save himself, but because he is religiously embodying a wolf, he's in a wolf mindset, he's "a beast in manflesh" as they say later in the movie.
Justice League Unlimited and the Cadmus arc. You knew Cadmus were the bad guys, but it was a struggle to come up with a good reason why. Wallers speech about a laser pointed down, shutting Batman up was so good and it really made you think.
There's a related concept to exaggerated juvenility that I like to refer to as (because I name my own fictional theorems until I hear something better that says the same thing) "Rated R for Deadpool", a theory that also explains where these things keep coming from.
Essentially, the problem is that filmmakers know that adult-rated content cannot categorically be marketed to kids, and will likely have a young audience comprised solely of those few who could somehow dupe the guy at the ticket counter. Once you cross the threshold of "mature" content, there is no going back from this. As such, this "mature" content often results in "in for a penny, in for a pound" style thinking. After all, if you can't make your money back on the young, your only available target demographics left are the various flavors of hedonists who confused "grow up" with "get taller". Sure you've got swearing and violence... but what about drugs for the stoner market? What about nudity for the horndogs? What about excessive gore for the slasher fans? Sex on screen! Make it a glorified p0rno! And don't forget to sprinkle the entire script with F-bombs until it goes from comically excessive to troublingly Freudian. Suddenly your gritty crime drama wherein one character drops a racial slur because it served the plot, setting and / or characters turns into Weekend at Slaaneesh's.
The reason these "mature" works come off as grotesque juvenile abominations whose sole aspiration is to be human vice's answer to a completed pokedex is because that's what they were designed to be. There _are_ no successful pieces of media who use mature content with restraint and for a purpose. Not anymore. The very understandable societal decision to artificially fence mature content from children (usually... Cuties) literally created a market incentive to wallow in excess. Deadpool, already a famous and wildly child-inappropriate antihero with a built-in audience essentially tested the waters for this theory, and apparently it's viable... for now. Hollywood executives betting their entire fortunes on creating a Deadpool-like extravaganza of debauchery (even DC Comics retconned Harley Quinn into a Deadpool of their own) would do well to remember that (1) Marvel was in vogue at the time, and (2) Ryan Reynolds is _hella_ charismatic, even when playing an intentionally annoying ass-clown.
For some reason when you were talking about sex in stories, I was reminded of the 1960s Ausin Powers movies such as Matt Helm and Derek Flint.
Wake up have sex
have breakfast have sex
get the assignment have sex
etc.
It was all done as a satire of James Bond.
Too much of “adult content” is just the same edgy, crude humor and shock value plot devices over and over. I love a good wholesome story that focuses on just regular (or extraordinary) people and their internal struggles, relationships, and conflicts. Good points as always ☀️
The lego movie. My favorite movie of all time 😢 wish it gotten a better sequel in my opinion
I'd say a kids' story that's very grown up with its themes is Puss in Boots 2 while a series that's pretty juvenile in its attempts to be grown up would probably be Helluva Boss.
Aww snap, you got the sponsor plugs now, moving on up! Lol It sucks you gotta do it, but I'm glad to see your channel growing, and getting free stuff out of it I'm sure is always nice.
Just recently a friend said they refuse to watch anything animated because they feel "watching cartoons" is childish. I'm just gonna show him this video because you make the argument in a way I never could. I'd go so far as to say it's rare I'm able to really enjoy "adult" content the same way. It almost feels like there's been a switch; adults and their content are more childish than ever, children seem to be more self-aware than we were when I was growing up. Is it just me growing up or do you think this a more ubiquitous recent phenomenon?
Laughed aloud at the insertion of Editor Greg. Good comedic timing!
I read all the Narnia books. Dislike most of it, but really enjoy the allegories and some of the concepts. What i found interesting is that i liked the most the books that didn't make into movies.
The horse and his boy and The Silver Chair were pretty cool. The Silver Chair had a lot of Bible things, which kinda became a theme, even though i'm not catholic it was entertaining.
The final book also has a few references, like the false god (or is it the false prophet?!) and the book of revelation (if i'm not mistaken) which announces the end
You didn't like the books? Very sad!
@@millernumber1 The story was very bland, but i like a lot of the concepts. I LOVED the nephew of the magician or something. A very cool concept of multiple worlds that doesn't go anywhere (because it was launched after the main series).
@@millernumber1 I don't regret reading it though
@@ricardogoncalves164 Interesting thoughts. I personally love the whole series, but it definitely is one of those things that can be polarizing. While I don't recommend the series, The Magicians by Lev Grossman does play with the idea that you liked in The Magician's Nephew. I'd recommend Piranesi by Susana Clarke way more, though!
@@millernumber1 that's the séries that got adapted into a show, right?!
Becausd i watched 1 Season and was pretty weak. Is the book better?
As an adult it's definitely
Alcohol < Coffee < Water
On the topic of violence and horror, movies that I absolutely love like John Carpenter's "The Thing" show grotesque, twisted monsters that David Cronenberg would approve of completely in the light, but the paranoia and knowing who can and can't be trusted are front and center (at least in my opinion). Despite what it's known for (and was blasted for on release), it's surprisingly restrained in the violence department and focuses on creating a tense, claustrophobic atmosphere where Kurt Russell's beard is the only thing you can trust.
There are scenes in that movie that don't involve the blood and guts shown that *still* chill me to the bone, and I've seen that movie dozens of times.
I do really like David Cronenberg work especially Videodrome and Crash .. I don’t know why but I not so big into John Carpenter.. I do ♥️ The Thing that is amazing indeed but can’t say why not the another things so much but that probably different taste and such…!
@@bacht4799 The Fly has been on my list for some time now, speaking of David Cronenberg (and I think that might be even more gross than The Thing).
Bro The Name of the Wind is my fav book of ALLTIME!...i won't forgive Rothfuss for the second book, wtf was he thinking.
I agree, I was disappointed in the second, and I think that might be why he can’t finish the third. Name of the Wind is phenomenal and he wasn’t able to capture the lightning twice and seems to have been knocked down so badly that he can’t get up.
its performative
u see a bit of that in twitter posts where it combines baby language and curse words, a infanticizing of adults cause they don't want to grow up
kid stories should be design to make a kid smarter, so they add morals into the plot, they give deeper thoughts, when they don't u get modern kid shows, that same infanicizing of the characters to dumb them down than trusting kids to be smarter or handle deeper subjects, especially in the west
Now that i think about it the drugs are kind of the least important thing in breaking bad. They are the mcguffin that pushes the plot along but ultimately the shows all about the characters and how theyre affected by the drugs.
Also my go to answer for a kids movie that's more than just a kids movie is the secret of nimh but watership down is probably a close second
I enjoyed the series Experience Force by Craig Allanson and in over 200 hours of stories on audible sex is mentioned several times but it cuts away before and picks up after every time and it is never gratuidous.
In 'Nobody Wants to Read Your Sh*t' by Steven Pressfield, he wrote that there was a way to make a sex scene good:
Write it like an action scene.
Like an action scene it ought to drive the story forward and develop the characters. If it doesn't do either of these, it ought to be cut.
What you're seeing with adult movies and stories is those creators trying to differentiate themselves from either 3000 or 140 years of written stories or movies. It's really hard. Visualize the pitch "Picture Andy Griffith show but.......wait for it........ with nudity and coke! I know right, amazing."
The clone wars animated series is an example of a kid's show with deeper meaning. The only thing about it that really sets it as a kids show is the dialog. It is very much at an elementary level. It also sad when comparing it to the disjointed and self contradicting writing in Star Wars now. World building was much better when Lucas was involved making kids cartoons.
The Clone Wars Cartoon starts off very slow. But after the first season is very good. The goes through life lessons time and time again.
I would highly recommend Star Wars: Clone Wars 2003. It is really good. Disney does not consider it canon. But it shows Anakin as Obi Wan talks to Luke about in ANH.
There is a place for the ultra violence. Namely in war movies. Black Hawk Down and We Were Soldiers needed the extreme graphic violence to hammer in the story.
Re watches Phineas Ferb just for this Video! Hehehehe
This is true, Avatar the Last Airbender is my favorite show of all time, it literally has the best storytelling of anything I've seen. It has a lot of real world "adult" themes but is still technically a kids show
"Why would I teach somebody who is foolish enough to jump off a roof?"
Common John Wick W
You know you made me realize how well Breaking Bad dealt with drugs and violence compared to other media. It never glorified either of them, typically they were used for much more of a horror aspect. It never showed you how "cool" the criminal life was, and it never made characters who were high seem out of place by either being 'too gone' and going on psychedelic adventures, they actually knew how drugs worked lol. The violence was always shocking but it felt well deserved, because it wasn't afraid to show you that while violence is a part of the criminal underworld it isn't a constant 24/7 battleground.
I think what a lot of writers fail to understand is that a story is always the main ingredient, and that action, comedy, romance, horror, shock, etc., are only ever going to be seasonings to make that story better. You are right with kids shows, being that they have to hold back a lot more it forces them either make a good story or be forgotten. The Incredibles to this day is my favorite superhero movie ever, and it's because while it is awesome and shows great superhero combat it didn't rely on it as a crutch. Meanwhile I found myself begging for Marvel fights to 'just end' even 10 years ago when they were still actually decent movies.
In A Wise Man's Fear, I'm not gonna lie, I found the fey wild part hilarious because it was so ridiculous. But I agree, after that I was like "yes, I get it..."
The part of that book that really threw me for a loop of going "whaaaaat?" (as my eyes slowly widen in horror the more I think about it) was the entire tribe(?) nation(?) that are so disbelieving that the entire menstrual cycle is a thing. Just imagine for a second the horror implied in that.
(Sorry to necro this)
Really enjoying the witty insights and the analysis.
Greg Owens is exactly the type of person I would invite to game night with friends and/or family.
Thank you!
We’d have a fun time, game night is so fun, I don’t know why more people don’t do them!
That pizza cutter comment is brilliant
THANK YOU FOR TALKING ABOUT WISE MAN’S FEAR!!!
A Children’s story that I found powerful was “Sound of Freedom.”
That one counts right? It’s the “children’s story”…. I’m sorry I just watched it, humor is my defense mechanism and I’m so flippen emotional from that movie right now
That’s why I can’t watch it! That particular subject matter gets me more than any other. I know when I do watch it that I’m going to be crying and somehow angry at the same time
From what I've heard that movie seems to take the issue of child sex trafficking and turn it into an action adventure following a "Man with a plan" rather than a more coordinated, realistic effort that could be used to help a much wider population of victims. I haven't watched it and probably won't, mainly because it sounds like the child abuse is being used as shock value. Still, I can't judge what I haven't seen. Just seems odd when people claim they cried in the first 40 mins, like, Yeah it sounds like you were feeling the anticipation of one of the most horrific things happening to innocent kids :/
@@CrescentUmbreon it’s a really good movie. It’s well executed and steers clear of any type of visual content. For example you see that government agents need to write report on all the footage they find. So someone has to watch each caught interaction for court. The Movie shows the reflection in the agent’s eye which is then glossed over with a tear. The action isn’t prevalent enough for it to be an “action movie.” The beginning shows real life security footage of cases where minors are snatched so yeah it’s has an impact
@CrescentUmbreon I've heard nearly the opposite, that compared to a movie like Taken, it doesn't turn it into a glorified action hero movie.
I haven't watched it but I know it's based on a true story and the guy the movie is about was heavily involved with its production.
They're also planning a documentary to cover the operations that couldn't be featured in the movie.
I love anime for that reason it has different well thought stories for each genre. Some are more “childish” but they are quite deep.
Now some like Cross Ange have fanservice but it is done in a way that furthers character development.
Ex 1: Ange getting stripped was to show the cold world the princess was now in. That she was no longer a person but a tool for war.
Ex 2: Ange walking in torn clothes was to show she no longer cared if others saw her practically naked. Why because she didn't value herself anymore & was secretly broken.
Ex 3: Ange kissing the mean girls was to show she could regain power. After they tried to poison her with a laxative.
Ex 4: Ange being embarresed and angry when er bf sees her naked because she does care how he sees her. As he was the only one to show kindness to her after she was a Norma.
Ex 5 (a stretch): But Ange kissing the once mean girl now best friend because she is trying to reassure her it’s okay not to be ashamed for liking her. That they will still always be close friends.
Ex 6: Later Ange and the Girls meet the true villain the Tuner he manipulates the world & plays with the hearts of the heroines violating them.
But in the end of Ange the girls retake control & kill the Tuner and are able to live a normal life. Now looking respectful and modest symbolizing how they no longer are just objects.
8:06 Dude, I don’t agree with this at all.
Following this logic; most people cannot relate to a war movie about the frontline because most simply never experienced anything close to being on a frontline; I can’t resonate with a movie about spies and you either; science fiction set on an alien planet isn’t relatable to any single human on Earth since no one ever seen one.
Writers think adults and teens want haha sex and drugs and gore in there movies and shows, when we actually want a well written story.
Indeed. Trouble is that good writing is hard, haha. Boobs and blood are just so much easier!
And then some of those adults and teens are led to think that it's "society" and "mainstream culture" that is the reason for media having all of that content, and that "feminism, et al" and all the other Current Year movements are the way to get rid of all that.
A juvenile movie done right is the original Robocop because it's juvenile to make fun of the action genre, I dont really feel like any of its scenes or story beats could be taken out and made more enjoyable.
I loved name of the wind, wise man’s fear seemed… preoccupied.
Seriously, guys, I have been using this desk since before I was making videos. It really is great!
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One piece is aimed at teenagers and it tackles some very heavy themes. Especially in some of the recent chapters
O my god, THANK YOU. I've been saying the same thing!!
I'm so glad it's not just me!
I tend to believe that a lot of YA novels fall into the camp that SD&RR are how we grow up. At least children’s novels have a point.
Eventually, you get to the point where utilizing adult tropes in a childish and vapid way for the sake of irony becomes amusing again, but only after you understand why it's cringe...and why a part of us still secretly finds it to be cool because we know it's bad.
The Phantom Tollbooth
Well put
Looking forward to your Rothfuss video. I'd also like to hear your thoughts on the new Willy Wonka trailer
Forget what Greg said - I strongly recommend that you read The Name of the Wind AND The Wise Man's Fear, because they are both phenomenal books. Yes, we have been waiting 12 years for The Doors of Stone, but the first two books are some of the best fantasy ever written. (If you don't believe me, check out how long the wait time is for one at your local library.)
Edit: However, his advice to "clean the pipes" (to use the phrasing from Something About Mary) before writing is well-taken. Like, sex is an important part of human interaction, but you don't need to linger on it to get the point across.
Aaaaah yes. Rothfuss.
I wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire and screaming he had the finished Doors of Stone manuscript in his pocket.
Most "mature" entertainment is actually immature.
What's funny is that my favorite games in terms of gameplay and story are "adult" games. Sengoku Rance is supposed to be a Hentai game, but is a really great turn based Strategy/RPG title that I crave more for the story and the gameplay than the art (which is well done in and of itself). Indie Publisher Sierra Lee puts out strictly adult/erotic games with amazingly deep and complex stories that I love! Meanwhile, so many other games that win awards for their writing and gameplay are just awful.
I rewatched the Lion King with my baby brother recently, and I can say that it’s definitely an adult movie in kids’ movie wrapping. The concepts within the film can’t be fully comprehended by a child, you need to have some life experience to fully get it.
Being able to use that joke is the best argument for abstaining from premarital sex I've ever heard
Greg, you must read the rest of the Narnia books! They are so good!
They are definitely on the list. A rather lengthy list, I’m afraid
@@gregowen2022 I know the feeling! Though Narnia is nice because you can knock them out quickly, and read them with the kids!
All the Narnia stories are great. I return to them often.
Disagree with your take on saw. At least during the early movies, the gore was used in the right way for the audience. It got lost in the later movies which just turned into "torture porn". Other than that I agree with your points made.
Going into this though I thought you were going to explain why porn has such bad plot 😂
Oh no i don't even have one yet but god